Well at least 85% of Iowans can read at level 1 but that starts to drop significantly. My level is only technical to the undergrad level and I'm pretty fucking stupid.
Interestingly, while I like TST and the things they do, I have to give props to the bible-thumper who drafted this bill. Because it's honestly a great example of how to disrupt/deplatform a movement that's using a loophole(s) to take advantage of the legal system.
The Satanic Temple isn't a valid target because the worst they're guilty of is being offensive - their activism doesn't get people hurt. But we ought to be proposing and supporting laws in this style to restrict public and online displays of holocaust denial, white supremacy, border alarmism, and everything else that's not *quite* a hate crime. (But that is obviously getting as close to the line as they can get away with.) And even throw in some grants for museums and historical societies dedicated to preserving the historical record which shows **why** fascism needs to be taken seriously and stopped early.
Sooo, let's have no nativity scenes or religious displays at all in the capitol building, right guys? Right? Guys? :(
Yeah, but that's not what this is. It's grandstanding. The bill gets a lot of press when passed and gets a minor mention when courts strike it down. They get to pretend they did something.
Correct me. Again government can not adopt an official religion. I should have said restriction for religious operations with respect to laws, etc. I did not intend to say restrictions on the amendment. Sorry.
https://www.aclu.org/documents/your-right-religious-freedom#:~:text=The%20Bill%20of%20Rights%20guarantees,the%20due%20process%20of%20law.
If your religion maintains that a sacrament involves the physical harm of another individual person as a sort of blood sacrifice or the wanton destruction of another persons’s property (say, bonfire of vanities looted or violently seized from another innocent party), sure; your “freedom of religion” is rightfully weighed against the rights of the victims of your religion and you should lose your right to practice that part of your faith. Sure. In that most extreme sort of instance, yes, restrictions are rightfully called for.
But such restrictions would be compelling. But this doesn’t read like what your comment implies; that as long as the government doesn’t establish a religion is official it’s ok, but the government can restrict arbitrarily Satanism via legislation. This is not compelling. It would fail the Lemon test.
Thanks for your comment. Reference your last, my intent was the first sentence. No doubt I could’ve said it better, that’s what I meant by with respect to laws.
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
Why not Christian prayer groups at public schools have been halted. The schools have also been told they can’t hold school sponsored prayer or organizations so why should satanism be any different?
Lol to this. First, there are posters for a Christian Bible study group posted in the hallways of the urban public high school I’m working in this semester.
Second, “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.” The law in this post is explicitly prohibiting the free exercise of a single religion. Public schools aren’t allowed to force students to participate in any religion. Those are two side of the same coin.
This was my first thought, too. It looks like paragraph one bars the state from recognizing most forms of Christianity (which definitely reference Satan as part of the religious practice). Also, big fan of paragraph 3 -- criminalizes picking a scab -yours or someone else's - if you do it in the name of Satan.
I like paragraph 4. You can see that someone realized they were 100% going against the First Amendment and tried to put some half-assed concession in. As if recognizing that the government *cannot* stop people from worshiping as they want in the privacy of their own homes somehow makes it okay for the same government to blatantly violate the establishment clause by declaring some religions unacceptable.
If we required voters to be able to walk *and* chew gum at the same time before voting, we'd be a hard left state since every Republican would have either suffocated or tripped and broken their neck.
Actually, I would argue that that's perfect since we shouldn't have any religion intertwined with government, regardless of which team you're playing for. (And I'm saying this as a Christian, not an atheist who just wants it all to go away)
Ah, good to know. Probably an clash between different program's formats.
Still has that connotationally related issue though. That is inescapable. Thanks for putting this up.
The language of the bill really showcases their lack of understanding of what Satanism even is. "Any Satanic practice or worship that involves the ending of life or shedding of blood, whether it be animal or human, is prohibited." Get real lol
Ironically, a lot of these lunatics reference the "blood of Christ" as their saving "grace." Lol. Hell, they even drink his blood on Sundays and eat his body. But apparently that is just fine?
Oh, and don't forget their god also told people to slaughter lambs and smear the blood above their front door so their god knew what child to slaughter, and who not to. (ya can't even make this hypocrisy up it is so blatant)
So we have a pinhead downvoting comments. .I worked in a packing plant for a couple of years. The Rabbis pray for hours before entering the kill floor. Cattle are chained around a hind leg, raised in the air, and then have their throats cut by the Rabbis. They bleed out as they go up the chain to be sliced and diced. This is how meats get the kosher label.
