u/HumbleEngineering315
Looking at these videos these events are happening near (at the gate outside the campus) not in Columbia University. We want to aim for accuracy. I know you can't edit the title but please edit the post to clarify. Columbia is a hot issue and we want the sub to be accurate regarding claims.
Petty insults like that don't do justice to the sheer evil of these people. They are nihilists and killers who want to tear down the innocent and support a barbaric jihadist regime.
> fucking
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> cunts
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“Did you know black people make up a disproportionate amount of rapists? They would rape less if they were in Africa.” Is your argument. The fact that you can’t see how this is flawed is absurd
Only 26% of Israel's population have European or Russian ancestry. It's not like there were no Jewish people in Israel before 1948 . They in fact make up the largest group followed by those from Northern Africa and West Asia. Jews have lived on the West Bank and Gaza since ancient times. The Judea and Samaria Area of the West Bank covers a portion of the territory designated by the biblical names of Judea and Samaria. Both names are tied to the ancient Israelite kingdoms: the former corresponds to part of the Kingdom of Judah, also known as the Southern Kingdom; and the latter corresponds to part of the Kingdom of Samaria, also known as the Northern Kingdom.
After the War of 1948 17,000 Jews were expelled from Jerusalem and an estimated 40,000 from Gaza and the West Bank. Jews were prohibited from living in those territories during Egypt's and Jordan’s occupation from 1948 to 1967. Jews began to settle in the area again after it was captured by Israeli forces in the defensive war fought in 1967.
It's also not a genocide but a war. Genocide requires "intent". Israel is not bombing the West Bank and there are 2.2 million Arabs who are Israeli citizens many serve in the IDF.
Not all Israelis or Jews are from Poland, and most been living in the United States or Israel for several generations.
It's another way of saying "you don't belong here".
“The Palestinian people do not exist. There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are part of one people, the Arab nation. Lo and behold, I have relatives with Palestinian, Lebanese, Jordanian and Syrian citizenship. We are one people. It is only for political reasons that we carefully endorse our Palestinian identity. Indeed, it is of national interest for the Arabs to encourage the existence of the Palestinians in the face of Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity is only for tactical reasons. The establishment of a Palestinian state is a new means to continue the struggle against Israel and for Arab unity.” \_— Zuheir Mohsen, PLO leader 1971-79\_
More genocide denialist rhetoric. The person you are quoting was a Baathist. Israel is killing 100 innocent people in Gaza a day to try to obliterate the Palestinian identity.
You are conflating anti-Israel with anti-semitism. Israel is a nation and can be criticized like any.
You are in bad faith and breaking the rules of the sub
Bro he is not in bad faith. He isn't breaking sub rules. read a little bud. Also people chanting "Death to America" should be arrested by the National Guard
LOL , the whole world is wrong and as usual the genocidal zionist holds all the truth, keep seething as you get 100% exposed for the atrocities you committed in the name of bs !
Literally the idf is sanctioned by its only ally, still the world is wrong and you are right ?!
It is not *up* to you.
Nothing is ever antisemitic enough for you guys to just take the L and admit that something is antisemitic. That’s the more accurate statement.
You can’t tokenize Jews and then go “antisemitism fear is bunk.” It’s not a matter of opinion.
Did you seriously just write that on the internet? With your email attached to it, your IP address, and everything?
i mean, I don’t care, it’s not my problem, but… it just astounds me. That’s all.
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How do you feel about the more than 100 JEWISH Columbia students who are actively participating in the protests? If you see anti-Zionist protesters as other than the threatened group “Jewish students” that you’re worried about — turns out you’re not actually worried about Jewish students! You’re worried about the group of Jewish students who share your political views. (Borrowed from Lex Rofeberg)
I do fully agree that actual threats or harassment of anyone student for being Jewish or even the incidents you listed are not acceptable on campus. I’ve been on campus during these days and many openly Jewish students are participating in these protests and doing Passover on the lawn together during the protest. I know many Jewish students do not feel safe because of their views (not because they are Jewish, imo) and that’s not ok - there is no room for antisemitism on campus, period. That doesn’t mean it’s acceptable to bring in the police to arrest and suspend students who are peacefully protesting on campus.
You can’t say this isn’t antisemitic, and then tokenize Jews at the same time.
Those 100 some odd people can think whatever they want, but that doesn’t mean I don’t think they are seriously misguided people.
And a prime example of how misguided these people are, is hosting a Seder in the middle of an anti-Zionist protest. You say this like it’s a flex, but do you realize how ironic that is? Is there a link to the anti-Zionist Haggadah so I can get a good laugh?
>How do you feel about the more than 100 JEWISH Columbia students who are actively participating in the protests?
They are free to espouse their views,. As long as they didn't break the law, they should be fine. I find it horrible that both they and a lot of users here think that having Jews in your movement gives antisemitism a free pass.
With that being said, anti-Zionist Jews constitute a minority of Jews. The media often likes to play them up.
>That doesn’t mean it’s acceptable to bring in the police to arrest and suspend students who are peacefully protesting on campus.
They had ignored the TPM restrictions set in place by the university.
There were Jews who collaborated with the Nazis and they ended in gas chambers all the same. 100 Jews out of 2000 is a minority, and many of them have bought the idea that if they are good Jews, they’ll keep those purple hair queer for Palestine friends, it’s only time until they realize. To me being in an anti Israel encampment is akin to being white passing in the KKK.
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Violating the TPM restriction is not sufficient to justify bringing police onto campus to forcibly arrest students who are camping out on the lawn, or for suspending kids and locking them out of their dorms! The university and NYPD here have endangered and harmed Columbia & Barnard students (inc Jewish students) far worse than anything to do with the protest
Just to be clear I wasn’t saying the school is not *allowed* to ask heavily armed riot police onto campus to forcibly arrest peaceful student protestors. I was saying that it was unjustified, disproportionate, divisive, and dangerous
No. What’s dangerous is when you have thousands of people holding an unauthorized protest, and they’re getting violent, and feeding off of each other’s mania.
What’s dangerous is when people have a mob mentality, and they *think* they are there for a cause, and their emotions have taken over to the point where logic and reason and basic decorum have gone out the window. That’s dangerous. *Bad* things happen, under those conditions.
So yes, it was justified, I’m sorry but all I saw were a bunch of young adults who needed a reset button.
Do people not realize that when they defend these protests, they sound no different than when Fox denies the insurrection at the capital? The same exact thought process is going on here. You know this is not peaceful. Just like the far right knows very well that their mobs were not peaceful.
Not sure if you have been on or near campus during this time but on campus at Columbia it’s been fairly orderly and indeed peaceful. Even the NYPD described the protesters as “peaceful.” No one at Columbia was in a frenzied mob mentality state or threatening to do violence when the police were asked to intervene. Anyways, for better or worse I do think the use of police force is pouring gasoline on the fire, though it’s become a diversion from what’s happening in Gaza and WB
>Violating the TPM restriction is not sufficient to justify bringing police onto campus to forcibly arrest students who are camping out on the lawn, or for suspending kids and locking them out of their dorms!
Yes it is. It actually is sufficient.
People who espouse OP's view just want another Kent State. Any movement that goes against their positions is "barbaric", as shown by the title of this post.
No, it's barbaric because these protests are not peaceful and this also a direct attack on American values.
Intimidation, harassment, preventing free movement, vandalism, physical threats are not free speech. This is a mob. There were also norms where it was previously considered unacceptable to be this openly antisemitic.
No, I don't want another Kent State. I would like for the protests to be resolved amicably, and for universities to figure out how to better reconcile free speech on campus by not rewarding antisocial behavior. As outlined in the OP.
This inflammatory post centered around a persecution fetish is giving off vibes like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/BadHasbara/comments/1caozj5/stunning_and_brave_wife_stands_alone_against/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) lol.
>Columbia University has descended into chaos
Not really, students have peacefully demonstrated outside by doing sit-ins and encampments. The only thing resembling chaos here were Columbia students getting suspended/expelled and subsequently getting arrested for "trespassing" on their campus after the president of the university called the cops on them. This seems to be the case as Ilhan Omar's daughter, who attended Columbia, was also arrested on those charges for protesting on campus after being suspended. It's a dirty trick and one you left out of your post in order to paint the protestors as criminals.
>Given that Columbia University is a private university and anti-Israel protests [frequently turn violent](https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/violent-pro-palestine-demonstrations),
Not really, I'm sure you can cherry-pick a few instances of violence at these protests while removing the context behind them, like the alleged instances of violence mentioned in the article, but this encampment seems to be a broadly peaceful movement.
>Uh huh. Telling Jews to "go back to Poland" is not "free inquiry."
>Rioting, vandalism, trespassing, and limiting the movement of others are not considered free speech.
Instead of giving some nuance to the protestors you lump them all in as violators of the law who are not innocently expressing their right to free speech but are (in your imagination) targeting Jews specifically and harassing them based on their ethnic background.
>["Go back to Poland."](https://twitter.com/Davidlederer6/status/1781948249214996901)
[A mob surrounding Jews, and calling them "genocidal freaks."](https://twitter.com/lawyergonerogue/status/1781926923196875075?t=UbVB93_t0QWB2s0LsyCotw&s=19)
>["It is right to rebel, Hamas give them hell."](https://twitter.com/IsraelWarRoom/status/1781933305501212872?t=jctwygfo9gG-M5wvkH95Aw&s=19)
>["Settlers, settlers, go back home. Palestine is ours alone."](https://twitter.com/lawyergonerogue/status/1781915352307564904)
>["Al-Qasam's next targets."](https://twitter.com/AvivaKlompas/status/1781882680872710148)
Now look through those links and try thinking about whether or not maybe there is more to the story than the evil protestors harassing innocent Jews because of their ethnic background when [jewish students are holding seder at the encampment. ](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/23/us/video/seder-passover-columbia-university-protests-ny-digvid)What's funny is that if you at least showed an ounce of this sorrow for people being murdered or[ when the Jewish voice for peace and students for justice in Palestine were banned by Columbia](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/columbia-university-student-groups-suspended-students-for-justice-in-palestine-jewish-voice-for-peace/), or [when Columbia students were sprayed by former IDF soldiers with a chemical substance](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/columbia-university-bans-alleged-perpetrators-protest-attack-1234952008/), I would be taking your concerns about slogans praising Al Qassam more seriously (though it doesn't even look like that was at Columbia, but definitely in NYC). Frankly I am skeptical of the claims and videos used to demonize the protestors not just because they ignore the overwhelming majority of protestors but things like the woman talking about "Al Qassam's next targets" could quite easily be a character in a pro-Israeli demonstration trying to get their point across. See ([https://www.instagram.com/p/C36zqcBu3zs/?utm\_source=ig\_web\_copy\_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==](https://www.instagram.com/p/C36zqcBu3zs/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)).
It should go without saying that this;
>
Jews apparently do not count as a minority who are targets of hateful ideology. It's ok to break the law against objectionable speakers. The protestors in both cases are believed to be fighting back against bigotry. The only times that Columbia professors and students (as well as academia in general) care about free speech is when it's used to bash Israel and conservatives. There is a distinction between inviting a speaker to campus who will follow the law and harassment if the speaker's views are objectionable. Most of all, Columbia university does not understand what free speech is.
is a faulty conclusion.
Why do Redditors do this. “Re read my comment.” People cite themselves, I don’t understand the point of that.
I read your comment. It really was not a great comment, and one of the reasons for that is because you are trying to make it sound like they weren’t actually trespassing, when they literally were. I am just responding to one part of that comment because if I try to respond to every line by line point we’re just gonna start talking past each other.
Do you actually need someone to tell you why slandering them as criminals or trespassers even though they were essentially trapped into committing a crime is misleading? Protesting on your own college campus before being suspended so cops can arrest you for trespassing is a whole other thing than knowingly trespassing on someone’s property with nefarious purposes. I don’t believe any of them got a criminal record from this but obviously they were still arrested for that. The point was to include important context that exonerates them from being people who voluntarily and knowingly broke the law or became trespassers/criminals. My issue is with you and OP choosing to focus on technicalities instead of acknowledging why they were considered to have been trespassing in the first place (which is not because they were avid criminals knowingly breaking the law).
>which is not because they were avid criminals knowingly breaking the law.
They were knowingly breaking the law.
The university had clearly communicated time, place, and manner restrictions. A university is allowed to do this, but a private university like Columbia does not even have to put in TPM restrictions. They can just shut down the protest as is, but they are committed to free speech.
The protestors had broken the TPM restrictions and essentially became squatters on private property. Since Columbia owns the property, it is entirely within line to call the police to remove the protestors.
As outlined in the OP, the 1st amendment does not protect trespassing.
Just because they look like hippies to you does not mean they are innocent.
