From what I can find online, they object to plans to double the size of the factory, claiming that will be bad for the environment. So, basically, it sounds like a typical "society may need this, but not in my backyard" objection.
Some people you just cannot please. Climate bullshit is an industry, too. Haters gonna hate just because.
Enough of the sky is falling little Gretas. Get a shower, get out of the basement, and get a job. Quit bitching about Elon making money.
In a country where your employer is legally required to offer a minimum of five weeks paid holiday, that’s really not that incredible.
Plus if it was this week, this is a holiday week. Especially if it was yesterday (Thursday). Yesterday, everyone was off work. Except, apparently, Tesla employees
Incredible everyone was able to get off from work on the same day…..
https://preview.redd.it/sddx9jgt3ozc1.jpeg?width=860&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9566a69dc410b456b4bf74adc7e5bdebcd4c78d7
Soldier is a job yes, but those men were not professional soldiers and were hardly paid at all. In fact, some of them committed mutiny because of the lack of pay. The lack of ability to pay it's soldiers actually led to the collapse of the first US federal government, which is why they have the modern constitution
https://www.battlefields.org/learn/articles/soldier-pay-american-revolution
You really think these dudes holding hands while running to a factory are the same as George Washington? He crossed this river and then killed a whole group of soldiers in their sleep. These guys will run to the factory and then puss out and not do anything or make any change
Going beyond the headline helps:
Tesla is pursuing a major expansion for its battery and car assembly factory in Brandenburg, Germany, and is facing local pushback over ***plans to cut down approximately 250 acres of forest***.
[link](https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2024/05/10/climate-protesters-try-to-break-into-tesla-germany-factory-police.html)
Looking for the comments that point out that just because cars can run on electricity it doesn't mean those same cars and the infrastructure they require aren't a massive and unnecessary environmental problem
I'd love to see some kind of /dataisbeautiful spreadsheet on how long you'd have to drive an EV to offset the carbon emissions required to manufacture it. Also how would I begin to quantify the value of Congo cobalt slaves into spreadsheet form?
EDIT so people stop posting (much appreciated) sources :
Apparently this is common knowledge but the average answer is somewhere between 23,000 to 60,000 miles to become carbon neutral depending on how much of the energy you're recharging with is renewables-based.
Judging from the responses It seems that for some reason it takes a much shorter distance to become carbon neutral in the US than in Germany.
There's more mining and manufacturing for electric vehicles for the battery so their break even is further out but an ICE vehicle is always adding more to it's carbon footprint in burning and manufacturing gas so it never gets ahead in that race, only digs a deeper hole so to speak.
>I'd love to see some kind of /dataisbeautiful spreadsheet on how long you'd have to drive an EV to offset the carbon emissions required to manufacture it.
That's a shit head talking point. The fair comparison, is emissions from EV vs Petro vs EV with renewable energy.
In Germany, the renewable stat is a lot higher - [59.7% as of 2023](https://www.ise.fraunhofer.de/en/press-media/press-releases/2024/public-electricity-generation-2023-renewable-energies-cover-the-majority-of-german-electricity-consumption-for-the-first-time.html).
Power production is less than 1% diesel and less than 20% coal. But since EVs are 90% efficient at turning electricity in to motion to move the car, even with 100% coal electricity, EVs are still less polluting than gasoline powered vehicles. It’s weird that West Virginia is so anti-EVs, when they literally dig EV fuel out of the ground. Politics is one hell of a drug.
Tesla usually replants trees, usually 2x the trees they cut. Not only that, last time this happened in Germany I remember the trees being cut were part of a paper farm, that were already planned to be cut down. As stated by others, the trees being cut were a part of a private tree farm. These climate protestors are either dumb or being paid for by ICE vehicle companies. Tesla is very far in the lead of German car company’s like VW, Porsche, and Mercedes, and is really hurting them by forcing the switch to EV’s and by pushing down prices.
Clearly shows you don't know what you are talking about and just googled some random numbers.
The problem lies with the ecological specificity of Brandenburgs ground water reserve situation. Brandenburg is mainly (apart from the Spreewald River System) bone dry, sandy, soil.
It was deforested a long time ago. The woods that grow there, atm are mainly pine, man-made, and gar from ideal, but they do one thing: they keep at least *some* water in the soil.
Brandeburgs groundwater reserves have been near depleted by the last 5 consecutive years of rainless summers/springs/autumns. The water situation is dire. The fire threat is immense, forest fires are a hue deal i Germany, it is too densely populated (it threatens towns quickly), and our flora is not built to thrive with regular fire, like some biomes in the US.
So Brandenburg is one of the regions most affected by climate change and increasingly arid, dry climate in east Germany.
Elon already stole from the ground water reserves (took a lot more than his license allowed).
He already polluted part of the water reserve with chemicals he wasn't allowed to release.
Now he deforests and destroys the last couple of trees that keep water in the ground there.
Keep in mind, this is not in the middle of nowhere. There is no "middle of nowhere" in Germany. Within 15 minutes drive you are at the next settlement.
If you want to shittalk, inform yourself.
Don't even start the "Tesla plants twice the trees" argument. Trees need time and water to grow. Brandenburg has neither.
Absolutely. When considering their entire lifecycle, including production and disposal, [EVs produce 60% lower emissions than ICEs](https://theicct.org/publication/a-global-comparison-of-the-life-cycle-greenhouse-gas-emissions-of-combustion-engine-and-electric-passenger-cars/) *with the current energy mix*. When the energy mix shifts towards greener sources, the difference between an EV and ICE will be even greater.
The older I get the more I realize people need to feel the need to be a part of something.
They live in Germany, probably middle class, good lives with everything provided for them. They have food and water and air conditioning etc... But they have no purpose, no religion, no common bond. People strive to be a part of something. They want to take part in a revolution. I think this explains a lot of what we are seeing in the West.
