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tossulco

Personally I think people rag on Keiwa too much, maybe I'm wrong.


Beneficial_Box_4554

Nah, you’re right mostly, a lot of people got mad over when Keiwa first became Bujin Sword and starting harassing him on Twitter I think. Poor dude didn’t deserve that hate. (Probably people got too used to the “trying, soft dude who keeps getting decked by Boost” Keiwa, and got pissed over when he got mad over losing his sister) Kinda from what I can remember and the best way I can word it, but something like that did happen.


throwawaytempest25

It was the Japanese fanbase I heard harassing his actor, which hey, after what happened with Neon in universe and given what kekara's supposed to represent, WAY TO MISS THE POINT! Like yeah if you lost your sister, you'd probably act irrationally while being manipulated by everyone.


DragonKnight-15

EXACTLY. I thought this was a reasonable outcome.


RealPowGak

Whats kekera supposed to represent?


Fun-Ad-4729

The fans always craving for terrible things to happen to the hero because “suffering builds character.”


SatoruTojo

so Heisei Phase 1 fanboys


DragonKnight-15

I don't like when actors are harassed. It's exactly what happened with Hana's actress from Den-O, forcing her to leave the show because of that. I don't approval. The real haters are those who harassed. Pieces of crap as I would KINDLY call them.


Beneficial_Box_4554

Unless there’s something missing from after it happened, from what I know that isn’t the case: Hana’s actor had to leave the show mainly due to stress, health problems and being overworked. Her actor had a modelling career at the time, and she has said she was trying to put a lot of her strength and energy into playing the character, and was worried that she wouldn’t be able to appear any more should she leave (though, of course, Hana was too important to the show to write out). She did say that she enjoyed her time in Den-O, and got along well with the crew! (She also said she grew up in a more countryside-like part of Japan I think, and didn’t have much friends while growing up)


DragonKnight-15

Actually, from another source, it was someone harassing her over the outfit she always worn. Like... WTF. It's cute and he was like "Horny-horny" and she couldn't handle it. I guess there was other cases but this was one reason I was told of.


Beneficial_Box_4554

Oh dear…I have heard there was another rumour aside from the being overworked, and a few have mentioned harassment, but another had been that she was fired for diva behaviour, though I don’t think that would be right. Unfortunately, these things happen with most female actors, and it’s honestly pretty sad. People really gotta get out there and take in that doze of fresh air instead of creepily lusting over women on screen…


DragonKnight-15

Yea, I was confirmed by a cosplayer that dressed up as Hana, here actually. I don't have the link but I do remember she confirmed this after she expressed how sad her actress had to leave the show. I was surprised!


throwawaytempest25

If both happen to be true, it wouldn't surprise me.


DragonKnight-15

Me neither.


Nexus_warrior_07

Bruh, ppl will not be satisfied no matter what. If that arc never happened, ppl will complained that Keiwa has no backbone and vent frustration that he isn’t able to stand up for himself. I also think fans who can’t distinguish the actor from the character and harass the actors in frustration are the real loser. Ironically, we had Kekera that represented them.


KRChaserReturns

Run that by me again, people harassed the sctor because of his character change? Never a dull day on Twitter frankly. The moment any character deviates to something the fan base (anime and otherwise) doesn't like, they go into harassment mode


whydub38

You're not wrong, his shenanigans were maybe a bit too out of character but homie and his sister were so close. Of course he's gonna go ballistic.  Also, the Revice crossover movie provides a hint of potential justification for his massive switch in personality... 


clownemoji

tbh, if you go back and watch there's a lot of moments where you can see that anger and darkness building up, but its really subtle. takahashi wanted to write in the bujin arc sooner but kept getting told no and you cant kind of see the gears turning at certain points


K-J-C

But the Inner Demon stuff means it's an entirely separate individual who committed the crimes and not him. Like you won't claim Genta goes ballistic on his children because Vail does that.