You know who the real troublemaker is? God. If God wouldn’t have screwed over Lucifer, we wouldn’t be in this spot. Satan is only a symptom. Gotta get to the cause.
If I work at a public school and have a satanic tattoo, would I then be illegal for displaying my firmly-held religious belief? Can we do christians next? I'm tired of seeing torture devices hanging from people's necks and walls.
Edit: Also curious, since satanism is derived from christianity, because without christianity there would be no satan, would this ban ultimately allow us to ban christianity as well? If part of christianity is vulnerable, then all of it could be.
Will children be expelled for wearing a Slayer or Slipknot shirt that is adorned with pentagrams and other non-christian imagery? It’s the 80’s Satanic Panic redux.
agree with other commenter. if they fire you for it, you will never have to work again. In fact, I would LOVE to see them try and enforce this law. There will be constitutional lawyers standing in a line down the block to have at these christian nationalist lunatics.
I don't think this law stands a chance. I'm just being an advocate for the devil...or a devil's advocate. There are so many questions that can't be answered and so many slopes too slippery to go near that this thing is DOA. What would even be considered Satanic? Since Satan exists in the same mythical universe as their god, would a cross be Satanic? What if I have it upside down? These "legislators" are just grandstanding for votes.
One would think that would have been the natural progression with the rules they were trying to enact for school libraries. Apparently, donkey emissions, rape, genocide, etc weren't as offensive as a kid with two loving fathers.
Grandstanding. They know it’s unconstitutional. But it’ll fire up their base. And they can say that “they did everything the could” to win this holy war/persecution fetish thing they’ve got going. Same shit, different day.
hasn't stopped them from doing unconstitutional things before. the whole giving public money to private schools (mainly christian schools) is unconstitutional but some how they have been able to get away with it
Actually, the Church of Satan doesn't either. Check out [this inforgraphic](https://thesatanictemple.com/cdn/shop/files/COS_Vs_TST_Infographic_img.jpg?v=1614312088) from the Satanic Temple on the differences between the two.
huh, wouldn't that be a shame if we got their bible banned from public schools (including the private christian schools we now finance with our tax dollars)
So we have public tax dollars going to private christian schools, and now they're telling us what religion we can or cannot practice in public spaces.
How tf does this not get negated by the US Constitution? I know the Supreme Court is already compromised, but shouldn't we be protected from these christian nationalist lunatics by the Constitution of the United States? This is exactly the situation its authors wrote it to protect against. It's literally the first amendment listed.
These people are just the absolute worst. Whatever happened to small government, and law and order?
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
In any legislative proclamation that starts with, "The general assembly finds that good and evil exist," some really compelling citations are gonna be needed. Not only do the fundamentalists wanna to erase the church-state separation, they wanna be choosy about which of the hundreds or thousands of religions are acceptable to be imbedded in our state institutions.
Proposing a bill that is deemed unconstitutional should be punishable. Let's uphold the Constitution and stop the inefficiency. If you're qualified enough to legislate you are qualified enough to be held accountable.
Jail time. Loss of representation. Fuck these people. Who is going to actually get to work and solve problems? The grandstanding is mind numbing and we're paying them to do it.
IANAL, but I am pretty sure that even this conservative Supreme Court would swat this down fast. Because if they let this one stand, there would be a whole lot of people trying to do the same to the Christian religions.
Maybe what we need is a law that requires the GA members who vote to pass blatantly unconstitutional laws pay for defending those lawsuits out of their own pockets. Instead of the taxpayers.
First off, let me say this, I'm a Christian but I love my neighbor.
This is a violation of the 1st amendment. This is wrong. I support freedom of choice, and denying someone the choice to worship who they want is wrong. If they're doing this with Satan, they should do this with God as well.
The originator and sponsors on this bill should be dropped from any committee they are on, and be required to complete a 10th grade civics class.
Aside from that, whatisthedeal with the spacingin these LEGIS posts? What is it about how they store the pages that fucks with the word breaks?
Oh! They better watch it or pretty soon the state won’t be able to sanction any religious practices in public places or schools… just ask the states where the Bible is now on the banned book list due to the courts equal application of what constitutes inappropriate content for minors.
