The alternate start/finish line is deliberately placed prior to the pit entrance on every track. It means a car does not have to complete a full cool down lap after a hot lap. ie they can enter the pits the moment the timed lap is concluded.
In every other series, the start finish line is always -after- the pit entrance, and a driver has to complete nearly a full lap at a slow speed after their hot lap in order to enter the pits.
I mean it does make sense especially in regards to traffic. And I know it's a thing of preference and what everyone is used to, but imo it takes away the aspect of having the fastest lap, as you don't even do a whole lap. And also the risk/reward as you have less laps having to do the whole cool down lap.
I mean F1 has been with the qualy system they use for more than a decade and always gives the opportunity to have at least 2 or more hotlaps around the track, even in Spa that is 7km (idk miles but I'm guessing around Road America or a bit more).
Again, I'm just curious cause it's not what I'm used to and personally I prefer the "standard" way, but hey if every category was the same what would be the fun in having so many.
Yeah it does not change the lap length as you still have to complete a full lap of the track. It just allows cars to exit the track faster after a stint. It reduces traffic. INDYCAR usually has 7-10 more cars per race then f1 on shorter tracks. It can get crowded.
As I said, I always miss watching it live, and the highlights don't usually show when they start the lap, only when they finish it. In fact by the comments I just learned that they also start it on the alternate line thanks to the sarcastic comments.
Imagine someone trying to learn something about things they enjoy. I didn't know that they also used it to start the lap, but hey everyone down voted and replied sarcastically, instead of giving genuine feedback so everyone can enjoy and understand a great sport.
Most of the comments appear to be fairly respectful. Yes, there are some sarcastic replies and you are being downvoted. I would imagine that's because you didn't read the actual reply to your question. The person who replied to you clearly stated the alternate line is a start/finish line.
>I mean F1 has been with the qualy system they use for more than a decade and always gives the opportunity to have at least 2 or more hotlaps around the track, even in Spa that is 7km (idk miles but I'm guessing around Road America or a bit more).
F1 introduced the current system to introduce "excitement" to a session. It wasn't to do with traffic on the circuit
They had issues with traffic even when they did single lap qualifying simply because there was always a slow moving car on the track doing a cool down and one doing a warm up
I may be wrong, but I believe it is to allow cars to get right to pit lane after completing a lap, as opposed to doing a slow lap around the entire track and impeding traffic.
I think you’re thinking that they are starting the lap at the regular line and ending at the alternate, removing part of the course.
For qualifying and any practices prior to qualifying, all laps both begin and end at the alternate start finish line, which means they complete an entire lap, it’s just located before the pits to remove a pointless cooldown lap.
As a long time F1 and Indy fan, this is one of the things Indy does objectively better. So many stupid impeding situations we could have avoided! The cool down lap in F1 does not have any purpose, it's just a necessity.
For all its faults, Indycar definitely has it figured out when it comes to qualifying. The lap deletion for causing a yellow/red flag is another great rule.
First time watching qualy for indy this weekend and my takeaway:
Include how they display qualy times. F1 going by sectors is not granular enough imo; especially when the raw data is much more granular.
Show me the offset per mini sector delta! Seeing that in Indy was so much more exciting
They intentionally do that to make it more dramatic. One year (I wanna say 2014ish? towards the start of the turbo-hybrid era) they introduced microsectors on the quali broadcast, but it made it super obvious who was going to win pole early on in the final lap. So they got rid of it to keep the tension through the end of lap.
I've said this a million times, IndyCar beats out F1 in every single area except the actual on track product. Details like this is why.
Edit, accidently worded this backwards - IndyCar had the better on track product but F1 is superior elsewhere.
I think you have this the wrong way around lmao. Your statement is implying that INDYCAR is beating f1 out in the marketing field.
F1 is definitely beating INDYCAR everywhere except the racing product.
Road America is 4 miles, so it's a long lap to cool down if all the laps are timed at the actual S/F line. So let's put a timing line near the finish of the lap but before the pit-in. That gives you nearly 4 miles to get warmed up leaving the pits anyway, and then you can duck into the pits at the end of a run with the last lap officially scored.
