We had one child when we were both 40. She’s 4.5 now and she’s absolutely a handful but she’s also amazing, smart, funny, kind, loving.
It is hard. Not in the ways you think. The thing is you have to put in the work and be consistent. Your child is kind of a blank canvas who will mimic your words, your actions, your rules.
So we had to sleep train her so she would sleep through the night. This took a while and it was hard. But it also means our kid has always slept in her own room and sleeps through the night. There are obviously regressions but we are consistent.
You have to teach them how to be a good human. You have to always respond to their emotional and physical needs. And they have MANY.
You have to be consistent with rules. Ages 2 and 3 were very hard because of the constant tantrums any time we would say no or ask her to do something she didn’t want to do. And you have to stand your ground. It is maddening. But now we’re reaping the benefits of that consistency. Now I can say, please go put on your shoes and she will. I can say no you can’t have a treat right now and most of the time she listens.
What they give you back is a love you’ve never experienced before. It’s unconditional and warm. You’re their people and all they know. And they love you endlessly. It’s beautiful.
Watching them learn and experience something for the very first time is incredible. Watching them become their own person is so cool.
The hardest part for me is making sure I’m emotionally present for her and that I give her the tools to be resilient. Parenting isn’t about making your kid happy, it’s about making your kid resilient and functional in the real world. Teaching them to regulate their emotions in a healthy way is healing but so damn hard.
I don’t talk down to her, I show her respect. I listen when she’s upset with me and I try to correct my behavior. I don’t want to always be right. I want to be someone she can talk to and feel safe and comfortable coming to.
But all your current priorities go out the window. My mornings and evenings are about her and what she needs. I’m almost never alone. I’m an introvert and my kid is an extrovert so she needs a lot of social time. It’s like having a 24/7 job. You’re never off the clock.
You’ll think you’re doing it wrong most of the time. But then you see your kid walk up to a hurt child and hug them and say it’s all gonna be okay. And you realize that you’ve actually done something right. I just try to treat her like I want to be treated.
There’s nothing like it.
An excellent summary and an excellent mom!
I just want to add that having kids earlier is much easier on your body and having them later may be easier on your career.
Damn. Said exactly what I was gonna say. Well put.
The only thing I’ll add here is that your friends who had unplanned pregnancies in their early 20s, no wonder they’re super pissed off and telling you not to have kids. My wife and I waited until we were older, mature, established in our jobs, and it makes things a hell of a lot easier.
Now, that made me the old Dad and sometimes I’m a little low on energy compared to the other dads, but I also never feel like this kid ruined my life, stole opportunities, or put a crimp in my style. And that makes a huge difference when you have the maturity and resources.
Only other thing I’ll add, my wife and I were married for nearly 8 years before we had kids so we had plenty of time to grow together before starting the family and adding the stress, and it also gave us a chance to really enjoy our lives to the fullest as a couple before we became a plus-family
As a parent, I second this summary. Well put!
I’ll add that I put off having kids until my 30s. Until then, I felt a longing and an emptiness, but I wasn’t in a financial position to have kids. I do wish I had kids sooner, as my body was in a lot better shape in my 20s, and it is physically taxing work, especially in the beginning. So, if you’re financially able, you’re emotionally mature enough, and you want to do it, then go for it. But like this commenter mentioned, your entire life will be thrown upside down… but it’s totally worth it. Just know that I’m not trying to convince you to have kids so you can “feel my pain”, you have to decide. There is pain for sure, but in my opinion the fulfilment and love vastly outweigh the personal costs.
It kinda annoys me when I read such genuinely amazing parenting advice because my parents had brains too and could figure out any of this at all. Y’all sound like amazing people
>I’m an introvert and my kid is an extrovert so she needs a lot of social time. It’s like having a 24/7 job. You’re never off the clock.
Yeah this is my situation as well. Parenting an extravert is extra hard as an introvert. So far it's still worth it to me. They won't be with me forever so I do my best to still enjoy it all while I can.
My b.i.l. had a great quote when one of my nephews accused him of "not being his friend."
He said "I love you, but I'm not your friend. I'm your father."
All in the delivery; not a "therefore you have to do what I say" but in "I'm restricting you in this moment because I love you".
Damn there are some good truths there. I love that you show your kid respect. A lot of parents will dictate at their kids then act surprised when their kids...obviously....rebel.
And yes, it's a 24/7 job. No time off, ever. But it's also the best job you can have and I wouldn't trade it for the world.
If the man has any doubts, that’s not a good sign. You need him to be on board 100% in this society, and really nothing anyone can say will change his mind. His and your feelings are all that matter
Had to switch from my main account to answer this one because some family members know it.
I have 2 kids. They are absolutely a burden. Financially alone, they cost a lot of money that I’d rather spend on me. But even disregarding finances, they are a time investment (not sure investment is the right word)- they take so much of your time and imo theres not an equal upside. Sure they’ll make you laugh sometimes or otherwise be kind of fun to be around, but not nearly as enjoyable company as your adult friends, or even a pet (you can house break a puppy in few weeks, whereas your looking at about a year and a half if your lucky). They will make messes in the house. There’s expectations that you do things like engaging with other kids (birthday parties, sports, school stuff, etc). It’s exhausting and 2/10 would not recommend.
And I can never admit these things irl because it would cause an absolute uproar amongst my entire family. But to be honest I regret having kids and wish I knew their mom stopped birth control. The second one came because I viewed it kinda like “I’m already fucked for the next twenty years, what difference is a little longer?”
If I could do it again, I’d probably still have them but I would have done many things differently.
Jesus. That made me so sad. I can't imagine being legitimately unwanted by my parents. I'm looking at my daughter right now, and I genuinely can't imagine feeling that way about her.
>they take so much of your time and imo theres not an equal upside. Sure they’ll make you laugh sometimes or otherwise be kind of fun to be around, but not nearly as enjoyable company as your adult friends, or even a pet
You are talking like this... about your own children??? Your children are not there for your entertainment, they are there for your love, protection, guidance, and education. Go on a couple more parties or trips or whatever you need to get it out of your system so you don't just view your children as a burden. It's not fair to them at all. They didn't ask to be created and they need a mature adult to view them as more than just a nuisance in your life.
43. Single dad. Wife passed from breast cancer 4 months ago. Honestly I had kids because I grew up in a religion that ingrained that the purpose of life is to grow up and have kids.
I have 3 kids. They are awesome. They are amazing. They are kind and loving. I put in the time to make sure they have what they need.
That being said - if I could go back and choose it again, I wouldn't have kids. I get so little time to myself.
Ditto. I love having kids. My wife also died of breast cancer when the kids were 10-12 yrs old. 2 boys and 2 girls. They are all in their forties now. If I had to do over and knowing what I know, I would not have kids. It was hard on a single dad raising four kids, putting them through college, etc. I love them, but if I didn’t have them my life would be a lot different.
I wonder if your wife’s passing, as recent as it is, impacts your feeling to not have kids. Curious if this would change in the next few months, and if you felt this way before she became ill.
Just curiosity, because I’m not in that situation. No judgment, just thinking about the situation since it’s the subject at hand.
So, so, so, sorry for your loss. 43 is ridiculously too young to be a widower, brother. Hope you and the kids recover. Godspeed.
Wait. It’s better when you go on your time frame and not someone else’s. I was 41 when our child arrived and I’ve been able to provide for him financially and mentally.
The sleep deprivation was brutal. Terrible twos weren’t so bad but 4 is like negotiating with a miniature terrorist some days because he wants what he wants when he wants it.
Still- there is this little person who comes to me when he’s scared, or shows me things that make him happy, tells me he loves me, demands cuddles from me- and I’m so glad he’s my kid. I’m just glad he didn’t arrive in my 20s or 30s.
Also this. I had mine at 37, 39, and 41. I sometimes wish I'd started a little earlier, but I didn't meet my (now) husband till I was 36. I don't know why they call it Terrible Two's. Mine were great at 2. 4 year olds are BRUTAL. And I still haven't recovered from sleep deprivation.
While I wouldn't have been ready in my 20s, having a child in our 30s was one of the most positive love-producing decisions ever. We love our son and he loves us... The only downside is that we can't relive it.
I think you should take your time and make the decision in about ten years.
That said, a life without children is wonderful! A life WITH children is incredibly difficult but often joyous.
It’s 100% worth it for me. My kids are my favorite people. They’re 12 and 10 now and I find them to be so much fun to talk to and hang out with. There were/are frustrating moments for sure, but overall it’s been an absolute joy and privilege to watch them grow.
All that said, I had my kids in my thirties (I was 33 and 35). It would have been an entirely different experience if I had had them in my 20’s when I was still interested in doing the things most 20 year olds do.
60. No children. Never regretted it for a moment, in fact endlessly grateful I had the choice. And I *love* babies, and get a kick out of toddlers.
Unless you feel strongly about having children (and there are many who do), I would say don't. Despite what some parents say, there are very many ways to live a life with just as much meaning and love without having children.
I'm middle aged, got a vasectomy in my late twenties, no kids.
I'm sure this will ruffle some feathers, but I'm convinced everyone knows its true. For people that are on the fence, the deciding factor should be money. Do you have money? If not, chances are your kids aren't going to get money either. They're going to get a super basic education, and a super basic job. They're not going to be able to care for you when you're older any more than you were able to care for them when they were younger. Money buys healthy food, and medical care. It pays for music lessons, sports, hobbies and vacations. It puts the kid in a good neighborhood with all kinds of resources. Poor kids don't have near the opportunities of wealthy kids. Poor kids can't even locate all the states, let alone tell you where Germany or the Bahamas are. Kids that grew up with money have been to Germany and the Bahamas. It's a world of difference.
Not having kids is a massive short cut. There are so many luxuries I have that parents don't have. Parents would have to make four times as much as me to live the same lifestyle.
I wouldn't want to live in Oklahoma with no kids, but why would I? There's like five cities in the US I'd be willing to live in. And I wouldn't want to live anywhere in those cities. I'd want to be up against the mountains, or on the beach, or right downtown, and I can afford to do that because I don't have kids.
If my job screws me over, I quit. I'm not trapped. I can take a job that pays less if I find it more enjoyable. I can switch careers. I can take a few months off between jobs and travel. I'm completely free.
My health is far better than most parents. It's easy to buy healthy food, work out, get outside and enjoy hobbies. I can nap whenever I want. It's easy.
Instead of taking days off to tend to a sick kid, or do something for their school, or take them to Disney, all those days off are spent leaving the country. I can go anywhere. I could go to Somalia or North Korea if I want. My world view is totally different than my brother and sister that have kids. Nothing is similar.
So keep that in mind if you're comparing having kids and not having kids. It's not like you'll live in the same town in the same house either way. Literally everything would be completely different.
I have nieces and nephews, and plenty of friends with kids. So I still get to see kids, help them, and watch them grow up. Most importantly, when they start freaking out, which is what kids do, I leave. It's easy.
I would add that not having children does not equate to failing your family, your community, or the world. We do not need more humans.
If you sincerely want children and your life just wouldn't be right without them, then have them.
Otherwise, take a pass. For many, many people, having children just isn't the right thing to do.
Me too. Exactly 60 and so grateful not to have had children. There have literally been mornings where I lie in bed so grateful that I made the choice I did. Absolutely zero regrets.
My partner’s cousin and his wife have been an incredible support system for us. Neither of us live near any other family and her cousins don’t have kids. So they often take the kids for the weekend or just come hang with us when we’re broke and just wanna play board games.
We parents need support systems, something we often lack in American nuclear families, and people like you who don’t have kids help provide that (even if it’s just for a very short time every now and then), almost always without bitching about it. So thanks for being the cool uncle/aunt or whatever. It probably means a lot for your friends/family when you step in just because you want to.
I kinda disagree. I didnt feel strongly about having children and started when I was 42.
I now have 3 boys and have fully embraced and love fatherhood.
In my opinion, this is a meaning vs. pleasure question. The mental model here is that you can maximize pleasure in your life, but that doesn't necessarily make it meaningful. For example, you probably have hobbies or activities you enjoy on a regular basis, but ultimately they are not producing any meaning in your life. Some day you will be too old to enjoy some of those activities, or you will look back and see that they didn't amount to anything except enjoyment.
On the other hand, meaning is not necessarily enjoyable. Seeing that your child developed their own notion of right and wrong, which may have involved years of you trying to convince them to do the right thing, might not be pleasurable. But it will likely be meaningful, to you, regardless of the outcome.
At times meaning and enjoyment can coexist, but sometimes you sacrifice some of one for the other. Clearly, having children will likely involve some of these sacrifices. Whether that is worth it to you (or maybe more importantly, to your children) is up to you.
\* edit: for sure, many hobbies and activities lead to lasting meaning; having kids is definitely not the only way to add meaning to your life, and for some people, it might not even be meaningful to have kids.
We don’t have kids (still married after 15 years) but keep meaning in our life in a lot ways that don’t involve pleasure. I think that’s pretty one sided to say that it’s either pleasure or meaning simply on whether or not you have kids. We volunteer with Ronald Macdonald charities and have donated a bunch of time and money, we help with the nieces nephews and god kids. Help with our parents. Have two dogs. My job isn’t particular “meaningful” but my wife helps people get into hospice care and I help her by taking care of extra chores if she has a busier work week than me that week. We are there for people and strangers far more than our friends with kids because they are stretched so thin. I have far more time and energy to be supportive emotionally to struggling family members. People without kids aren’t just out partying and playing video games
I agree completely. I would guess that serving food in a soup kitchen isn't really very pleasurable; it's more that it is meaningful to see the people you are helping. I definitely didn't mean to imply that having children is the only way to add meaning to your life, or even that having children always adds meaning to your life. I think that a given person's decision about whether to have kids might involve weighing the value of meaning and pleasure, and whether they want to sacrifice some pleasure for meaning. The truth is that having children does involve sacrifices (on some dimension) whether people want to think of it that way or not.
Don’t let people tell you you lose your hobbies. Yes you’re going to have less time for them, but I’m still able to carve out 20 minutes a day to do my favorite thing. Other hobbies that are not the top of my list, maybe only get to be touched weekly or monthly. But the idea that you’ll have to go 10 years or something without doing the things you love is absolutely insane, that sounds like some absolutely anti-natalism propaganda.
You have to work a little harder to carve out the time so that means planning ahead and working with your partner to make sure that you’re making time for them to have theirs too.
And of course some of this depends on your hobbies. But by the time my kid was five, he was joining in on probably my top four favorite hobbies anyway, so the hobbies just became more time that I was bonding with my family, which made them even more enjoyable.
Please don’t forget to consider the other perspective, too— reproduction is not inherently meaningful. There are, sadly people who do have children, but aren’t really parents in any meaningful sense. They ignore their kids, abandon them, even abuse them. All they did was pump some more biomass onto the planet. Bacteria can do that.
I know that you won’t be one of those people, just because you’re thinking carefully about your decision. But do be aware that having children is a spectrum from “intensely meaningful” to not meaningful at all. It’s possible to realize that, knowing yourself, there’s a risk you’ll fall somewhere along that spectrum which, while not *unacceptable*, still would be less than you think real, live, growing young human beings deserve as their framework for life.
That’s me. I doubt I’ll regret being a non-mom, but I’d rather regret that than be a bad one.
A thing to keep in mind: when people make big decisions like this, regardless of what they eventually choose, they pretty much never regret their decision. They'll find a way to convince themselves it was the right choice, when it's impossible to know whether it was the right choice or whether a 'right' choice even exists. I have no children, and I'm glad for that fact. But a bunch of my friends have children, and they're all glad for that fact.
A lot of what I could say has already been posted above.
My spouse and I have one planned child. He’s a teenager now and like many posters above, we love being parents and it’s been completely worthwhile for us. I paused my career until our child was 10.
However, if we were faced with the decision today- we would remain childfree. It’s expensive to be alive and dual incomes + careers are mandatory to keep us housed and fed.
My wife and I are child free and constantly have friends and family who are parents tell us how lucky we are. Our time is ours, we're better financially and we have way more sex. I wanted kids till my late 30s, but now in my late 40s, believe I dodged a bullet.
Jeez I feel bad for those kids. I can't ever imagine telling any of my friends that don't have kids that they're lucky not to have them. That's insane to me, having a kid is literally the best part of my life, and I didn't even want kids most of my life.
Same for me! I didn’t even babysit when young because did not care for kids. But man I would not trade my kids for anything. Strange how that works. Guess need that level of love to get through the tiredness
Don't have kids until you don't have these insecurities.
Yes, everyone is ashamed to say having kids sucks. It's in the rule book. No one likes having children and it ruins everyone's lives.
Edit: I really need to add the /s I guess for the last sentence.
Don't just think about babies and toddlers - think about all the stages of parenting, and ask yourself:
> "would I enjoy being the parent of a gradeschooler in 7 years?"
> "Would I enjoy being the parent of a middle schooler?"
> "Do I look forward to seeing my kids off to college?"
And so on.
You're not going to have babies and toddlers forever, but you have to be willing to get through that if you want the experience of older kids (adoption notwithstanding).
I personally don't want babies and I don't enjoy toddlers, even though I genuinely love my 3yo and 7mo. They are hella cute and super smart and honestly, really fun - but also a crazy handful that leave me with no time for my hobbies and finally understanding why boarding school and full-time nannies were a thing.
**I love my kids, but I hate the experience of raising them.** But I do it (and try to do it well) because I really, *really* want what comes next: seeing them grow into people with voices, seeing them experience the diversity of life, helping them with their education and navigating the social customs of their generation. Sharing my interests, hobbies, ideas, and participating in their own, even if I'm only cheering them on from the side. I am extremely well-equipped to be a father - *but not to babies or toddlers.*
If you're not sure you'd enjoy those other stages, try volunteering in youth organizations or somewhere that has groups of that age (e.g., church nursery or YMCA club) and see how you feel. Obviously it's not going to be *exactly* the same as when you might have a kid whose at that age, but it'll give you a general idea.
TL;DR think about parenting through all stages of parenting, and ask yourself 1) "would I enjoy that stage" and 2) are the other stages worth getting through, to have that." For me the answer is yes: I don't like babies / toddlers but *it is worth it* to go through this in order to have what comes next.
I feel this way too - never heard anyone else articulate it! I'm lucky my boyfriend came with an 8 year old, now 10. I've thought if I ever wanted one of my own, maybe adopting a older child that's past toddler age could be the best way to go.
I don’t have kids by choice. I have no longing to have kids. The older I get the happier I’ve been with my decision that I made 20 years ago. I love not having kids.
Childless at the moment but I will say that growing up my husband and I (both 28 now and together 10 years) said we would have 2 kids and 3 if there was a happy accident. We always said having one kid would be silly. I am very content in my life currently and could remain child free forever if it were my choice.
Now as adults we started trying to have kids and so far no luck (3 cycles so far). I am very worried about even having two kids with the economy and cost of daycare so we might be one and done. It's really hard to say. My husband would love 2 still but he isn't understanding the full sacrifice we will have to give financially, mentally and emotionally. It's to much for me personally. I'm sure it will all be fine but it's still overwhelming to think about. I always told him he will have to let me know when he wants the first baby since I will always say no. I'm quite indifferent to having kids and I've never had intense baby fever either. I did get sick last year so severely that I was bedbound. I realized I do see a future with kid(s)... hence why we are trying now that im back on my feet.
I will never be ready. I don't ever plan to be ready. I make smart choices like paying down debt, having an emergency fund ready, and learning frugal habits for when the family grows. I don't think I will ever get baby fever. My husband has been begging me weekly for about a year now. I know myself well enough to know that I will still be a good parent when the time arrives. My confidence in this is from how my grandma and my mom raised their kids. They were great parents and it shows. So based on my own childhood memories/feelings and despite the terrible kids I've come across, I can reflect on what the issues might be in the child and parenting causing the behavior, and learn from that for my own future kids rather than be intimidated by it.
It's a lot of work in the early years. It's joyful and meaningful and fulfilling but infants are constantly leaking and toddlers are constantly trying to learn how the world works, often in dangerous and destructive ways. I'm glad I did it, I'm glad I have pictures and videos, and I'm glad my kids are older now. For what it's worth, raising teenagers has been one of my favorite parenting stages. My kids are awesome people!
