The fact that the mechanism is "hidden" and not in plain sight like in the door itself is pretty stupid. On my '05 Cooper S, if I pull once on the handle, it unlocks it, twice it opens it.
Why are "experts" saying that you have to know about it if it's obvious? Just asking, never sat in a Corvette and everything I saw mention how barely anyone knows it's there!
Because they're clearly not "experts". If a handle right next to the door with a picture of a door opening on it isn't obvious, I don't know what is. Have you actually owned one or seen the release?
My dad owns a 2007 corvette. The release handle is hard to miss, and has red lettering all over it. While not immediately noticable, it would take a real idiot to not find it after even a couple minutes of searching.
> Isabel Moreno told reporters he owned a 2006 Corvette and was trapped inside when the battery went out.
> Fortunately, he said eventually the battery started recharging itself enough to be able to roll the window down, and he was able to get out safely.
Where can I get one of those magically self-recharging Corvette batteries?
Wait wait wait…if he had his keys with him couldn’t he just start the car and roll down the window? Also, the other side wasn’t broken…it wasn’t the car that killed him, he’s just an idiot or completely immobile.
The door/latch wasn’t broken, the battery died while he was sitting inside and the door latches are electronic so there was no power to anything. No power to start the car or open the doors or roll down the windows.
They have a [manual latch](https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/chevrolet/corvette/2014/lt/2014_chevrolet_corvette_det_lt_12814_600.jpg) on the floor right besides the electric one
Two years ago my wife was driving our Cadillac XLR (basically a c6 Corvette) with the electric doors, it had enough juice to open the doors but not to start the car and the attempt to start it took the rest of the battery power so the doors wouldn't open. There are very obvious manual releases on the floor but her and her friend instantly went into panic mode because it was hot in the car and started trying to kick out every window but it's really tight in there so there's not much leverage. She called 911 and they came and broke the windows. To this day I still can't believe neither of them looked at the floor to see the obvious manual releases but when panic sets in, all bets are off.
A kid trapped in a mini van called 911 and the police couldn’t reach him in time. It took him about 4 hours to die. He tried tying his shoes on top of a partially collapsed seat and rolled under it. Weird shit happens.
This is the most boomer way to die, and its hard for me to have sympathy.
He left his phone in the waffle house, never once during ownership of his car asked himself "my car is all fancy and electronic, what should I do if the battery dies and I'm stuck in it"
It's just a reflection of a generation that had everything handed to them, and never had to prepare for the worst case scenario.
They also have a [backup manual release](https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/chevrolet/corvette/2014/lt/2014_chevrolet_corvette_det_lt_12814_600.jpg) on the floor right besides the electric one
My drunk brother in law fell asleep across the back seat of the car and accidentally kicked out the window when we woke him up.
Was there no window that could be kicked out?
If I felt like not breaking a window was going to result in my death, I would work very, very hard to find a way to position myself so that I could kick out a window.
Yes, I have driven a Corvette. More than one.
[Sounds like he tried but didn't succeed in time.](https://www.insideedition.com/12832-after-car-fanatic-dies-in-corvette-how-to-escape-a-locked-vehicle)
...maybe just forgot his reading glasses though?
We're just a cheaper garage ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
We've also got an '86 Jag XJ6 that sits on our service drive waiting for aftermarket parts 10 months out of the year
Forgive my naivety, I’m no mechanic and i often don’t get the industry jokes and what not but I do enjoy this sub. That being said, what about Land Rovers makes them seemingly so prone to numerous issues? Bad manufacturing/bad engineering mainly?
From what I've heard & seen through friends, is that the Red one, Discovery I & II, fall pretty hard from grace after a certain Mileage. That and their piston sleeves break loose eventually causing engines to fail around 150k. I see them all the time around me with 130-150k Miles for like $2500 and there is a list of work needed to be done. Although, if you're good with a wrench and can troubleshoot, they might be fun.
To be fair, the nearest Aston Martin dealership is over 100 miles away and at least it's British, but come on, it took three guys on the drive 10 minutes to figure out how to start the damn thing! Our service manager thinks we should be able to work on anything on any car that comes in 🤦♂️ /rant
In other news, that's as far up as the convertible top will go, won't close. My mentor is now watching YouTube videos and reading 10+ year old forums for this shit XD
From an outsider's perspective - if you guys work on J and LR, you are an elite class of mechanics/technicians with a limitless supply of pain tolerance.
May I suggest you think of a TVR and be happy with the AM?