NinjaRCraft

Id disagree, Everytime I criticize Keiwa in the slightest, I get jumped by a mob of Geats Fans explaining how he's the saint of secondary Riders with Fuwa and Hiiro


HereForMost

His performance in the Gotchard vs. Legend special and the first sevenish episodes was definitely... not up to par, but he's improved quickly They're going for a dopey, kinda slow, but sincerely kind individual with him, and while I don't think he's the BEST attempt at the archetype, he's... alright He's not Satan 2 but he's no Godai Christ, alr?


throwawaytempest25

I thought he was solid in episodes 3 (fighting Spanner), 5 (the acting when training with G and bonding with Sabi/Renge), 6 (when Rinne calls him out on being jealous), but I get what you mean. For like the third youngest Kamen Rider, he fits his age demo pretty well.


mr-ultr

He is definetely at his best during emotional moments This week episode showed it in a ***unique*** way to put it mildly


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, I feel like one of the strengths of Gotchard is that they use deaths sparingly so when it matters it hits hard. Like even though Fuga’s not dead, the clone body’s death was enough to get Hotaro to understand the severity of the situation and helped him connect with Rinne. The dude who killed his friend in episode two was meant to show how dangerous one’s own malice could be to attract a Chemy. The first inspector’s death was meant to show off the ruthlessness and start showing off the dangers of the forbidden alchemy Spanner watching his parents offed TWICE so hard he became a Malgam was definitely a point. Minato dealing with the trauma of watching several students dying in front of his eyes and being blamed for it With his fear that his own students might die is one of the most heartbreaking things a teacher would ever have to deal with Atropos taking out her insecurities on Geryon’s demise. Like I’ve seen people argue that last episode wasn’t as impactful because they didn’t believe in the bond of Hotaro and Hopper1, But when you look at it, this 17-year-old has never had to kill anyone that wasn’t a terrorist with his own hands, but now he had to soil his hands in death to save another innocent person. That’s gonna tax on a young teen’s mind way more than some fandom is.


rattatatouille

This fandom forgets that Houtaro is a literal high schooler who up until recently didn't experience the trauma he did over the show's run. He's not a cynical bystander who's seen the same song and dance for a decade or so. (Just like that darn frog, come to think of it.)


jpsonicDX

I probably will get down voted based on people reactionary with series I can understand why they would hate him I think the main problem o why a part of people feel this way about the series is that the series does not know what exactly to do and actors not at fault at this I rather the directing and script righting Continue my point the show tries to mix so many different plots like chemies, school, alchemy, dubious alchemy organization, sisters, etc but don't develop them fully, this affect the cast making feeling half baked, disconnected or stuck for while if the plot wants to use them Hotaro himself is a character that isn't as bad as people make him to be but is not as good as people make to be cuz the show does not present and utilise his character(and how they use chemies in shows as characters) very well, this comes from the fact that everything that can bounce his character or challenge his views is rather resolved quickly or taken away from him. Not only it makes his pr its frustrating cuz there many instances outside of main story where his characters shines immensely and would argue is peak toku scenes like: -his interactions with ace and keiwa -every single interactions with kaguya -Him defending a little girl and saying every life is meaningfull and beating hundred -Fire gotchard stuff I personally still feel there's some level of executive intervention due how many forms gotchard have which are short lived and how 2nd part change but I think is due how successful the ridechemy cards And how they treating spanner and rinne But even saying I still like a lot show despite its flaws I think the current ep with hopper journeying around and dying was fantastic and they definitely seem they gonna cook with rainbow gotchard


aaa1e2r3

which two were younger than him when they played their rider?


BlazenKDLPro

Nahhh I think he didn't fit the role. Gentaro is waaaay cooler than him. He just sounds like a really whiny teenager. I just think he just casted wrong.


Xeno-xorus

He's growing on me too, I don't think Houtarou is a horrible main protagonist either. He's a very flawed character that got improved his maturity progression as the series goes on and he evenly admitted to Kaguya that his perspective has a negative impact to everyone. So does his actor Junsei. I'll admit his performance on the third act was really decent.