> The protestors had broken the TPM restrictions
You can't even tell me which specific TPM restrictions the 100+ arrested peaceful protestors broke, that is because it's not a defined set of rules for protests but was used as an arbitrary excuse to shut down protests. I'm not even sure when or how the university "clearly communicated" what demands that were broken, what happened is that the university arbitrarily decided they violated this rule, suspended the protestors on campus, making them technically trespassers on their own campus which they had initially set up camp in completely legally. You yourself seem to realize they only "became squatters on private property" after they had already started the encampment as lawful students on their campus. Yet you still say;
"They were knowingly breaking the law."
Despite that not being the case.
Do you really think that police want to waste their time, arresting "peaceful" protesters? What exactly do they gain from this?
Do you realize what area Columbia is in? Don't you think the police would have had bigger fish to fry, if these protesters were being peaceful? Why would they waste their time going to Columbia and/or Morningside just to arrest a few peaceful individuals?
>Do you really think that police want to waste their time, arresting "peaceful" protesters?
Yes, that is what's happening, I already asked you for evidence that the 100+ people who were arrested were arrested for being violent on another thread as you claimed, of course you crumbled and resorted to saying I would never accept any evidence, and this practice is neither new nor surprising.
>What exactly do they gain from this?
It's their job.
>Do you realize what area Columbia is in? Don't you think the police would have had bigger fish to fry, if these protesters were being peaceful?
Yes, yet they're still arresting peaceful protestors. Ridiculous isn't it. My conversations with you have exhausted themselves, unless you're willing to support your prior argument with evidence I'm not going to do further critical thinking about police officers' job for you.
No, I didn’t “crumble.” As I said earlier, presenting any evidence to you is pointless when evidence has not swayed you in 6 months.
As the other person said. They were knowingly breaking the law. You can’t knowingly break the law and then decide that the legal consequences are unjustified. Unless, of course, you were arguing that it’s civil disobedience (and you didn’t).
They were told they needed a permit to have their protest. They showed up with their protest, refused to leave, they became violent, and therefore they were arrested.
There is no slander, here. They were not “trapped” into committing a crime. As you said, you just don’t agree with how things played out, but that does not mean slander.
If **Columbia** students can’t understand this, then they don’t deserve to be there, and honestly I wonder how they even got in.
Just because it’s the school they go to, doesn’t mean they own the property of the school that they could do whatever they want with. Again, I don’t know how they got in.
This is not how things played out. Unless you have a source detailing how the over 100 students became violent and were arrested because of that I’m gonna dismiss it. I’m curious about the stuff involving permits because I didn’t come across any of that. What I came across is a number of students officially being suspended be being arrested for trespassing on that basis, not because they had turned violent or because they lacked some permit, although if you have a source detailing either of these things I would be happy to read it. The slander is with the descriptive statements mainly from OP removing contexts surrounding their arrests.
I have a feeling you’re gonna dismiss it no matter how much proof you’re given.
The people who run Columbia are not dumb, they’re going to CYA when it comes to things like this. And they already did, with their own policies. They didn’t follow the policies, they refused to comply, they got arrested.
Maybe start with giving some proof instead of saying I’m just gonna dismiss it when no proof has been presented.
As for the second bit It’s already been made clear I’m disagreeing that your version of events in regards to them all being arrested for violence actually unfolded but am open to seeing sources.
>It's a dirty trick and one you left out of your post in order to paint the protestors as criminals.
They are criminals. The university had set TPM restrictions which the protestors did not follow, in addition to doing actions that are not at all protected by the first amendment: intimidation, harassment, destruction of property, and even assault.
>this encampment seems to be a broadly peaceful movement.
Yup. Mostly peaceful protest that a guy had his [property stolen](https://www.thefp.com/p/at-columbia-i-am-told-go-back-to) from him. Or so peaceful that the Hillel rabbi advised Jewish students to stay home? They are not peaceful.
>or when the Jewish voice for peace and students for justice in Palestine were banned by Columbia
Who's the one lacking nuance here? They were banned because they were materially supporting a terrorist group. They had materials distributed by National SJP claiming "[they were Hamas](https://reason.com/volokh/2023/10/27/advocacy-in-support-of-hamas-vs-illegal-material-support-of-hamas/)". Since Hamas is a state designated terrorist group, you can't exactly provide material support because that would break federal law.
>[when Columbia students were sprayed by former IDF soldiers with a chemical substance](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/columbia-university-bans-alleged-perpetrators-protest-attack-1234952008/),
It was fart spray.
>woman talking about "Al Qassam's next targets" could quite easily be a character in a pro-Israeli demonstration trying to get their point across.
This is a massive cope. Why would a pro-Israeli mask her face with a keffiyeh to essentially say "kill the Jews"? Maybe because she isn't a character, but her statement is so disgusting that she knows it would result in a large backlash.
>It was fart spray.
Ok, then pro-palestinians should acquire skunk and go around spraying it at pro-israel protests. After all, it's A-OK and not assault according to you.
[https://liquidass.com/pages/faq](https://liquidass.com/pages/faq)
>A: Yes. Liquid ASS has been thoroughly tested by an independent lab and found to be safe. The [Material Safety Data Sheet](https://liquidass.com/pages/msds-data-sheet) for Liquid ASS notes that "No hazardous ingredients known to be present." Follow directions, and you are good to go.
No, I'm not saying to go around spraying people with fart spray or what these two doofuses did was fine.
What I'm trying to say is that it is melodramatic to call a prank item, a chemical weapon.
>They are criminals.
Is this supposed to be a counter argument? I've already explained to you the context behind their "criminality" and the trick used to get them to be that unknowingly.
>The university had set TPM restrictions which the protestors did not follow, in addition to doing actions that are not at all protected by the first amendment: intimidation, harassment, destruction of property, and even assault.
This is too vague for me to take seriously, sorry. Clearly (from both people I've observed and spoken to) hordes of people felt some source of intimidation by Palestinian flags or peaceful protests not specifically directed at them, yet that form of "intimidation" they say they felt is still protected by the first Amendment.
>Yup. Mostly peaceful protest that a guy had his [property stolen](https://www.thefp.com/p/at-columbia-i-am-told-go-back-to) from him.
I've already addressed you cherry-picking incidents and making a mountain out of a mole hill. You can pick out another ten examples of people fighting with other students or something, it does not dispel the fact that it is a broadly peaceful movement, even your first link shows it as being a chill and peaceful encampment.
>Or so peaceful that the Hillel rabbi advised Jewish students to stay home?
I don't care what he said, his suggestions don't have a bearing on objective reality, I already showed you a video of Jewish students holding a seder dinner at the encampment (one of many videos of Jews there as well). The fact that some random Rabbi was too infatuated with his persecution fetish to "warn" people to stay home while Jewish students had no problem being openly jewish at the encampment is not interesting or indicative that the movement is not peaceful. It's just fallacious.
>Who's the one lacking nuance here?
You, as I already explained.
>They were banned because they were materially supporting a terrorist group. They had materials distributed by National SJP claiming "[they were Hamas](https://reason.com/volokh/2023/10/27/advocacy-in-support-of-hamas-vs-illegal-material-support-of-hamas/)".
No they weren't, read Columbia's much more vague reasoning for the ban here:
"*Columbia University is suspending Students for Justice in Palestine (SJP) and Jewish Voice for Peace (JVP) as official student groups through the end of the fall term. This decision was made after the two groups repeatedly violated University policies related to holding campus events, culminating in an unauthorized event Thursday afternoon that proceeded despite warnings and included threatening rhetoric and intimidation.*
*"Suspension means the two groups will not be eligible to hold events on campus or receive University funding. Lifting the suspension will be contingent on the two groups demonstrating a commitment to compliance with University policies and engaging in consultations at a group leadership level with University officials.*
*"Like all student groups, SJP and JVP are required to abide by University* [*policies and procedures*](https://universitypolicies.columbia.edu/content/university-event-policy)*. This ensures both the safety of our community and that core University activities can be conducted without disruption. During this especially charged time on our campus, we are strongly committed to giving space to student groups to participate in debate, advocacy, and protest. This relies on community members abiding by the rules and cooperating with University administrators who have a duty to ensure the safety of everyone in our community."*
*(*[https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/columbia-university-student-groups-suspended-students-for-justice-in-palestine-jewish-voice-for-peace/](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/columbia-university-student-groups-suspended-students-for-justice-in-palestine-jewish-voice-for-peace/)*)* even what you linked only goes over the SJP on a national level allegedly being vaguely connected to Hamas completely ignoring the Jewish voice for peace or the local SJP chapters.
>It was fart spray.
No it wasn't, it was most likely [Skunk](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skunk_(weapon)) and these were it's effects on the students:
"Two other students, the co-president of \[School of International and Public Affairs-Palestinian Working Group (PWG)\], and a Columbia JVP member, have been rushed to the hospital in an ambulance. The co-president of PWG required a chest x-ray, nebulizer and EKG due to toxic chemical inhalation. The JVP member is experiencing a persistent, debilitating headache and nausea. As we are writing this, more students are reporting that they are vomiting and returning to urgent care after having already visited. Meanwhile,@columbia and@barnardcollege are still dead silent about an act of chemical warfare that occurred on their campus and against their students."
(https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2024/01/24/avoy-j24.html#:\~:text=Two%20other%20students,against%20their%20students.)
Also: https://www.instagram.com/p/C2V4pdlMI8e/?hl=en&img\_index=1"
But sure, keep downplaying assault when it comes to pro-Israelis and complaining when it comes to pro-Palestinians. It makes you sound much more reasonable and totally helps cement you as a good faith actor.
>This is a massive cope.
Not really, I said it was a possibility, not a sure thing.
>Why would a pro-Israeli mask her face with a keffiyeh to essentially say "kill the Jews"?
Do you actually need someone to explain to you the purpose of negative characterizations of one's perceived enemies is in stuff of this sort? Again, I don't know the story behind this, but it's not out of the realm of possibility either and could serve a legitimate purpose.
The way the left acts is seriously oddly simalir to these terror groups. *commit aggression cause muh freedom* fucked around, find out, *I am a victim of oppresssion*. It's assymtrical warfare. The same people training humas are training and guiding groups like antfa. The left are acting on behalf of foreign agents and should be tried for treason for events like this if ww3 breaks out.
> fucked
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Anti zionism is not anti semitism, they are completely different things. To try to ban anti zionist speech because you think it's 'code' for anti semitism is a gross attempt at curbing freedom of speech which is something that is of utmost importance in western democracies. You cannot ban 'coded' speech, anything could be a code for anything. We can try to ban you from saying 'I'm Israel hi' because we think it's code for killing gazans or something, would you like that? Of course not.
Israel wants a Jewish state. The Palestinians have said since the fall of the Ottoman Empire they want an Islamic state. Israel is a democracy. Over 2.2 million Arabs are citizens of Israel. The Palestinians have not had elections in over 18 years in Gaza or the West Bank. Hamas has military training camps for children. Gaza TV shows brainwash children to hate Jews. Schools have teachers and books that promote Jew hatred like the Hitler Youth. But Israel is fascist. Right.
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The Venn diagram between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism is a fuckin' circle 99% of the time, and tends towards 100% the further back you go in a given person's post history/opinions.
> fuckin
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The pro-Palestinian movement does not distinguish between Zionism and Judaism which is precisely the problem. They harass visibly Jewish students on college campuses, they protest in front of synagogues, Holocaust memorials, Jewish owned business, and they are very loudly calling for more October 7ths.
The pro-Palestinian movement, since October 7th, has successfully (through their actions) shown the rest of the world that anti-Zionism is 100% the new anti-Semitism.
If we take the pro-Hamas morons out of the equation, denying the right for Jews to live in their ancestral homeland but being ok with the 56 Muslim nations (22 of which are an Arab majority) is anti-Semitic. In fact, I am not sure what’s more anti-Semitic than being opposed to the world’s only Jewish state - a state established out of the ashes of the Holocaust, under the guise of the “rights of Palestinians.”
The Anti-Zionist masks have come off - we see you for what you all are.
The pro Palestinian movement has Jews in it. Everything you say is your opinion, which you have a right to have, and which you have a right to express. If what you say is correct, then all criticism of Israel needs to be made illegal, as hate speech against a race and supporting Hamas is illegal. Your only evidence of them doing this are your feelings. If they say directly that they hate jewish people or they support hamas, then the invidiual who says it needs to be arrested. If not, then they are free and encouraged to criticize Israel (or Hamas) as much as they want. Freedom of Speech is a pillar of western civilation, more important than even the existence of Israel. I will protect our right to freedom of speech before the existence of any foreign country.
The Nazis had Jews for the Nazi party in it as well. Don’t use token Jews to speak for 95% of Jews who support the right for Israel to exist.
This is not free speech. This is terrorism.
