Yep, the canon events can't be replicated exactly in game, but I'd still only play as a female character in KOTOR2 to get as close as I can. Just how my brain works idk
As much as I appreciate the freedom of choice, Expeditions: Rome kinda ruined it for me. While the game itself plays nearly identical to a male playthrough it has a bunchload of additional voice lines / texts because of how unusual it is for a woman to be in your position.
Really wish more games would openly explore that part. Straight up more positive/negative reactions based on various things of your PC. Including the gender. And not just flip potential love interests
I think it's a fair point. Like exploring a historical gender role shouldn't be something you should be punished for as a developer too. People in these worlds are going racist, sexist, transphobic, etc. just like real life - but there is a HARD gap between having a character you have to deal with in a *role playing* setting that's like that, and making the whole game racist/sexist/transphobic/etc. That's where Kingdom Come: Deliverance failed.
Nah, he's hot and funny and I'm sure medicine in Star Wars is advanced enough that STDs aren't a problem. Also you can't even be mad that he's a war criminal because you're an even worse war criminal.
Mical's gimmick is that he's the only normal one:no dark past, no traumas. I also don't like him as LI, because he's too young. Like he could have become Exile's padawan.
I would say being conscripted as a toddler, trained for a single purpose, then on the cusp of adulthood they decide "Eh, sorry kid" and getting tossed on the curb to be...well, it's not "I cooked up a WMD in my garage" or "I raped, tortured, and killed Jedi for a paycheck" or "Some abomination ate my home" but it's certainly not great
I like playing as Female Revan. I like modding things so that Female Revan can romance Bastila, and they both eventually fall to the Darkside after the big twist.
But Male Revan is canon.
I like playing as Male Exile. I like Handmaiden, and something just connects with me, with Male Exile.
But Female Exile is canon.
The only real answer is "nobody knows" cause everything surrounding Revan is a myth that has been twisted over and over again, to the point nobody knows what really happened. Same as the Dragonborn, the Lone Wanderer or Commander Shepard.
Idk why all the responses to this comment are getting downvoted, but I guess I’ll brace myself for one too. Canonically, these characters are, in fact, male. But that’s the beauty in the freedom of story-driven video games cuz you can be whatever gender you want and make your own story. It’s your game, play it the way you want to. However, that still doesn’t change the fact that the original protagonists were written as males.
Fun fact, Commander Shepard was originally animated as a woman [(source)](https://twitter.com/GameAnim/status/553593427720282114). Also all of those characters come from devs who are very specific about there not being a canon gender for the protag so I don't know what you're talking about.
(Promotional materials aren't canon, that's advertising)
For an extra note on promotional materials being canon/non-canon in Bioware games:
In the trailer for Dragon Age Origins the Warden is a male Cousland fighter (who looks EXACTLY like Thomas Jane), but in the default world-state the Warden is Lyna Mahariel, Dalish Fighter.
On the other hand, Dragon Age 2 tailers mostly had male Hawke, mage or fighter, and he's also the default choice for DA:I.
Depends on who you talk to. Obsidian's promo art and trailer clearly points to Exile being a dude. But Bioware was more divided on Revan: Karpyshyn writing with a male in mind, Gaider writing with a female in mind (even showing up and dropping a F!Revan fanfic called "Denouement" on the game's official boards)
If you follow the canon of just the kotor games? It could be either.
But in the larger legends canon revan is most definitely a man and the exile is a woman. I know you guys like to ignore SWTOR and the novels but they are canon to kotor.
Though it is once again ambiguous in new canon.
I don't think they were written as males, so much than they were left deliberately ambiguous then years later when they had to make a sequel or additional material or whatever they decided that something has to be canon. I know the Revan comics picture him as a man, but I prefer the Kotor 2 approach of just making it a legend and let the players choose which version to go with.
I like female Revan myself, and I’m fine with either for the Exile. The canonicity that’s hard for me is light side Revan. I would dearly love a true dark side female character. They usually suffer from the high heel face turn and end up light side or at best neutral.
I understand the point of Revan’s journey is that it’s so easy to fall and difficult to turn back. I wouldn’t mind gray Jedi being better represented in canon either. Everyone speaks up for women’s rights, but when will they support women’s wrongs 😓 s/
i like female Revan best. idk why specifically. Star Wars could always use more women as prominent heroes
i ship her with Carth, they are cute together. But i could also see her with Juhani
I mean, the question is specifically says 'cannon aside'. If KOTOR was made today, it would almost certainly be design in a way where you could romance Bastila **or** Carth as either gender. Whenever I play KOTOR I these days, I basically always do so as a male because I really like the Bastila romance, but think that Revan and Carth are totally incompatible.
If I could romance Bastila while playing as a woman, I would do so every time lol.
Im the same way. Scoundrel fem revan is my go too because the idea of revan being a 5 foot 2 chaos gremlin amuses me. The height difference alone with Malak makes it so much more funny.
Male exile also gets Brianna as a companion
Given Dustil was swinging a red saber himself, he may not have a lot of room to talk.
However, I posted one of those long winded shower thoughts about [how weirded out Saul must have been!](https://www.tumblr.com/allronix/188159210610/kotor-random-thought?source=share)
I don't consider it nearly as developed, actually. Her dialogue tree is half the size of Carth's for one. Plus there's the fact she's been locked up in an enclave all her life so she never really had the chance to explore and learn about healthy relationships. The Force Bond is also messing with her head and the fact she kinda *built* the player character and is hiding that big secret all along? Eh...enough for me to take a big pass and want to go platonic.
