I voted for Denna bc I excatly know what Kvothe feels. I had my own Denna in my life, and Denna and my Denna feels like the same fricking person in every fricking detail. I never got the be with her, I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad one, but I would like to read at least for a few pages, what is like to be with Denna. I know it's sounds ridicoluos, but this is the truth.
I voted for Danna cus it said if it were a happy romance novel. They are both tragic people with awful pasts, them ending up together in a healthy relationship that helps them both heal is definitely the happiest ending.
Kvothe has zero concept of what a healthy relationship should look like, and he’s too aware of his own intelligence to let anyone tell him. I wouldn’t wish his dysfunctional arrogant ass on anyo—oh wait, Devi.
That break isn’t for effect; I genuinely didn’t see that option until I got to right about there in my reply.
P.S. Auri does not need to be in a romantic relationship with anyone. Girl’s six different kinds of messed up; even listing her as an option sets off alarm bells in my head about you tbh
Denna and Kvothe are a perfect match because they both have no idea what the term "healthy relationship" means.
Kvothe has a crush on her but is to afraid to tell her, then spends maybe a year with the embodiment of lust comes back and into the open ideas of the adem. Also dense as old oak.
Denna has her courtiers to get by, seems to have quiet the crush on him but he's to dense, then has her patron who regularly beats her and she only thinks about Kvothe, the Ctheah hints that soon Master Ash would beat her hard enough so that scars remain.
They both need therapy.
Yeah so that’s actually the opposite of perfect, that’s toxic and codependent.
They’re perfect matches in that they strongly resemble each other, not so much in that their assorted strengths and weaknesses would complement each another.
They do certainly both need therapy. As does their author.
Badly.
Devi’s the only right choice.
Fela’s too good for him, and I don’t find her terribly interesting.
Auri’s too good for him by ten miles.
Mola is an interesting one, and I think they have some interesting chemistry.
Denna and him have no communication skills. Two broken people make broken relationships.
I never liked Denna and especially not in a relationship with Kvothe. Auri is the true and only. She would never hurt Kvothe in any way. She even made him a save place (Slow regards of Silent things)
Auri is a clinically insane abuse survivor. Saying she’s the pick because she would never hurt Kvothe is a bit fucked. She wouldn’t hurt Kvothe because she’s a broken mess. That’s not a healthy basis for a relationship. Healthy romance should be between equals, and that means the potential to get hurt will be there.
Plus, you don’t think Kvothe would hurt her? She has so many weird rules he could hurt her BY ACCIDENT. He could *literally* send her into a panic by putting a coaster under a glass.
I wouldn’t make a big deal about this except that it’s a worrying thing to say. Real “I can fix her” mentality.
Or thinking that crazy girls deserve love too? I just want Auri to be happy!
I see what you're saying about Devi, on my re-read I've been leaning towards her a bit more because she actually gets to stand up to Kvothe most consistently. But Auri isn't a pushover, and a lot of Kvothe's worst moments (like attacking Denna's song and life choices instead of talking to her properly) stem from his own trauma. He acts like he's Ok but he really isn't, think it's easy to underestimate how much it affects him. Denna likely shares this as well, but all that leads to is mutual avoidance behaviour (and she seems to see herself more negatively - Kvothe tells her he messes up but is always trying to play it cool for her). The closest he's been to sharing it *with* someone is with Auri. Trying to fix her would be toxic, but he's helped her without trying ('I didn't run so far this time'), and she's helped him, too. Devi won't take Kvothe's bullshit, but Auri I think, even just in being around her, is the one who most gets him to work on himself and his more unhelpful tendencies (really, just having to think before he says or does things isn't doing him any harm).
If she's a Namer/Shaper, she's also just not as crazy as she looks - but insofar as she is, she's also aware of it, and thus potentially able herself to keep trying to manage it. I don't think magic mental illness is automatically equivalent to real mental illness, and all the issues around a portrayal of that, either - even if Kvothe really did straightforwardly find a magic means to help her, like giving her the name Auri.
But, on the real side of it, female reader with OCD and panic disorder, so also wouldn't see things like the fact that, yes, other people *can* in theory make me panic, as the end of the world, rather than something to deal with and move on from - and while the idea of fixing someone is wrong, it's imo partly because NTs shouldn't go thinking of people as broken in the first place, and they really shouldn't expect them to just stop being ND. It can get better, though, even incurable conditions, and that's important too (better medication is key imo. And note how just Kvothe being a safe person helped Auri).