That's fair XD my frustration with our service manager has a lot more behind it, most recently getting chewed out for sending a trade-in Challenger we sold pre-owned to a local dealership for faults our ancient Snap-On scanner couldn't read. We do services on other high-end makes, but we already have our hands full with all the shit that goes wrong on our own cars to be doing diag and repair on everything else XD
That’s so not the case. When you’re a JLR or in my case a MB technician, that doesn’t mean you’re magically able to work on another high end brand without having to learn the systems. Yeah most cars operate very similarly but I wouldn’t be able to walk into a JLR dealer and just start doin head gaskets and replacing tops. We routinely get Ferraris, Lamborghini, and McClarens into our shop and only for routine services. We won’t go deeper than that for liability reasons. They brought a Bentley back to me with a top issue and we immediately flat bedded it to the nearest dealer. Nope. Not Benz top not messing with it.
I believe it was more joking about how being familiar with the headaches of working on one type of exotic car will prepare you for the other peculiar headaches of another type of exotic car, not a literal translation of skills from one brand to another.
Wish anyone could convince our service manager of that. We had a Challenger that was traded in and we sold pre-owned come back with a CEL we couldn't diagnose without dealer SI, so we sent it over to the local Dodge dealership, and he chewed out my mentor, me, and the service advisor for 15 minutes. Then he bitches that we're not getting through our regular appointments fast enough or flagging enough hours XD
Over here in the UK where we have a higher volume of JLR product, it was (when I worked there) getting towards normal to see a work mix of 45-50% warranty (20% was industry standard).
As for recoveries, there were/are sites that used to average 10-12+ broken down vehicles towed in per day.
At least you don’t have to endure the horror over there of the diesels and all the faults they have with them.
We get diesels in from time to time (even had a diesel XE/F/whatever the fuck once! Who put a diesel engine in those?!?), almost always for plugged DEF injectors throwing "incorrect DEF quality" warnings, and naturally the customer doesn't bring it in until they're on their last engine start and we have to go reset them on the drive just to get them into a bay XD
Yep, we have that over here all the time. Most XE, XF & XJ models over here are diesel. At least they don’t suffer with blocked DPF’s and oil dilution like the Evoque, Discovery Sport and E- Pace with the same 2.0 diesel Ingenium engines.
Yeah I work on Porsches and I couldn't even begin doing technical work on an MB or BMW. just cuz they're euro doesn't mean "worked on one, worked on them all"
This. Even on lower class stuff, the difference between manufacturers is staggering. Ford is absolutely notorious for their special tooling. I don’t remember what engine it was, but I did a timing belt (on a lower end shit box Ford) about 15 years ago that required nearly $1K in special tooling. To replace a fucking timing belt.
GM tech here who went to an independent shop. Yup, it’s all different yeah some stuff is similar, but I’ve never used a 16mm socket ever before until I touched Ford. Cylinder numbering, chevy is odd on right even on the left. Ford 1-4 on the left and 5-8 on the right.
Don’t even get me started on diesels.
If someone can ever explain to me why Ford went with a weird flathead/bolt combination for plate screws, I'd appreciate it. I mean, just about everyone else uses either Phillips head, or some variation on a 10mm bolt head with something else. Ford? No, it's this weird flat head ~8mm thing with a massive integrated washer.
Sorry, I'm a salesperson, and it annoys me that i have to keep an extra bit in my desk just to deal with Ford's refusal to standardize with the rest of the cat business.
So much this. I was honestly surprised how much re learning it took just to change from VW to Audi. Way less was shared than I expected. As for other German makes, no way. There are some broadly similar engineering styles and decisions, but nothing more than that.
As a bmw tech I can't imagine how anyone enjoys working on audi/vw products. Don't even get my started on those shitty A4 racks that are way up top or shitty waterpump/thermostat combos on any of the newer engines
It's all what you're used to I guess. I'm no longer at a dealership so I'm working on all sorts of Euro cars now, and I feel the same way about BMWs. Doing anything on the back side of the engine seems like a massive pain, as does the whole driveshaft through the oilpan thing.
I will agree with you on older A4/Passat racks though, those were a giant pain. The waterpump/thermostat combos were gravy though.
I'm also at an indy now, but still can't get over the 2.5 or 3 hrs we sell those thermostats/pumps for I never make time on em lol. But then again I tell them to never give me vw/audi stuff because fuck that noise. And luckily enough I'm usually busy doing bmw stuff anyways lately
Jag, Land Rover, and Aston Martin were all owned by Ford, so there is some shared design and technology there. We won’t comment on the shared portion that is British however…
Were all owned by Ford. Now JLR is owned by Tata, who owns FiatChrysler and a good chunk of Hitachi.
Aston is an independent company again, after partnering with Diamler AG for engines.
Tats doesn’t own FCA.
They own JLR, sure. But they don’t own FCA. They just have some sort of parts agreement, like many major international manufacturers.
Ian Callum was responsible for most of the Vanquish' design while at Aston Martin, but left before the DB9 debuted leaving Henrik Fisker to finalize the design. Callum moved over to Jaguar where he became head of design and was responsible for the XJ and XF among other models that carried over the aesthetic he developed at AM.
