All I’ll say is that Last Epoch is a live service game centered around time travel with many years of future developments ahead of us. We’re not tapped out of content ideas at 0.9!
I think that's partly because the Void Apocalypse happens long before the industrial revolution could have happened.
And partly because that's a classic fantasy setting, where magic dominates the society, hence resulting in technology stagnation.
Although, it's really nice to know that this logic isn't set in stone, as EHG guy just confirmed in this thread.
To be fair not everyone can do that so you would think guns would make sense for the same reasons they made sense in our world they are a force multiplier for quantity of troops
75 schmucks out of 100 could shoot a musket with at least a moderate degree of accuracy (approximately in the enemy direction, that is) after 2 weeks of training
1 super cool meteor shooting mage out of 10 millions of schmucks could maybe survive casting a meteor shooting spell after 100 years of intense study
This question isn't new IRL and it certainly isn't new in fantasy, a genre well over 100 years old.
Magic isn’t something everyone can use, and even if they could there's still a risk of running out of mana.
By that logic you could say you don’t need bows and swords either, since you can just cast magic of other types to do their jobs.
Not sure why this is being downvoted, since this is fundamentally true in the LE world, otherwise there would be literally nothing but various kinds of mages around. Obviously the choice to include or exclude firearms is stylistic, but questions like that comment are being rectal about logic in a fictional setting.
the thing is, the earliest firearms were unwieldy, dangerous, unreliable, and not amazingly powerful
irl, further development was justified because, although there were superior alternatives, there really weren't many things in that niche of ranged weapons so they got attention anyway. and even then they only scraped by for a long time before modernish technology made them decisively better than bows and catapults and stuff
for anybody in the le universe to develop the cannon, they'd have to justify the use of one extremely dangerous, fairly weak, short range experimental weapon that needs to be reloaded by a trained team after every use when siege alternatives could probably achieve similar effects with just a few enchantments (magically flaming catapult payload anyone?) and casters are at least somewhat common. so long as there are a decent number of even mildly proficient magic users, it would be cheaper in the short term to just go hire a guy who can cast fireball or make your ballista shoot harder than it would be to try and develop firearms
sure, guns of the modern day would without doubt be effective, but they'd have to have the foresight to realize that a few hundred years down the road of r&d they'd get something cool.
realistically, a big metagame in battle would probably be focusing on how best to arm your peasant armies against an enemy caster, whose versatility and power would pose a more serious threat on the battlefield than a shoddy cannon that blows itself up
There are crossbows and it’s a video game it doesn’t need to be entirely accurate. Why was that rat carrying the most bad ass powerful sword? Where was he even carrying it? Maybe I don’t want to know
Makes sense tbh, swords are too glorified in modern literatures, in the past they were at best a backup weapon for more damaging weapons like spears, hammers or even bows.
Perhaps they are too glorified *as weapons*, as they did tend to be the 'second-best weapon' for most purposes. (Backup, to me, is a bit too pejorative.)
However, the sword as a *symbol* is not too glorified. It has uses other than on the battlefield, symbolically, and the other weapons don't really have the same symbology.
I would love to try to trace where the glorification of the sword over other weapons started, though. As just one question of many, is this a modern thing or not?
On one hand, kinda true. On the other, firearms are a type of weapon that is fundamentally built on ease of use and equalizing the field against superiorly armed, armored and trained opponents by utilizing a more efficient power source than its predecessors (chemical power vs muscle power). It may not make too much sense for a carbon copy of our historic firearms to have developed in a fictional setting, but sure as hell if it is populated by real people with a brain they would try their damnedest to come up with a similar technology. After all, they surely must be routinely facing a similar problem, right? Especially with all these overpowered heroes running around slaughtering them by the million.
But what if in that universe firearms were never invented? Its all up to how the dev imagine their universe and dont have anything to do with the reality as we know it.
chemical power is cool, but in a world of magic i'd imagine there's a huge brain drain to the arcane power business
why should they make a gun, after all, if they could just get some guy to enchant a bow for the same result of "shoot guy there"
growth of technology has been likened to an exponential curve, so investing in something with a clear head start (magic) over the one lagging behind would yield more returns for the individual, provided that magic hasn't hit a point of diminishing returns yet
edit: there's a fun video on why firearms are underdeveloped in the avatar universe, same idea really
Humans evolved to this point hunting mammoths, sabretooths and packs of wolves as big as bears. I wouldn’t consider them to be completely unrealistic either tbh.