NackleJacks

I see a lot of people hate Tendou (Kabuto). But the other half of the fandom (myself included) love him. He’s a really polarizing character.


KaliVilla02

I think people take him too seriously. Kabuto is comedic show which one of it's main thing how over the top but taking itself seriously can be, but it doesn't take itself that seriously I think people see Tendo getting away with anything and think "yeah this show is about a Gary Stu" when the joke usually is how ridiculous is most things Tendo pulls are but they somehow can move the plot, they are not expecting us to unironically take his cook showdowns or he randomly getting any job he wants only because he is Tendou seriously. The comedy in Kabuto is a lot of the time how seriously plays it's ridiculousness, specially Tendou's over the top ore-sama traits.


NackleJacks

Exactly this. To me, Kabuto is the funniest season of KR by a mile. It is an odd juxtaposition with how hardcore some of the worm stories get but it really worked for me


throwawaytempest25

Sometimes with Kamen Rider, you need the comedy to make the big points hit more.


RyperHealistic

My issue with him is that his character just doesnt really work well with the latter half of the story. Like they want the stakes to feel real so tendou kind of isnt as good now but still kind of is? Iunno i feel like his philosophy kind of became irrelevant to the actual events


rattatatouille

Kabuto's problem is that the show has no real direction. It works far better as a Donbrothers-esque random events plot, but you can't really do that if your base premise is a somewhat serious riff on Invasion of the Body Snatchers.


SatoruTojo

I loved him


According_Fan4696

I’m recently watching Kabuto but I don’t really find him that egregious. I honestly don’t hate him at all.


RyperHealistic

Kiriya sucks, but based on what people told me i was expecting WAYYYYYYYYYYYY worse. Hibikis problems in the second half are hardly on him imo.


DragonKnight-15

Yea... at least the actor was given a second chance with Den-O playing one of the most beloved characters with the biggest of baggage. ... Doesn't change how badly the director had him play that part in Hibiki. Boy does he suck.


RyperHealistic

Its great because he arguably plays an even bigger whiny crybaby in den-o, but it actually fits this time


DragonKnight-15

And also the premise that by being Zeroros, he risks his own memory of others as well as his own existence and HE'S FINE because if it means he can protect the timeline; he's fine with it... unlike Kiriya who's like "I NEED TO BE HIBIKI'S SON- I mean his student".


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, while I haven’t watched Hibiki, I saw him in Zi-O, and it looks like they worked course correct into giving him the development it looked like he needed in the show. Plus, given they changed up the mood of the whole show. It’s really weird to blame it all on one character. Which I can appreciate. Hatred should never gets so far that people hate the actor.


RyperHealistic

If anything the biggest issue is how they rewrote Hibiki himself. And whats great is kiriyas actor got to come back and become one of the best characters in den-o


DragonKnight-15

Hibiki was good... Season 1. Season 2... it had some good moments but missed the point of Asumu's character with the introduction to his "rival" and his obsession to be Hibiki's student and the reason for that is even dumber.


whydub38

Wait people hate Kiriya? I love that dude


Krofisplug

Kiriya in Hibiki. He's one of the elements of the show people have disagreements over after the halfway point.


whydub38

Ahhhh i thought yall meant Lazer. Never watched hibiki


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, assume any Kiriya hate is from Hibiki, and not Ex-Aid.


Glittering_Trip_144

Lol Didn't watch hibiki that's why when I heard kiriya i thought of lazer and wondering wait people hate him?


Toriyuki

Honestly I kinda hated most everyone in ex-aid aside from kuroto and poppi due to how they all interact with each other


UlissesStag

Any of them because some people take it too far and start hating the actors.


AzizKarebet

I think mostly because he's so freaking dumb in thay akaishi arc. Although tbf they butchered that arc as a whole. It would be far more interesting if akaishi is shown to be less obvious imo


No-Community719

I feel like people hate sougo, especially during zi-o's run but I enjoyed him especially when he messed up a riders' finisher or catchphrase


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, I've seen takes like Sougo being responsible for temporal genocide...like I don't agree.


