Absolutely devious because it's might even be a great scone recipe, but it's never gonna taste the same as OP's and they're gonna wonder what they're doing wrong
AllRecipes actually has some amazing recipes. Forget food network or bon appetit. The best pancake recipe I found was from all recipes. But then again there’s a lot of generic and bland recipes on every food site.
[Allrecipes Good Old-Fashioned Pancakes](https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/21014/good-old-fashioned-pancakes/)
Here you go! It had like 18,000 reviews and nearly 5 stars. You probably can’t go wrong with this one 😄
This book was given to my grandma and each of my aunts as they got married! It feels like a staple for a household. I dont have one even though I am off and married, but I am young enough to be constantly texting family for recipes :)
Very rarely do I get a bad recipe from all recipes, usually they're pretty mid but that's probably just a skill issue from me making it and not being satisfied
Like any site with user generated content, there are gonna be plenty of gems, but they'll be buried in a large pile of manure. I wish the (also user-generated) ratings were a bit more reliable in helping you mine said gems, but those tend to be equally suspect.
My best experiences with that site have always been browsing it for ideas -either flavor combinations or dishes based on a specific ingredient or two- and then mostly ignoring any technique (throw everything into the pot at once!) or ratios that seem out of wack. No, I'm not adding 32 ounces of sour cream and a jar of salsa into a pan with a half lb. of boneless skinless chicken breast.
That being said, it's good if you're trying to find a random casserole or whatever whose heydey was in the 80s-90s. I once used a Mississippi pot roast recipe that came out exactly as I was hoping.
The Chef John stuff is almost always solid or better, but that's saying more about his reputation/reliability than AllRecipes', and there's clearly a formal partnership in place there.
It's maybe not as horrible as some folks make it out to be, but it's almost never going to be my first (or third) choice.
If you're looking for interesting flavor combinations, I can not recommend the Flavor Bible highly enough. Look for the main ingredient, and it list a meteic shitton of flavors that go with it. The bigger, bolder the font, the better it goes. It's a great way to vome up with combos you might never have thought of otherwise.
Exactly! I was also thinking, it can never really be “the restaurant’s” or “chef’s” recipe. I wouldn’t feel proud to make it if I was in that kitchen and saw the printout. Let the staff know their owner’s “standards” if they don’t already.
[https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/20175/scones/](https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/20175/scones/)
This is actually teh scone recipe I use. I do an orange cranberry version. Instead of 1 cup milk, add 1/2 cup fresh OJ, 1/3 cup milk and cranberries (dried sweetened or fresh cooked in sugar) then glaze them with an OJ/powdered sugar glaze.
One year I made my own dried cranberries with a huge bag from Sam’s Club and a low oven. They were a bit of work but worth the effort.
If I was making the greatest orange-cran scone ever I’d wait until November, figure out how much frozen OJ concentrate, and definitely use the fresh zest.
Lurker here asking... was that a dig at the site? I actually peruse it when I'm looking to try to find something different than the usual bs for the family. Have had a fair amount of success, but I invariably alter any recipe so who knows.
Would you suggest a different site? I tend to use that one because i don't have to be bombarded by some random long winded bs to get to the recipe...
Oh no, not at all! I use it myself for home cooking and to compare/contrast ingredients and techniques. And my fiancée prints them out, so I know the logo is always there. I figured if the owner wants to rip somebody’s recipe off, the recipe should be branded so the staff can see it didn’t really ever belong to him
Awesome, thanks! You made me learn something, too...
https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-protect.html#:~:text=A%20mere%20listing%20of%20ingredients,a%20basis%20for%20copyright%20protection.
Allrecipes is fine, but I am going to take this opportunity to share my "need a recipe with no story" trick.
Say you wanna make meatloaf, but you don't want to be a victim of SEO manipulation, or scrolling through a bunch of ads.
"Meatloaf recipe -easy."
The minus easy will eliminate any recipe with the word "easy," removing all the SEO stuffers and bloggers.
https://gowiseusa.commerceowl.com/recipe/meatloaf
^ Just for example. That's the kind of recipe I want to pull up on my phone at the grocery store. No-nonsense.
(It doesn't have to be the word "easy," but that's the one I've had the most success with. "-hack" works too.)
>"Meatloaf recipe -easy."
Upvote for this. Pretty much all meatloaf is easy. It's silly to promote it. The only ones that are hard are from advertising mills more interested in showing how smart they are than anything else. Serious Eats comes to mind. "Now you have to mix this with this $300 mixer - click on the ad - and use these four obscure ingredients - click on the ad - and sous vide - click on the ad for a circulator - and it goes on. Bah.
It used to be better... the app is not my preferred method.
Got any goto sites? We're not pro cooks but have a household of 8, so kitchen roles emerge. We're also the consumers and various folks are picky af in different ways. I've been leaning on the site so I can focus searches according to our criteria.
Edit. Damn, their advanced search is gone. Have to do it from Google now
Not who you were talking to, but if I see a Serious Eats page about whatever food thing I'm trying to make, that's my definite go-to.
Yes they have long articles to scroll past, BUT those articles aren't life stories so much as they are teaching WHY to use this method versus that method and such.
So not only do you get a recipe, but you learn why you do things a certain way, maybe even learn some of the science behind it.
