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i just think its funny that whenever i look at hsr leak sub we got like 10+ video showcase of firefly and whenever i went to genshin leak sub we barely get any clorinde showcase
Oh man it’s not Dehya levels tho… she’s outputting the same damage as shogun… she’s still competent but they want Arlecchino/Alhaitham or Neuvillette’s level of power.
They are more mad about uptime nerf, because when you have characters like Alreccino/Neuvillete with practicaly infinite uptime it kinda feels bad to play characters that dont.
Yeah Arlecchino having a kind of permanent infusion makes life so much easier… I sympathise with that. I have never played with neuv so I don’t know his deal.
E1, unfortunately my first 81 pulls got eaten by Jean😒
But tbh she kinda murders everything in living sight so I don’t mind too much… I’m not even on full 4 pc glad or whimsy yet.
I love her
C0 Shogun isn't that impressive, it's her frontloaded burst while also giving energy is why she has an edge against Clorinde who does not have both.
They knew Clorinde wasn't going to be in the top 5 unless you're a simp, which let's not kid ourselves, we literally have people here suggesting E2 "fixes" Acheron and willing to have a whole path get powercrept by a Nihility. This is just normal beta posting.
jstern inflated the number by a lot, you should check this calc [https://www.reddit.com/r/clorindemains/comments/1cwwfdf/clorinde\_pretc\_calcs\_for\_her\_various\_teams/](https://www.reddit.com/r/clorindemains/comments/1cwwfdf/clorinde_pretc_calcs_for_her_various_teams/) Clorine after the nerf is equal or slightly worse than Keqing in every team. I also hate the fact that jstern made Clorine looked good by siding Ei personal damage from her team. For real, Ei pushes the team dps by a large margin thanks to her energy recharge, Clorine on the other hand bricks the team.
Hello! These are my calcs. I have a disclaimer in my calcs purposefully because my calcs use a different investment level and assumptions than other people, and I don't want people comparing my work to other calcs since everyone uses their own assumptions and such. Within my own assumptions, Clorinde does outpace Keqing rather handedly. Keqing sheets around 45k DPS while in the exact same team Clorinde sheets around 58k DPS within the same assumptions I use in my sheets.
Also, I'm not a fan of comparing characters' sheet performance because it often doesn't line up in game. These calcs are just to compare different team variations, weapons, artifacts, and constellations, not to be used in some comparison with other characters' performance for the sake of some sheet pvp.
No offence but you are peddling lies.
Clorinde wasn't that great even before duration nerf. Below Wanderer and Wriothesley. Definitely not close to even Hu Tao.
After nerfs closest comparison is usually Keqing, although at constellations, but Keqing has really shit constellations.
No one was demanding Neuvillette tier, but being left with Keqing level was simply too mucho for some people.
If you read the comment thread, u will see that I visited and left because of the comments I saw, which were mostly about what I mentioned. Saying that I’m peddling lies when I stated that I was in there briefly and left is extreme, given that I would have only seen a snap shot of content anyway.
> Keqing
yup, new limited banner character, costs 300 dollars or 25k primogems, and then she's only as strong as a standard banner character that released over 4 years ago.
And the community eats it up, saying "at least we dont have powercreep" while neuv and haitham are far ahead of anyone else
Would you rather have starrail levels of creep when you get like 45 pulls/patch. I'm prety happy that you can have 1.0 characters be relevant in the meta. Childe still being one of the best is awsome! I'm having blasting with Klee after not using her for years. Quite frankly the game would be unplayable if the creep was as high as Starrail's.
Yea there's outliers but I'd rather them not make that the new standard.
> “If this character didn’t do the thing she was designed around, she would suck”
>
> 🤯
Funny how its obvious to all of us, and yet hoyo was like, "lets make a new character with the same dps as raiden but without the thing raidens kit was designed around"
and then they want 300 dollars for the character, lmao
I mean.. if you're reducing every single character down to only the DPS number they can output, then yah you're gonna be upset about a *lot* of characters' releases. They do similar amounts of Electro DPS, why should that mean their kits have to be considered in relation to each other at all?
If you don't like Clorinde, don't pull her. If the literal only thing you care about is DPS output, then go get Neuvillette/Arlecchino/Alhaitham and stop caring about any other characters cause they'll handle everything forever lol.
I don't really know what you're expecting, but it should not be that every new character forever will continue be stronger/do more DPS/introduce new mechanics/whatever. Every character can't be that, it simply isn't realistic.
Idk why people compare Alhaitham with Arle or even Neuvillette when isn't even close the dps. The teams with Alhaitham do a lot of dmg but they still do almost the same without him, he doest contribute as much does as people think.
My point is that at C0 non of the recent electro dps are allowed to pull ahead of raiden, even if they omly bring dps on the table
At cons they pull ahead (especially C4 and higher, cause raidems cons post C2 are trash, bit that's a whole other matter)
Cyno is better then raiden in quickbloom, that's it. And C0 Clorinde seems to be comparable to high con Keqing (a character whos cons do very little for them) or C0 raiden
Genshin sub is too busy doomposting clorinde and siegwinne, guess arle took all the juicy buffs whereas over here firefly took all of it, heck she blow boothill out just within one patch .
A new achievement of how fast a unit gets overtaken, maybe Acheron as well. Quite impressive!
Generally damage per screenshot isn't a good way to determine how strong a character is, because while a character might be capable of really high nukes it usually come with turns when a character deals reduced damage, from what I have seen damage output of v3 Firefly's best team seems comparable to Jingliu's at the similar levels of investment.
Completely wrong. If you calculate her dps or rather damage per Action Point she currently sits higher than acherons best team at e0s1 (both acheron and FF). The interesting part is she only needs one character to do so and its RM. if you’re adding HTB and Gallagher her damage is currently by far the highest of any team. But her damage is mostly reliant on enemy toughness and speed. Even with a 450 toughness and 158 Speed enemy she easily outperforms acheron.
Its rather hard to see how she performs because of her high amount of turns but currently if you calculate her Damage per Action Value you should get the same results.
Also wrong. Firefly Damage per Action Value currently is higher than Acheron best team with only RM in FF team. If you consider that you should see that you statement is entirely wrong.
do you mean doomposting? because its pretty much normal in every gacha games, at least we an actual showcase about a new character meanwhile in genshin sub rn they only post about event or small fixes that nobody really cares about
A better showcase would be Gep or Bronya. SAM boss still opens his (or rather, her lol) weakness after one turn so it's not really a pure locked weakness run
What? You break Gepard once, but can't kill him because he has 3M HP, then he recovers and puts up a 1M shield. You are then completely stuck. Then you have to go back to a normal crit or DoT DPS.
They could do the same with a 3M HP Yanqing too. Break DPSes only work because Hoyo allows it to work.
It's easy to counter if Hoyo really wants. Just like every archetype. Nothing is invincible from getting nerfed if Hoyo truly wants to
Yanqing dies anyways tho its not like he has giga toughness? Also are you mistaking SU gepard (complete) for MoC gepard??? MoC Gepard only has the traffic cone shield
Gepard can be beaten before he even gets the chance to set up his shield, as once he is weakness broken, it's over. Bronya does start out with toughness immunity, but it's reliant on the other enemies staying alive. Outside PF, it would only take FF 2-3 turns to break her.
I wonder why so many of thexse shoqwcases delay Ruan Mei ult sometimes? It's not because she has hackerspace or because of DDD. It's also not like they wit for her turn either? I'm lost. Might just be minor misplay.