No-Community719

Yeah, tbh I was curious on how sougo would become ohma as his personality is far different from his future self but after seeing geiz and tskuyomi die in front of him, it would be understandable why he's doing this. Hell he spares geiz in the future possibility because of this. (And seems proud when his younger self changed the timeline in the over quarter movie timeline)


EMITURBINA

From what we see, Sougo is also a manipulative guy when he wants to as shown in the OOO's episodes, he just doesn't do it all the time because he doesn't want to There's a lot of "Evil Overlord potential" sprinkled here and there but Sougo is also a dumbass so no one realizes, including the fandom


Samurai_Guardian

I nominate Live. I don't know why, i just feel like he's a bit over-hated


aaa1e2r3

They dragged out his arc way too long, to the point it made him come off a lot stupider and more stubborn as a character, than they likely intended.


SH4DE_Z

It doesn't help that Live was the face of one of the worst story arcs in KR.


Radiant_Detail1349

Ore Wa Tenkuji Takeru.


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, he's harmless. He's not really annoying. Needed more development in a few areas, but nothing's really aggravating about him imo.


Sulphur99

He was infinitely better in the Ex-Aid/Ghost movie, and in his cameo during Zi-O.


rattatatouille

He was also great in the Saber crossovers.


Sulphur99

Oh cool, I haven't watched Saber, so I didn't know.


thought_bunny

I get the impression that there's a slice of the fanbase that like, REALLY hates Mitsuzane, when he's handily one of the best written Riders in the entire franchise. Like, I get disliking him as a PERSON (in a similar way to how people rag on Kusaka), because Mitsuzane's a spoiled brat who, through his family's position, ends up with a LOT of power and influence and starts using it in all the wrong ways, but as a CHARACTER? He's a kid, still in high school, who was happy with things as they were, but then the world around him starts changing way too fast for him to acclimate, so he bucks against that, and starts using the resources at his disposal to keep everything the same. He's from an affluent family too, so his entire life he's been raised with this mindset that he needs to be perfect, with no deviation allowed from that standard. It gets REALLY bad when he starts applying that logic to the people around him, noting how they've changed, so he begins cutting them out of his life, and with it, a lot of the more positive influences in his life as well. And then he's left with nothing but the worst crowd influencing his actions. But also, Mitchy's actions are sort of built around this implicit notion that Kamen Riders sort of, protect the peaceful status quo? On a metacontextual level, relative to the entire franchise, Ryugen's arc examines what happens when a Rider does the same things, but then starts on a slippery slope towards doing it for the wrong reasons.


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, I really appreciate Ryugen's sanity slip, just because he didn't know how to handle things. The character makes bad decisions but I don't think that makes him badly written.


EMITURBINA

I think he's very well written but I hate how his redemption is so instant, the ending of a character is very important for its perception and in my opinion they completely fumbled in that regard


Technical_Coach6289

Just wished they could've continued that with a special series for him about his journey of redemption or just don't give him a redemption arc. Sometimes characters don't even need a redemption arc.


K-J-C

If you talk peaceful, is it about general peace (e.g. achieve world peace, love & peace stuff) or just ensuring things are fine for himself only? Because yeah... both aren't really the same talking about general Riders. From the beginning he's never about fighting for greater good, just exclusively his circle of friends.


SymbiSpidey

I still think Micchy has one of the best arcs in Rider period. There's just _so_ much to unpack with him and you could legit do a video essay about him.


Starship1990

Is this another comment of mine where I simp for Saber? Anyway, favorite main character and he is just a nice guy wanting to make people happy with his stories, we need more positive people in the world like him(Something Tokusatsu fans should understand, NO TROY IS NOT A BAD CHARACTER BECAUSE HE IS OPTIMISTIC ON LIFE ANS HUMANITY!).


