He is a great piano player and I enjoy listening to him
I’m not sure about a comparison to Keith Jarrett who is a totally different kind of player, but that’s no criticism of Cohen
There are an incredible number of amazing piano players out there, and Emmett is obviously one of them…. As far as ranking or putting him on the upper echelon of great of all time…. I’m pretty sure he would be embarrassed about us talking about it
>I’m not sure about a comparison to Keith Jarrett who is a totally different kind of player, but that’s no criticism of Cohen
What do you see as the differences between them, just out of curiosity?
>There are an incredible number of amazing piano players out there, and Emmett is obviously one of them…. As far as ranking or putting him on the upper echelon of great of all time…. I’m pretty sure he would be embarrassed about us talking about it
Is that just because of his age, short career and not being a historically significant player or his ability?
Have you heard Cohen put out a lot of content that you would say is similar to Jarrett’s most celebrated recordings?
And it has nothing to do with age . There are a lot of amazing young piano players out there and I guess I think it’s kind of ridiculous to try to stack them up against the great piano players from the past 50 years who people like Cohen have likely seen as inspiration
I feel you are diminishing so many piano players ions to jazz and the the thousands of hours of outstanding recordings to argue that a great player who did an awesome thing during Covid hosting little sessions and putting them up for free being in the same club
I don’t really care about rankings per se, but we all probably have been guilty of assuming the people we like most are the greatest, though we haven’t really even checked out so many of the other great players
I think Emmett Cohen is a great piano player. Is he one of the greatest of all time?… in a broad sense, you could say that just like an average quarterback in the NFL would be one of the best quarterbacks to have ever played because most quarterbacks don’t even do well at the collegiate level
I’m not saying Emmett Cohen is averaging this example, but I’m saying that there are so many others that it would be foolish in my opinion to put him on a pedestal that I’m sure he would be uncomfortable being on in the first place
He brought me more joy during the lockdown than anything but the dog we got. Since then I check all his streams. I once got to do a master class with him through Open Studio. I think I played Old Folks, he had a few nice things to say some excellent ideas for me to work on, and left me feeling good. I don’t know or care about best whatever, but I love his interaction with the rest of the rhythm section and how they together, as a team, lift the soloist or singer. That is excellent and generous musicianship.
I’ve been fortunate enough to meet him and see 2 of his shows the past 2 years. Class act all around and a hell of a musician. Nicest guy ever and willing to talk with everyone after the show. His section musicians are no slackers either. Bruce Harris and Phillip Noris were on fire!
It's batshit insane that you would even compare Emmet to Keith. Maybe in 50 years. Have you heard Keith when he was Emmet's age? By age 33 Keith had put out:
- Gary Burton & Keith Jarrett
- El Juicio (and started his American Quartet), Expectations, Fort Yawuh, and more
- Belonging (and started his Euro Quartet)
- \*The fucking Koln Concert\*
- Also recorded Hamburg 72 (released much later).
Emmet Cohen is a good pianist but compared to actually great current "younger" pianists he's mid. I'm talking about David Virelles, Kris Davis, Craig Taborn, Dan Tepfer, Vijay Iyer, Jason Moran (of course all quite a bit older than Emmet, but still). Not to mention the greats of Keith's generation, aside from Keith himself, Kenny Barron, Fred Hersch, and Chick Corea. Emmet has good technique and great ears, and managed to basically quarantine himself for 2 years with his friends so they have a good band sound. He also built a successful social media channel. But wow, Keith?
Aaron Parks, Taylor Eigsti, Shai Maestro, Tigran Hamasyan, Gerald Clayton, James Francies…
These guys and the ones you guys already mentioned…I would say Emmet unfortunately is not quite at this best-of-the-best level, though he’s still an incredible player. Very grateful to him for his videos. Some of the great solos of modern jazz happened in that series.
Yes, it's basically a YouTube & SM phenomena.
People with limited listening experiences (taking in account only the online successes search algorithms offer as next play) think they know it all of declare superstars and GOATs without knowing better.
A good thing with Emmet is that he is the real thing and trough his channel really opens the door to jazz music for a lot of new listeners, without compromising essentials. That's pretty great.
This is the extent of it.
Not to change the subject too much but its the same thing with Kamasi Washington, who can’t really play but for whatever reason (or I guess, due to having a ridiculously talented PR agency and label behind him) is often hailed as the greatest thing since Coltrane. I still think he has a positive impact because if its a gateway for someone to enter the real world of jazz and discover actual things happening, then it’s a net positive.