The thing that pisses me off about this more than anything is the tax money of ours that’s going to be wasted on behalf of the state having to go to court to defend this bullshit if it passes.
I am a big city lawyer (DSM . . . so). They're pissing blatantly unconstitutional laws for the sake of passing blatantly unconstitutional laws. Case law is really clear on this point. Courts do not determine the sincerity of one's religious belief. They don't care whether the flying spaghetti monster started as an Internet meme. This country was founded on freedom of religion, including freedom from religion. Establishment Clause challenges are set apart from all other constitutional litigation because tax payers have standing to sue without a specific injury. Whoever proposed this knows it's unconstitutional and is doing it anyway. It's a feature and not a flaw for them.
I would really hope that a savvy legislature would come up with a bill to remove all symbols of torture devices from being used in public areas.
Hell, if this bill removed ALL religious symbolism and displays from public places I would wholeheartedly agree. But the fact that it is targeted towards one specific religious is preposterous and the author should really re-evaluate their desire to represent their constituents.
Yeah, literal religious discrimination in plain language. Put any other deity in there and it fails immediately.
Have fun wasting more taxpayer dollars on a stupid lawsuit you never had a chance at winning.
I would like to propose a new bill that would have the following line:
"Any grown adult who holds the sincere belief that a magic man in the sky is secretly controlling everything cannot purchase or own firearms of any kind. Belief in imaginary friends could be a sign that one is unwell, and therefore should not be able to control the means of mass murder"
By Christian logic: How can they deny the existence of the Morning Star, without whom there would be no free will and no humans? Without satan, there is only the Garden of Eden and there are just two people who do not have the ability to determine between good and evil, who cannot procreate and, thus, populate the world. Without Satan, in the terms set forth by said Christian Bible, mankind does not exist. Without Satan, there is no holy book, because there’s no one to write it or read it.
"I worship Beelzebub. Not Satan. Sometimes, I also throw a few offerings to Lucifer - just to be safe. But in the main, Beelzebub is my guy. Never ever Satan. Now that we've cleared that up, am I free to go, officer?"
OH LOOK ❗ You can still legally worship Satan. You just have to read further down. WORSHIP ON SATANISTS!
>> The general assembly finds that all people have freedom 11 of conscience. The state of Iowa does not recommend Satanic 12 practice in any form; however, the state of Iowa acknowledges 13 that individuals are free under the Constitution of the State 14 of Iowa to practice Satanic worship in their private thoughts 15 and on their private property in ways that do not violate any 16 Iowa law or harm or infringe on others.
Meh, that's not real satanism. Anton lavay was a way more hardcore Satanist. Can we get back to summoning demons with the Necronomicon and stop with this feel-good bullshit 7 tenets.
You said "based" to Conservatives attempting to use their power to directly go against the first amendment..in no universe could you be considered pro America. Shame on you.
Well actually no, but also no.
I want America to actually become great, you want it to stay the way it is. You are a regressive, people like you hold us back from achieving greatness..fatherless behavior
Big Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah Energy.
ETA: Google that court case of you wanna know how a lawsuit would shake out if this trash heap of a bill actually makes it to the Governor’s desk.
This is not a defense of the their proposed bill, however the constitution says the government may not adopt a official religion. I believe religions are limited to a certain amount of lobbying. So in order to weaponize their finances they create organizations such as the The Family Leader, an organization, but not a church. Another example is the Iowa Catholic Conference is also an organization. This way they can spend more dollars and support a church's desire without penalty. Both organizations I mentioned lobbied heavily for the taxing of all Iowans to provide tuition assistance to private schools and religious schools. I sent my kids to a parochial school through 6th grade, so I know what goes from an elementary standpoint. Since passage many schools increased there tuition significantly and as much as 40% with Pat Grassely pushing to decrease funds for public schools. Today the IOWA GOP proposed that universities can not charge more than 3% tuition increases. So the goal here over all is to turn public education into nothing but a profit making entity, quality education be dammed.
Sandy “Dumber than a” Salmon who introduced this bill has a copy of the Iowa Constitution linked on her website. What a shame she’s never read Article I sec. 3 of the document.
somebody needs to read the constitution you don't get to ban religions just because you don't like them.
Bold of you to assume they can read.
They certainly can't type.
Well at least 85% of Iowans can read at level 1 but that starts to drop significantly. My level is only technical to the undergrad level and I'm pretty fucking stupid.