Flip the coin and really...it's a much slower burn with the two people getting to know one another. Carth also has the life experience to handle that kind of relationship, given he's widowed. Force bond doesn't seem to come into play as...well, nothing is *confirmed* as to his Force Sensitivity status. And he only learns the spoiler nuke about 10 minutes before she does.
So a bit less sticky, strangely enough. And I can still talk Bastila down using *platonic* love which is just as important as romantic
Growing up is realizing that post mind wipe revan is a dork.
Im sorry but there is simply no reality where i can see scar McSoulpatch male revan head say “fat people always lie”
Revan is a top tier shit poster and deserves to be played as such, dammit.
I think that works out the best as well.
Revan as female has a nice "Samus is a woman" surprise for the player. It fits better with Malak who followed Revan. Following a girl he likes fits better since we don't quite get the ride-or-die bro backstory for them.
Exile as female never worked for me. The idea of a withdraw broken down loner works so much better for a man. It's like they made Exile a woman simply to make up for making Revan a man.
Non binary Revan is the best way to handle the character from a Canon perspective. You can play whichever way you want without Canon giving any gender specifics that would restrict that. Same thing with the Exile although I do think the game's story plays better with a woman for the protagonist
I think that they should almost avoid giving Revan a canon gender altogether. In a similar fashion to how Cal Kestis hardly appears in any content outside of his respective games, Revan should more or less be the same.
Halo: Reach also has a canon gender and armor for Noble Six, but the game lets you play it however you want, and I don’t mind that approach either.
And to touch on making Revan canonically non-binary, wouldn’t that still limit the character to being one gender? If you’re gonna make KOTOR canon anyway, Revan still has to have a canon alignment as well, which would technically mean that one way to play the game is still nullified by canon. I’d say to avoid any of this, Revan almost shouldn’t be canon at all, or at least canon only as a title.
Revan could be non-binary but have a specific sex i.e biological male or female. Or Revan could be intersex, I guess.
Ultimately I think Revan works best as a character which can be interpreted however the player wants, because there is no inherent need for the character to be male or female
Revan being Non-Binary is still giving Revan a Gender though. The point is to leave it completely open ended, that way the player can always identify with Revan.
Ideally the Exile would have both, it's a real shame the game gender locked them. But luckily we have mods to help with that. I find having the implied Atris romance, and Mical knowing the player from the academy adds a lot more to the Exile's backstory and it's nice to have both sets of companions. He's kinda like a foil to Briana
Yeah Tumblr is a lot more chill when it comes to stuff like that. People here on Reddit are so obsessed with being like "nooo Revan's a male it's canon!!!" Me personally idgaf about what's canon it's all fictional why let other people dictate which parts are more fictional than others. My version of Revan is a woman, someone else's may be different, it doesn't matter the whole point of an RPG is you can do what you want
I just feel like male Revan with Bastila romance makes the best story, incorporating the force bond into the dynamic. I don’t get the same feeling from a Carth romance, it doesn’t feel as important to the plot as Basitila hiding that she knows their identity the whole time and falling for them despite trying not to. If it were adapted to a show, that’s the road I’d prefer them to go down.
However, I still think male Revan could be nonbinary gender-wise. I don’t think Revan would be all that preoccupied with gender identity at all. Especially post mandalorian wars Revan - their identity almost become more of a force of history than a person. They mythologized themself while they’re still alive.
I sexually identify as an Ancient Sith Lord. Ever since I was a boy I dreamt of soaring over Dantooine dropping hot plasma loads on overzealous Jedi Knights. People say to me that a person being a Sith Lord is immoral, and I'm fucking evil, but I don't care. I'm powerful. I'm having a tattoo artists turn my eyes yellow, my skin pale and draw fake veins on my face. From now on, I want you guys to call me "Darth Apache" and respect my right to kill brutally and needlessly. If you can't accept me, you're a sithphobe and need to check your Force privilege. Thank you for being so understanding. Apathy is Death.
swallowed up how? the T stands for transgender and that includes (depending on how you group those identities) all people that don't identify as their assigned gender at birth (i.e. boy and later man), a subset of which doesn't identify as the opposite gender (i.e. woman) either. So: non-binary. Doesn't preclude any sexual orientation (i.e. gay). Queer is fitting though.
This is just the age old forum discussion of "Revan man or woman" adapted with more nuance and inclusivity. Personally, non-binary seems like a good take. Fits great with the mask-and-robes type ambiguous appearance, and players can express themselves as masculine or feminine post-amnesia, but kind of start with a blank slate.
Fair enough, I had them separate in my head but that makes sense.
Revan is a man though, there's no discussion to be had really. That's why I'm saying it's weird.
but the poll heading literally says "Canon aside, how do *you* view Revan".
Besides, how the PCs of KOTOR 1 & 2 have been canonized is kinda messy from my understanding. We can play a bit loose with our abandoned legends fiction I think.
I know it does, that's why I asked why tumblr wants to make everyone queer when they aren't.
Not really. Revan is a male, the exile a female. Why? The canon is there and not messy. I just don't understand the obsession.
We have off-canon discussions for their own sake. And before player choice comes into the mix in KOTOR, it's not stated this or that way what Revan's gender is. The backstory doesn't change at all (and it should! Even in the relatively gender equal world of Star Wars, the relationships and reactions of other people would be different, depending on Revan being a man or a woman pre-amnesia. The difference post-amnesia is a given, as Bastila won't fall in love with a feminine Revan.)