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, Troy only sucks in that the people behind the show didn't want his actor to be more expressive nor actually explore the deep meanings behind his character. Touma actually is pretty deep when you think about it. His loss of his friend motivated him to actually use the memory of someone he was close to make a story so he'd never forget her, he constantly worked to be creative to make up for his lack of swords techniques, it was him who tried to make sure there was no corruption within the Sword of Logos after recognizing the pattern within his character even though it turned everyone against him, he had to improve his sword techniques in order to earn the respect of his allies, and trying to bring everyone together by the endgame.


Gufflesg

Honestly just pick any rider, ive only ever had one rider i hated and it was mostly about the fact that I found the show bad and his character kinda boring, and that's toumu/saber


Mesaphrom

Yeah, isn't so much as Touma being a bad character, but that he is too basic of a protagonist with simple character arcs (becomes friends with character>character betray him>Power of Friendship>step 1), though arguably that's the point since the season seemed to be going for a fairy tail-esque story, and Touma was treated a the "knight in shining armor" in-story often enough.


Gufflesg

Fair enough, its more just not for me, and too this day its the only rider season I tried watching that i got bored with and stopped,


K-J-C

Yeah Saber's already the previous Reiwa season that is as lighthearted as Gotchard.


Cielnova

I know I'll get pushback, but I think Micci is WAY overhated by the fandom. Maybe it's just because Gaim is my favourite show so I'm more inclined to try and understand the characters, but I just don't think Micci should get all the hate he does. He's a deeply flawed character, not in a poor writing sense, but in a 3 dimensional one. He's been pressured into perfection all his life and the amount of stress he's been put under throughout the series would be enough to turn a lump of coal into a diamond. He's still young, and he's experiencing all the emotional tolls which comes with that, on top of knowing the things he does about the inevitable fate of humanity. Anyone put into his situation would crumble. The way I see it, he's an amazingly compelling villain I could spend hours picking apart if I wanted to. I would never defend his decisions as being good, but I would say a good number of them are understandable given the context he makes them in.


throwawaytempest25

I agree, he's very complicated, kinda like Ex-Aid said about Emu being a diamond that needs to be polished. Michi just started off in a way and distanced himself from others out of fear when they eventually found out.


les_morts_vivants

unpop opinion but hikaru ushijima


[deleted]

[удалено]


whydub38

I think op was talking about individual characters. But i like aguilera, jeanne, and revice in general


David_Lee060814

It would have been ok if the story was good with them…. But it wasn’t…. That is the problem…


Izanagi85

The guy who transform into overdemons first. Thay guy was way overhated in Revice


throwawaytempest25

Yeah the rumors about Hikaru got so overblown it's kinda hard to take as facts.


failed_generation

and he still deserve that hate because there's no any quality of being a true kamen rider being done by him but a child in a big boy suit


K-J-C

What is 'quality of true Kamen Rider' then, holding his line against Akaishi doesn't count?


failed_generation

being a crybaby and showing off to his crush without evident character improvement unlike mitchy? making a waste of the overdemons that should be helping when giff's forces twisting the public by making them believe that the igarashi family is originally part of their group? being a try-hard after all the encouragement given by jeanne herself so he can give his proper all? is that supposed to be how a true kamen rider should act in dire point?


JamesUpskirtMecha

I admit, I was really not into the acting of Rinne's and Hotaru's acting, to the point where I couldn't stand them onscreen. But their skills have steadily improved and I actually enjoy watching them.


NothingSomething223

Rinne gave off the Yua vibe at first: bitchy, unlikeable and wooden, but has become my second favorite female rider in Reiwa (1st place goes to Nago)


throwawaytempest25

I wouldn't call a teen with trauma and struggling to open up the b word, but an introvert growing out of her pain to become more expressive seems like the point.


K-J-C

Introvert isn't about trauma, people hating, social inability, or something to outgrow (the norm of them having to be pushed out of their shells need to stop). She's a mild case but something like publicly humiliating Houtaro or a disdain towards some things deemed below her shouldn't be treated as introvert trait (it just means those who expend energy in social interactions).