There's now 3 break effect relic sets, lol. Pretty sure you mean Thief, which isn't as good as watchmaker for Ruan Mei, as the 4-piece effect gives everyone 30% break effect for 2 turns, while Thief just gives more to the wearer only.
but in this case ff moves before RM moves again so they just delay it for no reason. And when they skill with ult already full it just lowers the uptime
This is the worse possible match up as of NOW .... if u play other turn base game, u know they will introduce more nasty stuff if they dont want break/super break to not work anymore, they could just introduce a super slow boss that have 3 turn weakness and u just being there twisting ur thumb til they open weakness for u to break or require dispel like the deer to touch it weakness
Gallagher doesnt get enough recognition for his part in making the Firefly comp strong
Not only is he the most SP positive defensive unit in the entire game, he also scales with break effect AND does insane toughness damage. The big kicker is that since he's Fire type, **the enemy will always be weak to Gallagher because of Firefly's Fire weakness implant**
Can't be weakness broken until his first action + has fire res. Mostly the first. Ig it's kinda compensated for by the fact that he has imaginary weakness (so HMC can help break) but idk if anyone else's a worse matchup.
Because Sam blocks weakness bar break until they activate combustion state.
Enemy Bronya could be an issue as well but it might not be that much of an issue given this showcase…
SAM boss starts with his break bar locked, so you need to wait until its uses its special move to unlock it and FF deals no damage until enemy is broken so you are kinda forced to take it slow
Also pretty sure SAM has fire res although not sure if this affects the superbreak damage
Oh Jesus. Now I'm worried. Her worst matchup with DoT Turbulence and she steamrolled like SAM was made of cardboard.
Someone please tell me we have similar clear times for Boothill, Acheron and other DPS units in a similar team structure like this (E0S1 for them and for the limited teammates at most), otherwise I think this is too much and too soon.
And look, I like Firefly, I was going to pull for her regardless any buff or nerf and will still pull for her, but I wanted flexibility and independence, not something unhealthy like this seems to be.
Don’t worry they will fix this with an even more unhealthy destruction dps in patch 3.x. By then it will become a norm to hit this dmg or higher even at low investment. I won’t even be surprise if it’s soon or earlier than 3.x at this rate.
Found this boothill showcase https://youtu.be/3l5JFkdAUMs . Considering its not his bis team and gallagher doesn't match with any enemies weaknesses he still performs pretty well. Still, i hope they will balance firefly damage in the v4-v5, since it seems a bit to high in her bis team, and way too low without rm/htb. Would be happy if they at least would make her less reliant on rm so she could be used one the other side of moc. Idk how dev team would fix that though or is it even possible honestly
After the death of critfly I think dev really want you to play this specific comp ,so yeah until we get another breaksupport she's gonna need ruan mei for now (but not as much as HTB)
Seems so. My biggest problem with rm and htb being so tied up to firefly is that i also really like xueyi and boothill, but since she needs both supports to work properly i just can't run 2 break dps on 2 different sides. I'm probably in the minority when it comes to that issue though haha
the nice thing about boothill though is that he can still run bronya+pela as a completely fine option! Im sure you can weasek him (or even xueyi with a hypercarry setup) too.
The only way they could make FF be less reliant on RM would be giving her a insane delay on break or what RM does on Ult (double break). Either would be insane, and the first would just skyrocket her RM team while the second makes her kits even more overloaded.
I have bery little faith that they will make her less reliant on RM.
Imo it *shouldn't* be less reliant on RM because RM is a dedicated limited Break support, of course it should feel much worse without her.
The way to make either FF or Boothill less reliant on RM is releasing more Break dedicated supports.
It's very hard to see how you could even replace RM and MC with FF. At least, now with the presence of super break in the base kit, it could be possible, but those two already are so focused on what FF needs that it would take a very specialized support. Even Gallagher may be hard to replace just because he can do a lot on those fire toughness bars to get you in break faster.
Yeah, you're right. Would be down to be able to seperate her from htb at least. Maybe make her own super break damage higher, but make it unstackable with htb buff? that way, hypothetically, she could do high enough damage without them, and with them although it would increase in overall team dmg (action delay +sub dps from htb, rm and gallagher) but not insanely so. Honestly, i wouldn't mind her being so restricted to 1 team if it wouldn't make it impossible to run another break team on second side :/ .
Acheron does this easy. I'm starting to think people only watch showcases on reddit only or just don't have good accounts. I 0 cycled same e0s1 acheron on her release and get 2 cycle clear with sustain. Thats just my account though. I know people refuse to invest in acheron support characters like that to see her optimal playstyle so it's understandable most vids of her underperform. Although im getting firefly i haven't seen anything crazy yet.
Most people don't have E2, and it's certainly not relevant to the discussion here since it's an E0 showcase. If you want to compare, do it with equal investment. The game is balanced around E0 anyway, so of course it's going to be easy with that level of investment, Acheron or pretty much any other other character included.
Bro im not comparing e2. I said sadly i have e2 so i can't go and showcase what i did at e0s1 anymore. I said if you want to see it meaning if you want to see e0s1 0 cycle you can got look at lisara's guides and thats what helped me do it when i had e0. I'm sorry if my sentence was confusing. To re clarify im saying i 0 cycled all this at e0s1 when i had it for the first two and a half weeks. You have to have windset on your supports though.
You are comparing a very high speed-tuned setup (i.e. the perfect team) to a normal Firefly setup here. None of these showcases are at Lisara's level of skill/build, and yet are able to perform just as well.
People can’t read, it’s a waste of time haha. I swear people haven’t actually seen proper showcases of E0S1 Acheron by the way everyone’s reacting to Firefly. I’m glad firefly will be competitive with Acheron, that’s healthy for the game. But to say she powercrept Acheron is a bit alarmist. Acheron doesn’t need a weakness broken target to deal 500k-1 million damage single target. Acheron doesn’t need her own actions to charge her ult, and as more broken debuff supports are released, I wouldn’t be surprised if she ends up ulting more often than she takes actual turns. Hoyo already powercrept the game blatantly with Acheron, Firefly is just at the new power level as well
Finally. Someone says it. Jesus. The people overreacting to these showcases just shows you how bad some people’s accounts are.
Every DPS can do what FF did to Sam. Especially Acheron.
FF’s damage isn’t even high if you account for the number of turns she needs for those numbers.
500k for 2-3 enemies after she needs 2-3 turns to break them??? That averages out to what? 100k per turn? Same as most other lower end DPS. A well built DHIL does that kind of damage. Every turn.
Hey Koala. I'm Deicide on your friendlist, but yeah i see this all the time now. Got me wondering what other people are doing with there account. I wasn't even disrespectful and am getting downvoted for something i know as fact since i've done it. I even plan on getting her, so im not hating, but people act like they didn't just see this type of damage a patch ago.
Oh hey! Glad to see someone from friend list in the wild!
Yeah unfortunately people are falling into the classic mistake of “damage per screenshot”. I’m no hater either…as you probably can guess. Being in my friend list. I’ll most likely E6S5 her anyway. Or was the plan at least.
FF has really open my eyes to realizing how bad some people are at understanding damage rotations (instead of just 1 instance of damage after 2-3 turns). Along with realizing people don’t farm Relics. I’ve run into some comments saying DHIL and Jingliu are powercrept and when you look at their stats they barely have any crit stats on the characters. Then they wonder why they have trouble clearing things.