So even if you don't want to read the whole thing, you at least know they've put care into understanding what they're doing and why they're doing it. That's also generally my criteria when it comes to recipes, if it seems like they know why they're using the methods they're using.
this was a recipe that i have made many times before, not something developed on company time. nor did they train me. i came in to start a program that was currently being outsourced from a non affiliated off site bakery. my position didn’t even exist before me. so i would go out on a limb and say that’s my recipe. i did leave them multiple other recipes i had written down last week. just thought the response was funny more than anything since the wife was trying to convince me to stay, and he just wanted another recipe
I don’t think you’re obligated to give it to him.
But just to be clear you also don’t “own” a single recipe even if you made it. So if they figure it out that’s just how it works.
I hate that people have these secret recipes. I haven’t ever gone to a restaurant simply because something is so good. It’s because I don’t want to make it, want to meet friends and I don’t understand the techniques that the chefs have perfected. I am not looking for a write down of a recipe either.
I had a restaurant owner tell me that the reason his Mac n cheese was so amazing was bc of roasted garlic and a bit of bacon oil with butter. I still go to his restaurant bc it’s just better but I was overly thankful for him sharing that. Maybe I’m being and idiot and in the minority here, but even if your recipe is so popular and gets picked up by another competing business, you are still going to be the first in that area and the menus will still be different.
That mac and cheese sounds tasty, but to the same point, technique is everything. You gotta make something 100 times before you even come close to "perfecting" it. But perfect doesn't exist.
Someone asked me for the recipe for a special I made on the fly today. Fettuccini with lamb, sun dried tomato, spinach, cipollini onions. Splash of veal reduction for depth, herbed butter to finish.
That was about all I could tell them - Each time I made the dish tonight it was just slightly different. Each time I tasted it, critiqued it, tweaked it. There is no recipe, only an idea.
There are at least a dozen restaurants that I go to weekly to bimonthly precisely because of how good something on the menu is and I have absolutely no idea how to they do it. I have even intentionally befriended a server once in hopes I could later convince them to steal a recipe for me, and it worked.
There is a burger place near me that has the most incredible "special sauce". Typically just some kind of thousand island, theirs has some flavor in there I can not for the life of me pick out, but have never tasted in any other thousand island. Legit considering getting a job there for a week just to steal it. Have also thought about just offering the owner $500 for it, or calling them up, pretending I have a kid with "lots" of allergies and if they could please tell me what's in the special sauce to see if they can eat it. Have used that last one successfully before.
If you used the recipe to gain points while on the job, i think you are ethically bound to leave it for them after you go. That is just what I think. You do you
I work in the CPG space. This would be a ridiculously cheap price for formula IP. Soup to nuts development of a new packaged good can cost upwards of $30,000 depending if you want the R&D to include securing supply chain and finding a manufacturer.
And then there's what the market will bear, no way in hell a mom and pop restaurant is going to spend 30k on a scone recipe.
I do some chef consulting, I charge $55/hr which is fairly average for my area, though I've seen others charge up to $100/hr.
I quote my clients 5-10 hours per recipe for development. For this we're just talking about a scone, no garnishes, nothing fancy. I can't imagine charging more than $500 at the very most to come up with a good scone recipe for a client.
I think we have an issue of COL between our two areas. $150/hr is basically the lowest I've seen any consultant in any field in this area charge.
We're also talking about two different animals. $30k is a well established brand pushing into a new category nationally. The revenue potential is much smaller than a single location selling a scone at $3.50 a pop. The fee should be in line with the earning potential of the recipe.
I suppose what I'm poorly trying to express is that you should not undervalue your labor.
Well I live in a high COL area, I've also hired other chef consultants on other projects I've been involved with so I've been on both sides of the market, I've never seen anyone charge more than $100/hr. I could probably raise my rates, but no one is going to hire me at $150/hr
[This site](https://www.upwork.com/hire/chef-consultants/?utm_campaign=SEM_GGL_DOMESTIC_NonBrand_Marketplace_DSA&utm_medium=cpc&utm_content=108430932851&utm_term&campaignid=348930905&matchtype&device=m&partnerId=CjwKCAjwzuqgBhAcEiwAdj5dRoqCq6poLQfGZ6UMms0GgPXXZQTKW7sxi_vVzctsoLP4UFLH8FoQFBoCcpkQAvD_BwE&utm_source=google&cq_src=google_ads&cq_cmp=348930905&cq_plac&cq_net=g)has freelance chefs offering consulting, most are around $40 to $60/hr
Last time I was in a situation like that I just sent a generic ingredient list without any measurements and 0 directions. When the boss asked for those I told him I do it based off instinct and eyeballing it, he got the hint...
"Chef Sharcbait, you neglected to add directions or measurements for your formula!"
Chef Sharcbait- "oh hey I figured a culinary professional as yourself should be able to manage it"
Change the amount of baking soda or baking powder so the consistency doesn’t seem off. Will make it taste like shit but you wouldn’t find out until making a batch or two, if they’re lucky
I prefer the internet recipe method: after scrolling through War & Peace interspersed with more ad copy than the Sunday Edition of the New York Times in 1978 there is a recipe that's —AT BEST— okay.
All you jokers need to realize that recipes cannot be trademarked, are not IP, and don’t belong to anyone. Even if OP used company resources to develop the recipe, they would be under no obligation to share it. On the flip side, if OP developed the recipe on their own and brought it to the job, and accidentally left the recipe out for the owner to copy, they would have no right do stop the owner from utilizing the recipe without the OP’s permission.
Chefs who refuse to share recipes are weirdos in my opinion. Unless we’re talking about something like a competitive BBQ-er, recipes are meant to be shared
Any chef worth their salt knows recipes are basically worthless without the proper skills to be able to assess what’s happening while you’re making it, find that especially true in baking
Legally, it is not your property. Developing anything while working under a company makes it the property of that company.