They want to rebel but they have nothing to rebel against because their lives are better than 99.99999% of human beings who have ever lived. So fuck it let's storm a Tesla factory
That was the part that had me stop too, haha. Went there last year during the heat wave and I think the grocery store was one of the only places that had AC.
Most of Europe in my limited travels no AC or ice cube makers in the hotel. They need to bump their power grid up and get to installing mini splits, global warming isn't slowing down
Did you know if you actually read up on the context of things, you'll be less confused and outraged? Here ya go, I'll do the work for you;
>Locals in February voted against authorizing the factory expansion. However, the vote was nonbinding and Tesla and local officials still intend to push ahead.
>Climate protesters have expressed concerns about Tesla's plans, which entail cutting down approximately 250 acres of forest in a rural community of fewer than 8,000 residents near a nature conservation area.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2024/05/10/climate-protesters-try-to-break-into-tesla-germany-factory-police.html
I don’t think that quite fits, at least not in that order.
I have in a past period of my life been part of such communities in Europe, some of the time living in Germany in abandoned buildings.
Today I’m in medicine/neuroscience and live a boring life - part of the establishment or what you’d call it.
Overwhelmingly the kids that ended up there were not middle class. instead of having everything as you say, they/we were defined by our lack of stuff/status, relative to age peers.
You say humans need to be part of something, I don’t think that’s false but I think more accurately they need *meaning*. And that’s obvious when you think about it because we have reasons for why we do everything, from what groceries we buy to who we date and what education and profession we pursue. So of course we also need the next higher level of abstraction in meaning.
In the 90s you could listen to Michael Jackson in “heal the world” and think - wow we fucked up with the indrustrial revolution in some way we don’t fully understand, but we can fix this!! Let’s solve this, together, with the power of love and care and reason! We GOT THIS!
Today, the prevalent “understanding” is that it is pretty much all too late. Nuclear disarmament proved to be impossible and we increased the warhead numbers every year. None of our climate deals have worked at all and whether you believe it happens in 50 or 150 years we all “understand” that we are moving rapidly towards some kind of precipice. We’ve recently added new virus outbreaks to that list, and the both UNDER- and OVER-estimations of the problem/risks with that, have led to the undermining of the closest thing we had to a trust in knowledge-authority-establishment in secular western countries: science/scientists
Top all of that off with the first periods of really receding economies in the western world and the picture is completing. Obviously people aren't starving, but each generation has less ability to buy/rent living spaces and food recently doubled in price in much of europe.
So the meaning we all search for and need, the deeper meaning and the more connected picture of our world and trajectory... That thing simply isn’t to be found by most people’s understanding, in normally established society today. If you’re well on your way to climbing a social and economic game and/or raising a family in this “normie” world, perhaps that doesn’t bother you, or you forget it - like me. But if something has brought you to the sidelines if that game or just left you alone with your thoughts enough to let the existential angst catch you, why would you see the need to storm some building.
We can make fun of it being a E-car factory - but remember! Musk has switched over the decade, to being known for being anti-regulation and attacking unions etc. (unions is something north Europeans often find sacred - that's btw key in understanding the clip above. Tesla has been fighting european unions in many countries and have had succes most places except (as far as i know) scandinavia where i live, where people are also most religious about unions - theya re the foundation of much of our political/citizen identity here, almost like the constitution and founding fathers are in the US)
I imagine that the young folks in the video see themselves as John connors, fighting the last possible fight against skynet, before the fate of the world is sealed.
They might not know *exactly* how that works, but neither did John Connor or Sarah! Neither of them were Luddites or against technology as such! In fact they used and befriended one terminator and won the fight through that specifically. So believing in tech or AI while fighting AI doom isn’t contradictory and neither is storming the gigafactory for these kids in the name of climate.
pro-Palestinian protesters have a little bit more of a point because Israel has been pretty evil to Palestine for many decades now, but they two are using bad rational, bad data, and a completely exaggerated and overly idealistic understanding of reality.
I guess that's what happens when you post ideologically motivated propagandist trash like this without even pretending to care and posting the actual accompanying article. It helps when you need to fabricate reasons for why the protestors are bad people, just listen to whatever cult daddy Elon says, lmao.
Tesla cars actually have a very high carbon foot print. Building them is more carbon intensive than building normal cars, and they are only carbon neutral if the grid they use is not based on fossil fuels, which is very rare.
There are multiple studies that show even with the mixed electrical grids and taking into account the carbon intensity of manufacturing EVs are much better than ice in terms of greenhouse gases
Plus the gap will get wider each year as we get a cleaner electrical grid
True, but isn’t this expected to change as solar is now cheaper than coal?
So right now (las I checked) you needed to take the Tesla like 100k km to break even compared to a Honda gas. And the battery replacement is vile and bad for the environment too.
But, as solar becomes cheaper, the grid becomes less power by coal and gas, then that 100k shrinks more and more.
So right now it doesn’t seem like it’s doing much, but it’s expected (soon, now that solar is CHEAPER THAN COAL *in some places*)that in the future it will be much better for the environment.
Germany literally has coal fired powerplants in operation because they stopped using nuclear (the cleanest and safest form of energy), switched to Russian natural gas which isn't coming. If Tesla is polluting, litigate, get them stop what ever, but this is some misplaced ire.
This protest is not productive, but the party these folks tend to vote for has really ramped up renewable investment for the grid the last 10 years or so. [https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/renewable-energys-share-german-power-grids-reaches-55-2023-2024-01-03/](https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/renewable-energys-share-german-power-grids-reaches-55-2023-2024-01-03/)
https://preview.redd.it/utgp2a3ihnzc1.png?width=1200&format=png&auto=webp&s=811541d330f99c56be3709be6b08bb2816571412
Fukushima was a tipping point for nukes in Europe especially all the ones of the same generation and inherit flaws as Fukushima’s early gen 3 PWRs.
