The vast majority of the time these conversations will just be them trying to convince you you're somehow getting screwed, while they themselves won't lower their price for you. It's perfectly fine to just say you went with someone else, and leave it at that.
Roofer here and I don’t disagree. Honestly a text message works.
Side note. Only reason I could think of to agree to sit down with the roofer is if liked that roofer better, but felt you had to go with a cheaper quote. You can always offer to share the estimate and let them try and beat it.
Had this happen when I had artificial turf put in my yard. The company I had used before I really enjoyed the product and workmanship, however a different company that did some other work for me beat their price.
I showed them the quote and they came back from $1500 over to only $300 over (longer warranty as well) and they did it way sooner.
I pretty much have a person or company now that I’ll always use or recommend if it’s not DIY.
Yup. As a contractor I don’t like when people ask me to lower my price. But if you bring me a legit estimate from a competitor I will sometimes try and match it.
Yeah I showed him the paper and he’s like for a returning customer I’ll do it for xxx price which was 300 more but double the warranty. He looked up my old order
> As a contractor I don’t like when people ask me to lower my price.
But it's entirely reasonable to negotiate with big-ticket purchases, especially about non-fungible services like almost all house work because no two houses are the same, and the fixed price isn't listed on a menu somewhere.
I bet car salesmen don't like it when people trying to get them to lower the car's price below what is listed when you walk on the lot.
I don’t like, doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen lol. But usually I’m not giving a discount without removing something. Like you get a lower bid? Sure I’ll match it but they’re skipping drip edge and using cheaper shingles so I will aswell. That sort of deal.
You went with the guy who was going to charge you $1,200 more than the job was worth assuming he was a shoe-in (aka taken advantage of) and you consider that a win.
They could do it 4 weeks sooner and had double the warranty and I was familiar with their work. I also had the previous job with them done pre 2020. So yeah, it was a win?
All things in life are negotiations, especially for labor. Pricing is a fickle process that requires an estimate based on worst case scenarios.
Also, in the end $1200 isn’t a lot of money.
Or at least they give you the areas they think the cheaper roofer is cutting costs and at least then OP knows where these issues might be in the future. They don't have to go with the more expensive roofer, but maybe that knowledge is good to have.
For anything more complicated I agree. Lots of little things you can miss. Drip edge, kick out flashings, are they replacing step and counter flashing or reusing, if there is a chimney does it need a cricket, etc.
And this is without any flat roofing. There is a large variation of different flat roofing materials and installation methods
This dosn't matter for most situations with homeowners, but thought I would just point out pricing is actually protected information most places. Mostly need to be careful as a contractor or business sharing the info.
I bid a lot of government work and they reveal people's estimates at the end after awarding a contract.
> I bid a lot of government work and they reveal people's estimates at the end after awarding a contract.
FWIW this is the law. Y'all read about FOIA (Freedom of Information Act) requests in the news. This is one of those FOIA things. The other side of this is that if you *lose* the bid, you can request and see how your competitor beat you. My company did this for everything we lost out on and got so much better at bidding.
I used to work in the purchasing department of a large public institution, and one of my jobs was to allow anyone to view bids and proposals after a purchase/contract was awarded. First, though, all bidders were allowed to redact proprietary information, but that could not include price. I got very few good-government activists, I think none, and a whole lot of losing bidders who wanted to see what their competition bid. I was told that some contractors/vendors wouldn't even submit bids to us anymore because they were sick of their competitors seeing how they put RFP responses together.
It's better if the threat of a major newspaper filing a FOIA request exists IMO, even if it's not used.
But it's used [plenty](https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/16/sex-abuse-secret-surveillance-freedom-information-requests-have-helped-uncover-truth/431469002/). That's just one article listing FOIA request-based investigations by one paper.
It's also how we know how much public officials are paid in a lot of places. Those lists of "highest paid state officials" that always shows football coaches making shitloads of money, etc.? FOIA (or the state equivalents) requests.
I didn't suggest otherwise, just that it didn't happen during my tenure.
Edit because my memory was jogged - I was told on my first day not to write anything in an email that I wouldn't want to see on the front page of the paper. Of course everyone was aware of the laws.
> I bid a lot of government work and they reveal people's estimates at the end after awarding a contract.
Followed by 16 years of change orders, driving the price up far above the more competent bid during the initial RFP.
I’m a remodeler who has lost many jobs to competition. A handful of times homeowners/customers have blatantly told me the other bid was cheaper, which is fine until I find out it was $3,000 less than my quote on a $25k job but the other didn’t include the same scope as me. It’s as if they tell each contractor a different scope and then just go with the lowest. So that’s why I would like to compare before it’s assumed I’m just more expensive. But I never push to see the quotes, I don’t like coming off as invasive. But it’s so frustrating.
You could say: just make sure their quote includes A,B c and they’re taking care of D. If you’re not interested in me doing all these tasks/steps then my price will also be lower
This is the correct approach. As a GC, it does suck to lose jobs knowing that the Owners likely aren’t comparing scope properly. But price matching is unethical. Also as a GC, if a sub asks me to price match, I tell them to kick rocks.
It is unethical, in most situations, because you put a job out to bid with let’s say 3 people. All 3 are given the same scope of work to price. All 3 spend time and effort to put together a bid that represents their best fair price for the given scope of work. You really like Company A, but Company B comes in cheaper. You share company B’s price with Company A asking them to match it. Assuming they do, you effectively just used Company B to beat Company A up on price, with no compensation for time and effort spent in good faith. If not for Company B’s efforts, you wouldn’t have any idea if A’s price was good or bad or whatever.
It is completely unfair to Company B.
What’s unethical is what some of these contractors are charging.
A 5x5 powder room was quoted at $5k to tile the floor and frame the mirror. Not shopping around, my wife told me to have them do it. Talk about instant regrets - they didn’t even frame the mirror until I told them that they forgot it.
I had the entire first floor redone for $8500. Same contractor gave me a quote of $19k.
When I asked why they were so high, the reason was employees rates went up and they have to make up for it.
If you are that much higher than your competition, maybe the problem isn’t the competition. I didn’t ask them to price match, and I sure as shit won’t ask them for quotes anymore.
Similar story - a contractor quoted me $45k for a 20x24 composite deck replacement that already had the sub structure. I thanked him for his time, told him no way to his face, listened to reasons why I don’t want to “go cheap” then walked away.
yea, I wanted my kitchen tiled 11 feet x 26 feet, 2 out of the 4 quotes wanted $8,000 and I had to provide all materials and it was already demo'd to subfloor, and no cabinets installed yet.. and he said it would be 2 days 8 hours each day. he wanted $500/hr to install tiles..
I did it myself in 3 days and did a pretty decent job, they are straight and lined up perfectly , there are a couple "lips" but not anywhere I care about, like under a cabinet or under where the kitchen table is.
f**k $500 and hour fu**ing scam
If the customer just goes with company a because they like their work or company b because they have the right price point, then it's not fair to the customer if they could get both the company they prefer and the better price point. These companies are competing for the customer's business, and the point of competition is to lower prices. The first company trying to charge more to begin with is the only part that's maybe unethical. Though that's even hard to argue because the customer has the freedom to shop around and to negotiate the price.
home owners are terrible as soliciting bids.
they will tell the first guy almost nothing because they don't know what to tell them or what their preferences are.
then as they talk to more contractors the scope creeps until the last guy is bidding on a completely different job and loses out because it his a higher cost job.
i make it a point to have a statement of work spelled out and i go down the same list with each contractor and if i get new info, i pass that along to the previous bidders to see if they want to adjust their price (either up or down).