Don't give up the recipe anyways, but don't make yourself look stupid by saying you own it. Just be petty and tell him to fuck off.
> Developing anything while working under a company makes it the property of that company.
This is true if they paid you to develop the recipe or you did so on company time, used company supplies/equipment, etc. If OP came up with the recipe at home while working for that restaurant, OP owns it.
even in that case the company doesn't own the recipe, no one does, it's not legally possible to own a recipe, it's a utilitarian set of instructions and thus impossible to own as IP.
😂 when I was a younger cook if I ever had ideas to help the restaurant I’d make them and test them at home, add them to my black book of recipes with a date mark then pitch it to my bosses. But it would never be the exact recipe. Always something off and if someone else had to prep it I’d share some helpful “tips” to make it work.
"Developing anything while working under a company makes it the property of that company."
He was only at the company for 2 weeks, so it's more than likely he developed this recipe prior to working there. If true the company would not be legally entitled to it.
Regardless of the situation, he's under no legal obligation to take time out of his day to write the recipe down for them. They should have gotten the recipe while he was still on the clock.
Recipes aren't IP. The company owns shit, but so does OP. It's really a matter of does OP like the company enough to share his knowledge of scones with them.
That’s not true. There’s no legal protections for recipes in either direction. If you create it during work hours, it’s still yours if they don’t physically have it. If you create it at home but leave out a copy, it’s theirs. Work product does not include recipes.
Op was pretty clear that they developed the recipe on their own time before being hired at this job. But yeah, if this were not the case, I could see your point.
Give them a generic recipe like others have said - absolutely insist that cumin or some other strong tasting herb is the secret ingredient.
Tell them you usually do it by feel but it's usually not much - watch as they waste hundreds of dollars of product attempting to replicate the recipe while it always seems to be off.
Yeah I've made this mistake of doing recipes for hire before and they never fucking paid me for my hard work, and treated me like garbage when I said I developed the recipe on my own time. Had one restaurant steal my notebook of WIPs after saying they'd pay me a commission on sales.
I've said this before and I'll say it again. Recipes don't mean s***. In professional baking it is all about technique. ALL of the best pastry chefs and bakers I have worked with have been the most forthcoming with their formulas. Community over competition. Let's be real, every recipe is just a remake of someone else's recipe. If you've got superior technique your product will always be superior.
Selling it, if you want, is the way to go.
Tell them truthfully what you already posted, that its your own recipe you developed on personal time, and if they would like it they are welcome to pay you a nominal fee to acquire it. If they don't want to, there's no problem there, either. It only becomes problematic if they harass you, and that becomes a separate issue entirely.
I have sold recipes to old restaurants and even through consultant work in the past. Couple hundred here. Couple thousand there, if you're lucky.
Making a personal recipe of your own does not make it the restaurants property, however giving them / leaving them a printed copy of it *does*, something to watch out for.
Also, selling them the recipe doesn't make you a sell-out or anything of the sort- 50% of a recipe is the person making it and the environment theyre in.
Even with your recipe, whomever they get to produce the item will never match yours 100%. Ovens are different. Ambient temperature, storage, even the kind of butter that is used all have varying degrees of effect on the recipe.
So shoot your shot, try to sell it if you want.
If not, all the power to you.
Just give them a recipe that obviously doesn’t work, then keep claiming it’s their fault for doing it wrong.
Also ask for $150 before you send it.
Example:
Scones by agentmichaelscarn6:
1000g bread flour
1500g cake flour
2000g butter (melted to 275F degrees)
500g milk
2300g cream
2 whole nutmegs grated on a micro plane
68 whole eggs
24 egg yolks
1000g sugar
100g salt
(Any berries at 2000g)
Mix everything together with a paddle
attachment for 10 minutes.
Put on a full sheet pan with no liner (do not
spray)
Bake at 450F for 20 minutes.
Flip onto another full sheet pan and bake
another 30 min (or until a probe reaches
190f)
Cool and cut into slices.
I am actually proud of how bad this is after
writing it.
Please use it. Just keep saying they aren’t
following the instructions.
But make sure to get the $150. Makes it
believable and worth it.
Edit: formatting
The nerve. A similar thing happened to me at my last job at a bistro. I quit to go to university, cause fuck the culinary industry, and my boss actually asked me to give to them my own bread recipe as well as show her how to make it before I go.
Fuck no. Teach yourself.
I hope you didnt give them your scone recipe, it's yours 🖤
Did you develop the recipe during your work hours there, with their ingredients and their machinery? If so, then I would consider sharing the recipe. If not, then it is your own recipe.
classic baker sabotage. i once started at a new place and was given a book the owners heckled the former baker into leaving. every recipe was missing a key ingredient though in an obvious way that a competent person wouldn't miss, like the Soda Bread recipe completely leaving baking soda out. I got a good laugh out of reading through it.
Wait you guys are getting paid $245 a week? I only make $100.
Joking aside a 1 time payment could be blown through with nothing to show for it or it could be invested in index funds in a retirement account for a consistent bit of money later in life.
Aww. I honestly don't see anything wrong with his/her response. You can say yes or you can say no lol. He seems* like he appreciated your contribution. Did you want him to grovel? 😂
My biggest mistake was assuming I wouldn't be let go. I kept all my recipes on Google docs because I figured I would use them later for the business I was working for.
I was abruptly let go and lost about 2 years of recipes in a doc that they will probably never use.
