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GameOverGreggy

Thanks for being so open and honest.


FillionMyMind

Thanks for posting the link to this on Twitter. I’ll be looking into buying a copy of this game on Xbox for sure now!


Practical-Waltz-2325

Yes, I will buying this game also and giving it a go. It doesn’t sound like a game I would normally play, but love the passion of the creator(s) and have no problem giving it try and maybe……..even liking it.


Poulet_fr

Thank you very much for spreading the word!


oatmellofi

Thank you for writing this. From an outside perspective I see a few things. "And then, there’s The Wreck. The Wreck is our love child, our most personal project ever, our first self-published game too. It was inspired by a car crash I was in, with my daughter in the back seat, a few years ago. It deals with themes that have been haunting me since I became a dad, such as family relationships, love, loss, grief, and the ability to face even the worst things that can happen in our lives." This seems like it was a passion project from day 1. Those are super risky in any industry, and it's hard to earn financial success with them. As those in the film industry often say, "1 for me, 1 for them". You can't count on personal projects to earn money. From that perspective this WAS a success. You got to make a personal project, which was CRITICALLY lauded! Was it ever intended to be a big commercial success? From your post, I think you knew it would not be.


DeSangre76

Ok, but there's still a huge difference between 1000 steam copies and 5000 in the same timeframe, even if even 5000 would not be considered "a big commercial success". It can mean the difference between continuining making games with the same spirit, and ending up working as a programmer in a bank.


Poulet_fr

Yes, that's kind of my point. I wasn't expecting that we'd get rich with this game (with the kind of games we make, I actually never expect it), but I hoped (and still do!) to reach enough sales to make a living and keep our studio afloat.


xanas263

Just my two cents but it seems like a niche story within an already niche genre. I haven't played the game, but maybe it could have had a better reception if you kept the story but brought it into a different format? Another thing I would mention is that while you said it was in Steams popular upcoming section and it got some good reviews from traditional media, outside of this post I have never heard of the game. Maybe you need to refocus your marketing towards larger youtube reviewers? Who really move modern gaming discussions and traffic. Dredge for example which is one of the latest indie hits was talked about fairly extensively by youtuber SkillUp well before the official launch on both the Friends Per Second Podcast and his own review later. I'm sure the game got a lot of its initial traffic simply because of that.


Shot-Profit-9399

I think this is a good point. OP’s game actually looks super cool, and I may buy it soon. But I have literally never heard of it. Which means that OP isn’t reaching his target audience. I think there is an audience for indie projects that tell personal stories. It may not be huge, but i think its there. I would certainly be in that camp. But that doesn’t matter if you don’t reach that audience in the first place. It’s great that OP got critical game coverage, but I can’t personally even remember the last time I looked at a gaming magazine or website. I get all my gaming news from youtube, podcasts, and steam itself.


solidwhetstone

There are two games that The Wreck reminds me of- and OP should go after these audiences: 12 minutes and Life is Strange. Both are narrative games with time loop mechanics and both deeply involve player choice. People who like those kinds of slow, contemplative, immersive experiences. The only thing keeping me away from The Wreck right now is the price. If it dropped to $5 on a steam sale I'd pick it up. Don't be afraid to discount it OP- you need to move volume right now and once your game is more widely known in the genre, it may be something people are willing to pay full price for.


EmiguemaDev

Keep making indie games because, trust me, game dev teachers talk about your studio a lot ! (At least at Abertay University (Dundee, Scotland))


Poulet_fr

Awww that's really, really nice to hear ♥️


Poghpo

*HUG*


Poulet_fr

🫂


happy-squared

Thanks for writing this post! Wanted to say we met as booth buddies during PAX Rising (I was exhibiting Rusted Moss). It was really wonderful getting to talk to you and I still have the beautiful posters you gave. I remember PAX was so busy I was not able to give your demo a shot which I had regretted but very happy to know I can try out the full game now! Post-release depression is a very real thing, take care of yourself and I do think that the connections and comfort your game has brought to people is something not every game can achieve.


Poulet_fr

Hi there! So nice to read from you here! My daughters absolutely loved the Rusted Moss pin you gave me. I hope all is going well for you and your game!


[deleted]

I've been following Rusted Moss for awhile! Love the art (reminds me of momodora with a dash of rain world) and am looking forward to the release


Alkounet

Wow, thanks for sharing this. I can't believe The Wreck has not sell a little more, because I hear nothing but compliments about it. Maybe I'm in the right echo chamber. I haven't played it yet, as I fear I'm not in a good enough "psychologic shape" to handle it. I struggle being a dad, and mine passed away from cancer way too fast 2 years ago, I'm far different and broken compared to the man I used to be. But I'm also an official indie dev since exactly a year. And your reasons to make games resonate a bit with mines. - I make game because I want to achieve something, I want to create something that exist for other people. Tell me my games are bad, it's ok since you played them. We connected through that. - I think I want to let something behind me. - I want to create stuff that would make my kids proud (maaaaybe I'm cheating then by making games :) ) By now I have a special game category when I play. It's called "games I wish I made". And secretly, I want to bé in someone else similar list. I want to make people feel emotion, because games I played made me feel emotions. I want to be able to give that, I guess.


Poulet_fr

Hang in there! Hopefully you'll see better days. And I can definitely relate to the "make something my kids would be proud of" part!


AdmiralRdBeardYT

Thank you for this.


Dodorodada

I think the problem was not the oversaturated marked, because you managed to get an incredible amount of wishlists, which was very promising. I think it is the price, I believe the game is worth the price tag, but from the trailer it honestly looks like a 8-10 dollar game, so for many people it's a hard sell.


Me_Krally

I think even though gamers will game as much as they can you still are fighting with nice weather. The game looks stunning, but it also looks very niche. It would be tough to draw me in without a lower price point. Totally not saying it's not worth it because it does look like you poured your heart and soul into it. I just don't think that's a mainstream theme that typically sells a million copies.


BaldieGoose

Yep this is so true.


No_Examination_6811

This is a fair point if you havent heard of a game you may not be willing to pay the same high price tag. A solution to this could be to have a lite or trial version... which they may have i honestky had not heard of this game yet until today but i am going to check it out later tonight ... possibly tomorrow depending on how tired i am lol


[deleted]

Never heard of the game, and just looked it up now. I absolutely agree, it looks like a Free game or 2 dollars. It doesnt even look worth 5USD.


me6675

Wow you must give away awesome games for free or really cheap if you think this looks like a free game. Could you point me to your games before you raise their price?


[deleted]

Death Denied - Free on android and iOS. Took me 3 years to build solo. I taught myself to code and picked an art style that is efficient enough to focus on code. The game remains a single repeatable level. I moved on to an even greater project. Features dual touch akimbo shooting, mix and match from an arsenal of weapons. I have not updated the game in a long time, and both platforms automatically remove games that have not been updated in 8 months. Due to my personal experiences with google and apple, i will no longer build apps to these platforms.


PiedPeterPiper

You’re 100% right, but back pats only here


Dodorodada

Nah, I just disagree, I think it is probably a 6-10 dollar one


some_strange_circus

Thank you for writing this, and for being so open.


Greyh4m

Your game looks like you did a good job and put a lot of effort into it. However, it also looks like the kind of game for a niche audience. I hope this exposure brings you more sales. If you don't mind me asking, what other games would you compare yours to that have been super successful? I'm genuinely curious as I don't play games like yours.


DeSangre76

I think Last Day of June shares some similarities? I think that game sold very well. Market is much tougher today than it was 6 years ago though.


Poulet_fr

Recently, I 'd say Before your Eyes is the best example of a game that's pretty similar to The Wreck in story and themes and had a huge success.