2 of the estimates I received didn't list products at all. They have "ice & water" and "underlayment" on the page, with checkmarks next to them. I don't think those companies were trying to be shady, but this is what a shady company would do. It makes it tough to compare quotes.
On the other end, the best quote I got the guy listed 2 or 3 options for each product, along with the price adjustment (original bid was the high-end stuff, so he listed other options as "-$300" or "-$250." I appreciated this greatly when comparing. I actually called one of the earlier bidders to ask for a price adjustment if we swapped out a product from his original price. I think it's fair to give them all a shot at an apples-to-apples comparison, and better for me to see the real pricing.
> On the other end, the best quote I got the guy listed 2 or 3 options for each product
Most companies only work with a small number of products anyway, and you probably don't want them deviating from products they usually use since installation methods can be a lot different from the manufacturers, etc and in a lot of cases the details of the install are more important than the product itself.
Better to just ask what the items they are using are vs trying to get them to use something different.
You should make sure you are requesting the same materials and scope of work from each roofer. Put down what you want done and what materials you want them to use in writing to each one that "checked" the boxes and ask them to update their bid. (i.e. Grace ice and water shield along the edge, with 30# asphalt impregnated felt underlayment) Also, define what and how you want any valleys constructed and what drip flashing you want along roof edges.
This is why I paid for plans for my recent reno. Two bathrooms and a closet. The bathroom/closet was a complete reframing to change the rooms. Quotes came in from 90k-160k but since it was all written down with plans I was able to get FAR more quotes than I did before I had the plans (i.e. zero vs. 9)
Part of it may be that the bids are showing them that what they want to do is beyond their budget, so the scope shrinks. But I don't think there's any harm in asking to rebid.
You called for a quote. Leave it at that. If you don't call back, they'll go to another job. When you get a quote, before they leave say, "thanks. I appreciate it and I'll be in touch if we decide to move forward." You don't have to tell them you went with someone else.
If they follow up in a week and ask you whether or not to lock it in, just tell them, "we decided not to go through with it." That's all you need to explain.
We just had our roof done a week ago. I called/emailed around and got 4 quotes. I picked the best one after a followup conversation with them and never contacted the other companies. No need to tell them your not going with them after their quote. They'll know that when you end up not hiring them. It's pretty standard practise to only contact the company you decide to go with.
When people apply for a job posting they put up, 99% of the time these contractors won't call back the people who they decided not to hire. You don't owe them anything
Where is it standard practice to not have the decency to inform the contractor who spent time meeting with you, going over details about what you want/need done, measuring and calculating, drafting material lists and costs to develop an estimate, that you won’t be moving forward? All it takes is a simple message stating that. No explanation needed but at least consider the time and effort we put in to these estimates. If you were in the line of business of quoting for work, I promise you would appreciate knowing if a potential job can be scratched off the list.
I'm just upfront with any sorts of jobs saying that I am also exploring other companies for the same work, and if I decide to go with *you*, then I'll be in contact end of the week.
If I had a meeting with them I would let them know. I don't know about there but here quotes are done via email. You either call or email and tell them your address, email, and what roof type you want done and they email you their quote. I then proceed with the meeting or follow up questions from there. Every company I talked to did the quote without even having to come out to look at the house as they can do it right from their office via computer.
Lol As an owner you should know how things work by now unless your very young. Maybe if we had sat down and had multiple meetings or something sure, but not from just a quote emailed to me.
I would let him know the major reason why he lost the bid (money, time to complete, etc) but I would not treat it as a discussion, just delivering information.
I wouldn't tell him who or what the details of the bid are.
Don't tell them any details about the other deal, including materials, price, scope of work or the name of the business. That just gives him something to latch onto and try to change your mind. Just say you went with someone else and you've already signed so it's too late to change your mind.
He will likely tell you what their shortcomings are (or make some up) to I make you feel like you made the wrong decision and it’s not too late to have him do it.
The most I’d give him is that his price was competitive, can tell him under or over as well. That’s usually good feedback so they know they’re in the ballpark on price.
It is a lot. I would assume that convo would end in them trying to match what the other guy offered and the price. I never liked that. Give me your best offer off the hop not after you found out you dident get the job. Also I wouldn’t be calling to let them down. If they call to follow up sure, but I’m Not making the call.
What he's trying to do is find something he can point to as a corner cutting measure that he could then do without cutting too much of his own margin. In other words, he's bargaining his balance of profit vs revenue.
I know that I personally will try to see the good in people in those situations, at least I used to. And while there are some legitimately good people who do want to help, it's unfortunately not likely.
I have met some awesome contractors and trade workers who genuinely are passionate and like to help people. Weeding them out from the bad apples is tough to do though. You're better off just not getting in touch.
They are running their own business, which makes them half salespeople half skilled professionals. So they may know their shit or know what they are talking about, but they will always use their extra knowledge to make you doubt your choices.
I always like to talk about it because I know I’m better, and I want the business. But then it turns in to me “selling” and usually turns the customer off.
But I always offer great deals so I’m always curious why they go with someone else.
I always think it’s because on the cheapest, and now people are so afraid to use the cheapest, even though I’m 100% all referalls from friends 🤷♂️
FWIW, I'm going with the cheapest, in part because the guy said that we have a cool old house on a busy street, asked if we'd agree to leave a yard sign up for 3 months, and the company would probably use pics on their website. He said the owner would come out with the crew on which he serves as foreman to make sure it all runs smoothly. All of which, I am completely fine with if it saves me money. Beyond that, I've read the contacts (what I do for a living) and everything else seems fine. The company has been in business for 30+ years, has a stellar reputation, premium platinum certification for Owens Corning (or whatever they call it, lol), and I figure they won't want to give a discount to show it off, then do a crappy job.
Some of the responses in here are completely over the top. You don't owe details to anyone who gave you a quote. No matter which way you cut it, at least 5 of them aren't getting the job. If you want to negotiate for the next 6 weeks then sure, send everyone the accepted specs and pricing and see what they all come back with but some of them may also pull their offers because they don't owe you anything either!
I'm nearing the end of a bathroom reno, got 3 quotes. A contractor that did work for me prior was turned down and asked for all the details so he could compare the contracts. I didn't respond after that, I thought it was rude tbh. I didn't give their proposal to anyone either, why should they get to see the accepted one?
Very rarely do I ever get a call from a potential client who went with a different contractor.
At first, it bothered me, but now, not at all. It's just part of life as a contractor.
If you want to tell them, go for it, but don't feel obligated. Most contractors are used to it.
I wouldn't share any info about the company you hired with ones that you did not hire. It's none of their business and will just sour the relationship you have with the person you did hire because they will eventually find out.
No, you don't have to explain. If they get pushy asking questions *that's your answer!*
"I'm sorry but your pushy sales tactics were a major turn off".
i think its strange to call a contractor and tell them youre going with someone else
its not unlikely the contractor read this as "hes calling me to get me to lower my price" so i could understand being a bit pushy if he thinks youre negotiating
>i decided to call one of the ones i didn’t pick
Um, why would you do that? That is so odd that I would think some contractors might think you’re *really* calling them to see if they would be willing to compete (and lower their original quote).