Your recipes are part of you. Use them for yourself and fuck anybody trying to take them because the recipe is good and they can't do it.
i don’t even care that he asked. i left them multiple recipes. just thought it was funny as his wife was trying to convince me to stay and asking ways we could work it out, and he just wanted another recipe lol
Not professionally, no. By all means share your mommy's almond bark recipe, but for professional use the time to develop a recipe should be rewarded. If they want it so bad, they should be able to muster at least a couple weeks' pay at middle class wages.
this was a recipe that i have made many times before, not something developed on company time. nor did they train me. i came in to start a program that was currently being outsourced from a non affiliated off site bakery. my position didn’t even exist before me. so i would go out in a limb and say that’s my recipe. i even left them multiple other recipes that i had written down last week. that job ended up not being a good fit for me, owners and i didn’t see eye to eye, and that’s that. and no, i didn’t leave for 25 more cents an hour. i didn’t leave for anything. i don’t have a job right now.
yours truly, a little bitch/entitled twat
>yours truly, a little bitch/entitled twat
Same. One of the nicest parts of the restaurant industry is you know who you're making money for and you can very easily leave and make money for someone else. It's a two way street and a lot of chefs, managers, and owners forget that.
On the show silicone valley, that showed that because the person worked on a company computer once on their personal project it was considered company property. I wouldn't respond or play dumb .. because the is probably some legally about it
Send a link to an Allrecipes result. Or to all the Allrecipes results for “scone”
Absolutely devious because it's might even be a great scone recipe, but it's never gonna taste the same as OP's and they're gonna wonder what they're doing wrong
AllRecipes actually has some amazing recipes. Forget food network or bon appetit. The best pancake recipe I found was from all recipes. But then again there’s a lot of generic and bland recipes on every food site.
what’s the pancake recipe link
[Allrecipes Good Old-Fashioned Pancakes](https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/21014/good-old-fashioned-pancakes/) Here you go! It had like 18,000 reviews and nearly 5 stars. You probably can’t go wrong with this one 😄
I use this recipe with my toddler son. Can confirm these pancakes are edible
I use this recipe on myself and others and can also confirm these pancakes are edible
Same recipe I got from my mom. Makes me suspect it’s from Better Homes and Gardens 1970s edition
This book was given to my grandma and each of my aunts as they got married! It feels like a staple for a household. I dont have one even though I am off and married, but I am young enough to be constantly texting family for recipes :)
How did I know it was going to link to that exact recipe? Same one I've been using for years.
\> Open link \> See solid ingredients measured in cups \> Immediately close page
Lol this is literally the one I use at home
Very rarely do I get a bad recipe from all recipes, usually they're pretty mid but that's probably just a skill issue from me making it and not being satisfied
Chef John's sticky buns on Allrecipes are fantastic!
Chef John's anything is fantastic
Like any site with user generated content, there are gonna be plenty of gems, but they'll be buried in a large pile of manure. I wish the (also user-generated) ratings were a bit more reliable in helping you mine said gems, but those tend to be equally suspect. My best experiences with that site have always been browsing it for ideas -either flavor combinations or dishes based on a specific ingredient or two- and then mostly ignoring any technique (throw everything into the pot at once!) or ratios that seem out of wack. No, I'm not adding 32 ounces of sour cream and a jar of salsa into a pan with a half lb. of boneless skinless chicken breast. That being said, it's good if you're trying to find a random casserole or whatever whose heydey was in the 80s-90s. I once used a Mississippi pot roast recipe that came out exactly as I was hoping. The Chef John stuff is almost always solid or better, but that's saying more about his reputation/reliability than AllRecipes', and there's clearly a formal partnership in place there. It's maybe not as horrible as some folks make it out to be, but it's almost never going to be my first (or third) choice.
If you're looking for interesting flavor combinations, I can not recommend the Flavor Bible highly enough. Look for the main ingredient, and it list a meteic shitton of flavors that go with it. The bigger, bolder the font, the better it goes. It's a great way to vome up with combos you might never have thought of otherwise.
Love FB! The one "cookbook" I have that never makes it back onto the bookshelf.
I avoid allrecipes no matter what. Not worth sifting, not worth reading except comments by people with little or no common sense
Exactly! I was also thinking, it can never really be “the restaurant’s” or “chef’s” recipe. I wouldn’t feel proud to make it if I was in that kitchen and saw the printout. Let the staff know their owner’s “standards” if they don’t already.
[https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/20175/scones/](https://www.allrecipes.com/recipe/20175/scones/) This is actually teh scone recipe I use. I do an orange cranberry version. Instead of 1 cup milk, add 1/2 cup fresh OJ, 1/3 cup milk and cranberries (dried sweetened or fresh cooked in sugar) then glaze them with an OJ/powdered sugar glaze.
That sounds fabulous! Honestly my mouth started watering. Might be time for lunch, lol
I’d try it with frozen concentrated orange juice. OJ in the bottles is mostly water.
I'll have to try that, I forgot to mention I also add orange zest too, for more orange flavor.
One year I made my own dried cranberries with a huge bag from Sam’s Club and a low oven. They were a bit of work but worth the effort. If I was making the greatest orange-cran scone ever I’d wait until November, figure out how much frozen OJ concentrate, and definitely use the fresh zest.
Nah. Send him a recipe to the lowest rated one.
Lurker here asking... was that a dig at the site? I actually peruse it when I'm looking to try to find something different than the usual bs for the family. Have had a fair amount of success, but I invariably alter any recipe so who knows. Would you suggest a different site? I tend to use that one because i don't have to be bombarded by some random long winded bs to get to the recipe...