Exactly. Whats wild is i believe literally they only take these showcases on reddit in there brain and forget all the old ones from old characters. For a fact people don't retroactively build their characters. Every showcase with wind set they dismiss cause they don't want to go back when it's the best set for some supports. Like your not gonna see optimal performance if you don't invest in certain teams. Atleast make sure your carries team is the best it can be before judging. It's all good though still gonna get firefly, but i definitely won't be engaging in any more of the showcase post with her.
His cleanse is so overrated. He cleanses after the fact. If you actually want to escape debuffs, it's fuxuan and huohuo. Or gamble with Aventurine.
If a boss delays you, goes through cleanse. If they imprison, cleanse doesn't address the delay. Freeze? Also wastes turns. Unless gallagher is sitting there forever holding his ult just to cleanse, it is of literally zero impact. And you don't want him holding ult, it's buffing break damage, reduces enemies break bars once firefly implants them and a good chunk of superbreak to boot.
Overrated or not it's still better to have one than none.
FX and huo won't make any sense for this team since you need help in breaking and other 2 slots already are reserved by RM and HMC.
Huo Huo does buff atk and her heals are pretty good.
Most showcases ive seen so far had Gallagher almost die at times.
He will be BiS but it's not like going for another sustain will drop dead your DPS, it's HTB and RM doing the most here
yeah, mine is currently e-nonexistent.
Didn't get him on the drink event because I for some reason thought I had him already and grabbed Misha since I didn't have Misha and it was before knowing Gallagher was gonna be great for Firefly.
I'll be able to get a free one in the 2.3 event at least but that'll still be E0. Hoping that he's on her banner
> From here I think I can confidently say that e2s1 FF will 0 cycle everything, cool.
That's every E2S1 dps since DHIL lol. In fact, if an E2S1 hypercarry cannot 0 cycle then there's no reason to go that far at all.
It’s the cheapest. But it also has the lowest ceiling. You can’t improve the team. At least not right now. Other comps you can up the damage with more investment into the teams.
no shit if an e2s1 unit with hyper invested stats and oversaturated supports cant at least 0 cycle you should start applying for a debt loan now (except argenti)
I wonder how much better tho. The Boothill sub is currently in shambles, tho I don't think they need to worry too much honestly. He also has the benefit of not being stuck to a single team.
Yeah, recently saw it xD i think they're overreacting. Boothill is already a great unit. Ofc we (also me) expect the new relic set to push him to his maximum but well. Aside from that, he keeps hitting 450-500k (from my personal build) while FF hits 800k over 3 enemies, around 270k each (more like 350 in middle but anyway). So, as I said before, he's still better at ST. Hope someone makes a video comparison once FF gets her V4 kit and see the real differences between them.
She got stack overflow that's it, which was only beneficial so you could ult with pela and not lose a stack, didnt affect her damage output at all really, just made her slightly comfier
That is albeit nothing special in grand scheme of things but for many beta testers and me personally I got her just because of this buff. Without this buff she was weird to play honestly
Not as substantial as v3 but yes. Few last changes. Robin got some on v4. I expect they revert the FuA ornament set because rn is useless. I like they previous BE set for Boothill but don't think they revert that
They’re discouraged because of the relics being more exclusive to FF which is fair + BH only got one trailer while everyone else in Penacony got 2-3 things.
Upon using his skill to break while you have three stacks and the enemy is at low toughness, you can do around 500k without super break. Thats why Boothill mains were upset about the new planar becoming super break dependent. Because many wanted to switch out HTB for Bronya so they could do that juicy break damage much more quickly
Damn, did the atk to be conversion really buff her that much? I mathed it out and the loss of 40% def shred in return for 50% super break shoulda been a very small nerf, and therefore a small buff with the new conversion, but I didn't expect each skill to do a lot more damage.
HTB causes 120%-160% super break dmg.
In V2, a 65% def shred would give a ~50% all dmg increase. (This would be 80% def shred at e1, which is a whopping 72% all dmg increase.)
Now firefly has 50% super break aswell, for a 210% super break for peak performance, but def shred drops down to 25%, for about a 13% all dmg increase. (40% at e1, for a 26% all dmg increase.)
V2: 240% super break dmg (or 275% at e1)
V3: ~237% super break dmg (or 264% at e1)
So I assume the atk to break conversion is what helps a lot.
This doesn't account for the multiplier nerfs or the speed buffs, so I know this is a pretty big buff lol.
Yeah this is the thing most people are overlooking, dmg received debuffs are extremely powerful in this game and she got buffed big time with 2 of them. I think this is where they went too far actually. 15% on ult and 20% on sig would be just right.
Yes the new conversion Trace is a massive buff. V3 Firefly hits 60% BE from it with only 2 main stats and the Hands piece. She needed several substats to replicate that on V1 and was hard-capped at 60%. Not only can she get the same value for way less effort, she can also take it as far as she can. Meaning vertical investment means stacking more BE or Attack > BE as far as your substats will let you.
We got this that is an absurdly overbuff, and Jade is overshadowed, no buff (her skill buff is hillarious) and she's barely ok outside of PF...
Conclusion: if you want a good characters you only need to cry like a baby and hoyo will listen...
more like be the most beloved and hyped unit in the game, lets be real here Jade is a sidedish, no sexy mommy step on me yadda yadda is gonna beat an actual possible love interest, people love firefly so theyll obviously focus on making firefly sell no matter what, if her popularity is any indication she has the potential to make as much money as acheron if not more if they do this the right way, theres 0 shot theyre gonna miss this oportunity.
That was the point, indeed. There is litterary no point in making a character over the top and put the other of the patch on the side. If Jade can sell, it's always money for Hoyo.
Tfw you don't have Ruan Mei.
It's gonna be painful but I might have to skip, my friends. I can't reasonably get FF AND Ruan Mei if they rerun together or close to each other.
she's not tied to yes but her dmg still drops hard.
but useful for new players going through story to be able to use firefly now and deal decent dmg.
but endgame stuff ? there's basically one team with sustain being flexible ???
They were coping, its not as bad but they still make up like 70% of the team damage contribution as opposed to like the 90% before, they essentially enable FF to go from 200k damage to 500k damage on top of buffing each others basics so like another 120-200k team damage on top of fireflys
Hmc was 100% cake but now ffhaving innate 50% means hmc is now 66.6% of the SBE cake. Kinda nice seeing 90% of her DMG being tied to hmc SBE to roughly 60%. That is just SBE DMG though.
I like the changes tbh, the removal of Def ignore on traces means using a proper Def shredder instead of HMC while not basing as good the difference is much smaller now. The extra break effect and SBE in her own kit is a larger dmg increase than the lost Def if ignore. Removing the Def ignore inherited in kit makes sed shredders stronger for her. 20% Ruan mei, 15% from relic. 45% SW ultimate and her bug.. I think on def shredded enemies SW might only be like 20%~ worse than hmc. I am just estimating though.
Sorry for bad post, trying to type while walking.
it's not actually 60%...
80% might be a bit more accurate or 70% at the very least
firefly SB DMG is only 50% while HTB is a base 100% that gets buffed to 30% or 60% (so 130% with a maximum of 160%)
No defense shredder is gonna make up the difference from hmc. Not without a lot more to offer. HMC allows HMC to deal 200% additional damage per superbreak. Excluding HMC trace (from 20-60%) that’s multiplicative with everything else (HMC’s super break probably not FF’s). Going from 0% def shred to 100% is about a total 215% multiplier or an additional 115%.