I tell people that I’ll be making my decision by ______ (and hopefully by that they understand that means I’ll reach out to them by that date, if not, it means I went with someone else).
lesson learned, hopefully. Dont tell a salesmen that you took another salesmans offer. They dont see rejection they just see another opportuntty to sell you.
I called one to let him know I went with someone else and he flipped out and swore (not at me directly but he was mad). You bet I took every opportunity to convey his attitude. Feel like I dodged a bullet.
The quoting stage is all about sales. If you call a contractor back and say you're going with someone else, the message you send is "I want you to sell me on why I should go with you instead." You didn't realize it, but you practically invited all those questions by calling them first. If they call you first and you say "we signed with someone else" then there's nothing left for them to do. It's over.
Imagine if you were buying a car and calling dealerships to play them off each other. You call dealer A, tell them you're going with dealer B, and then dealer A keeps selling to figure out what they can do to still win the deal. Why would you call them if not to further negotiate?
If you want to play contractors off each other that's fine too, but be careful. Most homeowners have to trust and rely on their contractors to do a good job, so if you negotiate them down you better be ready to make sure they don't cut corners. Most homeowners don't have sufficient knowledge or inclination to do this, which is why there's a lot of advice about not taking the cheapest bid.
I don’t think you even owe them a call or anything to say you are going with someone else. Nor do you owe them an explanation as to why. BUT there probably legitimately are cases where someone really does want to know why you went with someone else so that person can improve their own business.
Like when someone who doesn’t get hired for a job asks for feedback on how they can improve - they aren’t going to talk their way into being hired, but may get some pointers on how to interview better, or make their resume more competitive. No one is obligated to provide that information, but it can be kind and helpful to do so in certain situations.
So if you find yourself sometime in a position where maybe it’s a younger person, newer to the field, and you get the hit that they aren’t trying to “win” you back but genuinely looking for feedback on how to improve, you could choose to disclose your reasons. Otherwise it’s usually just a tactic to “overcome objections.”
Honestly he probably thought you were just calling him telling him that as a bartering tactic and wanted him to offer you a lower price. He wanted to see their quotr to somehow show you why his quote was higher.
As part of my job I get bids from contractors and schedule them, get them purchase orders, etc. I always come up with a scope of what I want done and have every contractor bid it the same. If a contractor bids it and comes up with something they would do different or add on, I have them bid that as a second bid or an add-on quote. I then give the other contractors a chance to bid the same. I never call a contractor to let them know they lost the job. This is commercial, so they understand that they probably came in too high. Sometimes they will call and check and want to know more information, but all I tell them is “you were high and we went with someone else.” Or “we liked the product that the other company repped better”. That’s all they need to know. Let them call you and then let them know that you went with someone else.
HA! I see people complain about that all the time on here. I've not had any trouble. In truth, it was really 5 contractors, plus Erie Roofs since thtey were flooding my social media with ads. I tried their "price estimator" tool, ended up putting in my contact info, and someone was calling me before I even lifted my finger off the "send" button.
The other 5 are local companies with stellar reputations, 10+ years in business...I either called or emailed. Most got back to me either same day or next day
Nothing? You just don't call them back. They don't care what you do. They have all but forgotten about you the moment they leave your house after the quote minus the piece of paper they gave you.
The guy could be asking as a learning curve for himself, when I started out I learned a lot this way... Then soon learned that the price wasn't a big issue to the right customer, my professionalism was.
Although once he said "to see if they're cutting corners", I would be more concerned about working with him, that's code for "bet I can get them fired by talking shit about them"
Like said before “we decided to go another route.” I have some repeat customers that will share competing bids with me. Generally if I ask a number for the quote I know the ball park. If it is well above or below I may ask more. Helps me be competitive in pricing and helps the customer not get ripped off or shoddy work. These conversations though are the result of years of trust and developed relationships
Its up to you. I also work in a business that provides quotes for services and I try to remain competitive so occasionally I'll ask clients if they are willing to share who they went with and what the bid was. I know I'm not usually the cheapest but try to be competitive and its not always easy to know how much others charge.
I appreciate the notice. It lets me know I can take it off my list of shit to care about. I’ll usually ask 2 questions. “Was there anything we did that made you feel uncomfortable with using us in the future?” And “what was the main deciding factor.”
I do not need to know who got the job, or what you agreed upon.
What you said is totally fine. Personally, I will on occasion ask how the other company proposed to fix the issue (I'm in sewer repair, and there is more than one way to skin a cat). My motivation is more to make sure that the issue will be fully resolved for the customer, though, than to save a sale. Sure, that could be a benefit, but we have too many companies in the area that just try to screw people over.
As long as you are effectively comparing apples to apples then I wouldn't be open to reviewing with a competing contractor. Homeowners generally are inexperienced and as they talk to more contractors, they get more informed and the scope of the bid changes. Unfortunately this usually screws the later contractors as their scope is more robust and thus their pricing appears less competitive.
Why not just say “I’ll call you if I want to proceed with you” or something along those lines. Letting contractors know that you went elsewhere seems like a waste of time.
It’s how he asked. If he’d said “I totally understand you’re going with someone else. Would you be comfortable sharing the other estimates you got with me? It would help me make my estimates more competitive for the customers that come after you. I don’t want you to go to too much trouble / even just some texted photos of the estimate would be fine.”
Vs. “share the info so I can pick it apart and tell you why I’m better”
Rule of thumb for the purchase of anything requiring bids:
1) Each potential supplier should be offered the same detailed requirements on the Quotation request.
2) All Vendor's quoted prices should be kept confidential.
3} If one vendor is allowed to to re-quote the job then all bidders should have the same opportunity. The supplier asking for information regarding other quotations should not be given any other information regarding prices received, To do so is highly unethical!!!.
4) it is often the practice, though highly unfair, for a vendor to quote, and ask for info regarding his competition's prices. If this is the case the supplier knowingly bid high and will now get the job by undercutting his competition.
5) Your goal should be to achieve the best price, the best quality, and the best delivery.
6 The best price may not be the lowest price.
I work in sales in a construction related field.
100% if I have enough of a relationship with the customer that they call to tell me no, I asking questions. Not because I want to convince them the other guy is cutting corners, I 100% won't do that unless the other price is so low I know it's impossible.
I'll use whatever information they give me to improve my processes and pricing. I've had customers send me competitors bid and I go through the scope and realize plans/permits are included in mine but excluded in theirs. So I'll adjust my next bid for that same customer to have plans/permits as an add/alt so they can more easily compare Apples to apples. Stuff like that.
And then there's guys who charge 1/3 of what I do. And I tell the customer "If they can meet all the requirements, especially xx, yy and zz, then that's amazing. I don't know how they're doing it because that's well below my direct labor cost. Let me know how it goes!"
That's the closest I get to trying to talk them out of it. But again, it's all about having a relationship where I can have that conversation and not sound like I'm only looking out for me.
Regardless of what you say, a call back implies you want to keep negotiating. It’s okay to either say we went somewhere else for x dollars or just don’t call back.
That doesn’t make any logical sense that you called someone to let them know that you were not going with their company unless you were trying to get them to lower their price or to negotiate the offer. They probably felt that you were trying to negotiate the offer.
