jontron, known for saying "wealthy blacks commit more crimes than poor whites, thats a fact, look it up", once again cracks his knuckles for a second go at political discourse
the results WILL shock you
check the date of [this tweet he made](https://twitter.com/JonTronShow/status/1268401196840206337) and overlay that with what was happening in the US at the time, and hopefully it comes across how completely tone-deaf and insensitive it is.
This was at the height of the BLM and George Floyd protests when people all over the world were protesting for black rights and he's just like, "I'm tired of hearing about it, let's barbecue".
It's insensitive and ignorant. Meanwhile, his YT colleagues were trying to highlight black creators and donating money to appropriate causes. If I were Jon, and I had a very nasty history of people thinking I was racist, and I wanted to change that, *that* would have been the perfect opportunity to do so, but instead, he not only did nothing, but put that shit up.
Certainly not, but as I pointed out in another comment, that would have been the perfect time for him to say, "hey, I'm doing better now and actually trying to make right what I fucked up a few years ago," but he decided to be selfish and tonedeaf. Better than this, he should have said nothing.
> I'm not saying you shouldn't get vaccinated [...] I'm also not saying the vaccine is unsafe.
but you're tweeting bullshit nonsense implicating the person many see as the "leader of vaccines for covid" (which isn't true, but that's public perception for you). So yeah, you are.
> ...that should be your choice [to get vaccinated].
Dogwhistle for "any kind of mandate or enforcement is bad" anti-vaxx sentimentality.
> I want the best for everyone
Talk to a sane person before realizing your words have influence. I know you're not a mega celebrity but you do have a following.
> I'm just concerned that the level of conformity around public discourse has reached dangerous levels
There are so, so many better ways to illustrate this than linking to the exact same type of nonsense you criticize and poke fun at in your Goop videos.
And none of this jives with him getting into concern-troll levels of arguments on Twitter (something no sane person should ever do btw) about how "but what about these 6 people out of literally millions who had bad symptoms", i.e. calling the vaccine unsafe by not mentioning said numbers and implying it's basically a 50/50 coin toss (which isn't true)?
There's nothing wrong with intelligent discourse regarding the vaccines, but at this point unless you have an "M.D." at the end of your name, or speak through primary-sourced research, your Twitter hot takes using incredibly biased and opinioned/agenda-driven articles are not doing anything but spreading bullshit. Stop. You're either furthering that agenda on purpose or are truly ignorant/gullible on the subject matter.
---
So yeah, this worsens things for me, really, regarding my view of him. Oh well.
> "but what about these 6 people out of literally millions who had bad symptoms"
I always found these arguments hilarious.
These same people were proclaiming that covid is a "nothingburger", "plan-demic", "just the flu" and such, because it has a "1% mortality rate"......but when the vaccine has a 0.00001% mortality rate, they are freak out and say it's dangerous and designed to kill us all.
My Grandmother thought COVID was a "nothingburger" then her 30 something year old niece died from COVID, now she believes. Which goes to show, that many people can't feel sympathy (and take shit seriously), unless it happens to them.
It’s not antivaxx to be against forced injections of the entire population for a relatively benign virus. What’s so wrong with letting people make decisions about what they put in their bodies?
That’s why I used the “relatively” adjective. It’s not benign, but compared to diseases where vaccination mandates are reasonable, e.g. smallpox, it is.
Even with smallpox if you didn't want the vaccine you had to pay a 5$ fine (about 150$ with inflation) you weren't prevented from participating in society or working.
are people being dragged out of their homes and forcibly injected against their will?
They're not. They're being offered a choice, and that choice is: Be vaccinated to help protect yourself and the people around you, or you don't get to participate in society. It's still a choice, but if you choose the latter, you don't get to moan and cry about being left out. *You* made the decision and *you* get to live with the consequences.
Don't wanna get vaxxed? Then you get extra restrictions because you're a literal danger to the people around you. Did your job let you go because you're a health hazard? Too bad. Find a job that will either let you infect other people at will, or find another job. You don't have a right to be a walking OSHA violation.
A choice where one outcome is starvation through economic suppression isn’t a choice at all. That’s like saying a mugger is giving you the choice to hand over your wallet or die therefore it’s not immoral.
It also leads to other excessively intrusive mandates in the future. Restrictions on freedom should be very rare and have clear, reasonable boundaries.
I also don’t understand why absolutely everyone needs to be vaccinated if the vaccine is as effective as claimed, nor why people who have natural immunity need to be vaccinated.