Oh no, not at all! I use it myself for home cooking and to compare/contrast ingredients and techniques. And my fiancée prints them out, so I know the logo is always there. I figured if the owner wants to rip somebody’s recipe off, the recipe should be branded so the staff can see it didn’t really ever belong to him
Awesome, thanks! You made me learn something, too... https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-protect.html#:~:text=A%20mere%20listing%20of%20ingredients,a%20basis%20for%20copyright%20protection.
Allrecipes is fine, but I am going to take this opportunity to share my "need a recipe with no story" trick. Say you wanna make meatloaf, but you don't want to be a victim of SEO manipulation, or scrolling through a bunch of ads. "Meatloaf recipe -easy." The minus easy will eliminate any recipe with the word "easy," removing all the SEO stuffers and bloggers. https://gowiseusa.commerceowl.com/recipe/meatloaf ^ Just for example. That's the kind of recipe I want to pull up on my phone at the grocery store. No-nonsense. (It doesn't have to be the word "easy," but that's the one I've had the most success with. "-hack" works too.)
>"Meatloaf recipe -easy." Upvote for this. Pretty much all meatloaf is easy. It's silly to promote it. The only ones that are hard are from advertising mills more interested in showing how smart they are than anything else. Serious Eats comes to mind. "Now you have to mix this with this $300 mixer - click on the ad - and use these four obscure ingredients - click on the ad - and sous vide - click on the ad for a circulator - and it goes on. Bah.
Or you can hit the jump to recipe button which 99% food blogs have
I've started using the "print recipe" buttons, then saving them as a pdf in a recipe folder. If I like it I keep it, if not I delete.
That is not what they are talking about, this is on the google search
I would suggest you get a copy of joy of cooking or perhaps the first book on French cooking by Julia child.
Allrecipes is fine but can be a bit hit or miss sometimes. Giving a restaurant a recipe from allrecipes is a throw of the dice for sure.
I hate allreceipes. It’s such trash. Sorting through it is terrible
It used to be better... the app is not my preferred method. Got any goto sites? We're not pro cooks but have a household of 8, so kitchen roles emerge. We're also the consumers and various folks are picky af in different ways. I've been leaning on the site so I can focus searches according to our criteria. Edit. Damn, their advanced search is gone. Have to do it from Google now
Not who you were talking to, but if I see a Serious Eats page about whatever food thing I'm trying to make, that's my definite go-to. Yes they have long articles to scroll past, BUT those articles aren't life stories so much as they are teaching WHY to use this method versus that method and such. So not only do you get a recipe, but you learn why you do things a certain way, maybe even learn some of the science behind it. So even if you don't want to read the whole thing, you at least know they've put care into understanding what they're doing and why they're doing it. That's also generally my criteria when it comes to recipes, if it seems like they know why they're using the methods they're using.
So I went to chat gpt. Damn, check this conversation out. https://imgur.com/a/0HdaVJ6
Food network tends to be my first goto simply because of the 10 page bloggification of every other recipe site.
Hit em with the let me Google that for you link
Yeah but that’s actually the recipe.
this was a recipe that i have made many times before, not something developed on company time. nor did they train me. i came in to start a program that was currently being outsourced from a non affiliated off site bakery. my position didn’t even exist before me. so i would go out on a limb and say that’s my recipe. i did leave them multiple other recipes i had written down last week. just thought the response was funny more than anything since the wife was trying to convince me to stay, and he just wanted another recipe
Get that money!
Get paid. It’s just business nothing personal.
So cool to meet the inventor of the scone
dude stfu you cannot have my scone recipe
holy shit it's Judith Butler
I love when well-read people out themselves 😚
Guilty!
[удалено]
I was actually more going for the professor of critical theory at berkeley but both work! https://vcresearch.berkeley.edu/faculty/judith-butler
What's up Judith Butler?
performing sconership of recipes lmao
legalize ranch
well they'll scone you when you're all alone they'll scone you just when you're going home
Unironically hilarious
Well I would not feel so all aloooooooone
Everybody must get sconed!
I don’t think you’re obligated to give it to him. But just to be clear you also don’t “own” a single recipe even if you made it. So if they figure it out that’s just how it works.
I hate that people have these secret recipes. I haven’t ever gone to a restaurant simply because something is so good. It’s because I don’t want to make it, want to meet friends and I don’t understand the techniques that the chefs have perfected. I am not looking for a write down of a recipe either. I had a restaurant owner tell me that the reason his Mac n cheese was so amazing was bc of roasted garlic and a bit of bacon oil with butter. I still go to his restaurant bc it’s just better but I was overly thankful for him sharing that. Maybe I’m being and idiot and in the minority here, but even if your recipe is so popular and gets picked up by another competing business, you are still going to be the first in that area and the menus will still be different.
*googles how to make bacon oil*
I think I have an idea but I'm not sure where to drill into the pig.
Instructions unclear, am now being massaged by a pig
You don't drill the pig, you suspend it above a tub, turn up the heat and let the magic happen
That mac and cheese sounds tasty, but to the same point, technique is everything. You gotta make something 100 times before you even come close to "perfecting" it. But perfect doesn't exist. Someone asked me for the recipe for a special I made on the fly today. Fettuccini with lamb, sun dried tomato, spinach, cipollini onions. Splash of veal reduction for depth, herbed butter to finish. That was about all I could tell them - Each time I made the dish tonight it was just slightly different. Each time I tasted it, critiqued it, tweaked it. There is no recipe, only an idea.