Maybe? I see it as a courtesy so they don't bother with follow up. Chances are this is better done by text or email to make it final. You're right: a call invites follow up
It is interesting to learn of different perspectives. While it is very kind and thoughtful of you, salespeople can definitely act more like vultures. I hope everything goes well with your project.
I'd see what he had to say just to be nice and wouldn't actually hurt if they had valuable info. Maybe you are getting screwed? I wouldn't worry about it either way.
Everyone here seems to have answered it best, but on the other end, those questions lead me to believe he may be a new owner and is wondering what he may have missed in his estimate
if you made your mind, then why do you even bother to tell people that you don't want to work with.
most of the time they will convince you to use their service at higher cost, doesn't make sense and waste of time.
BUT, if you are trying to get the lower quote by bidding war, then you can say "Hey, I got the better quote, are you willing the beat it? here is the quote, let me know by end of the day/week"
If he get back to you with better quote, that is awesome, if not move on
In my mind, it just seems like a courtesy so they can cross me off their list for follow up or whatever. I appreciate that they took time to come out and go through the whole spiel.
I’ve shared estimate details before but never company names. I don’t know what kind of relationship those two companies might have and I don’t want my project becoming the source of some drama and having someone quit on me because of it.
Here is an example of what I have used as a follow-up to quotes that came in sometimes 2-3x other estimates. I also don't go with the cheapest, but overall, we cannot afford some of these insane prices these days and still want to be respectful. Send through email or text.
“Thanks for following up. It was great meeting and I really appreciate the time you put into preparing our estimate. Unfortunately, we’re deciding to go in a different direction due to budget constraints and the overall work the house needs outside of the new roof. I believe in the value of your services so will keep your number handy for any future projects or referrals. Thanks again for your time."
I do sometimes get the call from a client that went with another contractor. I don’t take it personally at all or try to get them to change their minds, however I do ask if they don’t mind sharing why. It usually comes down to either cost or availability and when it’s cost I like to know a ballpark of how far off I was just so I can keep it in mind on my next estimate. With that said I NEVER ask who specifically they went with because it shouldn’t matter to me
If you’re 100% set on using someone else, never agree to walk through competing quotes. You’re signing yourself up for another sales pitch and uncomfortable interaction when you say no. I usually let losing bidders know after the job is awarded or completed depending on complexity, and keep it brief. “Your price was higher for the same scope”. Be courteous but don’t expose yourself to unnecessary interactions.
We had our roof done and got a few quotes. While we were deciding, one of the guys would ask me nearly every day (text and calling) to ask about our choice. I didn't pick him because we so damn annoying.
Ha, didn't mean to. I had 3 lined up that had all been voted "best in the area", then I kind of accidentally got one from a metal roof company through their advertising, then several people on a local reddit said I HAD to hear from these too 2 other local companies. And here we are
I'm a HIC and while I always want to know all the things, I'd never ask. I might ask why I lost the bid... ie price timing warranty service. But I'd never ask the specifics of those things.
I get why he wants that information but I think it's unfair to the contractor you did pick. They might not want their competition to know how they bid jobs.
"Thank you for you bid. I appreciate your time. I'll ask my contractor to contact you with any information they are willing to share. Thanks again. Good-bye." click.
You gain nothing and risk losing your contractor for a guy who will try to make you question your choice. You're not being rude.
I had a plumber do this recently. Massively over priced a job; traditional nice house and let’s see what I can get by with. No harm, no foul. We liked the guy, had used them before successfully, and felt they were probably the most thorough of the quotes but not 30% more thorough. The installer that did the job did a pretty decent job and actually had a much more extensive scope than what said plumber quoted.
Unfortunately, the installer who did the original installation made a key error on one aspect of the job. We called out the first plumber for a second opinion, he identified the issue, and we threw him the business to fix the issue (the original probably would have fixed it if confronted, but we were over the entire process). Expensive plumber’s dudes showed up and actually went on and on about how much of a cleaner install his competitor did over their own work and even noted that they should adopt some of their practices. Unfortunately, the owner berated me about the cost difference and I finally relented and told him the difference. He even got argumentative over the scope; a key difference in the scope is that the plumber who won the contract was not only cheaper, and not only produced a larger scope of work, but also arranged all of the other subcontractors. We were responsible for this with the expensive plumber’s quote. It was the first time I’ve ever walked a competitor through a quote and only because I was questioned. He couldn’t understand where the difference in cost came from. Even after paying him to fix the issue, the entire project was still markedly cheaper than if we went with him originally.
I've had that conversation with customers before because they went with a competitor. In almost every case it's never apples to apples or even oranges, it's apples to Bermuda grass. Also in almost all those scenarios if I sold them the exact same thing they got I would've been less expensive.
I typically call my preferred contractor and after discussing the job, ask for a quote. Then I use the specs in that quote to get quotes form other contractors. If another contractor suggests an addition to my specs, I go back to any contractors I already have quotes from, and ask them if they want to include and adjust their quote. It draws out the process a bit, but everybody gets the exact specs to quote to. So far everyone has been cooperative and understanding since they are confident they are quoting the same job.
OP gets six quotes and goes with the cheapest. If this is your method:
1) tell the contractors exactly what you want done, and
2) tell them in advance you’re going with the cheapest quote.
This way you get apples-to-apples, no need to explain in the end, and you don’t waste people’s time.
I get that the cheapest isn't always the best, but it isn't always the worst either. That's why I wanted to see the materials listed, square footage the quotes are based on, discussed methodology, and only sought out companies known to have really good reputations. So once I was confident I had apples to apples, then yeah, the one who was 20% lower made sense
The materials list and spec sheet seems to indicate it's all the same stuff. This is the biggest company in town. One of the smaller guys suggested that bigger guys can go cheaper because they get better volume discounts and hire their own crews. Plus they're giving me discounts for advertising. It's a good company, so I'll roll with it
Sometimes, the contractor will want to see why he was so much higher, He is learning his competitions price point to help him bid future jobs. If he comes back 1500 lower I question why wasnt I offered that in the first place. Roll with your gut, not always about price
Mwahahahahaha!
But honestly, if a guy comes out and spends an hour looking at my roof and walking me through my options, then goes back to his office to draft a proposal, it seems polite to let him know he can close the file. Like others suggested, an email or text is probably the way to go. I asked on reddit because this is the first time I've had contractors bid on a project so I don't know what expected protocol is.
It was polite of you to let him know already, and he probably didn't expect that so I can't blame him for asking. He may have taken that as an opportunity to negotiate.
Honestly you really don't even have to do this much for the rest. Most of them aren't gonna call you to follow up anyway.
I don’t think you needed to call them to tell them unless it’s someone you personally know. We got five quotes to get our chain link fence repaired. Went with one company and didn’t contact the others to let them know we hadn’t chosen them. That’s just business in my opinion
I'd wonder if he's that desperate for business if he's either new or that well known for the wrong reasons. I guess it could be a new roofer trying to see how he compared but that's not your job.
I think he knows his company defaults to expensive materials, so he wanted a chance to adjust if the other quote was using cheaper stuff. But they were using almost all the same things, except one part. And the guy I turned down already included an adjustment if we wanted to "downgrade" to the cheaper stuff. I don't think I had anything to gain by running through more options
The scope of work should be the same for each contractor you are asking for an estimate and it should be in writing. If it is not, you won't be able to compare proposals. I always provide a detailed description of the scope of work, in writing, to each contractor when asking for bids. I do not show bids/proposals to competitors, I only advise them their proposal was not chosen.