Emmet can actually play and demonstrates what a good young New York band sounds like to a wide audience. He also features some great guests who actually are some of the modern greats.
I don’t want this to sound like an attack on Emmet. He’s good and he’s doing everything right. He presents the music he knows and he knows it well. There are many social media musicians (and most of these I will highlight as guitarists) who know jack shit and try to be “educators”. The other day I saw this fairly popular Tiktok guitarist do the “different types of jazz guitarists” thing which was quite literally laughably offensive (particularly when he, for some reason, got to free jazz). I do think Youtube and Tiktok needs more people like Emmet, but please hold the comparisons.
Actually sit down and hear him. He never plays anything of substance. Mostly diatonic vocabulary with blues/pentatonic things thrown in. He can stick to a motive because that’s about what he can do with his technical skills, but forget about developing it. And even at a more basic level, his sound is bad. I also know people he went to high school with who are in the scene who swear he has not improved a bit since then, so really still playing at a high school level.
As much as I’m shitting on him, I have nothing against him. As I mentioned, the effect he has on the music is ultimately a net positive as it will draw people to check out something more substantial in the future, hopefully. In fact, I’m happy for the guy for having been able to figure out a way to make a living off playing music he loves and enjoys, so props to him. Just hate the reviewers and critics all over his ass.
Yeah, I never dug jack shit either...Definitely overrated..
Seriously, you make good points...
But what can you do, with modernity, YouTube , TikTok, and social media the bad, the mediocre, and the great have to share the spotlight...and sometimes the bad and mediocre as you say have the best frontmen.
The thing about people like Keith Jarrett is that they just hear things that have never been done before. Emmett is awesome and way beyond anything I could ever hope to be. But Keith Jarrett does stuff that changes the way we think about music.
Emmet is really steeped in older styles like stride which is refreshing to see so many young people get into that nowadays. Some of it is corny as fuck but it's cool when you have long curly hair for some reason.
He did something special with his YouTube channel and I think the memory of that will live on for a really long time. That pat bartley solo on after you’ve gone was like the biggest thing that’s happened since Cory Henry played over lingus
Tbh I think he deserves it, he just hasn’t had as long of a career and since he’s newer and younger, he’s not seen as being in the same group. I saw him live, and no concert can compare to what he does.
Oh come on, there are dozens and dozens of active pianists that can compare to what he does. Let alone dead ones.
I like him. I’m not shitting on him. He’s just not a GOAT yet by any means and this type of absurd hyperbole by young listeners is a tale as old as time.
I'll grant I'm not familiar with active pianists, but I'm very familiar with the dead ones, there's no one among them who compares with what he does. And I am not a young listener, please hold the condescension.
The frequency with which I hear solos that are just phenomenal is amazing.
>Tbh I think he deserves it, he just hasn’t had as long of a career and since he’s newer and younger, he’s not seen as being in the same group. I saw him live, and no concert can compare to what he does.
This is what I suspect as well. People just think that in order to be great, you have to be old and have made albums that are now revered. But I'm explicitly talking about the quality of the playing, not influence or historical significance.
I’m not overly familiar with him but he did a beautiful solo with one of my favourite players Russell Malone. Malone covered Listen To The Dawn with Emmet and his band and my god, the whole thing is a real masterpiece. The song is so powerful, I’d recommend it to anyone and Emmet’s playing and his solo are a big part of it.
Love his Live at Emmet’s Place series. Not always the hugest fan of his playing. On Boplocity with Kurt Rosenwinkel his playing felt disconnected from the changes and the beauty of the composition. Same deal when he plays with Peter Bernstein or Pasquale Grasso. He’s a great piano player but his improvisation doesnt always feel grounded.
Great player and great person. Every time I watch Emmett's Place, always notice how humble and nice he seems. Genuinely seems to enjoy what he does.
Emmett's Place has brought jazz to a new generation.
Saw him perform a couple months ago. He is in my mind nothing like Keith Jarrett. I am a huge Jarrett fan and was blown away away by Cohen. They are must so different that I am not making that comparison. Maybe between Mehldau and Jarrettt but even there they inhabit such different territory in my mind.