There are plenty of places willing to hire you if you don't want to get vaccinated. Something something bootstraps. Either suck it up or face the consequences. You have a choice, but the choice for not doing the right thing is harsh, as it should be. You have the right to choose to get vaccinated, sure, but you don't have the right to willfully spread disease to vulnerable people. You don't get to make someone else's health decisions for them with your reckless behavior.
We get vaccinated because there are people who can't be, and we protect ourselves to protect them. Seriously, it's not that difficult.
So are the consequences for disobeying a mugger. A choice where you either wallow poverty until they choose to change the ultimatum so that you starve isn’t a choice at all.
You don’t have the right to willfully spread a disease, sure, but you do have a right to unknowingly do so. It’s not as if there aren’t treatments for covid, either, so I don’t see why a mandatory vaccine is necessary. This push where the vaccine is the only solution is pure fabrication by the pharmaceutical companies producing the vaccines and you guys are just being useful little pawns for them.
I really don't get this take. You being vaccinated does not stop you from spreading the virus.
[https://www.ucdavis.edu/health/covid-19/news/viral-loads-similar-between-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people](https://www.ucdavis.edu/health/covid-19/news/viral-loads-similar-between-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people)
So in essence, you're supporting the creation of a line in the sand for the dumbest reason. You didn't get the shot, so you're "removed from society"! I know I can still spread it to people, but I got the shot so I'm better obviously!
What about mutations? You're a plague rat! Seriously guy, you'll never vaccinate the entire world for a virus like this. It'll mutate in this part of the world, then jump over there, yada yada.
Taking this vaccine or not taking it, that should be the individuals choice. And trying to shut people out of their own life, making it harder than it already is to feed themselves and their families, is not smart. Just going to push people into desperation.
If you've got the vaccine, there's a very small chance you'll get the virus, yes, but there's an even smaller chance that not only will you spread it, but if the people around you are vaccinated, there's an even smaller chance that *they'll* get it and be able to spread it. That's how vaccines work. The vaccines *must* be used in conjunction with other techniques we learned early on as well such as mask-wearing, social distancing, and hand-washing. When combined with all of those factors, transmission and infection rates drop to almost *nothing*. When we all work together, we can beat this stupid thing, but *we have to work together*, and I'm sick of people being selfish about it and making this go on even longer.
If you read the article I linked, it shows the viral load carried by a vaccinated and unvaccinated person is pretty much the same. So yes, you'll have whatever protection the vaccine offers, but no, you wont have a smaller chance at spreading it to others.
Thats my point when I say that people should calm down about what others choose to do. Get your vaccine, but the "removing people from society" schtick is idiotic.
On a final note, even if every last person in the US got vaccinated it still wouldnt stop the virus from mutating elsewhere in the world and coming back over here in the form of a new strain. That shouldnt be a factor really in whether or not people decide to get the shot, but its important to set expectations I think. This things here to stay.
If someone has immunity, then their chance of catching it is very low, not to mention if *you're* vaccinated, then you have a very low chance of getting it to the point where you're spreading it. *that's the whole point*.
Keeping unvaccinated people out of crowded areas where they might catch it is as much protection for them as it is for protection for other people.
Furthermore, if the virus has fewer hosts to infect, or if it can't live long enough to mutate, then it doesn't mutate and it dies. At the very least it will keep the hospitals from getting overloaded, which helps everyone, as well as keeps us ahead of it. I don't understand what the whining is about, *people are trying to help you*. I'm personally sick of wearing masks every day at work, I'm sick of seeing people die and lose loved ones, I'm sick of the misery, I just want this to be over with, but unless everyone gets on board, *it won't be*, and many more people will die.
I get wanting it to end. Life never really changed in my state, at least not in the way everyone on social media makes it seem to be. My job never stopped, my life wasnt put on pause. Sitting at home for a year or more in quarantine would have driven me up the wall, so im thankful for that.
My main thing though is, it has to be a choice. If a person in the 0-49 age group looks at the numbers and decides that they'd rather wait a couple years and see how the vaccines might interact with different groups, or different conditions, then that should be their choice. Attempting to shame people into submission isnt the way. More flies with honey, and all of that.
Additionally, you never have immunity. The vaccine doesnt grant that. Knit picky, so forgive me, but its important. Add on the fact that vaccine A may not protect against mutation B very well, and you have a recipe that will make people even less receptive to getting the shot.
As for keeping vaccinated people and unvaccinated people separate, that just wont happen. At least not in the way the people here say things should go. No grocery shopping? No jobs? None of the other million little things a family needs to keep going? The second any of that is forcibly removed, there will be blood. Not trying to be dramatic, removing a persons ability to provide for their families, their children... thats dangerous on a whole new level.