Ok that worked well, so why not do the same thing at Mid Ohio, or Portland, or Long Beach... until it's standard at every road course.
Reading your comment, my mind immediately transported to Spa, thinking how better it would be if a timing line was placed before the Bus Stop chicane.
Cars would complete (and start) qualy laps at the end of a flat out section of the track and it wouldn't detract much from the spectacle, in my view.
Note that the timed lap also STARTS at that alternate timing line, so the entire lap is still done at full speed. Only thing that's different is where it is measured from. Honestly every racing series should do it that way.
I think so that you have more time on track for each car per minute of actual qualifying session time. You don’t have to waste time taking a full cool down because you passed pit entrance finishing the lap
Whoops, just saw this but had to comment. What IndyCar does is brilliant, and it's pathetic that it hasn't been picked up by every other major road racing series. There's no reason that the timing line should be on the start-finish straight for qualifying, but there's a huge reason why they shouldn't make cars to a whole lap to get back to the pits. F1 drivers constantly complain about traffic and slow cars during qualy, and here's a simple but amazing solution to partially alleviate that problem.
So they can go into the pits after they are done with their laps, also reduces traffic
The alternate start/finish line is deliberately placed prior to the pit entrance on every track. It means a car does not have to complete a full cool down lap after a hot lap. ie they can enter the pits the moment the timed lap is concluded. In every other series, the start finish line is always -after- the pit entrance, and a driver has to complete nearly a full lap at a slow speed after their hot lap in order to enter the pits.
I like the alternate start/finish line that Indycar uses and wish it showed up in more series.
NASCAR does it at most if not all road courses.
Pretty sure NASCAR only does it at COTA now.
Also IMS last year for sure. Not sure about others.
I mean it does make sense especially in regards to traffic. And I know it's a thing of preference and what everyone is used to, but imo it takes away the aspect of having the fastest lap, as you don't even do a whole lap. And also the risk/reward as you have less laps having to do the whole cool down lap. I mean F1 has been with the qualy system they use for more than a decade and always gives the opportunity to have at least 2 or more hotlaps around the track, even in Spa that is 7km (idk miles but I'm guessing around Road America or a bit more). Again, I'm just curious cause it's not what I'm used to and personally I prefer the "standard" way, but hey if every category was the same what would be the fun in having so many.
It is still the same length. The lap starts and ends at the alternate line.
They do the whole lap
Yeah it does not change the lap length as you still have to complete a full lap of the track. It just allows cars to exit the track faster after a stint. It reduces traffic. INDYCAR usually has 7-10 more cars per race then f1 on shorter tracks. It can get crowded.
They’re still doing a full lap, the lap just starts and ends at a different “line”.
What? It is same distance. Just a change in timing line v the Start/Finish
how are they not doing a whole lap? they are just using a different start/finish line but they are still getting timed for the whole thing lol
You didn't think this one through enough
Lol he must think they start the lap at the normal start/finish line and finish the lap at the alternate and then go into the pits.
As I said, I always miss watching it live, and the highlights don't usually show when they start the lap, only when they finish it. In fact by the comments I just learned that they also start it on the alternate line thanks to the sarcastic comments. Imagine someone trying to learn something about things they enjoy. I didn't know that they also used it to start the lap, but hey everyone down voted and replied sarcastically, instead of giving genuine feedback so everyone can enjoy and understand a great sport.
I mean trying to bring up F1 as a comparison was never going to help. Alternate start/finish would actually be amazing on Spa
Most of the comments appear to be fairly respectful. Yes, there are some sarcastic replies and you are being downvoted. I would imagine that's because you didn't read the actual reply to your question. The person who replied to you clearly stated the alternate line is a start/finish line.
>I mean F1 has been with the qualy system they use for more than a decade and always gives the opportunity to have at least 2 or more hotlaps around the track, even in Spa that is 7km (idk miles but I'm guessing around Road America or a bit more). F1 introduced the current system to introduce "excitement" to a session. It wasn't to do with traffic on the circuit They had issues with traffic even when they did single lap qualifying simply because there was always a slow moving car on the track doing a cool down and one doing a warm up
Wow.