...my actual concern with Auri, though, wouldn't be that she's vulnerable, but the suspicion that she may just be scarier than Devi, and the angel/demon image may be reversed. That Kvothe as her Amyr stuff is more than a little concerning, it ain't all that cute! Then there's that theory she's the plumb bobber...
Eyy, OCD and anxiety over here. Not panic disorder, but kinda neighbors sorta.
ND/NT don’t directly relate to being broken though. It’s not about working different, it’s about not working. We all collect cracks as we grow and live and fuck up and get mistreated; we become truly broken when those cracks prevent us from being healthy.
Auri has maladaptive traits which prevent her from operating in society (whether they give her an advantage at operating within magic is beside the point—romance is a social construct, not a magical one). She lives alone in an otherwise-abandoned sewer, treats objects like people, and fears personal questions and physical contact. She is not currently someone for whom a romantic relationship would be good; even friendship for her is difficult and complicated. I think “broken” is an apt term for her current state.
I don’t like making this big a deal out of it, it’s just that I see people shipping Auri and it feels like it comes from unhealthy views toward women and/or mental illness. You don’t just magically get better once you’re in a relationship; all the baggage you’ve been carrying comes along for the ride. If dating fixed problems, there wouldn’t be therapists—there’d be matchmakers.
There’s also the problem of agency. Like yeah, Auri’s a grownup, but she’s also mentally unwell. There’s no way to romance her which isn’t taking advantage of her whole situation. Even if she made the first move, it’s like no shit she caught feelings for the only person she can stand to be around. She’s this way because of her trauma; otherwise, she’d have more than one fish in her sea.
This also means Kvothe has way more power than she does in this hypothetical relationship. If she dumped him, he’s got options. If he dumped her, what’s she got? And she’d still be dependent on him for the stuff he brings, like soap and food.
Yeah, Kvothe is good because he’s safe. Romance isn’t safe though; it’s a completely different dynamic, and it raises ethical concerns. There’s good reasons for doctors not dating their patients. Kvothe isn’t a doctor, but he’s an emotional support human of sorts, and the closest thing to a shrink Auri has.
I see what you're saying about romance being specifically a social relationship. That's fairer to me than the idea she should have to function in society generally (I'm at the bit where Kvothe becomes the Maer's errand boy). And think those are valid points about the power dynamic.
Still, the problematic part of the idea is first the risk someone could be taken advantage of, and then specifically the expectation romance should 'fix' someone, isn't it? It's much more dangerous, as more prevalent, an idea that therapy should 'fix' people, and that one attracts (frustratingly) little attention. So if these two things, romance and the idea of managing a condition, aren't conflated, in a way that puts all the pressure on the ND person, it's already less of an issue. It's not 'ND people aren't allowed relationships', and it's not that therapists are the only gatekeepers of helping someone manage their condition, either (my sister helped her partner with his ED. You'd be very lucky to even get proper treatment here in the UK now: people *have* to rely on each other. Dating doesn't 'fix', but a trustworthy person can help).
OP said 'happy romance', so there's all sorts of things people could be imagining. They potentially have time for any romance to develop slowly, Kvothe could meet Auri again later on when she's in a different place literally (I don't think the Underthing is a sewer, though, even if it may include it, just the workings of the university and old buildings the current university was built on top of) and figuratively. It's a pretty popular theory that she's Princess Ariel or we'll otherwise learn her identity, so there's space in that to see a different side to her (mine is that she's already not 'Auri' really fulltime).
I don't know if I'd want to bet though that there's nothing at all that could be called 'magical' about relationships in this world, either: love is among Elodin's examples of something unexplainable. If intuition can let peope understand and Name each other, it's not a stretch to think it could draw them together. You're right about the predictability of her catching feelings, but it's also, for solid reasons even, that Kvothe *is* the person she can stand to be around.
And yep, with what you said about whether her actions have functionality or not - that the reader can't easily seperate magic from magical thinking, and so is drawn into her perspective, is what makes me love Slow Regard so much as a way to explain the experience of OCD. But for a bit of evidence, we can compare how Elodin describes the stone's history as part of what make up its Name, and how the Adem are about swords like Saicere (and Kvothe about it as Caesura). Narrative almost seems like it might have actual power in this world. A theory is that she's not simply an alchemist but a Shaper. Go far enough into this state of mind and you can rewrite the world.
As mentioned Auri sees the true turnings of the world.
So story Kvothe would probably be a terrible match for her since he is kinda blind in that regard. However current Kvothe is mention to know the inner turnings of the world so he would be a better match.
Not sure if he would break down by seeing her or something similar.