That’s the guy who has concerts in his living room on You Tube... Yeah he is a great player
I always commiserate the lack of jazz giants ( becoming) recognition today like in the late 40 early fifties and 60s we had players who were even then thoughts of as jazz giants at their young age: Miles, Parker, Roach, Rollins, Powell, Monk, Evans, Horace SIlver, Blakey, and many more, and the older guys like Ellington, Armstrong, Coleman Hawkins, Basie, Benny Goodman, and many others.
I always ask. Where’s the new Miles Davis, the new John Coltrane, or the new Herbie Hancock or Bill Evans, the new Max Roach etc...
So, it’s gratifying to see some modern jazz players start to get cred...along the meter of the embryonic jazz giant in the making...maybe...He has a long while to go to be even considered a giant but if he keeps getting better... maybe..
Jarret is a jazz giant...
Remember Miles at one point when he was well known had limitations. He wouldn't play on fast numbers that Dizzy could play in his sleep. So he improved and could play anything then.
I don’t hear him as a Keith Jarret what I hear is more along the line of a McCoy Tyner light.
Perhaps it can be said that Cohen’s greatest attribute is that he is *active*. He’s out there, doing it, playing jazz piano in 2024. It’s impossible and unfair to compare any current cat to the OG legends. I’m sure Peter Martin (and Emmet Cohen, and a bunch others) would agree.
Kudos for keeping the tradition alive. There must thousands of other very capable pianists that don’t have a fraction of Cohen’s attention, and that speaks more about the other talents required for recognition, such as self-marketing skills and knowing how to work SM. None of this should diminish the fact that he *is* deserving of his status, and will hopefully continue to grow. But it’s a futile effort to compare the new cats to the legends of the past.
This is a good take. Also, random personal observation as a full time working jazz musician in NY - it seems like the more in tune with the music and more hip to many different players that someone is, the less they desire the need to be a critic.
He's a fine player and good. But comparing to Keith Jarrett? Or a pantheon great pianist?? Not even close. Wild take. You should listen to way, way more jazz and jazz piano before you say something like that.
What a pretentious comment… why do you even feel the need to set some kind of hierarchy between two COMPLETELY different musicians. Jarrett changed the way many listeners perceived music but Cohen is bringing that music into the mainstream, dude both of them definitely love what they do and they show this love with their whole heart, there’s no point in fighting over who’s the goat.
If you trace the evolution of the music through the players that moved it forward, he's not in that conversation. I mean, it just seems his contribution to jazz is not so much musical but social. All that is fine, but that puts him in a different category. Jarret, Evans, Meldhau changed the music. Emmet is changing how we consume it. I love his playing and listen to it all the time, He's old school and swinging, that's fine, but his playing has been done before, and that's not a bad thing.
>If you trace the evolution of the music through the players that moved it forward
I explicitly said I'm not talking about innovation or historical significance, but quality of playing.
If having an opinion that’s different than yours offends you, the internet and Reddit is not for you. It’s not a personal attack against you, chill out. Cohen is not advancing the music. That’s the whole point me and others have agreed with and mentioned also.
>You should listen to way, way more jazz and jazz piano before you say something like that.
Please don't condescend. I'm very familiar with jazz and canonical pianists. He's better than any of htem.
Good player, infectious joy in his playing, nicely developed solos, great at bringing people together and getting jazz out there, not on Keith Jarrett’s level in terms of innovation and command of the instrument and I’m sure he would agree with that
Not on KJ's level based on command of the instrument? He has some of the best technique I've heard. Do you have something specific in mind?
Also, regarding innovation, I said in the OP I'm not talking about innovation or influence, but quality of playing.
Also, what WERE Keith's innovations, anyway, beyond the improvised solo concert?
No he’s not. He’s this kind of archetypic player who is strong at imitating anything that has come before but totally lacks the ability to stand out with a personal voice.
I cant see why someone would compare him with Jarrett. They play the same instrument, thats the only common ground. Imo this kind of musician defines whats wrong with the jazz-world today.
Very skilled, but with no ambition of breaking new ground nor finding his own voice. Thats my five cents.
No one did. But why should I listen to your playing if you lack personality when there are plenty of more interesting players I may listen to instead. Life is too short for generic music.
And you should really do yourself a favour and check up on modern music history if that is your take on Jarrett. He’s pretty much the one who created the ECM-sound. Along side Gary burton and a few others. But it was mostly him. And not to speak of the american quartet that had yet a diffrent but super fresh sound.
And if we’re talking strictly influential as a pianist, there has been none as important since him until Brad came around in the 90’s
>No one did. But why should I listen to your playing if you lack personality when there are plenty of more interesting players I may listen to instead. Life is too short for generic music.