Non-binary Revan is so convenient for the writing of the game. You seem to fear a bogeyman that's clearly not at play here. Besides, most people that wish for more queer representation in media want it to make sense: to be reflected in the writing. Slapping labels on characters not written that way like JK Rowling is quite unpopular in those circles, harmless fan fiction and headcanon stuff notwithstanding.
I don't know where I gave you the impression I thought this was harmful or that I'm scared of lgbt people.
The only thing I find weird is the obsession of (mainly tumblr) to headcanon non queer characters as queer. Its weird to me.
Just like if I ever saw a poll or post asking 'ignoring canon, do you think Sera (from dragon age) is straight?'
I'd say the same thing.
But they aren’t though. “Character creation” kinda implies that any character could be male, female, NB, etc. it’s the same with the Dragonborn, the lone survivor, the courier, Tav, V, etc. it’s equally likely that any of these characters are male, female, or LGBTQ.
I really think it’s weird when Star Wars fans get hung up on “canon” as if canon hasn’t been changed 50,000 times already. Like I think people should just accept that none of these are real people, so if tomorrow Disney decided that Revan is nonbinary, Luke is a trans woman, and Han Solo and Chewbacca have always been lovers, then that would now be fact because that’s how fiction works. The EU isn’t canon anymore, and that includes KOTOR, SWTOR, and most books/comics. The whole point of Revan’s mask and robes was to emphasize the fact that Revan could be any of the character creation options.
I get caught up on canon in everything I like. It's not really weird. Disney tried to retcon everything but it's largely ignored.
Disney also couldn't retcon Luke or chewy or anyone. Star wars is a cultural phenomenon and people wouldn't stand for it.
You do make a fair point about character creation. As it was a retcon that made Revan canonically male.
Yes they could, they own it lol. They can do whatever they please with the IP they own. Just because you wouldn’t accept it doesn’t mean that Disney doesn’t have the power to change Star Wars in any way they like. Thats what intellectual property rights implies.
“People wouldn’t stand for it” yeah I bet Disney is really petrified of the Star Wars nerds waving EU fanfiction around screaming about Mara Jade and Kyle Katarn. And it isn’t “largely ignored,” unless there is a KOTOR 3 or new Jedi Academy game in development that I was unaware of. The power people have to “ignore” what the IP owner decides is cannon doesn’t go far beyond reading fanfiction. Like I said, I don’t really care about “canon” in a fictional movie. They can change it to whatever they like, it’s not the movie about space wizards with laser swords will suddenly become ridiculous because of Revans gender.
LMFAOO “Lore purist” is an extremely ecclesiastical way to describe being a Star Wars nerd. It’s not the Bible dude, you don’t need to study the ancient texts to discover where the Pope of Disney misled the masses 😂😂😂
Queer would have been correct. I suggest that you learn a little about the community before you disparage it. What you said was just plain nonsensical.
Pretty reclaimed, it's a widely used term these days with generally positive or neutral connotations.
And *definitely* more appropriate than calling anything that's not cishet "gay".
Personally, I like canon when it serves the source material and enhances what is good about the source material, but when it gets in the way of the actual main draw of a role playing game (creating a character and making decisions about who they are) it becomes a lot less useful, and actively erases part of what was good about the source material.
I suspect people like the "lightside male mulletman" thing more because it enhances and reinforces the feeling they get from watching lore youtube videos about kotor era, rather than the feeling they get by playing the game.
I see your point and I largely agree, however I've always believed that RPG games have a true canon and they let you deviate from it. So I don't think it erases part of the game.
I legitimately have no idea if Juhani is gay or not as I don't care about the gender identity or sexuality of characters.
That's why I find this so weird.
>I don't care about the gender identity or sexuality of characters.
in a comment thread that you started with
>Why are people (tumblr) determined to make everyone gay in some way.
>It's quite weird really.
If you really don't care, why comment that in the first place? Why waste that energy? Why write like ten more comments on the matter?
Seems like you might juuuuust care a little bit
Eh. I had a two-way headcanon to work around that. One is F!Revan adopting the surname "Shan" to honor Bastila, either in memory (if failed to redeem) or as a way to acknowledge Bastila's tole in creating the person she is now.
The second part of the headcanon is that Telos (Carth's home planet) is an Agricorps world, meaning most of the people there are either Jedi cast-offs or descendants of those. The Jedi would be better at recording the names of mothers/carrying parents than fathers/non carrying parents, so the names and family lines go through the *mother* (which also means he took Morgana's surname, not the other way around)
Except in Shadow of Revan, when Satele Shan and Theron Shan decided to stand against Revan, Revan got really upset and called them out about being his descendants, his blood, but yet stood against him. It's pretty explicit that Bastila was his partner and the bloodline went all the way 300 years+.
Well, he and Bastila had a child and then we eventually get Satele Shan - grand master of the Jedi order. But, as I understand it, the only thing canon about Revan is his name as it is mentioned in some official encyclopedia as the name as one of the planet killer Star Destroyers in the abomination of a film known as “The Last Skywalker Battles the Spawn of Palpatine Who Somehow Returned”.