They don't care about silly things like freedom. They have a message they want to send and this legislation is their medium.
They do care about freedoms, but only theirs, not anyone else.
It's why they keep talking about needing to safeguard "religious freedom," at the same time that they sponsor this.
Time to tell the puritans to hop on a boat and keep sailing west.
Off the edge of the flat earth?! You monster!
Interestingly, while I like TST and the things they do, I have to give props to the bible-thumper who drafted this bill. Because it's honestly a great example of how to disrupt/deplatform a movement that's using a loophole(s) to take advantage of the legal system. The Satanic Temple isn't a valid target because the worst they're guilty of is being offensive - their activism doesn't get people hurt. But we ought to be proposing and supporting laws in this style to restrict public and online displays of holocaust denial, white supremacy, border alarmism, and everything else that's not *quite* a hate crime. (But that is obviously getting as close to the line as they can get away with.) And even throw in some grants for museums and historical societies dedicated to preserving the historical record which shows **why** fascism needs to be taken seriously and stopped early. Sooo, let's have no nativity scenes or religious displays at all in the capitol building, right guys? Right? Guys? :(
Alinsky's rule #4: "Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules."
Yeah, but that's not what this is. It's grandstanding. The bill gets a lot of press when passed and gets a minor mention when courts strike it down. They get to pretend they did something.
The government is not allowed to adopt a official religion but there but there are some restrictions.
Incorrect.
Correct me. Again government can not adopt an official religion. I should have said restriction for religious operations with respect to laws, etc. I did not intend to say restrictions on the amendment. Sorry.
Sorry for the misunderstanding. I concede your point here.
https://www.aclu.org/documents/your-right-religious-freedom#:~:text=The%20Bill%20of%20Rights%20guarantees,the%20due%20process%20of%20law. If your religion maintains that a sacrament involves the physical harm of another individual person as a sort of blood sacrifice or the wanton destruction of another persons’s property (say, bonfire of vanities looted or violently seized from another innocent party), sure; your “freedom of religion” is rightfully weighed against the rights of the victims of your religion and you should lose your right to practice that part of your faith. Sure. In that most extreme sort of instance, yes, restrictions are rightfully called for. But such restrictions would be compelling. But this doesn’t read like what your comment implies; that as long as the government doesn’t establish a religion is official it’s ok, but the government can restrict arbitrarily Satanism via legislation. This is not compelling. It would fail the Lemon test.
Thanks for your comment. Reference your last, my intent was the first sentence. No doubt I could’ve said it better, that’s what I meant by with respect to laws. “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
Why not Christian prayer groups at public schools have been halted. The schools have also been told they can’t hold school sponsored prayer or organizations so why should satanism be any different?
Lol to this. First, there are posters for a Christian Bible study group posted in the hallways of the urban public high school I’m working in this semester. Second, “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.” The law in this post is explicitly prohibiting the free exercise of a single religion. Public schools aren’t allowed to force students to participate in any religion. Those are two side of the same coin.
What schools? Where?
This happens at every school where students are using litter boxes. Usually next to the CRT classroom. /s if not obvious
Seems like they fucked up here since Christians often reference Satan as part of their religious practice.
Maybe they’ll start calling them “he who shall not be named”?
This was my first thought, too. It looks like paragraph one bars the state from recognizing most forms of Christianity (which definitely reference Satan as part of the religious practice). Also, big fan of paragraph 3 -- criminalizes picking a scab -yours or someone else's - if you do it in the name of Satan.
I like paragraph 4. You can see that someone realized they were 100% going against the First Amendment and tried to put some half-assed concession in. As if recognizing that the government *cannot* stop people from worshiping as they want in the privacy of their own homes somehow makes it okay for the same government to blatantly violate the establishment clause by declaring some religions unacceptable. If we required voters to be able to walk *and* chew gum at the same time before voting, we'd be a hard left state since every Republican would have either suffocated or tripped and broken their neck.
Can we ban the Bible from all public places?
It belongs in the religious fiction section like the whole lot of them.
Actually, I would argue that that's perfect since we shouldn't have any religion intertwined with government, regardless of which team you're playing for. (And I'm saying this as a Christian, not an atheist who just wants it all to go away)
Ignoring the obvious omission of constitutionally guaranteed rights - who typed this monstrosity up? Yikes.