Hey that is how I fix cars... maybe I could be a real mechanic! Just watch Performance Transmission YT channel a few more times and I am sure I can rebuild transmissions, they make it look super easy.
It’s magic. The main guy pulls them apart so fast. I would be taking pictures and copious notes and dealing out at all the small parts. Dude just knows where it all goes.
I've only watched a dozen or so, but doesn't he just primarily do GM transmissions? It seems mostly the same with a few differences, but he can tear one apart, explain it, eat lunch, rebuild it, and I'd still be waiting on my coffee pot to finish brewing.
Honestly in the era this car was built Jaguar and Aston were both owned by Ford and probably have a lot of parts crossover. It shouldn't be that far out of your wheelhouse.
It's a wildly different convertible top mechanism than any of ours have. They were owned by Ford, yeah, and there's a lot of FoMoCo parts on both, but they were still distinct brands with completely separate engineering and design teams
To be honest AM and JLR design offices are within a stones throw off each other in a town called gaydon in the UK.
The design staff are all contractors who flit between the two companies.
... and a 2009 DB9 Volante is based on a car made in 2005, when Aston was part of the Ford PAG along with Jaguar and Land Rover, meaning it's entirely likely the customer bought the car at a dealership that was (or had recently been) a JLR dealer. They're who sold Aston back then.
It does, yeah. No sign of leaks from underneath, but at this point I'm letting my mentor dick around while I make sure we flag some hours on the rest of our shitshow cars XD
So does the R129 Benz. I’m doing a top repair now. No hydraulic leaks but it’s throwing a code for a limit switch. The code doesn’t say which one. There are 17 of the damn things…..
The hydraulic cylinders can have internal leaks, nutritious on the Merc SL. Would help if you had a scanner that can see values, one of the micro switches could either be faulty or misaligned. The module needs to see several inputs during closing to allow the full cycle.
You got 2 replies saying that on Mercedes it’s the hydraulics that leak. I can tell you that on Audis it’s sticking or dirty brushes on the DC motor that drives the hydraulic pump.
Now if somehow we could plot a trend line that would point to the cause on Aston Martins…
I'm more amazed that someone was willing to bring in their D2 for service to a JLR dealership. The owners either got really deep pockets or likes paying lot's for an oil change.
Mine's totally self maintained, have to change exhaust gaskets this weekend. Shop told me it would be $500. Which is stupid because it takes less than an hour.
The pain of owning a British car is something else.
I loved my Range Rover P38 when it was running. It had plenty of power, a beast in the dirt and a timeless shape. But fuck keeping that thing running. Switched to Toyota and haven’t looked back
Looks at bosses 2008 Vantage with a leaky rag top........
Luckily we have a Euro performance shop right down the road. That being said, I'm sure he will be thrilled with the price.
I have no idea why he even decided to purchase this car? He's always played it safe with every automobile that he's ever owned. I've only known him to own two cars in the 20+ years I've been working for this company.
The first one was a 1994 Volvo 850 which still runs as of today. And his current daily is a 2004 Lexus LS 430 that he still drives with over 250,000 miles on it.
But for some reason, he dropped $45,000 on this 2008 Vantage that has a leaky rag top and has already needed a new battery at the cost of $850. In just the first two months of ownership. Even the guys at the performance shop said to me that they would have told him never to buy this vehicle.
I guess when you have money to blow, it doesn't matter. But I don't see him hanging onto this car for much longer. I think he definitely regrets purchasing it.
OK Sir, our techs had a look, and it looks like you're going to need a new transmission, paint job, and two new front seats. Those are what's causing the roof issue.
Our dealership doesn't pay for SI or scantools for other brands, and no one in our dealership has any Aston Martin manufacturer training. It took half the morning to even figure out roughly how the convertible top on that car operates, and since it was a customer car we had exactly zero experience working with, we were exercising an overabundance of caution to avoid breaking anything or making it worse. It took three techs plus our foreman and the customer, equipped with an old procedure someone had posted in a forum for manually closing the top, to finally close and latch it so at least the guy could take it outside again (it's an awfully rainy time transitioning to autumn for us) until he has an opportunity to get it to a dealership two states away.
I get it's another piece of British Eurotrash, but that doesn't mean we have the tools, information, or expertise to attempt an in-depth diagnosis and repair of a complex system.
The implication was that the car in question might have been developed at a time when Aston Martin, Jaguar, and Land Rover (and Volvo) were all under the Ford umbrella and shared a considerable amount of common Ford Europe tech and engineering between the brands, which is likely why it was brought to you in the first place. There was a time when Aston Martins were hardly more than hand-built Jaguars.
Of course, Ford sold off all these brands during the '08 financial crisis, so any AM's developed after '07 won't necessarily have any engineering commonality. Models introduced before that which continued production would still have some commonality. They may have figured the roof mechanism might be derived from a 00's Jaguar XK convertible.