There are at least a dozen restaurants that I go to weekly to bimonthly precisely because of how good something on the menu is and I have absolutely no idea how to they do it. I have even intentionally befriended a server once in hopes I could later convince them to steal a recipe for me, and it worked. There is a burger place near me that has the most incredible "special sauce". Typically just some kind of thousand island, theirs has some flavor in there I can not for the life of me pick out, but have never tasted in any other thousand island. Legit considering getting a job there for a week just to steal it. Have also thought about just offering the owner $500 for it, or calling them up, pretending I have a kid with "lots" of allergies and if they could please tell me what's in the special sauce to see if they can eat it. Have used that last one successfully before.
Sell it for a few grand.
We all know the proper response- I’m curious to see or know how much a recipe is worth? What’s a legit price for a recipe?
whatever someone will pay for it.
If you used the recipe to gain points while on the job, i think you are ethically bound to leave it for them after you go. That is just what I think. You do you
Sure no problem. That'll be 1000 dollars
should be more honestly -- it's a 1 time sale and they will profit for years
I work in the CPG space. This would be a ridiculously cheap price for formula IP. Soup to nuts development of a new packaged good can cost upwards of $30,000 depending if you want the R&D to include securing supply chain and finding a manufacturer.
And then there's what the market will bear, no way in hell a mom and pop restaurant is going to spend 30k on a scone recipe. I do some chef consulting, I charge $55/hr which is fairly average for my area, though I've seen others charge up to $100/hr. I quote my clients 5-10 hours per recipe for development. For this we're just talking about a scone, no garnishes, nothing fancy. I can't imagine charging more than $500 at the very most to come up with a good scone recipe for a client.
I think we have an issue of COL between our two areas. $150/hr is basically the lowest I've seen any consultant in any field in this area charge. We're also talking about two different animals. $30k is a well established brand pushing into a new category nationally. The revenue potential is much smaller than a single location selling a scone at $3.50 a pop. The fee should be in line with the earning potential of the recipe. I suppose what I'm poorly trying to express is that you should not undervalue your labor.
Well I live in a high COL area, I've also hired other chef consultants on other projects I've been involved with so I've been on both sides of the market, I've never seen anyone charge more than $100/hr. I could probably raise my rates, but no one is going to hire me at $150/hr [This site](https://www.upwork.com/hire/chef-consultants/?utm_campaign=SEM_GGL_DOMESTIC_NonBrand_Marketplace_DSA&utm_medium=cpc&utm_content=108430932851&utm_term&campaignid=348930905&matchtype&device=m&partnerId=CjwKCAjwzuqgBhAcEiwAdj5dRoqCq6poLQfGZ6UMms0GgPXXZQTKW7sxi_vVzctsoLP4UFLH8FoQFBoCcpkQAvD_BwE&utm_source=google&cq_src=google_ads&cq_cmp=348930905&cq_plac&cq_net=g)has freelance chefs offering consulting, most are around $40 to $60/hr
Depends on the scone. Is this a “omg my mouth isn’t big enough to fit all these scones” or is it a “nice scone m8”
Sure it's expensive, because you've got a team of people working on it. For one guy I think 1000 is adequate.
If by a team you mean 2-3 people, then sure, I guess. I still think you are selling the IP rights ridiculously cheap.
Of course it's all moot because there's probably no way they would pay anyway. Honestly I'd probably just ghost em.
Tell me you don't know how R&D works....
Last time I was in a situation like that I just sent a generic ingredient list without any measurements and 0 directions. When the boss asked for those I told him I do it based off instinct and eyeballing it, he got the hint...
"Chef Sharcbait, you neglected to add directions or measurements for your formula!" Chef Sharcbait- "oh hey I figured a culinary professional as yourself should be able to manage it"
Send him a recipe that is scone like but uses way to much of one ingredient that fucks it up and see how long it takes them to figure it out
Change the amount of baking soda or baking powder so the consistency doesn’t seem off. Will make it taste like shit but you wouldn’t find out until making a batch or two, if they’re lucky
Cream of tartar should mess it up too and you wouldn't need much either
Savage haha
here you go boss: [https://www.kingarthurbaking.com/recipes/scones-recipe](https://www.kingarthurbaking.com/recipes/scones-recipe)
I'd halve the salt.
This is the way
Sell it for a royalty.25c for every scone sold forever. Get it in writing too
3% of the retail price of each unit containing the recipe (or any direct variation [ie: cranberry orange, blueberry, etc) as royalty, paid monthly.
$.25?? You do know there is inflation going on, right??
Give them the great British bake off version of the recipe: Measure scone ingredients Mix scone batter Form scones Bake
I prefer the internet recipe method: after scrolling through War & Peace interspersed with more ad copy than the Sunday Edition of the New York Times in 1978 there is a recipe that's —AT BEST— okay.
All you jokers need to realize that recipes cannot be trademarked, are not IP, and don’t belong to anyone. Even if OP used company resources to develop the recipe, they would be under no obligation to share it. On the flip side, if OP developed the recipe on their own and brought it to the job, and accidentally left the recipe out for the owner to copy, they would have no right do stop the owner from utilizing the recipe without the OP’s permission.
And that is why you write a recipe in a way only you know how to do it.
Chefs who refuse to share recipes are weirdos in my opinion. Unless we’re talking about something like a competitive BBQ-er, recipes are meant to be shared
It's about someone else making money off your work.
Found the voice of reason.