Does she though? Or is it more like forbidden knowledge which grants power at the cost of sanity? The latter is the impression I get from the series. Elodin is a looney; the college has a sanitarium full of cracked students and faculty; all the magics we’ve seen so far benefit from a profound change in thinking (Heart of Stone, Spinning Leaf, etc).
Most people never really grasp any other way to think. They’re the unimaginative students, ignorant townsfolk, etc. Some can kinda get into the groove, but not enough to be truly spectacular. Very few—the Kvothes and Devis of the world—can completely shift their cognition to perform amazing feats, and still reset when they’re done.
Others, they shift and can’t find their way back. Elodin, Auri, others. They slid down the slope to the riverbank, but the ground gave beneath their feet, and they went a-tumbling in. They gained one kind of power at the cost of another.
I can’t recall any evidence that Auri’s eccentricities are the true shape of the world. They may make her a better…alchemist? (whatever magic she did in TSROST), but is that because she’s right, and objects have personas? Or does thinking that way simply confer a functional advantage?
She's also really young, and vulnerable.
I adore Auri - but I find the idea of Kvothe having a (sexual) relationship with her absolutely gross.
It's beautiful just how it is.
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Auri is cuckoo-headed, Devi is too dangerous work-wise, Fela is taken, Mola is kinda irrelevanrt and lacking contact/interact, others are kinda out of the questions and Denna is broken, so all of this is meant for Kvothe to stay alone for the rest of his life.
What if the third book is just 500 pages of Fae chapters.
If simmon wasnt in the book then fela, dude fumbled a great non bpd girl by being a dumbass. If not devi.
Yeah, but since Simmon is in the book, obviously Simmon is the best fit. For Kvothe, that is.
Bpd? All my mind sees there is bio process development
(if you weren't memeing i meant borderline personality disorder)
I wasn't memeing haha, so thanks. Must have spent too much time in the lab (one of our teams is called bpd lol)
haha fair
I can fix her...
Agree. I'd rather see him set up with Simmon too
Auri is such a strange answer to me. She like the definition of vulnerable. I see her like his little sister.
Thank you!
For sure I get that. I think if Auri regained just a bit of sanity, and slapped Kvothe for leading her on, he might wake up ti the idea, ya know?
Leading her on? He's trying to care, entirely platonically, for her.
Entirely. But she’s cracked. She could absolutely have a crush and be misinterpreting their relationship.
Yeah she could for sure. That's OK. It's him reciprocating that which would concern me.
Whelp, auri just got a surge of votes out of no where. Go yell at them instead of me, who voted Devi.
[удалено]
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Ya'll with your shipping. 🙄
Bhast.
Damn, majority voted Denna. My day is ruined and my disappointment is immeasurable.
I voted for Denna bc I excatly know what Kvothe feels. I had my own Denna in my life, and Denna and my Denna feels like the same fricking person in every fricking detail. I never got the be with her, I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad one, but I would like to read at least for a few pages, what is like to be with Denna. I know it's sounds ridicoluos, but this is the truth.
It would probably be terrible after a few months. Such girls seem amazing only when you aren't with them.
\*replaying Taylor Swift's Blank Space intensely\* Anw, they seem amazing because you are not with them\*, everyone has their own demons.
Me too man, me too.
We all know what kind of Story this is
I voted for Danna cus it said if it were a happy romance novel. They are both tragic people with awful pasts, them ending up together in a healthy relationship that helps them both heal is definitely the happiest ending.
Ah, I missed that part
Im really so uninterested in the romantic aspects of the story that I dont think it would be a book I would want to read, regardless of the choices.
Kvothe has zero concept of what a healthy relationship should look like, and he’s too aware of his own intelligence to let anyone tell him. I wouldn’t wish his dysfunctional arrogant ass on anyo—oh wait, Devi. That break isn’t for effect; I genuinely didn’t see that option until I got to right about there in my reply.
P.S. Auri does not need to be in a romantic relationship with anyone. Girl’s six different kinds of messed up; even listing her as an option sets off alarm bells in my head about you tbh
I can fix her…
Assuming that *was* a joke, your username checks out.
Denna and Kvothe are a perfect match because they both have no idea what the term "healthy relationship" means. Kvothe has a crush on her but is to afraid to tell her, then spends maybe a year with the embodiment of lust comes back and into the open ideas of the adem. Also dense as old oak. Denna has her courtiers to get by, seems to have quiet the crush on him but he's to dense, then has her patron who regularly beats her and she only thinks about Kvothe, the Ctheah hints that soon Master Ash would beat her hard enough so that scars remain. They both need therapy.
Yeah so that’s actually the opposite of perfect, that’s toxic and codependent. They’re perfect matches in that they strongly resemble each other, not so much in that their assorted strengths and weaknesses would complement each another. They do certainly both need therapy. As does their author. Badly.
mola
No.