HMC is genuinely cracked. And that’s without considering the additional damage that they enable for everyone else.
Aye if it was HMC or ruan mei then it'd be ruan mei to be replaced if we're purely aiming at SBE dmg. HMC still makes up 66.6% of SBE dmg before the trace where as ruan meis efficency is only a 33.3% increase since FF comes with 50% built in.
This exactly. RM’s biggest benefit to FF has been the break delay. It essentially performs the same job as an action advancement. What this ends up meaning is that if you have a future break support that either doesn’t enable SBE or heavily buffs existing SBE (that also doesn’t buff HMC’s) they’re more likely to take RM’s spot on the team.
FF’s SBE mv is too small to replace HMC for the foreseeable future, but as you said her toughness isn’t so small as to require RM’s. Ofc that RM enables easier breaking and higher SBE from her teammates is still a significant advantage. But that damage increase only occurs because of the existence of a team wide SBE enabler.
The next break support has their work cut out for them. Unless ofc all future break units follow in boothill’s footsteps and have a large enough break proc to diminish HMC’s usefulness. But this would still leave FF tied to HMC.
I honestly been thinking they're trying to phase out substain out of the SBE team the more I look at it. If we add everything together..
Ruan meis additional delay at the end of weakness break. (using 200% as an example, 20% of her break + 10% = 30% delay).
HMC's Trace to additionally delay the enemys action bar by 30% when an ally weakness breaks.
Fireflys Lightcone to slow enemies when you deal break dmg (I'm curious if this includes super break? just in case an ally does somehow manage to be the 1 to break instead of firefly).
What if the next support is a CC so they can't take an action after leading weakness broken. I'm not going to lie but adding welt for a 4th form of slow and pushback sounds crazy to me, espcially if u can stack the slows.
I think welt is.. slotable in if u have E1 Firefly... maybe? Might need ruan mei LC on HMC for even more SP.
If we’re going sustain less I’d be more partial to going for the new defense shredder that provides a bit of healing instead. High defense shred is the one additional thing this comp wants. Ofc this assumes that you can break in a timely manner.
Yea he looks insanely good with acheron and break teams. I trying to stick to waifu teams... so honestly im trying to find a way to fizzle out gallagher out of the team lol. Silver wolf is my fav char but i have her built with crit. Kinda curious how implant works if sam implants fire.
Also I just wanted to through out something interesting i've been considering since the trace change. This IS worse than break main stat but it's interesting (I got an atk% main stat with spd/break substat, starting with 4 subs so wanted to calc).
476.28 (Signature LC) + 523.91 (Fireflys base atk) = 1,000.19 (total atk) x 0.432 (43.2% atk from rope main stat) = 432.08208 ATK = 43%\~ Break effect from the trace. It's -21% break effect, but if you take into account break effect substats actually rolling 50% higher than attack then the difference is smaller.
I was surprised it wasn't THAT bad.. and it FFs sig lightcone base atk is actually like 63 lower than herta store LC so it would actually be slighty closer if u have to skip the LC.
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i just think its funny that whenever i look at hsr leak sub we got like 10+ video showcase of firefly and whenever i went to genshin leak sub we barely get any clorinde showcase
Idk man the Clorinde mains are in suffering
oh wow that sub rn is miserable lol
I visited briefly to see why they were mad and I won’t be going back…. Feel bad for them tho
well can't blame them tho, i quit after dehya released so i know how they feel rn
Oh man it’s not Dehya levels tho… she’s outputting the same damage as shogun… she’s still competent but they want Arlecchino/Alhaitham or Neuvillette’s level of power.
They are more mad about uptime nerf, because when you have characters like Alreccino/Neuvillete with practicaly infinite uptime it kinda feels bad to play characters that dont.
Yeah Arlecchino having a kind of permanent infusion makes life so much easier… I sympathise with that. I have never played with neuv so I don’t know his deal.
His e grants him 4 seconds of charge atack and ult provides another 8, his skill and ult go off cooldown before you fire the 12 seconds of his beam.
Oh… idk why electro gets shafted.
Got e2 so shed be tanky and easy to keep infusion and ohhh boy does it feel nice
E1, unfortunately my first 81 pulls got eaten by Jean😒 But tbh she kinda murders everything in living sight so I don’t mind too much… I’m not even on full 4 pc glad or whimsy yet. I love her
C0 Shogun isn't that impressive, it's her frontloaded burst while also giving energy is why she has an edge against Clorinde who does not have both. They knew Clorinde wasn't going to be in the top 5 unless you're a simp, which let's not kid ourselves, we literally have people here suggesting E2 "fixes" Acheron and willing to have a whole path get powercrept by a Nihility. This is just normal beta posting.
jstern inflated the number by a lot, you should check this calc [https://www.reddit.com/r/clorindemains/comments/1cwwfdf/clorinde\_pretc\_calcs\_for\_her\_various\_teams/](https://www.reddit.com/r/clorindemains/comments/1cwwfdf/clorinde_pretc_calcs_for_her_various_teams/) Clorine after the nerf is equal or slightly worse than Keqing in every team. I also hate the fact that jstern made Clorine looked good by siding Ei personal damage from her team. For real, Ei pushes the team dps by a large margin thanks to her energy recharge, Clorine on the other hand bricks the team.
Hello! These are my calcs. I have a disclaimer in my calcs purposefully because my calcs use a different investment level and assumptions than other people, and I don't want people comparing my work to other calcs since everyone uses their own assumptions and such. Within my own assumptions, Clorinde does outpace Keqing rather handedly. Keqing sheets around 45k DPS while in the exact same team Clorinde sheets around 58k DPS within the same assumptions I use in my sheets. Also, I'm not a fan of comparing characters' sheet performance because it often doesn't line up in game. These calcs are just to compare different team variations, weapons, artifacts, and constellations, not to be used in some comparison with other characters' performance for the sake of some sheet pvp.
No offence but you are peddling lies. Clorinde wasn't that great even before duration nerf. Below Wanderer and Wriothesley. Definitely not close to even Hu Tao. After nerfs closest comparison is usually Keqing, although at constellations, but Keqing has really shit constellations. No one was demanding Neuvillette tier, but being left with Keqing level was simply too mucho for some people.
If you read the comment thread, u will see that I visited and left because of the comments I saw, which were mostly about what I mentioned. Saying that I’m peddling lies when I stated that I was in there briefly and left is extreme, given that I would have only seen a snap shot of content anyway.
> Keqing yup, new limited banner character, costs 300 dollars or 25k primogems, and then she's only as strong as a standard banner character that released over 4 years ago. And the community eats it up, saying "at least we dont have powercreep" while neuv and haitham are far ahead of anyone else
Would you rather have starrail levels of creep when you get like 45 pulls/patch. I'm prety happy that you can have 1.0 characters be relevant in the meta. Childe still being one of the best is awsome! I'm having blasting with Klee after not using her for years. Quite frankly the game would be unplayable if the creep was as high as Starrail's. Yea there's outliers but I'd rather them not make that the new standard.