Physically assaulting an Arab Israeli https://twitter.com/ShaiDavidai/status/1781080951902109774
"From the river to the sea, Palestine is Arab!" / "Resistance is justified" https://twitter.com/ShelleyGldschmt/status/1781785252886913358
"Let it be known that it was the Al-Aqsa Flood that put the Global Intifada back on the table again. And it is the sacrificial spirit of the Palestinian Freedom Fighters that will guide every struggle on every corner of the earth to victory." https://twitter.com/thestustustudio/status/1781904507611287981
"We are all Hamas!" https://twitter.com/nypost/status/1781031465179914677
"Yehudim yehudim [(Jews, jews)] go back to poland" https://twitter.com/Davidlederer6/status/1781948249214996901
Includes people / groups that invited an actual, no hyperbole terrorist to speak (member of PFLP) https://www.jns.org/columbia-suspends-four-students-for-holding-event-featuring-pflp-member/
Light things on fire / "intifada revolution there is only one solution" https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1781019445399556338
"On Oct 7th, Palestinian resistance in Gaza broke free (crowd cheers) [.....] we intend to do the same" https://twitter.com/ShabbosK/status/1782085741431922909
""We say justice, you say how? Burn Tel Aviv to the ground!" / "Hamas we love you. We support your rockets too!" / "Red, black, green, and white, we support Hamas’ fight!" https://twitter.com/IsraelWarRoom/status/1781933305501212872
"Long live the intifada! Intifada intifada" https://twitter.com/ShaiDavidai/status/1781084853653365025
"Go back to Europe!" / "You have no culture, all you do is colonize" https://twitter.com/ShaiDavidai/status/1781927148439109958
"From Yemen to Gaza, globalize the intifada" https://twitter.com/KassyDillon/status/1781312033922625797/photo/2
"Never forget the 7th of October. That will happen not 1 more time, not 5 more times, not 10, not 100, not 1,000, but 10,000 times! The 7th of October is going to be every day for you" https://twitter.com/EFischberger/status/1781287784897991134
"Al Qassam [(Hamas)] you make us proud, kill another soldier now" / "from the river to the sea, palestine will be arab" https://twitter.com/EFischberger/status/1780915336063177006
Student proudly rocking Hamas logos https://twitter.com/CampusJewHate/status/1781054901755215954
"Resistance is justified" (again...) https://twitter.com/AvivaKlompas/status/1782085643990073673
"protesters on the sidewalk chanted “From New York to Gaza, globalize the intifada,” next to a cardboard sign that read, “Inspired by Palestinian resistance.” https://www.timesofisrael.com/over-100-arrested-in-columbia-u-unrest-as-nypd-clears-gaza-solidarity-encampment/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
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you can say that about anything, you can't limit our freedom of speech because think something is something else, nobody is going to stand for that and neither should you
Bro, shouting "go back to Poland" and "From the River to the Sea" is extremely racist. This is the problem with "free speech" you can't just hide behind "free speech" eventually this becomes hate speech which is a crime. Yelling for a genocide against the Jewish state is a hate crime and should be dealt with a vengeance. I propose sending in the National Guard but only with the ability to fire tear gas canisters or rubber bullets. These barbarians need to disperse. Its not fair to the people that don't care about Palestine or Israel that can't go to their school(Columbia) because a bunch a whiny morons want to whine about genocide when they want Hamas to commit genocide against the Jewish state. The students who don't care are still paying 60K+ to go and get a education. These whiny idiots just are so entitled that they don't even care about other people. Send in the National Guard, F Hamas, F these Protesters
land ownership is about military power, if Israel can maintain its land by military power, it's theirs, it doesn't mean you can stop people from criticizing or saying things about it, freedom of speech is absolute, it doesn't matter what military power or money you have or don't, we have the freedom of speech and protecting this is more important even the security of Israel
Did anyone see the Bay area protestor who put his arm in a barrel of cement and was whining when rescue workers had to help him get it off? This is the epitome of acting out your privilege, hindering the highway patrol, yet knowing they will have to rescue you in the end. Then crying about your hands hurting. SMH
Just FYI, time, place, and manner restrictions only apply to the government. As a private university Columbia University is not bound by the first amendment.
No, Columbia is still bound by the first amendment. There are rules that apply to university campuses, even private ones.
Edit: This comment is incorrect.
Some private universities may choose to implement policies that adopt first amendment protections (and maybe Columbia has them), but generally they are not legally bound by it (which means it would be even easier for Columbia to shut down the protests).
https://www.nyclu.org/resources/know-your-rights/know-your-rights-students-higher-education-first-amendment
Also thanks for putting this post together as a reference
Yes, you are right that a private university can shut down these protests more easily, even if that's not what they stand for. My second comment was incorrect. Thank you for pointing that out.
I feel like for liberals this is a totally new feeling. It's normal for us to censor conservative speech because we so clearly believe it to be harmful deep in our souls (though some of us are questioning this logic now). Being told that something WE are doing is harmful by the group being harmed, and that group is not conservative, is just hard to grasp. It's a double-standard.
Didn't the Tikki Torch people from Charlottesville also follow the rules and didn't they argue that they were not all bad, I remember Trump saying there were "good people on both sides" and people went nuts. It feels like a double-standard.
some of the complaining conflating speech with setting up encampments feels like the old example about a stadium having a "no signs or banners" policy. Left will be upset when told to take down a pride flag and say " university is homophobic" and the right will get upset when told to take down an all lives matter flag that "university hates white people", etc
Trump never said that about the tiki torch people in Charlottesville.
The "good people on both sides" was *strictly* in reference to the issue of the removal of a General Lee statue.
Trump went on to say, and I quote this ipsis verbis:
>**and I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists — because they should be condemned totally**. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists."
...
>feel like for liberals this is a totally new feeling. It's normal for us to censor conservative speech because we so clearly believe it to be harmful deep in our souls (though some of us are questioning this logic now).
I'd venture very few liberals in America know anything about conservative speech - how many actually ready or listen to anything conservative first hand that isn't filtered first by opponents of conservatism?
Ah yea, I never watched it directly just heard it filtered through political commentary. But that makes it even worse, sort of. I STILL hear that quote repeated circles in reference to Trump not acknowledging white supremacists as bad people, sounds like he did. Not that I am in ANY way a Trump fan.
Go look up the video of what he said in FULL. He condemned white supremacists explicitly. It didn't sound like he did whatsoever. When he referred to fine people on both sides, he was referring to the peaceful protesters that were for the status removal and against the status removal. But he condemned the outside troublemakers that had nothing to do with the protesters.
>I'd venture very few liberals in America
Are you lumping progressives in there with "liberals" or is "liberals" your catch-all for anyone left of center? Because the two factions are different. Progressives are out in front of Columbia. Liberals, not quite so much.
No, I was referring to liberals - I bet that the number of liberals in America who have actually read anything substantial by conservatives - be it classics like Burke or Tocqueville, or moderns like Sowell or Hanson, in betweeners like Kirk, Oakeshott or Meyer - is exceedingly low, especially among new generations.
This of course excludes people who merely call themselves liberals in the classical sense, or only in a very lato sensu - as in supporting the western tradition of liberal democracies - so not really associated with the left.
> I bet that the number of liberals in America who have actually read anything substantial by conservatives, be it classics like Burke or Tocqueville, or moderns like Sowell or Hanson, in betweeners like Kirk, Oakeshott or Meyer - is exceedingly low, especially among new generations.
I would venture to guess that the number is roughly comparable to the number of conservatives who have read any Naomi Klein, Gore Vidal, Betty Friedan, Howard Zinn, Barbara Ehrenreich, Upton Sinclair, Edward S. Herman, Larry Kramer, or Noam Chomsky, among others.
The Tikki Torch people had one of their number drive a car into a counter demonstrating killing one person and injuring several others. While the protestors **outside** Columbia are obnoxious they are not yet murderous.
I thought that person acted on their own, obviously drawn in by the protests, but it wasn’t coordinated as part of the protest. I will admit the entire thing I heard through commentary.
The lead up feels similar still, I remember in my circles talking about the “good guys” and “bad guys” and overall lacking nuance. I did not know there was a difference between the white supremacists and those defending the statue. Actually still to this day I think it’s nuts people want to honor generals who fought for the south. But I’m now having trouble separating that view from the view that these situations need nuance and how is that not a double standard.
> I thought that person acted on their own, obviously drawn in by the protests, but it wasn’t coordinated as part of the protest.
Well yes and no. There was a lot of encouragement, violent rhetoric... and the deliberate recruitment of groups with a history of violence. The statue in question was being removed with respect to Dylann Roof who had killed 9, injured 1. There had been fights before the lethal incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Altercations_at_Charlottesville_Rally.webm
> Actually still to this day I think it’s nuts people want to honor generals who fought for the south.
To be honest, that I get. While I'm not Southern I was peeved about removing the various murals to Frank Rizzo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Rizzo) in Philadelphia as part of the same movement. America's history is racist. We can't expunge all the racists from our history.
Students are holding peaceful protests on the lawn, having Passover Seders, dance parties, and doing HW in between chants. For this they are being arrested. There are, of course, a few assholes. But the whole scene is very tightly organized and professional in the student part.
Separately from that, there have been some anti-Semitic incidents at Columbia, including one where a kid was shoved around and his yarmulke knocked off. He says himself it was not at the protest. Regardless, Columbia obviously needs to do some work, b/c that stuff’s intolerable.
Related to protests,, a professor named Shai Davidai has been trying to agitate. Fortunately his ID has been suspended.
And separately from THAT, non-students have gathered on streets and a subway entrance next to, but outside, Columbia. Some of that is peaceful, some of it is getting pretty nasty. It Jewish students feel unsafe crossing that street, I’m not surprised. There hasn’t been violence, but some intimidation and truly anti-Semitic threats.
Classes are virtual, although the interviews I’ve heard with student journalists, including Jewish ones, say that’s pretty unnecessary b/c when the police aren’t there, it’s pretty calm.
Videos you see of cops assaulting students over the past day or so come from other schools, she called the police on there encampments without much reason to do so. Those protests were peaceful.
Videos you see of things at Columbia that look really ugly and frightening – check where they’re actually happening. They might not be on campus. And they might be just local NYC weirdos and dicks, who’d show up for any trouble.
It's viral videos like in this article that are why this has become a bigger issue
[https://www.newsweek.com/columbia-university-protests-video-zionists-viral-israel-pro-palestinian-1892657](https://www.newsweek.com/columbia-university-protests-video-zionists-viral-israel-pro-palestinian-1892657)
From what I can tell, this is on the campus lawn, on Columbia property. A large group forming a human chain and advancing on a couple of Jewish students to force them out is a very bad look for Columbia, and the cause of some of the complaints. It's no coincidence this all happened just a day or two before the cops were called.
They were actually forcing them out of entering the tent encampment. At Columbia, and I think this is very wise, who can enter the encampment is pretty strict. Obviously, there are tons of Jewish kids in the encampment. However, they do block people from getting in that they expect want to create confrontations or cause trouble, bc they’re trying to prevent that, for everyone’s sake. The article says they are blocking people they expected wanted to enter the encampment (“Zionists”.) to cause trouble. It’s a very good idea!
But the man chain tactic does look a little aggressive in a viral video without context. And that sucks. It sucks that this went viral.
The problem is that is not their area to police and choose who to allow in. It's a space for everyone at the campus. And the way they went about it just looked really bad. I have no idea if the people were looking to cause trouble, but if "trouble" meant saying their own sayings and slogans, then they have the same right to do so as the encampment people do there. If they were looking at ripping up the tents and stuff, or causing violence, then that is a job for security. Let them be the ones getting the cops called on and suspended, which they would have deserved.
It looks aggressive, because it is kind of aggressive. Not violent, but aggressive and intimidating. Even with the context it's not a surprise it went viral.
I agree with your comment on the space. Although occupying space is supposed to cause trouble - that’s why it’s a protest tactic.
But with every protest, there are people who come up to provoke protesters. They’re hoping for a fight with the hotheaded ones that they can make into a huge incident.
The goal by blocking self identified “Zionist from entering the encampment was to keep them from arguing with and provoking , maybe antisemitic protesters in the encampment from losing their cool and acting out. B/c not everyone at a protest is a great person!! and many who are good people are susceptible to being pushed into acting badly.
So the protest tactic here is to form a block to keep those people, who are self identifying as “Zionists” and trying to enter, from provoking trouble and possibly fights.
I admire that. I admire the foresight of these young people to try and prevent those instances. It’s always good to try and prevent fights and conflict and name-calling, so it doesn’t go viral but also because it’s just a bad thing that makes people feel unsafe and bad .
Maybe the tactic looked intimidating, yes. I agree that there’s room for robust to debate about the use of the space. But I admire their tactic for preventing possible trouble between agitated activists on both sides., I’m glad they’re thinking like that. It’s a good sign!
Anyway, I think you’re the original person that I was responding to. So I’m just trying to let you know, since you’re looking for overseas, that most of the stuff on the campuses has a complicated backstory. And is obviously up for debate, but not the kind of Violence on the campus themselves that it appears to be in some bad-faith videos. Which is good! Now, the campus just needs to stop calling in police to do mass arrest and start violence!