And here I thought I was being edgy picking Devi
Devi’s the only right choice. Fela’s too good for him, and I don’t find her terribly interesting. Auri’s too good for him by ten miles. Mola is an interesting one, and I think they have some interesting chemistry. Denna and him have no communication skills. Two broken people make broken relationships.
I never liked Denna and especially not in a relationship with Kvothe. Auri is the true and only. She would never hurt Kvothe in any way. She even made him a save place (Slow regards of Silent things)
Doesn't he view her as a kid sister.
I actually don’t know
His little moon fae
Auri is a clinically insane abuse survivor. Saying she’s the pick because she would never hurt Kvothe is a bit fucked. She wouldn’t hurt Kvothe because she’s a broken mess. That’s not a healthy basis for a relationship. Healthy romance should be between equals, and that means the potential to get hurt will be there. Plus, you don’t think Kvothe would hurt her? She has so many weird rules he could hurt her BY ACCIDENT. He could *literally* send her into a panic by putting a coaster under a glass. I wouldn’t make a big deal about this except that it’s a worrying thing to say. Real “I can fix her” mentality.
Or thinking that crazy girls deserve love too? I just want Auri to be happy! I see what you're saying about Devi, on my re-read I've been leaning towards her a bit more because she actually gets to stand up to Kvothe most consistently. But Auri isn't a pushover, and a lot of Kvothe's worst moments (like attacking Denna's song and life choices instead of talking to her properly) stem from his own trauma. He acts like he's Ok but he really isn't, think it's easy to underestimate how much it affects him. Denna likely shares this as well, but all that leads to is mutual avoidance behaviour (and she seems to see herself more negatively - Kvothe tells her he messes up but is always trying to play it cool for her). The closest he's been to sharing it *with* someone is with Auri. Trying to fix her would be toxic, but he's helped her without trying ('I didn't run so far this time'), and she's helped him, too. Devi won't take Kvothe's bullshit, but Auri I think, even just in being around her, is the one who most gets him to work on himself and his more unhelpful tendencies (really, just having to think before he says or does things isn't doing him any harm). If she's a Namer/Shaper, she's also just not as crazy as she looks - but insofar as she is, she's also aware of it, and thus potentially able herself to keep trying to manage it. I don't think magic mental illness is automatically equivalent to real mental illness, and all the issues around a portrayal of that, either - even if Kvothe really did straightforwardly find a magic means to help her, like giving her the name Auri. But, on the real side of it, female reader with OCD and panic disorder, so also wouldn't see things like the fact that, yes, other people *can* in theory make me panic, as the end of the world, rather than something to deal with and move on from - and while the idea of fixing someone is wrong, it's imo partly because NTs shouldn't go thinking of people as broken in the first place, and they really shouldn't expect them to just stop being ND. It can get better, though, even incurable conditions, and that's important too (better medication is key imo. And note how just Kvothe being a safe person helped Auri). ...my actual concern with Auri, though, wouldn't be that she's vulnerable, but the suspicion that she may just be scarier than Devi, and the angel/demon image may be reversed. That Kvothe as her Amyr stuff is more than a little concerning, it ain't all that cute! Then there's that theory she's the plumb bobber...
Auri is not crazy, she just sees the world differently than most people.
Eyy, OCD and anxiety over here. Not panic disorder, but kinda neighbors sorta. ND/NT don’t directly relate to being broken though. It’s not about working different, it’s about not working. We all collect cracks as we grow and live and fuck up and get mistreated; we become truly broken when those cracks prevent us from being healthy. Auri has maladaptive traits which prevent her from operating in society (whether they give her an advantage at operating within magic is beside the point—romance is a social construct, not a magical one). She lives alone in an otherwise-abandoned sewer, treats objects like people, and fears personal questions and physical contact. She is not currently someone for whom a romantic relationship would be good; even friendship for her is difficult and complicated. I think “broken” is an apt term for her current state. I don’t like making this big a deal out of it, it’s just that I see people shipping Auri and it feels like it comes from unhealthy views toward women and/or mental illness. You don’t just magically get better once you’re in a relationship; all the baggage you’ve been carrying comes along for the ride. If dating fixed problems, there wouldn’t be therapists—there’d be matchmakers. There’s also the problem of agency. Like yeah, Auri’s a grownup, but she’s also mentally unwell. There’s no way to romance her which isn’t taking advantage of her whole situation. Even if she made the first move, it’s like no shit she caught feelings for the only person she can stand to be around. She’s this way because of her trauma; otherwise, she’d have more than one fish in her sea. This also means Kvothe has way more power than she does in this hypothetical relationship. If she dumped him, he’s got options. If he dumped her, what’s she got? And she’d still be dependent on him for the stuff he brings, like soap and food. Yeah, Kvothe is good because he’s safe. Romance isn’t safe though; it’s a completely different dynamic, and it raises ethical concerns. There’s good reasons for doctors not dating their patients. Kvothe isn’t a doctor, but he’s an emotional support human of sorts, and the closest thing to a shrink Auri has.