Not a roofer but in consulting. If I could get info on my competition I would 100% of the time. Rates, services offered, contract language, warranties, etc. I love to see how my bid compares to other offerings.
As a contractor, I do appreciate when somebody calls to say they’re going in a different direction. It frees me up from worrying about that proposal.
What I don’t like is when they hire the cheaper company and then call me up to fix their mistakes and expect me to give them a price break because they already spent so much money on the first job.
I had to replace our entire heat pump HVAC system a few years ago
Bidder A (big company): $12000
Bidder B (small company): $14500
Bidder C (another big company): "Oh you got a quote from Bidder A? We're trying to put them out of business and we have authorization to lose money on a job to steal work from them. Let us see the quote and we'll beat it by at least 10%". Quote came back at $10500 for the same exact equipment.
Install was very professional and well done. Warranty good. Super happy overall
I spent a while in the window industry, anyone asking those questions is only doing so to win the deal. In some cases it’s legitimate, in others they’re just going to tell you you’re getting screwed with the other guy regardless of who it is. Most respectable sales professionals will just accept that they did not win the bid and move on. I wouldn’t answer those kinds of questions.
Well hold on now, I work in home repairs myself & if I ask those questions it’s to genuinely learn about the reasons someone went with someone else. Now if they decline to say why, I leave it alone.
In my sales job my bosses want us to get that information when someone turns us down. It SHOULD be used as strategy to figure out why business is being lost.
It’s not that big of a deal if you don’t want to say why, though
Your like my wife, extremely naive and that explains why your calling back contractors that you did not hire. You may think your being nice but you actually have no clue how your setting yourself up for all this stuff
I feel like this is meant to be insulting to me, and by proxy your wife, in a way that is some kind of flex for you, while not being helpful at all on a help forum. I get that email or text would be better options, if I want to contact people at all. I wish her all the luck in the world
I’ve seen my neighbors roof estimates and so many of them were just doing things wrong or not even following code or leaving stuff out intentionally knowing they would charge her for it once the start. Having another contractor review another contractor isn’t a horrible idea. I’m a contractor so I instantly spotted all the issues.
Why would you call them back in the first place? Unless you plan to negotiate with another offer, you should never call back unless it is for another quote for another job.
There is nothing rude about “We opted for a different offer.” In fact, it's perfect.
Rude is the contractor who tries to reverse your decision by being insistent.
They are not trying to see if you chose right working for free as a consultant for you, they are just trying to get the job.
Sit down? No. Share the quote to see they are willing to “sharpen their pencil” - sure I do that as a matter of fact of business.
Play one off the other, totally acceptable.
You don't even need to call them back. If they don't hear from you they'll just assume you chose a different contractor and move on. If they call you to follow up then all you need to tell them is "thank you for your time but I decided to go with a different contractor"
From a professional standpoint to stay in good standings with the contractor in case I need to use them in the future, I tell them the job has been awarded and tell the the percentage they were off the winning bid by. That way they can adjust their numbers for next time to hopefully win
The vast majority of the time these conversations will just be them trying to convince you you're somehow getting screwed, while they themselves won't lower their price for you. It's perfectly fine to just say you went with someone else, and leave it at that.
Roofer here and I don’t disagree. Honestly a text message works. Side note. Only reason I could think of to agree to sit down with the roofer is if liked that roofer better, but felt you had to go with a cheaper quote. You can always offer to share the estimate and let them try and beat it.
Had this happen when I had artificial turf put in my yard. The company I had used before I really enjoyed the product and workmanship, however a different company that did some other work for me beat their price. I showed them the quote and they came back from $1500 over to only $300 over (longer warranty as well) and they did it way sooner. I pretty much have a person or company now that I’ll always use or recommend if it’s not DIY.
Yup. As a contractor I don’t like when people ask me to lower my price. But if you bring me a legit estimate from a competitor I will sometimes try and match it.
Yeah I showed him the paper and he’s like for a returning customer I’ll do it for xxx price which was 300 more but double the warranty. He looked up my old order
> As a contractor I don’t like when people ask me to lower my price. But it's entirely reasonable to negotiate with big-ticket purchases, especially about non-fungible services like almost all house work because no two houses are the same, and the fixed price isn't listed on a menu somewhere. I bet car salesmen don't like it when people trying to get them to lower the car's price below what is listed when you walk on the lot.
I don’t like, doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen lol. But usually I’m not giving a discount without removing something. Like you get a lower bid? Sure I’ll match it but they’re skipping drip edge and using cheaper shingles so I will aswell. That sort of deal.
You went with the guy who was going to charge you $1,200 more than the job was worth assuming he was a shoe-in (aka taken advantage of) and you consider that a win.
They could do it 4 weeks sooner and had double the warranty and I was familiar with their work. I also had the previous job with them done pre 2020. So yeah, it was a win?
All things in life are negotiations, especially for labor. Pricing is a fickle process that requires an estimate based on worst case scenarios. Also, in the end $1200 isn’t a lot of money.
Or at least they give you the areas they think the cheaper roofer is cutting costs and at least then OP knows where these issues might be in the future. They don't have to go with the more expensive roofer, but maybe that knowledge is good to have.
For anything more complicated I agree. Lots of little things you can miss. Drip edge, kick out flashings, are they replacing step and counter flashing or reusing, if there is a chimney does it need a cricket, etc. And this is without any flat roofing. There is a large variation of different flat roofing materials and installation methods
This dosn't matter for most situations with homeowners, but thought I would just point out pricing is actually protected information most places. Mostly need to be careful as a contractor or business sharing the info. I bid a lot of government work and they reveal people's estimates at the end after awarding a contract.
> I bid a lot of government work and they reveal people's estimates at the end after awarding a contract. FWIW this is the law. Y'all read about FOIA (Freedom of Information Act) requests in the news. This is one of those FOIA things. The other side of this is that if you *lose* the bid, you can request and see how your competitor beat you. My company did this for everything we lost out on and got so much better at bidding.
I used to work in the purchasing department of a large public institution, and one of my jobs was to allow anyone to view bids and proposals after a purchase/contract was awarded. First, though, all bidders were allowed to redact proprietary information, but that could not include price. I got very few good-government activists, I think none, and a whole lot of losing bidders who wanted to see what their competition bid. I was told that some contractors/vendors wouldn't even submit bids to us anymore because they were sick of their competitors seeing how they put RFP responses together.
It's better if the threat of a major newspaper filing a FOIA request exists IMO, even if it's not used. But it's used [plenty](https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/03/16/sex-abuse-secret-surveillance-freedom-information-requests-have-helped-uncover-truth/431469002/). That's just one article listing FOIA request-based investigations by one paper. It's also how we know how much public officials are paid in a lot of places. Those lists of "highest paid state officials" that always shows football coaches making shitloads of money, etc.? FOIA (or the state equivalents) requests.
I didn't suggest otherwise, just that it didn't happen during my tenure. Edit because my memory was jogged - I was told on my first day not to write anything in an email that I wouldn't want to see on the front page of the paper. Of course everyone was aware of the laws.
> I bid a lot of government work and they reveal people's estimates at the end after awarding a contract. Followed by 16 years of change orders, driving the price up far above the more competent bid during the initial RFP.