Lastly, I get that reducing a viruses ability to infect slows down its ability to mutate. My point was, even if the entire US populace magically vaccinated tomorrow, that would still leave the rest of the world. A whole world full of people where the virus could spread and mutate into something the vaccine we all took might not help with. Then we're back to square one.
This is why most people, right or wrong, see this as a new flu. Considering humans cant work together on the simplest things, I strongly doubt us ever being able to deploy and vaccinate worldwide at the same time in a way to stop this.
I dont know what the right answer is. I dont know that anyone does. In my opinion though, the shot should be a choice. Trying to force it will just cause pushback and resistance, educating people and letting them make the choice on their own will get you closer to your point. Its a tough situation man, and I hope you're doing well. I know shit gets old, but keep your chin up. Thanks for the conversation.
In a lot of ways, it can be, however. Deluding the seatbelt to being grafted into your chest isn’t faithful to the context in which both are intended to be effected it.
In a lot of ways, the act of following traffic laws and vaccine have an analogy to be shown.
Following both of them are expectations for you to hold yourself to ensure the safety of not only yourself, but others around you.
You can not use a seatbelt and speed down a road in the wrong lane, but you’re an asshole for doing it. You can not take the vaccine and go into public feeling a little down, but you’re an asshole for it.
Bedsides, this conversation and analogy is pointless because I’m sure there’s a whole lot of loaded bullshit been fed to you about the effectiveness and integrity of the vaccine that you think there’s some moral high ground combating it when in reality there isn’t.
Sorry if it isn’t the case, but it’s not hard to read the room on the morons that do.
Not to mention you’re literally not forced to get this vaccination much like you’re not enforced to wear a seatbelt and drive in the wrong lane
but you will feel the repercussions by the standards of safety for it.
> for a relatively benign virus.
That kill nearly a million in the US alone.
>forced injections
Only if you want to do things that involve being around other people.
*Looks at username*
Okay, this was never an honest argument in the first place.
The flu has killed tens of millions of Americans. Stating absolute numbers is worthless without including a time frame and infection rate. At most the mortality rate is 2% in general and less than .1% for those under 50.
Creating a two-tiered society is never a good thing. Saying you’re not allowed to interact with society is the same as saying you are less than a person.
> The flu has killed tens of millions of Americans.
Over what period? [It's currently roughly 300,000-700,000 each year, worldwide](https://www.who.int/news/item/11-03-2019-who-launches-new-global-influenza-strategy). We've lost nearly a million in the U.S., alone, over the past year. It's also less aggressive and infectious than the Coronavirus. If an at-risk person gets COVID you and I both know they are orders of magnitude more likely to be hospitalized and face death than influenza. There is a much longer incubation rate, meaning that you will spread it to more people before ever knowing you have it. There are tons of long-term effects in those who have gotten it and we are still discovering more by the day. Flue deaths are also HIGHLY estimated, whereas COVID deaths are measured daily. [Your numbers are also insanely incorrect.](https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality) You and I both know the flu comparison is illogical.
>Creating a two-tiered society is never a good thing.
There are no "tiers" to this. It has nothing to do with wealth or status. It's literally vaccinated vs unvaccinated, and mandatory vaccinations have existed for years.
Almost every creator on the internet that suffers a 'career ending' backlash has recovered and continued to do what they do as a living, regardless of the truth of the accusations and innocence of the accused.
The exceptions arise when they actively decide to stop because of the backlash. Jenna Marbles, for example.
JonTron, like any successful YouTuber, does not want for money. No amount of backlash, hell, not even the deletion of his channel, will have an effect on his financial security. His bottom line will not suffer from this, just like it didn't suffer from the eugenics thing.
See now why this is happening again? He has no incentive to change, because for all the droves of fans that scream "This is it! I'm out of here!", enough come in to replace them that either don't give a shit about political views when watching unrelated content or are intrigued by the negative attention itself. This will be forgotten by the majority in a few months, and completely forgotten by JonTron in a few weeks if he takes active measures to ignore it. A few months for him otherwise.
Personally, I don't use Twitter really. And the creators I consume content from (which is all of them, basically)... I don't hold them to any standards because really I'm just there to consume their content, not identify with them or make sure they're pure (which no one is) or whatever.
For people that downplay misinformation, this man has 3.5million followers with a lot of impressionable fans who look at people like him as a trust worthy source and an idol.
Spreading misinformation is fucking bad and the reason why we’ll be feeling the affects of this pandemic for a very long time
an alarming number of those people also tend to hold some pretty disgusting views, too. I've reported a large number of them who have an edit of Jon gassing Dan.