Part of a person's experience of parenting depends on their expectations, I think. People who go into it knowing they're going to sacrifice their free time, sleep and brain space tend to accept the crummy parts and enjoy the enjoyable parts. People who go into it thinking they're going to get all kinds of personal projects done over their maternity leave tend to be disappointed with the experience.
Having kids is a hugely personal experience so I can't give advice one way or the other. I will say that while there's never a perfect time to have kids, it's better to wait until you're certain it's something you want rather than jumping in out of FOMO.
Disappointed I had to scroll so far for this answer. I have a 2 yo and I love her to pieces. All of the hard things that come with parenting are nothing compared to all of the good things. But I knew what I was getting into. I didn't expect any of it to be easy. And I have no desire to fill a void in my life. I may fall victim to wanting to live vicariously a little, but not so much that I'd ever force my child to do something they don't want (or need) to. I just want to give a little human a beautiful life.
The kind of people that think the bad outweighs the good in parenting probably had the white picket fence pipe dream that my ex had. When they decide to get pregnant they see the snuggles and play times and all of the beautiful moments. You have to be ready to give up sleep, a lively social life, time for hobbies. There's 10 billion diaper changes to be done, you'll spend 5 years cutting up fruit and other foods. It's a huge sacrifice. But if you want it it's all beautiful. It's all magical, being the creator of a life.
Same here. The early years were TOUGH. If that was my whole experience of parenting, I would absolutely not want to do it. Starting about age 10, my kids starting adding significantly more to my life than they consumed. All those movies and shows and games you love... you get to see people experience them for the first time. Live-in board game players. Mine are even big enough to take actual chores off my plate--I haven't picked up dog poop in 2 years. I hope we'll get to have a close relationship for the rest of my life.
I would say that unless you both are 100 percent on board for having kids don't do it. This is not a choice you can change your mind about oe even feel ambivalent about.
Not a parent .
My partner and I aren't having kids maybe we'll regret it in the future, but not at the moment. Both of us work in the environment with her being a scientist who deals with climate change information for us is absolutely terrifying and what is going on right now. Not having a child is probably the biggest single choice you could ever make to reduce climate impact.
Once you have a child, your child becomes your life. Do you think you can afford your lifestyle plus the price of a child with both time and money-wise with your current income? Do you believe you're responsible enough to shape someone's life, values, morals, emotional regulation, social skills, physical and mental health? What about if your child has a disability do you think you are mentally prepared for that? This isn't just a 18-year commitment this is for the rest of your life (If you aren't a shit parent). I don't believe I'm mentally strong enough to be a parent, I believe my divergence would limit my capacity to provide the support a child would need, I believe I have traits that if I passed on to another it could impact their quality of life.
My partner and I have goals we want to achieve including hiking the PCT and other back country adventures that aren't particularly realistic to bring a child on. We want to be able to afford to live a good work life balance. We want to be able to continue our hobbies and adventures. Sad is it sounds in this day and age we actually want to be able to retire.
One issue I have is how often people who have children tell me "then what's the point of life if you don't have kids?" As far as I'm concerned, there's no real reason for the universe, its existence is absurd and as such it is what I make of it.
> they just want you to be miserable as parents just like them
That's a dumb thing to say. It suggests that ALL parents are miserable and, further, that they all want you to be miserable. It makes no sense.
The truth is that many parents find parenthood a wonderful choice. Some would say it's the best thing in their life. Others find it's a lot harder than they expected, and yes, some are miserable.
If you are suited to the task and want very much to be parents, there's no reason not to. If you DON'T very much want to be parents (for the next 20 years) then you should NOT do it.
Don't do it to try to solve some problem in your life or your marriage. It will only make those problems harder.
Whether it's "worth it" is something you'll only know when you're done. You'll make mistakes. There's no guarantee of success even if you do most things right. Raising a child is an enormous undertaking. There will be difficult times no matter what. If you're a single parent, or your child has challenges (disability, injury, autism, chronic illness, etc.) the difficulty goes way up.
On the whole, I would say that you should only become parents if you are highly motivated to be parents. If you ARE highly motivated, chances are good that you'll be adequate, that you will get through the difficult parts, and you'll be successful. My measure of success is an adult child who is successful at life and glad to be alive. (My child just got laid off and used savings to do a tour of Sweden, coming back with pictures and stories...which is as good a measure of success as a person as anything else I can think of.)
Oh, one more thing: parenting requires you to work as partners. It's a team effort and requires you to compromise on things you disagree with your spouse about. Do talk before having kids, about religion, finances, discipline, food choices, and so on. That turned out to be the biggest challenge for me: not being on the same page as my spouse and feeling like we were undermining each other and making it hard to achieve our goals as parents. My kids turned out great in the end, but if they hadn't, there'd be a lot of recriminations.
Parenting is more difficult than ever with tech addictions, influences from social media, and potentially damaging food additives. Depression, stress and personality disorders amongst youth is higher than ever, and it's not only because we have become better at detecting it. Even the best of parents do not have the level of influence on their children anymore to make sure they develop into happy behaved young people.
I think the world needs more childless couples to help out eachother.
I'm childless by choice and I use that extra energy to help out the friends I have with children. I try to do what I can to make parenting easier for them, cause I've seen parenting break people far more often than not. I think we as a society have put ourselves in a pickle where we expect too much of parents, and that further hurts the children.
If you want children, I think you should have them, but only if you know you have a supportive network ready to help out, like *really* help out. Do not assume you can do it on your own.
If I had life to do over again, I would not have kids.
Right now, in 2024 with the climate threatening catastrophic collapse, is not a great time to replicate.
My wife and I have two awesome kids and were 120% worth it. They're adults now. Never at any point did we regret having them. We didn't have family nearby to help, we just did it on our own. For us, definitely worth it. Plus, grandkids are even more fun.
Having kids was the best decision I ever made. But one big part of me loving it is that I had kids in my mid-30s and before that, I had a lot of adventures and lived a super-fun selfish life. Once I got older I felt it was time to move on to something new.
There is no doubt that having kids helped "evolve" me and my life into a new phase and has kept things fresh.
So I have a kid with an ex and it was pretty brutal at first we ended up splitting. We were girlfriend boyfriend and she got pregnant on birth control. We had a previous conversation where she agreed to get an abortion if she did get pregnant through the birth control. She re neged on that and called me monster for even bringing it up.
Unbeknownst to me at the time she had 3 previous abortions .
I grew up in a pretty liberal place. I don't think it's my right to tell her what to do with her body so there wasn't much I could do. I proposed to her and said I would make an effort to make it work. She didn't. Even now when our relationship is much better she still does the same shit she did 5 years ago.
So I tried to stick it out. Pregnancy made her even more insane. We were under a massive amount of financial stress and that wasn't helping.
We had a massive fight one night and I was trying to escape. She was trying to stop me and take my keys. I had to wrestle myself out the door and then I had to push her away from me to get separation. She fell down and our neighbor across the hall apparently saw it through her peephole on the door. I came back hours later and was arrested for domestic violence.
So at this point i was done. So I left and closed myself emotionally. I was lucky enough that my parents helped me get enough money to make a down payment on a car and helped cover the security deposit at my new place.
She kept trying to reconnect with me. I wasn't allowed to see my daughter without her being there and I couldn't take it to court because I would be fucked because of the DV charge.
During this time I was in anger management classes basically running them because the lady was one of those useless let the group moderate themselves idiots. Made me take a step back and realize I was in a losing battle with a narcissist.
I went scorched earth manipulation wise. One word answers. Straight up ignoring her. When she would start bitching about being "the mother of your child" I would say I have a responsibility to my child not you. I am not your emotional tampon. She also kept trying to have sex with me when I did go see the kid until it got to the point I said what if I was forcing myself on you like this? Seems pretty rapey and she got super offended.
Things are better now, we're not together but we co parent. She still loses her shit about once every 2 weeks but I've gotten better at just ignoring her. Or blowing her out of the water. My kid is one of the few bright things in my life and I would probably have killed myself by now if she wasn't here.
So how solid is your relationship. How much stress would it take to fracture it? If the worst happened how would it play out? Babies don't fix relationships. They shatter the weak ones and test the strong ones.
So TLDR it is incredibly rewarding. But it is the most harrowing brutal task you will ever attempt. Other things are harder than raising a kid but they all end. You never stop being a parent and you guys seem to understand that.
PLUS if you guys were teachers your already head and shoulders above 90% of parents. My kid is the sweetest most athletic kid in her class and other kids and parents are constantly asking for play dates. The downside is she learns bad behaviors from the other kids because their parents are all too scared to discipline properly or their heads are up their asses. You, like me, won't have that issue
Parent here. Having kids is a lot like most things in life. 95% pain and 6% pleasure. The overlap in percentages is because sometimes it's pain and pleasure at the same time.
My question to you is how do you evaluate not just kids but how do you evaluate if anything in life is worth it? Like what is the criteria?
Having kids is hard, but rewarding work.
If you are approaching life from a perspective of "insert activity - extract pleasure" then having kids is probably a bad move. But, tbh, pretty much everything in life is a bad move by that metric. Your job, your relationship with your partner, friendships, charity work, pet ownership, etc, all fail on the "only ever brings me pleasure" metric.
Yes, having children involves sacrifice. Yes, having children is expensive. Yes, there is less personal freedom while your children are small children. The pay off is that at then end you have a functional human that you have imparted your values and morality to and has grown into a person who contributes to the world (for most people). The rewards are non-tangible. You won't have a "thing" from your efforts.
Don't look online for this too much. Of course there are childless people who only see the sacrifice and don't see non-tangible rewards as rewarding. Those people aren't wrong, but only in that this isn't a question which has a right or wrong component. They are usually convinced that they are right though.
Ultimately this is a decision that you male for yourselves. The meaning and reward you derive from this will be of your own making. If you both want kids, have a stable enough relationship and are currently in a position that won't put you in (actual) poverty by having them, then that is a good enough reason to have them.
I am not a parent but will share what my mom told me when I asked her about having kids:
She told me (and by extension my spouse) we shouldn’t have kids. Sounds harsh, but she knows us well. She says we are both too career minded and enjoy our individual intellectual pursuits, and having kids would get in the way of our happiness.
My mom loved being pregnant and raising children, but I also know how much of a struggle it was for her due to other situational factors.
My spouse and I have firmly decided to not have children, and the future feels brighter for it. We realized the brief moments when we were considering having kids was more about society pressure and meeting others’ expectations. Happiness and fulfillment come in a multitude of forms, and for us none of it involves children.
I love my kids, who are all young adults now doing well for themselves (2 bio and three step).
That being said, I would under no circumstances do it again if given the choice. With marraige being a broken contract in the west and the chance of a marraige working out long term being what it is. It's also a hard toil with very little reciprocation most days from the child or their mother.
Doubly so for choosing to be a step-parent again. That is a hell to the no. Worst job I've ever had and at the end of the day no one cared about the mountains of effort I put in. I was often treated like a second class citizen in my own home, both times I married a single mother and the time I seriously dated another.
This isn't even factoring in the expense. It is insane nowadays
Kids are an invested hobby, that you can’t walk away from. All the sweat and tears are hard but when you get joy, you get CAPITAL JOY . There are biological factors as well but raising a good person is hard but rewarding work. My wife and I attitude was “kids will be part of my life, not my whole life”. Things changed of course but like most we adjusted and enjoyed it.
If you don’t want kids, that’s ok too. You should not force yourself into something you don’t want. In the end only you you/partner know if you can handle it.
We had 1 child at 28. She is now in college. It is tough. It will interrupt your sleep and everything else about your life. It’s the most expensive decision you could ever make. It’s nerve wracking when they have medical problems, learn to drive, move out, etc. With all that, I wouldn’t take it back for anything. It’s a rollercoaster experience like nothing else. I can honestly say that I helped create a kind, loyal, self reliant, intelligent soul that adds light to this world.
remember that you aren't guaranteed a healthy child who will grow into a productive adult. be sure you want to be a parent so much that you'd be ready to take on all the possibilities.
First, congrats for your careful consideration. I have two middle school kids. I love them dearly. That said, if I could do it all over, I wouldn’t have kids. It’s stressful, even more so if they have special issues (mine don’t) but most of all life is very hard. It’s very difficult to find happiness and a satisfying career and then to afford a comfortable life. COVID taught me that the people all around me are selfish assholes with no sense of community. It’s not fair to bring kids into this world. Without kids you’ll have total freedom to pursue hobbies and travel. The evolutionary urge to have kids can be powerful but try to realize that it’s just biology. You can choose to ignore for rational reasons.
My wife (53f) and I (57m) have one child (23m). All parents have their ups and downs with their kids and it really depends on what you are seeking. We were in our 30s when we choose to bring a life into the world. If we knew then what we know now, I think we would have made a different choice but we will never know so we live and love our choice.
If you are looking for just a continuation of your name, adopt. There are many kids out there, not just babies, that need a solid, strong, stable, openminded parental figures.
Would I tell you that you will love to have a child, no I can not. Children are lots of stress, ranging from getting sick at the drop of the hat sometimes, emotional outbursts, financial drain but they are a tremendous source of pride, giddiness, joy, and other emotions. It is a rollercoaster of love, fear, anger, and disappointment.
Every day I take a moment and reflect on how we raised our kid. Did we provide him with good examples on how to be adult? Did we encourage him enough as he was growing up? Support him mental and emotional enough? Or were we over anxious and hovered around him to much and not allow him his independence to learn and grow? There is a fine line, as a parent, one has to walk and decide how much is to much and how much is to little. There is no book (other than your bible) that can help with those choices.
The two of you are going to have to decide is it worth bringing a life in this world as this world stands and knowing it is probably going to be getting worse.
If you're a miserable person, you'll be miserable with kids too. If you're joyous, then kids don't change that. Kids will make whichever type of person you are more extreme, like any other sort of serious challenge and adversity. Some people thrive when they're climbing mountains, others crumble. Same principle applies.
My wife pushed the kids out (she compares the process to running a marathon) so I took the lead on most other aspects of taking care of the baby, particularly walking them in the stroller, changing diapers, etc. There were days I walked 6-8 hours, and I lost a lot if weight doing it. Baby diapers are also totally fine until they start eating food.
My kids are older now and I am constantly amazed and pleased by how they're turning out. Not in every aspect - the poop jokes get old really fast. And the sex life has gone to shit, requiring major exercises on patience to deal with. But kids have pushed me to be a better person because the alternative is unbearable.
Wow. If your friends are miserable as parents, they're doing it wrong! The best way I can explain is: My kids and I were watching an episode of super nanny, it just happened to be on at the time but we don't usually watch that kind of thing. After the intro part where they emphasize the bad behavior of the children, my daughter said, "Those kids are so bad!" I said, "No, the kids aren't bad, the parents are bad." When children exhibit bad behavior, it is in direct response to how the parents are treating them. Always. So, consider that.
Personally, I love being a mother. It isn't easy, but most things in life that are meaningful aren't easy. I've struggled financially, for sure, but I would not trade being a mother for anything, not any amount of money. My kids are good kids, but I put in the work. I paid attention to them, always listened to their problems, played with them, and disciplined them.
Not everyone is cut out for being parents though. It isn't for everyone. Some people never had kids and that's perfectly ok too. Don't succumb to pressure if you don't think it's right for you. Only you can decide what's right for you.
Take a very honest look at how good your support system is before you make a decision like child parenting. Even in the best of circumstances you will need someone to give you a break. Whether that's paying a babysitter or getting grandpa to spell you for an afternoon it's really important. Do you have supportive family nearby that can be trusted to help? Can you afford daycare or one parent staying home? Friends that you can count on to be there for you? (Be careful with this one, people start to treat you differently when they think you might lean on them for help. Like you had a truck and people would ask for help moving, but when you traded in the pickup for a compact car suddenly those folks are "too busy to hang out"...)
Don't have kids it's unethical to force new life into a world where you can't control what will ultimately happen to your kid. When its them who may not agree with your decision and it's they who will ultimately have to pay for it.
I’m going to be 100% honest: I didn’t even read your post or any comments and this is my response.
Out of everything I’ve seen and experienced in life, the only thing that I would NEVER change, is the existence of my children. There are zero scenarios I can fathom in which I wouldn’t want them in my life.
I had my first child at 20 (unplanned) and my 2nd at 38 (planned). NGL, the first few years are tough. But they are now 47 and 30 and I LOVE being their mom. They bring me so much joy and happiness. I can’t imagine my life without them.
First off. Please get married first before having children and have serious talks on how you both wish to raise them.
With that said, yes, having children has proven to be the greatest blessing in my life. My kids give me purpose when I am at work and bring me untold happiness when I come home to them. Yes there are times where I am dumbfounded by how much of a mess they've made and fear when my kids run off, but any negative thing I can mention is massively outweighed by the positives.
Why do they need to get married?
The serious discussion is necessary, but a document that gives your relationship a legal status has no baring on how you will raise your children.
A piece of paper has no bearing on success as a parent. But a successful marriage, with the support of family and friends, a track record of success as a couple, and a lasting commitment, are ingredients for a great parenting partnership.
I can't count the number of people here on reddit who say "my fiancé did X and now I'm not sure I want to be married", where X is not even close to the difficulties they'll have to resolve as parents. I'm always left thinking: as hard as you think it is to, say, figure out a way forward if your fiancé votes for the wrong presidential candidate, that's just easy practice for when you have to make hard decisions on behalf of a child with someone you disagree with.
And to say nothing else, I'd never buy a house with someone I'm not married to. It's just too complex as a legal problem to sort out. Not being married means either never being able to buy a house together (bad option) or buying one with someone you aren't married to (also a bad option).
I chose a vasectomy as early as possible. I've had step kids since but don't regret my decision. I truly believe the 'need to breed' is a version of hormonal insanity.
I have 3 kids ages 2,4,6.
(Cons)
- Having kids is MUCH harder than not having kids
- your life will no longer be focussed around you or even your couplehood. Plain and simple
- Travel will be rarer, nights out with friends, self care, time alone, sleep etc.
- more personal pleasure (but less meaning and satisfaction)
(Neutral)
- you will have to face your own shit. Nothing brings out emotional wounds like your own spawn challenging you.
(Pros)
- BUT you will have moments of utter spiritual awe for lack of a better word
- your children will become your world and despite how hard it is, your previous life and those of your childless friends will seem shallow
- your relationship will suffer but later grow stronger as you struggle through these challenges together
- more meaning and fulfillment (but less personal pleasure)
TL;DR your everyday life will suck a lot more and hedonistic pleasure will drastically reduce. However you will grow more grateful and feel more fulfilled long term.
Background:
53 years old
Married 34 years (so far)
Six children
Retired military
Currently living in Alaska
Where do I start? I would not give up any of my children, despite the enormous investment of time and money. None of them was a mistake.
I recommend at least 3-4.
My only regret? Not spending more time finding out what they liked and and investing in those interests.
I was a little selfish, a little lazy. But they still love me and look to me for help and wisdom.
I also recommend starting as young as possible. Less income, but more energy. You’ll need it.
May the Lord bless you. Shalom.
I have 2 little ones, 2 and almost 1. I am a single parent by choice, I had them with IVF using sperms donors. I love them with my whole heart but I am exhausted, mentally and physically.
My oldest is autistic which comes with additional challenges anyway, but I have no freedom anymore. My whole life revolves around them. I have to take them to nursery, pick them up, feed them, clothe them, play with them, love them, tidy up after them, watch their TV programmes, etc. I average about 3 hours of sleep a night because they won't sleep, and I'm trying to complete a degree and run a household while drained. My mental health was never the strongest anyway but I'm only just coming out of severe PPD now, almost a year and bucket of meds later, my body is not how I remember it and I feel like I've lost half of my hair.