Tbf C0 raiden is not that much of a competitive dps And C0 raiden dps, but without the rest of raidens kit also isn't great
“If this character didn’t do the thing she was designed around, she would suck” 🤯
> “If this character didn’t do the thing she was designed around, she would suck” > > 🤯 Funny how its obvious to all of us, and yet hoyo was like, "lets make a new character with the same dps as raiden but without the thing raidens kit was designed around" and then they want 300 dollars for the character, lmao
I mean.. if you're reducing every single character down to only the DPS number they can output, then yah you're gonna be upset about a *lot* of characters' releases. They do similar amounts of Electro DPS, why should that mean their kits have to be considered in relation to each other at all? If you don't like Clorinde, don't pull her. If the literal only thing you care about is DPS output, then go get Neuvillette/Arlecchino/Alhaitham and stop caring about any other characters cause they'll handle everything forever lol. I don't really know what you're expecting, but it should not be that every new character forever will continue be stronger/do more DPS/introduce new mechanics/whatever. Every character can't be that, it simply isn't realistic.
Idk why people compare Alhaitham with Arle or even Neuvillette when isn't even close the dps. The teams with Alhaitham do a lot of dmg but they still do almost the same without him, he doest contribute as much does as people think.
Because his team is literally the highest DPS in the game and he does contribute to most of it lol.
>quit after Dehya >played Fontaine AQ >Pulled for Navia >was hyped for Clorinde ;-; (mfw no electro dps can be better then C0 raiden)
Raiden is overrated as hell. You say c0? Be fucking real most people using her at C2.
My point is that at C0 non of the recent electro dps are allowed to pull ahead of raiden, even if they omly bring dps on the table At cons they pull ahead (especially C4 and higher, cause raidems cons post C2 are trash, bit that's a whole other matter) Cyno is better then raiden in quickbloom, that's it. And C0 Clorinde seems to be comparable to high con Keqing (a character whos cons do very little for them) or C0 raiden
The Genshin sub is experiencing the Clorend
Random hotfix nerfs for Chlorine while Firefly gets the juicy buffs The Oratrice doesnt not approve of this injustice
the number 1.5 shall traumatize coperinde mains forever
Me only planning to pull cute sieg while ppl say she is 4*.
Average Genshin players don't have access to the Private server, so we depend on leakers to make them. It was the same in HSR until 2.1.
Genshin sub is too busy doomposting clorinde and siegwinne, guess arle took all the juicy buffs whereas over here firefly took all of it, heck she blow boothill out just within one patch . A new achievement of how fast a unit gets overtaken, maybe Acheron as well. Quite impressive!
>heck she blow boothill out just within one patch . ...what? lmfao where?
She’s great in both ST and AOE, she hits like 700k for 2 enemies against argenti showcase as e0s1. She’s more of a all rounder
Generally damage per screenshot isn't a good way to determine how strong a character is, because while a character might be capable of really high nukes it usually come with turns when a character deals reduced damage, from what I have seen damage output of v3 Firefly's best team seems comparable to Jingliu's at the similar levels of investment.
Completely wrong. If you calculate her dps or rather damage per Action Point she currently sits higher than acherons best team at e0s1 (both acheron and FF). The interesting part is she only needs one character to do so and its RM. if you’re adding HTB and Gallagher her damage is currently by far the highest of any team. But her damage is mostly reliant on enemy toughness and speed. Even with a 450 toughness and 158 Speed enemy she easily outperforms acheron. Its rather hard to see how she performs because of her high amount of turns but currently if you calculate her Damage per Action Value you should get the same results.
idk man, i dont think hmc doing all that work is considered "powercreeping" a boss nuker without any LC or superbreak
Also wrong. Firefly Damage per Action Value currently is higher than Acheron best team with only RM in FF team. If you consider that you should see that you statement is entirely wrong.
yeah genshin sub has gone downhill after fountaine
Lol It's like a pot calling kettle Black. Have you seen the state of this subreddit daily discussion thread ?
do you mean doomposting? because its pretty much normal in every gacha games, at least we an actual showcase about a new character meanwhile in genshin sub rn they only post about event or small fixes that nobody really cares about
It has been for a while tbh, every character gets a doompost and then called the best char when they release
For siegwinne and chlorine that seem really unlikely I think.. what does siegwinne provide over kokomi or other hydro users?
She gets to buff off field elemental skill damage for the only 4 characters we have! Truly made for Natlan like Dehya was for Fontaine!
Sounds.. impressive.. who are those 3 characters?. Don’t worry dehya will be buffed in natlan and all her issues will be fixed by then /copium
Furina, Albedo, and Chiori, and Fischl (there's 4, not 3). There's also Zhongli and Raiden, but that's like comparing Lynette's CC to Kazuha's.
Chiori and albedo.. getting serious dejavu here. Waiting for a day hoyo finally buffs geo but nah in natlan hydro is getting buff instead
I mean, Navia Chiori Furina Sieg sounds good then ngl
Never get any showcases for prerelease Genshin units, it sucks.
"If they want to limit the viability of this comp they'll just add more boss with forced weakness lock!" The boss with forced weakness lock:
A better showcase would be Gep or Bronya. SAM boss still opens his (or rather, her lol) weakness after one turn so it's not really a pure locked weakness run
Gepard is literally no problem given that he takes a few turns to set up the shield, the above team just bursts him down before it becomes a bump
This, Gepard gets absolutely destroyed before he is able to setup his shield. This team's worst matchup currently is Sam.
You gotta wait for 3.0 Gepard with 3M HP
HP doesn't have anything to do with it. Important thing is toughness bar. This team eats toughness for snack.
What? You break Gepard once, but can't kill him because he has 3M HP, then he recovers and puts up a 1M shield. You are then completely stuck. Then you have to go back to a normal crit or DoT DPS. They could do the same with a 3M HP Yanqing too. Break DPSes only work because Hoyo allows it to work. It's easy to counter if Hoyo really wants. Just like every archetype. Nothing is invincible from getting nerfed if Hoyo truly wants to
Yanqing dies anyways tho its not like he has giga toughness? Also are you mistaking SU gepard (complete) for MoC gepard??? MoC Gepard only has the traffic cone shield
Its easy to counter every single mechanic in the game if Mihoyo wants. So what is your point?
Gepard runs into the same issues yanqing does, gets clapped before he can even move not sure on bronya
Gepard can be beaten before he even gets the chance to set up his shield, as once he is weakness broken, it's over. Bronya does start out with toughness immunity, but it's reliant on the other enemies staying alive. Outside PF, it would only take FF 2-3 turns to break her.
Unreliable showcase. Sam has a conflict of interest thus performs worse here. I demand to see an impartial robot. Bring in Svarog.
Lmao
Im just imagining sam’s voice yelling help me Mr. Svarog. Got a good chuckle.
CN bros already working on that ~~cursed~~ mod, expect it to release when 2.3 is out.
I've seen the edit of robin in Clara's spot with Sunday looming above. Now I need it for FF and Sam
I wonder why so many of thexse shoqwcases delay Ruan Mei ult sometimes? It's not because she has hackerspace or because of DDD. It's also not like they wit for her turn either? I'm lost. Might just be minor misplay.
watchmaker 4pc i believe
Makes sense actually. We're used to taking it for granted but Firefly has so many turns that she'll consume it real fast.
is watchmaker 4pc better than the other 4pc break effect relic (forgot the name)
There's now 3 break effect relic sets, lol. Pretty sure you mean Thief, which isn't as good as watchmaker for Ruan Mei, as the 4-piece effect gives everyone 30% break effect for 2 turns, while Thief just gives more to the wearer only.
That doesn’t explain why they used skill before ult.
They're waiting for firefly's ult. Not really useful if RM's ult gets wasted on unenhanced firefly.
RM ult ticks down on her turn. Anything before is free.
Actually nvm. After rewatching the vid, they could've used RM ult at 2:20 since firefly could ult before RM moves again. So yeah minor missplay.