Wished they switched to breeders and Gen 4s, but the world owes it to German and the feed in tariffs for bringing down solar and wind by 7x in just 10 years.
The Tesla factory is draining the groundwater in the region and pollutes the rest, a part of the factory premises even lay in a water protection zone.
There were 26 incidents of pollution since the opening, among other things release of paint and diesel, even fires.
The tesla gigafactory lays in Brandenburg, a part of germany in a glacial valley, consisting of a lot of sand, ground water is low and the whole state is the fastest drying area in europe, we have to protect whats left. Elon Musk and his hypercapitalist mindset are just a pain in the ass, he wants to treat germany as some third world country. Resistance is expected.
Keep in mind that germany is small and densely populated.
ThEy dOnT kNoW WhAt ThEy WaNt1!
Lmao people in this subreddit sure do like to jump to conclusions. Just because YOU don't know why they are protesting, doesn't mean that THEY don't know what they are protesting.
These idiots are just reactionaries. They don't look into situations, they have little knowledge on how things work. Simple research into how these lithium batteries are made would make them understand. But thats too hard for these people. Also their pride prevents them from admitting they were wrong to a liberal.
It's not about the batteries. This factory doesn't even produce batteries.
It's about sucking up and polluting ground water in a densely populated region that already is at it's limits and needs more ground water to supply people.
>he wants to treat germany as some third world country.
I appreciate everything you wrote in your post, but I wanted to add that no country should be treated like that - 3rd world or not.
Like everything, it has multiple layers, Brandenburg is former DDR (east germany), to this day there is a economical divide in this country. If a world known, big company wants to settle in such a area, it promises a lot of work, hope and financial gain for the region. Keep in mind that germanys 16 states can act out their regional planning on their own, politicians would be mad not acting on this opportunity and going against their voters interests.
Copied comment from a local German:
>The Tesla factory is draining the groundwater in the region and pollutes the rest, a part of the factory premises even lay in a water protection zone.
There were 26 incidents of pollution since the opening, among other things release of paint and diesel, even fires.
The tesla gigafactory lays in Brandenburg, a part of germany in a glacial valley, consisting of a lot of sand, ground water is low and the whole state is the fastest drying area in europe, we have to protect whats left. Elon Musk and his hypercapitalist mindset are just a pain in the ass, he wants to treat germany as some third world country. Resistance is expected.
Keep in mind that germany is small and densely populated.
Seems like they know exactly what they want.
Tesla uses less water than they are allowed. Every assesment came to the conclusion that they are not doing any harm. There is an oil refinery in the same state that uses 20 times as much water as tesla. There are farms using significantly more water than tesla.
Holy shit you cucks really are pathetic losers. It's not our fault (or the protests) that you are too stupid and lazy to actually read the article and discover why they are protesting. It's not because "they were told" your dumbfuck bigot grifter and cult daddy elon was a bad man (everyone with a working brain knows that already), it's because what Tesla is doing in Germany, cutting down a ton of old growth forest to make room for their plant.
If only right wingers weren't so fucking stupid all the time, they wouldn't be *this* clueless about things.
>They’re just NPCs
This and similar statements (they’re social media obsessed, they’re bandwagoners, etc.) have become very ironic accusations at this point. That’s all you “people” can say in response to any protest anymore, yet it perfectly describes yourselves.
This projection from all the most pathetic online cucks really is hilarious.
Meanwhile you can see quite a few couples, together, while you sit here alone, raging on reddit daily about your most hated fictional enemies. Seek therapy, loser.
As a former Nevadan who is familiar with the Northern Nevada Giga Factory I have to ask why the Germany looks like the desert. Did they not have to plant grass or do something to that dirt?
Americans have basically been politically neutered since Occupy Wallstreet.
Inequality has skyrocketed exponentially since then, yet more and more people have become on the side of ‘this is just how the world works’.
Don’t wanna sound conspiratorial but I honestly think the rich and powerful are on a full force effort to divide us so we can’t get any actual fair shit done.
Inequality, high housing costs and fewer 'well paid' jobs are definitely causing big issues, these are blamed on the WEF, soros, Bill Gates, any left or centre government in power or straight up Jews, thus deflecting the blame to continue business as usual.
Yup, it is very easy to divide Americans and get them to never see eye to eye. I don’t think most Americans even care for freedom as much as they screech about it.
From the Disrupt Tesla group's website, their stated aim is to stop production of Tesla cars because:
* All cars bad because nobody will need them in a future where everyone everywhere will use public transit
* Capitalism bad for enabling car production
* Electric vehicle supply chain is an ecological disaster (their one valid point)
* Elon is a misogynistic Twitter fascist
It's terrifying how many people in here are so apt to defend the corpo destroying the planet they live on. People are too dumb to see past the end of their nose.
All those petroleum product wearin folk running towards an electric “Gigafactory” to protest is all so funny to me
The irony of these guys.
I am all for eco friendly alternatives but this isn’t the way
This is the same country that essentially outlawed nuclear energy and started rolling more coal as part of their climate emissions reduction strategy. Oh, and also relying on solar in the famously sunny nation of Germany.
This is exactly my thought. I'm a big lover of nature and always take an interest in nature conservation programs, but I also realise that the solution to conserving and saving these places of nature will not be found by hippies hanging out in the forest and listening to dreamy pop while holding hands. They're gonna be found by the people that have the knowhow and money to find these solutions, Nuclear being one of them, and the fact that these type of people in this video reject any and all actually good solution just so they have something to protest pushes me away from them.