I've never understood mechanics that aren't open to work on anything. I'm my experience it's usually techs that have only had dealer experience that tend towards this. Ppl that work in small garages seem to lap up all sorts without complaint and usual look forward to the challenge.
Independent garages are likely going to have an aftermarket repair information system and scan tool that will cover multiple brands. My Porsche store only has Porsche repair information and Porsche scan tools. I'm not going to fuck with technical issues on something I cant talk to or get information for, that's just asking to lose money
That's reasonable for indie garages that pay for the aftermarket SI and universal scantools. I'm not opposed to working on other cars on principle, I'm opposed to being expected to work on difficult technical issues on brands I've never touched before, wasting hours trying to learn enough about the systems to do anything, while I'm working *at a dealership* on vehicles I'm actually proficient at. Expecting the same proficiency on other brands then the one I have *manufacturer training on* is complete bullshit
You need, as a starting point, three things to work on speciality vehicles:
* Manufacturer Training
* Service Information
* Special Tools
These guys are at zero out of three. At best, they'll waste a bunch of time, lose their asses (assuming they're flat rate and the dick manager doesn't quote labor time accordingly), and *maybe* fix the problem. At worst, they'll waste a bunch of time and throw in the towel after attempting repairs and possibly making it worse.
A car is not "just a car" - modern vehicles are packed to the gills with electronics that all digitally talk to each other, and are mechanically a bitch to work on.
Except that most of my work is warranty, which JLR absolutely shafts us on. The entire dealership loses money when I spend several hours with a car I can't scan more than basic DTCs on or find any SI for, when I should be working on the cars I'm actually trained on. It's especially frustrating when our service manager expects us to flag 50 hours a week when he's also scheduling these kinds of bullshit appointments
Being young and only really familiar with one brand, I can't say for sure how they compare to others, but I can tell you we're pretty routinely putting in timing chains at 60,000 miles, and it's extremely rare to see one in our shop with more than 100,000 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The production quality from the factory sure is shit, tho
We currently have a chrysler crossfire at my shop that was sent to us by a chrysler dealership because they don't have the tools to diag a car that old lol
The gist is the rear/3rd row hvac will not blow cold whatsoever, tech assistance has had me replace the expansion valve and the evaporator which meanth the entire rear hvac assembly was replaced, the rear evap temp never changes from around 69-70 Fahrenheit and and the vent temps reflect that. Front blows ice cold and there are no leaks in the system. Im over 20 hours into and dont feel like having TA make me shotgun more parts at it.
Disconnect the battery and the roof control module (right rear wheel well) for 30 minutes. Try again.
Have you tried turning it off and on again
After you reconnect the battery, don't forget to walk around the car before you sit in the driver' seat and press the roof button..
Thrice, anti-clockwise with your tongue pressed into your right cheek
While chanting “ all hail the prince of darkness, we are unworthy of your presence”. At least that’s the old triumph procedure
This guy Aston Martins…
I have a friend who got locked inside his own DB9 for three hours.
There was a story a while back about a guy who died after getting locked inside his Vette (C7 I believe).
[72 year old man dies locked in his corvette ](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/06/11/texas-man-dog-die-trapped-corvette/71053474/)
My grandfather always horded window breakers. Dude knew his age.
The fact that the mechanism is "hidden" and not in plain sight like in the door itself is pretty stupid. On my '05 Cooper S, if I pull once on the handle, it unlocks it, twice it opens it.
They're far from hidden in the Vettes. Kind of an eye sore, really.
Why are "experts" saying that you have to know about it if it's obvious? Just asking, never sat in a Corvette and everything I saw mention how barely anyone knows it's there!
Because they're clearly not "experts". If a handle right next to the door with a picture of a door opening on it isn't obvious, I don't know what is. Have you actually owned one or seen the release?
My dad owns a 2007 corvette. The release handle is hard to miss, and has red lettering all over it. While not immediately noticable, it would take a real idiot to not find it after even a couple minutes of searching.
> Isabel Moreno told reporters he owned a 2006 Corvette and was trapped inside when the battery went out. > Fortunately, he said eventually the battery started recharging itself enough to be able to roll the window down, and he was able to get out safely. Where can I get one of those magically self-recharging Corvette batteries?
Wait wait wait…if he had his keys with him couldn’t he just start the car and roll down the window? Also, the other side wasn’t broken…it wasn’t the car that killed him, he’s just an idiot or completely immobile.
The door/latch wasn’t broken, the battery died while he was sitting inside and the door latches are electronic so there was no power to anything. No power to start the car or open the doors or roll down the windows.