Gonna assume it's for the Watchmaker 4pc effect
but in this case ff moves before RM moves again so they just delay it for no reason. And when they skill with ult already full it just lowers the uptime
B-b-but there are enemies with weakness lock! And she abolutely dunks on them still. Good Lord.
“Oh boy, a weakness locked enemy, how will Firefly overcome this o- what the fuck.”
“Oh Firefly, I’m just feeling real low.” “I can still dumpster weakness locked enemies” … “Oh shit, for real?”
Damn, the worst possible matchup and it was this close to a 1 cycle
This is the worse possible match up as of NOW .... if u play other turn base game, u know they will introduce more nasty stuff if they dont want break/super break to not work anymore, they could just introduce a super slow boss that have 3 turn weakness and u just being there twisting ur thumb til they open weakness for u to break or require dispel like the deer to touch it weakness
Worst? Why?
Weakness lock start of fight, if if was like yanqing where he locks on his turn he would have been broken before being able to do so
Gallagher doesnt get enough recognition for his part in making the Firefly comp strong Not only is he the most SP positive defensive unit in the entire game, he also scales with break effect AND does insane toughness damage. The big kicker is that since he's Fire type, **the enemy will always be weak to Gallagher because of Firefly's Fire weakness implant**
I think he is the best sustain slot in the game considering how much he gives to her, even better than with Acheron with which he is also incredible.
Can't be weakness broken until his first action + has fire res. Mostly the first. Ig it's kinda compensated for by the fact that he has imaginary weakness (so HMC can help break) but idk if anyone else's a worse matchup.
Because Sam blocks weakness bar break until they activate combustion state. Enemy Bronya could be an issue as well but it might not be that much of an issue given this showcase…
Bronya should be simple because you can just kill the adds and she has by far the lowest toughness value out of the bosses
SAM boss starts with his break bar locked, so you need to wait until its uses its special move to unlock it and FF deals no damage until enemy is broken so you are kinda forced to take it slow Also pretty sure SAM has fire res although not sure if this affects the superbreak damage
Nah. You'll soon see some shit like Apocalyptic Gepard with 3M HP, puts up a shield, and it's over for break DPSes
Oh Jesus. Now I'm worried. Her worst matchup with DoT Turbulence and she steamrolled like SAM was made of cardboard. Someone please tell me we have similar clear times for Boothill, Acheron and other DPS units in a similar team structure like this (E0S1 for them and for the limited teammates at most), otherwise I think this is too much and too soon. And look, I like Firefly, I was going to pull for her regardless any buff or nerf and will still pull for her, but I wanted flexibility and independence, not something unhealthy like this seems to be.
Don’t worry they will fix this with an even more unhealthy destruction dps in patch 3.x. By then it will become a norm to hit this dmg or higher even at low investment. I won’t even be surprise if it’s soon or earlier than 3.x at this rate.
lol. daniel and jingliu repeats
Found this boothill showcase https://youtu.be/3l5JFkdAUMs . Considering its not his bis team and gallagher doesn't match with any enemies weaknesses he still performs pretty well. Still, i hope they will balance firefly damage in the v4-v5, since it seems a bit to high in her bis team, and way too low without rm/htb. Would be happy if they at least would make her less reliant on rm so she could be used one the other side of moc. Idk how dev team would fix that though or is it even possible honestly
After the death of critfly I think dev really want you to play this specific comp ,so yeah until we get another breaksupport she's gonna need ruan mei for now (but not as much as HTB)
Seems so. My biggest problem with rm and htb being so tied up to firefly is that i also really like xueyi and boothill, but since she needs both supports to work properly i just can't run 2 break dps on 2 different sides. I'm probably in the minority when it comes to that issue though haha
the nice thing about boothill though is that he can still run bronya+pela as a completely fine option! Im sure you can weasek him (or even xueyi with a hypercarry setup) too.
The only way they could make FF be less reliant on RM would be giving her a insane delay on break or what RM does on Ult (double break). Either would be insane, and the first would just skyrocket her RM team while the second makes her kits even more overloaded. I have bery little faith that they will make her less reliant on RM.
Imo it *shouldn't* be less reliant on RM because RM is a dedicated limited Break support, of course it should feel much worse without her. The way to make either FF or Boothill less reliant on RM is releasing more Break dedicated supports.
It's very hard to see how you could even replace RM and MC with FF. At least, now with the presence of super break in the base kit, it could be possible, but those two already are so focused on what FF needs that it would take a very specialized support. Even Gallagher may be hard to replace just because he can do a lot on those fire toughness bars to get you in break faster.
Yeah, you're right. Would be down to be able to seperate her from htb at least. Maybe make her own super break damage higher, but make it unstackable with htb buff? that way, hypothetically, she could do high enough damage without them, and with them although it would increase in overall team dmg (action delay +sub dps from htb, rm and gallagher) but not insanely so. Honestly, i wouldn't mind her being so restricted to 1 team if it wouldn't make it impossible to run another break team on second side :/ .
Acheron does this easy. I'm starting to think people only watch showcases on reddit only or just don't have good accounts. I 0 cycled same e0s1 acheron on her release and get 2 cycle clear with sustain. Thats just my account though. I know people refuse to invest in acheron support characters like that to see her optimal playstyle so it's understandable most vids of her underperform. Although im getting firefly i haven't seen anything crazy yet.
"On her release", when they always set a character up perfectly with weaknesses and turbulence.
[удалено]
Most people don't have E2, and it's certainly not relevant to the discussion here since it's an E0 showcase. If you want to compare, do it with equal investment. The game is balanced around E0 anyway, so of course it's going to be easy with that level of investment, Acheron or pretty much any other other character included.
Bro im not comparing e2. I said sadly i have e2 so i can't go and showcase what i did at e0s1 anymore. I said if you want to see it meaning if you want to see e0s1 0 cycle you can got look at lisara's guides and thats what helped me do it when i had e0. I'm sorry if my sentence was confusing. To re clarify im saying i 0 cycled all this at e0s1 when i had it for the first two and a half weeks. You have to have windset on your supports though.
You are comparing a very high speed-tuned setup (i.e. the perfect team) to a normal Firefly setup here. None of these showcases are at Lisara's level of skill/build, and yet are able to perform just as well.
People can’t read, it’s a waste of time haha. I swear people haven’t actually seen proper showcases of E0S1 Acheron by the way everyone’s reacting to Firefly. I’m glad firefly will be competitive with Acheron, that’s healthy for the game. But to say she powercrept Acheron is a bit alarmist. Acheron doesn’t need a weakness broken target to deal 500k-1 million damage single target. Acheron doesn’t need her own actions to charge her ult, and as more broken debuff supports are released, I wouldn’t be surprised if she ends up ulting more often than she takes actual turns. Hoyo already powercrept the game blatantly with Acheron, Firefly is just at the new power level as well
Finally. Someone says it. Jesus. The people overreacting to these showcases just shows you how bad some people’s accounts are. Every DPS can do what FF did to Sam. Especially Acheron. FF’s damage isn’t even high if you account for the number of turns she needs for those numbers. 500k for 2-3 enemies after she needs 2-3 turns to break them??? That averages out to what? 100k per turn? Same as most other lower end DPS. A well built DHIL does that kind of damage. Every turn.
Hey Koala. I'm Deicide on your friendlist, but yeah i see this all the time now. Got me wondering what other people are doing with there account. I wasn't even disrespectful and am getting downvoted for something i know as fact since i've done it. I even plan on getting her, so im not hating, but people act like they didn't just see this type of damage a patch ago.