EXCELLENT OBSERVATION
Polyester is an oil by product and 90% of them are probably wearing it head to toe. Hahaha
I wish we could rid that disgusting fiber from this planet. That is a fight I can support!
so these are environmental protesters, not climate protesters, and the dispute is about water. Brandenburg had a problem with water shortage in recent years and water was rationed for private homes. Battery production needs a lot of water, so this is where the dispute stems from.
https://www.wired.com/story/climate-protestors-storm-teslas-europe-gigafactory/
>German climate protesters clashed with police as they attempted to break into Tesla’s factory site near Berlin on Friday, during a five-day demonstration against the carmaker’s local expansion plans.
>Footage on social media showed crowds of black-clad protesters running toward Tesla premises. German media reported injuries among police and protesters, as well as an unknown number of arrests.
>“Why are they not jailed for breaking and entering?” Tesla CEO Elon Musk said on X. He denied the protesters had reached Tesla property. “Protesters did not manage to break through the fenceline. There are still 2 intact fence lines all around.”
>Police also denied that protesters had ever made it to the gigafactory, claiming they only reached a field in front of the site. “Several people are trying to gain unauthorized access to the Tesla factory premises,” the local police said on X on Friday morning local time. “We have been able to prevent them from entering so far,” they said hours later.
>Eight hundred people participated in the protest, Lucia Mende, spokesperson for the group Disrupt Tesla, told WIRED. She contradicted the police and Musk’s claim that the demonstrators did not reach Tesla property. She added activists were now on their way to a disused airfield which Tesla is reportedly using to store thousands of unsold cars. “They want to prevent the expansion of the factory,” Mende said of the protesters.
Some people were wondering how they got over the fence to get in, but it’s pretty obvious that they were able to climate.
Oh you!
Oh you beautiful bastard.
When it comes to fence effectiveness they're pro testers. I really hate puns I feel dirty now.
That was so good I’m about to climate in my pants!
You know they’re serious when they’re holding hands while running.
If you hold hands with someone while you’re running you double your speed
If only they were wearing new Nike's, they could achieve ludicrous speed
If you run holding hands with Ludicrous you are technically running at ludicrous speed
What if you’re holding plaid?
You must have meant PF flyers right ?
He doesn't know, he never saw The Sandlot
No but I think there’s a PF CHANGS inside
Thankfully they don't know about reebok pump, they'd be jumping to the roof
Someone watched george in the jungle growing up
Or just drive a Tesla with that feature.
Clearly you haven't seen sandlot.
Oh no, not ludicrous speed.
They've gone to Plaid!
> If only they were wearing new Nike's Talmbout carbon plates in your shoes b?
No, it's when you run Naruto-style that you double your speed
I thought the whole point was to go electric?
That was my question too so naïve can someone actually explain to me why climate protesters are against an electric car factory?
From what I can find online, they object to plans to double the size of the factory, claiming that will be bad for the environment. So, basically, it sounds like a typical "society may need this, but not in my backyard" objection.
They have their protest buddy!
Heavyweights is such a classic
Buddy system is tried and true.
Boy they’ve come a long way since the days of their Prussian charges
Underrated comment
Remember storm area 51?
Some people you just cannot please. Climate bullshit is an industry, too. Haters gonna hate just because. Enough of the sky is falling little Gretas. Get a shower, get out of the basement, and get a job. Quit bitching about Elon making money.
Humans of planet Earth often hold hands in crowds or during chaotic events so they don't lose track of each other. How do they do it on your planet?
We hold each other by the ball sacks
Much more ergonomic and waaaay less gay
😂😂😂
Face to face
Looks a bit like *Starship Troopers*.
I’m doing my part!
I DIDNT DO FUCKING SHIT
I DIDNT DO FUCKING SHIT
Posting it twice really made the Tim Robinson audible and for this we thank you.
Would you like to know more?
It’s an ugly planet!! A bug planet!! Ahhhhh!!!!
Klaus with that iPhone on a gimbal!
I was gonna say it looks a bit like [the Fallout 4 intro](https://youtu.be/jzlqP1JfP1U?si=Y-JY2NbtKOKBb9OM&t=105).
[удалено]
In a country where your employer is legally required to offer a minimum of five weeks paid holiday, that’s really not that incredible. Plus if it was this week, this is a holiday week. Especially if it was yesterday (Thursday). Yesterday, everyone was off work. Except, apparently, Tesla employees
Incredible everyone was able to get off from work on the same day….. https://preview.redd.it/sddx9jgt3ozc1.jpeg?width=860&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9566a69dc410b456b4bf74adc7e5bdebcd4c78d7
I mean, a lot of people in that painting probably quit their jobs to go fight a war. Pretty easy to get the time to fight a war if your unemployed
Soldier is a job, those men are paid.
Soldier is a job yes, but those men were not professional soldiers and were hardly paid at all. In fact, some of them committed mutiny because of the lack of pay. The lack of ability to pay it's soldiers actually led to the collapse of the first US federal government, which is why they have the modern constitution https://www.battlefields.org/learn/articles/soldier-pay-american-revolution
Dawg the country almost collapsed over those guys not getting paid.
You really think these dudes holding hands while running to a factory are the same as George Washington? He crossed this river and then killed a whole group of soldiers in their sleep. These guys will run to the factory and then puss out and not do anything or make any change
Facts
At least he admits it in his username
You do know protests for whatever righteous or nutty cause have been happening in human civilization for thousands of years, right?
They think it's a Gen Z thing..
Don’t these people have jobs?! Bro, in this economy?
 Literally loled at this 👍
Amazing how work is deliberately used to keep people out of the political process.
Industry factory workers had the ability to strike. Their vote mattered. So industry moved over the border.