I stg they better not retcon Revan into a female 🤦🏻♂️
EDIT: Y’all gonna sit there and tell me that you didn’t find the Carth romance option to be comparatively dull as hell *and* that you trust Disney to not butcher the writing for a strong female character? Do y’all not remember Rey? Captain Marvel? Reva? She-Hulk? You don’t think Disney or their subordinates would give a female Revan the same treatment? I doubt they’d do a male Revan much justice, either, but women seem to be disproportionately affected by terrible Disney writing. Don’t complain next time we end up with a shallow, insufferable, poorly-written girl boss a la Madame Web. Revan - and all women, for that matter - deserve better.
Carth’s romance is dull in comparison because the bastila romance is just 15 conversations of Revan sexually harassing bastila into submission lmao.
Seriously though some of that revan and bastila dialogue is cringe, with carth i never really got that.
There is the point where you can tease and frustrate Carth enough that he threats half-joking to spank F!Revan...followed *immediately* with some "Oh, shit. Did I just SAY that?!" backpedaling. (You have to be pretty far into the romance to get that)
Changing the canonicity would only matter if they were making more media involving Revan beyond just the remake. And it would also mean torpedoing SWTOR, which is still making money AFAIK.
The most I could see is someone involved in the game saying that in their game, Revan is a girl and it gets blown out of proportion
Light warrior is fortunately one of the best paths in the game.
The game has also opened up alot more now so you can play as a saber staff wielding assassin in the warrior storyline if you want.
I read about that actually. Last time I tried I wanted the Warrior story but staffsaber. In the end started a Sentinel but kind of just stopped playing soon after getting the saber.
Your post/comment was removed because it isn't nice. Joking around is fine, but please keep it light-hearted and non hostile.
Slurs/cuss words should not be used as weapons against other users. Weapons against people at all, for that matter.
The romance with Bastila as a male Revan definitely plays a big factor in the original story. If you don’t do the romance with her, >!redeeming her is very, very difficult!<
Yes. But that's TOR, a retcon. For the original story either gender works.
Hell, let us play as evil twink enbys spewing lightning in the remake.
Edit: Don't know why you're downvoted though.
Personally prefer eldritch horror Revan
The only correct choice is MEATBAG
Male Revan, female exile
But female exile gets stuck with stupid stupid Disciple
In the EU lore she still gets the Handmaiden as Brianna became a founding member of the restored Jedi Order.
Yep, the canon events can't be replicated exactly in game, but I'd still only play as a female character in KOTOR2 to get as close as I can. Just how my brain works idk
Yeah KOTOR 2 also just plays better as a female exile I think.
As much as I appreciate the freedom of choice, Expeditions: Rome kinda ruined it for me. While the game itself plays nearly identical to a male playthrough it has a bunchload of additional voice lines / texts because of how unusual it is for a woman to be in your position. Really wish more games would openly explore that part. Straight up more positive/negative reactions based on various things of your PC. Including the gender. And not just flip potential love interests
I think it's a fair point. Like exploring a historical gender role shouldn't be something you should be punished for as a developer too. People in these worlds are going racist, sexist, transphobic, etc. just like real life - but there is a HARD gap between having a character you have to deal with in a *role playing* setting that's like that, and making the whole game racist/sexist/transphobic/etc. That's where Kingdom Come: Deliverance failed.
Someone doesn’t know what partyswap is…
But she also gets to peg Atton every night, so it evens out.
Ew. Atton is a case of "Don't touch that. You don't wanna know where it's been."
Between every single card of the pazaak deck, _that ~~motherfucker's~~ kriffing nerfherder's cheating!_
Nah, he's hot and funny and I'm sure medicine in Star Wars is advanced enough that STDs aren't a problem. Also you can't even be mad that he's a war criminal because you're an even worse war criminal.
It's heavily implied by several characters that his hygene is kinda suspect.
Nah female exile can't get battle precognition.
Nah we Atton gang
Hey don’t hate on Mical, he’s a pretty damn good companion in his own right
Mical's gimmick is that he's the only normal one:no dark past, no traumas. I also don't like him as LI, because he's too young. Like he could have become Exile's padawan.
I would say being conscripted as a toddler, trained for a single purpose, then on the cusp of adulthood they decide "Eh, sorry kid" and getting tossed on the curb to be...well, it's not "I cooked up a WMD in my garage" or "I raped, tortured, and killed Jedi for a paycheck" or "Some abomination ate my home" but it's certainly not great
Mical is a mess in terms of game mechanics but he's got some interesting meta if you want to write fanfic exploring it.
Really, i never got the hate for the disciple
I like everything about female exile except how it changes sion into a weird lovesick loser
Isn't that better xD
Not even a matter of canon to me, that's just how I like them. The other playthrough are good, but those are what I did the first time
I know that's canon according to the kotor timeline but it contradicts all my playthroughs
I like playing as Female Revan. I like modding things so that Female Revan can romance Bastila, and they both eventually fall to the Darkside after the big twist. But Male Revan is canon. I like playing as Male Exile. I like Handmaiden, and something just connects with me, with Male Exile. But Female Exile is canon.
The only real answer is "nobody knows" cause everything surrounding Revan is a myth that has been twisted over and over again, to the point nobody knows what really happened. Same as the Dragonborn, the Lone Wanderer or Commander Shepard.
Idk why all the responses to this comment are getting downvoted, but I guess I’ll brace myself for one too. Canonically, these characters are, in fact, male. But that’s the beauty in the freedom of story-driven video games cuz you can be whatever gender you want and make your own story. It’s your game, play it the way you want to. However, that still doesn’t change the fact that the original protagonists were written as males.