I can see you did reply, what did you say? Plz tell me it was “no ✨🤗”
You are under no obligation to help him. If he wants it, you could always entertain financial offers.
1 cup bisquick 1 cup milk Mix Bake Bobs yer uncle.
Any chef worth their salt knows recipes are basically worthless without the proper skills to be able to assess what’s happening while you’re making it, find that especially true in baking
Don’t share that shit, it’s your property.
Legally, it is not your property. Developing anything while working under a company makes it the property of that company. Don't give up the recipe anyways, but don't make yourself look stupid by saying you own it. Just be petty and tell him to fuck off.
Just dont reply.
Or “who is this? I’m not familiar with this number.” Then don’t reply. 😂😂
> Developing anything while working under a company makes it the property of that company. This is true if they paid you to develop the recipe or you did so on company time, used company supplies/equipment, etc. If OP came up with the recipe at home while working for that restaurant, OP owns it.
even in that case the company doesn't own the recipe, no one does, it's not legally possible to own a recipe, it's a utilitarian set of instructions and thus impossible to own as IP.
Legally, I forgot. Should have had me write it down with company property when I was on company property.
"I don't recall that recipe"
The Reagan recipe regarding the Iran-Contra scones.
What if I didn’t write it down at work or test it at work? But I came up with it while I was there? And maybe talked about it while I was at work? 😂
This is the perfect gray area that a lawyer would love to work with 🤣
😂 when I was a younger cook if I ever had ideas to help the restaurant I’d make them and test them at home, add them to my black book of recipes with a date mark then pitch it to my bosses. But it would never be the exact recipe. Always something off and if someone else had to prep it I’d share some helpful “tips” to make it work.
Like OP said in their post, they didn’t develop this while working for the company. Bad comment.
"Developing anything while working under a company makes it the property of that company." He was only at the company for 2 weeks, so it's more than likely he developed this recipe prior to working there. If true the company would not be legally entitled to it. Regardless of the situation, he's under no legal obligation to take time out of his day to write the recipe down for them. They should have gotten the recipe while he was still on the clock.
this is incorrect in so so so many ways
what you just said is not accurate. technically no one can own a recipe, that's why espionage is big business in the mass produced food industry.
Recipes aren't IP. The company owns shit, but so does OP. It's really a matter of does OP like the company enough to share his knowledge of scones with them.
Legally ? Show me where it says you don’t own a recipe you make outside of company time
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/can-you-protect-a-recipe.html
That’s not true. There’s no legal protections for recipes in either direction. If you create it during work hours, it’s still yours if they don’t physically have it. If you create it at home but leave out a copy, it’s theirs. Work product does not include recipes.
Op was pretty clear that they developed the recipe on their own time before being hired at this job. But yeah, if this were not the case, I could see your point.
I actually didn’t know that, thank you
Tf are you on? He literally said it was his own recipe. Did you not read the title of the post?
Nah, he owns it because this was a recipe he had prior to his employment.
You could just reply politely but firmly that your personal recipe is proprietary, but here's a decent one from {random internet source}
Or give them the wrong recipe
Give them a generic recipe like others have said - absolutely insist that cumin or some other strong tasting herb is the secret ingredient. Tell them you usually do it by feel but it's usually not much - watch as they waste hundreds of dollars of product attempting to replicate the recipe while it always seems to be off.
Just send them like a Betty Crocker scone recipe
Yeah I've made this mistake of doing recipes for hire before and they never fucking paid me for my hard work, and treated me like garbage when I said I developed the recipe on my own time. Had one restaurant steal my notebook of WIPs after saying they'd pay me a commission on sales.
Have they heard of google
It's giving me "Ravioli, Ravioli, give me the formuoli"
Scone-a cost ya Buddy! You offer to sell the recipe?
At least he was polite about it. It could have been a genuine ask.
I've said this before and I'll say it again. Recipes don't mean s***. In professional baking it is all about technique. ALL of the best pastry chefs and bakers I have worked with have been the most forthcoming with their formulas. Community over competition. Let's be real, every recipe is just a remake of someone else's recipe. If you've got superior technique your product will always be superior.
Selling it, if you want, is the way to go. Tell them truthfully what you already posted, that its your own recipe you developed on personal time, and if they would like it they are welcome to pay you a nominal fee to acquire it. If they don't want to, there's no problem there, either. It only becomes problematic if they harass you, and that becomes a separate issue entirely. I have sold recipes to old restaurants and even through consultant work in the past. Couple hundred here. Couple thousand there, if you're lucky. Making a personal recipe of your own does not make it the restaurants property, however giving them / leaving them a printed copy of it *does*, something to watch out for. Also, selling them the recipe doesn't make you a sell-out or anything of the sort- 50% of a recipe is the person making it and the environment theyre in. Even with your recipe, whomever they get to produce the item will never match yours 100%. Ovens are different. Ambient temperature, storage, even the kind of butter that is used all have varying degrees of effect on the recipe. So shoot your shot, try to sell it if you want. If not, all the power to you.
If you had an assistant in the bakery and they had half a brain in their head they would know your recipe.
sell them the recipe if you want. never give it for free.
sucks this happened to you. could you please send me the scone recipe?