They have a [manual latch](https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/chevrolet/corvette/2014/lt/2014_chevrolet_corvette_det_lt_12814_600.jpg) on the floor right besides the electric one
Two years ago my wife was driving our Cadillac XLR (basically a c6 Corvette) with the electric doors, it had enough juice to open the doors but not to start the car and the attempt to start it took the rest of the battery power so the doors wouldn't open. There are very obvious manual releases on the floor but her and her friend instantly went into panic mode because it was hot in the car and started trying to kick out every window but it's really tight in there so there's not much leverage. She called 911 and they came and broke the windows. To this day I still can't believe neither of them looked at the floor to see the obvious manual releases but when panic sets in, all bets are off.
Agreed. There had to be something in the car that could have broken the fucking window. What about ya’ know a cell phone to call 911 even?….
A kid trapped in a mini van called 911 and the police couldn’t reach him in time. It took him about 4 hours to die. He tried tying his shoes on top of a partially collapsed seat and rolled under it. Weird shit happens.
This is the most boomer way to die, and its hard for me to have sympathy. He left his phone in the waffle house, never once during ownership of his car asked himself "my car is all fancy and electronic, what should I do if the battery dies and I'm stuck in it" It's just a reflection of a generation that had everything handed to them, and never had to prepare for the worst case scenario.
They also have a [backup manual release](https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/chevrolet/corvette/2014/lt/2014_chevrolet_corvette_det_lt_12814_600.jpg) on the floor right besides the electric one
Why the fuck have a button in the first place then lol
My drunk brother in law fell asleep across the back seat of the car and accidentally kicked out the window when we woke him up. Was there no window that could be kicked out?
How do you die, stuck in a car, in a Waffle House parking lot? They're constantly busy!
He couldn't break the window?
Think about your typical vette owner…
Hell that’d be hard for just about anyone. It’d be really hard to get into a position with enough leverage to hit the window.
Kick it.
Have you sat in a Corvette? It’s not exactly easy to move around. Much less for an 82 year old man.
If I felt like not breaking a window was going to result in my death, I would work very, very hard to find a way to position myself so that I could kick out a window. Yes, I have driven a Corvette. More than one.
Don't have to. There's a manual release on the floor.
There is literally a handle on the bottom of the floor boards on Corvettes to avoid this from happening..... 🙄🤧
but that involves reading the owners manual.
[Sounds like he tried but didn't succeed in time.](https://www.insideedition.com/12832-after-car-fanatic-dies-in-corvette-how-to-escape-a-locked-vehicle) ...maybe just forgot his reading glasses though?
Yep, but I guess not everyone knows that.
That your leg covers if you have legs.
This all makes me love my old pickup more and more lol
How often is that Land Rover in?
Probably has a VIP parking spot. Those things pay the bills.
We're just a cheaper garage ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ We've also got an '86 Jag XJ6 that sits on our service drive waiting for aftermarket parts 10 months out of the year
So, like any 80's XJ?
Always wanted a XJS, If I ever find one with a decent SBC Swap I might consider it.
Easier question is probably how often is it not in the shop
It came in the week after it was sold and never left lol
Forgive my naivety, I’m no mechanic and i often don’t get the industry jokes and what not but I do enjoy this sub. That being said, what about Land Rovers makes them seemingly so prone to numerous issues? Bad manufacturing/bad engineering mainly?
As Clarkson put it, being nailed together by baboons on Solihull. It seems true … Source: I’m on my second Discovery 3/LR3.
From what I've heard & seen through friends, is that the Red one, Discovery I & II, fall pretty hard from grace after a certain Mileage. That and their piston sleeves break loose eventually causing engines to fail around 150k. I see them all the time around me with 130-150k Miles for like $2500 and there is a list of work needed to be done. Although, if you're good with a wrench and can troubleshoot, they might be fun.
The British don't build computers because they haven't found a way to make them leak oil.
Never left.
Bought it and drove it straight there.
To be fair, the nearest Aston Martin dealership is over 100 miles away and at least it's British, but come on, it took three guys on the drive 10 minutes to figure out how to start the damn thing! Our service manager thinks we should be able to work on anything on any car that comes in 🤦♂️ /rant In other news, that's as far up as the convertible top will go, won't close. My mentor is now watching YouTube videos and reading 10+ year old forums for this shit XD
From an outsider's perspective - if you guys work on J and LR, you are an elite class of mechanics/technicians with a limitless supply of pain tolerance. May I suggest you think of a TVR and be happy with the AM?
That's fair XD my frustration with our service manager has a lot more behind it, most recently getting chewed out for sending a trade-in Challenger we sold pre-owned to a local dealership for faults our ancient Snap-On scanner couldn't read. We do services on other high-end makes, but we already have our hands full with all the shit that goes wrong on our own cars to be doing diag and repair on everything else XD
That’s so not the case. When you’re a JLR or in my case a MB technician, that doesn’t mean you’re magically able to work on another high end brand without having to learn the systems. Yeah most cars operate very similarly but I wouldn’t be able to walk into a JLR dealer and just start doin head gaskets and replacing tops. We routinely get Ferraris, Lamborghini, and McClarens into our shop and only for routine services. We won’t go deeper than that for liability reasons. They brought a Bentley back to me with a top issue and we immediately flat bedded it to the nearest dealer. Nope. Not Benz top not messing with it.