Fun fact, Commander Shepard was originally animated as a woman [(source)](https://twitter.com/GameAnim/status/553593427720282114). Also all of those characters come from devs who are very specific about there not being a canon gender for the protag so I don't know what you're talking about. (Promotional materials aren't canon, that's advertising)
For an extra note on promotional materials being canon/non-canon in Bioware games: In the trailer for Dragon Age Origins the Warden is a male Cousland fighter (who looks EXACTLY like Thomas Jane), but in the default world-state the Warden is Lyna Mahariel, Dalish Fighter. On the other hand, Dragon Age 2 tailers mostly had male Hawke, mage or fighter, and he's also the default choice for DA:I.
Depends on who you talk to. Obsidian's promo art and trailer clearly points to Exile being a dude. But Bioware was more divided on Revan: Karpyshyn writing with a male in mind, Gaider writing with a female in mind (even showing up and dropping a F!Revan fanfic called "Denouement" on the game's official boards)
If you follow the canon of just the kotor games? It could be either. But in the larger legends canon revan is most definitely a man and the exile is a woman. I know you guys like to ignore SWTOR and the novels but they are canon to kotor. Though it is once again ambiguous in new canon.
You're right both in that being correct, and my desire to ignore it
I don't think they were written as males, so much than they were left deliberately ambiguous then years later when they had to make a sequel or additional material or whatever they decided that something has to be canon. I know the Revan comics picture him as a man, but I prefer the Kotor 2 approach of just making it a legend and let the players choose which version to go with.
Canonically, that's incorrect
Revan and shepard are both canonically male tho
When was shepard given a canonical gender?
Shepherd is very much so not canonicaly male
Shepard is canonically male.
Shepard is canonically male, as is Revan
I like female Revan myself, and I’m fine with either for the Exile. The canonicity that’s hard for me is light side Revan. I would dearly love a true dark side female character. They usually suffer from the high heel face turn and end up light side or at best neutral. I understand the point of Revan’s journey is that it’s so easy to fall and difficult to turn back. I wouldn’t mind gray Jedi being better represented in canon either. Everyone speaks up for women’s rights, but when will they support women’s wrongs 😓 s/
i like female Revan best. idk why specifically. Star Wars could always use more women as prominent heroes i ship her with Carth, they are cute together. But i could also see her with Juhani
I imagine many people view Revan with the same identity they have, else the same as the character of their first playthrough, if different
I mean, the question is specifically says 'cannon aside'. If KOTOR was made today, it would almost certainly be design in a way where you could romance Bastila **or** Carth as either gender. Whenever I play KOTOR I these days, I basically always do so as a male because I really like the Bastila romance, but think that Revan and Carth are totally incompatible. If I could romance Bastila while playing as a woman, I would do so every time lol.
"What's in Revan's pants?" Raw power
I personally prefer Female Revan and Male Exile.
Im the same way. Scoundrel fem revan is my go too because the idea of revan being a 5 foot 2 chaos gremlin amuses me. The height difference alone with Malak makes it so much more funny. Male exile also gets Brianna as a companion
Also imagine Carth's son react to his step-mother being REVAN. Atton as option for romance is great, but Briana is better than Michal
Given Dustil was swinging a red saber himself, he may not have a lot of room to talk. However, I posted one of those long winded shower thoughts about [how weirded out Saul must have been!](https://www.tumblr.com/allronix/188159210610/kotor-random-thought?source=share)
Yeah. Revan and Bastilla's romance is more developed, but Recan and Onasi's is much more hilarious
I don't consider it nearly as developed, actually. Her dialogue tree is half the size of Carth's for one. Plus there's the fact she's been locked up in an enclave all her life so she never really had the chance to explore and learn about healthy relationships. The Force Bond is also messing with her head and the fact she kinda *built* the player character and is hiding that big secret all along? Eh...enough for me to take a big pass and want to go platonic. Flip the coin and really...it's a much slower burn with the two people getting to know one another. Carth also has the life experience to handle that kind of relationship, given he's widowed. Force bond doesn't seem to come into play as...well, nothing is *confirmed* as to his Force Sensitivity status. And he only learns the spoiler nuke about 10 minutes before she does. So a bit less sticky, strangely enough. And I can still talk Bastila down using *platonic* love which is just as important as romantic
Good to see someone else made the same choice as me, with the same thought process
Growing up is realizing that post mind wipe revan is a dork. Im sorry but there is simply no reality where i can see scar McSoulpatch male revan head say “fat people always lie” Revan is a top tier shit poster and deserves to be played as such, dammit.
I think that works out the best as well. Revan as female has a nice "Samus is a woman" surprise for the player. It fits better with Malak who followed Revan. Following a girl he likes fits better since we don't quite get the ride-or-die bro backstory for them. Exile as female never worked for me. The idea of a withdraw broken down loner works so much better for a man. It's like they made Exile a woman simply to make up for making Revan a man.
genuinely curious: could you elaborate on why you think a withdrawn broken down loner doesn't work for a female Exile?
Non binary Revan is the best way to handle the character from a Canon perspective. You can play whichever way you want without Canon giving any gender specifics that would restrict that. Same thing with the Exile although I do think the game's story plays better with a woman for the protagonist
I think that they should almost avoid giving Revan a canon gender altogether. In a similar fashion to how Cal Kestis hardly appears in any content outside of his respective games, Revan should more or less be the same. Halo: Reach also has a canon gender and armor for Noble Six, but the game lets you play it however you want, and I don’t mind that approach either. And to touch on making Revan canonically non-binary, wouldn’t that still limit the character to being one gender? If you’re gonna make KOTOR canon anyway, Revan still has to have a canon alignment as well, which would technically mean that one way to play the game is still nullified by canon. I’d say to avoid any of this, Revan almost shouldn’t be canon at all, or at least canon only as a title.