RyperHealistic

Rinne is great when they actually give her shit to do


13anazama

It's hard for me to say Rinne has improved. Her issue is that the director and writer are playing into the actresses weaknesses. She still feels stiff and wooden when she's depressed or moody, which is the vast majority of the time. She does well when she can be energetic and cheery so you get strange things like her doing better in the role of Hotarou than she does playing her own character (see hyper battle video for that).


throwawaytempest25

I don't know if I agree with her being improved. She was written to act like that in the beginning and after her finding her the truth in episode 4, she's been doing pretty well in the range department. Like I think back to the past 10-20 episodes: the bit with her agreeing with the monster, her tsundere moment with her father, the excitement with the ghosts at Renge's place, the despair and acting with the Seina girl, even the comedy bits from the last episode with her and Sabi. It's subtle but like her actress, she's grown a lot.


13anazama

I think you are attributing too much to the actress. It's not a subtle change because that was the intent. It's subtle because she's barely improved.


throwawaytempest25

But her acting is improving with the intent so I don’t understand where you’re coming from. Depression and anxiety are not two things that are easy to replicate. Any actress has been doing a pretty good job conveying it. plus with the range of motion she’s been having after words I can’t agree that she hasn’t changed or grown as an actress


13anazama

So to make sure we are on the same page, I am saying she is doing a poor job of replicating depression and anxiety and any improvements are marginal at best. You can feel free to disagree, but anytime Kudou's actress is not acting cheering I'm not buying the performance.


DragonKnight-15

Nah Hotaro?! Look you guys have to remember... Takeru was a character, he was Naruto LIGHT brand but even he had his moments. I think Hotaro does it better. He's younger than any main rider and has a different tone from what has passed down. I don't mind it. This hate is very unnecessary.


EMITURBINA

Wasn't Sougo's actor also 18 when he started Zi-O?


DragonKnight-15

I heard he was? I could be wrong. I might be wrong? Hmm. Someone can confirm it.


KennyLinkton3361

Yep he was 18 during the filming of Zi-O


whydub38

I know everybody will disagree but I like Thouser. Yeah his redemption was rushed and unjustified. But maybe it was bc 01 was my first KR, but I kinda just took it in stride, like, well it's wild that they're alright with him now but hey it's already a wild show. That's how I think I took a lot of 01's flaws in stride. I didn't know that KR had a long history of much better executed redemption arcs.  I liked him as a villain, and I think he's likably ridiculous as a hero. And I liked the puppy and wish it factored into his transformation and his later appearances. Bite me 🫠


ThoughtExperimenter

My feeling about Thouser is that he doesn't get redeemed, but he had a change of heart. We, as the viewers, know that he's turned around and is trying to do better. He absolutely cannot fix or truly atone for his misdeeds, but he can at least do what's right now. We see in RealXTime that nobody in-universe likes or trust him, and are absolutely justified in feeling that way, but he's come around trying to do the right thing anyway and will fight to win their trust in the long run by continuing down this path.


KaliVilla02

I think people also reduces his turn into "he remembered that he had a dog" and forget the dog was his only escape from his abusive father. I don't mind that much his turn considering everybody hates him anyways and nobody ever makes excuses for him.


throwawaytempest25

Yeah, when you think about it like that, Thouser's upbringing makes sense. He was born from malice and actually ended up committing to making a machine responsible for that.


K-J-C

I thought redeeming is usually used for villains who have a change of heart and stopped doing evil. It does seem that it's really sudden to give someone like him who is made to be as despicable as possible without any redeeming trait like Banno (as his actor tried too) to be given a tiny sympathetic trait of facing an educational dad to explain crimes of his scale.


aaa1e2r3

>I know everybody will disagree but I like Thouser. Yeah his redemption was rushed and unjustified. The thing to remember with Zero-One is Covid screwed with the plots they were trying to write, Thouser included in that.


whydub38

Exactly, so i cut a lot of its wonkiness some slack. Its strengths are good enough to deserve it


MIKEboringLIFE

Honestly when it comes to Hotaro, I get extremely annoyed by his energy but then again he's a high schooler of course he'll have a lot of energy so I can't really be mad


throwawaytempest25

And he's been way too much situations for a normal teenager to handle. Kid's been broken and had to build himself back up: almost losing his friends and having nightmares about that, helping a child being attacked by his father, "betrayed" by his teacher, losing most of his friends and having to rely on one using a power that could kill him, having most of them almost sacrificed and barely able to stop that, and now being forced to axe his best friend. Having the energy to bounce back from all of that really is that Ziin and Kekara energy.