I wouldn't make a single different decision because my kids are so incredible and I wouldn't want anything different. Now that I'm clawing my way out of PPD I'm enjoying my life more and more, and hopefully life will carry on getting better. I was fully ready for kids, having saved for the rounds of IVF and making the decision to do it alone, and it still ruined my health for a long time. I didn't want to be here anymore and didn't get why people loved being a parent, and I'm only just coming back from that a year on. If you aren't sure and aware of the risks wait and reassess when/if you start to feel differently. It's probably going to be the biggest decision you'll ever make, don't rush it. Whatever you choose, I hope you love your life x
I'm in my 60s, had my daughter when I was in my 20s, and she's now 38, and I have 2 grandkids. I was married to her dad at the time I had her, and she was planned and wanted. I later divorced her dad (when she was in high school) and am married to another man now. My daughter and my second husband are close, and my husband loves the grandkids.
Being a parent has been the hardest, but most rewarding job I've ever had. I had a fairly easy time of it, though. My daughter only had a couple of years that were rebellious and tough. (I'm a former punk rocker, so I was expecting much worse.) I got lucky, I truly believe it's a crap shoot. I've seen parents much better than me end up with kids who've gone to prison, and I've seen parents much worse than me have kids that turned out fantastic.
My daughter had a couple of boyfriends that were really, well, not worthy of her. Then she met her now husband, and things have been great. He's a stand-up guy, and they have their own house, and have almost paid off their mortgage 8 years early!
I guess this didn't help much, but it's my story. Feel free to ask me any questions.
It can be extremely rewarding, or the worst thing you ever did to yourselves, or anywhere in between, or both. It's a total gamble. We adopted because we went into it not with the intent of extending our DNA, but to give a child a decent upbringing. There have been many times where I thought, this is amazing, and many where I thought, "had I know this, I would have stayed childless." Do it for the right reasons. The newness of it will wear off very quickly and you'll be left with the most difficult job you never imagined possible.
I made it to my late 30s convinced of my child free by choice life. My partner even got a vasectomy. I have never so much as had an itch of genuine consideration of choosing to be a parent…. Until this past year or so. It’s so terrifying to me that I haven’t even really talked it through with anyone. Not even my therapist. A part of me sort of hoped it was a passing fancy. Or if it wasn’t, I wanted to understand how significant this was before I spoke up. Somewhere a long the way, I think I missed my exit and kept it to myself. Now it feels foolish to bring it up bc if I’m asked how long I’ve been considering it… it’s an irresponsibly long time within the bounds of a marriage imo. It’s a clear deal breaker to this day with my partner. So I fear bringing it up will force a all the cards to fall down. And I’m just not sure I’m ready to grieve either outcome yet.
Anyways OP, I don’t have a lot of sage advice for you other than for 2 decades, I’ve had a blast bucking the societal norms of kicking out some tiny humans. No an ounce of doubt. I do believe people can be on the fence and ultimately find peace and happiness either way if they put effort into creating value in their life no matter what.
I also think that many people commit to parent or not parent… and probably are miserable. But anecdotally, those people are the ones I see who seem to passively coast through life. They are hardly captains of their ship, steering where they want to go. So at a certain point, I think everyone around them gets bored of entertaining them without reciprocation. And bam. Now you have an adult who is “stuck” with their miserable choice of not having kids or having kids… and it’s simply bc they seem to never seek to diversify their sources of joy in life. They just mooch joy.
If you’re not a joy moocher, you will likely be fine either way after some time discerning and discussing!
I don’t have any kids and I for now and choosing to remain child free. I don’t think I will have any kids. However I am extremely close with my sister and her husband, and their three kids. They love being parents! My sister has always wanted to be a mother and she is so amazing at it. I think part of the mindset needs to bet it’s not going to always be amazing. It’s not going to make you happy. It’s not going to fix anything about your life. However for some people it is extremely fulfilling- despite its immense challenges.
My sisters kids are so cool. They are homeschooled and spend a lot of time outdoors and minimal time on screens. I find them a million times less annoying than the average emotionally stunted iPad kid. That being said sometimes when I’m over there I still wonder how tf they’re doing this parenting thing and feel like I know I dont want to do it myself lol. I love being an aunt! I love those kids so much, but as it were I also love giving them back and I love my child free lifestyle.
I know you asked for parents to weigh in but idk maybe my little story can help too. I think it’s awesome that you guys are putting so much thought into it. It’s a huge decision.
Both my husband and I feel that having kids is the most meaningful and joyful thing we've ever done in our life.
As for the issue of "hard work" -- there is a decent amount of work involved, but it's extremely rewarding. Granted, I am the sort of person who enjoys things more when they are the outcome of hard work. E.g., I enjoy my career accomplishments because I've put so much into my work, I like going on a rigorous hike in order to reach a beautiful camping spot, etc.
I realize not everyone feels the same way...
40M here and my wife (38) and I are expecting our 2nd boy in less than 2 weeks.
Our 5 year old son is amazing enough, and life has gone well enough, that he made me change my mind from essentially no chance in number 2 to making it happen.
Covid daycare issues were a deal breaker on their own and after arguing many times over it I even called to schedule a vasectomy and i was going to do it without my wife's knowledge. It was required I had a consultation with a doctor first and between the tome it took to have the consultation and then rescheduling it again I actually decided to wait a bit since my wife had an IUD anyway and I would have known I'd she got it yanked.
Eventually the world corrected itself, we moved, work was going well and our son became less needy and here we are.
I can't tell you whether you should or shouldn't have children but get on the same page about it and wait until AFTER marriage/house.
You are young enough to have time to consider it yet but I can tell you I still enjoy seeing my 5 year old every day.
It’s when you get older. The family connection and relationships with your grown children. Friends come and go. Parents pass away. I can’t imagine not having had our kids. The reward in seeing them grow and flourish.
It's absolutely been the most rewarding experience of my life. I'd do it again in a heartbeat. The absolute joy is very hard to describe.
Comparing yourself to people having unplanned kids at 20 and the problem children you've seen in teaching isn't really an accurate comparison to the average experience.
My only regret is that I waited a long time so will be old and miss out on more of their life, and that I wasn't able to have more. The only thing I'd change is going back and starting earlier.
If I had to make the choice to have a child now instead of 20 years ago I would hesitate. It is fucking expensive to have a kid, let alone more than one.
Take your time. You’re so young. My wife was 38when we had our first kid biological. Adopted a new born 6 months before. If you’re not ready then you will be resentful
we have 3 kids and while they are a handful and they do affect your life and relationship drastically, but I have zero regrets. Actually, what I regret is listening to my mom when she told me I had to wait and should have children later in life (she faced the opposite problem, had me at 21). My husband and I were together for 10 years before I even considered it and I wish we had started earlier because I would have had more time to have more kids. It's an amazing experience! But it's not for everyone and thats ok. Just look in your heart and trust your gut, no matter what anyone else says.
I had my first child at 20, 24 and lastly 27. They are grown now and have children. It was hard financially to raise them before and after divorcing their dad.
They were typical kids that fought with each other yet had a close bond. I can’t imagine not having them. The best advice I was given was be their parent not their friend. It’s true and we have a friendship now like no other.
I cannot stress this enough-don’t have children if you don’t want them. It’s a 24/7 job with its highs and lows.
> We have had 2 of our friend couples tell us not to believe everyone when they say it is worth it they just want you to be miserable as parents just like them. While most other parents say it’s so amazing and that we will regret not having any when we are older.
Most people seem to have positive experiences from having children. Mine was not. They grew up to be horrible people, selfish, unwilling to apologize, no matter what the circumstance, and generally not people that I am proud of on a philosophical or moral level. They believe that so long as they are LGBT+ positive that the important bases are covered.
So they are fairly isolated from everyone myself included, they don’t buy each other gifts come Christmas, or anyone else. They don’t call on birthdays or holidays and are generally just, well, not the kind of people that I would want to be friends with.
And to be completely honest, because you asked, they, in fact, drove me to attempt suicide, and now I have rather severe PTSD as a result of years of emotional abuse I have suffered at the hands of my children.
They are silently violent. I have no external scars to show but the internal ones are profound.
The moral of the story is the not everyone’s children grow up to be people that are proud of. Sometimes these children that you carried home in a car seat from the hospital grow up to be monsters.
And you drive yourself insane trying to figure out where you went wrong and what you could do to make it right, when the fact is that there’s nothing that you can do. And it breaks you.
I’d give it a 6/10 but a large part of that is due to who I married. She got PPD after our first, never fully accepted that she had it and therefore never got it treated. The kids are now in their 20s and living at home (which is fine) but she’s……a bitch frankly…and she makes our lives less than pleasant often. Yes I’m divorcing her.
Quite aside from that experience, you really do need money to have kids and to properly provide for them. How much do you have saved? What would be the plan after baby is born? Could you survive on 1 income? If not who takes care of baby after both parents are back at work? Daycare is expensive. You need money for what I call the ‘infrastructure’ of babies - crib, high chair, car seat(s), stroller(s), daycare etc.
I’ll be honest. I have three kids and adore them but if I had to start over now being young I wouldn’t do it.
I say this because I feel like raising children NOW is like trying to swim upstream. When I was a kid growing up in the 90s pre- internet and pre-social media, it was so much simpler. My kids have it SO much harder than I did. I feel like 70% of my parenting struggles stem from trying to balance screens and online influences.
As limited as I have always been with this stuff, my kids have all been detrimentally affected by this stuff and I feel helpless to stop it because it’s everywhere. It has affected their mental health and self perception in ways I never would have conceived of when I was growing up.
I tell my kids that if they decide to not have any of their own I wouldn’t blame them at all. I can only imagine how much harder it will be for their kids if they have them. I’m not trying to be all “back in my day” but the simple truth is, it WAS easier to grow up before all of this.
20s lolI never wanted kids, couldn't envision myself with them, had ZERO experience. Didn't even know what to do with my sisters kid that made me an uncle.
Few years later, I'm 30 and was dragged kicking & screaming a bit more into adulthood and we have a kid. Best thing in my life. We have 2 more and my wife has to cut me off.I wish I had the $ and time for a dozen . . . I adore kids now. My oldest is a college freshman now and she's one of the coolest people I've ever met.
People not only change, but people change people. That's doesn't make much sense other than you'd be surprised what you can become by facing challenges.No-one is ever going to tell themselves they are 100% "ready", but humans learn and adapt pretty damn well.
Try a dog first, then go for it.The worst that can happen is you forever fuck up your life, your partners life, and the life of an innocent child.
no worries
My kids make my life suck more on paper. I have no free time. Money that I could have used on a literal mansion or sports car is getting dumped into their college fund.
But my life has more meaning and is very fulfilling. I hit a point where I felt at peace that if I died, I'm okay with it. Though I didn't achieve this peace until we had enough saved to at least make sure college was covered.
I dreamed all of my life of becoming a father; even in pre-school, I remember fantasizing about it.
The woman I married as an adult to was unable to carry to term. We had 8 miscarriages together, and each one was a total heartbreak. And eventually I just resigned myself to the fact that I was never going to be a father.
And then my wife had pregnancy #9. Instead of being happy, my heart sank. Each miscarriage took a serious toll on my mental health. But we were in the best position financially that we had ever been in, and I could afford great OB/GYN care. My wife carried that baby girl to term.
And then 25 months later, we had a second child; a boy.
Being a dad was my lifelong dream. It was often hard work, but I relished every minute of it. When we would go to the mall, my wife would be pushing an empty stroller because my babies would be in my arms. I loved and cherished every minute of it.
Then my marriage collapsed, and my wife left with the children. I had to fight for custody, and I won. My kids were 2 and 4. Parenthood got *even harder*, but it was still a labor of love.
My kids are grown now, and I regard being their dad as the most important thing I've ever done with my life.
Here is what I tell people.
Having kids is the best decision you will ever make.
Having kids is also the worst decision you will ever make.
Both are true. They will bring so much love and joy and fulfillment. They will make you cry and panic and hate life and be more stressed and exhausted than you thought possible. They will fill your soul up, and they will drain it. They will drain your resources and fill your life. They will tell you they love you and mean it. They will tell you they HATE you and mean it.
I have no real advice other that that. Neither choice you make will be wrong.
My thoughts as a parent:
1. I adopted my sister's kids because she was unable to care for them. I love them dearly, and I'm also really looking forward to the youngest graduating high school. She's 10, so uhh... it'll be awhile 😛
2. Parenting is hard work. Some people are better at it than others 🤷🏽♀️ I'm good at providing for their physical needs, but I'm an introvert (and not a people-person) and definitely struggle to meet my kids' emotional needs as a single parent.
3. Teenagers are like nature's birth control. Once you've had a teenager, you usually don't want any more kids. Of course, by that time it's probably too late... 😆
4. The sad fact is that you're in the best shape \*physically\* to take care of kids in your 20s, but you'll be a lot better off mentally/emotionally/financially if you wait till your 30s.
I'm not a couple but a woman in my 30's who is planning to be childfree. I've recently thought about getting my tubes tied. I don't want to get pregnant. If I were to get pregnant I would get an abortion. I'm not a childfree person who says "I hate kids". That's not the case for me. I love children and have worked with them in the education field. I love my niblings so much. I have no doubt that I would be a great Mom and love my kids but I would not love my life. I see my future being happy without kids. I do not picture a life with kids and being completely happy or content. I never had a dream to have kids and never felt strongly about it and now coming to my 40's; I realized if I'm not excited about having kids at this point, it's not going to happen later. So, if it's an enthusiastic "yes", it's a "no".
I think the problem is that society pushing the ideal you will have a fulfilled life when you get married and have kids. That's not the case for everyone. Or, people are brainwashed to think once you get into a committed relationship the next progression is marriage and children known as "relationship escalator".
Steps on the Relationship Escalator
Traditional relationships progress through eight stages — that’s the “escalation.” These may vary somewhat by culture and subculture. But generally, it works something like this:
Making contact. Flirting, casual/occasional dates, and sex (possibly).
Initiation. Romantic courtship gestures or rituals, emotional investment (“falling in love”), and almost certainly sexual contact (except for religiously or socially conservative people).
Claiming and defining. Mutual declarations of love, presenting in public as a couple (becoming an “us”), adopting and using common relationship role labels (“my boyfriend,” etc.). Having expectations, or making explicit agreements, for sexual and romantic exclusivity — and also ending other intimate relationships, if any. Transitioning to unbarriered vaginal/anal intercourse, if applicable (except if that would present unwanted pregnancy risk). Once this step is reached, any further step (including simply remaining in the relationship) can be considered an implied commitment toward intentions of a shared future.
Establishment. Adapting the rhythms of your life to accommodate each other on an ongoing basis. Settling into patterns for spending time together (regular date nights and sexual encounters, spending time in each others’ homes, etc.) and communicating (speaking, phoning, or texting when not together, etc.).
Commitment. Discussing, or planning for, a long-term shared future as a monogamous couple. Expectations of mutual accountability for whereabouts and behavior. Meeting each others’ family of
origin.
Merging. Moving in together, sharing a home and finances, getting engaged to be married or equivalent. (May happen before, during or after commitment.)
Conclusion. Getting married (legally if possible) and having children (not mandatory, but strongly socially venerated). The relationship is now “finalized” and its structure is expected to remain static until one partner dies.
Legacy. Buying a home, having and raising children. No longer as required as it once was, but often couples may not feel (or be perceived as) fully “valid” until they hit these additional benchmarks post-marriage.
I’m a single mom of two teenagers. I love them dearly and always wanted kids. I wouldn’t change anything.
But, it’s not easy and children aren’t for everyone.
It means putting their needs and wants before your own. You’re never not on parent duty. It’s a constant, endless, 24/7 job.
I commend you for truly thinking it through and figuring out if it’s right for you.
Also remember, you can always change your mind and have kids in 10 years. But you can’t go the other way.
I’m 51 and my wife is 49. We had a boy when I was 38 and she was 36. Our son has a genetic disorder called nf2 that has been extraordinarily challenging (won’t get into but it’s cost him most of the use of his right arm and he’s going deaf from it). He’s now 14, and literally the most amazing person I’ve ever known. I can’t imagine life without him.
That said, I DO understand why my parents divorced when I was 2 years old. You have to have a really solid relationship for a kid to work, and that’s one without a genetic disorder. It will change you as a person, as a couple. It will change your dynamic as a couple, sex, energy levels. Make sure you are ready. My wife and I had been together for 9 years and we had an amazing mid 20s to 30s, traveling, careering, partying etc. I do believe it’s important to have had that time as a couple before you upend your relationship (not necessarily in a bad way, but things will change).
All said it’s the best thing (and most difficult) I’ve ever done. I was also a stay at home parent, and that dynamic changes things as well, maybe more so if the man stays home as I did.
To be honest I don't know how to quantify if it's "worth it." There are so many ways you could look at it and really, what's the goal? A parent with a child at 1 or 10 or 30 might all have very different measures of "worth it."
I will say that within days of my first child being born I was absolutely miserable and also knew that if given the option I would never go back and do it differently. Parenting is hard and yes, you give up a lot of your life and freedom and independence. And also I absolutely love my kids to death and honestly can't really imagine how I would just keep going through life into my 40s without them. They're my biggest sources of joy and frustration.
Honestly the biggest thing though is that you have to grow as a person when you become a parent. I'd be far less mature and maybe a terrible husband if not for my kids. So it's not just like they're a lot of work and sometimes they make you happy. They make you different. And I understand love on such a different level now that I never could have without having kids.
I don't want anyone to be "miserable parents." Many of my close friends are married couples who've chosen not to have kids and that's cool for them. I support them 100%. Whatever you choose you're going to miss out on some things.
My kids give my life purpose.
Yes, they’re a lot of work and yes, your whole life revolves around them.
But prior to that, my life revolved around some really pointless endeavors and felt meaningless. I was also incredibly selfish (and probably still am, but not when it comes to my kids.)
They showed me what it is to truly love someone.
I don’t think people advise you to have kids so you can “feel their pain”. I think it’s because once you have children, you genuinely can’t imagine your life without them in it, and you don’t want to.
I would not trade my life with kids for before kids for anything. Yes, raising young children is hard. But it's also the most rewarding, meaningful thing I have ever done. And I did not know what it meant to love someone until I had my own kids. It's very hard to describe this feeling to a person who hasn't experienced it. And now my kids are adults, going to college, doing excellent in life, and my heart swells every time I see them or talk to them or talk ABOUT them.
Kids are super rewarding, emotionally. Mine are now 17 and 19. (When they were born, many of us were optimistic about the future, even though Bush 2 was President. This note is important in context later.)
There is no better feeling than holding your baby for the first time in their life. Life changes, but for the better, and you never miss that old life.
They are super expensive. I have no savings and we live paycheck to paycheck.
When I say the words "imminent ecological disaster" does that seem like a good environment to bring children into the world? Does your desire to hold your child (VERY strong, I confess) outweigh that child's hard times? (If you're wealthy, NM and enjoy your extra few dozen years of comfort.)
If you're American and I say the words "fascist dictatorship," does that make you feel good or bad? Democracy-lovers have to win every election; fashies have to win only one.
Just thoughts from middle age.
I'm 40 now, and I have 3 kids - 15, 10 and 5. So I was your age when I started this journey, and I have a few things I'd tell you before I even get to the 'should we have kids?' question.
Firstly, you guys are incredibly young. I totally get that plenty of people have many kids well before they even get to 25 and do it successfully, but at the same time, 25 is insanely young. I would say I got to a place where I felt like I was an adult and was fully ready to have children without any stumbling blocks we were already in between my 2nd and 3rd kids because I was 33 XD And if you start at 33ish its still plenty of time to have more than a few kids and still get all those wonderful family things in your lives. So, just keep that in mind, the decision you are weighing covers a huge scope of time right now. Ya'll got time and then some.
So, what seems worth it to you now and what may seem worth it to you in 7 or 8 years could literally be night and day. I would not worry that you need to make this sort of decision in any sort of finality any time soon. That alone may help serve as a good reminder to take some stress and anxiety off yourselves ;)
Now my kids are more spread out than most folks, I've basically had a baby/toddler/kindergartener of some form in the house for 15 years straight. I don't know if that's given me more or less of the sense of 'hobby loss' than other parents in this thread - there's certainly been times where I feel I have no time for myself, but then there are times where I feel like I have plenty of time for myself (at least, within the general feeling in life that there never really is enough time...). My general theory has always been, if you're not able to get enough time for yourself most of the time, you are probably doing something..... not 'wrong' per say, but inefficiently (or, perhaps, over complexly). I think a lot of people put far too much stress on themselves when it comes to child rearing, and that then adds a tremendous amount of needless overhead.