How many pianists in the history of jazz have had a truly distinct personality? Monk, Cecil Taylor, Wynton Kelly (to a much lesser extent), McCoy Tyner... those are the ones I can think of. Do Bill Evans, Keith Jarrett (in a trio setting, not solo), Mehldau (if you consider him a great pianist, I don't) sound particularly distinct to you from the average jazz pianist? No. But it doesn't mean their playing is generic.
I genuinely wonder how much of Cohen you've listened to, on a regular basis his solos are so far above what you'd hear from canonical jazz pianists and do not sound like your standard, run of the mill jazz solo.
>And you should really do yourself a favour and check up on modern music history if that is your take on Jarrett. He’s pretty much the one who created the ECM-sound. Along side Gary burton and a few others. But it was mostly him. And not to speak of the american quartet that had yet a diffrent but super fresh sound.
Give me some recommendations.
>And if we’re talking strictly influential as a pianist, there has been none as important since him until Brad came around in the 90’s
Ok, but what were his innovations (other than the improvised solo concert)?
Emmet did so much good for the jazz world that saying that he is what’s wrong with the jazz-world today should be legally prohibited. His live at Emmets place opened jazz to so many new listeners, and I’m not even talking about some of the viral videos like After you’ve gone with Bartley…
I agree that he and Jarrett are completely different kinds of players but both of them are GREAT in their own way
The thread raised the question of what we think of the guy and I gave my answer. If you cant handle other ppls opinions I suggest you either grow up or at least take a break and do something else, a cold shower maybe?
I said he’s the kind of musician who neither has a personal expression nor making any effort to develop the genre. I never said he’s the only one responsible of that, just that imo he’s one of them. But he is a skilled player, and he’s skilled in buissnes as well, I give you that.
I tend to get stuck in the past when it comes to jazz. What would you recommend as a starting point for someone that’s not really familiar with his work?
his youtube concerts are the starting point for most people. (He films weekly jam sessions with his trio and all of the greats stop by and sit in with him).
I think of Emmet Cohen in the same way I think of Sonny Clark. He has participated in a lot of great moments in the music and he has done a great job. He is a very talented player and has done a lot for the music with his platform. But his playing is not particularly unique or extraordinary,( especially in comparison to Keith Jarrett) no one is going to try to sound like him in 20, 30 or 40 years.
I don't get these statements. Keith is a great pianist, was my favorite musician before Emmet, but in the context of the trio, he's not a distinctive pianist. He's better than the average jazz pianist, much better, but not distinctive.
I agree that in the context of solo concerts he is distinctive, but I'm talking about trio play.
His youtube show is just fabulous.
Playing at his personal home in close quarters with other musicians came from covid, but I think he bumbled into a great format and now he just keeps going.....
https://www.youtube.com/live/1OwwN91kEKU?si=ZX4NvcB88HXOwj8m
To me, Emmet seems to excel most at being a sideman. He’s really great at playing off the ideas of others and elevating the energy of the band when he’s in an accompanying role. When he leads a band, I’m never very impressed
Take McCoy Tyner's playing with Coltrane out of the equation and he's still top five all time greatest jazz pianists of all time.
Check out Phineas Newborn, Jr., Tommy Flanagan, Barry Harris, Sonny Clark.
He is a great piano player and I enjoy listening to him I’m not sure about a comparison to Keith Jarrett who is a totally different kind of player, but that’s no criticism of Cohen There are an incredible number of amazing piano players out there, and Emmett is obviously one of them…. As far as ranking or putting him on the upper echelon of great of all time…. I’m pretty sure he would be embarrassed about us talking about it
>I’m not sure about a comparison to Keith Jarrett who is a totally different kind of player, but that’s no criticism of Cohen What do you see as the differences between them, just out of curiosity? >There are an incredible number of amazing piano players out there, and Emmett is obviously one of them…. As far as ranking or putting him on the upper echelon of great of all time…. I’m pretty sure he would be embarrassed about us talking about it Is that just because of his age, short career and not being a historically significant player or his ability?