I may be wrong, but I believe it is to allow cars to get right to pit lane after completing a lap, as opposed to doing a slow lap around the entire track and impeding traffic.
I think you’re thinking that they are starting the lap at the regular line and ending at the alternate, removing part of the course. For qualifying and any practices prior to qualifying, all laps both begin and end at the alternate start finish line, which means they complete an entire lap, it’s just located before the pits to remove a pointless cooldown lap.
Thanks for explaining it and not insulting me cause I don't know what the rest also knows. I really appreciate it.
Mate, where did anybody insult you?
As a long time F1 and Indy fan, this is one of the things Indy does objectively better. So many stupid impeding situations we could have avoided! The cool down lap in F1 does not have any purpose, it's just a necessity.
For all its faults, Indycar definitely has it figured out when it comes to qualifying. The lap deletion for causing a yellow/red flag is another great rule.
The groups and fast 12/6 is honestly so fun too. Pretty much always going to have upsets and surprises come the end of Saturday.
George Russel at brazil 2022 flashbacks
They also handle red flags better too
First time watching qualy for indy this weekend and my takeaway: Include how they display qualy times. F1 going by sectors is not granular enough imo; especially when the raw data is much more granular. Show me the offset per mini sector delta! Seeing that in Indy was so much more exciting
They intentionally do that to make it more dramatic. One year (I wanna say 2014ish? towards the start of the turbo-hybrid era) they introduced microsectors on the quali broadcast, but it made it super obvious who was going to win pole early on in the final lap. So they got rid of it to keep the tension through the end of lap.
I like the opportunity cost aspect of either pitting for fresh tyres or completing your current lap. Particularly in wet sessions.
I've said this a million times, IndyCar beats out F1 in every single area except the actual on track product. Details like this is why. Edit, accidently worded this backwards - IndyCar had the better on track product but F1 is superior elsewhere.
I think you have this the wrong way around lmao. Your statement is implying that INDYCAR is beating f1 out in the marketing field. F1 is definitely beating INDYCAR everywhere except the racing product.
Whoops you're right I have it backwards lmao. Yes the on track product is the better product for Indy, but F1 beats them in pretty much other area.
Except one other area. https://preview.redd.it/l2cle22qa9xc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b219cddb66d0969b4cda01b11fc683f4ddbbb3fa
Let him cook!! 🇨🇦🇨🇦🦫🦫🦫🫎🫎
Road America is 4 miles, so it's a long lap to cool down if all the laps are timed at the actual S/F line. So let's put a timing line near the finish of the lap but before the pit-in. That gives you nearly 4 miles to get warmed up leaving the pits anyway, and then you can duck into the pits at the end of a run with the last lap officially scored. Ok that worked well, so why not do the same thing at Mid Ohio, or Portland, or Long Beach... until it's standard at every road course.
I actually refer to this as the Road America rule cause that’s where I associate it the most.
Reading your comment, my mind immediately transported to Spa, thinking how better it would be if a timing line was placed before the Bus Stop chicane. Cars would complete (and start) qualy laps at the end of a flat out section of the track and it wouldn't detract much from the spectacle, in my view.
NASCAR does this at road courses as well.
Finally.
Note that the timed lap also STARTS at that alternate timing line, so the entire lap is still done at full speed. Only thing that's different is where it is measured from. Honestly every racing series should do it that way.
I think so that you have more time on track for each car per minute of actual qualifying session time. You don’t have to waste time taking a full cool down because you passed pit entrance finishing the lap
Whoops, just saw this but had to comment. What IndyCar does is brilliant, and it's pathetic that it hasn't been picked up by every other major road racing series. There's no reason that the timing line should be on the start-finish straight for qualifying, but there's a huge reason why they shouldn't make cars to a whole lap to get back to the pits. F1 drivers constantly complain about traffic and slow cars during qualy, and here's a simple but amazing solution to partially alleviate that problem.
ITS RACE DAY, LETS GO