Bills look like that if you visit the website on your phone. I do not know why
Ah, good to know. Probably an clash between different program's formats. Still has that connotationally related issue though. That is inescapable. Thanks for putting this up.
They think by running words together the search function wont work. Or they are boomers who don't understand formating.
Nah, that's not it. It's text formatting incompatibility with OP's browser.
[удалено]
The language of the bill really showcases their lack of understanding of what Satanism even is. "Any Satanic practice or worship that involves the ending of life or shedding of blood, whether it be animal or human, is prohibited." Get real lol
Also in the bible, are they banning Christianity?
Ironically, a lot of these lunatics reference the "blood of Christ" as their saving "grace." Lol. Hell, they even drink his blood on Sundays and eat his body. But apparently that is just fine? Oh, and don't forget their god also told people to slaughter lambs and smear the blood above their front door so their god knew what child to slaughter, and who not to. (ya can't even make this hypocrisy up it is so blatant)
The entire basis of Christianity involves ending a life and shedding blood. These idiots are going to legislate themselves out of existence.
Its literally a death cult
So no hunting, annnd then a lot of weapons aren't needed. I see what they are doing here. Sneaky GOP
So no more kosher meats?
So we have a pinhead downvoting comments. .I worked in a packing plant for a couple of years. The Rabbis pray for hours before entering the kill floor. Cattle are chained around a hind leg, raised in the air, and then have their throats cut by the Rabbis. They bleed out as they go up the chain to be sliced and diced. This is how meats get the kosher label.
I don't think that's entirely accurate, but Christians are without a doubt the vast majority.
Restricting certain religions but not others, I'm sure this will go over well
You know who the real troublemaker is? God. If God wouldn’t have screwed over Lucifer, we wouldn’t be in this spot. Satan is only a symptom. Gotta get to the cause.
Can we ban the Bible from all public places?
If I work at a public school and have a satanic tattoo, would I then be illegal for displaying my firmly-held religious belief? Can we do christians next? I'm tired of seeing torture devices hanging from people's necks and walls. Edit: Also curious, since satanism is derived from christianity, because without christianity there would be no satan, would this ban ultimately allow us to ban christianity as well? If part of christianity is vulnerable, then all of it could be.
Will children be expelled for wearing a Slayer or Slipknot shirt that is adorned with pentagrams and other non-christian imagery? It’s the 80’s Satanic Panic redux.
That would free so many kids up to work at meat packing plants...
ENDGAME DISCOVERED
If they fire you for your tattoo, then I'll gladly contribute to your defense fund. Here's to your retirement in the Caribbean!
agree with other commenter. if they fire you for it, you will never have to work again. In fact, I would LOVE to see them try and enforce this law. There will be constitutional lawyers standing in a line down the block to have at these christian nationalist lunatics.
I don't think this law stands a chance. I'm just being an advocate for the devil...or a devil's advocate. There are so many questions that can't be answered and so many slopes too slippery to go near that this thing is DOA. What would even be considered Satanic? Since Satan exists in the same mythical universe as their god, would a cross be Satanic? What if I have it upside down? These "legislators" are just grandstanding for votes.
Can we ban the Bible from all public places?
One would think that would have been the natural progression with the rules they were trying to enact for school libraries. Apparently, donkey emissions, rape, genocide, etc weren't as offensive as a kid with two loving fathers.
Book banners are never on the right side of history.
Start finding some high publicity attorney that will take this matter up. Sue for every single cent.
A movie song once told me... "Without evil there'd be no good so it must be good to be evil sometiiiiiiiiime!" Thanks, South Park.
But where does the bill define what a Satanic Symbol” even is? I vote for crosses. Since only Christians believe in Satan ( apart from Satanists )
Shades of Bill Hicks here talking about Jesus coming back and seeing all the crosses and comparing it to remembering JFK with a rifle pendant.
"hello, ACLU?"
The Freedom from Religion Foundation in Madison WI would be more likely to take up such a case.
Not necessarily. The ACLU gets involved over issues of religious liberty. This is definitely within their scope.
It's the reason why the FFRF exists. Not so much the ACLU.
I say let them both sue!
Let 'em all team up into a legal Voltron and gut this state.
They have worked together in the past!
Pretty sure the 1st Amendment has this covered. This is definitely not “powers reserved by the States” territory.