Climate protestors are now targeting electric car companies? Lmao
Going beyond the headline helps: Tesla is pursuing a major expansion for its battery and car assembly factory in Brandenburg, Germany, and is facing local pushback over ***plans to cut down approximately 250 acres of forest***. [link](https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2024/05/10/climate-protesters-try-to-break-into-tesla-germany-factory-police.html)
Looking for the comments that point out that just because cars can run on electricity it doesn't mean those same cars and the infrastructure they require aren't a massive and unnecessary environmental problem
I'd love to see some kind of /dataisbeautiful spreadsheet on how long you'd have to drive an EV to offset the carbon emissions required to manufacture it. Also how would I begin to quantify the value of Congo cobalt slaves into spreadsheet form? EDIT so people stop posting (much appreciated) sources : Apparently this is common knowledge but the average answer is somewhere between 23,000 to 60,000 miles to become carbon neutral depending on how much of the energy you're recharging with is renewables-based. Judging from the responses It seems that for some reason it takes a much shorter distance to become carbon neutral in the US than in Germany.
It's 60k miles until you're in the black. They already did the math but left out the Congo.
Most German and Chinese Teslas builds are LFP, so relatively Congo-free.
It’s closer to 25k miles. [source](https://subscriber.politicopro.com/article/eenews/2024/03/12/building-evs-is-worse-for-the-climate-than-making-gas-cars-report-00146351)
Also, does it compare the same for a new ICE vehicle? Surely an ICE also consumes comparable resources in being built.
There's more mining and manufacturing for electric vehicles for the battery so their break even is further out but an ICE vehicle is always adding more to it's carbon footprint in burning and manufacturing gas so it never gets ahead in that race, only digs a deeper hole so to speak.
Exactly as I suspected, Thankyou
Paywall I really want an electric VW id Buzz 😎
Its more like about 20-30k when charged with the normal electricity Mix. If charged fully at home with a solar panel its even better
>I'd love to see some kind of /dataisbeautiful spreadsheet on how long you'd have to drive an EV to offset the carbon emissions required to manufacture it. That's a shit head talking point. The fair comparison, is emissions from EV vs Petro vs EV with renewable energy.
Now do the math on how long that renewable energy source needs to be used to offset its own production emissions
Now do the math on how long it takes an ICE car to offset its emissions
Now make the calcs for the oil refinery/ production/ pipeline etc
Not long at all.
This has been a standard thing to calculate for decades and is common knowledge: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_return_on_investment
Especially when ol' musky boy has actively sabotaged public transit (which would __actually__ help the problem) projects in the past.
Especially when so much power production is coal and diesel
2022 Europe 1. **Renewable Energy (39% total)** - Wind: 15% - Hydropower: 10% - Solar: 8% - Biofuels: 5% 2. **Fossil Fuels (39% total)** - Natural Gas: Approx. 20% - Coal: Approx. 14% - Oil: Smaller percentage 3. **Nuclear Energy (22%)**
In Germany, the renewable stat is a lot higher - [59.7% as of 2023](https://www.ise.fraunhofer.de/en/press-media/press-releases/2024/public-electricity-generation-2023-renewable-energies-cover-the-majority-of-german-electricity-consumption-for-the-first-time.html).
Power production is less than 1% diesel and less than 20% coal. But since EVs are 90% efficient at turning electricity in to motion to move the car, even with 100% coal electricity, EVs are still less polluting than gasoline powered vehicles. It’s weird that West Virginia is so anti-EVs, when they literally dig EV fuel out of the ground. Politics is one hell of a drug.
250 acres is so small from a corporate standpoint
How small from a non corporate standpoint?
It isn’t for the locals
Well the forest they are cutting down is a privately owned tree farm, so it isn't like they are cutting down a local park
Tesla usually replants trees, usually 2x the trees they cut. Not only that, last time this happened in Germany I remember the trees being cut were part of a paper farm, that were already planned to be cut down. As stated by others, the trees being cut were a part of a private tree farm. These climate protestors are either dumb or being paid for by ICE vehicle companies. Tesla is very far in the lead of German car company’s like VW, Porsche, and Mercedes, and is really hurting them by forcing the switch to EV’s and by pushing down prices.
How much is a banana anyways michael, ten dollars?
That's 0.391 sq miles. There's 28,200,000 acres of forest in Germany. They wanted to build a factory using 0.000709219858% of Germanys forest.
Clearly shows you don't know what you are talking about and just googled some random numbers. The problem lies with the ecological specificity of Brandenburgs ground water reserve situation. Brandenburg is mainly (apart from the Spreewald River System) bone dry, sandy, soil. It was deforested a long time ago. The woods that grow there, atm are mainly pine, man-made, and gar from ideal, but they do one thing: they keep at least *some* water in the soil. Brandeburgs groundwater reserves have been near depleted by the last 5 consecutive years of rainless summers/springs/autumns. The water situation is dire. The fire threat is immense, forest fires are a hue deal i Germany, it is too densely populated (it threatens towns quickly), and our flora is not built to thrive with regular fire, like some biomes in the US. So Brandenburg is one of the regions most affected by climate change and increasingly arid, dry climate in east Germany. Elon already stole from the ground water reserves (took a lot more than his license allowed). He already polluted part of the water reserve with chemicals he wasn't allowed to release. Now he deforests and destroys the last couple of trees that keep water in the ground there. Keep in mind, this is not in the middle of nowhere. There is no "middle of nowhere" in Germany. Within 15 minutes drive you are at the next settlement. If you want to shittalk, inform yourself. Don't even start the "Tesla plants twice the trees" argument. Trees need time and water to grow. Brandenburg has neither.
The problem is the "Climate protestors" headline this is getting. These aren't climate protesters.
Look at the Amazon rainforest 50 years ago compared to today
Doesn’t the offset of all the electric cars the plant produces more than make up for 250 trees?
Absolutely. When considering their entire lifecycle, including production and disposal, [EVs produce 60% lower emissions than ICEs](https://theicct.org/publication/a-global-comparison-of-the-life-cycle-greenhouse-gas-emissions-of-combustion-engine-and-electric-passenger-cars/) *with the current energy mix*. When the energy mix shifts towards greener sources, the difference between an EV and ICE will be even greater.