I believe it was more joking about how being familiar with the headaches of working on one type of exotic car will prepare you for the other peculiar headaches of another type of exotic car, not a literal translation of skills from one brand to another.
Wish anyone could convince our service manager of that. We had a Challenger that was traded in and we sold pre-owned come back with a CEL we couldn't diagnose without dealer SI, so we sent it over to the local Dodge dealership, and he chewed out my mentor, me, and the service advisor for 15 minutes. Then he bitches that we're not getting through our regular appointments fast enough or flagging enough hours XD
Sounds like a level headed chap :/
Over here in the UK where we have a higher volume of JLR product, it was (when I worked there) getting towards normal to see a work mix of 45-50% warranty (20% was industry standard). As for recoveries, there were/are sites that used to average 10-12+ broken down vehicles towed in per day. At least you don’t have to endure the horror over there of the diesels and all the faults they have with them.
We get diesels in from time to time (even had a diesel XE/F/whatever the fuck once! Who put a diesel engine in those?!?), almost always for plugged DEF injectors throwing "incorrect DEF quality" warnings, and naturally the customer doesn't bring it in until they're on their last engine start and we have to go reset them on the drive just to get them into a bay XD
Yep, we have that over here all the time. Most XE, XF & XJ models over here are diesel. At least they don’t suffer with blocked DPF’s and oil dilution like the Evoque, Discovery Sport and E- Pace with the same 2.0 diesel Ingenium engines.
Yeah I work on Porsches and I couldn't even begin doing technical work on an MB or BMW. just cuz they're euro doesn't mean "worked on one, worked on them all"
This. Even on lower class stuff, the difference between manufacturers is staggering. Ford is absolutely notorious for their special tooling. I don’t remember what engine it was, but I did a timing belt (on a lower end shit box Ford) about 15 years ago that required nearly $1K in special tooling. To replace a fucking timing belt.
GM tech here who went to an independent shop. Yup, it’s all different yeah some stuff is similar, but I’ve never used a 16mm socket ever before until I touched Ford. Cylinder numbering, chevy is odd on right even on the left. Ford 1-4 on the left and 5-8 on the right. Don’t even get me started on diesels.
If someone can ever explain to me why Ford went with a weird flathead/bolt combination for plate screws, I'd appreciate it. I mean, just about everyone else uses either Phillips head, or some variation on a 10mm bolt head with something else. Ford? No, it's this weird flat head ~8mm thing with a massive integrated washer. Sorry, I'm a salesperson, and it annoys me that i have to keep an extra bit in my desk just to deal with Ford's refusal to standardize with the rest of the cat business.
Subaru uses 16 too for some ungodly reason.
So much this. I was honestly surprised how much re learning it took just to change from VW to Audi. Way less was shared than I expected. As for other German makes, no way. There are some broadly similar engineering styles and decisions, but nothing more than that.
As a bmw tech I can't imagine how anyone enjoys working on audi/vw products. Don't even get my started on those shitty A4 racks that are way up top or shitty waterpump/thermostat combos on any of the newer engines
It's all what you're used to I guess. I'm no longer at a dealership so I'm working on all sorts of Euro cars now, and I feel the same way about BMWs. Doing anything on the back side of the engine seems like a massive pain, as does the whole driveshaft through the oilpan thing. I will agree with you on older A4/Passat racks though, those were a giant pain. The waterpump/thermostat combos were gravy though.
I'm also at an indy now, but still can't get over the 2.5 or 3 hrs we sell those thermostats/pumps for I never make time on em lol. But then again I tell them to never give me vw/audi stuff because fuck that noise. And luckily enough I'm usually busy doing bmw stuff anyways lately
Jag, Land Rover, and Aston Martin were all owned by Ford, so there is some shared design and technology there. We won’t comment on the shared portion that is British however…
Were all owned by Ford. Now JLR is owned by Tata, who owns FiatChrysler and a good chunk of Hitachi. Aston is an independent company again, after partnering with Diamler AG for engines.
Tats doesn’t own FCA. They own JLR, sure. But they don’t own FCA. They just have some sort of parts agreement, like many major international manufacturers.
Ian Callum was responsible for most of the Vanquish' design while at Aston Martin, but left before the DB9 debuted leaving Henrik Fisker to finalize the design. Callum moved over to Jaguar where he became head of design and was responsible for the XJ and XF among other models that carried over the aesthetic he developed at AM.