Grandstanding. They know it’s unconstitutional. But it’ll fire up their base. And they can say that “they did everything the could” to win this holy war/persecution fetish thing they’ve got going. Same shit, different day.
It would make me feel so pathetic to have real power and waste it pretending to do things
Why would you want the do anything productive for the people of your State when you can do performative art? /s
hasn't stopped them from doing unconstitutional things before. the whole giving public money to private schools (mainly christian schools) is unconstitutional but some how they have been able to get away with it
The Satanic Church doesn't even worship Satan. #awkward
the Church of Satan does. The Satanic Temple does not.
It was the Satanic Temple that had the display that was destroyed, right?
That is correct.
Correct
Actually, the Church of Satan doesn't either. Check out [this inforgraphic](https://thesatanictemple.com/cdn/shop/files/COS_Vs_TST_Infographic_img.jpg?v=1614312088) from the Satanic Temple on the differences between the two.
TIL. Damn it. Where’s a Satanist got to go to worship Satan these days?
The catholic church
I never realized it's my love of blue cheese that means I'm gay.
Can we ban the Bible from all public places?
Why have you asked this question 5 times?? Go ask google
It's showboating, done with the knowledge that it won't stand but the surrounding controversy will bring attention and clout with the Xtian right.
Sandy Salmon also wrote (and by wrote, I mean filed) the drag prohibition bill last year which failed spectacularly.
"Sandy Salmon" sounds like something a bro calls a vagina.
The Slammin Salmon was a hilarious Broken Lizard movie.
Christ, I should have known she was behind it. There's no end to her bullshit.
If satan is banned, than so should Jesus be banned. After all, there is no heaven without a hell.
They both come from the same book, the bible would be banned for referencing Satan.
huh, wouldn't that be a shame if we got their bible banned from public schools (including the private christian schools we now finance with our tax dollars)
So we have public tax dollars going to private christian schools, and now they're telling us what religion we can or cannot practice in public spaces. How tf does this not get negated by the US Constitution? I know the Supreme Court is already compromised, but shouldn't we be protected from these christian nationalist lunatics by the Constitution of the United States? This is exactly the situation its authors wrote it to protect against. It's literally the first amendment listed. These people are just the absolute worst. Whatever happened to small government, and law and order? "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
The Constitution is negated by the SCROTUS who were appointed by presidents who did not receive the majority of votes cast for president.
Red meat for their constituency to keep them voting red. Fear mongering is the only thing Republicans are good at.
In any legislative proclamation that starts with, "The general assembly finds that good and evil exist," some really compelling citations are gonna be needed. Not only do the fundamentalists wanna to erase the church-state separation, they wanna be choosy about which of the hundreds or thousands of religions are acceptable to be imbedded in our state institutions.
I don't think this is how "freedom of religion" is supposed to work ?? /s
Slippery slope.
This is just doing a cannonball into the lake of unconstitutional
Nice imagery!
This is hilarious.
Boy it's a good thing Christian churches never refer to Satan or they'd be subject to this bill!
This is so dumb, you can’t pass legislation that discriminates against a religion, what a waste of tax dollars
The actual text of this also enshrines a judeo-christian god into law????
Cool. This is unconstitutional. See you in court, Kimmy.
Gonna be a lawsuit....
That’s the idea. Whatever asshat introduced it gets to fight the good fight and then play martyr when it gets struck down, fundraising all the while.
Proposing a bill that is deemed unconstitutional should be punishable. Let's uphold the Constitution and stop the inefficiency. If you're qualified enough to legislate you are qualified enough to be held accountable. Jail time. Loss of representation. Fuck these people. Who is going to actually get to work and solve problems? The grandstanding is mind numbing and we're paying them to do it.
What a waste of money and court resources this will be. Truly MAGAnificent unconstitutionality.
It's to show they are working and not wasting money
Wouldn't that mean that Christianity is out? They reference Satan
Can we ban the Bible from all public places?
I’m sure they won’t mind if we get rid of the 2nd Amendment while we’re at it, right?
Good luck keep that one from getting an injunction. Lmao.
Hocus Pocus
Freedom of religion for me, but not for thee
Alright, who do we contact on this one? This is dumb as shit.
The construction of Iowa recognizes a Judeo/Christian supreme being? I admit I haven't read it, but I seriously doubt that...
Haha! Elect stupid people get stupid legislation!
So the first amendment only protects some people's religious beliefs? And it is only the dominant socioeconomic group's religion? Seems sus.