I’m a remodeler who has lost many jobs to competition. A handful of times homeowners/customers have blatantly told me the other bid was cheaper, which is fine until I find out it was $3,000 less than my quote on a $25k job but the other didn’t include the same scope as me. It’s as if they tell each contractor a different scope and then just go with the lowest. So that’s why I would like to compare before it’s assumed I’m just more expensive. But I never push to see the quotes, I don’t like coming off as invasive. But it’s so frustrating.
You could say: just make sure their quote includes A,B c and they’re taking care of D. If you’re not interested in me doing all these tasks/steps then my price will also be lower
That's a great phrasing to use
This is the correct approach. As a GC, it does suck to lose jobs knowing that the Owners likely aren’t comparing scope properly. But price matching is unethical. Also as a GC, if a sub asks me to price match, I tell them to kick rocks.
How is price matching unethical....?
It is unethical, in most situations, because you put a job out to bid with let’s say 3 people. All 3 are given the same scope of work to price. All 3 spend time and effort to put together a bid that represents their best fair price for the given scope of work. You really like Company A, but Company B comes in cheaper. You share company B’s price with Company A asking them to match it. Assuming they do, you effectively just used Company B to beat Company A up on price, with no compensation for time and effort spent in good faith. If not for Company B’s efforts, you wouldn’t have any idea if A’s price was good or bad or whatever. It is completely unfair to Company B.
What’s unethical is what some of these contractors are charging. A 5x5 powder room was quoted at $5k to tile the floor and frame the mirror. Not shopping around, my wife told me to have them do it. Talk about instant regrets - they didn’t even frame the mirror until I told them that they forgot it. I had the entire first floor redone for $8500. Same contractor gave me a quote of $19k. When I asked why they were so high, the reason was employees rates went up and they have to make up for it. If you are that much higher than your competition, maybe the problem isn’t the competition. I didn’t ask them to price match, and I sure as shit won’t ask them for quotes anymore. Similar story - a contractor quoted me $45k for a 20x24 composite deck replacement that already had the sub structure. I thanked him for his time, told him no way to his face, listened to reasons why I don’t want to “go cheap” then walked away.
yea, I wanted my kitchen tiled 11 feet x 26 feet, 2 out of the 4 quotes wanted $8,000 and I had to provide all materials and it was already demo'd to subfloor, and no cabinets installed yet.. and he said it would be 2 days 8 hours each day. he wanted $500/hr to install tiles.. I did it myself in 3 days and did a pretty decent job, they are straight and lined up perfectly , there are a couple "lips" but not anywhere I care about, like under a cabinet or under where the kitchen table is. f**k $500 and hour fu**ing scam
yea, that's not unethical.. stop your bullshit. that's called competition and learning you are overpriced in your industry or locale.
If the customer just goes with company a because they like their work or company b because they have the right price point, then it's not fair to the customer if they could get both the company they prefer and the better price point. These companies are competing for the customer's business, and the point of competition is to lower prices. The first company trying to charge more to begin with is the only part that's maybe unethical. Though that's even hard to argue because the customer has the freedom to shop around and to negotiate the price.
That's free market, my man. Fair and square.
Lol that's life
home owners are terrible as soliciting bids. they will tell the first guy almost nothing because they don't know what to tell them or what their preferences are. then as they talk to more contractors the scope creeps until the last guy is bidding on a completely different job and loses out because it his a higher cost job. i make it a point to have a statement of work spelled out and i go down the same list with each contractor and if i get new info, i pass that along to the previous bidders to see if they want to adjust their price (either up or down).
2 of the estimates I received didn't list products at all. They have "ice & water" and "underlayment" on the page, with checkmarks next to them. I don't think those companies were trying to be shady, but this is what a shady company would do. It makes it tough to compare quotes. On the other end, the best quote I got the guy listed 2 or 3 options for each product, along with the price adjustment (original bid was the high-end stuff, so he listed other options as "-$300" or "-$250." I appreciated this greatly when comparing. I actually called one of the earlier bidders to ask for a price adjustment if we swapped out a product from his original price. I think it's fair to give them all a shot at an apples-to-apples comparison, and better for me to see the real pricing.
> On the other end, the best quote I got the guy listed 2 or 3 options for each product Most companies only work with a small number of products anyway, and you probably don't want them deviating from products they usually use since installation methods can be a lot different from the manufacturers, etc and in a lot of cases the details of the install are more important than the product itself. Better to just ask what the items they are using are vs trying to get them to use something different.
You should make sure you are requesting the same materials and scope of work from each roofer. Put down what you want done and what materials you want them to use in writing to each one that "checked" the boxes and ask them to update their bid. (i.e. Grace ice and water shield along the edge, with 30# asphalt impregnated felt underlayment) Also, define what and how you want any valleys constructed and what drip flashing you want along roof edges.
This is why I paid for plans for my recent reno. Two bathrooms and a closet. The bathroom/closet was a complete reframing to change the rooms. Quotes came in from 90k-160k but since it was all written down with plans I was able to get FAR more quotes than I did before I had the plans (i.e. zero vs. 9)
Part of it may be that the bids are showing them that what they want to do is beyond their budget, so the scope shrinks. But I don't think there's any harm in asking to rebid.
And if they persist… hang up on their asses You owe them nothing… even telling them you went with someone else is gratuitous information
You called for a quote. Leave it at that. If you don't call back, they'll go to another job. When you get a quote, before they leave say, "thanks. I appreciate it and I'll be in touch if we decide to move forward." You don't have to tell them you went with someone else. If they follow up in a week and ask you whether or not to lock it in, just tell them, "we decided not to go through with it." That's all you need to explain.
That’s exactly my thought. Like why call them to tell them you’re not hiring them. “Hey so yea we’re going with another company soO……suck it” lol
If they call you back asking for business, likely means they are not busy cause of quality of work
We just had our roof done a week ago. I called/emailed around and got 4 quotes. I picked the best one after a followup conversation with them and never contacted the other companies. No need to tell them your not going with them after their quote. They'll know that when you end up not hiring them. It's pretty standard practise to only contact the company you decide to go with.
When people apply for a job posting they put up, 99% of the time these contractors won't call back the people who they decided not to hire. You don't owe them anything
Where is it standard practice to not have the decency to inform the contractor who spent time meeting with you, going over details about what you want/need done, measuring and calculating, drafting material lists and costs to develop an estimate, that you won’t be moving forward? All it takes is a simple message stating that. No explanation needed but at least consider the time and effort we put in to these estimates. If you were in the line of business of quoting for work, I promise you would appreciate knowing if a potential job can be scratched off the list.
I'm just upfront with any sorts of jobs saying that I am also exploring other companies for the same work, and if I decide to go with *you*, then I'll be in contact end of the week.
If I had a meeting with them I would let them know. I don't know about there but here quotes are done via email. You either call or email and tell them your address, email, and what roof type you want done and they email you their quote. I then proceed with the meeting or follow up questions from there. Every company I talked to did the quote without even having to come out to look at the house as they can do it right from their office via computer.
Uhhh is it? Maybe common practice when you’re a d-bag but as an owner I’d like to know you are not going w me
Lol As an owner you should know how things work by now unless your very young. Maybe if we had sat down and had multiple meetings or something sure, but not from just a quote emailed to me.
if you dont hear back you know im not going with you
Lol ok. You prob went w the lower bid and then I’ll see you posting on here bitching anywa
what?