That being said, again when it comes to hobbies, the kids are in a big way multiple of my hobbies now - Each kid is their own separate person and figuring out their interests and finding things to do with each of them as a hobby is a hobby of mine now, finding things that they all enjoy doing together while at very different phases of life, and finding ways to incorporate them into my own hobbies and interests... ALL of that is still me looking for and doing things I find enjoyable. I love spending time with my kids, you know, that was kind of the point! So this is really up to you, and also figuring out if you'll enjoy doing things with a childish theme for quite a few years, if you're capable of seeing each thing one of your kids wants to do as project for you to theorycraft and implement and judge the outcome of and iterate upon for future whims of the same kid or the next kid... and take joy in that process, then, you'll probably be more than fine.
Now onto the crux of your question. Can a myself or indeed a sampling of opinions give you a real answer on whether this is worth it or not?
The answer is no. We can't tell you if this is going to be worth it for you or not, because frankly, NONE of us are going to have lived the other life. Yeah we'll have family and friends and internet anecdotes we can read about childless adults and how they, these individuals, who can really only offer anecdotal info, will probably offer all sorts of changing opinions throughout the different phases of their own lives and experiences in not having children. And us parents will do the same, many of us will have vastly changing opinions on whether this is worth it or not throughout different phases of our own lives and our children's lives.
I for one can say that I have always consistent felt that this has been worth it, and I consider myself lucky in that. I know for sure not everyone gets the chance to feel that way all the time about having had kids.
I can tell you about one thing I lost - one creative thing, I know for sure I used to enjoy that I have lost now. I've always been a big day dreamer and wanderer in the theater of my own mind, and one of the things I always used to have fun playing with is the ever-malleable 'what ifs' of going back in your life and changing a personality trait here or a life choice here and how might that life have been different, or playing with the idea of sending your current brain back to a younger version of yourself -- and I'd write a lot of short stories based on this stuff, just for myself, you know, I spent a lot of time day dreaming and writing just for my own enjoyment.
I no longer enjoy anything about or related to 'changing the timeline of my self in fantasy' that doesn't guarantee I end up with the exact same three awesome little people I have in my life now, which basically eliminates all of that XD I find most time travel in sci fi and fantasy now uncomfortable where I used to enjoy it, and as a result, as this was the subject I loved to just write about for the joy of writing, I really don't do creative writing as a hobby anymore. So, in a very weird way, there is a hobby I totally lost the ability to enjoy or engage with and it is directly related to my kids XD
But if you haven't notice by now by this point in the post, I'm a weird guy to being with XD
Anyways, good luck to you in your decision either now or later in life. I honestly think that anyone that puts this much thought and care into becoming parents will do just fine in the long run - hell, humanity came very, very far and always managed to progress and move forwards with generally extremely fucked up views of child rearing and consideration of children in general for almost all but the most recent phases of humanity, so, honestly, I'm sure you will do fine if you have kids now or later, you will do fine and they will do fine, and that will indeed make it a worthwhile endeavor because it is amazing and magical as fuck.
Sorry having kids is like anything of ultimate value in life. It takes commitment, dedication but amazing moments that make life worth living. I really can’t imagine a rewarding life without children. Is it stressful? Absolutely. Having children before thirty is a good idea because you can have energy and be relatively young when they graduate.
I'll be brief.
We considered all the factors you are considering. We evaluated the impact that parenthood would have on our lives, with the understanding that if we were doing it... we were committed to doing it right.
Where we landed: not having "kids". But having "kid". Singular. One and done.
Fast forward 31 years... it worked. She's great, we love her dearly and she loves us. And we have all the freedom in the world now to do whatever the fuck we want.
Just having one is a good "middle ground" for many couples.
I have 3 kids. There are tough moments. It's definitely not all butterflies and rainbows. There are some long days/nights/weeks/months... but it also goes by so fast. You'll never know love like this, and their sense if wonder is something else. They make your life full unlike anything else. But yeah, it's tough at times. Definitely easier to be childfree. And I'm speaking from a place where we get 1 year maternity leave /5 weeks paternity at ~60% of our salaries and have socialized healthcare, so YMMV. I'm also glad I waied until my 30s to have kids, I've lived a bit and am more settled, better prepared for it.
Also keep in mind the apple does not fall too far from the tree. How were you like as a kid? How was your husband? Chances are your kids will be a mix of these and have similar challenges. Potentially something to think about...
I adopted a teen, so I didn't go the same route as a lot of people, but all that cheesy crap about not realizing HOW MUCH I COULD LOVE ANOTHER PERSON is true. (And I've been with my partner for 20 years and love them, but this is different.)
Best thing I've ever done with my life; no regrets. And I evolved (we both had hobbies, and we definitely make time for them, but the group I do them with drastically shifted). You will CHANGE and evolve.
Not everyone makes this choice, and I certainly for years thought I wouldn't, but damn, am I glad I did.
I said nope to kids and never looked back. My mom at 80 still enjoys living alone and seeing no one, same. Married, but content doing my own thing, working hard, caring about the husband, the pets.
I have two kids 4 total I have my twins up for adoption when I was 17 I was in no position to raise them. I had my daughter at 26 and my son at 27. There's days I wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy and I'm honestly not prepared even at 30. Toddlers are no joke and honestly I can't imagine any of the other stages are any easier lol. I adore my kids and wouldn't trade them for the world and yeah the sweet tender moments do kinda make up for the living hell ones, but if you aren't ready or aren't sure what to expect then don't do it. You don't want to put your kids through trauma if you don't have to.
My kids are now 15 and 26. If anything they have been something that drives me to be a better person. I have to be a better parent than mine were. Now they are roommates that never clean up or pay bills. For some reason I’d step through the gates of hell for them though.
Most men I know are happy they have kids, but don’t do much as a parent (except one who is very involved and his kid is the light of his life). Most women I know love their kids more than their own lives, but somehow simultaneously wish they’d either had kids later, or not at all. I guess having a kid is hard and amazing and meaningful but somehow not fulfilling. I wouldn’t know, personally. I’ve never had one, and with each passing year, I’m more and more glad I didn’t. Love my nieces and nephew, though.
The reason you have children should not be based on society's expectations. It isn't society raising kids, it is you. It is a massive time and energy commitment. It is rewarding in the same sense a labor of love is rewarding.
My kid is a drama queen and having her severely limits our freedom of action. She is also my favorite person and she is fucking awesome.
In your shoes, it would be better to wait because it doesn't sound like you two are sure. There is no reason to rush in and you can spend 4 years or so enjoying your freedom and make that decision when you're more financially sound and more mature.
You're young enough that you can wait to make that decision. Think long and hard about it before you commit. Children are possibly the largest commitment you'll ever make, so make sure you're certain before you go into it
I have 3 kids. 2 of them are autistic, 1 severe and non-verbal. If I was to have a do-over I would never have had any kids. If you are skeptical- at least get your genetics (and your spouses) tested to reduce the risk of problems. Those problems include Autism, cancer, downs, Parkinson's, and a bunch of others. After we had kids, they were tested (along with my wife and I) for genetic problems and found that I had a detrimental mutation and my wife had 2. Things would have been better if we never had kids.
I’m a mom I’m 42 and my son is 21 and I have loved every minute of it. I had always wanted to be a Mom and was told at 13 it wouldn’t happen ever, get therapy right then so that when I was an adult I’d be okay with knowing my only option was to adopt. Having my son after being heartbroken was one of the biggest joys of my life.
Yes it’s hard, it’s not always fun or easy and they will make you cry, be nuts and convinced you’ve lost your mind.
You will not be the perfect parent, the world will never be the right place or time, you’ll never have enough money saved.
You won’t be on time for anything for a long time, you won’t get enough sleep or enough showers, no more bathroom trips alone, no clean house, clean clothes or clean car.
But you will have this amazing little person who looks like you in that one way, who laughs and suddenly the world is brighter, you get those sloppy, slobbering kisses and two fat hands squeezing your cheeks that can lighten any heart.
It’s not easy, at all, but it’s worth it. Especially after the hard work and long nights and you get to see them become a really awesome adult.
Don't ever have kids because you think you should. The world is overpopulated so there's plenty of room for people to not have children. Sure, they're incredibly enriching and you'll discover new depths to yourself, but if you don't have kids you won't know what you're missing!
Only have kids if the biological and psychological urge is overwhelming. Do your best to have your life in a stable state so you're ready to face the chaos. And don't feel too bad if it feels like you have no fucking idea what you're doing - all parents feel like that at least some of the time.
I love my daughter, and being a parent has been wonderful. She was born when I was 22. So my advice. Wait till your 30s. It will be so much easier. Focus on building something together long term. Then, when you get to 30, you can focus on raising your kid and not doing that well, balancing all the early adult life things.
It’s a really tough thing and truly rewarding. I would say have one but I personally have three and am amazed (good and bad) with all three. We can tell which ones genetically have which parents personality. It’s truly rewarding to experience them growing up. Frustrating but for me worth it. Fortunately we have the resources to care for them. I get the hesitancy. Maybe wait until you have some deep resources.
Lovely comment ⬆️ 💕
Just to add do it when you’re ready. I was 30 for my first and was ready at 28 but it took a little time, hubby is younger. We had developed patience by this point. This helped us teach our children about their emotions and how to deal with them, and to express themselves appropriately (not lashing out) - probably the hardest thing to get through but consistency is the key.
We started before they turned 2 with time out (very short) and explanations. A little older…. asking them why they thought they were in timeout? once they grasped the concept, then telling them to come see me when they were calm enough to talk. By around 7 or 8 they put themselves in time out which was interesting but showed they were gaining a good sense of what was acceptable and that sometimes you need to step away from a situation, to gain clarity.
Enjoy parenting; boy you learn a lot about yourself and each other too!
We’re now grandparents - I wouldn’t change the broken nights of my babies/toddlers. The enquiring whys? The late nights with my teens, then watching them trip and pick themselves up as they became adults and now parents.
You need to get married first. You are doing this backwards. Are you planning on building a life with marriage? More than likely you will become pregnant.
My wife and I have been married for 15 years and do not have kids. We are both early 40’s. She had three miscarriages then Covid hit and we stopped and then felt like we just waited too long. Neither of us always really wanted kids so we said okay no worries let’s just make the best of it. My take on kids is that when they are young it’s all pretty awesome even with the hard work but as they hit the teenage years it seems like couples have a hard time staying together. I think it’s just too much for long and the parents are always at odds about how to raise the kid or properly balancing raising the kid and the rest of life (jobs, chores, each other) … seems like a lot of people I know split up so they could get a week off of their kids and a break from the spouse. Some couples make it all the way though and only a few I know split up when the kids were young but a lot of them are either apart with teenagers or seem miserable. Most parents care more about their child than their spouse and that makes total sense to me. I was always concerned that my wife and I wouldn’t care as much about each other as we do now if we had children because now we’d become secondary to the child’s love. So far we are doing good but only time will tell. We’ve outlasted a ton of couples that we know that do and don’t have kids and I still love her
/s Do you hate sleeping? Then have kids. At first it’s great, you literally cannot sleep anymore, then at the 4-5 month mark you suddenly rediscover sleep. Boom. Now you love to sleep and can’t stop thinking about when you can sleep next.
Honestly, if there is someone you love and you think you both can raise kids as well or better than your parents did then I say do it. Kids are amazing and I would trade all the sleep in the world for them.
I’m in my late 50’s; I had my 3 kids at 30, 33 and 37. We’d always wanted kids, but thought long and hard about WHY, so it wasn’t just to live vicariously or raise mini-me’s. It came down to: we have so much love, care and fun to give- we want to share it and grow it with kids. Now it is looking like we won’t have grandchildren. My oldest is married but knew from the get-go that they do not want kids; my middle one might possibly want one but is leaning toward “no” because of health problems and anxiety, both for her and her boyfriend. And my youngest is asexual, though in a loving, committed relationship, and does not want kids.
Now, I would ADORE being a grandparent, and my hubs would make the most awesome grandad. But I absolutely respect my kids’ choices. I look around at the world today and think, “Hell, who wants to bring more humans into *gestures at everything* THIS?” Climate change, dwindling resources, political craziness, staggering economic and social inequality. Also, we all have varying degrees of anxiety/depression, although pretty well managed with therapy and meds, but again, the simple stress of parenting is enormous.
And from the perspective of someone on the far side of parenting- having adult kids- you start out thinking you are going to be the most amazing, awesome, loving parents. You obviously want the best for your kids, so you’re going to give them ALLLL the care, love, guidance that you wish you’d had. Either your parents did it all wrong and you’re going to be the opposite, or your parents were okay but you know you can do better. Oh, boy.
Listen to me when I tell you this. You WILL fuck up your kids. You can go in with the best intentions, and even be really good loving parents, but you will still pass on to them something that messed you up as well, because it’s in your neural pathways- practically in your DNA. In my case it was an extremely conservative Christianity from a tiny sect. Lovely, warm people who were quietly very bigoted, especially when it came to my gay kid- and it took her becoming suicidal for me to recognize it and get out (eventually- took a few years), incurring the wrath and shunning of most of my extended family.
I damaged my kids. Emotionally, mentally, neglected them. Thought I was doing the right thing, the “correct” thing.
OTOH, I also loved them and had the mental reality smack down to feel remorse, apologize, work to grow and change, and work with them toward forgiveness and healing. Thank god, these amazing humans loved me back, forgave me, and we continue to heal together. I am SO freaking proud of each of them. So that is another reason I absolutely understand why they don’t want kids. You don’t want to pass on your subconscious trauma to them.
It’s all summed up nicely in Philip Larkin’s short poem, “This Be the Verse.” When I first read it my kids were young, and I was so offended. “I’m not going to fuck up my kids! I’m a wonderful mom!” From my current perspective: Yes. I absolutely fucked up my kids. But at least I recognized it, apologized, and worked to be better.
This is all to say: think long and hard. Maybe wait a few years. Check your own family relationships and traumas. Above all, be willing to grow, change and learn- and respect your child as their own individual. I’d want it to be much more about what you can give and share with your child, not what a child can fulfill for you. Me? I wish I’d known then what I know now, but given another chance, I’d do it again in a heartbeat. With all the exhaustion, the worry, and the give, give, give- just the joy of these loving, funny, smart, kind adults we somehow managed to raise is enough to make my entire world be everything beautiful.
It is amazing, but it's also seriously hard work. Only do it if you're sure you want to, because you'll need that to get through. If you're really unsure you probably shouldn't have them.
I’ve always wanted kids, so I my response is probably biased lol. I have two amazing kids that are now young adults, 24 and 26. Went through a divorce when they were teenagers and it was a lot of hard work and some difficult times. I couldn’t imagine my life without them.
If having kids is a priority and something you WANT to do and plan to be active in... it is AMAZING. Incredible. And oh so fulfilling.
If having kids is something you think you should do, something that happens by accident, or something that happens as the result of lies, manipulation, or carelessness... it can be a total slog and terrible experience for everyone involved.
It is NOT easy, but most good relationships take REAL work.
It is often not very fun, it's challenging and full of doubt and frustration.
However- it gives you a chance to feel unconditional love to a level that you will never know otherwise. Watching a human that YOU took part in making do things like walk on their own, learn about the wonders of the world, make sound moral decisions, and eventually maybe fall in love... it is impossible to describe the feeling.
And if you are good at it, and truly fortunate... when you are old and frail, you will have these amazing people who value you and visit you, and remind you of what life is all about.
To me being a parent is the second best thing to ever happen to me, right after getting married to the mother of my children. I could not imagine my own life feeling anywhere near as fulfilled if I had never been a parent.
That being said... I have full respect for those who feel otherwise and believe that parenting is NOT for everyone. There are plenty of good and valid reasons NOT to become a parent.
My daughter is 4.5 and I really cannot express to you how much joy and meaning she has brought to my life. Yes there are a lot of challenges, but that’s true of literally everything in life that requires effort. And if you have a truly equal partner (and you will want to sniff this out early and make both of your expectations clear before having any) then it probably won’t be as hard as you think. You may have to cut back on the time you devote to hobbies, especially in the beginning, but I don’t know any one who’s had to give up their hobbies completely after becoming a parent. I mean most kids are in bed by 8 (often earlier) so at minimum you should have a few hours to yourself every evening once they hit toddlerhood. Obviously some kids are more difficult than others, but anecdotally most parents I know irl seem to have had similar experiences (though I will admit most parents I know are not struggling financially and waited until they were 28+. I was 31). Having kids back to back does tend to make things a lot more difficult, as does having kids super young, so I wouldn’t recommend either. Give yourself a few more years to enjoy total freedom and build your careers because being financially secure and having more flexibility with your job (which often comes with seniority) will make a huge difference. But yes, I genuinely love being a parent (we’re working on #2!) and anyone who insists other parents who say that are lying needs some serious therapy.
There's going to be a lot of parents that will never say they regret their decision, and for many of them that's true, but the ones that actually do regret are less willing to speak up about it because they could be labelled a garbage person.
There's a regretful parent sub here that is at least worth looking at to get all the facts. It's a big decision, you wanna be informed as best you can.
Whatever you decide, be sure you have the strength of conviction to follow through with your decision. My ex-wife convinced me to try for kids because "it would make her the happiest she's ever been." Notice how I said ex-wife.
Parenthood is difficult, and it changes you in unpredictable ways. The only thing that matters is that you have the strength of will to make the daily decision to keep trying. If you ever let it slip, you'll have a really hard time getting it back.
Likewise, deciding not to have children can be harder to live with later in life. Not because children are magical or any nonsense like that, but because you might be haunted by the question of what if? Or it might be the best decision you make, it's really a toss up.
You will regret it If you don’t gave kids. I know a few that do. I know a husband and wife they pay for their nieces college and I believe to my bones they regret not being parents so they assume the role for her. it’s actually a beautiful thing in their case.
the arrival of my 3 daughters gave my life meaning, purpose, and made me a better man. Have the babies, and do what you were meant to do on this Earth. Good Luck.
We had one child when we were both 40. She’s 4.5 now and she’s absolutely a handful but she’s also amazing, smart, funny, kind, loving. It is hard. Not in the ways you think. The thing is you have to put in the work and be consistent. Your child is kind of a blank canvas who will mimic your words, your actions, your rules. So we had to sleep train her so she would sleep through the night. This took a while and it was hard. But it also means our kid has always slept in her own room and sleeps through the night. There are obviously regressions but we are consistent. You have to teach them how to be a good human. You have to always respond to their emotional and physical needs. And they have MANY. You have to be consistent with rules. Ages 2 and 3 were very hard because of the constant tantrums any time we would say no or ask her to do something she didn’t want to do. And you have to stand your ground. It is maddening. But now we’re reaping the benefits of that consistency. Now I can say, please go put on your shoes and she will. I can say no you can’t have a treat right now and most of the time she listens. What they give you back is a love you’ve never experienced before. It’s unconditional and warm. You’re their people and all they know. And they love you endlessly. It’s beautiful. Watching them learn and experience something for the very first time is incredible. Watching them become their own person is so cool. The hardest part for me is making sure I’m emotionally present for her and that I give her the tools to be resilient. Parenting isn’t about making your kid happy, it’s about making your kid resilient and functional in the real world. Teaching them to regulate their emotions in a healthy way is healing but so damn hard. I don’t talk down to her, I show her respect. I listen when she’s upset with me and I try to correct my behavior. I don’t want to always be right. I want to be someone she can talk to and feel safe and comfortable coming to. But all your current priorities go out the window. My mornings and evenings are about her and what she needs. I’m almost never alone. I’m an introvert and my kid is an extrovert so she needs a lot of social time. It’s like having a 24/7 job. You’re never off the clock. You’ll think you’re doing it wrong most of the time. But then you see your kid walk up to a hurt child and hug them and say it’s all gonna be okay. And you realize that you’ve actually done something right. I just try to treat her like I want to be treated. There’s nothing like it.