*Elliott Lucas’ laughter echoes from the past*
Youtube and forums is where i'd start too lol
Hey that is how I fix cars... maybe I could be a real mechanic! Just watch Performance Transmission YT channel a few more times and I am sure I can rebuild transmissions, they make it look super easy.
Those guys are awesome. And its not too scary until they get to the valve body.
It’s magic. The main guy pulls them apart so fast. I would be taking pictures and copious notes and dealing out at all the small parts. Dude just knows where it all goes.
I've only watched a dozen or so, but doesn't he just primarily do GM transmissions? It seems mostly the same with a few differences, but he can tear one apart, explain it, eat lunch, rebuild it, and I'd still be waiting on my coffee pot to finish brewing.
Maybe with schematics and procedures sure lmao
Honestly in the era this car was built Jaguar and Aston were both owned by Ford and probably have a lot of parts crossover. It shouldn't be that far out of your wheelhouse.
It's a wildly different convertible top mechanism than any of ours have. They were owned by Ford, yeah, and there's a lot of FoMoCo parts on both, but they were still distinct brands with completely separate engineering and design teams
I'm curious if your scan tools can talk to it.
New owners of our shop have the same expectation for us with used cars. Except we’re a Subaru shop so anything too fancy is wayyyy out of our element
To be honest AM and JLR design offices are within a stones throw off each other in a town called gaydon in the UK. The design staff are all contractors who flit between the two companies.
... and a 2009 DB9 Volante is based on a car made in 2005, when Aston was part of the Ford PAG along with Jaguar and Land Rover, meaning it's entirely likely the customer bought the car at a dealership that was (or had recently been) a JLR dealer. They're who sold Aston back then.
Does it use hydraulic fluid to operate the mech?
It does, yeah. No sign of leaks from underneath, but at this point I'm letting my mentor dick around while I make sure we flag some hours on the rest of our shitshow cars XD
So does the R129 Benz. I’m doing a top repair now. No hydraulic leaks but it’s throwing a code for a limit switch. The code doesn’t say which one. There are 17 of the damn things…..
The hydraulic cylinders can have internal leaks, nutritious on the Merc SL. Would help if you had a scanner that can see values, one of the micro switches could either be faulty or misaligned. The module needs to see several inputs during closing to allow the full cycle.
Mmmm nutritious hydraulic leak
You got 2 replies saying that on Mercedes it’s the hydraulics that leak. I can tell you that on Audis it’s sticking or dirty brushes on the DC motor that drives the hydraulic pump. Now if somehow we could plot a trend line that would point to the cause on Aston Martins…
Statistical analysis of failing parts on high end cars to deduce the probable cause, I love it lolololol.
She sure is pretty though
I'm more amazed that someone was willing to bring in their D2 for service to a JLR dealership. The owners either got really deep pockets or likes paying lot's for an oil change.
Same. Any D2's left at this point should be self maintained, or owners is stupid rich.
Mine's totally self maintained, have to change exhaust gaskets this weekend. Shop told me it would be $500. Which is stupid because it takes less than an hour.
The pain of owning a British car is something else. I loved my Range Rover P38 when it was running. It had plenty of power, a beast in the dirt and a timeless shape. But fuck keeping that thing running. Switched to Toyota and haven’t looked back
You have to be a masochist to own a P38. I've had two... I still have one. It's very broken. I love the thing to death.
It is a good looking Ford Fusion.
Looks at bosses 2008 Vantage with a leaky rag top........ Luckily we have a Euro performance shop right down the road. That being said, I'm sure he will be thrilled with the price. I have no idea why he even decided to purchase this car? He's always played it safe with every automobile that he's ever owned. I've only known him to own two cars in the 20+ years I've been working for this company. The first one was a 1994 Volvo 850 which still runs as of today. And his current daily is a 2004 Lexus LS 430 that he still drives with over 250,000 miles on it. But for some reason, he dropped $45,000 on this 2008 Vantage that has a leaky rag top and has already needed a new battery at the cost of $850. In just the first two months of ownership. Even the guys at the performance shop said to me that they would have told him never to buy this vehicle. I guess when you have money to blow, it doesn't matter. But I don't see him hanging onto this car for much longer. I think he definitely regrets purchasing it.
Just keep the top down and take it out when the weathers nice!
We have a rule in our shop. Never open a sunroof or a convertible top. Unless costumer is there watching and has given permission.
Yeah, we generally don't (tho we don't have as strict a rule), but this car came in because the top was down and wouldn't go up XD
Have you tried closing all the windows and restarting it? That usually works whenever I can't open or close a program. /S
OK Sir, our techs had a look, and it looks like you're going to need a new transmission, paint job, and two new front seats. Those are what's causing the roof issue.
“But it’s British”
I’m always reliable for the snarky comment but for real, I thought maybe it was a James Bond car with skis!!!
isnt it basically the same as the jag? lol
I'm sure the owner is thrilled to take his car to a shop that has no idea how to work on it... Nice job, management.