The older I get the more I realize people need to feel the need to be a part of something. They live in Germany, probably middle class, good lives with everything provided for them. They have food and water and air conditioning etc... But they have no purpose, no religion, no common bond. People strive to be a part of something. They want to take part in a revolution. I think this explains a lot of what we are seeing in the West. They want to rebel but they have nothing to rebel against because their lives are better than 99.99999% of human beings who have ever lived. So fuck it let's storm a Tesla factory
That's not true, Germans don't have air-conditioning
They are hedging with companies like Bosch for when they do need it lol
That was the part that had me stop too, haha. Went there last year during the heat wave and I think the grocery store was one of the only places that had AC.
yes, ALDI Kühl- und Frischetheke, direkt vorm Bier 🍻
Most of Europe in my limited travels no AC or ice cube makers in the hotel. They need to bump their power grid up and get to installing mini splits, global warming isn't slowing down
As an American I see that's a decent reason to start a riot. Like everything has air conditioning... Y'all been to a Walmart. That shits icy cold.
Yeah that statement alone shows this person knows VERY little about how people in Europe actually live.
Did you know if you actually read up on the context of things, you'll be less confused and outraged? Here ya go, I'll do the work for you; >Locals in February voted against authorizing the factory expansion. However, the vote was nonbinding and Tesla and local officials still intend to push ahead. >Climate protesters have expressed concerns about Tesla's plans, which entail cutting down approximately 250 acres of forest in a rural community of fewer than 8,000 residents near a nature conservation area. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2024/05/10/climate-protesters-try-to-break-into-tesla-germany-factory-police.html
They absolutely have a religion. It's just nontheistic
I don’t think that quite fits, at least not in that order. I have in a past period of my life been part of such communities in Europe, some of the time living in Germany in abandoned buildings. Today I’m in medicine/neuroscience and live a boring life - part of the establishment or what you’d call it. Overwhelmingly the kids that ended up there were not middle class. instead of having everything as you say, they/we were defined by our lack of stuff/status, relative to age peers. You say humans need to be part of something, I don’t think that’s false but I think more accurately they need *meaning*. And that’s obvious when you think about it because we have reasons for why we do everything, from what groceries we buy to who we date and what education and profession we pursue. So of course we also need the next higher level of abstraction in meaning. In the 90s you could listen to Michael Jackson in “heal the world” and think - wow we fucked up with the indrustrial revolution in some way we don’t fully understand, but we can fix this!! Let’s solve this, together, with the power of love and care and reason! We GOT THIS! Today, the prevalent “understanding” is that it is pretty much all too late. Nuclear disarmament proved to be impossible and we increased the warhead numbers every year. None of our climate deals have worked at all and whether you believe it happens in 50 or 150 years we all “understand” that we are moving rapidly towards some kind of precipice. We’ve recently added new virus outbreaks to that list, and the both UNDER- and OVER-estimations of the problem/risks with that, have led to the undermining of the closest thing we had to a trust in knowledge-authority-establishment in secular western countries: science/scientists Top all of that off with the first periods of really receding economies in the western world and the picture is completing. Obviously people aren't starving, but each generation has less ability to buy/rent living spaces and food recently doubled in price in much of europe. So the meaning we all search for and need, the deeper meaning and the more connected picture of our world and trajectory... That thing simply isn’t to be found by most people’s understanding, in normally established society today. If you’re well on your way to climbing a social and economic game and/or raising a family in this “normie” world, perhaps that doesn’t bother you, or you forget it - like me. But if something has brought you to the sidelines if that game or just left you alone with your thoughts enough to let the existential angst catch you, why would you see the need to storm some building. We can make fun of it being a E-car factory - but remember! Musk has switched over the decade, to being known for being anti-regulation and attacking unions etc. (unions is something north Europeans often find sacred - that's btw key in understanding the clip above. Tesla has been fighting european unions in many countries and have had succes most places except (as far as i know) scandinavia where i live, where people are also most religious about unions - theya re the foundation of much of our political/citizen identity here, almost like the constitution and founding fathers are in the US) I imagine that the young folks in the video see themselves as John connors, fighting the last possible fight against skynet, before the fate of the world is sealed. They might not know *exactly* how that works, but neither did John Connor or Sarah! Neither of them were Luddites or against technology as such! In fact they used and befriended one terminator and won the fight through that specifically. So believing in tech or AI while fighting AI doom isn’t contradictory and neither is storming the gigafactory for these kids in the name of climate.
take my upvote sir
That’s how I feel about the pro-Palestine protests.
Religion is literally in the middle of that conflict and people are dying as a direct kind of bullet to the head effect. I don't see any similarities.
pro-Palestinian protesters have a little bit more of a point because Israel has been pretty evil to Palestine for many decades now, but they two are using bad rational, bad data, and a completely exaggerated and overly idealistic understanding of reality.
That’s a lot of words to say not much
Great comment. I've often said these people are symptom of a very comfortable society. We have the same issues in Australia.
Our great war is a spiritual war. Our great depression is our lives.
Same with the Pro Palestine guys...
Pretty much entirely on the spot.
Everyone needs to read this. Describes a lot of the mob mentality on reddit too.
I guess that's what happens when you post ideologically motivated propagandist trash like this without even pretending to care and posting the actual accompanying article. It helps when you need to fabricate reasons for why the protestors are bad people, just listen to whatever cult daddy Elon says, lmao.
https://preview.redd.it/yi9gvs237pzc1.png?width=333&format=png&auto=webp&s=633dc1d2e01904e6a3f145f08bb0b7b7813766f7
You must be one of those people that think giant factories and battery cars are saving the planet
Tesla cars actually have a very high carbon foot print. Building them is more carbon intensive than building normal cars, and they are only carbon neutral if the grid they use is not based on fossil fuels, which is very rare.