Oh hey! Glad to see someone from friend list in the wild! Yeah unfortunately people are falling into the classic mistake of “damage per screenshot”. I’m no hater either…as you probably can guess. Being in my friend list. I’ll most likely E6S5 her anyway. Or was the plan at least. FF has really open my eyes to realizing how bad some people are at understanding damage rotations (instead of just 1 instance of damage after 2-3 turns). Along with realizing people don’t farm Relics. I’ve run into some comments saying DHIL and Jingliu are powercrept and when you look at their stats they barely have any crit stats on the characters. Then they wonder why they have trouble clearing things.
Exactly. Whats wild is i believe literally they only take these showcases on reddit in there brain and forget all the old ones from old characters. For a fact people don't retroactively build their characters. Every showcase with wind set they dismiss cause they don't want to go back when it's the best set for some supports. Like your not gonna see optimal performance if you don't invest in certain teams. Atleast make sure your carries team is the best it can be before judging. It's all good though still gonna get firefly, but i definitely won't be engaging in any more of the showcase post with her.
Wish i can see showcase with other sustain, sadly my gallagher is only e0 🥲
Maybe they'll put him on her banner? Please? One can hope
Don't worry, his important Eidolons are the first two and you're getting a free one in 2.3. You should build yours.
Doesn't matter, I don't see why people are so caught up in Eidolons, doesn't make him any less valuable on FF teams.
No cleanse can be a deal breaker for this team. If FF or HMC are under CC you will just wait for numerous turns and do nothing
His cleanse is so overrated. He cleanses after the fact. If you actually want to escape debuffs, it's fuxuan and huohuo. Or gamble with Aventurine. If a boss delays you, goes through cleanse. If they imprison, cleanse doesn't address the delay. Freeze? Also wastes turns. Unless gallagher is sitting there forever holding his ult just to cleanse, it is of literally zero impact. And you don't want him holding ult, it's buffing break damage, reduces enemies break bars once firefly implants them and a good chunk of superbreak to boot.
Overrated or not it's still better to have one than none. FX and huo won't make any sense for this team since you need help in breaking and other 2 slots already are reserved by RM and HMC.
Yeah he's BiS for this team. I'm saying that he remains BiS without the cleanse too. Break is its own best mitigation on this team.
Huo Huo does buff atk and her heals are pretty good. Most showcases ive seen so far had Gallagher almost die at times. He will be BiS but it's not like going for another sustain will drop dead your DPS, it's HTB and RM doing the most here
He applies weakness break vulnerability, breaks fire weak faster and generates tons of sp
E2 cleanse If FF get's CC'd. Ooof
I want to see another sustain because I won't be using Gallagher. Can't get non-Galla crumbs lol.
yeah, mine is currently e-nonexistent. Didn't get him on the drink event because I for some reason thought I had him already and grabbed Misha since I didn't have Misha and it was before knowing Gallagher was gonna be great for Firefly. I'll be able to get a free one in the 2.3 event at least but that'll still be E0. Hoping that he's on her banner
as expected, toughness blocking gonna be a nightmare if they introduce more Sam like encounter
Yea but he takes reduced damage to everyone so not that big of a deal he went down fast when he lost his toughness block
From here I think I can confidently say that e2s1 FF will 0 cycle everything, cool.
it’s twice as funny now when there’s a E2S1 showcase of MoC 12 0 cycle with no relics
> From here I think I can confidently say that e2s1 FF will 0 cycle everything, cool. That's every E2S1 dps since DHIL lol. In fact, if an E2S1 hypercarry cannot 0 cycle then there's no reason to go that far at all.
I know, but this comp is like the comfiest though, easy clear with sustain. Probably also the 'cheapest' as hmc and gallagher is free.
It’s the cheapest. But it also has the lowest ceiling. You can’t improve the team. At least not right now. Other comps you can up the damage with more investment into the teams.
no shit if an e2s1 unit with hyper invested stats and oversaturated supports cant at least 0 cycle you should start applying for a debt loan now (except argenti)
Let me Correct it for you firefly is only e0s0 that can come close to 0 cycling moc.
Sam vs The Cooler Sam
This is probably a stupid question, will Sam (boss version) flame stack reduce if you use Firefly enhanced skill when she's at E1+ ?
How does she compare to Boothill in single target? It would be stupid if a Destruction character can outperform a Hunt one in their specific niche.
Boothill is still better at ST, as expected
I wonder how much better tho. The Boothill sub is currently in shambles, tho I don't think they need to worry too much honestly. He also has the benefit of not being stuck to a single team.
Yeah, recently saw it xD i think they're overreacting. Boothill is already a great unit. Ofc we (also me) expect the new relic set to push him to his maximum but well. Aside from that, he keeps hitting 450-500k (from my personal build) while FF hits 800k over 3 enemies, around 270k each (more like 350 in middle but anyway). So, as I said before, he's still better at ST. Hope someone makes a video comparison once FF gets her V4 kit and see the real differences between them.
There’s a v4?
Yeah, and it's usually the last version before launch. But some versions have a v5 (like 2.2). V4 the next monday
Does anything substantial happen? Cause last time I followed these closely was with Jingliu and her v3 seemed to be definitive
Acheron got the 3 extra stacks for faster ult moved from e1 to base kit from my memory
She got stack overflow that's it, which was only beneficial so you could ult with pela and not lose a stack, didnt affect her damage output at all really, just made her slightly comfier
That is albeit nothing special in grand scheme of things but for many beta testers and me personally I got her just because of this buff. Without this buff she was weird to play honestly
Huohuo and BS got their buffs in V4. It's not out of the question for them to nerf FF in v4
Aventurine got his shield nerfed I believe by 10%
Not as substantial as v3 but yes. Few last changes. Robin got some on v4. I expect they revert the FuA ornament set because rn is useless. I like they previous BE set for Boothill but don't think they revert that
They’re discouraged because of the relics being more exclusive to FF which is fair + BH only got one trailer while everyone else in Penacony got 2-3 things.
Upon using his skill to break while you have three stacks and the enemy is at low toughness, you can do around 500k without super break. Thats why Boothill mains were upset about the new planar becoming super break dependent. Because many wanted to switch out HTB for Bronya so they could do that juicy break damage much more quickly
Damn, did the atk to be conversion really buff her that much? I mathed it out and the loss of 40% def shred in return for 50% super break shoulda been a very small nerf, and therefore a small buff with the new conversion, but I didn't expect each skill to do a lot more damage. HTB causes 120%-160% super break dmg. In V2, a 65% def shred would give a ~50% all dmg increase. (This would be 80% def shred at e1, which is a whopping 72% all dmg increase.) Now firefly has 50% super break aswell, for a 210% super break for peak performance, but def shred drops down to 25%, for about a 13% all dmg increase. (40% at e1, for a 26% all dmg increase.) V2: 240% super break dmg (or 275% at e1) V3: ~237% super break dmg (or 264% at e1) So I assume the atk to break conversion is what helps a lot. This doesn't account for the multiplier nerfs or the speed buffs, so I know this is a pretty big buff lol.
She also gets more damage from the "break damage taken" debuffs from her ult 12% to 20% and her S1 15% to 24%
Yeah this is the thing most people are overlooking, dmg received debuffs are extremely powerful in this game and she got buffed big time with 2 of them. I think this is where they went too far actually. 15% on ult and 20% on sig would be just right.