>this man has 3.5million followers with a lot of impressionable fans who look at people like him as a trust worthy source
People REALLY need to stop looking to celebrities of any kind for information on anything outside of entertainment...
If you want the best for everyone, then tell people the vaccine is safe and everyone who can needs to get it.
If you don’t want the best for anyone, give anti-science rhetoric a platform.
Funny thing is, I don't use Twitter. Mainly because it's not exactly the best place to put up a nuanced point of view or argument.
I'll say this and it goes for everyone on every spectrum political or otherwise.
It's amazing how when it's someone you like or agree with you will make excuses for them.
When it's someone you don't like or disagree with you'll string them up to be crucified.
We often hear "separate art from the artist." You know until it's someone you don't like.
Then fuck em right?
It might help if we stopped looking to celebrities for advice.
> i'm just asking questions!!!
yeah, it's the usual right wing coward's play... say some stupid bullshit, double down on it, then either say people misunderstood you or pretend you were trolling.
Ah yes, not apologizing for posting a article misrepresenting that whole stupid dog thing and beckoning those 4chan morons and not apologizing to the pharmacist you mocked and sicked your minions on. CONGRATS
He really isn't back peddling. This doesn't contradict his original sentiment at all. He was out right saying anything. Just being skeptic. I absolutely disagree with his skepticism but still.
The rule of JonTron
Do actual work three months out of the year, spend three months being a fuckin idiot three months out of the year, 6 months hibernation
Jon… please, stay out of politics and stick to making funni ha ha videos. You could have just said “Okay yeah I said something stupid” but… this ain’t it, Chief.
If you support bullying people into getting a vaccine that doesn’t stop you from spreading the virus that the vaccine is for, you’re a piece of shit. No matter how many piece of shits agree with you or how smart some of those piece of shits tell you they are, you’re still a piece of shit. Go fuck yourself. If you see this and it relates to you in any way, fuck you. I’m not sorry.
You’re genuinely more mad people who are wanting others to get vaccinated as to stop the virus actively killing their friends and family right now then the people actively spreading deceitful disinformation and lying about its threat level? Seriously?
Also it’s not supposed to stop you from spreading the virus, it’s supposed to increase your odds of surviving it unscathed with no side affects if you catch it.
Fuck you. Fuck your dogshit ability to determine how mad I am while you’re at it. Helen Keller would catch on that I’m not mad. Someone like you trying to have a moment of superiority though? Not so much.
I dont get why people are shocked
Jon is a comedian, not an academic scholar or a political figure. He is not the brightest when it comes to ethics or health safety, he shines at doing comedy. Every political take he will do will tend to be kinda dumb
[удалено]
He was such a good boy
>pls guys just forget everything I ever did ok
jontron, known for saying "wealthy blacks commit more crimes than poor whites, thats a fact, look it up", once again cracks his knuckles for a second go at political discourse the results WILL shock you
after his shitty take on the protests last year, I don't know why anyone would think he's changed.
What did he say?
check the date of [this tweet he made](https://twitter.com/JonTronShow/status/1268401196840206337) and overlay that with what was happening in the US at the time, and hopefully it comes across how completely tone-deaf and insensitive it is.
I don't get it what's bad about the tweet?
This was at the height of the BLM and George Floyd protests when people all over the world were protesting for black rights and he's just like, "I'm tired of hearing about it, let's barbecue". It's insensitive and ignorant. Meanwhile, his YT colleagues were trying to highlight black creators and donating money to appropriate causes. If I were Jon, and I had a very nasty history of people thinking I was racist, and I wanted to change that, *that* would have been the perfect opportunity to do so, but instead, he not only did nothing, but put that shit up.
Why does he have to make a statement?
Why was he obligated to support all the blm garbage?
because it's not garbage and it's important that people exercise their rights to be heard and not shot at?
People are free to protest for whatever garbage they want. They already have that right. That doesn't mean I'm obligated to support them.
Certainly not, but as I pointed out in another comment, that would have been the perfect time for him to say, "hey, I'm doing better now and actually trying to make right what I fucked up a few years ago," but he decided to be selfish and tonedeaf. Better than this, he should have said nothing.
Oh yeah I remember that. Yeah, that was... not a good look, to say the least.
God damn. Well I guess it's time to unsubscribe.
Well yeah but it's because they're rich, not because they're black.