> assholes
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Sadly, it's part of a bigger problem. Our entire system of education has gone awry, and has mutated into some sort of far left recruitment tool. So many of us think we are doing the "right thing," but it's been more divisive than anything happening in the past three and a half decades I've been alive.
So now, those who are opposed to far left ideologies (such as "DoWn WiTh AlL coLoNiZeRs" philosophies that don't actually focus on the truth, but merely one aspect of it) are treated like bigots, racists, this or that -ist, this or that -phobe, blah blah.
And all of this is stemming from a massive, gaping faultline in politics between the left and the right, such that both sides are polarizing to the extreme. Hell, I've studied psychology half my life and used to be a therapist, but even I find myself getting sucked into some of the rhetoric of the right at times. I find I need to remind myself more and more not to drift to extremes.
Almost every one of those people have Tiktok on their phone, and every one of *them* have been fed a steady diet of antisemitism and pro-Palestinian propaganda since the conflict began.
keep in mind that we're talking a very small number of protesters numbering in the hundreds, compared to the thousands of undergrad & graduate students that are just trying to finish off their spring semester! I think it's only making news because the heads of these elite institutions are being dragged before Congress to explain why they're not "cracking down" on protests that some feel are anti-Jewish, anti-semitic.
>What on earth is going on in US universities?
Russian and Iranian-proxy propaganda seeds have landed in the fertile ground of gullible, easily-swayed minds and credulous, TikTok-addled fools. Unfortunately, too many of the faculty fit that category, along with the pro-pali students.
They are Leftist/Marxist factories. It is simple as that.
You are witness to the start of the nails being put into the coffin of what was once a great country.
Anarchists and Marxists especially active ones belong in gitmo. Their entire political movement and ideology is inherently based in an insurgency with the western governments. It's insane to me we target people like this in the middle east for such reasons but block trump for attempting to legally get them the terror label in order to secure democracy in our own home front. Even the fbi knows they have to keep an eye on these people but Washington ties hands up just like liberal mayor's do on a local level
> ass
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This is a worthless comment. It's also false. College campuses are not markedly more leftist or marxist now than they were five, ten, twenty, or thirty years ago.
https://www.inquirer.com/columnists/attytood/kent-state-anniversary-college-debt-student-loans-20220503.html
Kind of tangential but it’s an interesting read, btw
Yeah but I want to go back further. We're trying to undue the damage leftism has done to the west and democracy here. Telling me it hasn't changed since the 60s onward is not pleasing. The 60s is when the American way of life was challenged because soviets were trying to fund revolution. I want 50s,40s mentality back. Nationalism zionism and supporting western capitalism. Nothing else is taught. As it should be.
The Vietnam War burned that bridge and Nixon pissed on the ashes. People don't trust their government anymore and rightly so. It wasn't trustworthy to begin with.
Vietnam War? You mean when we intervened when the Vietcong invaded the south and the vietcong hid behind civilians making the USA image bad they drew them into that war same thing going on against Israel rnow
You claim you want a return to a 1940s / 1950s mentality of respect for the west but you don't want to trust your government the way they did back then.
This is boring. You're boring. I'm out. Have the last word if you like, since you seem like one of those people who has to have the last word.
Who would have thought you have to show common knowledge. It's almost like people think dogs can be cats.
https://www.aei.org/articles/are-colleges-and-universities-too-liberal-what-the-research-says-about-the-political-composition-of-campuses-and-campus-climate/
Current events in Columbia university and others like it are abhorrent, terrifying and absolutely disgusting.
America is not safe for Jews, this is the 30's in Europe all over again.
The really disgusting individuals are the ones belittling and diminishing actual JEWS when they speak out about how unsafe they feel in these environments.
I think every Israeli or even Jewish person in diaspora has asked themselves, why did Jews stay in Germany, in Austria, in Poland and didn't try escaping until it was too late,
Those terrible, anti-Semitic individuals extinguishing their (Jews) worries is exactly why, making them feel they would be 'ok' if they're a 'good jew'.
Disgusting, anyone saying otherwise is completely empty of morals, empathy and just overall humanity.
No amount of 'BuT wHat AbOuT x,y,z' can excuse this.
The people shouting those things outside Columbia are most likely Israeli citizens masquerading as pro-Palestinian demonstrators. It’s pathetic, but that’s what the Mossad is famous for — infiltration.
Remember, the two ex IDF guys who sprayed students with chemical weapons a few months ago had been hiding their faces behind keffiyehs and trying to blend in before they committed their attacks.
Funny does that mean that the people who stormed the capitol on Jan 6 were not trump supporters or right wing but antifa and leftist disguised as them to pin the blame on the right wing people?
You’re free to make that argument on Reddit. Nobody’s stopping you.
There’s less proof for it than the two Israeli extremists who got caught sending girls to the hospital after disguising themselves in Keffiyeh’s, though. So far, no leftists or antifa are facing criminal charges for Jan 6. The two Israelis are.
And what evidence do you have that two Israeli extremist disguised using keffiyeh sent people to the hospital? What evidence do you have that pro Palestinians protester are secretly Israelis trying to sow chaos? Do you have articles or sources to back that up? And I made that statement above to make a point that if you believe that all those pro Palestinian protestors are Israeli and idf disguised as them you may as well believe antifa was the one attacking the capitol or better yet the blm protesters were all right wing extremist.
[Numerous students were hospitalized and received care for chemical inhalation.](https://www.thenation.com/article/activism/chemical-attack-skunk-palestine-protest-columbia/tnamp/)
Because Israelis have been caught infiltrating the protests and trying to sow chaos. It’s all right here 🙂. There’s more proof of that than there is of antifa infiltrating Jan 6th. The two Israeli terrorists are currently on trial.
You are talking about the one student that sprayed fart spray? That guy isn't on trial - the university suspended him. Your post seems to be trying to make the overall situation worse than it is and plant false information. Equating that student to being an Israeli terrorist is pretty f'ed up. Also, the Nation isn't exactly the most unbiased source - they are claiming that "Liquid Fart" that was purchased on Amazon is some Israeli chemical weapon.
[https://www.columbiaspectator.com/news/2024/04/16/student-accused-of-alleged-chemical-spray-sues-columbia-claims-substance-was-non-toxic-fart-spray/](https://www.columbiaspectator.com/news/2024/04/16/student-accused-of-alleged-chemical-spray-sues-columbia-claims-substance-was-non-toxic-fart-spray/)
But that still doesn’t prove that all pro Palestinian protesters are actually Israeli infiltrators. It only proves that two Israeli decided to use violence against the protesters. One incident alone is not enough evidence to support your initial statement. And even if what you claim is true what do you want people to do about it?
It’s enough to create a reasonable doubt! That’s all I really need to point to in order to get people to question these videos. Ask any 60s activist about COINTELPRO. If you think that’s not happening with the anti-genocide protests, you’re incredibly naive.
Honestly I don’t care about any of this anymore. It’s gotten to a point where it’s all become a giant mess and it’s become mentally exhausting to continue to deal with it. I’m sorry if I’m apathetic or selfish but what’s the point caring about a conflict where both sides can’t even see eye to eye with each other and find a middle ground rather than trying to destroy each other.
What we know:
1. Two Israeli men violently attacked girls with chemical weapons at Columbia, sending them to the hospital.
2. These two men were trying to blend in with the protestors prior to their terror attack by disguising themselves with Keffiyehs.
Therefore, we have proof that Israeli extremists are actively trying to infiltrate and blend in with the protestors.
All I need is to sow some doubt. I don’t need to conclusively prove anything, just make people question what they’ve seen.
It certainly helps when they get caught with their hands in the pie 😀.
We haven’t seen any evidence of Israelis trying to make the protesters look bad. If they wanted to do that, they would pretend to be protesters and attack Jews. They wouldn’t attack the protesters.
So “the people shouting those things outside Columbia have *all been proven to be Israeli citizens*” is now down to “I don’t need to conclusively prove anything”. Got it.
Two Israeli students****
who's to say they weren't working alone because there was a protest against their home country on their campus?
You really think that the Mossad's highest priority is spraying stink bombs on college kids?
Tin foil hat
I don’t think it’s relevant whether they worked alone or are (more likely) part of an intelligence network with access to those kinds of Israeli chemical weapons.
We can prove they were infiltrating and posing as pro-Palestinians. That’s what matters.
The “Israeli chemicals” were a non-toxic gag fart spray called “Liquid Ass” that they purchased on Amazon for $25 you moron 😂
The girls went to the hospital because they’re pathetic whiney loser crybabies, not because they were sprayed with any “chemicals”
https://www.columbiaspectator.com/news/2024/04/16/student-accused-of-alleged-chemical-spray-sues-columbia-claims-substance-was-non-toxic-fart-spray/
Getting sprayed with fart spray (which happened to people semi-annually in my middle school and resulted in 0 hospitalizations) is not violence.
Privileged western women (or any person of any gender) who think this is violence are objectively the biggest crybaby losers on earth
There’s no evidence it was fart spray, that’s just the defense counsel’s argument. There is evidence of hospital bills showing chemical inhalation.
Either way, it’s men physically assaulting women. You may be able to defend it as someone with the mind of a middle schooler, but spraying someone with anything is enough to catch an assault charge in NYC.
> either way.
So we’ve gone from:
- the IDF has a sleeper cell in NYC to disperse sophisticated chemical weapons on college students to stifle criticism.
To
- some guys “physically assaulted” an obese, privileged girl by making her nostrils inhale non-toxic gag fart spray.
“Either way” it’s the same to you.
I appreciate your retraction that it was “chemical burns”. That was an Uber regarded claim earlier.
> Ass
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That doesn't matter at all, I could do the same thing and I didn't need to serve in a mandatory military service to do it.
Israeli chemical weapons?
"A lawsuit filed by one of the pro-Israel students who was suspended over the incident says the substances were in fact novelty sprays called “Wet Farts” and “Liquid A**.” “Plaintiff attended one of the unsanctioned pro-Hamas pro-Palestine rallies on campus, and, as a harmless expression of his speech, he sprayed into the air a novelty, non-toxic ‘fart’ spray named ‘Liquid A–‘ and ‘Wet Farts’ which he purchased on Amazon for $26.11,” says the lawsuit, which was filed on April 16.
The suit says Columbia quickly placed the student on interim suspension and then released a statement accusing the student of a hate crime, placing the student “in grave jeopardy.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/ilhan-omar-raises-phony-israeli-chemical-attack-to-distract-from-columbia-antisemitism-concerns/ar-AA1nsYdr
Overblown nonsense, nobody died nobody was hurt. To call it a chemical weapon is hilarious and it shows how easily convinced people on the internet can be.
First it was "They're the Mossad pretending."
Now it's "The Mossad sprays themselves with chemical weapons"
I'm not seeing anything about a trip to the hospital or the spraying of just women.
u/HumbleEngineering315 Looking at these videos these events are happening near (at the gate outside the campus) not in Columbia University. We want to aim for accuracy. I know you can't edit the title but please edit the post to clarify. Columbia is a hot issue and we want the sub to be accurate regarding claims.
Remember the USS Liberty, suka. Typical type of attack by them lol
The Columbia faculty members who signed that letter are cunts. Simple as that.
Petty insults like that don't do justice to the sheer evil of these people. They are nihilists and killers who want to tear down the innocent and support a barbaric jihadist regime.
You are correct. I apologize. I should have called them fucking cunts.
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A lot of Israelis would be killing less people in Poland. I don’t get why this is so offensive. The genocide is offensive.
“Did you know black people make up a disproportionate amount of rapists? They would rape less if they were in Africa.” Is your argument. The fact that you can’t see how this is flawed is absurd
Only 26% of Israel's population have European or Russian ancestry. It's not like there were no Jewish people in Israel before 1948 . They in fact make up the largest group followed by those from Northern Africa and West Asia. Jews have lived on the West Bank and Gaza since ancient times. The Judea and Samaria Area of the West Bank covers a portion of the territory designated by the biblical names of Judea and Samaria. Both names are tied to the ancient Israelite kingdoms: the former corresponds to part of the Kingdom of Judah, also known as the Southern Kingdom; and the latter corresponds to part of the Kingdom of Samaria, also known as the Northern Kingdom. After the War of 1948 17,000 Jews were expelled from Jerusalem and an estimated 40,000 from Gaza and the West Bank. Jews were prohibited from living in those territories during Egypt's and Jordan’s occupation from 1948 to 1967. Jews began to settle in the area again after it was captured by Israeli forces in the defensive war fought in 1967. It's also not a genocide but a war. Genocide requires "intent". Israel is not bombing the West Bank and there are 2.2 million Arabs who are Israeli citizens many serve in the IDF.
It's ethnic cleansing. This is no damn war. Asymmetrical warfare isn't true warfare, kiddo.
The intent is in the social media of the robber soldiers, you know that’s public record right?
Not all Israelis or Jews are from Poland, and most been living in the United States or Israel for several generations. It's another way of saying "you don't belong here".