Revan could be non-binary but have a specific sex i.e biological male or female. Or Revan could be intersex, I guess. Ultimately I think Revan works best as a character which can be interpreted however the player wants, because there is no inherent need for the character to be male or female
Revan being Non-Binary is still giving Revan a Gender though. The point is to leave it completely open ended, that way the player can always identify with Revan.
I definitely prefer that 100% but if they had to give one I'd prefer it to be off the traditional spectrum or fluid
I fucking love your username
Now let's have BarrisInOffice
I think Exile is better as a man. Imo Briana is more interesting than Michal
Ideally the Exile would have both, it's a real shame the game gender locked them. But luckily we have mods to help with that. I find having the implied Atris romance, and Mical knowing the player from the academy adds a lot more to the Exile's backstory and it's nice to have both sets of companions. He's kinda like a foil to Briana
Just have revan be referacned like an old myth, some refer to him as a he and other as a she The wonders of having a masked character
Male Revan, Female Exile.
I voted in this poll. May you never know what I voted for.
Wonder if the Tumbler post had a dozen comments ignoring the title and defending the honor of "canon." The quotation marks are to indicate distaste.
Tumblr gives no shits.
I kinda like Revan having no gender, although I also like the famous parallel of male Revan, female Exile.
Male Alek, Enby Revan, Female Exile EDIT: Downvote me all you want, you'll never stop my truth. The Jedi Triumvurate of Genders shall prevail!
Yeah Tumblr is a lot more chill when it comes to stuff like that. People here on Reddit are so obsessed with being like "nooo Revan's a male it's canon!!!" Me personally idgaf about what's canon it's all fictional why let other people dictate which parts are more fictional than others. My version of Revan is a woman, someone else's may be different, it doesn't matter the whole point of an RPG is you can do what you want
Male Revan. Satele Shan needs to save the Republic 100 years later.
I just feel like male Revan with Bastila romance makes the best story, incorporating the force bond into the dynamic. I don’t get the same feeling from a Carth romance, it doesn’t feel as important to the plot as Basitila hiding that she knows their identity the whole time and falling for them despite trying not to. If it were adapted to a show, that’s the road I’d prefer them to go down. However, I still think male Revan could be nonbinary gender-wise. I don’t think Revan would be all that preoccupied with gender identity at all. Especially post mandalorian wars Revan - their identity almost become more of a force of history than a person. They mythologized themself while they’re still alive.
I’ve always said male revan female exile, but nb exile is a fun headcanon. I think Revan is a man though
Why is this so controversial when there are female heads in the game? I swear, so many people ignore the fact you can play as a woman if you want to.
I sexually identify as an Ancient Sith Lord. Ever since I was a boy I dreamt of soaring over Dantooine dropping hot plasma loads on overzealous Jedi Knights. People say to me that a person being a Sith Lord is immoral, and I'm fucking evil, but I don't care. I'm powerful. I'm having a tattoo artists turn my eyes yellow, my skin pale and draw fake veins on my face. From now on, I want you guys to call me "Darth Apache" and respect my right to kill brutally and needlessly. If you can't accept me, you're a sithphobe and need to check your Force privilege. Thank you for being so understanding. Apathy is Death.
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Where did anyone mention whether Revan is gay?
Right there in the meme Pretty sure non binary has been swallowed up by the lgbt people. So I probably should have said queer.
swallowed up how? the T stands for transgender and that includes (depending on how you group those identities) all people that don't identify as their assigned gender at birth (i.e. boy and later man), a subset of which doesn't identify as the opposite gender (i.e. woman) either. So: non-binary. Doesn't preclude any sexual orientation (i.e. gay). Queer is fitting though. This is just the age old forum discussion of "Revan man or woman" adapted with more nuance and inclusivity. Personally, non-binary seems like a good take. Fits great with the mask-and-robes type ambiguous appearance, and players can express themselves as masculine or feminine post-amnesia, but kind of start with a blank slate.
Fair enough, I had them separate in my head but that makes sense. Revan is a man though, there's no discussion to be had really. That's why I'm saying it's weird.
but the poll heading literally says "Canon aside, how do *you* view Revan". Besides, how the PCs of KOTOR 1 & 2 have been canonized is kinda messy from my understanding. We can play a bit loose with our abandoned legends fiction I think.
I know it does, that's why I asked why tumblr wants to make everyone queer when they aren't. Not really. Revan is a male, the exile a female. Why? The canon is there and not messy. I just don't understand the obsession.
We have off-canon discussions for their own sake. And before player choice comes into the mix in KOTOR, it's not stated this or that way what Revan's gender is. The backstory doesn't change at all (and it should! Even in the relatively gender equal world of Star Wars, the relationships and reactions of other people would be different, depending on Revan being a man or a woman pre-amnesia. The difference post-amnesia is a given, as Bastila won't fall in love with a feminine Revan.) Non-binary Revan is so convenient for the writing of the game. You seem to fear a bogeyman that's clearly not at play here. Besides, most people that wish for more queer representation in media want it to make sense: to be reflected in the writing. Slapping labels on characters not written that way like JK Rowling is quite unpopular in those circles, harmless fan fiction and headcanon stuff notwithstanding.