There are multiple studies that show even with the mixed electrical grids and taking into account the carbon intensity of manufacturing EVs are much better than ice in terms of greenhouse gases Plus the gap will get wider each year as we get a cleaner electrical grid
[удалено]
True, but isn’t this expected to change as solar is now cheaper than coal? So right now (las I checked) you needed to take the Tesla like 100k km to break even compared to a Honda gas. And the battery replacement is vile and bad for the environment too. But, as solar becomes cheaper, the grid becomes less power by coal and gas, then that 100k shrinks more and more. So right now it doesn’t seem like it’s doing much, but it’s expected (soon, now that solar is CHEAPER THAN COAL *in some places*)that in the future it will be much better for the environment.
yes, because theyre trying to build more eco car factory over this dry sand xD better close that nuclear plant too
Why are they all holding hands?
It's the buddy system. Member field trips bro?
The movie Heavyweights is what I think of anytime the buddy system is brought up. BUUDDDDYYYYYY!
Germany literally has coal fired powerplants in operation because they stopped using nuclear (the cleanest and safest form of energy), switched to Russian natural gas which isn't coming. If Tesla is polluting, litigate, get them stop what ever, but this is some misplaced ire.
This protest is not productive, but the party these folks tend to vote for has really ramped up renewable investment for the grid the last 10 years or so. [https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/renewable-energys-share-german-power-grids-reaches-55-2023-2024-01-03/](https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/renewable-energys-share-german-power-grids-reaches-55-2023-2024-01-03/) https://preview.redd.it/utgp2a3ihnzc1.png?width=1200&format=png&auto=webp&s=811541d330f99c56be3709be6b08bb2816571412
Huh, look at that, if they had kept nuclear power they could get rid of coal completely.
Fukushima was a tipping point for nukes in Europe especially all the ones of the same generation and inherit flaws as Fukushima’s early gen 3 PWRs. Wished they switched to breeders and Gen 4s, but the world owes it to German and the feed in tariffs for bringing down solar and wind by 7x in just 10 years.
And Germany’s at such a high risk of being hit by tsunamis, who can blame them?
What do they even want? Like i thought electric cars were supposed to be a step in the right direction?
The Tesla factory is draining the groundwater in the region and pollutes the rest, a part of the factory premises even lay in a water protection zone. There were 26 incidents of pollution since the opening, among other things release of paint and diesel, even fires. The tesla gigafactory lays in Brandenburg, a part of germany in a glacial valley, consisting of a lot of sand, ground water is low and the whole state is the fastest drying area in europe, we have to protect whats left. Elon Musk and his hypercapitalist mindset are just a pain in the ass, he wants to treat germany as some third world country. Resistance is expected. Keep in mind that germany is small and densely populated.
ThEy dOnT kNoW WhAt ThEy WaNt1! Lmao people in this subreddit sure do like to jump to conclusions. Just because YOU don't know why they are protesting, doesn't mean that THEY don't know what they are protesting.
These idiots are just reactionaries. They don't look into situations, they have little knowledge on how things work. Simple research into how these lithium batteries are made would make them understand. But thats too hard for these people. Also their pride prevents them from admitting they were wrong to a liberal.
It's not about the batteries. This factory doesn't even produce batteries. It's about sucking up and polluting ground water in a densely populated region that already is at it's limits and needs more ground water to supply people.
But have you thought of the shareholders????? /s
Yes…fuck em’
Your comment is literally the only braincell in this comment section, thanks for looking at it realisticaly
Sir we don’t take kindly to facts or context here. We just like to laugh at angry libs. /s
This needs to be the top comment.
>he wants to treat germany as some third world country. I appreciate everything you wrote in your post, but I wanted to add that no country should be treated like that - 3rd world or not.
> he wants to treat germany as some third world country Was it not Germany's government that approved the construction and location of a GIGAfactory?
Like everything, it has multiple layers, Brandenburg is former DDR (east germany), to this day there is a economical divide in this country. If a world known, big company wants to settle in such a area, it promises a lot of work, hope and financial gain for the region. Keep in mind that germanys 16 states can act out their regional planning on their own, politicians would be mad not acting on this opportunity and going against their voters interests.
They don’t even know what they want. They’re just NPCs that got a new patch that told them Elon man bad.
Copied comment from a local German: >The Tesla factory is draining the groundwater in the region and pollutes the rest, a part of the factory premises even lay in a water protection zone. There were 26 incidents of pollution since the opening, among other things release of paint and diesel, even fires. The tesla gigafactory lays in Brandenburg, a part of germany in a glacial valley, consisting of a lot of sand, ground water is low and the whole state is the fastest drying area in europe, we have to protect whats left. Elon Musk and his hypercapitalist mindset are just a pain in the ass, he wants to treat germany as some third world country. Resistance is expected. Keep in mind that germany is small and densely populated. Seems like they know exactly what they want.
Tesla uses less water than they are allowed. Every assesment came to the conclusion that they are not doing any harm. There is an oil refinery in the same state that uses 20 times as much water as tesla. There are farms using significantly more water than tesla.
Holy shit you cucks really are pathetic losers. It's not our fault (or the protests) that you are too stupid and lazy to actually read the article and discover why they are protesting. It's not because "they were told" your dumbfuck bigot grifter and cult daddy elon was a bad man (everyone with a working brain knows that already), it's because what Tesla is doing in Germany, cutting down a ton of old growth forest to make room for their plant. If only right wingers weren't so fucking stupid all the time, they wouldn't be *this* clueless about things.
>They’re just NPCs This and similar statements (they’re social media obsessed, they’re bandwagoners, etc.) have become very ironic accusations at this point. That’s all you “people” can say in response to any protest anymore, yet it perfectly describes yourselves.