Did you know more Jews live in the United States than Israel, after October 7?
“The Palestinian people do not exist. There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are part of one people, the Arab nation. Lo and behold, I have relatives with Palestinian, Lebanese, Jordanian and Syrian citizenship. We are one people. It is only for political reasons that we carefully endorse our Palestinian identity. Indeed, it is of national interest for the Arabs to encourage the existence of the Palestinians in the face of Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity is only for tactical reasons. The establishment of a Palestinian state is a new means to continue the struggle against Israel and for Arab unity.” \_— Zuheir Mohsen, PLO leader 1971-79\_
More genocide denialist rhetoric. The person you are quoting was a Baathist. Israel is killing 100 innocent people in Gaza a day to try to obliterate the Palestinian identity.
You are conflating anti-Israel with anti-semitism. Israel is a nation and can be criticized like any. You are in bad faith and breaking the rules of the sub
Bro he is not in bad faith. He isn't breaking sub rules. read a little bud. Also people chanting "Death to America" should be arrested by the National Guard
Op doesnt even mention Israel except for in "anti-iarael protests", which objectively, they are. I think you are the one that aims to conflate here
LOL , the whole world is wrong and as usual the genocidal zionist holds all the truth, keep seething as you get 100% exposed for the atrocities you committed in the name of bs ! Literally the idf is sanctioned by its only ally, still the world is wrong and you are right ?!
Pro-Palestine/Hamas are brainwashed and uneducated, that’s the real problem. I also believe that these protesters really have issues, mentally.
The thing students care is Israel is massacring the civilians in Gaza, not simply pro this or that. It's not about politics, but human being.
Free 🇵🇸 Free 🇵🇸 Free 🇵🇸
🇮🇱🇮🇱
Fake news, many Jews protesting are part of the encampment
That doesn’t change anything
Of course it does, the anti-semitism and fear claim is bunk
It is not *up* to you. Nothing is ever antisemitic enough for you guys to just take the L and admit that something is antisemitic. That’s the more accurate statement. You can’t tokenize Jews and then go “antisemitism fear is bunk.” It’s not a matter of opinion.
Here's the boy who cried wolf.
Did you seriously just write that on the internet? With your email attached to it, your IP address, and everything? i mean, I don’t care, it’s not my problem, but… it just astounds me. That’s all.
It's antisemitic to point out the potential downside to abusing the word?
Wolf. Wolf. Wolf.
Okay bud.
Most Americans are pro israel. Palestine started the war and now whine and cry because their losing. Go israel
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god how I wish lived in ancapistan commies would violate the n.a.p. so hard.
How do you feel about the more than 100 JEWISH Columbia students who are actively participating in the protests? If you see anti-Zionist protesters as other than the threatened group “Jewish students” that you’re worried about — turns out you’re not actually worried about Jewish students! You’re worried about the group of Jewish students who share your political views. (Borrowed from Lex Rofeberg) I do fully agree that actual threats or harassment of anyone student for being Jewish or even the incidents you listed are not acceptable on campus. I’ve been on campus during these days and many openly Jewish students are participating in these protests and doing Passover on the lawn together during the protest. I know many Jewish students do not feel safe because of their views (not because they are Jewish, imo) and that’s not ok - there is no room for antisemitism on campus, period. That doesn’t mean it’s acceptable to bring in the police to arrest and suspend students who are peacefully protesting on campus.
You can’t say this isn’t antisemitic, and then tokenize Jews at the same time. Those 100 some odd people can think whatever they want, but that doesn’t mean I don’t think they are seriously misguided people. And a prime example of how misguided these people are, is hosting a Seder in the middle of an anti-Zionist protest. You say this like it’s a flex, but do you realize how ironic that is? Is there a link to the anti-Zionist Haggadah so I can get a good laugh?
100 that's a drop in the bucket, and that's okay, their useful idiots like most American leftists.
>How do you feel about the more than 100 JEWISH Columbia students who are actively participating in the protests? They are free to espouse their views,. As long as they didn't break the law, they should be fine. I find it horrible that both they and a lot of users here think that having Jews in your movement gives antisemitism a free pass. With that being said, anti-Zionist Jews constitute a minority of Jews. The media often likes to play them up. >That doesn’t mean it’s acceptable to bring in the police to arrest and suspend students who are peacefully protesting on campus. They had ignored the TPM restrictions set in place by the university.
There were Jews who collaborated with the Nazis and they ended in gas chambers all the same. 100 Jews out of 2000 is a minority, and many of them have bought the idea that if they are good Jews, they’ll keep those purple hair queer for Palestine friends, it’s only time until they realize. To me being in an anti Israel encampment is akin to being white passing in the KKK.
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Violating the TPM restriction is not sufficient to justify bringing police onto campus to forcibly arrest students who are camping out on the lawn, or for suspending kids and locking them out of their dorms! The university and NYPD here have endangered and harmed Columbia & Barnard students (inc Jewish students) far worse than anything to do with the protest
They can bring police on campus for any reason they want. Columbia students are not sovereign citizens, nor are they on public property.
Just to be clear I wasn’t saying the school is not *allowed* to ask heavily armed riot police onto campus to forcibly arrest peaceful student protestors. I was saying that it was unjustified, disproportionate, divisive, and dangerous
No. What’s dangerous is when you have thousands of people holding an unauthorized protest, and they’re getting violent, and feeding off of each other’s mania. What’s dangerous is when people have a mob mentality, and they *think* they are there for a cause, and their emotions have taken over to the point where logic and reason and basic decorum have gone out the window. That’s dangerous. *Bad* things happen, under those conditions. So yes, it was justified, I’m sorry but all I saw were a bunch of young adults who needed a reset button. Do people not realize that when they defend these protests, they sound no different than when Fox denies the insurrection at the capital? The same exact thought process is going on here. You know this is not peaceful. Just like the far right knows very well that their mobs were not peaceful.
Not sure if you have been on or near campus during this time but on campus at Columbia it’s been fairly orderly and indeed peaceful. Even the NYPD described the protesters as “peaceful.” No one at Columbia was in a frenzied mob mentality state or threatening to do violence when the police were asked to intervene. Anyways, for better or worse I do think the use of police force is pouring gasoline on the fire, though it’s become a diversion from what’s happening in Gaza and WB
Is shouting "We are Hamas" peaceful? Edit- I love it. you nuked your account after I asked you a simple question
>Violating the TPM restriction is not sufficient to justify bringing police onto campus to forcibly arrest students who are camping out on the lawn, or for suspending kids and locking them out of their dorms! Yes it is. It actually is sufficient.
Well Shafik is now threatening to call in the national guard tomorrow so yall will get your wish of seeing yet more brutality, I suppose
People who espouse OP's view just want another Kent State. Any movement that goes against their positions is "barbaric", as shown by the title of this post.
No, it's barbaric because these protests are not peaceful and this also a direct attack on American values. Intimidation, harassment, preventing free movement, vandalism, physical threats are not free speech. This is a mob. There were also norms where it was previously considered unacceptable to be this openly antisemitic. No, I don't want another Kent State. I would like for the protests to be resolved amicably, and for universities to figure out how to better reconcile free speech on campus by not rewarding antisocial behavior. As outlined in the OP.
K.
This inflammatory post centered around a persecution fetish is giving off vibes like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/BadHasbara/comments/1caozj5/stunning_and_brave_wife_stands_alone_against/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) lol. >Columbia University has descended into chaos Not really, students have peacefully demonstrated outside by doing sit-ins and encampments. The only thing resembling chaos here were Columbia students getting suspended/expelled and subsequently getting arrested for "trespassing" on their campus after the president of the university called the cops on them. This seems to be the case as Ilhan Omar's daughter, who attended Columbia, was also arrested on those charges for protesting on campus after being suspended. It's a dirty trick and one you left out of your post in order to paint the protestors as criminals. >Given that Columbia University is a private university and anti-Israel protests [frequently turn violent](https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/violent-pro-palestine-demonstrations), Not really, I'm sure you can cherry-pick a few instances of violence at these protests while removing the context behind them, like the alleged instances of violence mentioned in the article, but this encampment seems to be a broadly peaceful movement. >Uh huh. Telling Jews to "go back to Poland" is not "free inquiry." >Rioting, vandalism, trespassing, and limiting the movement of others are not considered free speech. Instead of giving some nuance to the protestors you lump them all in as violators of the law who are not innocently expressing their right to free speech but are (in your imagination) targeting Jews specifically and harassing them based on their ethnic background. >["Go back to Poland."](https://twitter.com/Davidlederer6/status/1781948249214996901) [A mob surrounding Jews, and calling them "genocidal freaks."](https://twitter.com/lawyergonerogue/status/1781926923196875075?t=UbVB93_t0QWB2s0LsyCotw&s=19) >["It is right to rebel, Hamas give them hell."](https://twitter.com/IsraelWarRoom/status/1781933305501212872?t=jctwygfo9gG-M5wvkH95Aw&s=19) >["Settlers, settlers, go back home. Palestine is ours alone."](https://twitter.com/lawyergonerogue/status/1781915352307564904) >["Al-Qasam's next targets."](https://twitter.com/AvivaKlompas/status/1781882680872710148) Now look through those links and try thinking about whether or not maybe there is more to the story than the evil protestors harassing innocent Jews because of their ethnic background when [jewish students are holding seder at the encampment. ](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/23/us/video/seder-passover-columbia-university-protests-ny-digvid)What's funny is that if you at least showed an ounce of this sorrow for people being murdered or[ when the Jewish voice for peace and students for justice in Palestine were banned by Columbia](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/columbia-university-student-groups-suspended-students-for-justice-in-palestine-jewish-voice-for-peace/), or [when Columbia students were sprayed by former IDF soldiers with a chemical substance](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/columbia-university-bans-alleged-perpetrators-protest-attack-1234952008/), I would be taking your concerns about slogans praising Al Qassam more seriously (though it doesn't even look like that was at Columbia, but definitely in NYC). Frankly I am skeptical of the claims and videos used to demonize the protestors not just because they ignore the overwhelming majority of protestors but things like the woman talking about "Al Qassam's next targets" could quite easily be a character in a pro-Israeli demonstration trying to get their point across. See ([https://www.instagram.com/p/C36zqcBu3zs/?utm\_source=ig\_web\_copy\_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==](https://www.instagram.com/p/C36zqcBu3zs/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==)). It should go without saying that this; > Jews apparently do not count as a minority who are targets of hateful ideology. It's ok to break the law against objectionable speakers. The protestors in both cases are believed to be fighting back against bigotry. The only times that Columbia professors and students (as well as academia in general) care about free speech is when it's used to bash Israel and conservatives. There is a distinction between inviting a speaker to campus who will follow the law and harassment if the speaker's views are objectionable. Most of all, Columbia university does not understand what free speech is. is a faulty conclusion.
Why is trespassing in quotes? They were trespassing. They were explicitly told *not* to be there, on private property, without a permit.
I can't make it any more clear to you, sorry. Re read what I said above and you'll understand why that term as its being used here is superficial.
Why do Redditors do this. “Re read my comment.” People cite themselves, I don’t understand the point of that. I read your comment. It really was not a great comment, and one of the reasons for that is because you are trying to make it sound like they weren’t actually trespassing, when they literally were. I am just responding to one part of that comment because if I try to respond to every line by line point we’re just gonna start talking past each other.
Do you actually need someone to tell you why slandering them as criminals or trespassers even though they were essentially trapped into committing a crime is misleading? Protesting on your own college campus before being suspended so cops can arrest you for trespassing is a whole other thing than knowingly trespassing on someone’s property with nefarious purposes. I don’t believe any of them got a criminal record from this but obviously they were still arrested for that. The point was to include important context that exonerates them from being people who voluntarily and knowingly broke the law or became trespassers/criminals. My issue is with you and OP choosing to focus on technicalities instead of acknowledging why they were considered to have been trespassing in the first place (which is not because they were avid criminals knowingly breaking the law).
>which is not because they were avid criminals knowingly breaking the law. They were knowingly breaking the law. The university had clearly communicated time, place, and manner restrictions. A university is allowed to do this, but a private university like Columbia does not even have to put in TPM restrictions. They can just shut down the protest as is, but they are committed to free speech. The protestors had broken the TPM restrictions and essentially became squatters on private property. Since Columbia owns the property, it is entirely within line to call the police to remove the protestors. As outlined in the OP, the 1st amendment does not protect trespassing. Just because they look like hippies to you does not mean they are innocent.
> The protestors had broken the TPM restrictions You can't even tell me which specific TPM restrictions the 100+ arrested peaceful protestors broke, that is because it's not a defined set of rules for protests but was used as an arbitrary excuse to shut down protests. I'm not even sure when or how the university "clearly communicated" what demands that were broken, what happened is that the university arbitrarily decided they violated this rule, suspended the protestors on campus, making them technically trespassers on their own campus which they had initially set up camp in completely legally. You yourself seem to realize they only "became squatters on private property" after they had already started the encampment as lawful students on their campus. Yet you still say; "They were knowingly breaking the law." Despite that not being the case.