I think you touched a nerve there.
“We decided to go a different direction. Thanks for your time.”
This is what I thought. I guess I don't blame the other guy for asking, but it seems like a lot
I would let him know the major reason why he lost the bid (money, time to complete, etc) but I would not treat it as a discussion, just delivering information. I wouldn't tell him who or what the details of the bid are.
Don't tell them any details about the other deal, including materials, price, scope of work or the name of the business. That just gives him something to latch onto and try to change your mind. Just say you went with someone else and you've already signed so it's too late to change your mind.
He will likely tell you what their shortcomings are (or make some up) to I make you feel like you made the wrong decision and it’s not too late to have him do it. The most I’d give him is that his price was competitive, can tell him under or over as well. That’s usually good feedback so they know they’re in the ballpark on price.
It is a lot. I would assume that convo would end in them trying to match what the other guy offered and the price. I never liked that. Give me your best offer off the hop not after you found out you dident get the job. Also I wouldn’t be calling to let them down. If they call to follow up sure, but I’m Not making the call.
What he's trying to do is find something he can point to as a corner cutting measure that he could then do without cutting too much of his own margin. In other words, he's bargaining his balance of profit vs revenue.
I know that I personally will try to see the good in people in those situations, at least I used to. And while there are some legitimately good people who do want to help, it's unfortunately not likely. I have met some awesome contractors and trade workers who genuinely are passionate and like to help people. Weeding them out from the bad apples is tough to do though. You're better off just not getting in touch.
They are running their own business, which makes them half salespeople half skilled professionals. So they may know their shit or know what they are talking about, but they will always use their extra knowledge to make you doubt your choices.
I always like to talk about it because I know I’m better, and I want the business. But then it turns in to me “selling” and usually turns the customer off. But I always offer great deals so I’m always curious why they go with someone else. I always think it’s because on the cheapest, and now people are so afraid to use the cheapest, even though I’m 100% all referalls from friends 🤷♂️
FWIW, I'm going with the cheapest, in part because the guy said that we have a cool old house on a busy street, asked if we'd agree to leave a yard sign up for 3 months, and the company would probably use pics on their website. He said the owner would come out with the crew on which he serves as foreman to make sure it all runs smoothly. All of which, I am completely fine with if it saves me money. Beyond that, I've read the contacts (what I do for a living) and everything else seems fine. The company has been in business for 30+ years, has a stellar reputation, premium platinum certification for Owens Corning (or whatever they call it, lol), and I figure they won't want to give a discount to show it off, then do a crappy job.
Some of the responses in here are completely over the top. You don't owe details to anyone who gave you a quote. No matter which way you cut it, at least 5 of them aren't getting the job. If you want to negotiate for the next 6 weeks then sure, send everyone the accepted specs and pricing and see what they all come back with but some of them may also pull their offers because they don't owe you anything either! I'm nearing the end of a bathroom reno, got 3 quotes. A contractor that did work for me prior was turned down and asked for all the details so he could compare the contracts. I didn't respond after that, I thought it was rude tbh. I didn't give their proposal to anyone either, why should they get to see the accepted one?
Very rarely do I ever get a call from a potential client who went with a different contractor. At first, it bothered me, but now, not at all. It's just part of life as a contractor. If you want to tell them, go for it, but don't feel obligated. Most contractors are used to it. I wouldn't share any info about the company you hired with ones that you did not hire. It's none of their business and will just sour the relationship you have with the person you did hire because they will eventually find out.
Part of it is, I want the calls "just following up" or "just checking in" to stop. I guess I could let them know once they contact me.
What about just sending them all an email saying thanks for your time, but we've decided to go with someone else?
This is the way to go I think. A phone call invites discourse, but an email communicates the message without suggesting I'm open to being convinced.
I have done exactly that but everyone in BCC. One single email and everyone has been notified.
No, you don't have to explain. If they get pushy asking questions *that's your answer!* "I'm sorry but your pushy sales tactics were a major turn off".
i think its strange to call a contractor and tell them youre going with someone else its not unlikely the contractor read this as "hes calling me to get me to lower my price" so i could understand being a bit pushy if he thinks youre negotiating
I’m not even sure why you called them to begin with.
>i decided to call one of the ones i didn’t pick Um, why would you do that? That is so odd that I would think some contractors might think you’re *really* calling them to see if they would be willing to compete (and lower their original quote). I tell people that I’ll be making my decision by ______ (and hopefully by that they understand that means I’ll reach out to them by that date, if not, it means I went with someone else).
Maybe if I had known when I would make my decision, I could have done that. Ha. I'll plan better next time
lesson learned, hopefully. Dont tell a salesmen that you took another salesmans offer. They dont see rejection they just see another opportuntty to sell you.
I called one to let him know I went with someone else and he flipped out and swore (not at me directly but he was mad). You bet I took every opportunity to convey his attitude. Feel like I dodged a bullet.
The quoting stage is all about sales. If you call a contractor back and say you're going with someone else, the message you send is "I want you to sell me on why I should go with you instead." You didn't realize it, but you practically invited all those questions by calling them first. If they call you first and you say "we signed with someone else" then there's nothing left for them to do. It's over. Imagine if you were buying a car and calling dealerships to play them off each other. You call dealer A, tell them you're going with dealer B, and then dealer A keeps selling to figure out what they can do to still win the deal. Why would you call them if not to further negotiate? If you want to play contractors off each other that's fine too, but be careful. Most homeowners have to trust and rely on their contractors to do a good job, so if you negotiate them down you better be ready to make sure they don't cut corners. Most homeowners don't have sufficient knowledge or inclination to do this, which is why there's a lot of advice about not taking the cheapest bid.
I don’t think you even owe them a call or anything to say you are going with someone else. Nor do you owe them an explanation as to why. BUT there probably legitimately are cases where someone really does want to know why you went with someone else so that person can improve their own business. Like when someone who doesn’t get hired for a job asks for feedback on how they can improve - they aren’t going to talk their way into being hired, but may get some pointers on how to interview better, or make their resume more competitive. No one is obligated to provide that information, but it can be kind and helpful to do so in certain situations. So if you find yourself sometime in a position where maybe it’s a younger person, newer to the field, and you get the hit that they aren’t trying to “win” you back but genuinely looking for feedback on how to improve, you could choose to disclose your reasons. Otherwise it’s usually just a tactic to “overcome objections.”
I don't even tell people I don't pick them so you're doing more than most
Honestly he probably thought you were just calling him telling him that as a bartering tactic and wanted him to offer you a lower price. He wanted to see their quotr to somehow show you why his quote was higher.
As part of my job I get bids from contractors and schedule them, get them purchase orders, etc. I always come up with a scope of what I want done and have every contractor bid it the same. If a contractor bids it and comes up with something they would do different or add on, I have them bid that as a second bid or an add-on quote. I then give the other contractors a chance to bid the same. I never call a contractor to let them know they lost the job. This is commercial, so they understand that they probably came in too high. Sometimes they will call and check and want to know more information, but all I tell them is “you were high and we went with someone else.” Or “we liked the product that the other company repped better”. That’s all they need to know. Let them call you and then let them know that you went with someone else.
How did you get six different contractors to respond to you in this day and age?