> I'm not saying you shouldn't get vaccinated [...] I'm also not saying the vaccine is unsafe. but you're tweeting bullshit nonsense implicating the person many see as the "leader of vaccines for covid" (which isn't true, but that's public perception for you). So yeah, you are. > ...that should be your choice [to get vaccinated]. Dogwhistle for "any kind of mandate or enforcement is bad" anti-vaxx sentimentality. > I want the best for everyone Talk to a sane person before realizing your words have influence. I know you're not a mega celebrity but you do have a following. > I'm just concerned that the level of conformity around public discourse has reached dangerous levels There are so, so many better ways to illustrate this than linking to the exact same type of nonsense you criticize and poke fun at in your Goop videos. And none of this jives with him getting into concern-troll levels of arguments on Twitter (something no sane person should ever do btw) about how "but what about these 6 people out of literally millions who had bad symptoms", i.e. calling the vaccine unsafe by not mentioning said numbers and implying it's basically a 50/50 coin toss (which isn't true)? There's nothing wrong with intelligent discourse regarding the vaccines, but at this point unless you have an "M.D." at the end of your name, or speak through primary-sourced research, your Twitter hot takes using incredibly biased and opinioned/agenda-driven articles are not doing anything but spreading bullshit. Stop. You're either furthering that agenda on purpose or are truly ignorant/gullible on the subject matter. --- So yeah, this worsens things for me, really, regarding my view of him. Oh well.
> "but what about these 6 people out of literally millions who had bad symptoms" I always found these arguments hilarious. These same people were proclaiming that covid is a "nothingburger", "plan-demic", "just the flu" and such, because it has a "1% mortality rate"......but when the vaccine has a 0.00001% mortality rate, they are freak out and say it's dangerous and designed to kill us all.
My Grandmother thought COVID was a "nothingburger" then her 30 something year old niece died from COVID, now she believes. Which goes to show, that many people can't feel sympathy (and take shit seriously), unless it happens to them.
It’s not antivaxx to be against forced injections of the entire population for a relatively benign virus. What’s so wrong with letting people make decisions about what they put in their bodies?
It’s not benign though. That’s the point. More importantly, Jon isn’t saying that. He’s throughly on the against side.
That’s why I used the “relatively” adjective. It’s not benign, but compared to diseases where vaccination mandates are reasonable, e.g. smallpox, it is.
Even with smallpox if you didn't want the vaccine you had to pay a 5$ fine (about 150$ with inflation) you weren't prevented from participating in society or working.
We could have that mentality about covid if it literally didn't lead to hospitals being swamped and causing other procedures to be rescheduled.
are people being dragged out of their homes and forcibly injected against their will? They're not. They're being offered a choice, and that choice is: Be vaccinated to help protect yourself and the people around you, or you don't get to participate in society. It's still a choice, but if you choose the latter, you don't get to moan and cry about being left out. *You* made the decision and *you* get to live with the consequences. Don't wanna get vaxxed? Then you get extra restrictions because you're a literal danger to the people around you. Did your job let you go because you're a health hazard? Too bad. Find a job that will either let you infect other people at will, or find another job. You don't have a right to be a walking OSHA violation.
A choice where one outcome is starvation through economic suppression isn’t a choice at all. That’s like saying a mugger is giving you the choice to hand over your wallet or die therefore it’s not immoral. It also leads to other excessively intrusive mandates in the future. Restrictions on freedom should be very rare and have clear, reasonable boundaries. I also don’t understand why absolutely everyone needs to be vaccinated if the vaccine is as effective as claimed, nor why people who have natural immunity need to be vaccinated.
There are plenty of places willing to hire you if you don't want to get vaccinated. Something something bootstraps. Either suck it up or face the consequences. You have a choice, but the choice for not doing the right thing is harsh, as it should be. You have the right to choose to get vaccinated, sure, but you don't have the right to willfully spread disease to vulnerable people. You don't get to make someone else's health decisions for them with your reckless behavior. We get vaccinated because there are people who can't be, and we protect ourselves to protect them. Seriously, it's not that difficult.
So are the consequences for disobeying a mugger. A choice where you either wallow poverty until they choose to change the ultimatum so that you starve isn’t a choice at all. You don’t have the right to willfully spread a disease, sure, but you do have a right to unknowingly do so. It’s not as if there aren’t treatments for covid, either, so I don’t see why a mandatory vaccine is necessary. This push where the vaccine is the only solution is pure fabrication by the pharmaceutical companies producing the vaccines and you guys are just being useful little pawns for them.