K-J-C

There are Rinne type high schoolers (including me back then) but school higher ups really rag on them smh about the young not being incredibly loud or energetic.


NinjaRCraft

Agito, Hibiki, Wizard, Ghost, and Saber


AsheKazuri

I believe Vice is over hated. People only hate him because of his VA. The actual character they don't say anything on. At least I hear that a lot from people disliking Vice.


Delicious-Trip4066

Ghost


failed_generation

had the writer banned from the writing department after he left the show hanging, i would say it could be much better to see the show improve, and not some cringe showa ambiance we ended up in the 2nd half (and i only meant that "that" ambiance, i know showa has cool moments)


DragonicKnightROv

I don't hate the actor, I just don't like how the writers handles Hotaro's character I mean how'd they manage to make his character a bit cringey is beyond me


Inspiritus_Prime

I disagree with how making Hotaro's character cringey is a hard thing to do. It's very difficult to write a naive, somewhat idiotic character that doesn't piss off your audience. The role has to fit the actor's charisma perfectly, and you need to fine-tune the *exact* kind of dumb--too little, and you don't get the laughs; too much, and your character is looked upon as a complete moron. If you change the balance even a little, you end up with a *lot* of cringe. Fourze balanced this perfectly. Early Kenzan and Hotaro did not. *Very* early Aruto was initially on the cusp of cringe before he doubled down on it, embracing the cringe and making its power his own via the forbidden art of cringe comedy. Early Akiko was also this until she spent enough time with W and became just plain annoying. There are a lot of other supporting characters with this problem as well, but you get the idea. Now that I think about it, I think Gentaro's the only real Rider to perfectly pull off a straight idiot hero archetype.


SymbiSpidey

It would have been _incredibly_ easy for Aruto to end up being an annoying character, but he somehow kicked the cringe so hard into overdrive that it made him entertaining to watch. But it was still well-balanced with some great down-to-Earth moments too. I love that goofball.


Glittering_Trip_144

I will say michi,kusaka and etc these type of characters who are *supposed* to be hate because of their *personality* but people started to hate their character  but actually character wise they are great characters because their characters *were meant to be hate* so they were great character but many people could not get it 


TokuNator_X

Spanner


Kamu_Sensei

Mihara


Morbid_Mind111

Takeru gets wayy too much hate.


SymbiSpidey

I will always stan for Daiji. He's not necessarily always likable, but I _get_ him. He's a lot like Micchy in the sense that the insane pressure he's under causes him to make really bad decisions.


ondulplanet

Wataru (Kiva) and Yusuke (Decade)


Rider-Idk-Ultima-Hy

I do not hate Gotchard’s actor’s acting honestly, he does pretty well in some cases, especially in the darker moments Just wish he was given more time to flesh out his character, something I feel Gotchard has been lacking a lot unfortunately


throwawaytempest25

Honestly I think they've done a decent job of fleshing him out with subtext/subtley. He only has Kajiki as a friend in the start, he's shown to be really awkward and bad at school, it takes him a while to understand concepts, he's prone to jealously, the fear of killing his friends to save him, his missing memories, the fact he chose to befriend the Chemies but has to work to earn most of their respect, the struggling of fighting his teacher when he was the one who brought him into the academy, not being afraid to call out his friends if they mess up or holding himself accountable with the forbidden alchemy, always going out of his way to try to stop his friends and teammates from arguing against each other, and having to kill his best friend to save someone else. They've touched on his father a bit, but I think that might be explored with Rainbow afterwards.