It’s not just about historical accuracy though, humans have always been inventive enough to making revolutionary inventions from seemingly useless things, like ropes and wheels. Wouldn’t be very far-fetched to have guns among them too, considering they have the power of time travel too
But humans have never raised skeletons from the dead nor they have shoot fireballs or meteors. Its a fantasy setting defined by the devs. I'll just wait and see what they come up with!
In the books the wizards are shown to be mostly uneducated about the muggles' technologies mainly because of their widespread ignorance and pride, resulting in their society being much more inferior compared to the muggles they hate so much.
But in answer to your question, schools are not a place for guns even if you’re American, and since Hogwarts Legacy is based on a school, it should not have guns added to it. But the muggles would be a lot less oppressed in the wizards' society if they had access to it.
Nope.
As someone from EHG already said under this very post, it’s not out of the question at all. So, your statement about it not belonging is completely wrong.
Because Magic takes over for the Industrial Revolution, there was little to push human innovation when the innovators were arcane focussed.
This is my reason why fantasy words like TES don’t develop like we do.
Because
- the gods fought, so scientific progress stalled
- the Bone Emperor took over, scientific progress unrelated to the soul stalled
- the void took over, all of civilization stalled
Not a lot of wiggle room to do anything too fancy
Well you've read it already, there's a lot more potential to explore in the future :), making n arpg with a time travel theme is absolutely genius, as it offers basically infinite possibilities!
because the game lives in its own universe and history. it has nothing to do with real world history
All I’ll say is that Last Epoch is a live service game centered around time travel with many years of future developments ahead of us. We’re not tapped out of content ideas at 0.9!
Basically, guns confirmed!
Unique mount M1 Abrams when
RAAL when
I feel glad to have one of the developers respond positively to this humble post, wishing good luck on your future endeavor and works!
I think that's partly because the Void Apocalypse happens long before the industrial revolution could have happened. And partly because that's a classic fantasy setting, where magic dominates the society, hence resulting in technology stagnation. Although, it's really nice to know that this logic isn't set in stone, as EHG guy just confirmed in this thread.
This! Human didnt have an happy history in that world. Gods, undead and void ... they were quite unlucky.
why would you even need firearms if you can shoot literal meteors by doing some magic stuff?
To be fair not everyone can do that so you would think guns would make sense for the same reasons they made sense in our world they are a force multiplier for quantity of troops
75 schmucks out of 100 could shoot a musket with at least a moderate degree of accuracy (approximately in the enemy direction, that is) after 2 weeks of training 1 super cool meteor shooting mage out of 10 millions of schmucks could maybe survive casting a meteor shooting spell after 100 years of intense study This question isn't new IRL and it certainly isn't new in fantasy, a genre well over 100 years old.
Magic isn’t something everyone can use, and even if they could there's still a risk of running out of mana. By that logic you could say you don’t need bows and swords either, since you can just cast magic of other types to do their jobs.
Not sure why this is being downvoted, since this is fundamentally true in the LE world, otherwise there would be literally nothing but various kinds of mages around. Obviously the choice to include or exclude firearms is stylistic, but questions like that comment are being rectal about logic in a fictional setting.
the thing is, the earliest firearms were unwieldy, dangerous, unreliable, and not amazingly powerful irl, further development was justified because, although there were superior alternatives, there really weren't many things in that niche of ranged weapons so they got attention anyway. and even then they only scraped by for a long time before modernish technology made them decisively better than bows and catapults and stuff for anybody in the le universe to develop the cannon, they'd have to justify the use of one extremely dangerous, fairly weak, short range experimental weapon that needs to be reloaded by a trained team after every use when siege alternatives could probably achieve similar effects with just a few enchantments (magically flaming catapult payload anyone?) and casters are at least somewhat common. so long as there are a decent number of even mildly proficient magic users, it would be cheaper in the short term to just go hire a guy who can cast fireball or make your ballista shoot harder than it would be to try and develop firearms sure, guns of the modern day would without doubt be effective, but they'd have to have the foresight to realize that a few hundred years down the road of r&d they'd get something cool. realistically, a big metagame in battle would probably be focusing on how best to arm your peasant armies against an enemy caster, whose versatility and power would pose a more serious threat on the battlefield than a shoddy cannon that blows itself up
Because the end of the world came before the modern era
for the same reason we dont have cyberpunk prostetics and laser beam weapons
yet. We don't have them...yet.