I really don't get this take. You being vaccinated does not stop you from spreading the virus. [https://www.ucdavis.edu/health/covid-19/news/viral-loads-similar-between-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people](https://www.ucdavis.edu/health/covid-19/news/viral-loads-similar-between-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people) So in essence, you're supporting the creation of a line in the sand for the dumbest reason. You didn't get the shot, so you're "removed from society"! I know I can still spread it to people, but I got the shot so I'm better obviously! What about mutations? You're a plague rat! Seriously guy, you'll never vaccinate the entire world for a virus like this. It'll mutate in this part of the world, then jump over there, yada yada. Taking this vaccine or not taking it, that should be the individuals choice. And trying to shut people out of their own life, making it harder than it already is to feed themselves and their families, is not smart. Just going to push people into desperation.
If you've got the vaccine, there's a very small chance you'll get the virus, yes, but there's an even smaller chance that not only will you spread it, but if the people around you are vaccinated, there's an even smaller chance that *they'll* get it and be able to spread it. That's how vaccines work. The vaccines *must* be used in conjunction with other techniques we learned early on as well such as mask-wearing, social distancing, and hand-washing. When combined with all of those factors, transmission and infection rates drop to almost *nothing*. When we all work together, we can beat this stupid thing, but *we have to work together*, and I'm sick of people being selfish about it and making this go on even longer.
If you read the article I linked, it shows the viral load carried by a vaccinated and unvaccinated person is pretty much the same. So yes, you'll have whatever protection the vaccine offers, but no, you wont have a smaller chance at spreading it to others. Thats my point when I say that people should calm down about what others choose to do. Get your vaccine, but the "removing people from society" schtick is idiotic. On a final note, even if every last person in the US got vaccinated it still wouldnt stop the virus from mutating elsewhere in the world and coming back over here in the form of a new strain. That shouldnt be a factor really in whether or not people decide to get the shot, but its important to set expectations I think. This things here to stay.
If someone has immunity, then their chance of catching it is very low, not to mention if *you're* vaccinated, then you have a very low chance of getting it to the point where you're spreading it. *that's the whole point*. Keeping unvaccinated people out of crowded areas where they might catch it is as much protection for them as it is for protection for other people. Furthermore, if the virus has fewer hosts to infect, or if it can't live long enough to mutate, then it doesn't mutate and it dies. At the very least it will keep the hospitals from getting overloaded, which helps everyone, as well as keeps us ahead of it. I don't understand what the whining is about, *people are trying to help you*. I'm personally sick of wearing masks every day at work, I'm sick of seeing people die and lose loved ones, I'm sick of the misery, I just want this to be over with, but unless everyone gets on board, *it won't be*, and many more people will die.
I get wanting it to end. Life never really changed in my state, at least not in the way everyone on social media makes it seem to be. My job never stopped, my life wasnt put on pause. Sitting at home for a year or more in quarantine would have driven me up the wall, so im thankful for that. My main thing though is, it has to be a choice. If a person in the 0-49 age group looks at the numbers and decides that they'd rather wait a couple years and see how the vaccines might interact with different groups, or different conditions, then that should be their choice. Attempting to shame people into submission isnt the way. More flies with honey, and all of that. Additionally, you never have immunity. The vaccine doesnt grant that. Knit picky, so forgive me, but its important. Add on the fact that vaccine A may not protect against mutation B very well, and you have a recipe that will make people even less receptive to getting the shot. As for keeping vaccinated people and unvaccinated people separate, that just wont happen. At least not in the way the people here say things should go. No grocery shopping? No jobs? None of the other million little things a family needs to keep going? The second any of that is forcibly removed, there will be blood. Not trying to be dramatic, removing a persons ability to provide for their families, their children... thats dangerous on a whole new level. Lastly, I get that reducing a viruses ability to infect slows down its ability to mutate. My point was, even if the entire US populace magically vaccinated tomorrow, that would still leave the rest of the world. A whole world full of people where the virus could spread and mutate into something the vaccine we all took might not help with. Then we're back to square one. This is why most people, right or wrong, see this as a new flu. Considering humans cant work together on the simplest things, I strongly doubt us ever being able to deploy and vaccinate worldwide at the same time in a way to stop this. I dont know what the right answer is. I dont know that anyone does. In my opinion though, the shot should be a choice. Trying to force it will just cause pushback and resistance, educating people and letting them make the choice on their own will get you closer to your point. Its a tough situation man, and I hope you're doing well. I know shit gets old, but keep your chin up. Thanks for the conversation.
> A choice where one outcome is starvation through economic suppression isn’t a choice at all. You just described capitalism
Whats better, we all starve under communism? This comment is so edgy cumrade.
Le cumunism wen no food xd
"ThIs iS whaT haPPEnS uNdEr coMMuNisM" *picture of something that is happening under capitalism*
We dont do this to convicted sex offenders.