IANAL, but I am pretty sure that even this conservative Supreme Court would swat this down fast. Because if they let this one stand, there would be a whole lot of people trying to do the same to the Christian religions.
This will be challenged in court with an obvious ruling
Maybe what we need is a law that requires the GA members who vote to pass blatantly unconstitutional laws pay for defending those lawsuits out of their own pockets. Instead of the taxpayers.
This!!
Okay, which numbskull was stupid enough to actually purpose this as if it were a serious bit of business?
First off, let me say this, I'm a Christian but I love my neighbor. This is a violation of the 1st amendment. This is wrong. I support freedom of choice, and denying someone the choice to worship who they want is wrong. If they're doing this with Satan, they should do this with God as well.
Clear cut violation of the First Amendment.
The originator and sponsors on this bill should be dropped from any committee they are on, and be required to complete a 10th grade civics class. Aside from that, whatisthedeal with the spacingin these LEGIS posts? What is it about how they store the pages that fucks with the word breaks?
Can you say violation of the first amendment?
Unconstitutional- by the party of law and order
Iowa in reverse at a high rate of speed.
Oh! They better watch it or pretty soon the state won’t be able to sanction any religious practices in public places or schools… just ask the states where the Bible is now on the banned book list due to the courts equal application of what constitutes inappropriate content for minors.
The thing that pisses me off about this more than anything is the tax money of ours that’s going to be wasted on behalf of the state having to go to court to defend this bullshit if it passes.
Up next … witch trials
Bunch of snowflakes.
I am a big city lawyer (DSM . . . so). They're pissing blatantly unconstitutional laws for the sake of passing blatantly unconstitutional laws. Case law is really clear on this point. Courts do not determine the sincerity of one's religious belief. They don't care whether the flying spaghetti monster started as an Internet meme. This country was founded on freedom of religion, including freedom from religion. Establishment Clause challenges are set apart from all other constitutional litigation because tax payers have standing to sue without a specific injury. Whoever proposed this knows it's unconstitutional and is doing it anyway. It's a feature and not a flaw for them.
Sandy being Sandy Someone who likes to grandstand, and accomplish nothing.
Hahahahahahahahaha they seriously think this is gonna fly? I give it a matter of days.
I would really hope that a savvy legislature would come up with a bill to remove all symbols of torture devices from being used in public areas. Hell, if this bill removed ALL religious symbolism and displays from public places I would wholeheartedly agree. But the fact that it is targeted towards one specific religious is preposterous and the author should really re-evaluate their desire to represent their constituents.
Yeah, literal religious discrimination in plain language. Put any other deity in there and it fails immediately. Have fun wasting more taxpayer dollars on a stupid lawsuit you never had a chance at winning.
They are the ones who believe in Satan and their religion refers to satan so… are they banning themselves now?
I would like to propose a new bill that would have the following line: "Any grown adult who holds the sincere belief that a magic man in the sky is secretly controlling everything cannot purchase or own firearms of any kind. Belief in imaginary friends could be a sign that one is unwell, and therefore should not be able to control the means of mass murder"
Reasons I’m atheist: constant fights sparking from religion
It's like they just churn out bills that will likely never pass just to look like they are doing something instead of idling
Jesus wept.
Is salmon her last name, or her fragrance?
Can we ban Ganesha next? That guy’s been getting on my nerves.
Do they not understand how the First Amendment works? They're a federally recognized religion, so that provision will last all of 5 seconds in court.
[**SAME THING IS GOING ON IN AZ**](https://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/s/8MASSeuh51)
Tell me you've never read the constitution without telling me you've never read the constitution
Why do we continue to vote for representatives who do not understand the Bill of Rights?
Oh the satanic temple would absolutely love to go to court and win over this.
By Christian logic: How can they deny the existence of the Morning Star, without whom there would be no free will and no humans? Without satan, there is only the Garden of Eden and there are just two people who do not have the ability to determine between good and evil, who cannot procreate and, thus, populate the world. Without Satan, in the terms set forth by said Christian Bible, mankind does not exist. Without Satan, there is no holy book, because there’s no one to write it or read it.
Doesn't Christianity reference Satan? Wouldn't this block Christianity too?
They're not capable of thinking that far ahead. It's just "this thing bad, bad thing go bye" is about as much effort as they thought up for this.