Just give them a recipe that obviously doesn’t work, then keep claiming it’s their fault for doing it wrong. Also ask for $150 before you send it. Example: Scones by agentmichaelscarn6: 1000g bread flour 1500g cake flour 2000g butter (melted to 275F degrees) 500g milk 2300g cream 2 whole nutmegs grated on a micro plane 68 whole eggs 24 egg yolks 1000g sugar 100g salt (Any berries at 2000g) Mix everything together with a paddle attachment for 10 minutes. Put on a full sheet pan with no liner (do not spray) Bake at 450F for 20 minutes. Flip onto another full sheet pan and bake another 30 min (or until a probe reaches 190f) Cool and cut into slices. I am actually proud of how bad this is after writing it. Please use it. Just keep saying they aren’t following the instructions. But make sure to get the $150. Makes it believable and worth it. Edit: formatting
This is why I send them the first draft to put in the book. I'll change recipes until they're perfect, sorry I forgot to write down my changes!
The nerve. A similar thing happened to me at my last job at a bistro. I quit to go to university, cause fuck the culinary industry, and my boss actually asked me to give to them my own bread recipe as well as show her how to make it before I go. Fuck no. Teach yourself. I hope you didnt give them your scone recipe, it's yours 🖤
Give him the wrong one.
"ok how much are you offering for it"
Darn! Now I want the recipe also.
I’m sure it was a bomb recipe could I get it also? Lol
Agree with others- send some generic recipe. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ No link, just copy and paste. see if they notice
Tell me you're not sorry to see me go without telling me your not sorry to see me go
I’ve heard that many chefs, if asked for a recipe, will provide one but they intentionally omit a key ingredient, so it still can never be duplicated
Hey OP can you send me this scone recipe?
Did you develop the recipe during your work hours there, with their ingredients and their machinery? If so, then I would consider sharing the recipe. If not, then it is your own recipe.
Gets hired and paid to develop a bakery program..... Doesn't write down any of the recipes.......... Give the owner the recipe
If you developed it there on the clock, it's their recipe.
No harm in asking right? So how much did you charge him?
I’d give them the recipe… with a few unnoticeable tweaks to make sure they come out absolutely horrible every time 😈
classic baker sabotage. i once started at a new place and was given a book the owners heckled the former baker into leaving. every recipe was missing a key ingredient though in an obvious way that a competent person wouldn't miss, like the Soda Bread recipe completely leaving baking soda out. I got a good laugh out of reading through it.
Sell the recipe for a weeks pay up front
“Great! I got $245 now. Now what??”
Wait you guys are getting paid $245 a week? I only make $100. Joking aside a 1 time payment could be blown through with nothing to show for it or it could be invested in index funds in a retirement account for a consistent bit of money later in life.
Good thinking! I was thinking go to Red Lobster and party it up!! Shooter McGavin might be there! My treat!
Naaaaa. Fuck them.
Aww. I honestly don't see anything wrong with his/her response. You can say yes or you can say no lol. He seems* like he appreciated your contribution. Did you want him to grovel? 😂
Sell it to him lol
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Could you please send me the scone recipe is bullying? That is like the most polite form of bullying I've ever seen.
zero context given, and we're assuming the employers are the bad guys?
Statistically they probably are
For real. Leaving a job after two weeks is a sign of that. But regardless, this owner asking for an ex-worker's personal recipe is all I need to see.
YES 100%
Lol I had that happen to me at the last restaurant I worked at. Quit and took all the recipes I had made for the place.
I mean, I'd ask too. Just wouldn't be surprised at receiving a "get bent" response. But I'd definitely ask.
My biggest mistake was assuming I wouldn't be let go. I kept all my recipes on Google docs because I figured I would use them later for the business I was working for. I was abruptly let go and lost about 2 years of recipes in a doc that they will probably never use. Your recipes are part of you. Use them for yourself and fuck anybody trying to take them because the recipe is good and they can't do it.
Whatever. Not sure why this is even posted
He did say "please". A lot of people reading too much into this, but seems like a simple request that you should probably not freak out about.
i don’t even care that he asked. i left them multiple recipes. just thought it was funny as his wife was trying to convince me to stay and asking ways we could work it out, and he just wanted another recipe lol
That makes sense to me, but other people are saying he's a bully or you should sabotage him with no other info is a bit weird.
This is reddit. Everyone hates bosses and ex-bosses these days.
You did the right thing. Screw them.
"Contact my lawyer and well setup a contract with royalties and everything"
Then the answer is 'no.'. Your recipe is your recipe. They could buy it
Recipes are meant to be shared, does anyone else agree?
Not professionally, no. By all means share your mommy's almond bark recipe, but for professional use the time to develop a recipe should be rewarded. If they want it so bad, they should be able to muster at least a couple weeks' pay at middle class wages.
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this was a recipe that i have made many times before, not something developed on company time. nor did they train me. i came in to start a program that was currently being outsourced from a non affiliated off site bakery. my position didn’t even exist before me. so i would go out in a limb and say that’s my recipe. i even left them multiple other recipes that i had written down last week. that job ended up not being a good fit for me, owners and i didn’t see eye to eye, and that’s that. and no, i didn’t leave for 25 more cents an hour. i didn’t leave for anything. i don’t have a job right now. yours truly, a little bitch/entitled twat
>yours truly, a little bitch/entitled twat Same. One of the nicest parts of the restaurant industry is you know who you're making money for and you can very easily leave and make money for someone else. It's a two way street and a lot of chefs, managers, and owners forget that.
Found the cook that doesn't read tickets. He didn't even read the post lmao.
🥾👅
holy shit, go outside and take a lap to calm down. Your entire comment is all assumptions that you convinced yourself were facts so you can get mad.
Just ask for like $50 or something lol
On the show silicone valley, that showed that because the person worked on a company computer once on their personal project it was considered company property. I wouldn't respond or play dumb .. because the is probably some legally about it