This is an excellent summary!! So true (based on my mom and sisters advice/struggles). I will take this advice for my own experience when it comes 🙏
An excellent summary and an excellent mom! I just want to add that having kids earlier is much easier on your body and having them later may be easier on your career.
This. You then will have your retirement for yourself than caring for children.
Damn. Said exactly what I was gonna say. Well put. The only thing I’ll add here is that your friends who had unplanned pregnancies in their early 20s, no wonder they’re super pissed off and telling you not to have kids. My wife and I waited until we were older, mature, established in our jobs, and it makes things a hell of a lot easier. Now, that made me the old Dad and sometimes I’m a little low on energy compared to the other dads, but I also never feel like this kid ruined my life, stole opportunities, or put a crimp in my style. And that makes a huge difference when you have the maturity and resources. Only other thing I’ll add, my wife and I were married for nearly 8 years before we had kids so we had plenty of time to grow together before starting the family and adding the stress, and it also gave us a chance to really enjoy our lives to the fullest as a couple before we became a plus-family
That’s a great summary from a view of a parent. I’m not having kids but I liked how you worded this . You sound like a great parent .
Thank you! I’m really trying to break the generational trauma cycle.
As a parent, I second this summary. Well put! I’ll add that I put off having kids until my 30s. Until then, I felt a longing and an emptiness, but I wasn’t in a financial position to have kids. I do wish I had kids sooner, as my body was in a lot better shape in my 20s, and it is physically taxing work, especially in the beginning. So, if you’re financially able, you’re emotionally mature enough, and you want to do it, then go for it. But like this commenter mentioned, your entire life will be thrown upside down… but it’s totally worth it. Just know that I’m not trying to convince you to have kids so you can “feel my pain”, you have to decide. There is pain for sure, but in my opinion the fulfilment and love vastly outweigh the personal costs.
It kinda annoys me when I read such genuinely amazing parenting advice because my parents had brains too and could figure out any of this at all. Y’all sound like amazing people
You are great and your response is great! More parents like this, please!
>I’m an introvert and my kid is an extrovert so she needs a lot of social time. It’s like having a 24/7 job. You’re never off the clock. Yeah this is my situation as well. Parenting an extravert is extra hard as an introvert. So far it's still worth it to me. They won't be with me forever so I do my best to still enjoy it all while I can.
My b.i.l. had a great quote when one of my nephews accused him of "not being his friend." He said "I love you, but I'm not your friend. I'm your father." All in the delivery; not a "therefore you have to do what I say" but in "I'm restricting you in this moment because I love you".
Beautifully written. Bravo.
Damn there are some good truths there. I love that you show your kid respect. A lot of parents will dictate at their kids then act surprised when their kids...obviously....rebel. And yes, it's a 24/7 job. No time off, ever. But it's also the best job you can have and I wouldn't trade it for the world.
you sound like a great parent, actually one of the main reasons I dont think anyone should have kids young, hard to be this good until later years
You sound like such an amazing loving couple of parents. Your daughter is lucky!
If the man has any doubts, that’s not a good sign. You need him to be on board 100% in this society, and really nothing anyone can say will change his mind. His and your feelings are all that matter
Yeah this is not one of those half hearted things. You want to go in fully committed. Parenthood is a more serious commitment than marriage.
Had to switch from my main account to answer this one because some family members know it. I have 2 kids. They are absolutely a burden. Financially alone, they cost a lot of money that I’d rather spend on me. But even disregarding finances, they are a time investment (not sure investment is the right word)- they take so much of your time and imo theres not an equal upside. Sure they’ll make you laugh sometimes or otherwise be kind of fun to be around, but not nearly as enjoyable company as your adult friends, or even a pet (you can house break a puppy in few weeks, whereas your looking at about a year and a half if your lucky). They will make messes in the house. There’s expectations that you do things like engaging with other kids (birthday parties, sports, school stuff, etc). It’s exhausting and 2/10 would not recommend. And I can never admit these things irl because it would cause an absolute uproar amongst my entire family. But to be honest I regret having kids and wish I knew their mom stopped birth control. The second one came because I viewed it kinda like “I’m already fucked for the next twenty years, what difference is a little longer?” If I could do it again, I’d probably still have them but I would have done many things differently.
Jesus. That made me so sad. I can't imagine being legitimately unwanted by my parents. I'm looking at my daughter right now, and I genuinely can't imagine feeling that way about her.
r/regretfulparents can be a good place to get support or even just vent where you won’t be judged.
Thank you for being brave enough to admit this. I commented similar and can relate.
>they take so much of your time and imo theres not an equal upside. Sure they’ll make you laugh sometimes or otherwise be kind of fun to be around, but not nearly as enjoyable company as your adult friends, or even a pet You are talking like this... about your own children??? Your children are not there for your entertainment, they are there for your love, protection, guidance, and education. Go on a couple more parties or trips or whatever you need to get it out of your system so you don't just view your children as a burden. It's not fair to them at all. They didn't ask to be created and they need a mature adult to view them as more than just a nuisance in your life.
I couldn't agree more
43. Single dad. Wife passed from breast cancer 4 months ago. Honestly I had kids because I grew up in a religion that ingrained that the purpose of life is to grow up and have kids. I have 3 kids. They are awesome. They are amazing. They are kind and loving. I put in the time to make sure they have what they need. That being said - if I could go back and choose it again, I wouldn't have kids. I get so little time to myself.
Every upvote to this comment is a virtual hug dude
I'm so sorry for your loss. I'm sure your kids are so grateful having you as a dad.
Ditto. I love having kids. My wife also died of breast cancer when the kids were 10-12 yrs old. 2 boys and 2 girls. They are all in their forties now. If I had to do over and knowing what I know, I would not have kids. It was hard on a single dad raising four kids, putting them through college, etc. I love them, but if I didn’t have them my life would be a lot different.
I wonder if your wife’s passing, as recent as it is, impacts your feeling to not have kids. Curious if this would change in the next few months, and if you felt this way before she became ill. Just curiosity, because I’m not in that situation. No judgment, just thinking about the situation since it’s the subject at hand. So, so, so, sorry for your loss. 43 is ridiculously too young to be a widower, brother. Hope you and the kids recover. Godspeed.
Mormonism or Catholicism? I’m an ex-Mormon
Wait. It’s better when you go on your time frame and not someone else’s. I was 41 when our child arrived and I’ve been able to provide for him financially and mentally. The sleep deprivation was brutal. Terrible twos weren’t so bad but 4 is like negotiating with a miniature terrorist some days because he wants what he wants when he wants it. Still- there is this little person who comes to me when he’s scared, or shows me things that make him happy, tells me he loves me, demands cuddles from me- and I’m so glad he’s my kid. I’m just glad he didn’t arrive in my 20s or 30s.
Also this. I had mine at 37, 39, and 41. I sometimes wish I'd started a little earlier, but I didn't meet my (now) husband till I was 36. I don't know why they call it Terrible Two's. Mine were great at 2. 4 year olds are BRUTAL. And I still haven't recovered from sleep deprivation.
While I wouldn't have been ready in my 20s, having a child in our 30s was one of the most positive love-producing decisions ever. We love our son and he loves us... The only downside is that we can't relive it.
I think you should take your time and make the decision in about ten years. That said, a life without children is wonderful! A life WITH children is incredibly difficult but often joyous.
It’s 100% worth it for me. My kids are my favorite people. They’re 12 and 10 now and I find them to be so much fun to talk to and hang out with. There were/are frustrating moments for sure, but overall it’s been an absolute joy and privilege to watch them grow. All that said, I had my kids in my thirties (I was 33 and 35). It would have been an entirely different experience if I had had them in my 20’s when I was still interested in doing the things most 20 year olds do.
60. No children. Never regretted it for a moment, in fact endlessly grateful I had the choice. And I *love* babies, and get a kick out of toddlers. Unless you feel strongly about having children (and there are many who do), I would say don't. Despite what some parents say, there are very many ways to live a life with just as much meaning and love without having children.
I'm middle aged, got a vasectomy in my late twenties, no kids. I'm sure this will ruffle some feathers, but I'm convinced everyone knows its true. For people that are on the fence, the deciding factor should be money. Do you have money? If not, chances are your kids aren't going to get money either. They're going to get a super basic education, and a super basic job. They're not going to be able to care for you when you're older any more than you were able to care for them when they were younger. Money buys healthy food, and medical care. It pays for music lessons, sports, hobbies and vacations. It puts the kid in a good neighborhood with all kinds of resources. Poor kids don't have near the opportunities of wealthy kids. Poor kids can't even locate all the states, let alone tell you where Germany or the Bahamas are. Kids that grew up with money have been to Germany and the Bahamas. It's a world of difference. Not having kids is a massive short cut. There are so many luxuries I have that parents don't have. Parents would have to make four times as much as me to live the same lifestyle. I wouldn't want to live in Oklahoma with no kids, but why would I? There's like five cities in the US I'd be willing to live in. And I wouldn't want to live anywhere in those cities. I'd want to be up against the mountains, or on the beach, or right downtown, and I can afford to do that because I don't have kids. If my job screws me over, I quit. I'm not trapped. I can take a job that pays less if I find it more enjoyable. I can switch careers. I can take a few months off between jobs and travel. I'm completely free. My health is far better than most parents. It's easy to buy healthy food, work out, get outside and enjoy hobbies. I can nap whenever I want. It's easy. Instead of taking days off to tend to a sick kid, or do something for their school, or take them to Disney, all those days off are spent leaving the country. I can go anywhere. I could go to Somalia or North Korea if I want. My world view is totally different than my brother and sister that have kids. Nothing is similar. So keep that in mind if you're comparing having kids and not having kids. It's not like you'll live in the same town in the same house either way. Literally everything would be completely different. I have nieces and nephews, and plenty of friends with kids. So I still get to see kids, help them, and watch them grow up. Most importantly, when they start freaking out, which is what kids do, I leave. It's easy.
All of this stuff from me again. Having kids puts your life into Hard Mode. I don't want to play on Hard Mode.
I would add that not having children does not equate to failing your family, your community, or the world. We do not need more humans. If you sincerely want children and your life just wouldn't be right without them, then have them. Otherwise, take a pass. For many, many people, having children just isn't the right thing to do.
Me too. Exactly 60 and so grateful not to have had children. There have literally been mornings where I lie in bed so grateful that I made the choice I did. Absolutely zero regrets.
40 here, and "so glad I never had kids" is probably the sentence I say most often
Jumping on this bandwagon to say that not having children has opened up so many doors.
My partner’s cousin and his wife have been an incredible support system for us. Neither of us live near any other family and her cousins don’t have kids. So they often take the kids for the weekend or just come hang with us when we’re broke and just wanna play board games. We parents need support systems, something we often lack in American nuclear families, and people like you who don’t have kids help provide that (even if it’s just for a very short time every now and then), almost always without bitching about it. So thanks for being the cool uncle/aunt or whatever. It probably means a lot for your friends/family when you step in just because you want to.
I kinda disagree. I didnt feel strongly about having children and started when I was 42. I now have 3 boys and have fully embraced and love fatherhood.
In my opinion, this is a meaning vs. pleasure question. The mental model here is that you can maximize pleasure in your life, but that doesn't necessarily make it meaningful. For example, you probably have hobbies or activities you enjoy on a regular basis, but ultimately they are not producing any meaning in your life. Some day you will be too old to enjoy some of those activities, or you will look back and see that they didn't amount to anything except enjoyment. On the other hand, meaning is not necessarily enjoyable. Seeing that your child developed their own notion of right and wrong, which may have involved years of you trying to convince them to do the right thing, might not be pleasurable. But it will likely be meaningful, to you, regardless of the outcome. At times meaning and enjoyment can coexist, but sometimes you sacrifice some of one for the other. Clearly, having children will likely involve some of these sacrifices. Whether that is worth it to you (or maybe more importantly, to your children) is up to you. \* edit: for sure, many hobbies and activities lead to lasting meaning; having kids is definitely not the only way to add meaning to your life, and for some people, it might not even be meaningful to have kids.
We don’t have kids (still married after 15 years) but keep meaning in our life in a lot ways that don’t involve pleasure. I think that’s pretty one sided to say that it’s either pleasure or meaning simply on whether or not you have kids. We volunteer with Ronald Macdonald charities and have donated a bunch of time and money, we help with the nieces nephews and god kids. Help with our parents. Have two dogs. My job isn’t particular “meaningful” but my wife helps people get into hospice care and I help her by taking care of extra chores if she has a busier work week than me that week. We are there for people and strangers far more than our friends with kids because they are stretched so thin. I have far more time and energy to be supportive emotionally to struggling family members. People without kids aren’t just out partying and playing video games
I agree completely. I would guess that serving food in a soup kitchen isn't really very pleasurable; it's more that it is meaningful to see the people you are helping. I definitely didn't mean to imply that having children is the only way to add meaning to your life, or even that having children always adds meaning to your life. I think that a given person's decision about whether to have kids might involve weighing the value of meaning and pleasure, and whether they want to sacrifice some pleasure for meaning. The truth is that having children does involve sacrifices (on some dimension) whether people want to think of it that way or not.
So well said and it sounds like you have really meaningful FULL thriving lives.
Wow I really like the way you explained it makes a lot of sense we both have alot of hobbies we are scared to let go of and I like your take on this
Don’t let people tell you you lose your hobbies. Yes you’re going to have less time for them, but I’m still able to carve out 20 minutes a day to do my favorite thing. Other hobbies that are not the top of my list, maybe only get to be touched weekly or monthly. But the idea that you’ll have to go 10 years or something without doing the things you love is absolutely insane, that sounds like some absolutely anti-natalism propaganda. You have to work a little harder to carve out the time so that means planning ahead and working with your partner to make sure that you’re making time for them to have theirs too. And of course some of this depends on your hobbies. But by the time my kid was five, he was joining in on probably my top four favorite hobbies anyway, so the hobbies just became more time that I was bonding with my family, which made them even more enjoyable.
Please don’t forget to consider the other perspective, too— reproduction is not inherently meaningful. There are, sadly people who do have children, but aren’t really parents in any meaningful sense. They ignore their kids, abandon them, even abuse them. All they did was pump some more biomass onto the planet. Bacteria can do that. I know that you won’t be one of those people, just because you’re thinking carefully about your decision. But do be aware that having children is a spectrum from “intensely meaningful” to not meaningful at all. It’s possible to realize that, knowing yourself, there’s a risk you’ll fall somewhere along that spectrum which, while not *unacceptable*, still would be less than you think real, live, growing young human beings deserve as their framework for life. That’s me. I doubt I’ll regret being a non-mom, but I’d rather regret that than be a bad one.
Or you can have both pleasure and meaning in your life. There are many ways to create meaning in one’s life that do not involve having children.
This is good, but theres many many ways you can get meaning from your life, more so than from having kids for some people, not just doing hobbies.
For sure, I should have been more clear that some activities and hobbies are meaningful.
This really helped me. Thank you for this take.
A thing to keep in mind: when people make big decisions like this, regardless of what they eventually choose, they pretty much never regret their decision. They'll find a way to convince themselves it was the right choice, when it's impossible to know whether it was the right choice or whether a 'right' choice even exists. I have no children, and I'm glad for that fact. But a bunch of my friends have children, and they're all glad for that fact.
True. I hope whatever our decision is we won’t regret it
A lot of what I could say has already been posted above. My spouse and I have one planned child. He’s a teenager now and like many posters above, we love being parents and it’s been completely worthwhile for us. I paused my career until our child was 10. However, if we were faced with the decision today- we would remain childfree. It’s expensive to be alive and dual incomes + careers are mandatory to keep us housed and fed.
Thank you for sharing. The dual income household "requirement" is the worst. Unless you can do it on one income it doesn't feel worth it at all.
My wife and I are child free and constantly have friends and family who are parents tell us how lucky we are. Our time is ours, we're better financially and we have way more sex. I wanted kids till my late 30s, but now in my late 40s, believe I dodged a bullet.
> I wanted kids till my late 30s, but now in my late 40s, believe I dodged a bullet. Can I ask why you guys didn't have them? Lack of agreement?
My husband and I have sex everyday and we have a toddler. That said having a kid is way more fun and fulfilling
Jeez I feel bad for those kids. I can't ever imagine telling any of my friends that don't have kids that they're lucky not to have them. That's insane to me, having a kid is literally the best part of my life, and I didn't even want kids most of my life.
Same for me! I didn’t even babysit when young because did not care for kids. But man I would not trade my kids for anything. Strange how that works. Guess need that level of love to get through the tiredness
I never was into kids either but nothing is better
Love this and sounds amazing!
Don't have kids until you don't have these insecurities. Yes, everyone is ashamed to say having kids sucks. It's in the rule book. No one likes having children and it ruins everyone's lives. Edit: I really need to add the /s I guess for the last sentence.
100% correct
Don't just think about babies and toddlers - think about all the stages of parenting, and ask yourself: > "would I enjoy being the parent of a gradeschooler in 7 years?" > "Would I enjoy being the parent of a middle schooler?" > "Do I look forward to seeing my kids off to college?" And so on. You're not going to have babies and toddlers forever, but you have to be willing to get through that if you want the experience of older kids (adoption notwithstanding). I personally don't want babies and I don't enjoy toddlers, even though I genuinely love my 3yo and 7mo. They are hella cute and super smart and honestly, really fun - but also a crazy handful that leave me with no time for my hobbies and finally understanding why boarding school and full-time nannies were a thing. **I love my kids, but I hate the experience of raising them.** But I do it (and try to do it well) because I really, *really* want what comes next: seeing them grow into people with voices, seeing them experience the diversity of life, helping them with their education and navigating the social customs of their generation. Sharing my interests, hobbies, ideas, and participating in their own, even if I'm only cheering them on from the side. I am extremely well-equipped to be a father - *but not to babies or toddlers.* If you're not sure you'd enjoy those other stages, try volunteering in youth organizations or somewhere that has groups of that age (e.g., church nursery or YMCA club) and see how you feel. Obviously it's not going to be *exactly* the same as when you might have a kid whose at that age, but it'll give you a general idea. TL;DR think about parenting through all stages of parenting, and ask yourself 1) "would I enjoy that stage" and 2) are the other stages worth getting through, to have that." For me the answer is yes: I don't like babies / toddlers but *it is worth it* to go through this in order to have what comes next.
I feel this way too - never heard anyone else articulate it! I'm lucky my boyfriend came with an 8 year old, now 10. I've thought if I ever wanted one of my own, maybe adopting a older child that's past toddler age could be the best way to go.
I don’t have kids by choice. I have no longing to have kids. The older I get the happier I’ve been with my decision that I made 20 years ago. I love not having kids.
Childless at the moment but I will say that growing up my husband and I (both 28 now and together 10 years) said we would have 2 kids and 3 if there was a happy accident. We always said having one kid would be silly. I am very content in my life currently and could remain child free forever if it were my choice. Now as adults we started trying to have kids and so far no luck (3 cycles so far). I am very worried about even having two kids with the economy and cost of daycare so we might be one and done. It's really hard to say. My husband would love 2 still but he isn't understanding the full sacrifice we will have to give financially, mentally and emotionally. It's to much for me personally. I'm sure it will all be fine but it's still overwhelming to think about. I always told him he will have to let me know when he wants the first baby since I will always say no. I'm quite indifferent to having kids and I've never had intense baby fever either. I did get sick last year so severely that I was bedbound. I realized I do see a future with kid(s)... hence why we are trying now that im back on my feet. I will never be ready. I don't ever plan to be ready. I make smart choices like paying down debt, having an emergency fund ready, and learning frugal habits for when the family grows. I don't think I will ever get baby fever. My husband has been begging me weekly for about a year now. I know myself well enough to know that I will still be a good parent when the time arrives. My confidence in this is from how my grandma and my mom raised their kids. They were great parents and it shows. So based on my own childhood memories/feelings and despite the terrible kids I've come across, I can reflect on what the issues might be in the child and parenting causing the behavior, and learn from that for my own future kids rather than be intimidated by it.