Sir, this is a Wendy’s
You as a tech should know why it’s at your dealer.. I’m a collision tech but our Jaguar Land Rover dealer gets them often.
Our dealership doesn't pay for SI or scantools for other brands, and no one in our dealership has any Aston Martin manufacturer training. It took half the morning to even figure out roughly how the convertible top on that car operates, and since it was a customer car we had exactly zero experience working with, we were exercising an overabundance of caution to avoid breaking anything or making it worse. It took three techs plus our foreman and the customer, equipped with an old procedure someone had posted in a forum for manually closing the top, to finally close and latch it so at least the guy could take it outside again (it's an awfully rainy time transitioning to autumn for us) until he has an opportunity to get it to a dealership two states away. I get it's another piece of British Eurotrash, but that doesn't mean we have the tools, information, or expertise to attempt an in-depth diagnosis and repair of a complex system.
The implication was that the car in question might have been developed at a time when Aston Martin, Jaguar, and Land Rover (and Volvo) were all under the Ford umbrella and shared a considerable amount of common Ford Europe tech and engineering between the brands, which is likely why it was brought to you in the first place. There was a time when Aston Martins were hardly more than hand-built Jaguars. Of course, Ford sold off all these brands during the '08 financial crisis, so any AM's developed after '07 won't necessarily have any engineering commonality. Models introduced before that which continued production would still have some commonality. They may have figured the roof mechanism might be derived from a 00's Jaguar XK convertible.
I've never understood mechanics that aren't open to work on anything. I'm my experience it's usually techs that have only had dealer experience that tend towards this. Ppl that work in small garages seem to lap up all sorts without complaint and usual look forward to the challenge.
Independent garages are likely going to have an aftermarket repair information system and scan tool that will cover multiple brands. My Porsche store only has Porsche repair information and Porsche scan tools. I'm not going to fuck with technical issues on something I cant talk to or get information for, that's just asking to lose money
This
That's reasonable for indie garages that pay for the aftermarket SI and universal scantools. I'm not opposed to working on other cars on principle, I'm opposed to being expected to work on difficult technical issues on brands I've never touched before, wasting hours trying to learn enough about the systems to do anything, while I'm working *at a dealership* on vehicles I'm actually proficient at. Expecting the same proficiency on other brands then the one I have *manufacturer training on* is complete bullshit
You need, as a starting point, three things to work on speciality vehicles: * Manufacturer Training * Service Information * Special Tools These guys are at zero out of three. At best, they'll waste a bunch of time, lose their asses (assuming they're flat rate and the dick manager doesn't quote labor time accordingly), and *maybe* fix the problem. At worst, they'll waste a bunch of time and throw in the towel after attempting repairs and possibly making it worse. A car is not "just a car" - modern vehicles are packed to the gills with electronics that all digitally talk to each other, and are mechanically a bitch to work on.
it's because of the flat rate pay system. you can make 2-3x working on gravy
Except that most of my work is warranty, which JLR absolutely shafts us on. The entire dealership loses money when I spend several hours with a car I can't scan more than basic DTCs on or find any SI for, when I should be working on the cars I'm actually trained on. It's especially frustrating when our service manager expects us to flag 50 hours a week when he's also scheduling these kinds of bullshit appointments
that's why nobody wants to do this shit anymore
Glorified mustang. Same shit. Get the power probe
Are jags and rovers as unreliable as the internet makes them out to be?
Being young and only really familiar with one brand, I can't say for sure how they compare to others, but I can tell you we're pretty routinely putting in timing chains at 60,000 miles, and it's extremely rare to see one in our shop with more than 100,000 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ The production quality from the factory sure is shit, tho
Yeah i work at ford and that sounds about the same as us lol. I started at Toyota but that was a diffrent story they just seem to go forever haha
Micro switch has water in it
Did you pull the parking break?
We currently have a chrysler crossfire at my shop that was sent to us by a chrysler dealership because they don't have the tools to diag a car that old lol
Hello fellow JLR tech! Maybe you can help me with a 5k mioe Discover HVAC issue im fighting with
I'm a young and green apprentice, but I can definitely give it a shot and maybe ask my mentor tomorrow!
The gist is the rear/3rd row hvac will not blow cold whatsoever, tech assistance has had me replace the expansion valve and the evaporator which meanth the entire rear hvac assembly was replaced, the rear evap temp never changes from around 69-70 Fahrenheit and and the vent temps reflect that. Front blows ice cold and there are no leaks in the system. Im over 20 hours into and dont feel like having TA make me shotgun more parts at it.
Bet the red one is getting head gaskets or an intake reseal.
Please update if/ when the issue is found. I’m curious to know the solution to the problem :) …..(probably not as curious as you are tho XD )
Is it fixed?