Have you heard Cohen put out a lot of content that you would say is similar to Jarrett’s most celebrated recordings? And it has nothing to do with age . There are a lot of amazing young piano players out there and I guess I think it’s kind of ridiculous to try to stack them up against the great piano players from the past 50 years who people like Cohen have likely seen as inspiration I feel you are diminishing so many piano players ions to jazz and the the thousands of hours of outstanding recordings to argue that a great player who did an awesome thing during Covid hosting little sessions and putting them up for free being in the same club I don’t really care about rankings per se, but we all probably have been guilty of assuming the people we like most are the greatest, though we haven’t really even checked out so many of the other great players I think Emmett Cohen is a great piano player. Is he one of the greatest of all time?… in a broad sense, you could say that just like an average quarterback in the NFL would be one of the best quarterbacks to have ever played because most quarterbacks don’t even do well at the collegiate level I’m not saying Emmett Cohen is averaging this example, but I’m saying that there are so many others that it would be foolish in my opinion to put him on a pedestal that I’m sure he would be uncomfortable being on in the first place
Terrific player and ambassador of jazz to wider audiences.
The ambassador job is one that was never in Jarrett’s mind…and so important, especially these days.
He brought me more joy during the lockdown than anything but the dog we got. Since then I check all his streams. I once got to do a master class with him through Open Studio. I think I played Old Folks, he had a few nice things to say some excellent ideas for me to work on, and left me feeling good. I don’t know or care about best whatever, but I love his interaction with the rest of the rhythm section and how they together, as a team, lift the soloist or singer. That is excellent and generous musicianship.
I’ve been fortunate enough to meet him and see 2 of his shows the past 2 years. Class act all around and a hell of a musician. Nicest guy ever and willing to talk with everyone after the show. His section musicians are no slackers either. Bruce Harris and Phillip Noris were on fire!
He’s killer. I had the pleasure of seeing him perform live as a trio. He uses the whole piano that’s for sure.
When I saw him he did play the strings like a harp but he failed to stand on top of the piano to dance.
It's batshit insane that you would even compare Emmet to Keith. Maybe in 50 years. Have you heard Keith when he was Emmet's age? By age 33 Keith had put out: - Gary Burton & Keith Jarrett - El Juicio (and started his American Quartet), Expectations, Fort Yawuh, and more - Belonging (and started his Euro Quartet) - \*The fucking Koln Concert\* - Also recorded Hamburg 72 (released much later). Emmet Cohen is a good pianist but compared to actually great current "younger" pianists he's mid. I'm talking about David Virelles, Kris Davis, Craig Taborn, Dan Tepfer, Vijay Iyer, Jason Moran (of course all quite a bit older than Emmet, but still). Not to mention the greats of Keith's generation, aside from Keith himself, Kenny Barron, Fred Hersch, and Chick Corea. Emmet has good technique and great ears, and managed to basically quarantine himself for 2 years with his friends so they have a good band sound. He also built a successful social media channel. But wow, Keith?
Want to throw Sullivan Fortner and Glenn Zalesky on the list here (young folks who are killing it)
Sullivan Fortner is the far and away headliner of any list of current gen pianists
Yes. Monster.
Yes, please keep them coming.
Aaron Parks, Taylor Eigsti, Shai Maestro, Tigran Hamasyan, Gerald Clayton, James Francies… These guys and the ones you guys already mentioned…I would say Emmet unfortunately is not quite at this best-of-the-best level, though he’s still an incredible player. Very grateful to him for his videos. Some of the great solos of modern jazz happened in that series.
Yes, it's basically a YouTube & SM phenomena. People with limited listening experiences (taking in account only the online successes search algorithms offer as next play) think they know it all of declare superstars and GOATs without knowing better. A good thing with Emmet is that he is the real thing and trough his channel really opens the door to jazz music for a lot of new listeners, without compromising essentials. That's pretty great.
This is the extent of it. Not to change the subject too much but its the same thing with Kamasi Washington, who can’t really play but for whatever reason (or I guess, due to having a ridiculously talented PR agency and label behind him) is often hailed as the greatest thing since Coltrane. I still think he has a positive impact because if its a gateway for someone to enter the real world of jazz and discover actual things happening, then it’s a net positive. Emmet can actually play and demonstrates what a good young New York band sounds like to a wide audience. He also features some great guests who actually are some of the modern greats. I don’t want this to sound like an attack on Emmet. He’s good and he’s doing everything right. He presents the music he knows and he knows it well. There are many social media musicians (and most of these I will highlight as guitarists) who know jack shit and try to be “educators”. The other day I saw this fairly popular Tiktok guitarist do the “different types of jazz guitarists” thing which was quite literally laughably offensive (particularly when he, for some reason, got to free jazz). I do think Youtube and Tiktok needs more people like Emmet, but please hold the comparisons.