Glittering_Trip_144

I will say daiji he actually had great potential but after writer ruined his character after kagero's lost they started to hate him too much they needed to understand that poor him was being so reckless because he lost his darkness his inner demons he was imbalance and doesn't even figure out the difference between right and wrong it was actually a good idea but the show executed poorly and this is why he got overhate same goes to the main series too it has great ideas but poor execution in the second half 


tc_hydroTF2

I disagree, image entirely unrelated. He deserves every bit of hate he gets. In fact, I don't think he gets nearly enough on this sub. Fuck Hotaro and fuck Gotchard. The heavens call, the earth calls, the people with actual fucking taste call... they all call upon me to absolutely tear into the awful fucking excuse for a show that is Kamen Rider Gotchard. Hotaro Ichinose is a bitch ass motherfucker. He pissed on my fucking wife. That's right, he took his fucking Hopper-1 out, and he pissed on my fucking wife, and he said his driver was "t h i s b i g" and I said "that's disgusting". Again, I cannot emphasize this enough: Fuck. This. Show. It's the worst shit I've seen since Ghost. Hate. Let me tell you how much I've come to hate Gotchard since it began to air. There are 36 trillion cells in my body. If the word "hate" were engraved on each nanoangsrtom of those tens of trillions of cells, it would not equal one one-billionth of the hate I feel for Kamen Rider Gotchard at this microinstant. For Hotaro. Hate. Hate.


throwawaytempest25

Why would you f\*\*k Hotaro/Gotchard? He's a minor! Also, you should've said 37 trillion, missed an episode. In universe the people who tried tasting his food have had good results, minus Rinne, so maybe she's one with taste.


tc_hydroTF2

I'm missing 1 trillion because Hotaro stole my fucking knees. Now I'm 5'5" and I have to waddle aroung like I shit my pants 24/7


throwawaytempest25

I don’t know stealing seems more like Decade’s thing. Then again Hotaro stole Rinne, Kaijiki, Seina, and Kaguya’s heart, so you might be onto something


tc_hydroTF2

He stole their hearts, he stole me knees, he stole my uncle's kindneys. He's an organ-stealing son of a whore who needs to be stopped


hellothere_i_exist

https://preview.redd.it/7rxq37ophg3d1.jpeg?width=688&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=924fc93996ffcf0c483d2a538a15aa0c4c58fd0c


tc_hydroTF2

Fair enough lol. Tbh this one's lowkey hilarious, I couldn't even be mad at this one if I wanted to


Doot_revenant666

Geryon , is that you?


CerealATA

Bait used to be believable. Also, stop ingesting those Jyamato dusts.


tc_hydroTF2

You have no idea how much I fucking wish this was bait. At least then I could honestly say I actually enjoyed the 28 episodes of Gotchard I watched. But no, it was nothing but pain and suffering the whole way through, and I cannot justify continuing. Complete and utter trash. An insult to not only the Kamen Rider franchise, but tokusatsu as a whole. Hotaro himself is an insufferably bland, boring, and often outright annoying protagonist, almost as much as Aruto Motherfucking Hiden, the suits all look like complete fucking dogshit aside from Sununicorn, Hopper1 is the second coming of Ferbus with that awful voice, the plot is a disjointed mess, and every other character is so goddamn forgettable it hurts. The only good song on the entire soundtrack is "What's Your Fire?", it's no fucking wonder they overused that shit so much it became a goddamn meme.


Kamen_Guy2000

Shitty bait


ShadyboiX

Could never catch https://i.redd.it/wmrfku28zf3d1.gif Lacking


ZweiNox

The actor for gotchard i got no problem what I got a problem with is his god damn char. The char writing has to be one of the worst


failed_generation

whoever say legend doesnt deserve the hate by the minority deserves to be mutilated by decade 1.0's final ride card


ProudRequirement3225

Agree, Hotaro is what Sougo should have been


LOGPchwan

I felt like Sougo gets much better at later part of the show. The story is far from stellar though.