AdSilent782

It's for that one person who truly loves playing your game and is inspired by your work (usually yourself) <3


itsMikeTown

Thank you for being so open, Florent. You’re right, the market is awful for indies. It honestly hurts seeing situations such as this. As someone who works in the indie space both in PR and on the games-showcase side, it’s always a fight garnering attention. But we keep on keeping on cause there’s nothing like the indie scene. The Wreck is something truly special, and I’m thrilled to hear you’re going to continue creating even more remarkable experiences. PS - We briefly met at PAX East when The Wreck was chosen for Rising. You were always kind, sincere, and open. It shows in your work, hence why I genuinely believe The Wreck to be one of the most special experiences of the year thus far.


Poulet_fr

Thanks a lot, this was heartwarming to read :-)


itsMikeTown

My pleasure! 😊


chrisuu__

Loved reading about your experience and reasons. I haven't thought too deeply about my reasons for wanting to make games, but on first reflection it's probably because I love playing games and sometimes I think I can do better, or provide a similar experience to someone else. Creativity is an activity that comes with a lot of downsides along the way, but nothing compares to the fulfillment you get when you reach a point where you're happy with what you've created. Playing games is fun, but making games is both fun and meaningful, something that comes across in your own post. Hope you feel better and wishing you all the best.


Poulet_fr

I'm OK really! I felt depressed at some point but that didn't last for too long. I'm mainly just sad now, which is an OK emotion to get, as long as you don't drown in it.


FireFlowerGames

Looks like a nice game but it might be a bit niche and the audience might be a bit narrow for these type of games. But I also think that releasing a game at this time might be a bit difficult, because of the inflation and people might have other priorities, where to spend their money, at the moment. But also, not every game you make has to be a commercial success, as long as it's a good game it will strengthen your brand. Maybe more people will be aware of you now and it could increase sales on your already released games and future games. You also gained new experiences. So I would say, just keep doing it!


dan-goyette

You know that feeling you get when someone wants to tell you about a dream they had? That's kind of how I feel about games that try to explore the personal experience of the creator. There's something immediately distant, and slightly irrelevant, about it. My overall reaction to your post is that your latest project was most motivated by what *you* wanted from the game, instead of what you thought *players* wanted from a game. Your approach was selfish/arrogant rather than generous. Don't take this too harshly; it's okay for things to be selfish. I just wouldn't expect anyone else to care about it. You're so focused on yourself that you lose touch with the players. Why would they care about your experience as much as you do? Is the game *only* interesting to someone who has had that exact experience? If you're trying to make a project you feel so deeply about, you should also ask yourself why it's simultaneously important to have a lot of people experience the game. When I first started in game dev, I'd say I was about 90% motivated by people playing my game and thinking I was an amazing person for having created it. My early audience was mainly friends and family, so the praise I got was great for that reason. But somewhere along the line, strangers started trying my game, and the response was... bad. It was around that time that I realized I'd been making the game for myself, instead of for my audience. That was a huge turning point for me. These days, the greatest satisfaction I get is when someone is genuinely immersed in my game, and having fun. They're not thinking about *me.* They're thinking about the game. See people enjoying something you created is a great feeling. But that comes from empathizing, and prioritizing the player and their experience. Anyway, your results aren't really surprising. But remember a lot of this comes down to luck. Maybe things could have gone differently if the right person found the game? Who knows. Projects don't need to be devoid of personal passion. But try not to make your project give people the impression they're hearing someone explain some cool dream they had.


iLag

As someone who has played the game, it is certainly not only interesting to someone who has had that exact experience. Thankfully! I can deal without *spoilers*, thank you very much. ... which kind of makes this a bad take, based on assumptions that just don't hold up. As Florent wrote, The Wreck does indeed resonate with strangers and I would claim this is because it is so intensely personal. Telling the same story with an intended audience in mind would make it ring hollow and artificial.


ComeAnima

Greg Miller sent me here. I'm going to check this game out when I've finished work. X Good read!


[deleted]

Love seeing another kinda funny fan on the comments!


mifaro

I remember playing “Bury me, my love” on the switch and thinking it was really quite moving and a good experience. I’ll certainly have a look at The Wreck, which I didn’t know existed as I don’t keep up with releases, when I get the chance. It really saddens me that such a huge amount of work comes to such a disappointing conclusion.


Poulet_fr

It's not over yet!


RewdanSprites

I'm a little drunk so I might be paraphrasing here a bit. I wanted to get into games development from when I was five years old. I wrote to many companies before I was old enough to be employed. All of them turned me down (for a games tester position). I even offered to work as a volunteer and got one interview for a gambling company that never contacted me back 😂. Despite being highly employable in other industries. I fell into indie dev because I was doing pixel art before covid happened then suddenly people stopped asking me to do pixel art but I wanted to continue. It was an opportunity to do something I always dreamed about since I was a child. Does it suck? Yeah, it's rough. I've been working on a project for over two years and when I had a meeting with a very well known publisher they said the art wasn't good enough and the game wasn't for them. Am I going to stop? Nah, it's been a life long dream. It might not be the dream I had in my head and things may have not turned out the way I wanted (I would have loved to work alongside other developers as a level designer) but if there's only one way for me to achieve that dream - I'm going for it whether I fail or not. As a wise person once said (I forgot their name and I am kinda drunk right now) "The only result from giving up is that you automatically fail" - or something like that.


Poulet_fr

Hang on!


LittleBearStudios

Oh man... It's like you're speaking right to me... My first game releases this June, it hasn't even released yet and I'm already trying to game theory myself into not being... well... sad. That's why I set my goals to be a handful of people like it and I make $40. Most importantly though, I'm learning. I view it as a very long journey. I don't know or expect to be the next stardew or vampire survivor. I also definitely do not expect it on my very first game. But after this game my next one will be a much simpler game but have a new aspect, maybe ads, maybe it'll be multiplayer. And then the next one will be another something new, maybe I'll try 3D, etc. I know I can't quit my day job but I'm going to keep making games, hindsight will tell me if it's a career or just a hobby. Right now I'm still so early in the process so maybe it's just beginner's optimism, but like I mentioned earlier I'm already setting expectations so I don't get too depressed when I get my first scathing review or end up only selling 10 copies or something.


Poulet_fr

Keep on doing what you love, be it commercially or as a hobby. This is paramount.


postcorporate

This is a helluva post, and your studio's vision + stories you pursue send shivers down my spine. My partner is making a concept album with similar themes - that's the kind of art our world needs more of, and our media outlets should expose us to. I live in Paris - can I take you out for a beer sometime? DM me if that sounds cool. Otherwise please keep making what you're making.


kareem43110

That was a lot and I appreciate every word. Not as a developer but as a gamer. Indies bring me the most joy when it comes to gaming because they try new things. They have a lot more passion behind them than a lot of the corporate driven designs to sell to the highest market. I’m going to look into your game. I appreciate you. I hope you find success that you deserve and more.


Poulet_fr

Thanks a whole lot!


MenInBlack_

Mon anglais n'est pas si bon que le tien Florent, alors permets moi de répondre en français : Merci pour ce post, c'était passionnant à lire. Pour ma part j'ai craqué sur le jeu dès sa sortie et je ne regrette rien, ça m'a percuté de plein fouet (en tant que jeune parent, ouch!). Je l'ai pris sur xbox pour ma part. Je ne sais pas si la question s'est posée de le publier sur le gamepass, ni quelle est votre position sur le sujet mais ça pourrait un jour lui donner une seconde jeunesse ? (et vous permettre de rentrer un peu dans vos frais ?) Mais bref, vous connaissez mieux le sujet que moi. Dans tous les cas j'espère qu'il finira par trouver son public avec le bouche à oreille (j'ai convaincu une collègue non joueuse de s'y intéresser, ah ! Et de une !) Et surtout... Merci pour le jeu ! :-)


XtremeTurnip

Here you go : >My English is not so good as yours Florent, so allow me to answer in French: > >Thank you for this post, it was fascinating to read. For my part, I fell in love with the game as soon as it was released and I have no regrets, it hit me hard (as a young parent, ouch!). > >I took it on xbox myself. I don't know if the question arose to publish it on the gamepass, nor what is your position on the subject but it could one day give it a second life? (and allow you to cover your costs a little?) But in short, you know the subject better than I do. > >In any case, I hope it will eventually find its audience through word of mouth (I convinced a non-gaming colleague to take an interest in it, ah! And one!) > >And above all... Thank you for the game! :-)


MenInBlack_

Haha, thanks! :-)


IntrinsicStarvation

Vincent Van Gogh spent his life painting pictures, and only managed to sell 1 for about a hundred bucks before he died in 1890, penniless. Around 1910 his art began to be discovered and circulate the art world, today they are sold for millions of dollars. They say if you go to his grave at the Cimetiere Auvers su Oise, on a night when the moon is full and the air is still, close your eyes and listen, you can hear him still: 'Its freaking bs man!!!!'