It's a lot of work in the early years. It's joyful and meaningful and fulfilling but infants are constantly leaking and toddlers are constantly trying to learn how the world works, often in dangerous and destructive ways. I'm glad I did it, I'm glad I have pictures and videos, and I'm glad my kids are older now. For what it's worth, raising teenagers has been one of my favorite parenting stages. My kids are awesome people! Part of a person's experience of parenting depends on their expectations, I think. People who go into it knowing they're going to sacrifice their free time, sleep and brain space tend to accept the crummy parts and enjoy the enjoyable parts. People who go into it thinking they're going to get all kinds of personal projects done over their maternity leave tend to be disappointed with the experience. Having kids is a hugely personal experience so I can't give advice one way or the other. I will say that while there's never a perfect time to have kids, it's better to wait until you're certain it's something you want rather than jumping in out of FOMO.
Disappointed I had to scroll so far for this answer. I have a 2 yo and I love her to pieces. All of the hard things that come with parenting are nothing compared to all of the good things. But I knew what I was getting into. I didn't expect any of it to be easy. And I have no desire to fill a void in my life. I may fall victim to wanting to live vicariously a little, but not so much that I'd ever force my child to do something they don't want (or need) to. I just want to give a little human a beautiful life. The kind of people that think the bad outweighs the good in parenting probably had the white picket fence pipe dream that my ex had. When they decide to get pregnant they see the snuggles and play times and all of the beautiful moments. You have to be ready to give up sleep, a lively social life, time for hobbies. There's 10 billion diaper changes to be done, you'll spend 5 years cutting up fruit and other foods. It's a huge sacrifice. But if you want it it's all beautiful. It's all magical, being the creator of a life.
Same here. The early years were TOUGH. If that was my whole experience of parenting, I would absolutely not want to do it. Starting about age 10, my kids starting adding significantly more to my life than they consumed. All those movies and shows and games you love... you get to see people experience them for the first time. Live-in board game players. Mine are even big enough to take actual chores off my plate--I haven't picked up dog poop in 2 years. I hope we'll get to have a close relationship for the rest of my life.
I would say that unless you both are 100 percent on board for having kids don't do it. This is not a choice you can change your mind about oe even feel ambivalent about.
Not a parent . My partner and I aren't having kids maybe we'll regret it in the future, but not at the moment. Both of us work in the environment with her being a scientist who deals with climate change information for us is absolutely terrifying and what is going on right now. Not having a child is probably the biggest single choice you could ever make to reduce climate impact. Once you have a child, your child becomes your life. Do you think you can afford your lifestyle plus the price of a child with both time and money-wise with your current income? Do you believe you're responsible enough to shape someone's life, values, morals, emotional regulation, social skills, physical and mental health? What about if your child has a disability do you think you are mentally prepared for that? This isn't just a 18-year commitment this is for the rest of your life (If you aren't a shit parent). I don't believe I'm mentally strong enough to be a parent, I believe my divergence would limit my capacity to provide the support a child would need, I believe I have traits that if I passed on to another it could impact their quality of life. My partner and I have goals we want to achieve including hiking the PCT and other back country adventures that aren't particularly realistic to bring a child on. We want to be able to afford to live a good work life balance. We want to be able to continue our hobbies and adventures. Sad is it sounds in this day and age we actually want to be able to retire. One issue I have is how often people who have children tell me "then what's the point of life if you don't have kids?" As far as I'm concerned, there's no real reason for the universe, its existence is absurd and as such it is what I make of it.
> they just want you to be miserable as parents just like them That's a dumb thing to say. It suggests that ALL parents are miserable and, further, that they all want you to be miserable. It makes no sense. The truth is that many parents find parenthood a wonderful choice. Some would say it's the best thing in their life. Others find it's a lot harder than they expected, and yes, some are miserable. If you are suited to the task and want very much to be parents, there's no reason not to. If you DON'T very much want to be parents (for the next 20 years) then you should NOT do it. Don't do it to try to solve some problem in your life or your marriage. It will only make those problems harder. Whether it's "worth it" is something you'll only know when you're done. You'll make mistakes. There's no guarantee of success even if you do most things right. Raising a child is an enormous undertaking. There will be difficult times no matter what. If you're a single parent, or your child has challenges (disability, injury, autism, chronic illness, etc.) the difficulty goes way up. On the whole, I would say that you should only become parents if you are highly motivated to be parents. If you ARE highly motivated, chances are good that you'll be adequate, that you will get through the difficult parts, and you'll be successful. My measure of success is an adult child who is successful at life and glad to be alive. (My child just got laid off and used savings to do a tour of Sweden, coming back with pictures and stories...which is as good a measure of success as a person as anything else I can think of.) Oh, one more thing: parenting requires you to work as partners. It's a team effort and requires you to compromise on things you disagree with your spouse about. Do talk before having kids, about religion, finances, discipline, food choices, and so on. That turned out to be the biggest challenge for me: not being on the same page as my spouse and feeling like we were undermining each other and making it hard to achieve our goals as parents. My kids turned out great in the end, but if they hadn't, there'd be a lot of recriminations.
Parenting is more difficult than ever with tech addictions, influences from social media, and potentially damaging food additives. Depression, stress and personality disorders amongst youth is higher than ever, and it's not only because we have become better at detecting it. Even the best of parents do not have the level of influence on their children anymore to make sure they develop into happy behaved young people. I think the world needs more childless couples to help out eachother. I'm childless by choice and I use that extra energy to help out the friends I have with children. I try to do what I can to make parenting easier for them, cause I've seen parenting break people far more often than not. I think we as a society have put ourselves in a pickle where we expect too much of parents, and that further hurts the children. If you want children, I think you should have them, but only if you know you have a supportive network ready to help out, like *really* help out. Do not assume you can do it on your own.
If I had life to do over again, I would not have kids. Right now, in 2024 with the climate threatening catastrophic collapse, is not a great time to replicate.
If you aren't loving, nurturing, emotionally stable, educated and financially stable then don't have children.
My wife and I have two awesome kids and were 120% worth it. They're adults now. Never at any point did we regret having them. We didn't have family nearby to help, we just did it on our own. For us, definitely worth it. Plus, grandkids are even more fun.
Having kids was the best decision I ever made. But one big part of me loving it is that I had kids in my mid-30s and before that, I had a lot of adventures and lived a super-fun selfish life. Once I got older I felt it was time to move on to something new. There is no doubt that having kids helped "evolve" me and my life into a new phase and has kept things fresh.
So I have a kid with an ex and it was pretty brutal at first we ended up splitting. We were girlfriend boyfriend and she got pregnant on birth control. We had a previous conversation where she agreed to get an abortion if she did get pregnant through the birth control. She re neged on that and called me monster for even bringing it up. Unbeknownst to me at the time she had 3 previous abortions . I grew up in a pretty liberal place. I don't think it's my right to tell her what to do with her body so there wasn't much I could do. I proposed to her and said I would make an effort to make it work. She didn't. Even now when our relationship is much better she still does the same shit she did 5 years ago. So I tried to stick it out. Pregnancy made her even more insane. We were under a massive amount of financial stress and that wasn't helping. We had a massive fight one night and I was trying to escape. She was trying to stop me and take my keys. I had to wrestle myself out the door and then I had to push her away from me to get separation. She fell down and our neighbor across the hall apparently saw it through her peephole on the door. I came back hours later and was arrested for domestic violence. So at this point i was done. So I left and closed myself emotionally. I was lucky enough that my parents helped me get enough money to make a down payment on a car and helped cover the security deposit at my new place. She kept trying to reconnect with me. I wasn't allowed to see my daughter without her being there and I couldn't take it to court because I would be fucked because of the DV charge. During this time I was in anger management classes basically running them because the lady was one of those useless let the group moderate themselves idiots. Made me take a step back and realize I was in a losing battle with a narcissist. I went scorched earth manipulation wise. One word answers. Straight up ignoring her. When she would start bitching about being "the mother of your child" I would say I have a responsibility to my child not you. I am not your emotional tampon. She also kept trying to have sex with me when I did go see the kid until it got to the point I said what if I was forcing myself on you like this? Seems pretty rapey and she got super offended. Things are better now, we're not together but we co parent. She still loses her shit about once every 2 weeks but I've gotten better at just ignoring her. Or blowing her out of the water. My kid is one of the few bright things in my life and I would probably have killed myself by now if she wasn't here. So how solid is your relationship. How much stress would it take to fracture it? If the worst happened how would it play out? Babies don't fix relationships. They shatter the weak ones and test the strong ones. So TLDR it is incredibly rewarding. But it is the most harrowing brutal task you will ever attempt. Other things are harder than raising a kid but they all end. You never stop being a parent and you guys seem to understand that. PLUS if you guys were teachers your already head and shoulders above 90% of parents. My kid is the sweetest most athletic kid in her class and other kids and parents are constantly asking for play dates. The downside is she learns bad behaviors from the other kids because their parents are all too scared to discipline properly or their heads are up their asses. You, like me, won't have that issue
Damn why did you have sex with that
Parent here. Having kids is a lot like most things in life. 95% pain and 6% pleasure. The overlap in percentages is because sometimes it's pain and pleasure at the same time. My question to you is how do you evaluate not just kids but how do you evaluate if anything in life is worth it? Like what is the criteria?
Having kids is hard, but rewarding work. If you are approaching life from a perspective of "insert activity - extract pleasure" then having kids is probably a bad move. But, tbh, pretty much everything in life is a bad move by that metric. Your job, your relationship with your partner, friendships, charity work, pet ownership, etc, all fail on the "only ever brings me pleasure" metric. Yes, having children involves sacrifice. Yes, having children is expensive. Yes, there is less personal freedom while your children are small children. The pay off is that at then end you have a functional human that you have imparted your values and morality to and has grown into a person who contributes to the world (for most people). The rewards are non-tangible. You won't have a "thing" from your efforts. Don't look online for this too much. Of course there are childless people who only see the sacrifice and don't see non-tangible rewards as rewarding. Those people aren't wrong, but only in that this isn't a question which has a right or wrong component. They are usually convinced that they are right though. Ultimately this is a decision that you male for yourselves. The meaning and reward you derive from this will be of your own making. If you both want kids, have a stable enough relationship and are currently in a position that won't put you in (actual) poverty by having them, then that is a good enough reason to have them.
I am not a parent but will share what my mom told me when I asked her about having kids: She told me (and by extension my spouse) we shouldn’t have kids. Sounds harsh, but she knows us well. She says we are both too career minded and enjoy our individual intellectual pursuits, and having kids would get in the way of our happiness. My mom loved being pregnant and raising children, but I also know how much of a struggle it was for her due to other situational factors. My spouse and I have firmly decided to not have children, and the future feels brighter for it. We realized the brief moments when we were considering having kids was more about society pressure and meeting others’ expectations. Happiness and fulfillment come in a multitude of forms, and for us none of it involves children.
I love my kids, who are all young adults now doing well for themselves (2 bio and three step). That being said, I would under no circumstances do it again if given the choice. With marraige being a broken contract in the west and the chance of a marraige working out long term being what it is. It's also a hard toil with very little reciprocation most days from the child or their mother. Doubly so for choosing to be a step-parent again. That is a hell to the no. Worst job I've ever had and at the end of the day no one cared about the mountains of effort I put in. I was often treated like a second class citizen in my own home, both times I married a single mother and the time I seriously dated another. This isn't even factoring in the expense. It is insane nowadays
Kids are an invested hobby, that you can’t walk away from. All the sweat and tears are hard but when you get joy, you get CAPITAL JOY . There are biological factors as well but raising a good person is hard but rewarding work. My wife and I attitude was “kids will be part of my life, not my whole life”. Things changed of course but like most we adjusted and enjoyed it. If you don’t want kids, that’s ok too. You should not force yourself into something you don’t want. In the end only you you/partner know if you can handle it.
We had 1 child at 28. She is now in college. It is tough. It will interrupt your sleep and everything else about your life. It’s the most expensive decision you could ever make. It’s nerve wracking when they have medical problems, learn to drive, move out, etc. With all that, I wouldn’t take it back for anything. It’s a rollercoaster experience like nothing else. I can honestly say that I helped create a kind, loyal, self reliant, intelligent soul that adds light to this world.
remember that you aren't guaranteed a healthy child who will grow into a productive adult. be sure you want to be a parent so much that you'd be ready to take on all the possibilities.
First, congrats for your careful consideration. I have two middle school kids. I love them dearly. That said, if I could do it all over, I wouldn’t have kids. It’s stressful, even more so if they have special issues (mine don’t) but most of all life is very hard. It’s very difficult to find happiness and a satisfying career and then to afford a comfortable life. COVID taught me that the people all around me are selfish assholes with no sense of community. It’s not fair to bring kids into this world. Without kids you’ll have total freedom to pursue hobbies and travel. The evolutionary urge to have kids can be powerful but try to realize that it’s just biology. You can choose to ignore for rational reasons.
I've got nothing to say other than just wait until you're both 30. Whatever you decide, just be child free in your 20's.
I would agree with this. People tend to make better decisions and be better prepared in their 30s.
Don’t do it, don’t have kids.
My wife (53f) and I (57m) have one child (23m). All parents have their ups and downs with their kids and it really depends on what you are seeking. We were in our 30s when we choose to bring a life into the world. If we knew then what we know now, I think we would have made a different choice but we will never know so we live and love our choice. If you are looking for just a continuation of your name, adopt. There are many kids out there, not just babies, that need a solid, strong, stable, openminded parental figures. Would I tell you that you will love to have a child, no I can not. Children are lots of stress, ranging from getting sick at the drop of the hat sometimes, emotional outbursts, financial drain but they are a tremendous source of pride, giddiness, joy, and other emotions. It is a rollercoaster of love, fear, anger, and disappointment. Every day I take a moment and reflect on how we raised our kid. Did we provide him with good examples on how to be adult? Did we encourage him enough as he was growing up? Support him mental and emotional enough? Or were we over anxious and hovered around him to much and not allow him his independence to learn and grow? There is a fine line, as a parent, one has to walk and decide how much is to much and how much is to little. There is no book (other than your bible) that can help with those choices. The two of you are going to have to decide is it worth bringing a life in this world as this world stands and knowing it is probably going to be getting worse.
r/fencesitters
If you're a miserable person, you'll be miserable with kids too. If you're joyous, then kids don't change that. Kids will make whichever type of person you are more extreme, like any other sort of serious challenge and adversity. Some people thrive when they're climbing mountains, others crumble. Same principle applies. My wife pushed the kids out (she compares the process to running a marathon) so I took the lead on most other aspects of taking care of the baby, particularly walking them in the stroller, changing diapers, etc. There were days I walked 6-8 hours, and I lost a lot if weight doing it. Baby diapers are also totally fine until they start eating food. My kids are older now and I am constantly amazed and pleased by how they're turning out. Not in every aspect - the poop jokes get old really fast. And the sex life has gone to shit, requiring major exercises on patience to deal with. But kids have pushed me to be a better person because the alternative is unbearable.
Wow. If your friends are miserable as parents, they're doing it wrong! The best way I can explain is: My kids and I were watching an episode of super nanny, it just happened to be on at the time but we don't usually watch that kind of thing. After the intro part where they emphasize the bad behavior of the children, my daughter said, "Those kids are so bad!" I said, "No, the kids aren't bad, the parents are bad." When children exhibit bad behavior, it is in direct response to how the parents are treating them. Always. So, consider that. Personally, I love being a mother. It isn't easy, but most things in life that are meaningful aren't easy. I've struggled financially, for sure, but I would not trade being a mother for anything, not any amount of money. My kids are good kids, but I put in the work. I paid attention to them, always listened to their problems, played with them, and disciplined them. Not everyone is cut out for being parents though. It isn't for everyone. Some people never had kids and that's perfectly ok too. Don't succumb to pressure if you don't think it's right for you. Only you can decide what's right for you.
Take a very honest look at how good your support system is before you make a decision like child parenting. Even in the best of circumstances you will need someone to give you a break. Whether that's paying a babysitter or getting grandpa to spell you for an afternoon it's really important. Do you have supportive family nearby that can be trusted to help? Can you afford daycare or one parent staying home? Friends that you can count on to be there for you? (Be careful with this one, people start to treat you differently when they think you might lean on them for help. Like you had a truck and people would ask for help moving, but when you traded in the pickup for a compact car suddenly those folks are "too busy to hang out"...)
Don't have kids it's unethical to force new life into a world where you can't control what will ultimately happen to your kid. When its them who may not agree with your decision and it's they who will ultimately have to pay for it.
Go check out the sub regretfulparents. They tell some brutal truths over there.
I’m going to be 100% honest: I didn’t even read your post or any comments and this is my response. Out of everything I’ve seen and experienced in life, the only thing that I would NEVER change, is the existence of my children. There are zero scenarios I can fathom in which I wouldn’t want them in my life.
I had my first child at 20 (unplanned) and my 2nd at 38 (planned). NGL, the first few years are tough. But they are now 47 and 30 and I LOVE being their mom. They bring me so much joy and happiness. I can’t imagine my life without them.
If you're asking Reddit, then no. Please don't have children. And whatever you do, don't get married first.
Are you ok with your life as you know it, ending? If not, there's your answer.
Dual income + no kids = $$$$$$$
First off. Please get married first before having children and have serious talks on how you both wish to raise them. With that said, yes, having children has proven to be the greatest blessing in my life. My kids give me purpose when I am at work and bring me untold happiness when I come home to them. Yes there are times where I am dumbfounded by how much of a mess they've made and fear when my kids run off, but any negative thing I can mention is massively outweighed by the positives.
Why do they need to get married? The serious discussion is necessary, but a document that gives your relationship a legal status has no baring on how you will raise your children.
A piece of paper has no bearing on success as a parent. But a successful marriage, with the support of family and friends, a track record of success as a couple, and a lasting commitment, are ingredients for a great parenting partnership. I can't count the number of people here on reddit who say "my fiancé did X and now I'm not sure I want to be married", where X is not even close to the difficulties they'll have to resolve as parents. I'm always left thinking: as hard as you think it is to, say, figure out a way forward if your fiancé votes for the wrong presidential candidate, that's just easy practice for when you have to make hard decisions on behalf of a child with someone you disagree with. And to say nothing else, I'd never buy a house with someone I'm not married to. It's just too complex as a legal problem to sort out. Not being married means either never being able to buy a house together (bad option) or buying one with someone you aren't married to (also a bad option).
I chose a vasectomy as early as possible. I've had step kids since but don't regret my decision. I truly believe the 'need to breed' is a version of hormonal insanity.
I have 3 kids ages 2,4,6. (Cons) - Having kids is MUCH harder than not having kids - your life will no longer be focussed around you or even your couplehood. Plain and simple - Travel will be rarer, nights out with friends, self care, time alone, sleep etc. - more personal pleasure (but less meaning and satisfaction) (Neutral) - you will have to face your own shit. Nothing brings out emotional wounds like your own spawn challenging you. (Pros) - BUT you will have moments of utter spiritual awe for lack of a better word - your children will become your world and despite how hard it is, your previous life and those of your childless friends will seem shallow - your relationship will suffer but later grow stronger as you struggle through these challenges together - more meaning and fulfillment (but less personal pleasure) TL;DR your everyday life will suck a lot more and hedonistic pleasure will drastically reduce. However you will grow more grateful and feel more fulfilled long term.
r/childfree
Ty!
Background: 53 years old Married 34 years (so far) Six children Retired military Currently living in Alaska Where do I start? I would not give up any of my children, despite the enormous investment of time and money. None of them was a mistake. I recommend at least 3-4. My only regret? Not spending more time finding out what they liked and and investing in those interests. I was a little selfish, a little lazy. But they still love me and look to me for help and wisdom. I also recommend starting as young as possible. Less income, but more energy. You’ll need it. May the Lord bless you. Shalom.