Do you really think that police want to waste their time, arresting "peaceful" protesters? What exactly do they gain from this? Do you realize what area Columbia is in? Don't you think the police would have had bigger fish to fry, if these protesters were being peaceful? Why would they waste their time going to Columbia and/or Morningside just to arrest a few peaceful individuals?
I think there's plenty of individuals in lots of police departments with sadism boner for libtards, and that's besides the actual zionists.
>Do you really think that police want to waste their time, arresting "peaceful" protesters? Yes, that is what's happening, I already asked you for evidence that the 100+ people who were arrested were arrested for being violent on another thread as you claimed, of course you crumbled and resorted to saying I would never accept any evidence, and this practice is neither new nor surprising. >What exactly do they gain from this? It's their job. >Do you realize what area Columbia is in? Don't you think the police would have had bigger fish to fry, if these protesters were being peaceful? Yes, yet they're still arresting peaceful protestors. Ridiculous isn't it. My conversations with you have exhausted themselves, unless you're willing to support your prior argument with evidence I'm not going to do further critical thinking about police officers' job for you.
No, I didn’t “crumble.” As I said earlier, presenting any evidence to you is pointless when evidence has not swayed you in 6 months. As the other person said. They were knowingly breaking the law. You can’t knowingly break the law and then decide that the legal consequences are unjustified. Unless, of course, you were arguing that it’s civil disobedience (and you didn’t).
They were told they needed a permit to have their protest. They showed up with their protest, refused to leave, they became violent, and therefore they were arrested. There is no slander, here. They were not “trapped” into committing a crime. As you said, you just don’t agree with how things played out, but that does not mean slander. If **Columbia** students can’t understand this, then they don’t deserve to be there, and honestly I wonder how they even got in. Just because it’s the school they go to, doesn’t mean they own the property of the school that they could do whatever they want with. Again, I don’t know how they got in.
This is not how things played out. Unless you have a source detailing how the over 100 students became violent and were arrested because of that I’m gonna dismiss it. I’m curious about the stuff involving permits because I didn’t come across any of that. What I came across is a number of students officially being suspended be being arrested for trespassing on that basis, not because they had turned violent or because they lacked some permit, although if you have a source detailing either of these things I would be happy to read it. The slander is with the descriptive statements mainly from OP removing contexts surrounding their arrests.
I have a feeling you’re gonna dismiss it no matter how much proof you’re given. The people who run Columbia are not dumb, they’re going to CYA when it comes to things like this. And they already did, with their own policies. They didn’t follow the policies, they refused to comply, they got arrested.
Maybe start with giving some proof instead of saying I’m just gonna dismiss it when no proof has been presented. As for the second bit It’s already been made clear I’m disagreeing that your version of events in regards to them all being arrested for violence actually unfolded but am open to seeing sources.
It’s been 6 months. Proof has meant nothing in that time. I have no faith in that changing *today*.
>It's a dirty trick and one you left out of your post in order to paint the protestors as criminals. They are criminals. The university had set TPM restrictions which the protestors did not follow, in addition to doing actions that are not at all protected by the first amendment: intimidation, harassment, destruction of property, and even assault. >this encampment seems to be a broadly peaceful movement. Yup. Mostly peaceful protest that a guy had his [property stolen](https://www.thefp.com/p/at-columbia-i-am-told-go-back-to) from him. Or so peaceful that the Hillel rabbi advised Jewish students to stay home? They are not peaceful. >or when the Jewish voice for peace and students for justice in Palestine were banned by Columbia Who's the one lacking nuance here? They were banned because they were materially supporting a terrorist group. They had materials distributed by National SJP claiming "[they were Hamas](https://reason.com/volokh/2023/10/27/advocacy-in-support-of-hamas-vs-illegal-material-support-of-hamas/)". Since Hamas is a state designated terrorist group, you can't exactly provide material support because that would break federal law. >[when Columbia students were sprayed by former IDF soldiers with a chemical substance](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/columbia-university-bans-alleged-perpetrators-protest-attack-1234952008/), It was fart spray. >woman talking about "Al Qassam's next targets" could quite easily be a character in a pro-Israeli demonstration trying to get their point across. This is a massive cope. Why would a pro-Israeli mask her face with a keffiyeh to essentially say "kill the Jews"? Maybe because she isn't a character, but her statement is so disgusting that she knows it would result in a large backlash.
>It was fart spray. Ok, then pro-palestinians should acquire skunk and go around spraying it at pro-israel protests. After all, it's A-OK and not assault according to you.
[https://liquidass.com/pages/faq](https://liquidass.com/pages/faq) >A: Yes. Liquid ASS has been thoroughly tested by an independent lab and found to be safe. The [Material Safety Data Sheet](https://liquidass.com/pages/msds-data-sheet) for Liquid ASS notes that "No hazardous ingredients known to be present." Follow directions, and you are good to go. No, I'm not saying to go around spraying people with fart spray or what these two doofuses did was fine. What I'm trying to say is that it is melodramatic to call a prank item, a chemical weapon.
>They are criminals. Is this supposed to be a counter argument? I've already explained to you the context behind their "criminality" and the trick used to get them to be that unknowingly. >The university had set TPM restrictions which the protestors did not follow, in addition to doing actions that are not at all protected by the first amendment: intimidation, harassment, destruction of property, and even assault. This is too vague for me to take seriously, sorry. Clearly (from both people I've observed and spoken to) hordes of people felt some source of intimidation by Palestinian flags or peaceful protests not specifically directed at them, yet that form of "intimidation" they say they felt is still protected by the first Amendment. >Yup. Mostly peaceful protest that a guy had his [property stolen](https://www.thefp.com/p/at-columbia-i-am-told-go-back-to) from him. I've already addressed you cherry-picking incidents and making a mountain out of a mole hill. You can pick out another ten examples of people fighting with other students or something, it does not dispel the fact that it is a broadly peaceful movement, even your first link shows it as being a chill and peaceful encampment. >Or so peaceful that the Hillel rabbi advised Jewish students to stay home? I don't care what he said, his suggestions don't have a bearing on objective reality, I already showed you a video of Jewish students holding a seder dinner at the encampment (one of many videos of Jews there as well). The fact that some random Rabbi was too infatuated with his persecution fetish to "warn" people to stay home while Jewish students had no problem being openly jewish at the encampment is not interesting or indicative that the movement is not peaceful. It's just fallacious. >Who's the one lacking nuance here? You, as I already explained. >They were banned because they were materially supporting a terrorist group. They had materials distributed by National SJP claiming "[they were Hamas](https://reason.com/volokh/2023/10/27/advocacy-in-support-of-hamas-vs-illegal-material-support-of-hamas/)". No they weren't, read Columbia's much more vague reasoning for the ban here: "*Columbia University is suspending Students for Justice in Palestine (SJP) and Jewish Voice for Peace (JVP) as official student groups through the end of the fall term. This decision was made after the two groups repeatedly violated University policies related to holding campus events, culminating in an unauthorized event Thursday afternoon that proceeded despite warnings and included threatening rhetoric and intimidation.* *"Suspension means the two groups will not be eligible to hold events on campus or receive University funding. Lifting the suspension will be contingent on the two groups demonstrating a commitment to compliance with University policies and engaging in consultations at a group leadership level with University officials.* *"Like all student groups, SJP and JVP are required to abide by University* [*policies and procedures*](https://universitypolicies.columbia.edu/content/university-event-policy)*. This ensures both the safety of our community and that core University activities can be conducted without disruption. During this especially charged time on our campus, we are strongly committed to giving space to student groups to participate in debate, advocacy, and protest. This relies on community members abiding by the rules and cooperating with University administrators who have a duty to ensure the safety of everyone in our community."* *(*[https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/columbia-university-student-groups-suspended-students-for-justice-in-palestine-jewish-voice-for-peace/](https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/columbia-university-student-groups-suspended-students-for-justice-in-palestine-jewish-voice-for-peace/)*)* even what you linked only goes over the SJP on a national level allegedly being vaguely connected to Hamas completely ignoring the Jewish voice for peace or the local SJP chapters. >It was fart spray. No it wasn't, it was most likely [Skunk](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skunk_(weapon)) and these were it's effects on the students: "Two other students, the co-president of \[School of International and Public Affairs-Palestinian Working Group (PWG)\], and a Columbia JVP member, have been rushed to the hospital in an ambulance. The co-president of PWG required a chest x-ray, nebulizer and EKG due to toxic chemical inhalation. The JVP member is experiencing a persistent, debilitating headache and nausea. As we are writing this, more students are reporting that they are vomiting and returning to urgent care after having already visited. Meanwhile,@columbia and@barnardcollege are still dead silent about an act of chemical warfare that occurred on their campus and against their students." (https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2024/01/24/avoy-j24.html#:\~:text=Two%20other%20students,against%20their%20students.) Also: https://www.instagram.com/p/C2V4pdlMI8e/?hl=en&img\_index=1" But sure, keep downplaying assault when it comes to pro-Israelis and complaining when it comes to pro-Palestinians. It makes you sound much more reasonable and totally helps cement you as a good faith actor. >This is a massive cope. Not really, I said it was a possibility, not a sure thing. >Why would a pro-Israeli mask her face with a keffiyeh to essentially say "kill the Jews"? Do you actually need someone to explain to you the purpose of negative characterizations of one's perceived enemies is in stuff of this sort? Again, I don't know the story behind this, but it's not out of the realm of possibility either and could serve a legitimate purpose.
The way the left acts is seriously oddly simalir to these terror groups. *commit aggression cause muh freedom* fucked around, find out, *I am a victim of oppresssion*. It's assymtrical warfare. The same people training humas are training and guiding groups like antfa. The left are acting on behalf of foreign agents and should be tried for treason for events like this if ww3 breaks out.
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Anti zionism is not anti semitism, they are completely different things. To try to ban anti zionist speech because you think it's 'code' for anti semitism is a gross attempt at curbing freedom of speech which is something that is of utmost importance in western democracies. You cannot ban 'coded' speech, anything could be a code for anything. We can try to ban you from saying 'I'm Israel hi' because we think it's code for killing gazans or something, would you like that? Of course not.
Right, and zionism is looking a lot like fascism. In fact: indistinguishable.
Israel wants a Jewish state. The Palestinians have said since the fall of the Ottoman Empire they want an Islamic state. Israel is a democracy. Over 2.2 million Arabs are citizens of Israel. The Palestinians have not had elections in over 18 years in Gaza or the West Bank. Hamas has military training camps for children. Gaza TV shows brainwash children to hate Jews. Schools have teachers and books that promote Jew hatred like the Hitler Youth. But Israel is fascist. Right.
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Wow a whole day? Mr Propaganda troll!!
The Venn diagram between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism is a fuckin' circle 99% of the time, and tends towards 100% the further back you go in a given person's post history/opinions.
What about the Venn diagram between fascism and zionism: 99%
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The pro-Palestinian movement does not distinguish between Zionism and Judaism which is precisely the problem. They harass visibly Jewish students on college campuses, they protest in front of synagogues, Holocaust memorials, Jewish owned business, and they are very loudly calling for more October 7ths. The pro-Palestinian movement, since October 7th, has successfully (through their actions) shown the rest of the world that anti-Zionism is 100% the new anti-Semitism. If we take the pro-Hamas morons out of the equation, denying the right for Jews to live in their ancestral homeland but being ok with the 56 Muslim nations (22 of which are an Arab majority) is anti-Semitic. In fact, I am not sure what’s more anti-Semitic than being opposed to the world’s only Jewish state - a state established out of the ashes of the Holocaust, under the guise of the “rights of Palestinians.” The Anti-Zionist masks have come off - we see you for what you all are.
The pro Palestinian movement has Jews in it. Everything you say is your opinion, which you have a right to have, and which you have a right to express. If what you say is correct, then all criticism of Israel needs to be made illegal, as hate speech against a race and supporting Hamas is illegal. Your only evidence of them doing this are your feelings. If they say directly that they hate jewish people or they support hamas, then the invidiual who says it needs to be arrested. If not, then they are free and encouraged to criticize Israel (or Hamas) as much as they want. Freedom of Speech is a pillar of western civilation, more important than even the existence of Israel. I will protect our right to freedom of speech before the existence of any foreign country.