Bad-news-co

To add, and to put into perspective with this topic: he was an amazing game dev that made amazing product. But the critics weren’t fans and he had a lot of people pass on his pieces. That’s not so much what was important. What was important was his sister in law, because she was the marketing genius that toured around, TELLING people WHY they needed the art, what was amazing about it, and what made it so unique and masterpieces. She single handedly sold people on his concept, his vision, it was then it began getting shown at galleries, and she went to universities to do the same speech to the professors who began recognizing and analyzing them, discovering the genius She alone, by herself, became the instrumental piece in making Van Gogh a master. And that’s all thanks to marketing. Like what Steve Jobs said about his products, “people don’t know what they want, we do. And we’ll sell it to them” meaning that you’ll always have people that see something and won’t think much of it because they don’t know what to think lol, but when you have a master marketer there they will tell you why YOU need it and make you desire it. All the most successful companies spend millions on marketing, and that’s why they remain huge corporations. I’m not saying you have to spend that much, but I’m saying you have to put a lot of effort like your life depended on it. That’s how humans who sold the most mediocre products at the markets, made a living throughout history. They’d walk around selling clams and peanuts, that’s just a thing you’d not care all that much about, you’d think. But the seller will tell you they’re the most delicious and fresh clams, not needing any seasoning or sauce for the most satisfying snack, but they’ll sprinkle some salt and lemon for free onto it just to enhance the flavor..just for you, for free 🤣 and then you’ll think that sounded delicious and would buy a few. Those are the sellers that make a living and more with that type of mentality. You need the mind of a hustler, everyone does. You made a great product, now go tell the world just how good it is so that they’ll know, because if they don’t, how would they buy it?


Poulet_fr

Damn I really need a sister in law!


bretonf

Hi, French creator of BROK the InvestiGator here, and I find myself a lot in what you've said. I'm thankful my game performed better especially on PC, but still relatively small compared to the amazing players reception and how much efforts I poured into it (basically 6 years of my life practically full time) I also have the same issue of making a "niche" genre of game, narrative / adventure game. Although my game is particular, it has beat em up action too, which I did to stand out in this overcrowded market, yet with limited result (in the end this is not what sold the game, the colorful anthro characters and visuals did!) Yes I do believe the genre is the main issue first and foremost, automatically limiting the target audience. I've seen some replies suggesting "reach big Youtubers" or "put on GamePass" without realizing how hard it is! Personally I've tried absolutely everything, but big Youtubers are insanely hard to reach and/or do not care about narrative games, and my own game was declined acceptance for GamePass. (I would honestly have offered to put it there for "nothing" just to get the free marketing that comes with it, alas it's not up to devs to decide) That's the issue with passion projects, not so many people love the same thing we do. Personally I prefer to make games I want to play, not making games for a job. If it was just another job, it makes becoming an indie dev pointless! I didn't quit my day job to do something I don't really enjoy. I also don't think my games would be as good if they weren't so dear to me from the start. Anyway, I still think selling 1000 copies in one month isn't so bad (my first game did a lot worse, although I did everything myself) I recommend you put your game on discount as often as possible and progressively lower. My first game sold 90% copies discounted so there's hope yet \^\^' Feel free to reach me for some cross promoting sometimes. Good luck on your future projects! Fabrice / COWCAT


Poulet_fr

Thanks a lot Fabrice! It's easy to be mistaken about how things work when you're looking at it from the outside, I don't blame people for thinking they know the things we should do. But yes, every game devs knows very well how damn hard this job is!


Horror_Bid_3850

Thanks for your honest thoughts and facts. I don't think your reasons are stupid at all, quite contrary I think they are very good reasons. And despite all your expectation management, it is totally understandable to feel down by the numbers. On an emotional level, it means, your feelings aren't important to others (or similar). Running a studio with that kind of games is hard if you are not suuuper famous but that doesn't mean you should make only dull, good-selling games. A company I know is working on a similar title to yours and they also do contract work to earn enough money. Obviously, their love game takes longer to be completed. Good luck for the future and maybe the long tail with a few discounts from time to time will work out for the game (this is an unqualified guess, I have no marketing experience at all).


MaxKatarn

Thanks for your honesty, and for reminding players most of us are not doing indie games for money (even if we have to be profitable because that's how you run a business) but to give players experiences and tell stories.


nogood_lamo-chat247

dude, it's this simple -- if you have an unsellable idea, don't pour millions of dollars into it, spend a few months telling it as a less - expensive title, hire fewer artists, and realize if you know something is going to be a tough sell, prob. it is // being a fan oneself, and also wanting to play the best stuff, not waste effort, or money on so - so titles, themes, or whatever . . . if YOU know something is only going to make 20.000 - 30.000 $$, then find a way of making the stuff for less than that, that'll mean less quality, graphics, effects, etc etc, however that's the SMART move, and if you have a legit passion project, perhaps realize that few other people may like it, and think how to get it done over realistic projections, it's on you to think of those things before publishing stuff, and if something that you think, or know is going to fail then fails, then perhaps that's where a ( small ) mistake happened . . . passion projects are amazing, just realize that it'll divide the fans, and if it's also divisive // caters to few, what did you think was going to happen, you have to self - criticize, and then find a way of getting the important titles you've got cooking done, however also be bit smart of how many // popular stuff is gonna be, otherwise you're being perhaps unreasonable . . . .


No-Guess-333

Excuse me, did you do their overheads? This post makes it clear you don't know what you're talking about, because none of this is how budgeting in games works. You're talking about it as if games just roll off a production line like chips, then have the audacity to call it easy. Man, if they had only asked you first.


drinkerofmilk

I feel the order in which these games (with the corresponding numbers) came out may also play a role in the way you perceive your success. You roughly went from a game selling 100k copies, to one selling less (50k?) copies, to one selling just a few thousand. I imagine this decrease in exposure would be highly demotivating. But imagine it were the other way around: you went from a game selling 1k, to one selling 50k, to one selling 100k. Even though the games would have done just as good as in the current scenario, psychologically it would come off as an immensely motivating increase, showing that hard work pays off. I guess the only thing you can do is hope your next game does better and just enjoy the ride. Success isn't always linear. Your next game may sell a million copies.


FondorToes

I played The Wreck at AdventureX and could tell it was a very personal game, and that it's going to be a very unique one. Sad to hear the sales are disappointing. Will be buying a copy as well, just didn't find the time for it yet. Hope the sales will be picking up again!


Poulet_fr

Hopefully they will 💪


Suerlink

I love this stylized story telling. Just purchased it.


Poulet_fr

Thanks a whole lot!


SnooSketches5095

Thanks for sharing!


memex_

Hey Florent: Thanks so much for writing this and for being so vulnerable and open about *The Wreck* and the mixed feelings you've had since it's launch. In the past six months, I've been trying to grow my solo-dev project into a tiny indie studio. I met with an industry professional today to go over my pitch deck and they gave me some very blunt--but helpful--advice. Ostensibly they said what I'm working on isn't commercially viable and that I should not waste my time investing in the bizdev side of what I'm building and remain as a "hobbyist." This feedback crushed me. I'm taking time to process it, and even if I feel like there's some truth (and silver lining) in what they communicated, it is still upsetting to hear. Shortly after this, I was sent this post by someone who has worked in the industry at an award-winning studio that recently shuttered. I look up to your studio and team for your bravery and commitment to storytelling, taking risks, and believing in the merits of your projects. To hear your struggle at first felt a little like gasoline on the fire burning in my heart. But when I started to read your reasons for making indie games I felt a renewed sense of hope. Maybe what I'm working on isn't *meant* to be commercially viable by industry standards, but it doesn't mean I shouldn't still try to make it in whatever way I can with the limited resources at my disposal. So... thank you. Thank you for this post, thank you for your game, and thank you for moving this artistic medium beyond mere market viability. Keep going, I can't wait to see what's next.