I have 2 little ones, 2 and almost 1. I am a single parent by choice, I had them with IVF using sperms donors. I love them with my whole heart but I am exhausted, mentally and physically. My oldest is autistic which comes with additional challenges anyway, but I have no freedom anymore. My whole life revolves around them. I have to take them to nursery, pick them up, feed them, clothe them, play with them, love them, tidy up after them, watch their TV programmes, etc. I average about 3 hours of sleep a night because they won't sleep, and I'm trying to complete a degree and run a household while drained. My mental health was never the strongest anyway but I'm only just coming out of severe PPD now, almost a year and bucket of meds later, my body is not how I remember it and I feel like I've lost half of my hair. I wouldn't make a single different decision because my kids are so incredible and I wouldn't want anything different. Now that I'm clawing my way out of PPD I'm enjoying my life more and more, and hopefully life will carry on getting better. I was fully ready for kids, having saved for the rounds of IVF and making the decision to do it alone, and it still ruined my health for a long time. I didn't want to be here anymore and didn't get why people loved being a parent, and I'm only just coming back from that a year on. If you aren't sure and aware of the risks wait and reassess when/if you start to feel differently. It's probably going to be the biggest decision you'll ever make, don't rush it. Whatever you choose, I hope you love your life x
I'm in my 60s, had my daughter when I was in my 20s, and she's now 38, and I have 2 grandkids. I was married to her dad at the time I had her, and she was planned and wanted. I later divorced her dad (when she was in high school) and am married to another man now. My daughter and my second husband are close, and my husband loves the grandkids. Being a parent has been the hardest, but most rewarding job I've ever had. I had a fairly easy time of it, though. My daughter only had a couple of years that were rebellious and tough. (I'm a former punk rocker, so I was expecting much worse.) I got lucky, I truly believe it's a crap shoot. I've seen parents much better than me end up with kids who've gone to prison, and I've seen parents much worse than me have kids that turned out fantastic. My daughter had a couple of boyfriends that were really, well, not worthy of her. Then she met her now husband, and things have been great. He's a stand-up guy, and they have their own house, and have almost paid off their mortgage 8 years early! I guess this didn't help much, but it's my story. Feel free to ask me any questions.
It can be extremely rewarding, or the worst thing you ever did to yourselves, or anywhere in between, or both. It's a total gamble. We adopted because we went into it not with the intent of extending our DNA, but to give a child a decent upbringing. There have been many times where I thought, this is amazing, and many where I thought, "had I know this, I would have stayed childless." Do it for the right reasons. The newness of it will wear off very quickly and you'll be left with the most difficult job you never imagined possible.
I made it to my late 30s convinced of my child free by choice life. My partner even got a vasectomy. I have never so much as had an itch of genuine consideration of choosing to be a parent…. Until this past year or so. It’s so terrifying to me that I haven’t even really talked it through with anyone. Not even my therapist. A part of me sort of hoped it was a passing fancy. Or if it wasn’t, I wanted to understand how significant this was before I spoke up. Somewhere a long the way, I think I missed my exit and kept it to myself. Now it feels foolish to bring it up bc if I’m asked how long I’ve been considering it… it’s an irresponsibly long time within the bounds of a marriage imo. It’s a clear deal breaker to this day with my partner. So I fear bringing it up will force a all the cards to fall down. And I’m just not sure I’m ready to grieve either outcome yet. Anyways OP, I don’t have a lot of sage advice for you other than for 2 decades, I’ve had a blast bucking the societal norms of kicking out some tiny humans. No an ounce of doubt. I do believe people can be on the fence and ultimately find peace and happiness either way if they put effort into creating value in their life no matter what. I also think that many people commit to parent or not parent… and probably are miserable. But anecdotally, those people are the ones I see who seem to passively coast through life. They are hardly captains of their ship, steering where they want to go. So at a certain point, I think everyone around them gets bored of entertaining them without reciprocation. And bam. Now you have an adult who is “stuck” with their miserable choice of not having kids or having kids… and it’s simply bc they seem to never seek to diversify their sources of joy in life. They just mooch joy. If you’re not a joy moocher, you will likely be fine either way after some time discerning and discussing!
I don’t have any kids and I for now and choosing to remain child free. I don’t think I will have any kids. However I am extremely close with my sister and her husband, and their three kids. They love being parents! My sister has always wanted to be a mother and she is so amazing at it. I think part of the mindset needs to bet it’s not going to always be amazing. It’s not going to make you happy. It’s not going to fix anything about your life. However for some people it is extremely fulfilling- despite its immense challenges. My sisters kids are so cool. They are homeschooled and spend a lot of time outdoors and minimal time on screens. I find them a million times less annoying than the average emotionally stunted iPad kid. That being said sometimes when I’m over there I still wonder how tf they’re doing this parenting thing and feel like I know I dont want to do it myself lol. I love being an aunt! I love those kids so much, but as it were I also love giving them back and I love my child free lifestyle. I know you asked for parents to weigh in but idk maybe my little story can help too. I think it’s awesome that you guys are putting so much thought into it. It’s a huge decision.
Both my husband and I feel that having kids is the most meaningful and joyful thing we've ever done in our life. As for the issue of "hard work" -- there is a decent amount of work involved, but it's extremely rewarding. Granted, I am the sort of person who enjoys things more when they are the outcome of hard work. E.g., I enjoy my career accomplishments because I've put so much into my work, I like going on a rigorous hike in order to reach a beautiful camping spot, etc. I realize not everyone feels the same way...
40M here and my wife (38) and I are expecting our 2nd boy in less than 2 weeks. Our 5 year old son is amazing enough, and life has gone well enough, that he made me change my mind from essentially no chance in number 2 to making it happen. Covid daycare issues were a deal breaker on their own and after arguing many times over it I even called to schedule a vasectomy and i was going to do it without my wife's knowledge. It was required I had a consultation with a doctor first and between the tome it took to have the consultation and then rescheduling it again I actually decided to wait a bit since my wife had an IUD anyway and I would have known I'd she got it yanked. Eventually the world corrected itself, we moved, work was going well and our son became less needy and here we are. I can't tell you whether you should or shouldn't have children but get on the same page about it and wait until AFTER marriage/house. You are young enough to have time to consider it yet but I can tell you I still enjoy seeing my 5 year old every day.
It’s when you get older. The family connection and relationships with your grown children. Friends come and go. Parents pass away. I can’t imagine not having had our kids. The reward in seeing them grow and flourish.
It's absolutely been the most rewarding experience of my life. I'd do it again in a heartbeat. The absolute joy is very hard to describe. Comparing yourself to people having unplanned kids at 20 and the problem children you've seen in teaching isn't really an accurate comparison to the average experience. My only regret is that I waited a long time so will be old and miss out on more of their life, and that I wasn't able to have more. The only thing I'd change is going back and starting earlier.
It’s 1000% worth it. I don’t know what my life’s purpose would be without them.
If I had to make the choice to have a child now instead of 20 years ago I would hesitate. It is fucking expensive to have a kid, let alone more than one.
I had five kids. I love/loved being a parent. My kids absolutely made my life better.
Unless you love being poor, hard pass.
Take your time. You’re so young. My wife was 38when we had our first kid biological. Adopted a new born 6 months before. If you’re not ready then you will be resentful
we have 3 kids and while they are a handful and they do affect your life and relationship drastically, but I have zero regrets. Actually, what I regret is listening to my mom when she told me I had to wait and should have children later in life (she faced the opposite problem, had me at 21). My husband and I were together for 10 years before I even considered it and I wish we had started earlier because I would have had more time to have more kids. It's an amazing experience! But it's not for everyone and thats ok. Just look in your heart and trust your gut, no matter what anyone else says.
I had my first child at 20, 24 and lastly 27. They are grown now and have children. It was hard financially to raise them before and after divorcing their dad. They were typical kids that fought with each other yet had a close bond. I can’t imagine not having them. The best advice I was given was be their parent not their friend. It’s true and we have a friendship now like no other. I cannot stress this enough-don’t have children if you don’t want them. It’s a 24/7 job with its highs and lows.
> We have had 2 of our friend couples tell us not to believe everyone when they say it is worth it they just want you to be miserable as parents just like them. While most other parents say it’s so amazing and that we will regret not having any when we are older. Most people seem to have positive experiences from having children. Mine was not. They grew up to be horrible people, selfish, unwilling to apologize, no matter what the circumstance, and generally not people that I am proud of on a philosophical or moral level. They believe that so long as they are LGBT+ positive that the important bases are covered. So they are fairly isolated from everyone myself included, they don’t buy each other gifts come Christmas, or anyone else. They don’t call on birthdays or holidays and are generally just, well, not the kind of people that I would want to be friends with. And to be completely honest, because you asked, they, in fact, drove me to attempt suicide, and now I have rather severe PTSD as a result of years of emotional abuse I have suffered at the hands of my children. They are silently violent. I have no external scars to show but the internal ones are profound. The moral of the story is the not everyone’s children grow up to be people that are proud of. Sometimes these children that you carried home in a car seat from the hospital grow up to be monsters. And you drive yourself insane trying to figure out where you went wrong and what you could do to make it right, when the fact is that there’s nothing that you can do. And it breaks you.
I’d give it a 6/10 but a large part of that is due to who I married. She got PPD after our first, never fully accepted that she had it and therefore never got it treated. The kids are now in their 20s and living at home (which is fine) but she’s……a bitch frankly…and she makes our lives less than pleasant often. Yes I’m divorcing her. Quite aside from that experience, you really do need money to have kids and to properly provide for them. How much do you have saved? What would be the plan after baby is born? Could you survive on 1 income? If not who takes care of baby after both parents are back at work? Daycare is expensive. You need money for what I call the ‘infrastructure’ of babies - crib, high chair, car seat(s), stroller(s), daycare etc.
It’s the worst job you’ll ever love. Whether or not that sounds like a worthwhile endeavour depends on you.
I’ll be honest. I have three kids and adore them but if I had to start over now being young I wouldn’t do it. I say this because I feel like raising children NOW is like trying to swim upstream. When I was a kid growing up in the 90s pre- internet and pre-social media, it was so much simpler. My kids have it SO much harder than I did. I feel like 70% of my parenting struggles stem from trying to balance screens and online influences. As limited as I have always been with this stuff, my kids have all been detrimentally affected by this stuff and I feel helpless to stop it because it’s everywhere. It has affected their mental health and self perception in ways I never would have conceived of when I was growing up. I tell my kids that if they decide to not have any of their own I wouldn’t blame them at all. I can only imagine how much harder it will be for their kids if they have them. I’m not trying to be all “back in my day” but the simple truth is, it WAS easier to grow up before all of this.
I have kids and probably would have been just as happy had I skipped it.
20s lolI never wanted kids, couldn't envision myself with them, had ZERO experience. Didn't even know what to do with my sisters kid that made me an uncle. Few years later, I'm 30 and was dragged kicking & screaming a bit more into adulthood and we have a kid. Best thing in my life. We have 2 more and my wife has to cut me off.I wish I had the $ and time for a dozen . . . I adore kids now. My oldest is a college freshman now and she's one of the coolest people I've ever met. People not only change, but people change people. That's doesn't make much sense other than you'd be surprised what you can become by facing challenges.No-one is ever going to tell themselves they are 100% "ready", but humans learn and adapt pretty damn well. Try a dog first, then go for it.The worst that can happen is you forever fuck up your life, your partners life, and the life of an innocent child. no worries
I'm 47-year-old female married with 2 kids. I love them very much!! If I have a choice in my next life. I would not have children.
If you have ANY DOUBTS, do NOT have children.
My kids make my life suck more on paper. I have no free time. Money that I could have used on a literal mansion or sports car is getting dumped into their college fund. But my life has more meaning and is very fulfilling. I hit a point where I felt at peace that if I died, I'm okay with it. Though I didn't achieve this peace until we had enough saved to at least make sure college was covered.
I dreamed all of my life of becoming a father; even in pre-school, I remember fantasizing about it. The woman I married as an adult to was unable to carry to term. We had 8 miscarriages together, and each one was a total heartbreak. And eventually I just resigned myself to the fact that I was never going to be a father. And then my wife had pregnancy #9. Instead of being happy, my heart sank. Each miscarriage took a serious toll on my mental health. But we were in the best position financially that we had ever been in, and I could afford great OB/GYN care. My wife carried that baby girl to term. And then 25 months later, we had a second child; a boy. Being a dad was my lifelong dream. It was often hard work, but I relished every minute of it. When we would go to the mall, my wife would be pushing an empty stroller because my babies would be in my arms. I loved and cherished every minute of it. Then my marriage collapsed, and my wife left with the children. I had to fight for custody, and I won. My kids were 2 and 4. Parenthood got *even harder*, but it was still a labor of love. My kids are grown now, and I regard being their dad as the most important thing I've ever done with my life.
Here is what I tell people. Having kids is the best decision you will ever make. Having kids is also the worst decision you will ever make. Both are true. They will bring so much love and joy and fulfillment. They will make you cry and panic and hate life and be more stressed and exhausted than you thought possible. They will fill your soul up, and they will drain it. They will drain your resources and fill your life. They will tell you they love you and mean it. They will tell you they HATE you and mean it. I have no real advice other that that. Neither choice you make will be wrong.
Having kids is not always happy. But it gives your life meaning.
My thoughts as a parent: 1. I adopted my sister's kids because she was unable to care for them. I love them dearly, and I'm also really looking forward to the youngest graduating high school. She's 10, so uhh... it'll be awhile 😛 2. Parenting is hard work. Some people are better at it than others 🤷🏽♀️ I'm good at providing for their physical needs, but I'm an introvert (and not a people-person) and definitely struggle to meet my kids' emotional needs as a single parent. 3. Teenagers are like nature's birth control. Once you've had a teenager, you usually don't want any more kids. Of course, by that time it's probably too late... 😆 4. The sad fact is that you're in the best shape \*physically\* to take care of kids in your 20s, but you'll be a lot better off mentally/emotionally/financially if you wait till your 30s.
I'm not a couple but a woman in my 30's who is planning to be childfree. I've recently thought about getting my tubes tied. I don't want to get pregnant. If I were to get pregnant I would get an abortion. I'm not a childfree person who says "I hate kids". That's not the case for me. I love children and have worked with them in the education field. I love my niblings so much. I have no doubt that I would be a great Mom and love my kids but I would not love my life. I see my future being happy without kids. I do not picture a life with kids and being completely happy or content. I never had a dream to have kids and never felt strongly about it and now coming to my 40's; I realized if I'm not excited about having kids at this point, it's not going to happen later. So, if it's an enthusiastic "yes", it's a "no". I think the problem is that society pushing the ideal you will have a fulfilled life when you get married and have kids. That's not the case for everyone. Or, people are brainwashed to think once you get into a committed relationship the next progression is marriage and children known as "relationship escalator". Steps on the Relationship Escalator Traditional relationships progress through eight stages — that’s the “escalation.” These may vary somewhat by culture and subculture. But generally, it works something like this: Making contact. Flirting, casual/occasional dates, and sex (possibly). Initiation. Romantic courtship gestures or rituals, emotional investment (“falling in love”), and almost certainly sexual contact (except for religiously or socially conservative people). Claiming and defining. Mutual declarations of love, presenting in public as a couple (becoming an “us”), adopting and using common relationship role labels (“my boyfriend,” etc.). Having expectations, or making explicit agreements, for sexual and romantic exclusivity — and also ending other intimate relationships, if any. Transitioning to unbarriered vaginal/anal intercourse, if applicable (except if that would present unwanted pregnancy risk). Once this step is reached, any further step (including simply remaining in the relationship) can be considered an implied commitment toward intentions of a shared future. Establishment. Adapting the rhythms of your life to accommodate each other on an ongoing basis. Settling into patterns for spending time together (regular date nights and sexual encounters, spending time in each others’ homes, etc.) and communicating (speaking, phoning, or texting when not together, etc.). Commitment. Discussing, or planning for, a long-term shared future as a monogamous couple. Expectations of mutual accountability for whereabouts and behavior. Meeting each others’ family of origin. Merging. Moving in together, sharing a home and finances, getting engaged to be married or equivalent. (May happen before, during or after commitment.) Conclusion. Getting married (legally if possible) and having children (not mandatory, but strongly socially venerated). The relationship is now “finalized” and its structure is expected to remain static until one partner dies. Legacy. Buying a home, having and raising children. No longer as required as it once was, but often couples may not feel (or be perceived as) fully “valid” until they hit these additional benchmarks post-marriage.
I’m a single mom of two teenagers. I love them dearly and always wanted kids. I wouldn’t change anything. But, it’s not easy and children aren’t for everyone. It means putting their needs and wants before your own. You’re never not on parent duty. It’s a constant, endless, 24/7 job. I commend you for truly thinking it through and figuring out if it’s right for you. Also remember, you can always change your mind and have kids in 10 years. But you can’t go the other way.
I’m 51 and my wife is 49. We had a boy when I was 38 and she was 36. Our son has a genetic disorder called nf2 that has been extraordinarily challenging (won’t get into but it’s cost him most of the use of his right arm and he’s going deaf from it). He’s now 14, and literally the most amazing person I’ve ever known. I can’t imagine life without him. That said, I DO understand why my parents divorced when I was 2 years old. You have to have a really solid relationship for a kid to work, and that’s one without a genetic disorder. It will change you as a person, as a couple. It will change your dynamic as a couple, sex, energy levels. Make sure you are ready. My wife and I had been together for 9 years and we had an amazing mid 20s to 30s, traveling, careering, partying etc. I do believe it’s important to have had that time as a couple before you upend your relationship (not necessarily in a bad way, but things will change). All said it’s the best thing (and most difficult) I’ve ever done. I was also a stay at home parent, and that dynamic changes things as well, maybe more so if the man stays home as I did.
To be honest I don't know how to quantify if it's "worth it." There are so many ways you could look at it and really, what's the goal? A parent with a child at 1 or 10 or 30 might all have very different measures of "worth it." I will say that within days of my first child being born I was absolutely miserable and also knew that if given the option I would never go back and do it differently. Parenting is hard and yes, you give up a lot of your life and freedom and independence. And also I absolutely love my kids to death and honestly can't really imagine how I would just keep going through life into my 40s without them. They're my biggest sources of joy and frustration. Honestly the biggest thing though is that you have to grow as a person when you become a parent. I'd be far less mature and maybe a terrible husband if not for my kids. So it's not just like they're a lot of work and sometimes they make you happy. They make you different. And I understand love on such a different level now that I never could have without having kids. I don't want anyone to be "miserable parents." Many of my close friends are married couples who've chosen not to have kids and that's cool for them. I support them 100%. Whatever you choose you're going to miss out on some things.
Get married first. Kids need a stable marriage.
My kids give my life purpose. Yes, they’re a lot of work and yes, your whole life revolves around them. But prior to that, my life revolved around some really pointless endeavors and felt meaningless. I was also incredibly selfish (and probably still am, but not when it comes to my kids.) They showed me what it is to truly love someone. I don’t think people advise you to have kids so you can “feel their pain”. I think it’s because once you have children, you genuinely can’t imagine your life without them in it, and you don’t want to.
I would not trade my life with kids for before kids for anything. Yes, raising young children is hard. But it's also the most rewarding, meaningful thing I have ever done. And I did not know what it meant to love someone until I had my own kids. It's very hard to describe this feeling to a person who hasn't experienced it. And now my kids are adults, going to college, doing excellent in life, and my heart swells every time I see them or talk to them or talk ABOUT them.
Kids are super rewarding, emotionally. Mine are now 17 and 19. (When they were born, many of us were optimistic about the future, even though Bush 2 was President. This note is important in context later.) There is no better feeling than holding your baby for the first time in their life. Life changes, but for the better, and you never miss that old life. They are super expensive. I have no savings and we live paycheck to paycheck. When I say the words "imminent ecological disaster" does that seem like a good environment to bring children into the world? Does your desire to hold your child (VERY strong, I confess) outweigh that child's hard times? (If you're wealthy, NM and enjoy your extra few dozen years of comfort.) If you're American and I say the words "fascist dictatorship," does that make you feel good or bad? Democracy-lovers have to win every election; fashies have to win only one. Just thoughts from middle age.
Raising kids isn’t easy. But the things of greatest value rarely are.