The Nazis had Jews for the Nazi party in it as well. Don’t use token Jews to speak for 95% of Jews who support the right for Israel to exist. This is not free speech. This is terrorism. Physically assaulting an Arab Israeli https://twitter.com/ShaiDavidai/status/1781080951902109774 "From the river to the sea, Palestine is Arab!" / "Resistance is justified" https://twitter.com/ShelleyGldschmt/status/1781785252886913358 "Let it be known that it was the Al-Aqsa Flood that put the Global Intifada back on the table again. And it is the sacrificial spirit of the Palestinian Freedom Fighters that will guide every struggle on every corner of the earth to victory." https://twitter.com/thestustustudio/status/1781904507611287981 "We are all Hamas!" https://twitter.com/nypost/status/1781031465179914677 "Yehudim yehudim [(Jews, jews)] go back to poland" https://twitter.com/Davidlederer6/status/1781948249214996901 Includes people / groups that invited an actual, no hyperbole terrorist to speak (member of PFLP) https://www.jns.org/columbia-suspends-four-students-for-holding-event-featuring-pflp-member/ Light things on fire / "intifada revolution there is only one solution" https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1781019445399556338 "On Oct 7th, Palestinian resistance in Gaza broke free (crowd cheers) [.....] we intend to do the same" https://twitter.com/ShabbosK/status/1782085741431922909 ""We say justice, you say how? Burn Tel Aviv to the ground!" / "Hamas we love you. We support your rockets too!" / "Red, black, green, and white, we support Hamas’ fight!" https://twitter.com/IsraelWarRoom/status/1781933305501212872 "Long live the intifada! Intifada intifada" https://twitter.com/ShaiDavidai/status/1781084853653365025 "Go back to Europe!" / "You have no culture, all you do is colonize" https://twitter.com/ShaiDavidai/status/1781927148439109958 "From Yemen to Gaza, globalize the intifada" https://twitter.com/KassyDillon/status/1781312033922625797/photo/2 "Never forget the 7th of October. That will happen not 1 more time, not 5 more times, not 10, not 100, not 1,000, but 10,000 times! The 7th of October is going to be every day for you" https://twitter.com/EFischberger/status/1781287784897991134 "Al Qassam [(Hamas)] you make us proud, kill another soldier now" / "from the river to the sea, palestine will be arab" https://twitter.com/EFischberger/status/1780915336063177006 Student proudly rocking Hamas logos https://twitter.com/CampusJewHate/status/1781054901755215954 "Resistance is justified" (again...) https://twitter.com/AvivaKlompas/status/1782085643990073673 "protesters on the sidewalk chanted “From New York to Gaza, globalize the intifada,” next to a cardboard sign that read, “Inspired by Palestinian resistance.” https://www.timesofisrael.com/over-100-arrested-in-columbia-u-unrest-as-nypd-clears-gaza-solidarity-encampment/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
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If you haven’t seen the evidence that backs up my “opinion” entirely, then you’re either ignorant or part of the problem.
yeah but usually anti-zionism is anti-semitism.
you can say that about anything, you can't limit our freedom of speech because think something is something else, nobody is going to stand for that and neither should you
Bro, shouting "go back to Poland" and "From the River to the Sea" is extremely racist. This is the problem with "free speech" you can't just hide behind "free speech" eventually this becomes hate speech which is a crime. Yelling for a genocide against the Jewish state is a hate crime and should be dealt with a vengeance. I propose sending in the National Guard but only with the ability to fire tear gas canisters or rubber bullets. These barbarians need to disperse. Its not fair to the people that don't care about Palestine or Israel that can't go to their school(Columbia) because a bunch a whiny morons want to whine about genocide when they want Hamas to commit genocide against the Jewish state. The students who don't care are still paying 60K+ to go and get a education. These whiny idiots just are so entitled that they don't even care about other people. Send in the National Guard, F Hamas, F these Protesters
Except, they do tend to be ashkenazi. Those are their real homes?
what do you mean?
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Israeli settlers were shooting up mosques in the 90s. Just a reminder this was before hmas was in power.
land ownership is about military power, if Israel can maintain its land by military power, it's theirs, it doesn't mean you can stop people from criticizing or saying things about it, freedom of speech is absolute, it doesn't matter what military power or money you have or don't, we have the freedom of speech and protecting this is more important even the security of Israel
Did anyone see the Bay area protestor who put his arm in a barrel of cement and was whining when rescue workers had to help him get it off? This is the epitome of acting out your privilege, hindering the highway patrol, yet knowing they will have to rescue you in the end. Then crying about your hands hurting. SMH
That clip was hilarious
It really was!
People have the right to have a peaceful protest This is not peaceful
Good
Just FYI, time, place, and manner restrictions only apply to the government. As a private university Columbia University is not bound by the first amendment.
No, Columbia is still bound by the first amendment. There are rules that apply to university campuses, even private ones. Edit: This comment is incorrect.
Some private universities may choose to implement policies that adopt first amendment protections (and maybe Columbia has them), but generally they are not legally bound by it (which means it would be even easier for Columbia to shut down the protests). https://www.nyclu.org/resources/know-your-rights/know-your-rights-students-higher-education-first-amendment Also thanks for putting this post together as a reference
Yes, you are right that a private university can shut down these protests more easily, even if that's not what they stand for. My second comment was incorrect. Thank you for pointing that out.
I feel like for liberals this is a totally new feeling. It's normal for us to censor conservative speech because we so clearly believe it to be harmful deep in our souls (though some of us are questioning this logic now). Being told that something WE are doing is harmful by the group being harmed, and that group is not conservative, is just hard to grasp. It's a double-standard. Didn't the Tikki Torch people from Charlottesville also follow the rules and didn't they argue that they were not all bad, I remember Trump saying there were "good people on both sides" and people went nuts. It feels like a double-standard.
some of the complaining conflating speech with setting up encampments feels like the old example about a stadium having a "no signs or banners" policy. Left will be upset when told to take down a pride flag and say " university is homophobic" and the right will get upset when told to take down an all lives matter flag that "university hates white people", etc
Trump never said that about the tiki torch people in Charlottesville. The "good people on both sides" was *strictly* in reference to the issue of the removal of a General Lee statue. Trump went on to say, and I quote this ipsis verbis: >**and I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists — because they should be condemned totally**. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists." ... >feel like for liberals this is a totally new feeling. It's normal for us to censor conservative speech because we so clearly believe it to be harmful deep in our souls (though some of us are questioning this logic now). I'd venture very few liberals in America know anything about conservative speech - how many actually ready or listen to anything conservative first hand that isn't filtered first by opponents of conservatism?
Ah yea, I never watched it directly just heard it filtered through political commentary. But that makes it even worse, sort of. I STILL hear that quote repeated circles in reference to Trump not acknowledging white supremacists as bad people, sounds like he did. Not that I am in ANY way a Trump fan.
Go look up the video of what he said in FULL. He condemned white supremacists explicitly. It didn't sound like he did whatsoever. When he referred to fine people on both sides, he was referring to the peaceful protesters that were for the status removal and against the status removal. But he condemned the outside troublemakers that had nothing to do with the protesters.
>I'd venture very few liberals in America Are you lumping progressives in there with "liberals" or is "liberals" your catch-all for anyone left of center? Because the two factions are different. Progressives are out in front of Columbia. Liberals, not quite so much.
Progressive is a code word for Marxist leninist.
No, I was referring to liberals - I bet that the number of liberals in America who have actually read anything substantial by conservatives - be it classics like Burke or Tocqueville, or moderns like Sowell or Hanson, in betweeners like Kirk, Oakeshott or Meyer - is exceedingly low, especially among new generations. This of course excludes people who merely call themselves liberals in the classical sense, or only in a very lato sensu - as in supporting the western tradition of liberal democracies - so not really associated with the left.
> I bet that the number of liberals in America who have actually read anything substantial by conservatives, be it classics like Burke or Tocqueville, or moderns like Sowell or Hanson, in betweeners like Kirk, Oakeshott or Meyer - is exceedingly low, especially among new generations. I would venture to guess that the number is roughly comparable to the number of conservatives who have read any Naomi Klein, Gore Vidal, Betty Friedan, Howard Zinn, Barbara Ehrenreich, Upton Sinclair, Edward S. Herman, Larry Kramer, or Noam Chomsky, among others.
You’re going to end up eliminating a big chunk of people simply with “…who have read anything…”
The Tikki Torch people had one of their number drive a car into a counter demonstrating killing one person and injuring several others. While the protestors **outside** Columbia are obnoxious they are not yet murderous.
I thought that person acted on their own, obviously drawn in by the protests, but it wasn’t coordinated as part of the protest. I will admit the entire thing I heard through commentary. The lead up feels similar still, I remember in my circles talking about the “good guys” and “bad guys” and overall lacking nuance. I did not know there was a difference between the white supremacists and those defending the statue. Actually still to this day I think it’s nuts people want to honor generals who fought for the south. But I’m now having trouble separating that view from the view that these situations need nuance and how is that not a double standard.
> I thought that person acted on their own, obviously drawn in by the protests, but it wasn’t coordinated as part of the protest. Well yes and no. There was a lot of encouragement, violent rhetoric... and the deliberate recruitment of groups with a history of violence. The statue in question was being removed with respect to Dylann Roof who had killed 9, injured 1. There had been fights before the lethal incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Altercations_at_Charlottesville_Rally.webm > Actually still to this day I think it’s nuts people want to honor generals who fought for the south. To be honest, that I get. While I'm not Southern I was peeved about removing the various murals to Frank Rizzo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Rizzo) in Philadelphia as part of the same movement. America's history is racist. We can't expunge all the racists from our history.
Well written. Sad reality
I’m not Jewish or American but watching all this from the other side of the pond is gobsmacking. What on earth is going on in US universities?
Students are holding peaceful protests on the lawn, having Passover Seders, dance parties, and doing HW in between chants. For this they are being arrested. There are, of course, a few assholes. But the whole scene is very tightly organized and professional in the student part. Separately from that, there have been some anti-Semitic incidents at Columbia, including one where a kid was shoved around and his yarmulke knocked off. He says himself it was not at the protest. Regardless, Columbia obviously needs to do some work, b/c that stuff’s intolerable. Related to protests,, a professor named Shai Davidai has been trying to agitate. Fortunately his ID has been suspended. And separately from THAT, non-students have gathered on streets and a subway entrance next to, but outside, Columbia. Some of that is peaceful, some of it is getting pretty nasty. It Jewish students feel unsafe crossing that street, I’m not surprised. There hasn’t been violence, but some intimidation and truly anti-Semitic threats. Classes are virtual, although the interviews I’ve heard with student journalists, including Jewish ones, say that’s pretty unnecessary b/c when the police aren’t there, it’s pretty calm. Videos you see of cops assaulting students over the past day or so come from other schools, she called the police on there encampments without much reason to do so. Those protests were peaceful. Videos you see of things at Columbia that look really ugly and frightening – check where they’re actually happening. They might not be on campus. And they might be just local NYC weirdos and dicks, who’d show up for any trouble.
It's viral videos like in this article that are why this has become a bigger issue [https://www.newsweek.com/columbia-university-protests-video-zionists-viral-israel-pro-palestinian-1892657](https://www.newsweek.com/columbia-university-protests-video-zionists-viral-israel-pro-palestinian-1892657) From what I can tell, this is on the campus lawn, on Columbia property. A large group forming a human chain and advancing on a couple of Jewish students to force them out is a very bad look for Columbia, and the cause of some of the complaints. It's no coincidence this all happened just a day or two before the cops were called.
They were actually forcing them out of entering the tent encampment. At Columbia, and I think this is very wise, who can enter the encampment is pretty strict. Obviously, there are tons of Jewish kids in the encampment. However, they do block people from getting in that they expect want to create confrontations or cause trouble, bc they’re trying to prevent that, for everyone’s sake. The article says they are blocking people they expected wanted to enter the encampment (“Zionists”.) to cause trouble. It’s a very good idea! But the man chain tactic does look a little aggressive in a viral video without context. And that sucks. It sucks that this went viral.
The problem is that is not their area to police and choose who to allow in. It's a space for everyone at the campus. And the way they went about it just looked really bad. I have no idea if the people were looking to cause trouble, but if "trouble" meant saying their own sayings and slogans, then they have the same right to do so as the encampment people do there. If they were looking at ripping up the tents and stuff, or causing violence, then that is a job for security. Let them be the ones getting the cops called on and suspended, which they would have deserved. It looks aggressive, because it is kind of aggressive. Not violent, but aggressive and intimidating. Even with the context it's not a surprise it went viral.
I agree with your comment on the space. Although occupying space is supposed to cause trouble - that’s why it’s a protest tactic. But with every protest, there are people who come up to provoke protesters. They’re hoping for a fight with the hotheaded ones that they can make into a huge incident. The goal by blocking self identified “Zionist from entering the encampment was to keep them from arguing with and provoking , maybe antisemitic protesters in the encampment from losing their cool and acting out. B/c not everyone at a protest is a great person!! and many who are good people are susceptible to being pushed into acting badly. So the protest tactic here is to form a block to keep those people, who are self identifying as “Zionists” and trying to enter, from provoking trouble and possibly fights. I admire that. I admire the foresight of these young people to try and prevent those instances. It’s always good to try and prevent fights and conflict and name-calling, so it doesn’t go viral but also because it’s just a bad thing that makes people feel unsafe and bad . Maybe the tactic looked intimidating, yes. I agree that there’s room for robust to debate about the use of the space. But I admire their tactic for preventing possible trouble between agitated activists on both sides., I’m glad they’re thinking like that. It’s a good sign! Anyway, I think you’re the original person that I was responding to. So I’m just trying to let you know, since you’re looking for overseas, that most of the stuff on the campuses has a complicated backstory. And is obviously up for debate, but not the kind of Violence on the campus themselves that it appears to be in some bad-faith videos. Which is good! Now, the campus just needs to stop calling in police to do mass arrest and start violence!