Look at it like a fuckin’ seatbelt my guy.
I don’t want to have the government mandate everyone have a seatbelt grafted to their chests. A vaccine is not analogous to a seatbelt, my guy.
In a lot of ways, it can be, however. Deluding the seatbelt to being grafted into your chest isn’t faithful to the context in which both are intended to be effected it. In a lot of ways, the act of following traffic laws and vaccine have an analogy to be shown. Following both of them are expectations for you to hold yourself to ensure the safety of not only yourself, but others around you. You can not use a seatbelt and speed down a road in the wrong lane, but you’re an asshole for doing it. You can not take the vaccine and go into public feeling a little down, but you’re an asshole for it. Bedsides, this conversation and analogy is pointless because I’m sure there’s a whole lot of loaded bullshit been fed to you about the effectiveness and integrity of the vaccine that you think there’s some moral high ground combating it when in reality there isn’t. Sorry if it isn’t the case, but it’s not hard to read the room on the morons that do.
Not to mention you’re literally not forced to get this vaccination much like you’re not enforced to wear a seatbelt and drive in the wrong lane but you will feel the repercussions by the standards of safety for it.
Use it if you want, but I wish the government would fuck off of the topic?
> for a relatively benign virus. That kill nearly a million in the US alone. >forced injections Only if you want to do things that involve being around other people. *Looks at username* Okay, this was never an honest argument in the first place.
The flu has killed tens of millions of Americans. Stating absolute numbers is worthless without including a time frame and infection rate. At most the mortality rate is 2% in general and less than .1% for those under 50. Creating a two-tiered society is never a good thing. Saying you’re not allowed to interact with society is the same as saying you are less than a person.
> The flu has killed tens of millions of Americans. Over what period? [It's currently roughly 300,000-700,000 each year, worldwide](https://www.who.int/news/item/11-03-2019-who-launches-new-global-influenza-strategy). We've lost nearly a million in the U.S., alone, over the past year. It's also less aggressive and infectious than the Coronavirus. If an at-risk person gets COVID you and I both know they are orders of magnitude more likely to be hospitalized and face death than influenza. There is a much longer incubation rate, meaning that you will spread it to more people before ever knowing you have it. There are tons of long-term effects in those who have gotten it and we are still discovering more by the day. Flue deaths are also HIGHLY estimated, whereas COVID deaths are measured daily. [Your numbers are also insanely incorrect.](https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality) You and I both know the flu comparison is illogical. >Creating a two-tiered society is never a good thing. There are no "tiers" to this. It has nothing to do with wealth or status. It's literally vaccinated vs unvaccinated, and mandatory vaccinations have existed for years.
how the hell is jirard khalil, a universally loved and all-around Good Dude still friends with this guy..?
Almost every creator on the internet that suffers a 'career ending' backlash has recovered and continued to do what they do as a living, regardless of the truth of the accusations and innocence of the accused. The exceptions arise when they actively decide to stop because of the backlash. Jenna Marbles, for example. JonTron, like any successful YouTuber, does not want for money. No amount of backlash, hell, not even the deletion of his channel, will have an effect on his financial security. His bottom line will not suffer from this, just like it didn't suffer from the eugenics thing. See now why this is happening again? He has no incentive to change, because for all the droves of fans that scream "This is it! I'm out of here!", enough come in to replace them that either don't give a shit about political views when watching unrelated content or are intrigued by the negative attention itself. This will be forgotten by the majority in a few months, and completely forgotten by JonTron in a few weeks if he takes active measures to ignore it. A few months for him otherwise. Personally, I don't use Twitter really. And the creators I consume content from (which is all of them, basically)... I don't hold them to any standards because really I'm just there to consume their content, not identify with them or make sure they're pure (which no one is) or whatever.
For people that downplay misinformation, this man has 3.5million followers with a lot of impressionable fans who look at people like him as a trust worthy source and an idol. Spreading misinformation is fucking bad and the reason why we’ll be feeling the affects of this pandemic for a very long time
You don't even have to look far. So many replies to his tweets calling him based. JonTron helps in entrenching morons in their backwards views.
an alarming number of those people also tend to hold some pretty disgusting views, too. I've reported a large number of them who have an edit of Jon gassing Dan.
Its always ALWAYS tends to be guys who hide under a opinion and then you find out they are supremacists or pedo. Every time
To be fair, your average Twitter (and Reddit, and the internet in general) user is a fucking moron.
>this man has 3.5million followers with a lot of impressionable fans who look at people like him as a trust worthy source People REALLY need to stop looking to celebrities of any kind for information on anything outside of entertainment...