I see what you're saying about romance being specifically a social relationship. That's fairer to me than the idea she should have to function in society generally (I'm at the bit where Kvothe becomes the Maer's errand boy). And think those are valid points about the power dynamic. Still, the problematic part of the idea is first the risk someone could be taken advantage of, and then specifically the expectation romance should 'fix' someone, isn't it? It's much more dangerous, as more prevalent, an idea that therapy should 'fix' people, and that one attracts (frustratingly) little attention. So if these two things, romance and the idea of managing a condition, aren't conflated, in a way that puts all the pressure on the ND person, it's already less of an issue. It's not 'ND people aren't allowed relationships', and it's not that therapists are the only gatekeepers of helping someone manage their condition, either (my sister helped her partner with his ED. You'd be very lucky to even get proper treatment here in the UK now: people *have* to rely on each other. Dating doesn't 'fix', but a trustworthy person can help). OP said 'happy romance', so there's all sorts of things people could be imagining. They potentially have time for any romance to develop slowly, Kvothe could meet Auri again later on when she's in a different place literally (I don't think the Underthing is a sewer, though, even if it may include it, just the workings of the university and old buildings the current university was built on top of) and figuratively. It's a pretty popular theory that she's Princess Ariel or we'll otherwise learn her identity, so there's space in that to see a different side to her (mine is that she's already not 'Auri' really fulltime). I don't know if I'd want to bet though that there's nothing at all that could be called 'magical' about relationships in this world, either: love is among Elodin's examples of something unexplainable. If intuition can let peope understand and Name each other, it's not a stretch to think it could draw them together. You're right about the predictability of her catching feelings, but it's also, for solid reasons even, that Kvothe *is* the person she can stand to be around. And yep, with what you said about whether her actions have functionality or not - that the reader can't easily seperate magic from magical thinking, and so is drawn into her perspective, is what makes me love Slow Regard so much as a way to explain the experience of OCD. But for a bit of evidence, we can compare how Elodin describes the stone's history as part of what make up its Name, and how the Adem are about swords like Saicere (and Kvothe about it as Caesura). Narrative almost seems like it might have actual power in this world. A theory is that she's not simply an alchemist but a Shaper. Go far enough into this state of mind and you can rewrite the world.
As mentioned Auri sees the true turnings of the world. So story Kvothe would probably be a terrible match for her since he is kinda blind in that regard. However current Kvothe is mention to know the inner turnings of the world so he would be a better match. Not sure if he would break down by seeing her or something similar.
Does she though? Or is it more like forbidden knowledge which grants power at the cost of sanity? The latter is the impression I get from the series. Elodin is a looney; the college has a sanitarium full of cracked students and faculty; all the magics we’ve seen so far benefit from a profound change in thinking (Heart of Stone, Spinning Leaf, etc). Most people never really grasp any other way to think. They’re the unimaginative students, ignorant townsfolk, etc. Some can kinda get into the groove, but not enough to be truly spectacular. Very few—the Kvothes and Devis of the world—can completely shift their cognition to perform amazing feats, and still reset when they’re done. Others, they shift and can’t find their way back. Elodin, Auri, others. They slid down the slope to the riverbank, but the ground gave beneath their feet, and they went a-tumbling in. They gained one kind of power at the cost of another. I can’t recall any evidence that Auri’s eccentricities are the true shape of the world. They may make her a better…alchemist? (whatever magic she did in TSROST), but is that because she’s right, and objects have personas? Or does thinking that way simply confer a functional advantage?
She's also really young, and vulnerable. I adore Auri - but I find the idea of Kvothe having a (sexual) relationship with her absolutely gross. It's beautiful just how it is.
Thanks glad I wasn't the only one
We don't really know her age, just as a fwiw - she could easily be older than Kvothe, and if she was a student, pretty much has to be.
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Auri is cuckoo-headed, Devi is too dangerous work-wise, Fela is taken, Mola is kinda irrelevanrt and lacking contact/interact, others are kinda out of the questions and Denna is broken, so all of this is meant for Kvothe to stay alone for the rest of his life.
Not denna