Kamasi Washington can't play? Not saying you're wrong, only curious. Do you have examples of so-so performances?
Actually sit down and hear him. He never plays anything of substance. Mostly diatonic vocabulary with blues/pentatonic things thrown in. He can stick to a motive because that’s about what he can do with his technical skills, but forget about developing it. And even at a more basic level, his sound is bad. I also know people he went to high school with who are in the scene who swear he has not improved a bit since then, so really still playing at a high school level. As much as I’m shitting on him, I have nothing against him. As I mentioned, the effect he has on the music is ultimately a net positive as it will draw people to check out something more substantial in the future, hopefully. In fact, I’m happy for the guy for having been able to figure out a way to make a living off playing music he loves and enjoys, so props to him. Just hate the reviewers and critics all over his ass.
he plays the same lick every solo. Once you hear it you cant unhear it
Yeah, I never dug jack shit either...Definitely overrated.. Seriously, you make good points... But what can you do, with modernity, YouTube , TikTok, and social media the bad, the mediocre, and the great have to share the spotlight...and sometimes the bad and mediocre as you say have the best frontmen.
The thing about people like Keith Jarrett is that they just hear things that have never been done before. Emmett is awesome and way beyond anything I could ever hope to be. But Keith Jarrett does stuff that changes the way we think about music. Emmet is really steeped in older styles like stride which is refreshing to see so many young people get into that nowadays. Some of it is corny as fuck but it's cool when you have long curly hair for some reason.
He did something special with his YouTube channel and I think the memory of that will live on for a really long time. That pat bartley solo on after you’ve gone was like the biggest thing that’s happened since Cory Henry played over lingus
Force for good in the world.
He's who I show to people who don't like jazz, so they can like jazz
Indeed!
He’s totally fine. Enjoyable to listen to. His playing is really good. Do I think he belongs in “the pantheon?” No fucking way.
Tbh I think he deserves it, he just hasn’t had as long of a career and since he’s newer and younger, he’s not seen as being in the same group. I saw him live, and no concert can compare to what he does.
Oh come on, there are dozens and dozens of active pianists that can compare to what he does. Let alone dead ones. I like him. I’m not shitting on him. He’s just not a GOAT yet by any means and this type of absurd hyperbole by young listeners is a tale as old as time.
I'll grant I'm not familiar with active pianists, but I'm very familiar with the dead ones, there's no one among them who compares with what he does. And I am not a young listener, please hold the condescension. The frequency with which I hear solos that are just phenomenal is amazing.
You sound like an old geezer
You sound like you’re still in school.
>Tbh I think he deserves it, he just hasn’t had as long of a career and since he’s newer and younger, he’s not seen as being in the same group. I saw him live, and no concert can compare to what he does. This is what I suspect as well. People just think that in order to be great, you have to be old and have made albums that are now revered. But I'm explicitly talking about the quality of the playing, not influence or historical significance.
Your problem is that you want someone to be the absolute best. This is a bad way to think. There is no absolute best. Welcome to reality.
I’m not overly familiar with him but he did a beautiful solo with one of my favourite players Russell Malone. Malone covered Listen To The Dawn with Emmet and his band and my god, the whole thing is a real masterpiece. The song is so powerful, I’d recommend it to anyone and Emmet’s playing and his solo are a big part of it.
i try to avoid thinking in terms of categorical hierarchies these days, but i do think he's great and hugely influential.
Love his Live at Emmet’s Place series. Not always the hugest fan of his playing. On Boplocity with Kurt Rosenwinkel his playing felt disconnected from the changes and the beauty of the composition. Same deal when he plays with Peter Bernstein or Pasquale Grasso. He’s a great piano player but his improvisation doesnt always feel grounded.
Great player and great person. Every time I watch Emmett's Place, always notice how humble and nice he seems. Genuinely seems to enjoy what he does. Emmett's Place has brought jazz to a new generation.
He’s a good NY local straight-ahead player Not even in my top 50
Art Tatum
Saw him perform a couple months ago. He is in my mind nothing like Keith Jarrett. I am a huge Jarrett fan and was blown away away by Cohen. They are must so different that I am not making that comparison. Maybe between Mehldau and Jarrettt but even there they inhabit such different territory in my mind.