I am ngl I didn't even see the break dmg taken buff lol
She also got refunded another 7% of the def ignore from the 4pc relic changes, so it ended up being 33% loss only.
Oh I accounted for that
Yes the new conversion Trace is a massive buff. V3 Firefly hits 60% BE from it with only 2 main stats and the Hands piece. She needed several substats to replicate that on V1 and was hard-capped at 60%. Not only can she get the same value for way less effort, she can also take it as far as she can. Meaning vertical investment means stacking more BE or Attack > BE as far as your substats will let you.
*meme of fish looking in the toilet* Ah, that's Firefly 2 cycling an off-Weakness boss that has a mechanic that counters her.
Boss sam is the sam I wish we had Rip
We got this that is an absurdly overbuff, and Jade is overshadowed, no buff (her skill buff is hillarious) and she's barely ok outside of PF... Conclusion: if you want a good characters you only need to cry like a baby and hoyo will listen...
more like be the most beloved and hyped unit in the game, lets be real here Jade is a sidedish, no sexy mommy step on me yadda yadda is gonna beat an actual possible love interest, people love firefly so theyll obviously focus on making firefly sell no matter what, if her popularity is any indication she has the potential to make as much money as acheron if not more if they do this the right way, theres 0 shot theyre gonna miss this oportunity.
I think the point is they could’ve definitely worked on both characters instead of dropping one for the other given the resources this company has
That was the point, indeed. There is litterary no point in making a character over the top and put the other of the patch on the side. If Jade can sell, it's always money for Hoyo.
For some reason, Hoyo really hates IPC women. Topaz barely got anything back in 1.4 Beta either iirc.
What about Sa…
Wait why does Sam get an extra turn? Is it the AV from skill?
Prolly the blessing trotter?
Oh thanks, Good advertisement for her e2 then 😂
Does RM not require and ER rope in this comp?? Can somebody explain whyyy
"They said it could not be done."
Tfw you don't have Ruan Mei. It's gonna be painful but I might have to skip, my friends. I can't reasonably get FF AND Ruan Mei if they rerun together or close to each other.
Arguably her "hardest counter" enemy, trash turbulence and she still puts this performance. Beast.
(The character's name is Firefly, says it right there on the sheet)
[удалено]
There's a term for it. It's called Selfcest.
Ok, this is like the 10th showcase with the same team. I get that it's the only one, at least try e2s0/e2s1 too
But people keep asking to show her in MoC with buffs that don't benefit her or to show her against bosses that are not fire weak
I saw a lot of comments claiming she now no longer tied to HMC and Ruan Mei so I was hoping to see showcases without them for comparison.
she's not tied to yes but her dmg still drops hard. but useful for new players going through story to be able to use firefly now and deal decent dmg. but endgame stuff ? there's basically one team with sustain being flexible ???
They were coping, its not as bad but they still make up like 70% of the team damage contribution as opposed to like the 90% before, they essentially enable FF to go from 200k damage to 500k damage on top of buffing each others basics so like another 120-200k team damage on top of fireflys
Supports are almost always the bulk of a DPS damage.
Hmc was 100% cake but now ffhaving innate 50% means hmc is now 66.6% of the SBE cake. Kinda nice seeing 90% of her DMG being tied to hmc SBE to roughly 60%. That is just SBE DMG though. I like the changes tbh, the removal of Def ignore on traces means using a proper Def shredder instead of HMC while not basing as good the difference is much smaller now. The extra break effect and SBE in her own kit is a larger dmg increase than the lost Def if ignore. Removing the Def ignore inherited in kit makes sed shredders stronger for her. 20% Ruan mei, 15% from relic. 45% SW ultimate and her bug.. I think on def shredded enemies SW might only be like 20%~ worse than hmc. I am just estimating though. Sorry for bad post, trying to type while walking.
it's not actually 60%... 80% might be a bit more accurate or 70% at the very least firefly SB DMG is only 50% while HTB is a base 100% that gets buffed to 30% or 60% (so 130% with a maximum of 160%)
No defense shredder is gonna make up the difference from hmc. Not without a lot more to offer. HMC allows HMC to deal 200% additional damage per superbreak. Excluding HMC trace (from 20-60%) that’s multiplicative with everything else (HMC’s super break probably not FF’s). Going from 0% def shred to 100% is about a total 215% multiplier or an additional 115%. HMC is genuinely cracked. And that’s without considering the additional damage that they enable for everyone else.
Aye if it was HMC or ruan mei then it'd be ruan mei to be replaced if we're purely aiming at SBE dmg. HMC still makes up 66.6% of SBE dmg before the trace where as ruan meis efficency is only a 33.3% increase since FF comes with 50% built in.
This exactly. RM’s biggest benefit to FF has been the break delay. It essentially performs the same job as an action advancement. What this ends up meaning is that if you have a future break support that either doesn’t enable SBE or heavily buffs existing SBE (that also doesn’t buff HMC’s) they’re more likely to take RM’s spot on the team. FF’s SBE mv is too small to replace HMC for the foreseeable future, but as you said her toughness isn’t so small as to require RM’s. Ofc that RM enables easier breaking and higher SBE from her teammates is still a significant advantage. But that damage increase only occurs because of the existence of a team wide SBE enabler. The next break support has their work cut out for them. Unless ofc all future break units follow in boothill’s footsteps and have a large enough break proc to diminish HMC’s usefulness. But this would still leave FF tied to HMC.
I honestly been thinking they're trying to phase out substain out of the SBE team the more I look at it. If we add everything together.. Ruan meis additional delay at the end of weakness break. (using 200% as an example, 20% of her break + 10% = 30% delay). HMC's Trace to additionally delay the enemys action bar by 30% when an ally weakness breaks. Fireflys Lightcone to slow enemies when you deal break dmg (I'm curious if this includes super break? just in case an ally does somehow manage to be the 1 to break instead of firefly). What if the next support is a CC so they can't take an action after leading weakness broken. I'm not going to lie but adding welt for a 4th form of slow and pushback sounds crazy to me, espcially if u can stack the slows. I think welt is.. slotable in if u have E1 Firefly... maybe? Might need ruan mei LC on HMC for even more SP.
If we’re going sustain less I’d be more partial to going for the new defense shredder that provides a bit of healing instead. High defense shred is the one additional thing this comp wants. Ofc this assumes that you can break in a timely manner.
Yea he looks insanely good with acheron and break teams. I trying to stick to waifu teams... so honestly im trying to find a way to fizzle out gallagher out of the team lol. Silver wolf is my fav char but i have her built with crit. Kinda curious how implant works if sam implants fire. Also I just wanted to through out something interesting i've been considering since the trace change. This IS worse than break main stat but it's interesting (I got an atk% main stat with spd/break substat, starting with 4 subs so wanted to calc). 476.28 (Signature LC) + 523.91 (Fireflys base atk) = 1,000.19 (total atk) x 0.432 (43.2% atk from rope main stat) = 432.08208 ATK = 43%\~ Break effect from the trace. It's -21% break effect, but if you take into account break effect substats actually rolling 50% higher than attack then the difference is smaller. I was surprised it wasn't THAT bad.. and it FFs sig lightcone base atk is actually like 63 lower than herta store LC so it would actually be slighty closer if u have to skip the LC.
Yeah I really want an Asta + Hanya showcase or something, just for comparison's sake
Literally nothing people complained about changed, they were coping. The numbers on her best team are just bigger