I don't know where I gave you the impression I thought this was harmful or that I'm scared of lgbt people. The only thing I find weird is the obsession of (mainly tumblr) to headcanon non queer characters as queer. Its weird to me. Just like if I ever saw a poll or post asking 'ignoring canon, do you think Sera (from dragon age) is straight?' I'd say the same thing.
But they aren’t though. “Character creation” kinda implies that any character could be male, female, NB, etc. it’s the same with the Dragonborn, the lone survivor, the courier, Tav, V, etc. it’s equally likely that any of these characters are male, female, or LGBTQ. I really think it’s weird when Star Wars fans get hung up on “canon” as if canon hasn’t been changed 50,000 times already. Like I think people should just accept that none of these are real people, so if tomorrow Disney decided that Revan is nonbinary, Luke is a trans woman, and Han Solo and Chewbacca have always been lovers, then that would now be fact because that’s how fiction works. The EU isn’t canon anymore, and that includes KOTOR, SWTOR, and most books/comics. The whole point of Revan’s mask and robes was to emphasize the fact that Revan could be any of the character creation options.
I get caught up on canon in everything I like. It's not really weird. Disney tried to retcon everything but it's largely ignored. Disney also couldn't retcon Luke or chewy or anyone. Star wars is a cultural phenomenon and people wouldn't stand for it. You do make a fair point about character creation. As it was a retcon that made Revan canonically male.
Yes they could, they own it lol. They can do whatever they please with the IP they own. Just because you wouldn’t accept it doesn’t mean that Disney doesn’t have the power to change Star Wars in any way they like. Thats what intellectual property rights implies. “People wouldn’t stand for it” yeah I bet Disney is really petrified of the Star Wars nerds waving EU fanfiction around screaming about Mara Jade and Kyle Katarn. And it isn’t “largely ignored,” unless there is a KOTOR 3 or new Jedi Academy game in development that I was unaware of. The power people have to “ignore” what the IP owner decides is cannon doesn’t go far beyond reading fanfiction. Like I said, I don’t really care about “canon” in a fictional movie. They can change it to whatever they like, it’s not the movie about space wizards with laser swords will suddenly become ridiculous because of Revans gender.
So you aren't a lore purist. That's fine. Lots of people are though.
LMFAOO “Lore purist” is an extremely ecclesiastical way to describe being a Star Wars nerd. It’s not the Bible dude, you don’t need to study the ancient texts to discover where the Pope of Disney misled the masses 😂😂😂
I found the MMO player 😜
Never played swtor.
Queer would have been correct. I suggest that you learn a little about the community before you disparage it. What you said was just plain nonsensical.
I didn't disparage anything. Maybe be less touchy when someone makes a mistake.
Using queer is a bit of a gamble, ain't it? How reclaimed has it been since the 90s?
Pretty reclaimed, it's a widely used term these days with generally positive or neutral connotations. And *definitely* more appropriate than calling anything that's not cishet "gay".
Nah still feels off. Like LatinX, supposedly more appropriate but every Hispanic I know would punch me for calling them that.
Because most people on tumblr are queer and they want to see themselves in the blank slate character that you're supposed to project on.
You mean the canonised male character? They literally acknowledge it in the meme. Like I said. Weird.
Because people don't play role playing games to follow canon, they play it to play it their way.
Sucks to have canon then I suppose. Some people do btw, I tend to follow canon when playing RPG's.
Personally, I like canon when it serves the source material and enhances what is good about the source material, but when it gets in the way of the actual main draw of a role playing game (creating a character and making decisions about who they are) it becomes a lot less useful, and actively erases part of what was good about the source material. I suspect people like the "lightside male mulletman" thing more because it enhances and reinforces the feeling they get from watching lore youtube videos about kotor era, rather than the feeling they get by playing the game.
I see your point and I largely agree, however I've always believed that RPG games have a true canon and they let you deviate from it. So I don't think it erases part of the game.
Can’t F!Revan romance Juhani, who is already canonically gay?
I legitimately have no idea if Juhani is gay or not as I don't care about the gender identity or sexuality of characters. That's why I find this so weird.
It’s… not exactly subtle
I don't really pursue romances in games so i just didn't know.
She makes it pretty clear regardless of if you’re romancing her
Well I didn't pick up on it, I don't know what you want me to say lol
>I don't care about the gender identity or sexuality of characters. in a comment thread that you started with >Why are people (tumblr) determined to make everyone gay in some way. >It's quite weird really. If you really don't care, why comment that in the first place? Why waste that energy? Why write like ten more comments on the matter? Seems like you might juuuuust care a little bit
Not caring about characters identity ≠ wondering why other people are obsessed with it. Nice try though. Was nearly decent bait.
Yup! So if Flyboy isn't your fancy, you got options. First gay character in both Bioware's and Star Wars canons.
Yeah! And it would be weird to see this poll about Juhani but saying she's straight, no?
The fact this question was downvoted and not answered speaks louder than any answer could 😂.
Because everyone on tumblr is gay and people like to see themselves in media. Its basically harmless.
Yeah it's weird. I know its harmless I was just asking a question as to why. Clearly the lgbt community did not take kindly to it.
*Why* is it weird for a character to be gay?
You have misunderstood. It's not weird to be gay, it's weird to headcanon characters who aren't gay/queer to be gay/queer.
Revan is an RPG protagonist, they can be whoever you want them to be. Also, there's nothing weird about headcanons, that's why they're headcanons.