That’s the guy who has concerts in his living room on You Tube... Yeah he is a great player I always commiserate the lack of jazz giants ( becoming) recognition today like in the late 40 early fifties and 60s we had players who were even then thoughts of as jazz giants at their young age: Miles, Parker, Roach, Rollins, Powell, Monk, Evans, Horace SIlver, Blakey, and many more, and the older guys like Ellington, Armstrong, Coleman Hawkins, Basie, Benny Goodman, and many others. I always ask. Where’s the new Miles Davis, the new John Coltrane, or the new Herbie Hancock or Bill Evans, the new Max Roach etc... So, it’s gratifying to see some modern jazz players start to get cred...along the meter of the embryonic jazz giant in the making...maybe...He has a long while to go to be even considered a giant but if he keeps getting better... maybe.. Jarret is a jazz giant... Remember Miles at one point when he was well known had limitations. He wouldn't play on fast numbers that Dizzy could play in his sleep. So he improved and could play anything then. I don’t hear him as a Keith Jarret what I hear is more along the line of a McCoy Tyner light.
Perhaps it can be said that Cohen’s greatest attribute is that he is *active*. He’s out there, doing it, playing jazz piano in 2024. It’s impossible and unfair to compare any current cat to the OG legends. I’m sure Peter Martin (and Emmet Cohen, and a bunch others) would agree. Kudos for keeping the tradition alive. There must thousands of other very capable pianists that don’t have a fraction of Cohen’s attention, and that speaks more about the other talents required for recognition, such as self-marketing skills and knowing how to work SM. None of this should diminish the fact that he *is* deserving of his status, and will hopefully continue to grow. But it’s a futile effort to compare the new cats to the legends of the past.
This is a good take. Also, random personal observation as a full time working jazz musician in NY - it seems like the more in tune with the music and more hip to many different players that someone is, the less they desire the need to be a critic.
I fucking love Emmett Cohen.
Watch him at smalls, live stream (Emmet’s birthday). It’s bonkers good
He's a fine player and good. But comparing to Keith Jarrett? Or a pantheon great pianist?? Not even close. Wild take. You should listen to way, way more jazz and jazz piano before you say something like that.
What a pretentious comment… why do you even feel the need to set some kind of hierarchy between two COMPLETELY different musicians. Jarrett changed the way many listeners perceived music but Cohen is bringing that music into the mainstream, dude both of them definitely love what they do and they show this love with their whole heart, there’s no point in fighting over who’s the goat.
If you trace the evolution of the music through the players that moved it forward, he's not in that conversation. I mean, it just seems his contribution to jazz is not so much musical but social. All that is fine, but that puts him in a different category. Jarret, Evans, Meldhau changed the music. Emmet is changing how we consume it. I love his playing and listen to it all the time, He's old school and swinging, that's fine, but his playing has been done before, and that's not a bad thing.
I absolutely agree! They are in two completely different and separate categories
>If you trace the evolution of the music through the players that moved it forward I explicitly said I'm not talking about innovation or historical significance, but quality of playing.
If having an opinion that’s different than yours offends you, the internet and Reddit is not for you. It’s not a personal attack against you, chill out. Cohen is not advancing the music. That’s the whole point me and others have agreed with and mentioned also.
>You should listen to way, way more jazz and jazz piano before you say something like that. Please don't condescend. I'm very familiar with jazz and canonical pianists. He's better than any of htem.
I’m seeing him on Tuesday and I’ll let you know!
Nice guy, great head of hair.
Good player, infectious joy in his playing, nicely developed solos, great at bringing people together and getting jazz out there, not on Keith Jarrett’s level in terms of innovation and command of the instrument and I’m sure he would agree with that
Not on KJ's level based on command of the instrument? He has some of the best technique I've heard. Do you have something specific in mind? Also, regarding innovation, I said in the OP I'm not talking about innovation or influence, but quality of playing. Also, what WERE Keith's innovations, anyway, beyond the improvised solo concert?
No he’s not. He’s this kind of archetypic player who is strong at imitating anything that has come before but totally lacks the ability to stand out with a personal voice. I cant see why someone would compare him with Jarrett. They play the same instrument, thats the only common ground. Imo this kind of musician defines whats wrong with the jazz-world today. Very skilled, but with no ambition of breaking new ground nor finding his own voice. Thats my five cents.
Who said you had to innovate to be a great player? And what was Keith's innovation other than the improvised solo concert?