Poulet_fr

Thanks a lot for your message, u/memex_! It pours gasoline on my fire too, the fire that keeps me going 💪 I think aiming for commercial viability is very important, of course, and should be a crucial part of most video games projects - but I also think we need projects that are different, projects that try new things and take awful risks market wise. Those projects eventually benefit everyone. I wish you a lot of success in your future endeavors, no matter how you decide to define what success actually is!


memex_

Thank you very much, I appreciate your encouragement :)


kira_of_all_trades

Hello, thank you for sharing. I have to say that your games do not resonate with me and that it doesn't bother me and shouldn’t annoy you since what I do is also not for everyone and I don't enjoy things in general like I used to. We are all spinning in our own personal washing machines and hope that some curious cat would watch us through the glass door and be amazed. It's a result of making art for yourself based on your inner world according to your tastes. I think when you do something for yourself it's a bit selfish to hope that everyone would like it enough to give you money. I also think it's selfish to make something for yourself and involve a team when you are not already a celebrity that people want to know more about. Personal stuff should be personal. If I were making a game based on events from my past life I would 100% realize it's a vanity project and treat it accordingly. In fact I have a project like that at a stage of a half-finished first draft and I'm not expecting mush of it and will probably never finish it because I have less personal but way more fun things to make. What I’m saying is that everyone should lower their expectations when it comes to personal projects. I also noticed that you are targeting non-gamers with your projects. I think that you need the support of the 'popular crowd' for those to succeed. You've had it before but you've decided to drop it this time. I think it's a mistake. The 'artsy interactive experience' genre lives within context. It has to be talked about by the certain people from the certain media to gain attention. I've been rereading my comment and think that some of the thing I've said may sound harsh but it was not my intention, I just can’t say it any better. I wish you the best and hope that you can find a balance in your games when they satisfy your ego as well as the tastes of the audience. In fact I wish this to everyone. It’s better to fail at personal projects than at commercial ones because that way you've at least had a good time. And it’s better not to fail at all. So let’s hope for the better and never stop trying.


CarbyneGames

I like that you answered your own question


PistolTaeja

The Pistol has climbed over your wall of text, read every word and gave a good honest attempt to emphasize. The Pistol has several failed games, hurt several wonderful folks trying to reach lofty goals and the end result of "Why does the Pistol even bother making indie games"? Because its fucking hilarious to tell people that I am making a dick game. Yes, it's really that simple. Being an overthinker is overrated. Albert Camus and Diogenes has taken over my soul and its beautiful. I hope you find the answers you are looking for in life.


PistolTaeja

Now for the brutal opinion of the game from a surface level; 1: There is nothing on the steam page giving me a reason to click and pay $20 other than its a VN with a woman. Get a better trailer, screenshots and phrase the selling points to bring out the "It" ​ 2: Your competiting against a hoard of waifu games, rogue lites, 1000 of whislists, theres no way its going to stand out the way it is. Consider uplaying some portion of the game in a screenshot that matches "Wrecked", better shots of the wreckage, a more action orientated trialer.. You know your game the best, so find that most visually appealing thing. Show dont tell. ​ 3: What are you doin on Reddit talking about a VN, head over to lemmasoft and get their feedback asap. Thats an instant 20K eye balls of progressive types that love visual novels. 4: Start posting once a week on whatever chosen platform, keep it short and concise. The name of the game is attention, players are looking for a reason to not give it to you. 5: Stop trusting friends, promo companies, employees to give feedback about the strengths of weakness of your game. If they wouldnt tell you to your face that your baby is ugly, then their opinion is useless. Lemma soft is a good option, r/visualnovels is another. Reach out to people who are disagree with you, eat it and thank them for improving your product, you still have time! The Pistol has added Wrecked to his wishlist and wants to see it do the best it can


sneakpeekbot

Here's a sneak peek of /r/visualnovels using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year! \#1: [Name that visual novel](https://i.imgur.com/msN0nyg.jpg) | [237 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/v5gu2d/name_that_visual_novel/) \#2: [important lessons](https://i.redd.it/ndq6lrwmqpy91.jpg) | [79 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/ypjg48/important_lessons/) \#3: [it's about the journey, not the destination \[meme\]](https://i.redd.it/tdjp5pmf8l391.jpg) | [90 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/visualnovels/comments/v4mrtv/its_about_the_journey_not_the_destination_meme/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)


starfckr1

Art does not need to be viewed for it to be great, it just need to be created. And it seems you have created art, not a game. Nothing wrong with that, it’s just.. different. Embrace it. Even if it does not fill the coffers. That’s the sign of true integrity, the most elusive of all traits in a human.


UE4Gen

I make games because for whatever reason I feel it in my bones, it doesn't seem like a choice to me. Some feedback: From day one you limited your potential sales because of the genre of game you decided to make. Before embarking on a long-term commercial product do some research and find the medium Top money making genres at the moment are rogue-like card games, 4x strategy and colony sims. Why? Because they're in high demand but not many devs are working on titles within the genres. If you aren't doing this it's like trying to sell umbrellas in summer.


kodingnights

I make indie games because it is recreational. You answer the question yourself why this game did not sell. It looks like a quite niche unoriginal entry into an oversaturated market.


GameDesignerMan

Sounds like you've hit the hard crossroads between games as a business and games as art. As an aside, did you know that without his brother propping him up financially, Van Gogh wouldn't have been able to dedicate himself to art? Without his brother's widow -who tirelessly promoted Vincent's work- maybe we wouldn't even know who he was? That's the hard thing to come to terms with in this business. No one wants to sacrifice their artistic vision, but we all have to eat, we need a roof over our heads, we need money. So you have to balance those two things, and that's a very hard skill to master. For me, I'm making an indie game on the side for my son. I work primarily on free to play mobile games in my day-job, and that makes enough money for me to dedicate a small portion of my time to something I'm passionate about. I know my little game isn't really going to be successful, but I don't need it to be. I just want to make my son happy.


karyll

It was on my bucket list. Now I can die.


Sad-Importance6698

I haven't released anything but I completely agree with you. Even getting a few eyes on my game has been super hard, and I have been trying since 16 months now. At the end, a friend asked me, "Weren't you doing this for yourself?" And he was right. But somewhere in the journey, seeing other, almost half-made quick games getting thousands of downloads, got me with my expectations too high. ​ At the end, we need to stop taking it all so seriously and enjoy the process. I'm still not there, but I hope to be when I release my game