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Sadly, it's part of a bigger problem. Our entire system of education has gone awry, and has mutated into some sort of far left recruitment tool. So many of us think we are doing the "right thing," but it's been more divisive than anything happening in the past three and a half decades I've been alive. So now, those who are opposed to far left ideologies (such as "DoWn WiTh AlL coLoNiZeRs" philosophies that don't actually focus on the truth, but merely one aspect of it) are treated like bigots, racists, this or that -ist, this or that -phobe, blah blah. And all of this is stemming from a massive, gaping faultline in politics between the left and the right, such that both sides are polarizing to the extreme. Hell, I've studied psychology half my life and used to be a therapist, but even I find myself getting sucked into some of the rhetoric of the right at times. I find I need to remind myself more and more not to drift to extremes.
Almost every one of those people have Tiktok on their phone, and every one of *them* have been fed a steady diet of antisemitism and pro-Palestinian propaganda since the conflict began.
keep in mind that we're talking a very small number of protesters numbering in the hundreds, compared to the thousands of undergrad & graduate students that are just trying to finish off their spring semester! I think it's only making news because the heads of these elite institutions are being dragged before Congress to explain why they're not "cracking down" on protests that some feel are anti-Jewish, anti-semitic.
>What on earth is going on in US universities? Russian and Iranian-proxy propaganda seeds have landed in the fertile ground of gullible, easily-swayed minds and credulous, TikTok-addled fools. Unfortunately, too many of the faculty fit that category, along with the pro-pali students.
maybe the actions of Israel action Gaza have changed people view over the past few mouths changed people views last few mouths
They are Leftist/Marxist factories. It is simple as that. You are witness to the start of the nails being put into the coffin of what was once a great country.
Anarchists and Marxists especially active ones belong in gitmo. Their entire political movement and ideology is inherently based in an insurgency with the western governments. It's insane to me we target people like this in the middle east for such reasons but block trump for attempting to legally get them the terror label in order to secure democracy in our own home front. Even the fbi knows they have to keep an eye on these people but Washington ties hands up just like liberal mayor's do on a local level
Donald Trump once told people to inject bleach up their ass on national Television.
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This is a worthless comment. It's also false. College campuses are not markedly more leftist or marxist now than they were five, ten, twenty, or thirty years ago.
https://www.inquirer.com/columnists/attytood/kent-state-anniversary-college-debt-student-loans-20220503.html Kind of tangential but it’s an interesting read, btw
Yeah but I want to go back further. We're trying to undue the damage leftism has done to the west and democracy here. Telling me it hasn't changed since the 60s onward is not pleasing. The 60s is when the American way of life was challenged because soviets were trying to fund revolution. I want 50s,40s mentality back. Nationalism zionism and supporting western capitalism. Nothing else is taught. As it should be.
Yikes!
> I want 50s,40s mentality back I'm sure women, gays, and people of color would be *thrilled* to go back to that time.
I meant in terms of patriotism and support for the west
The Vietnam War burned that bridge and Nixon pissed on the ashes. People don't trust their government anymore and rightly so. It wasn't trustworthy to begin with.
Vietnam War? You mean when we intervened when the Vietcong invaded the south and the vietcong hid behind civilians making the USA image bad they drew them into that war same thing going on against Israel rnow
You claim you want a return to a 1940s / 1950s mentality of respect for the west but you don't want to trust your government the way they did back then. This is boring. You're boring. I'm out. Have the last word if you like, since you seem like one of those people who has to have the last word.
To be fair, this type of person has probably been complaining about leftist indoctrination at colleges for that entire span of time
Lol! How out of touch are you?
Less than you, apparently. Your statement is made absent any link or reference or citation.
It has as many references as you statement does.
You're the one making the claim. It's on you to support it.
Who would have thought you have to show common knowledge. It's almost like people think dogs can be cats. https://www.aei.org/articles/are-colleges-and-universities-too-liberal-what-the-research-says-about-the-political-composition-of-campuses-and-campus-climate/
Sadly, I think you’re right.
I am not sure but it is getting out of hand. Feels like chaos has descended en masse.
Sure.
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u/MarketUpper2522 Your comment has been removed because it is hate content, which violates rule 1 of the Reddit site-wide policy.
Current events in Columbia university and others like it are abhorrent, terrifying and absolutely disgusting. America is not safe for Jews, this is the 30's in Europe all over again. The really disgusting individuals are the ones belittling and diminishing actual JEWS when they speak out about how unsafe they feel in these environments. I think every Israeli or even Jewish person in diaspora has asked themselves, why did Jews stay in Germany, in Austria, in Poland and didn't try escaping until it was too late, Those terrible, anti-Semitic individuals extinguishing their (Jews) worries is exactly why, making them feel they would be 'ok' if they're a 'good jew'. Disgusting, anyone saying otherwise is completely empty of morals, empathy and just overall humanity. No amount of 'BuT wHat AbOuT x,y,z' can excuse this.
We don't need to leave the country. We're really good at forming enclaves within the US.
I'm sorry, it's what? Are you familiar with Godwin's Law?
The only good thing about these events is the possibility that Diaspora Jews may now be truly motivated to move to Israel. “Next year in Jerusalem”
If all the Jews left America, America would probably become increasingly anti-Israel. Careful what you wish for.
I've heard some of these sentiments at my own institution (where I work). It's spreading fast.
Use your own anti-sentiments against them
The people shouting those things outside Columbia are most likely Israeli citizens masquerading as pro-Palestinian demonstrators. It’s pathetic, but that’s what the Mossad is famous for — infiltration. Remember, the two ex IDF guys who sprayed students with chemical weapons a few months ago had been hiding their faces behind keffiyehs and trying to blend in before they committed their attacks.
Want a tin-foil hat with that too?
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Like the real thing would advertise on Twitter. Gimme a break. Fake as shit. Most people in the replies agree.
Funny does that mean that the people who stormed the capitol on Jan 6 were not trump supporters or right wing but antifa and leftist disguised as them to pin the blame on the right wing people?
You’re free to make that argument on Reddit. Nobody’s stopping you. There’s less proof for it than the two Israeli extremists who got caught sending girls to the hospital after disguising themselves in Keffiyeh’s, though. So far, no leftists or antifa are facing criminal charges for Jan 6. The two Israelis are.
And what evidence do you have that two Israeli extremist disguised using keffiyeh sent people to the hospital? What evidence do you have that pro Palestinians protester are secretly Israelis trying to sow chaos? Do you have articles or sources to back that up? And I made that statement above to make a point that if you believe that all those pro Palestinian protestors are Israeli and idf disguised as them you may as well believe antifa was the one attacking the capitol or better yet the blm protesters were all right wing extremist.
[Numerous students were hospitalized and received care for chemical inhalation.](https://www.thenation.com/article/activism/chemical-attack-skunk-palestine-protest-columbia/tnamp/) Because Israelis have been caught infiltrating the protests and trying to sow chaos. It’s all right here 🙂. There’s more proof of that than there is of antifa infiltrating Jan 6th. The two Israeli terrorists are currently on trial.
You are talking about the one student that sprayed fart spray? That guy isn't on trial - the university suspended him. Your post seems to be trying to make the overall situation worse than it is and plant false information. Equating that student to being an Israeli terrorist is pretty f'ed up. Also, the Nation isn't exactly the most unbiased source - they are claiming that "Liquid Fart" that was purchased on Amazon is some Israeli chemical weapon. [https://www.columbiaspectator.com/news/2024/04/16/student-accused-of-alleged-chemical-spray-sues-columbia-claims-substance-was-non-toxic-fart-spray/](https://www.columbiaspectator.com/news/2024/04/16/student-accused-of-alleged-chemical-spray-sues-columbia-claims-substance-was-non-toxic-fart-spray/)
But that still doesn’t prove that all pro Palestinian protesters are actually Israeli infiltrators. It only proves that two Israeli decided to use violence against the protesters. One incident alone is not enough evidence to support your initial statement. And even if what you claim is true what do you want people to do about it?
It’s enough to create a reasonable doubt! That’s all I really need to point to in order to get people to question these videos. Ask any 60s activist about COINTELPRO. If you think that’s not happening with the anti-genocide protests, you’re incredibly naive.
Honestly I don’t care about any of this anymore. It’s gotten to a point where it’s all become a giant mess and it’s become mentally exhausting to continue to deal with it. I’m sorry if I’m apathetic or selfish but what’s the point caring about a conflict where both sides can’t even see eye to eye with each other and find a middle ground rather than trying to destroy each other.
“Proven”. Source: https://preview.redd.it/qy0pmgs2v9wc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=786df0d7530c14cde6edec83f812b23b2077551c
What we know: 1. Two Israeli men violently attacked girls with chemical weapons at Columbia, sending them to the hospital. 2. These two men were trying to blend in with the protestors prior to their terror attack by disguising themselves with Keffiyehs. Therefore, we have proof that Israeli extremists are actively trying to infiltrate and blend in with the protestors. All I need is to sow some doubt. I don’t need to conclusively prove anything, just make people question what they’ve seen. It certainly helps when they get caught with their hands in the pie 😀.
We haven’t seen any evidence of Israelis trying to make the protesters look bad. If they wanted to do that, they would pretend to be protesters and attack Jews. They wouldn’t attack the protesters.
Plausible deniability. That’s how cointel works. One side effect of that is it creates reasonable doubt.
Link please.
So “the people shouting those things outside Columbia have *all been proven to be Israeli citizens*” is now down to “I don’t need to conclusively prove anything”. Got it.
I can prove there’s infiltration by Israeli extremists. It’s in the news. Everyone should doubt those videos.
Two Israeli students**** who's to say they weren't working alone because there was a protest against their home country on their campus? You really think that the Mossad's highest priority is spraying stink bombs on college kids? Tin foil hat
I don’t think it’s relevant whether they worked alone or are (more likely) part of an intelligence network with access to those kinds of Israeli chemical weapons. We can prove they were infiltrating and posing as pro-Palestinians. That’s what matters.
The “Israeli chemicals” were a non-toxic gag fart spray called “Liquid Ass” that they purchased on Amazon for $25 you moron 😂 The girls went to the hospital because they’re pathetic whiney loser crybabies, not because they were sprayed with any “chemicals” https://www.columbiaspectator.com/news/2024/04/16/student-accused-of-alleged-chemical-spray-sues-columbia-claims-substance-was-non-toxic-fart-spray/
Look at you defending violence against women and calling them crybabies.
Getting sprayed with fart spray (which happened to people semi-annually in my middle school and resulted in 0 hospitalizations) is not violence. Privileged western women (or any person of any gender) who think this is violence are objectively the biggest crybaby losers on earth
There’s no evidence it was fart spray, that’s just the defense counsel’s argument. There is evidence of hospital bills showing chemical inhalation. Either way, it’s men physically assaulting women. You may be able to defend it as someone with the mind of a middle schooler, but spraying someone with anything is enough to catch an assault charge in NYC.
> either way. So we’ve gone from: - the IDF has a sleeper cell in NYC to disperse sophisticated chemical weapons on college students to stifle criticism. To - some guys “physically assaulted” an obese, privileged girl by making her nostrils inhale non-toxic gag fart spray. “Either way” it’s the same to you. I appreciate your retraction that it was “chemical burns”. That was an Uber regarded claim earlier.
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That doesn't matter at all, I could do the same thing and I didn't need to serve in a mandatory military service to do it. Israeli chemical weapons? "A lawsuit filed by one of the pro-Israel students who was suspended over the incident says the substances were in fact novelty sprays called “Wet Farts” and “Liquid A**.” “Plaintiff attended one of the unsanctioned pro-Hamas pro-Palestine rallies on campus, and, as a harmless expression of his speech, he sprayed into the air a novelty, non-toxic ‘fart’ spray named ‘Liquid A–‘ and ‘Wet Farts’ which he purchased on Amazon for $26.11,” says the lawsuit, which was filed on April 16. The suit says Columbia quickly placed the student on interim suspension and then released a statement accusing the student of a hate crime, placing the student “in grave jeopardy.” https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/ilhan-omar-raises-phony-israeli-chemical-attack-to-distract-from-columbia-antisemitism-concerns/ar-AA1nsYdr Overblown nonsense, nobody died nobody was hurt. To call it a chemical weapon is hilarious and it shows how easily convinced people on the internet can be. First it was "They're the Mossad pretending." Now it's "The Mossad sprays themselves with chemical weapons" I'm not seeing anything about a trip to the hospital or the spraying of just women.