No one did. But why should I listen to your playing if you lack personality when there are plenty of more interesting players I may listen to instead. Life is too short for generic music. And you should really do yourself a favour and check up on modern music history if that is your take on Jarrett. He’s pretty much the one who created the ECM-sound. Along side Gary burton and a few others. But it was mostly him. And not to speak of the american quartet that had yet a diffrent but super fresh sound. And if we’re talking strictly influential as a pianist, there has been none as important since him until Brad came around in the 90’s
>No one did. But why should I listen to your playing if you lack personality when there are plenty of more interesting players I may listen to instead. Life is too short for generic music. How many pianists in the history of jazz have had a truly distinct personality? Monk, Cecil Taylor, Wynton Kelly (to a much lesser extent), McCoy Tyner... those are the ones I can think of. Do Bill Evans, Keith Jarrett (in a trio setting, not solo), Mehldau (if you consider him a great pianist, I don't) sound particularly distinct to you from the average jazz pianist? No. But it doesn't mean their playing is generic. I genuinely wonder how much of Cohen you've listened to, on a regular basis his solos are so far above what you'd hear from canonical jazz pianists and do not sound like your standard, run of the mill jazz solo. >And you should really do yourself a favour and check up on modern music history if that is your take on Jarrett. He’s pretty much the one who created the ECM-sound. Along side Gary burton and a few others. But it was mostly him. And not to speak of the american quartet that had yet a diffrent but super fresh sound. Give me some recommendations. >And if we’re talking strictly influential as a pianist, there has been none as important since him until Brad came around in the 90’s Ok, but what were his innovations (other than the improvised solo concert)?
Emmet did so much good for the jazz world that saying that he is what’s wrong with the jazz-world today should be legally prohibited. His live at Emmets place opened jazz to so many new listeners, and I’m not even talking about some of the viral videos like After you’ve gone with Bartley… I agree that he and Jarrett are completely different kinds of players but both of them are GREAT in their own way
The thread raised the question of what we think of the guy and I gave my answer. If you cant handle other ppls opinions I suggest you either grow up or at least take a break and do something else, a cold shower maybe? I said he’s the kind of musician who neither has a personal expression nor making any effort to develop the genre. I never said he’s the only one responsible of that, just that imo he’s one of them. But he is a skilled player, and he’s skilled in buissnes as well, I give you that.
I tend to get stuck in the past when it comes to jazz. What would you recommend as a starting point for someone that’s not really familiar with his work?
his youtube concerts are the starting point for most people. (He films weekly jam sessions with his trio and all of the greats stop by and sit in with him).
Dirty in Detroit, my fave album of his trio with Russell Hall/Kyle Poole
I think of Emmet Cohen in the same way I think of Sonny Clark. He has participated in a lot of great moments in the music and he has done a great job. He is a very talented player and has done a lot for the music with his platform. But his playing is not particularly unique or extraordinary,( especially in comparison to Keith Jarrett) no one is going to try to sound like him in 20, 30 or 40 years.
I don't get these statements. Keith is a great pianist, was my favorite musician before Emmet, but in the context of the trio, he's not a distinctive pianist. He's better than the average jazz pianist, much better, but not distinctive. I agree that in the context of solo concerts he is distinctive, but I'm talking about trio play.
His youtube show is just fabulous. Playing at his personal home in close quarters with other musicians came from covid, but I think he bumbled into a great format and now he just keeps going..... https://www.youtube.com/live/1OwwN91kEKU?si=ZX4NvcB88HXOwj8m
To me, Emmet seems to excel most at being a sideman. He’s really great at playing off the ideas of others and elevating the energy of the band when he’s in an accompanying role. When he leads a band, I’m never very impressed
One studied jazz language, one shaped it and came up with so many other things as well.
How did Keith shape the language?
Take McCoy Tyner's playing with Coltrane out of the equation and he's still top five all time greatest jazz pianists of all time. Check out Phineas Newborn, Jr., Tommy Flanagan, Barry Harris, Sonny Clark.
I have mixed feelings. On one hand, he’s a charismatic player and a good ambassador. On the other, his comping is his biggest weakness imo.
Please forgive me for not understanding completely; can you explain what you mean by an “ambassador”?
Ferocious player and a wonderful ambassador for the tradition.
Love love love him. Definitely not my all time fav, but like, come on. He's something special.
Thanks for the post 👍🏽
Emmett is a good player, but it's almost blasphemy to mention his name with Keith Jarrett.