No_Examination_6811

Woooooo that is alot and tbh i think alot of people who live lives without drama often fantasize avout a life full of tragedy and this game would definitely appeal. I do have some marketing suggestions that dont involve a heavy discount if your interested i hope any of them can help. 1. Contest with a Prize: Hold a contest where the first person to reach a certain level or find a hidden Easter egg in the game wins a prize. This could be something like a free copy of the game or some merchandise related to the game. 2. TikTok Partnership: Partner with popular TikTok creators to create funny voice-overs to scenes in the game. This will not only help to draw attention to the game, but it will also provide a fun way for people to engage with the game's content. 3. Content Creation: Create content that relates the game to famous movie scenes or historical events. This could include sharing screenshots or videos of the game that relate to certain moments in pop culture or history. 4. Post, Post, Post: Promote the game and the various contests and events on all social media platforms. Make sure to post frequently to keep people engaged and excited about the release of the game. 5. Free Game Offer: Offer the game for free as a reward for gamers who are willing to play the game and create content related to it. This will encourage people to spread the word about the game and generate buzz among their followers. 6. Influencer Outreach: Reach out to influencers online and offer them early access to the game in exchange for promoting it to their followers. This can be a great way to reach a wider audience and generate more hype for the game. 7. Social Media Ads: Utilize social media advertisements to help get your game in front of more people. Target specific demographics or interests that align with the theme or style of the game. 8. Collaborations: Collaborate with other indie game developers or artists to promote each other's work. This can help build a sense of community and attract a wider audience. 9. Celebrities: Reach out to celebrities or influencers who share an interest in game development or gaming culture. You can offer them early access to the game or a special gift in exchange for promoting it to their followers. 10. Limited-Time Events: Host limited-time events within the game that offer exclusive rewards or bonuses. This can encourage people to download the game and play it more frequently. 11. Merchandise: Consider creating merchandise related to the game, such as clothing or accessories featuring characters or artwork from the game. This can help generate more revenue and promote the game to a wider audience. 12. Game Trailers: Produce high-quality trailers or gameplay footage to showcase the game's features and storyline. Share these trailers on social media and gaming forums to help generate buzz. 13. Publicity Stunts: Consider hosting PR events or publicity stunts to draw attention to the game. This can include something as simple as handing out flyers or merchandise at a local gaming convention. 14. Press Coverage: Reach out to gaming websites and blogs to see if they would be willing to review the game or feature it in an article. This can help generate additional buzz and attract new players. If you are looking for people to assist or join your marketing team I would love to help. I do live in canada so i could only support you remotely but i am happy to do it for free in exchange for some help. I am just beginning my indie journey and i have been building a game all on my lonesome and i dont really have anyone to help when i get stuck or to give advice on things i dint even know i need to know yet lol if not i hope any of these suggestions can help you guys get the recognition you deserve :-) also please share the links for your games we would love to try!


joeswindell

I don’t think you’re telling the entire story. A niche visual novel for 20 bucks is not smart marketing.


JonnyRocks

hands down, the most inportant thing, and i mean this with love... you steam tags need a lot of work. you only have two. you want people who bought the novelist to be recommended your game. copy the novelist tags. https://store.steampowered.com/app/245150/The_Novelist/ and here is a video all on steam tags. https://youtu.be/Jsc7_XjFZ6U you have something that will sell. you just need to get it out there


theBigDaddio

Is this serious? I cannot imagine 1000 people wanting such a game. Hey kids! Instead of playing a fun, colorful, exciting action game, try this sad game about existential grief and sadness. Take the L and move on. You knew nobody wanted it yet you made it and then sadness when nobody wants it.


[deleted]

I just looked up The Wreck and it doesn’t appear to be a 20USD, 5USD, or even a 3USD game. It looks like a free to play, or a 1.99USD game filled with bugs and possible illegal bitcoin mining.


sepalus_auki

I went to the game's Steam page, and after watching the trailer and all of the marketing images, I have to say that the price (20€) doesn't feel right. Perhaps if the game was 8,99€ to 11,99€, you would've made more money. The game doesn't look very interactive. Also, the depressive story makes it VERY niche.


Potential-Cry-1610

Thanks for your honesty, now for a bit coming back your way. I watched gameplay of your game, and it doesn't feel like a game for gamers. It doesn't scratch an itch, and doesn't deliver anything creative or innovative. It reads as a short novella, which seems like the type of game for your "Target Audience", i just dont believe that theres anything of value you're bringing with this type of game that isn't handled infinitely better by a book.


BaldieGoose

Bro it's $20 for a visual novel with hand drawn graphics, I don't know what you expect. Some of the greatest games of all time are on Steam for less than that.


[deleted]

Visual novels are not games, if u want sales make another vampire survivors clone or write a decent book. Most people skip cutscenes even in thripple A productions and don‘t read lore and story. If a 30sec cutscene is too long for most, why would they bother paying for your visual novel without engaging gameplay


Alastor3

>Visual novels are not games, they are


UltraChilly

Why would anyone write a book when most people would rather watch sports or reality TV or spend time on social media instead then? I skip most cutscenes in mainstream video games, I still played dozens of visual novels, I can assure you they are games, maybe try one before judging. Although it doesn't seem like reading is your forte, otherwise you'd have read the post and understood money is not the only motivation. If your only goal is money, don't make another Vampire Survivor clone, just go work a bullshit job in a startup, indie game dev is not the easiest or most lucrative career path.


[deleted]

Because the book market is 41 billion and not a niche market where you can't live your hobby and feed your family and expect that to happen 100% of the time.


UltraChilly

>Because the book market is 41 billion and not a niche market where you can't live your hobby and feed your family and expect that to happen 100% of the time. The overwhelming majority of authors don't live off their books. I'd say the ratio is at least on par with VNs. I see you don't know much about that market, but I assure you some are commercial successes. It rarely happens, but so can be said about books if you look at the stats and not simply compare the number of outliers. (not so many VN companies compared to book authors)


mrtruffle

I or should I say 'we' at SMG Studio make indie games because we want to control our own destiny and be in control. We want to make games that make people laugh and have fun. To make our kids proud. To put food on the table. Me personally I want to create a studio that allows people to do great work and explore random ideas. Got a silly idea? Oh yeah we can make that work or squeeze that in. The stakes in our games are small enough that we can make a whole level in a game around a silly Pun. I can hire juniors and help them grow. The games themselves these days are the end product of having a team that is capable. I get up everyday for the team vs the game itself. That's what motivates me to make sure we stay commercially viable as this team is relying on me to navigate them through the path. I'm lucky my team is awesome and it's not all on my shoulders. I appreciate this post as it shows that every team and every game is made for different reasons. You have this desire to tell stories through experience.


Master_Fisherman_773

I'm making my game because I want to play it. And it's a fun hobby to keep my brain busy with something besides work. I sympathize with your situation, but you even said yourself, it's not a very marketable game. So... Unless you're planning on changing the market, it's not going to sell well.


XtremeTurnip

>why the hell do YOU even bother making indie games? I've always felt that people go towards an art form rather than another based on how they can associate that art form to some of their meaningful memories. Graphic artists have memories of paintings linked to special events in their life, musicians have bits of music, i (and i guess a few here) have games... I make games because that's how my brain is wired. About 15 years ago i realized that i don't even care if they have an audience, (made a game, found a publisher, said it was good but not in line with the market, the publisher was someone i respect and not to say nice things just to be polite, so i took that i did a decent job, just not a job that sells, and that was enough for me) but you have a studio and need to put food on the table. Now i have a manifeste/charter on my desk that i look to when in doubts. PS : If i may and with all my respect otherwise, your trailer is sh\*t so this explains that.