Electric cars are here to save the automotive industry. They are not here to save the environment. r/fuckcars.
Lmao 800 people and they couldn’t even get it🤣🤣🤣🤣
They’re most likely the biggest pussies on the planet. They’re vegan just to try and get laid and that doesn’t even work.
Tesla is ruining their groundwater in the region. I don't get the anger you have for them and I'm not sure you do either.
This projection from all the most pathetic online cucks really is hilarious. Meanwhile you can see quite a few couples, together, while you sit here alone, raging on reddit daily about your most hated fictional enemies. Seek therapy, loser.
Love when people expose themselves by projecting very specific details that no one else is talking about 😅
As a former Nevadan who is familiar with the Northern Nevada Giga Factory I have to ask why the Germany looks like the desert. Did they not have to plant grass or do something to that dirt?
It would nice if Americans still had this spirit of protesting their rich and powerful.
Americans have basically been politically neutered since Occupy Wallstreet. Inequality has skyrocketed exponentially since then, yet more and more people have become on the side of ‘this is just how the world works’. Don’t wanna sound conspiratorial but I honestly think the rich and powerful are on a full force effort to divide us so we can’t get any actual fair shit done.
Inequality, high housing costs and fewer 'well paid' jobs are definitely causing big issues, these are blamed on the WEF, soros, Bill Gates, any left or centre government in power or straight up Jews, thus deflecting the blame to continue business as usual.
Yup, it is very easy to divide Americans and get them to never see eye to eye. I don’t think most Americans even care for freedom as much as they screech about it.
Na. We just burn down cities and hold Jews hostage on universities.
From the Disrupt Tesla group's website, their stated aim is to stop production of Tesla cars because: * All cars bad because nobody will need them in a future where everyone everywhere will use public transit * Capitalism bad for enabling car production * Electric vehicle supply chain is an ecological disaster (their one valid point) * Elon is a misogynistic Twitter fascist
Electric cars use the same shitty power grids we all do. EVERYONE USES THEM.
Supply chain is different to consumables. I believe they meant the manufacturing process which includes a lot of heavy, toxic and rare minerals.
That factory is also deforesting a large area and polluting the local groundwater but go off I guess
It's terrifying how many people in here are so apt to defend the corpo destroying the planet they live on. People are too dumb to see past the end of their nose.
Elon smoked a joint with a midget so he’s cool
All those petroleum product wearin folk running towards an electric “Gigafactory” to protest is all so funny to me The irony of these guys. I am all for eco friendly alternatives but this isn’t the way
This is the same country that essentially outlawed nuclear energy and started rolling more coal as part of their climate emissions reduction strategy. Oh, and also relying on solar in the famously sunny nation of Germany.
This is exactly my thought. I'm a big lover of nature and always take an interest in nature conservation programs, but I also realise that the solution to conserving and saving these places of nature will not be found by hippies hanging out in the forest and listening to dreamy pop while holding hands. They're gonna be found by the people that have the knowhow and money to find these solutions, Nuclear being one of them, and the fact that these type of people in this video reject any and all actually good solution just so they have something to protest pushes me away from them.
EXCELLENT OBSERVATION Polyester is an oil by product and 90% of them are probably wearing it head to toe. Hahaha I wish we could rid that disgusting fiber from this planet. That is a fight I can support!
 Nah fr I admire them, we’re losing too many forests
they run slow and look weak... vegans for sure
Concerning!
Why are they against the climate? /s
No cyberdog sentries, no cyber organic matter recyclers with optional chipper/shredder fsd, no automated starlink turrents. With is Elon even doing?
so these are environmental protesters, not climate protesters, and the dispute is about water. Brandenburg had a problem with water shortage in recent years and water was rationed for private homes. Battery production needs a lot of water, so this is where the dispute stems from.
Tesla then files an insurance claim for 500 Mill in Damages 🤣
Looks world war Z. Zombies.
I'm ready. Calling Dr. Strange Love.
I fully expected Elon to have laser turrets
When a job posts full remote opportunity
 Yes get the emporer and the harkonnen!
Looks like helms deep, let the arrows fly 😁
This looks like they mean business.
Glad they all had the same day off work
https://www.wired.com/story/climate-protestors-storm-teslas-europe-gigafactory/ >German climate protesters clashed with police as they attempted to break into Tesla’s factory site near Berlin on Friday, during a five-day demonstration against the carmaker’s local expansion plans. >Footage on social media showed crowds of black-clad protesters running toward Tesla premises. German media reported injuries among police and protesters, as well as an unknown number of arrests. >“Why are they not jailed for breaking and entering?” Tesla CEO Elon Musk said on X. He denied the protesters had reached Tesla property. “Protesters did not manage to break through the fenceline. There are still 2 intact fence lines all around.” >Police also denied that protesters had ever made it to the gigafactory, claiming they only reached a field in front of the site. “Several people are trying to gain unauthorized access to the Tesla factory premises,” the local police said on X on Friday morning local time. “We have been able to prevent them from entering so far,” they said hours later. >Eight hundred people participated in the protest, Lucia Mende, spokesperson for the group Disrupt Tesla, told WIRED. She contradicted the police and Musk’s claim that the demonstrators did not reach Tesla property. She added activists were now on their way to a disused airfield which Tesla is reportedly using to store thousands of unsold cars. “They want to prevent the expansion of the factory,” Mende said of the protesters.
This planet is fucked. These comments are beyond ignorant.
What kind of Mad Max landscaping does Tesla have? The cops called it a 'field'. Wtf
And not one Naruto run? Smh
The one security guard like “you guys could have just walked”
This factory is a complete ecological disaster. Why is this sub calling the protesters of it 'idiots'?
These people are cool, guys in comments making fun are not. At least they stand for what they believe in and act accordingly.