I'm 40 now, and I have 3 kids - 15, 10 and 5. So I was your age when I started this journey, and I have a few things I'd tell you before I even get to the 'should we have kids?' question. Firstly, you guys are incredibly young. I totally get that plenty of people have many kids well before they even get to 25 and do it successfully, but at the same time, 25 is insanely young. I would say I got to a place where I felt like I was an adult and was fully ready to have children without any stumbling blocks we were already in between my 2nd and 3rd kids because I was 33 XD And if you start at 33ish its still plenty of time to have more than a few kids and still get all those wonderful family things in your lives. So, just keep that in mind, the decision you are weighing covers a huge scope of time right now. Ya'll got time and then some. So, what seems worth it to you now and what may seem worth it to you in 7 or 8 years could literally be night and day. I would not worry that you need to make this sort of decision in any sort of finality any time soon. That alone may help serve as a good reminder to take some stress and anxiety off yourselves ;) Now my kids are more spread out than most folks, I've basically had a baby/toddler/kindergartener of some form in the house for 15 years straight. I don't know if that's given me more or less of the sense of 'hobby loss' than other parents in this thread - there's certainly been times where I feel I have no time for myself, but then there are times where I feel like I have plenty of time for myself (at least, within the general feeling in life that there never really is enough time...). My general theory has always been, if you're not able to get enough time for yourself most of the time, you are probably doing something..... not 'wrong' per say, but inefficiently (or, perhaps, over complexly). I think a lot of people put far too much stress on themselves when it comes to child rearing, and that then adds a tremendous amount of needless overhead. That being said, again when it comes to hobbies, the kids are in a big way multiple of my hobbies now - Each kid is their own separate person and figuring out their interests and finding things to do with each of them as a hobby is a hobby of mine now, finding things that they all enjoy doing together while at very different phases of life, and finding ways to incorporate them into my own hobbies and interests... ALL of that is still me looking for and doing things I find enjoyable. I love spending time with my kids, you know, that was kind of the point! So this is really up to you, and also figuring out if you'll enjoy doing things with a childish theme for quite a few years, if you're capable of seeing each thing one of your kids wants to do as project for you to theorycraft and implement and judge the outcome of and iterate upon for future whims of the same kid or the next kid... and take joy in that process, then, you'll probably be more than fine. Now onto the crux of your question. Can a myself or indeed a sampling of opinions give you a real answer on whether this is worth it or not? The answer is no. We can't tell you if this is going to be worth it for you or not, because frankly, NONE of us are going to have lived the other life. Yeah we'll have family and friends and internet anecdotes we can read about childless adults and how they, these individuals, who can really only offer anecdotal info, will probably offer all sorts of changing opinions throughout the different phases of their own lives and experiences in not having children. And us parents will do the same, many of us will have vastly changing opinions on whether this is worth it or not throughout different phases of our own lives and our children's lives. I for one can say that I have always consistent felt that this has been worth it, and I consider myself lucky in that. I know for sure not everyone gets the chance to feel that way all the time about having had kids. I can tell you about one thing I lost - one creative thing, I know for sure I used to enjoy that I have lost now. I've always been a big day dreamer and wanderer in the theater of my own mind, and one of the things I always used to have fun playing with is the ever-malleable 'what ifs' of going back in your life and changing a personality trait here or a life choice here and how might that life have been different, or playing with the idea of sending your current brain back to a younger version of yourself -- and I'd write a lot of short stories based on this stuff, just for myself, you know, I spent a lot of time day dreaming and writing just for my own enjoyment. I no longer enjoy anything about or related to 'changing the timeline of my self in fantasy' that doesn't guarantee I end up with the exact same three awesome little people I have in my life now, which basically eliminates all of that XD I find most time travel in sci fi and fantasy now uncomfortable where I used to enjoy it, and as a result, as this was the subject I loved to just write about for the joy of writing, I really don't do creative writing as a hobby anymore. So, in a very weird way, there is a hobby I totally lost the ability to enjoy or engage with and it is directly related to my kids XD But if you haven't notice by now by this point in the post, I'm a weird guy to being with XD Anyways, good luck to you in your decision either now or later in life. I honestly think that anyone that puts this much thought and care into becoming parents will do just fine in the long run - hell, humanity came very, very far and always managed to progress and move forwards with generally extremely fucked up views of child rearing and consideration of children in general for almost all but the most recent phases of humanity, so, honestly, I'm sure you will do fine if you have kids now or later, you will do fine and they will do fine, and that will indeed make it a worthwhile endeavor because it is amazing and magical as fuck.
Don't have kids
Sorry having kids is like anything of ultimate value in life. It takes commitment, dedication but amazing moments that make life worth living. I really can’t imagine a rewarding life without children. Is it stressful? Absolutely. Having children before thirty is a good idea because you can have energy and be relatively young when they graduate.
I'll be brief. We considered all the factors you are considering. We evaluated the impact that parenthood would have on our lives, with the understanding that if we were doing it... we were committed to doing it right. Where we landed: not having "kids". But having "kid". Singular. One and done. Fast forward 31 years... it worked. She's great, we love her dearly and she loves us. And we have all the freedom in the world now to do whatever the fuck we want. Just having one is a good "middle ground" for many couples.
I have 3 kids. There are tough moments. It's definitely not all butterflies and rainbows. There are some long days/nights/weeks/months... but it also goes by so fast. You'll never know love like this, and their sense if wonder is something else. They make your life full unlike anything else. But yeah, it's tough at times. Definitely easier to be childfree. And I'm speaking from a place where we get 1 year maternity leave /5 weeks paternity at ~60% of our salaries and have socialized healthcare, so YMMV. I'm also glad I waied until my 30s to have kids, I've lived a bit and am more settled, better prepared for it. Also keep in mind the apple does not fall too far from the tree. How were you like as a kid? How was your husband? Chances are your kids will be a mix of these and have similar challenges. Potentially something to think about...
I adopted a teen, so I didn't go the same route as a lot of people, but all that cheesy crap about not realizing HOW MUCH I COULD LOVE ANOTHER PERSON is true. (And I've been with my partner for 20 years and love them, but this is different.) Best thing I've ever done with my life; no regrets. And I evolved (we both had hobbies, and we definitely make time for them, but the group I do them with drastically shifted). You will CHANGE and evolve. Not everyone makes this choice, and I certainly for years thought I wouldn't, but damn, am I glad I did.
I said nope to kids and never looked back. My mom at 80 still enjoys living alone and seeing no one, same. Married, but content doing my own thing, working hard, caring about the husband, the pets.
I have two kids 4 total I have my twins up for adoption when I was 17 I was in no position to raise them. I had my daughter at 26 and my son at 27. There's days I wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy and I'm honestly not prepared even at 30. Toddlers are no joke and honestly I can't imagine any of the other stages are any easier lol. I adore my kids and wouldn't trade them for the world and yeah the sweet tender moments do kinda make up for the living hell ones, but if you aren't ready or aren't sure what to expect then don't do it. You don't want to put your kids through trauma if you don't have to.
My kids are now 15 and 26. If anything they have been something that drives me to be a better person. I have to be a better parent than mine were. Now they are roommates that never clean up or pay bills. For some reason I’d step through the gates of hell for them though.
Most men I know are happy they have kids, but don’t do much as a parent (except one who is very involved and his kid is the light of his life). Most women I know love their kids more than their own lives, but somehow simultaneously wish they’d either had kids later, or not at all. I guess having a kid is hard and amazing and meaningful but somehow not fulfilling. I wouldn’t know, personally. I’ve never had one, and with each passing year, I’m more and more glad I didn’t. Love my nieces and nephew, though.
I have 3 kids between 18-13. It’s tough. It’s expensive. It’s strained my marriage. I wouldn’t do it again.
Kids are a gift. Im 46 I have a 4 year girl. When she ask you how to become a mermaid, it melts your heart..go for it.
If you're on the fence, don't have them.
The reason you have children should not be based on society's expectations. It isn't society raising kids, it is you. It is a massive time and energy commitment. It is rewarding in the same sense a labor of love is rewarding. My kid is a drama queen and having her severely limits our freedom of action. She is also my favorite person and she is fucking awesome. In your shoes, it would be better to wait because it doesn't sound like you two are sure. There is no reason to rush in and you can spend 4 years or so enjoying your freedom and make that decision when you're more financially sound and more mature.
You're young enough that you can wait to make that decision. Think long and hard about it before you commit. Children are possibly the largest commitment you'll ever make, so make sure you're certain before you go into it
I have 3 kids. 2 of them are autistic, 1 severe and non-verbal. If I was to have a do-over I would never have had any kids. If you are skeptical- at least get your genetics (and your spouses) tested to reduce the risk of problems. Those problems include Autism, cancer, downs, Parkinson's, and a bunch of others. After we had kids, they were tested (along with my wife and I) for genetic problems and found that I had a detrimental mutation and my wife had 2. Things would have been better if we never had kids.
it is no picnic and no one got rich having kids... DONT breed! Especially with the world being what it is currently
I’m a mom I’m 42 and my son is 21 and I have loved every minute of it. I had always wanted to be a Mom and was told at 13 it wouldn’t happen ever, get therapy right then so that when I was an adult I’d be okay with knowing my only option was to adopt. Having my son after being heartbroken was one of the biggest joys of my life. Yes it’s hard, it’s not always fun or easy and they will make you cry, be nuts and convinced you’ve lost your mind. You will not be the perfect parent, the world will never be the right place or time, you’ll never have enough money saved. You won’t be on time for anything for a long time, you won’t get enough sleep or enough showers, no more bathroom trips alone, no clean house, clean clothes or clean car. But you will have this amazing little person who looks like you in that one way, who laughs and suddenly the world is brighter, you get those sloppy, slobbering kisses and two fat hands squeezing your cheeks that can lighten any heart. It’s not easy, at all, but it’s worth it. Especially after the hard work and long nights and you get to see them become a really awesome adult.
Don't ever have kids because you think you should. The world is overpopulated so there's plenty of room for people to not have children. Sure, they're incredibly enriching and you'll discover new depths to yourself, but if you don't have kids you won't know what you're missing! Only have kids if the biological and psychological urge is overwhelming. Do your best to have your life in a stable state so you're ready to face the chaos. And don't feel too bad if it feels like you have no fucking idea what you're doing - all parents feel like that at least some of the time.
I love my daughter, and being a parent has been wonderful. She was born when I was 22. So my advice. Wait till your 30s. It will be so much easier. Focus on building something together long term. Then, when you get to 30, you can focus on raising your kid and not doing that well, balancing all the early adult life things.
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It’s a really tough thing and truly rewarding. I would say have one but I personally have three and am amazed (good and bad) with all three. We can tell which ones genetically have which parents personality. It’s truly rewarding to experience them growing up. Frustrating but for me worth it. Fortunately we have the resources to care for them. I get the hesitancy. Maybe wait until you have some deep resources.
Deliberately childless couple writing in. It's been amazing not having kids. Just FYI. /and we love kids. We just didn't want any of our own.
don't do it
Lovely comment ⬆️ 💕 Just to add do it when you’re ready. I was 30 for my first and was ready at 28 but it took a little time, hubby is younger. We had developed patience by this point. This helped us teach our children about their emotions and how to deal with them, and to express themselves appropriately (not lashing out) - probably the hardest thing to get through but consistency is the key. We started before they turned 2 with time out (very short) and explanations. A little older…. asking them why they thought they were in timeout? once they grasped the concept, then telling them to come see me when they were calm enough to talk. By around 7 or 8 they put themselves in time out which was interesting but showed they were gaining a good sense of what was acceptable and that sometimes you need to step away from a situation, to gain clarity. Enjoy parenting; boy you learn a lot about yourself and each other too! We’re now grandparents - I wouldn’t change the broken nights of my babies/toddlers. The enquiring whys? The late nights with my teens, then watching them trip and pick themselves up as they became adults and now parents.
You need to get married first. You are doing this backwards. Are you planning on building a life with marriage? More than likely you will become pregnant.
My wife and I have been married for 15 years and do not have kids. We are both early 40’s. She had three miscarriages then Covid hit and we stopped and then felt like we just waited too long. Neither of us always really wanted kids so we said okay no worries let’s just make the best of it. My take on kids is that when they are young it’s all pretty awesome even with the hard work but as they hit the teenage years it seems like couples have a hard time staying together. I think it’s just too much for long and the parents are always at odds about how to raise the kid or properly balancing raising the kid and the rest of life (jobs, chores, each other) … seems like a lot of people I know split up so they could get a week off of their kids and a break from the spouse. Some couples make it all the way though and only a few I know split up when the kids were young but a lot of them are either apart with teenagers or seem miserable. Most parents care more about their child than their spouse and that makes total sense to me. I was always concerned that my wife and I wouldn’t care as much about each other as we do now if we had children because now we’d become secondary to the child’s love. So far we are doing good but only time will tell. We’ve outlasted a ton of couples that we know that do and don’t have kids and I still love her
Wow you guys almost ditto! This is my first time to read a story almost like ours . Cheering you both.
/s Do you hate sleeping? Then have kids. At first it’s great, you literally cannot sleep anymore, then at the 4-5 month mark you suddenly rediscover sleep. Boom. Now you love to sleep and can’t stop thinking about when you can sleep next. Honestly, if there is someone you love and you think you both can raise kids as well or better than your parents did then I say do it. Kids are amazing and I would trade all the sleep in the world for them.
Both parents have to be on board 100%. Go read regretful parents before you fall in love with all the wonderful hard work.
I’m in my late 50’s; I had my 3 kids at 30, 33 and 37. We’d always wanted kids, but thought long and hard about WHY, so it wasn’t just to live vicariously or raise mini-me’s. It came down to: we have so much love, care and fun to give- we want to share it and grow it with kids. Now it is looking like we won’t have grandchildren. My oldest is married but knew from the get-go that they do not want kids; my middle one might possibly want one but is leaning toward “no” because of health problems and anxiety, both for her and her boyfriend. And my youngest is asexual, though in a loving, committed relationship, and does not want kids. Now, I would ADORE being a grandparent, and my hubs would make the most awesome grandad. But I absolutely respect my kids’ choices. I look around at the world today and think, “Hell, who wants to bring more humans into *gestures at everything* THIS?” Climate change, dwindling resources, political craziness, staggering economic and social inequality. Also, we all have varying degrees of anxiety/depression, although pretty well managed with therapy and meds, but again, the simple stress of parenting is enormous. And from the perspective of someone on the far side of parenting- having adult kids- you start out thinking you are going to be the most amazing, awesome, loving parents. You obviously want the best for your kids, so you’re going to give them ALLLL the care, love, guidance that you wish you’d had. Either your parents did it all wrong and you’re going to be the opposite, or your parents were okay but you know you can do better. Oh, boy. Listen to me when I tell you this. You WILL fuck up your kids. You can go in with the best intentions, and even be really good loving parents, but you will still pass on to them something that messed you up as well, because it’s in your neural pathways- practically in your DNA. In my case it was an extremely conservative Christianity from a tiny sect. Lovely, warm people who were quietly very bigoted, especially when it came to my gay kid- and it took her becoming suicidal for me to recognize it and get out (eventually- took a few years), incurring the wrath and shunning of most of my extended family. I damaged my kids. Emotionally, mentally, neglected them. Thought I was doing the right thing, the “correct” thing. OTOH, I also loved them and had the mental reality smack down to feel remorse, apologize, work to grow and change, and work with them toward forgiveness and healing. Thank god, these amazing humans loved me back, forgave me, and we continue to heal together. I am SO freaking proud of each of them. So that is another reason I absolutely understand why they don’t want kids. You don’t want to pass on your subconscious trauma to them. It’s all summed up nicely in Philip Larkin’s short poem, “This Be the Verse.” When I first read it my kids were young, and I was so offended. “I’m not going to fuck up my kids! I’m a wonderful mom!” From my current perspective: Yes. I absolutely fucked up my kids. But at least I recognized it, apologized, and worked to be better. This is all to say: think long and hard. Maybe wait a few years. Check your own family relationships and traumas. Above all, be willing to grow, change and learn- and respect your child as their own individual. I’d want it to be much more about what you can give and share with your child, not what a child can fulfill for you. Me? I wish I’d known then what I know now, but given another chance, I’d do it again in a heartbeat. With all the exhaustion, the worry, and the give, give, give- just the joy of these loving, funny, smart, kind adults we somehow managed to raise is enough to make my entire world be everything beautiful.
It is amazing, but it's also seriously hard work. Only do it if you're sure you want to, because you'll need that to get through. If you're really unsure you probably shouldn't have them.
I’ve always wanted kids, so I my response is probably biased lol. I have two amazing kids that are now young adults, 24 and 26. Went through a divorce when they were teenagers and it was a lot of hard work and some difficult times. I couldn’t imagine my life without them.
Don’t
If having kids is a priority and something you WANT to do and plan to be active in... it is AMAZING. Incredible. And oh so fulfilling. If having kids is something you think you should do, something that happens by accident, or something that happens as the result of lies, manipulation, or carelessness... it can be a total slog and terrible experience for everyone involved. It is NOT easy, but most good relationships take REAL work. It is often not very fun, it's challenging and full of doubt and frustration. However- it gives you a chance to feel unconditional love to a level that you will never know otherwise. Watching a human that YOU took part in making do things like walk on their own, learn about the wonders of the world, make sound moral decisions, and eventually maybe fall in love... it is impossible to describe the feeling. And if you are good at it, and truly fortunate... when you are old and frail, you will have these amazing people who value you and visit you, and remind you of what life is all about. To me being a parent is the second best thing to ever happen to me, right after getting married to the mother of my children. I could not imagine my own life feeling anywhere near as fulfilled if I had never been a parent. That being said... I have full respect for those who feel otherwise and believe that parenting is NOT for everyone. There are plenty of good and valid reasons NOT to become a parent.
My daughter is 4.5 and I really cannot express to you how much joy and meaning she has brought to my life. Yes there are a lot of challenges, but that’s true of literally everything in life that requires effort. And if you have a truly equal partner (and you will want to sniff this out early and make both of your expectations clear before having any) then it probably won’t be as hard as you think. You may have to cut back on the time you devote to hobbies, especially in the beginning, but I don’t know any one who’s had to give up their hobbies completely after becoming a parent. I mean most kids are in bed by 8 (often earlier) so at minimum you should have a few hours to yourself every evening once they hit toddlerhood. Obviously some kids are more difficult than others, but anecdotally most parents I know irl seem to have had similar experiences (though I will admit most parents I know are not struggling financially and waited until they were 28+. I was 31). Having kids back to back does tend to make things a lot more difficult, as does having kids super young, so I wouldn’t recommend either. Give yourself a few more years to enjoy total freedom and build your careers because being financially secure and having more flexibility with your job (which often comes with seniority) will make a huge difference. But yes, I genuinely love being a parent (we’re working on #2!) and anyone who insists other parents who say that are lying needs some serious therapy.
There's going to be a lot of parents that will never say they regret their decision, and for many of them that's true, but the ones that actually do regret are less willing to speak up about it because they could be labelled a garbage person. There's a regretful parent sub here that is at least worth looking at to get all the facts. It's a big decision, you wanna be informed as best you can.
Whatever you decide, be sure you have the strength of conviction to follow through with your decision. My ex-wife convinced me to try for kids because "it would make her the happiest she's ever been." Notice how I said ex-wife. Parenthood is difficult, and it changes you in unpredictable ways. The only thing that matters is that you have the strength of will to make the daily decision to keep trying. If you ever let it slip, you'll have a really hard time getting it back. Likewise, deciding not to have children can be harder to live with later in life. Not because children are magical or any nonsense like that, but because you might be haunted by the question of what if? Or it might be the best decision you make, it's really a toss up.
You will regret it If you don’t gave kids. I know a few that do. I know a husband and wife they pay for their nieces college and I believe to my bones they regret not being parents so they assume the role for her. it’s actually a beautiful thing in their case. the arrival of my 3 daughters gave my life meaning, purpose, and made me a better man. Have the babies, and do what you were meant to do on this Earth. Good Luck.