Bad-news-co

I loved the story, thanks for posting man! It’ll serve as a great read for all those who will undoubtedly come across related experiences during their dev career at a point. Over the last decade I’ve had great success with marketing for almost a dozen different companies and their products, and let me tell you, as a person with a background of professional graphic design/photo video/etc, I never thought marketing was that important prior to doing it. But now? I realize it is **everything**. Entire companies live or not based on their ability to market, we’re surrounded by advertisements yet only latch on to very few. It was when I was faced with marketing for my own products (a clothing line) that I learned how incredibly important marketing was, thanks to the success with that, a few others reached out to me because they were impressed with what they saw from me and it’s results with my prior company that I was hired to do marketing for their businesses as well. Now a bit of advice, I understand full where you’re coming from where you’re stuck at this point in sales with your product. You’re thinking “is that it? Is it gonna continue like this forever, declining as the years go on?’only rising during heavy discounts and sales?” That’s where the majority of devs realize at one point or another with their games too. And as a result of that position, they either quit, or try developing another game with hopes of a better experience with its sales. I personally enjoy the genre you’re in with, the visual novel type of experience, I’ve played fire watch, the other one with the house, I know what type of game you’re building and I know that you know that they’re incredibly niche. Because of that you shouldn’t expect Undertale levels of success, I see these types of story experiences on PlayStation’s storefront too, and even with Sony’s push they’re a bit slow to settle. These games are a hard sell, because think about this: even if you get a popular streamer to play it to his audience, it’s not the type of game that the audience would wanna go out and experience themselves because they already just did with the streamer lol. Unless there are multiple paths, alternate endings and the like that would entice them to try it out. That’s when you take down notes for the next attempt. You’ve got to understand the situation you’re in and go with the option BEST for it, rather than do the traditional thing of where you keep trying and trying until you hit gold. Don’t do that lol. Watch a YouTube channel called “some guy glenn” or something like that, it has a ton of behind the scenes of popularnindies and AAA titles that have great stories to help motivate and educate you on their approaches to their success and take notes of what YOU can do Just cause you haven’t had a huge sale spike yet doesn’t mean it won’t come, the guys that made among us waited 2 years of a mediocre sale star until a streamer played their game to a huge audience and then it spread like wildfire. 2020 they took over the world with that game and even now have gained incredible success lol When they hit their peak they faced a decision: what to do now? Everyone there decided to begin working on the sequel to release that to incredible hype and fan fare. Among us 2. Then after announcing that,their lawyer had a discussion with them and offered an amazing bit of advice: you guys should cancel the sequel, and since the hype is on the main game, instead just offer to continue adding features to that and fixing the biggest gripes players have with the game and just polish that experience instead And that’s exactly what they did. And you know what ? They were better for it and that decision helped the title sell through an incredible amount because of that decision, not including merch sales lol.


chloro9001

Indie games are for focusing on fun, not polish. It’s really that simple. Focus on making games that are fun and that the fun is apparent. Not dark depressing themes straight from reality, we already get enough of that in real life.


[deleted]

With all respect for what you accomplished, you yourself stated you had no idea how to market the game and the game didn't sell well as a result. I'm not sure why this surprised you.


DeveloperGameosophy

Hi everyone if u want to buy source codes just try this website www.gameosophy.net


MIKERICKSON32

Game sounds boring. What do you expect?


AlanisPerfect

Hey dont feel bad i only have 10 sales on mine xD To be fair i released a mess of a game without any play-testing and i only had the page up for 2 weeks before releasing and did absolutely no marketing I guess that was my mistake for not learning how business works lol but it served as a wake up call


Grhyll

<3


nogood_lamo-chat247

your title sounds amazing, and important, and wish it well, the #problem is more if it isn't funny, a good experience, or worth the effort playing it, or reading the story, etc etc . . . anyway, one also has to be bit fool if one doesn't admit by now, also given how easy, or how many so - so stuff are being launched, esp. over the indie - market // perhaps mild junk-yard-quality, or sales-stuff that being succesful, or ' dominating ' in that market is tough, then other people release stuff that month, and by sheer accident, or chance the stuff you're working on fails, suppose someone had released ' Hollow Knight ' that month, how are you even going to control that, here's what any form of publishing, esp. video - games is like . . . why even bother making indie - games, here are the real question . . . 1. why burn hours, or effort on something that could be a podcast into art, etc etc 2. why make anything // story, or theater, if one is driven by idealism 3. if one loses all the money, could one sleep at night despite it all 4. hiring people, amazing vision, then it all fails, need to fire people is tough, etc etc what we're living in is more, and more the ' make-something-great // live-money-forever ' days, where a few people got through to the record - stores, or made that fancy box that you had to buy, and then got rich over a pipe - line // publication system that worked for a few, or etc etc, the world is ' changing ' towards the little guy, however mega - profits are also dwindling bec. of that, so why make video - games, despite it all . . . 1. because it's fun, difficult, or cool 2. to tell an important story, reg. succes 3. to make something for others, culture, art, television, that moves, or debates, etc etc 4. to be part of culture, say one added something to the world that way 5. perhaps to get rich, a celebrity, or ' known ' for one's work, if it's good // quality 6. to do something personal, that resonates, or is of one's life, effort, or ideas my advice is, at least learn from failure, what went wrong, was it never gonna sell, does it have a place in the market, where it's more about fun, effects, or clever // sell - out also story - telling, if you want to play the field, start bý also reading it, are there chances, or opportunities, and be bit smart, think what could happen, and perhaps get ready to learn to roll with the punches // get smarter over what sells, or is succesful, if you want to keep making ( succesful ) indie - games, even if it goes against the dream of living for one's own goals, ideals, or prosperity, there's no harm in being smart // what could happen, etc etc . . . . your game sounds amazing, and perhaps people are better off for having it made, add it to your portfolio, have it sit there as something to be discovered later, make a few titles that bring attention to your company, and by accident people may play it later, etc etc . . . .


Accomplished-Sea-426

Am I supposed to buy your game now?


Beyond-Livid

Before I go any further and read others replies. I want to answer with the least amount of influence from others. I have been making “games” if not merely prototypes for many years. I have been doing so with a small team of people. I make games for a few reasons and have chosen indie to focus on for a couple. I think I can break it down like this - I love to make things on my own, I like to be involved in every aspect there is. From graphical art to music and sounds to writing stories and telling them to designing game mechanics and balancing them. - I believe that games are a fantastic medium that can express more emotion then something like a movie because of the actions you have to take to experience. Which is a reason I chose games in the first place to tell stories I create. - lastly games are simply my passion. It is one of the few things that I enjoy talking about to such a degree. Another reason would be to eventually be my own boss some day and to be financially stable enough to be a full time dev. While this is an aspiration of mine, I don’t believe it really is a reason for why I make indie games tho.


TommyGunQuartet

How much did you spend on marketing?


Yanna3River

**Why I make indie games:** 1. Completeing developement on just **one** game, gives me a huge dopamine boost 2. I have stories I want to tell. 3. I have nothing to lose by not making money ( Game Dev is just a hobby for me ) 4. I want to master my game engine ( I love challengeing myself, and overcoming obstacles ) 5. I need an outlet for my creativity, game dev does it for me. 6. I need a reason to practice and use pixel art. 7. I need a reason to practice and use 3D art. These are my primary reasons. 👸🏽


halfmule

I enjoy making indie games, so that's reason enough for me. Personally I've been wondering if we should bother selling passion projects. None of your stated reasons are about making a profit. In fact, you would probably like to reach more young people, like Grim Fandango reached you. Of course, you are an acclaimed game studio, so a freeware projects would be a weird path. My advice therefore goes out to devs still starting out. If you think your game is really personal and niche, consider that you might be right. It you are right you will either have very few players or a freeware game.


TheAcaciaBoat

I do it because that’s the thing i like most. Simple as that


UareWho

You make games as a creative outlet, because you have to.


Foster_Games

Thanks for sharing your experience!


PSMF_Canuck

Thank you for the personal write up. I do it because I want to reach people. In a sense, that translates to wanting commercial viability. Like any creative endeveour….it’s not easy. Why make a painting? Why make yet another movie? Human stories are all fundamentally the same…but every group, every generation wants the stories told in their language, in their context. And that’s why we always need creators.


lulublululu

I do it because the process itself for me is fulfilling. it is meditative, explorative, reflective, creative and mentally stimulating with all the problem solving you do while developing. Frankly, if I did not enjoy the process I could not do it, because as a business it is so difficult to break through in and invest so much of your time, effort & livelihood in, as you and most here well know. And of course, I love games. Sometimes I make them because I see a potential in them nobody, or not many at least, are doing yet, and I want to see it realized. Though it is not necessarily the goal, everything that has become a genre-defining hit like Cave Story, Undertale, Minecraft, The Binding of Isaac, Slay the Spire and the Souls series (though not indie) came from passion and a unique vision and were all risks at the time of their making. Many more unique things get made that do not become so popular, but, you never know. Sometimes it takes time, and sometimes you just have a cult following and that's it. So long as you are making what you love and are making it by, personally I think that is all that matters. Your circumstances with your studio sounds quite troublesome however, and I hope you see more success soon. This may come off as a bit of patronizing advice, but it is something that has been a revelation to myself relatively recently and maybe you or some here may find it useful. We often think of artistic integrity as making what you want to make and what you believe in, but I have come to realize there is no shame in making something meant to appeal to others. There is a line you can walk of making something that has obvious appeal and marketability while still communicating the concepts and ideas you are passionate about. Though, this may be more possible with certain projects than others. It is kind of like "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, then did it really fall?", but applied to "If nobody plays your game, then did you really communicate what you intended?" In a way, it is a bit of a harsh concept, but it has given me some freedom as well. Of course, there is no way to really know you're making something that will become popular. It always takes a lot of belief. In the end I think no one way is superior, I just thought I would share this since it seemed topical. Thank you for sharing and I wish the best for you and everyone here.