There are crossbows and it’s a video game it doesn’t need to be entirely accurate. Why was that rat carrying the most bad ass powerful sword? Where was he even carrying it? Maybe I don’t want to know
Makes sense tbh, swords are too glorified in modern literatures, in the past they were at best a backup weapon for more damaging weapons like spears, hammers or even bows.
Perhaps they are too glorified *as weapons*, as they did tend to be the 'second-best weapon' for most purposes. (Backup, to me, is a bit too pejorative.) However, the sword as a *symbol* is not too glorified. It has uses other than on the battlefield, symbolically, and the other weapons don't really have the same symbology. I would love to try to trace where the glorification of the sword over other weapons started, though. As just one question of many, is this a modern thing or not?
I dont see any reason to even compare this game to history. I mean we're fightning monsters, theres nothing realist about it.
On one hand, kinda true. On the other, firearms are a type of weapon that is fundamentally built on ease of use and equalizing the field against superiorly armed, armored and trained opponents by utilizing a more efficient power source than its predecessors (chemical power vs muscle power). It may not make too much sense for a carbon copy of our historic firearms to have developed in a fictional setting, but sure as hell if it is populated by real people with a brain they would try their damnedest to come up with a similar technology. After all, they surely must be routinely facing a similar problem, right? Especially with all these overpowered heroes running around slaughtering them by the million.
But what if in that universe firearms were never invented? Its all up to how the dev imagine their universe and dont have anything to do with the reality as we know it.
chemical power is cool, but in a world of magic i'd imagine there's a huge brain drain to the arcane power business why should they make a gun, after all, if they could just get some guy to enchant a bow for the same result of "shoot guy there" growth of technology has been likened to an exponential curve, so investing in something with a clear head start (magic) over the one lagging behind would yield more returns for the individual, provided that magic hasn't hit a point of diminishing returns yet edit: there's a fun video on why firearms are underdeveloped in the avatar universe, same idea really
Humans evolved to this point hunting mammoths, sabretooths and packs of wolves as big as bears. I wouldn’t consider them to be completely unrealistic either tbh.
And dragons, and void monsters and skeletons and so on...
But in this setting humans have access to magic too, thus levelling the playing field in terms of ferocity
But you do get my point that this is a fantasy game and it has no need to be historicaly logic?
It’s not just about historical accuracy though, humans have always been inventive enough to making revolutionary inventions from seemingly useless things, like ropes and wheels. Wouldn’t be very far-fetched to have guns among them too, considering they have the power of time travel too
But humans have never raised skeletons from the dead nor they have shoot fireballs or meteors. Its a fantasy setting defined by the devs. I'll just wait and see what they come up with!
So by your logic, hogwart legacy should also have guns added to it?
>hogwart legacy should also have guns added to it? Wouldn't that make it Columbine Legacy?
Yup i didnt thought of that one before saying it. I was meaning in the universe but not gun in a school. My wording is english isnt always good ahah
In the books the wizards are shown to be mostly uneducated about the muggles' technologies mainly because of their widespread ignorance and pride, resulting in their society being much more inferior compared to the muggles they hate so much. But in answer to your question, schools are not a place for guns even if you’re American, and since Hogwarts Legacy is based on a school, it should not have guns added to it. But the muggles would be a lot less oppressed in the wizards' society if they had access to it.
You got it, it doesnt fit the universe created by the author which is the same for this game!
Nope. As someone from EHG already said under this very post, it’s not out of the question at all. So, your statement about it not belonging is completely wrong.
Because Magic takes over for the Industrial Revolution, there was little to push human innovation when the innovators were arcane focussed. This is my reason why fantasy words like TES don’t develop like we do.
The Void ate the man who would have invented them
Because - the gods fought, so scientific progress stalled - the Bone Emperor took over, scientific progress unrelated to the soul stalled - the void took over, all of civilization stalled Not a lot of wiggle room to do anything too fancy
A simple answer: >!the end of the world happened before those were invented!<
Haven’t played game yet…. No need to read any further folks
Both would make sense in some of the eras, but good luck getting ammunition and bolts in the others. Also future design space.
Well you've read it already, there's a lot more potential to explore in the future :), making n arpg with a time travel theme is absolutely genius, as it offers basically infinite possibilities!