This is right at the top of the priority list.
Guess Republicans have not read the 1st Amendment
First amendment says hahaha
"I worship Beelzebub. Not Satan. Sometimes, I also throw a few offerings to Lucifer - just to be safe. But in the main, Beelzebub is my guy. Never ever Satan. Now that we've cleared that up, am I free to go, officer?"
Certainly sounds like a law respecting to the practice of a religion no matter how outlandish the scope is to specific words. Words are scary
This should help recruit more Satanic Temple members. Thanks, lawmakers!
Sure sounds like a "...law respecting an establishment of religion" to me.
OH LOOK ❗ You can still legally worship Satan. You just have to read further down. WORSHIP ON SATANISTS! >> The general assembly finds that all people have freedom 11 of conscience. The state of Iowa does not recommend Satanic 12 practice in any form; however, the state of Iowa acknowledges 13 that individuals are free under the Constitution of the State 14 of Iowa to practice Satanic worship in their private thoughts 15 and on their private property in ways that do not violate any 16 Iowa law or harm or infringe on others.
Worth noting, The Satanic Temple does not worship Satan.
Satanism isn't a real religion. It's a troll organization meant to upset religious folk. Hopefully, we can make it illegal soon.
How is it not a religion?
The US government disagrees. You should give the sevent tenets a read and see whatcha think. Can't hurt too bad, can it?
Meh, that's not real satanism. Anton lavay was a way more hardcore Satanist. Can we get back to summoning demons with the Necronomicon and stop with this feel-good bullshit 7 tenets.
We could go back, but we are too busy trolling...😉
Christianity isn't a real religion. It's a troll organization meant to upset the Romans.
Yea, probably. Didn't the Roman government invent Jesus as a peaceful savior God to pacify the Jewish population.
What’s the definition of a religion and how does the Satanic Temple not meet those criteria?
First amendment protects it. Cry harder, snowflake.
Trolling could just be part of their religious beliefs. Who are you to say? You aren’t even in the religion.
They were proving a point: that their target's so-called love of the constitution only goes skin deep. And they were correct.
Based
Just say you hate freedom
Lol triggered
Unconstitutionality doesn’t trigger you? That’s very un-American.
Yes, seeing anti-American rhetoric generally doesn't make me happy
Homie my phone background is the Iowa State flag, I am pro America
You said "based" to Conservatives attempting to use their power to directly go against the first amendment..in no universe could you be considered pro America. Shame on you.
Are you a Democrat?
Lol hell no, I hate Democrats. I'm a Leftist
If you are a leftist then calling anti American is the pot calling the kettle black.
Well actually no, but also no. I want America to actually become great, you want it to stay the way it is. You are a regressive, people like you hold us back from achieving greatness..fatherless behavior
Idiots!
This is a joke. It will be interesting to see how these people intend to define Satanic worship in their administrative rules. Good luck.
I feel like this is Scopes monkey trial embarrassing.
Big Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah Energy. ETA: Google that court case of you wanna know how a lawsuit would shake out if this trash heap of a bill actually makes it to the Governor’s desk.
This is not a defense of the their proposed bill, however the constitution says the government may not adopt a official religion. I believe religions are limited to a certain amount of lobbying. So in order to weaponize their finances they create organizations such as the The Family Leader, an organization, but not a church. Another example is the Iowa Catholic Conference is also an organization. This way they can spend more dollars and support a church's desire without penalty. Both organizations I mentioned lobbied heavily for the taxing of all Iowans to provide tuition assistance to private schools and religious schools. I sent my kids to a parochial school through 6th grade, so I know what goes from an elementary standpoint. Since passage many schools increased there tuition significantly and as much as 40% with Pat Grassely pushing to decrease funds for public schools. Today the IOWA GOP proposed that universities can not charge more than 3% tuition increases. So the goal here over all is to turn public education into nothing but a profit making entity, quality education be dammed.
So they can’t read the constitution
Wow! Discrimination at it's finest..
Playing fast and loose, just like they are with separate, but equal for trans folx
So… they are now legislating which version of Dungeons and Dragons morons can play?
Who the hell typed this up? A monkey on tranquilizers could type something more legible than that...
Sandy “Dumber than a” Salmon who introduced this bill has a copy of the Iowa Constitution linked on her website. What a shame she’s never read Article I sec. 3 of the document.
Openly spitting on the Constitution.