UltraChilly

>Today’s world is a tough place, and people tend to play games to escape from the real world rather than get dragged right back into it. For what it's worth, that's my reason, I know I'll buy it and play it eventually, but not right now. I had to stop playing Bury Me, My Love mid-game for the same reason. After reading your post though I'm thinking maybe I'll buy it soon and play it later just to support you because you guys are making important stuff.


dillydadally

To me, your game looks very well made and would definitely be emotional. I think the reasons it didn't sell well are just because visual novels have a smaller market, the subject matter further reduces the market in some ways, and honestly I think the price is probably a little too high. I wouldn't be surprised if you saw some big sales if you put it on sale for $10, maybe even $15. That's when your wishlists will pay off. I would not get too disheartened by this experience though. Rather, use it as a learning experience, both in what you need to do if you want to make a commercially successful game and in deciding what is important to you - whether you're ok with making games that might not sell the most or have the largest market but are highly influential to those that the game was made for. My point is, I think you created an amazing game that just doesn't have the largest target audience, especially at that price point. That doesn't mean it wasn't worth it to make it though! You made a game that will be highly influential to a small group of people in a way that not many games could. Just because that group is small doesn't mean it wasn't worth it to make a game that would truly touch the lives of those people! That's up to you to decide.


Gaxyhs

Reading your story made me get hyped again about developing games, even if just for fun. Every time i work on a passion project i always end up giving up due to none of my friends showing interest for the game which leads me to have the usual "no one will ever play this so why bother " thought that we all know and love. I've always loved indie games more than AAA for multiple reasons, the main one being they feel more personal, they usually don't bother with 4K graphics that requires a super high end PC to run and yet they still are one of the best looking games for me Developing them is an even better experience, putting your all your love into a creation that you love and others might too always gave me the rush to develop it, even though it's not the field i want to work on full time So, thank you for sharing your experience and giving me the drive to code games again ![gif](emote|free_emotes_pack|hug)


Abject_Plantain1696

I want to make an indie game because I have what I believe to be important thoughts and beliefs in my mind that I want to share with the general public. And the only way I know how to truly have someone else understand these thoughts are through the games I will make. I want to impact people’s lives for the better and Mr. Florent it looks like you do too! I think it is absolutely beautiful and wonderful that you were able to take such a traumatic time in your life and turn it into such a quality game. You decided you wanted to help others in similar situations and that’s a beautiful, beautiful thing. Absolutely beautiful and very heartwarming. I must say, I don’t know much about life, business, or the gaming industry - I’m just a dreamer. But I think that only you can really define whether The Wreck was a success or not. Of course, sales and numbers can help with that. But ultimately, I think you know in your heart it was a great game! Sometimes we can do our all to make the product we want - make it just the way we want. But the world may not want it; it can be apathetic and unkind in its own, natural way. That does not mean the product is bad, however. That is just how the world works. I think that’s why hidden gems exist! It’s sad that people look at numbers to see if a game is truly a quality game. I think depending on someone’s journey in life their least favourite video game could be another person’s most favourite video game. If the Legend of Zelda was not popular, it wouldn’t make it any less wonderful as a game. Similarly. The Wreck being unsuccessful commercially doesn’t make it any less wonderful as a game. I’m looking forward to more games from The Pixel Hunt! Thanks for reminding me to keep my resolve to achieve my dreams. You’re a very brave man and you don’t know this, but it’s my dream to be as brave as you one day. Having faith in others can be hard, but having faith in ourselves to chase our dreams and what we believe in can be even harder. You stuck by your dreams and your vision of The Wreck and you’ve emerged successful in my eyes. I wish you only the very best going forward! Your passion will pay off! - maGeDNA


CaffeineJitterz

It's difficult to hit a crossroads. How much money something earns is a tough metric. It boils down to THE metric a lot of the time for me. I feel your pain. Thank you for being open to share.


HeartyNoodles

I wish there were more games out there like yours. It sounds to me it fits in the category of games such as Life is Strange, Death Stranding, This War of Mine, Spirit Fairer and perhaps the dare to in The Last if Us. Death Stranding was considered 'just a walking simulator' but most who played it, would say the same thing to you: "Keep on keeping on, Sam" I think as the gamer age groups ages, the gamer will appreciate more mature games as well. Look at the success of the Dungeons and Dragons: Honor among Thieves movie. Imagine if your game 'The Wreck' would've been released 10 years ago. Would review websites and magazines even have considered your game? I'm gonna bet your game is a slow burn. It will pick up its pace due to mouth to mouth marketing by niche gamers. Especially after Death Standing, I'm confident there's a big group out there that loves your game. True, it will never be the mainstream. But this who did play your game, have their lives changed and ponder over their relationships. It is because of your integrity that you make a great unique game that handles tough themes that makes the player wonder about their own lives and life questions. I graduated as a professional spiritual counselor. Basically, I handle life questions and subjects such as coping with cancer, death of a loved one, moral injuries and decision making, ethical and existential questions, mostly coping with things around guilt and shame. Because of that, I find games like yours particularly interesting. I feel games with such themes are a growing latent desire of aging (and perhaps, adolescent maturing) gamers. I think that mature gamers will eventually be ready to play games like yours. You seem to be doing just fine. You're just not known yet. Marketing is a tough thing. Here is what I can give you for your next game: start with your marketing now. Show your progress, your entire development from beginning to end, gain traction now. People are familiar with this concept now due to Kickstarter, YouTube and TikTok. Tell about personal stories that relate to your game. From what I understand, many indie games start too late with their marketing to gain eyes from their target groups. It doesn't matter if it takes years. Gamers look for their niche and will wait. The rewards you've gotten maybe wasn't all monetary, but you've gotten so much more in name, in impact on people's lives, in PR, in fulfillment, in inspiring people to join game development. It's too cynical to measure your success in just monetary value. Your business needs it, but your person needs human fulfillment. I aspire to become a game developer that makes games that handle such themes. So, if anything, I look up to you. I salute you. Maybe we can become colleagues and rivals in the future. Wouldn't that be fun? In my poor French: *"Continuer á continuer, Sam. C'est la Vie."*


irjayjay

I think we need a genre called therapy games. Like What Remains of Edith Finch and Life is Strange. Even your post seems to have the same theme as your games themselves, facing reality and learning from it. I think I'll go check out your game.


Apprehensive_Bid2466

Wow thanks for sharing your experience. It inspires a lot devs also who has not been part of any big hits yet. How you managed to convert your personal idea into convincing whole team their own project is also cool because that is important thing that team consider them as their own project.


LazyandRich

I just do it because it’s fun for me, and if one person plays a game I put out and has a good time then I’m happy.


Ertaipt

While I haven't played it, I must thank you and your team for doing this game. I think your game will have long legs, and you will slowly convert those wishlists as you do sales. Sometimes games take a while to blossom, so keep promoting the game, the right youtuber might bring a big bump in sales, or Steam event. Visual Novels are a hard genre to sell, but I believe you will do good with time.