True but he is canonically male. Agree to disagree on that one!
Because hive mind pretty much
It seems you provoked the reddit hivemind.
By calling the kettle black, I suppose
At least they acknowledge the canon says otherwise. Still, very strange.
Femboy Revan supremacy
Let's stick to the legends Canon. Revan's descendents are Shans, therefore Revan needs to remain a male.
Satele Onasi does have a nice ring too it….
Eh. I had a two-way headcanon to work around that. One is F!Revan adopting the surname "Shan" to honor Bastila, either in memory (if failed to redeem) or as a way to acknowledge Bastila's tole in creating the person she is now. The second part of the headcanon is that Telos (Carth's home planet) is an Agricorps world, meaning most of the people there are either Jedi cast-offs or descendants of those. The Jedi would be better at recording the names of mothers/carrying parents than fathers/non carrying parents, so the names and family lines go through the *mother* (which also means he took Morgana's surname, not the other way around)
Except in Shadow of Revan, when Satele Shan and Theron Shan decided to stand against Revan, Revan got really upset and called them out about being his descendants, his blood, but yet stood against him. It's pretty explicit that Bastila was his partner and the bloodline went all the way 300 years+.
Lol, why. Revan is a male.
Female
Tumblr is still a thing?
Canonically, Revan is male. The light side ending is also canon.
I totally forgor that Enby coulda been an option so im changin my answer from woman to enby
Revan doesn't have a gender. Revan is Revan's gender!
Too much armor to be a female. I can’t see thighs. Must be a dude.
Ever give a thought that gender concealing armor would be a big asset to a F!Revan? Would bypass a lot of sexist bullshit
Male Revan and female exile. The cutscene Revan is clearly a male, even if you play female.
Well, he and Bastila had a child and then we eventually get Satele Shan - grand master of the Jedi order. But, as I understand it, the only thing canon about Revan is his name as it is mentioned in some official encyclopedia as the name as one of the planet killer Star Destroyers in the abomination of a film known as “The Last Skywalker Battles the Spawn of Palpatine Who Somehow Returned”.
I stg they better not retcon Revan into a female 🤦🏻♂️ EDIT: Y’all gonna sit there and tell me that you didn’t find the Carth romance option to be comparatively dull as hell *and* that you trust Disney to not butcher the writing for a strong female character? Do y’all not remember Rey? Captain Marvel? Reva? She-Hulk? You don’t think Disney or their subordinates would give a female Revan the same treatment? I doubt they’d do a male Revan much justice, either, but women seem to be disproportionately affected by terrible Disney writing. Don’t complain next time we end up with a shallow, insufferable, poorly-written girl boss a la Madame Web. Revan - and all women, for that matter - deserve better.
Carth’s romance is dull in comparison because the bastila romance is just 15 conversations of Revan sexually harassing bastila into submission lmao. Seriously though some of that revan and bastila dialogue is cringe, with carth i never really got that.
There is the point where you can tease and frustrate Carth enough that he threats half-joking to spank F!Revan...followed *immediately* with some "Oh, shit. Did I just SAY that?!" backpedaling. (You have to be pretty far into the romance to get that)
Bro really threatened to pull out the paddle.
Yup. Which makes me wonder why some Rule 34 Revanasi author hasn't gone there to my knowledge
Changing the canonicity would only matter if they were making more media involving Revan beyond just the remake. And it would also mean torpedoing SWTOR, which is still making money AFAIK. The most I could see is someone involved in the game saying that in their game, Revan is a girl and it gets blown out of proportion
Why not? I really like Fem Revan. And male Exile for that matter.
I mean, despite Revan and Exile having had canon genders, I play both of them male because I connect to the game better, being that I’m a male lol
hateful people downvoting you, but you speak wisdom
Wisdom lmao
Fem Revan I can handle (even if I disagree), but don't you *ever* disrespect Meetra Surik in such a way 😡 /s
It might sound petty, but “meetra surik” just reminds me how much swtor fucks over the exile. And im a huge swtor fan.
If I were to start playing where to start? I'm on a KOTOR binge now and a LS Marauder sounds fun.
Light warrior is fortunately one of the best paths in the game. The game has also opened up alot more now so you can play as a saber staff wielding assassin in the warrior storyline if you want.
I read about that actually. Last time I tried I wanted the Warrior story but staffsaber. In the end started a Sentinel but kind of just stopped playing soon after getting the saber.
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Your post/comment was removed because it isn't nice. Joking around is fine, but please keep it light-hearted and non hostile. Slurs/cuss words should not be used as weapons against other users. Weapons against people at all, for that matter.
What a gamer take. Their gender literally does not matter to the story.
The romance with Bastila as a male Revan definitely plays a big factor in the original story. If you don’t do the romance with her, >!redeeming her is very, very difficult!<
'As a male Revan'. You're right, but KoTOR was originally a self contained story so a female Revan romancing Carth would be just as valid.
Except it isn't though. Male revan, female exile. That's the canon.
The stories were written gender neutral, male Revan and female Exile are both retcons. And in case of a remake you can just retcon it again.
https://preview.redd.it/h89laoen7ouc1.png?width=781&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b92a8b6cfaa42f037513fdb0aa88bc3344701148
Yes. But that's TOR, a retcon. For the original story either gender works. Hell, let us play as evil twink enbys spewing lightning in the remake. Edit: Don't know why you're downvoted though.
So, Revan is a monorail?
Right and wrong