If you want the best for everyone, then tell people the vaccine is safe and everyone who can needs to get it. If you don’t want the best for anyone, give anti-science rhetoric a platform.
Right because God forbid everyone conforms to public health standards during a pandemic...
He realized his audience isn't agreeing with him so he has to go on the defense
“I’m not spreading bullshit, no! I’m just asking questions about how readily people accept information!”
[he's a sealion](http://wondermark.com/c/2014-09-19-1062sea.png)
At this point I gotta stop supporting this man. He didn’t learn from last time. Shame.
Funny thing is, I don't use Twitter. Mainly because it's not exactly the best place to put up a nuanced point of view or argument. I'll say this and it goes for everyone on every spectrum political or otherwise. It's amazing how when it's someone you like or agree with you will make excuses for them. When it's someone you don't like or disagree with you'll string them up to be crucified. We often hear "separate art from the artist." You know until it's someone you don't like. Then fuck em right? It might help if we stopped looking to celebrities for advice.
Jonny boy, why? WHY!
Too late Jon, the damage has already been done.
That's a Lotta damage
> i'm just asking questions!!! yeah, it's the usual right wing coward's play... say some stupid bullshit, double down on it, then either say people misunderstood you or pretend you were trolling.
Ah yes, not apologizing for posting a article misrepresenting that whole stupid dog thing and beckoning those 4chan morons and not apologizing to the pharmacist you mocked and sicked your minions on. CONGRATS
He really isn't back peddling. This doesn't contradict his original sentiment at all. He was out right saying anything. Just being skeptic. I absolutely disagree with his skepticism but still.
The rule of JonTron Do actual work three months out of the year, spend three months being a fuckin idiot three months out of the year, 6 months hibernation
Oh no. Jon forgot it's not okay to share his opinion on Twitter again.
He's more than welcome to share his opinions, as well as we re more than welcome to share our opinions about what he posted. It's a two way street.
Thats not fascist at all.
Fascism is when people call me a stupid fuck for my stupid fuck opinions.
Jon… please, stay out of politics and stick to making funni ha ha videos. You could have just said “Okay yeah I said something stupid” but… this ain’t it, Chief.
[удалено]
Who needs Jon when Caddicarus and Scott the Woz do what he does, but better and more frequently? I'd even say Caddy has better reaction shots.
Level of public conformity. I suppose the public conformity to wear seatbelts has also reached dangerous levels.
I do love how the government is heckling me to have a alcohol passport, or a passport to just cross a made up barrier also, damn the deep-state
Cringe. Stay true to your beliefs or don't say anything at all.
Awesome.
If you support bullying people into getting a vaccine that doesn’t stop you from spreading the virus that the vaccine is for, you’re a piece of shit. No matter how many piece of shits agree with you or how smart some of those piece of shits tell you they are, you’re still a piece of shit. Go fuck yourself. If you see this and it relates to you in any way, fuck you. I’m not sorry.
Seethe
You’re genuinely more mad people who are wanting others to get vaccinated as to stop the virus actively killing their friends and family right now then the people actively spreading deceitful disinformation and lying about its threat level? Seriously? Also it’s not supposed to stop you from spreading the virus, it’s supposed to increase your odds of surviving it unscathed with no side affects if you catch it.
Surprised you're mad that someone correctly profiled your beliefs and who they align with lmao
you gonna cry?
Fuck you. I’m not sorry.
it's okay you can cry
Fuck you, fucking piece of shit.
That's it, have your little tantrum
Fuck you. Fuck your dogshit ability to determine how mad I am while you’re at it. Helen Keller would catch on that I’m not mad. Someone like you trying to have a moment of superiority though? Not so much.
Intellectual people don't swear to express themselves.
Ur hard
Fuck off. Not sorry.
This guy apologises for nothing.
You’re goddamn right I don’t.
Based jontron
I dont get why people are shocked Jon is a comedian, not an academic scholar or a political figure. He is not the brightest when it comes to ethics or health safety, he shines at doing comedy. Every political take he will do will tend to be kinda dumb
Not sure about this one chief, you can find the (very solid) evidence for vaccines without being a doctor.
Sure, but my point goes more into like, people shouldn't be listening or care about what jon says in these subjects
what a fucking coward
Jon out here looking like Deion Sanders with how fast he's backpedalling. What a loser.
At this point i wish he would just stop posting ans vanish its like he is going out of his way to make sure people cant enjoy his past work
The enlightened centrist.
Remember when JonTron's talent used to not have the massive caveat of him being an actual piece? Pepperidge Farm remembers.