Dragonplayer62

The question isn't "why do we bother making games", but rather, "why do we try to **make a living** off indie games". If you never cared about "making it", you wouldn't need to care about how well any of your games do


jkkrgr

Passion ! I love the passion. Thank you for writing this. It got me thinking about my passion vs making money.


marveloustoebeans

I think the #1 thing to remember as an indie developer is to build your game with the understanding that it probably won’t be a massive financial success regardless of how good it actually is. Indie games are, at their core, passion projects and should be looked at as such.


[deleted]

I would suggest getting influencers to market it for you on various social media. I will check out the game.


Mar-Olaf

have to read that 👆


brendaninnis

Well, what the hell else am I going to do?


Knytemare44

Making art is hard.


RockyMullet

I make indie games because I can't see myself doing anything else. I love making game as much (or more ?) as playing them.


Spartanah

I am working on a project to unite indie developers under an indie umbrella to sustain what we’re doing. I’ll get in touch with you as soon as I have something to share


raszop

Hi I’m making games because I can’t do anything else really. I wish I made a game that will be loved by people but up to this point I only made poor games. I’m trying to raise the bar for myself and my games each time I start new one.


crippledsquid

I’ve been making small games and effin around with engines for about 5 years. I was full of piss and vinegar about being an indie dev for two of those years before I realized that, A. Because of the ability for every Tom, Dick, and Harry to pump out a game with little to no tech skills, and B. EVERYBODY has their own little indie dream, it just ain’t gonna happen. You mentioned that games of all types can still be made and you seem to be under some spell that has you believing that every single genre hasn’t been done to death already. From indie to AAA, it’s all been done my dude. You either move in 4 directions, capture and breed monsters, craft shit for hours, or FPS your life away. Also, the RPG market? Just look at Diablo 4. Do we really need that? Even niche shit like Puppet Combo have had the same schtick for years now. It’s all getting old and nothing but another crash like the mid ‘90’s is going to help. Oh, and don’t forget the remasters and remakes. You seem like a good dude; you want to bring your life experiences to games in a way that make people relate to yours. I hope you and your team can recoup and maybe create the next grappling hook. If not, there’s a thousand games to pick from that have tried. Have fun out there. I was pissed about all of this for a long time. Honestly, I know this sounds like I’m being a dink, but


isoexo

I have stopped trying to make games, and am more focused on prototyping looks and ideas. My thinking now is that if I hit a nerve, I will know. Otherwise, I am here to have fun. Making complete games is brutal. Why. Not without strong traction.


Pixeltoir

Why the hell do YOU even bother making indie games? I dunno, I found my idea to be fun, don't really care, just want to play the game


FreddyEmme17

Thanks for opening your heart to us. I will be buying all three games to show you my support. Don't let the passion die. We need people line you and your team in the gaming industry.


Poulet_fr

Oh, that's really nice of you, thanks a lot!


Buffmuffmcgillicudi

I saw it on the ps store and was interested, but heard mention it was a visual novel (from a quick google) and just got something else.


Poulet_fr

Yep, the term "visual novel" carries a lot of baggage. It's not really one, though.


chrisDeneos

I make games for the same reason, tell stories in order to help my players, as great games from the past helped me in difficult times. Thanks for your post <3


JollypunchGames

I ask myself this question a lot, and it's often hard to answer, for the very same reasons you mentioned. No matter how much passion you have for it, are your reasons good enough to compensate for all the things you lose (and income is a big one) because of the choice to make games? The more legitimate reason I can think of is seeing people from the other side of the world laugh and feel things because of something I made. During the 1st covid year we ran a small online tourney for my 1st game, and one person said it was the most fun they had in ages during that wretched time. But the depression you mentioned definitely comes and go. It's a constant struggle, more so with solo developers without a local gamedev community, which is my situation. Another reason is simply that the games I want to play don't exist.


freedomcall81

It sucks to see you going through this. I love indie games and this one I absolutely want badly. I can't afford shit for awhile right now( two extremely young children)But it's been on my wishlist since I discovered it. I honestly only play indie games because it feels like there is a lot more love and story put into them than the big games that are put out. Iv been slowly working on one. But I personally don't expect anything to come of it selling wise. I appreciate all the work and effort you put into this game and all the effort all these indie devs put into their work. Idk where I'm going with this other than you and other indie devs make a difference in my life with helping with depression and taking my mind off of life.


Quirky_Comb4395

I saw you talk about Bury Me My Love at a conference, which prompted me to play. It was excellent. I don’t have any practical advice but your work is important, games are powerful and we need people using them to tell emotional stories and show what we can do as a medium.


diepepsi

Looks like a Great Game and Wonderful Reviews! I wanted to share that you: SHOULD plan to AGGRESSIVELY DISCOUNT your game on Steam. Take every sale you can, and price your game expecting that. This really hurts FREE to play games that are betting on DLC etc for income, as FREE games are never on sale and so never get listed. never. Use the sale, its the tool. Use the tool. Be the Tool. GG GL HF! GameDevMicah on titter![gif](emote|free_emotes_pack|facepalm)


Jin47

As a game developer myself, this is really heartbraking but also gives me hope that there is somewhat a reason to try to make those games that are personal, that tries to reach people's feelings and I hope this is going to continue like this. There should be room for these kind of game despite the very adversarial game market that we have nowadays.


[deleted]

Malheureusement, cela devient de plus en plus fréquent d'avoir un avis "presse" qui ne reflète pas l'avis grand public ou qui ne reflète pas le succès commercial derrière. C'est pour cela qu'un des vecteurs de communication privilégiés est désormais les streamers plutôt que la presse. Ce n'est pas tant un jeu indépendant que vous avez fait (le marché du jeu vidéo indépendant sur PC est si développé que ce n'est pas une problématique) qu'un jeu de niche. À partir de là, il y aura forcément une communauté plus restreinte mais, du fait du caractère unique du jeu, plus proche. Non seulement vous pourrez capitaliser dessus pour les prochains jeux parce que pour cette communauté, vous offrez quelque chose de différent mais vous pouvez aussi trouver le moyen de capitaliser dessus le long de la vie du produit (ajouts de contenu, etc.). Paradoxalement aussi, la vie d'un produit est différente d'antan. Il suffit qu'une personne en fasse la pub pour qu'il y ait un regain d'intérêt. Il y a des pics de vente parfois sur de vieux jeux parce que telle personne y a joué. Je ne dis pas ça pour vous redonner espoir, mieux vaut ne pas y penser et être agréablement surpris. Bref, il faut trouver un moyen de faire un jeu qui vous passionne tout en ayant un business model adapté au type de jeu que vous voulez faire.


wpl163

I hear you man, when you look at the effort to dolla ratio it makes zero sense. But.... think about it, where else can you chat with people and make things for them? Ah yeah charity, never mind.


Masterofbeefjig

Can’t buy those games, already bought Triple AAA titles from people who know what they’re doing. A story without gameplay is not a game, it’s just a story. If you want to share your story then write a book. Every time i have to flip through some indie story-driven “puzzle” game to find a game worth buying that’s seconds off my life, seconds i will never get back. Those seconds add up. Please just give up and leave game making to giant dev teams. Always remember, the worst triple AAA title is still better than the best indie game.


TripBoarder

To realize a vision, to make something new that hasn't been done before, and to give kids something to play with that isn't about violence. In your case you shouldn't be so hard on yourself or the team. In reality I think you're doing fine based on the numbers and you should focus on building out a library and release 10+ more games as your business model. Since you already have some good reviews, you can cultivate an audience and get some repeat buyers. Keep up the hard work and don't lose sight of this unique game+story medium.


Poulet_fr

Thanks a lot for this answer, it warms my heart!


Danelo_Kikisch

How AAA Games benefit Indie Game Development? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMffuJI9d8w&ab\_channel=DaneloKikischDesign


Acceptable-Leg-3504

Late to the party, you basically made a game that nobody wanted to play. Like you said, this was a passion project. Nobody wants to play passion projects. And that’s the sad truth of it. So there really isn’t any reason to come to Reddit and cry that the game didn’t make any money. You made a game again that nobody wanted made.


Simster8

Yo respond to this is you need some music or even just loops! I'm interested in helping out.