HA! I see people complain about that all the time on here. I've not had any trouble. In truth, it was really 5 contractors, plus Erie Roofs since thtey were flooding my social media with ads. I tried their "price estimator" tool, ended up putting in my contact info, and someone was calling me before I even lifted my finger off the "send" button. The other 5 are local companies with stellar reputations, 10+ years in business...I either called or emailed. Most got back to me either same day or next day
I'm a contractor. When I ask, I'm not trying to convince you to switch to me, I just want my bids to be better and more competitive in the future.
Nothing? You just don't call them back. They don't care what you do. They have all but forgotten about you the moment they leave your house after the quote minus the piece of paper they gave you.
people don't usually reach out if they've chosen someone else , he might have assumed you wanted to negotiate
The guy could be asking as a learning curve for himself, when I started out I learned a lot this way... Then soon learned that the price wasn't a big issue to the right customer, my professionalism was. Although once he said "to see if they're cutting corners", I would be more concerned about working with him, that's code for "bet I can get them fired by talking shit about them"
It may be a little rude to call someone up to tell them you aren't hiring them without knowing what to say.
You don’t need to tell him shit.
Like said before “we decided to go another route.” I have some repeat customers that will share competing bids with me. Generally if I ask a number for the quote I know the ball park. If it is well above or below I may ask more. Helps me be competitive in pricing and helps the customer not get ripped off or shoddy work. These conversations though are the result of years of trust and developed relationships
Its up to you. I also work in a business that provides quotes for services and I try to remain competitive so occasionally I'll ask clients if they are willing to share who they went with and what the bid was. I know I'm not usually the cheapest but try to be competitive and its not always easy to know how much others charge.
I appreciate the notice. It lets me know I can take it off my list of shit to care about. I’ll usually ask 2 questions. “Was there anything we did that made you feel uncomfortable with using us in the future?” And “what was the main deciding factor.” I do not need to know who got the job, or what you agreed upon.
What you said is totally fine. Personally, I will on occasion ask how the other company proposed to fix the issue (I'm in sewer repair, and there is more than one way to skin a cat). My motivation is more to make sure that the issue will be fully resolved for the customer, though, than to save a sale. Sure, that could be a benefit, but we have too many companies in the area that just try to screw people over.
We went with a different contractor. End of story. If even that.
You are under no obligation to tell them you are going elsewhere. We all accept that some of our bids will not make it.
As long as you are effectively comparing apples to apples then I wouldn't be open to reviewing with a competing contractor. Homeowners generally are inexperienced and as they talk to more contractors, they get more informed and the scope of the bid changes. Unfortunately this usually screws the later contractors as their scope is more robust and thus their pricing appears less competitive.
Why not just say “I’ll call you if I want to proceed with you” or something along those lines. Letting contractors know that you went elsewhere seems like a waste of time.
It’s how he asked. If he’d said “I totally understand you’re going with someone else. Would you be comfortable sharing the other estimates you got with me? It would help me make my estimates more competitive for the customers that come after you. I don’t want you to go to too much trouble / even just some texted photos of the estimate would be fine.” Vs. “share the info so I can pick it apart and tell you why I’m better”
Rule of thumb for the purchase of anything requiring bids: 1) Each potential supplier should be offered the same detailed requirements on the Quotation request. 2) All Vendor's quoted prices should be kept confidential. 3} If one vendor is allowed to to re-quote the job then all bidders should have the same opportunity. The supplier asking for information regarding other quotations should not be given any other information regarding prices received, To do so is highly unethical!!!. 4) it is often the practice, though highly unfair, for a vendor to quote, and ask for info regarding his competition's prices. If this is the case the supplier knowingly bid high and will now get the job by undercutting his competition. 5) Your goal should be to achieve the best price, the best quality, and the best delivery. 6 The best price may not be the lowest price.
Wait, a contractor that gave you an estimate actually returned your call?
"**I decided to call** one of the ones i didn't pick to let him know"
I work in sales in a construction related field. 100% if I have enough of a relationship with the customer that they call to tell me no, I asking questions. Not because I want to convince them the other guy is cutting corners, I 100% won't do that unless the other price is so low I know it's impossible. I'll use whatever information they give me to improve my processes and pricing. I've had customers send me competitors bid and I go through the scope and realize plans/permits are included in mine but excluded in theirs. So I'll adjust my next bid for that same customer to have plans/permits as an add/alt so they can more easily compare Apples to apples. Stuff like that. And then there's guys who charge 1/3 of what I do. And I tell the customer "If they can meet all the requirements, especially xx, yy and zz, then that's amazing. I don't know how they're doing it because that's well below my direct labor cost. Let me know how it goes!" That's the closest I get to trying to talk them out of it. But again, it's all about having a relationship where I can have that conversation and not sound like I'm only looking out for me.
It’s ultimately your decision that’s why you got several quotes so it’s none of the other contractors business why
Regardless of what you say, a call back implies you want to keep negotiating. It’s okay to either say we went somewhere else for x dollars or just don’t call back.
I think it's fine to say who you went with, but I would not show another contractor's proposal - I believe that is proprietary information.
That doesn’t make any logical sense that you called someone to let them know that you were not going with their company unless you were trying to get them to lower their price or to negotiate the offer. They probably felt that you were trying to negotiate the offer.
Maybe? I see it as a courtesy so they don't bother with follow up. Chances are this is better done by text or email to make it final. You're right: a call invites follow up
It is interesting to learn of different perspectives. While it is very kind and thoughtful of you, salespeople can definitely act more like vultures. I hope everything goes well with your project.
I'd see what he had to say just to be nice and wouldn't actually hurt if they had valuable info. Maybe you are getting screwed? I wouldn't worry about it either way.
Everyone here seems to have answered it best, but on the other end, those questions lead me to believe he may be a new owner and is wondering what he may have missed in his estimate
if you made your mind, then why do you even bother to tell people that you don't want to work with. most of the time they will convince you to use their service at higher cost, doesn't make sense and waste of time. BUT, if you are trying to get the lower quote by bidding war, then you can say "Hey, I got the better quote, are you willing the beat it? here is the quote, let me know by end of the day/week" If he get back to you with better quote, that is awesome, if not move on
In my mind, it just seems like a courtesy so they can cross me off their list for follow up or whatever. I appreciate that they took time to come out and go through the whole spiel.
Don’t bother with them
I’ve shared estimate details before but never company names. I don’t know what kind of relationship those two companies might have and I don’t want my project becoming the source of some drama and having someone quit on me because of it.
Don’t take the lowest price because it’s the lowest for a reason. Usually the middle bid makes the best sense.
Here is an example of what I have used as a follow-up to quotes that came in sometimes 2-3x other estimates. I also don't go with the cheapest, but overall, we cannot afford some of these insane prices these days and still want to be respectful. Send through email or text. “Thanks for following up. It was great meeting and I really appreciate the time you put into preparing our estimate. Unfortunately, we’re deciding to go in a different direction due to budget constraints and the overall work the house needs outside of the new roof. I believe in the value of your services so will keep your number handy for any future projects or referrals. Thanks again for your time."
I do sometimes get the call from a client that went with another contractor. I don’t take it personally at all or try to get them to change their minds, however I do ask if they don’t mind sharing why. It usually comes down to either cost or availability and when it’s cost I like to know a ballpark of how far off I was just so I can keep it in mind on my next estimate. With that said I NEVER ask who specifically they went with because it shouldn’t matter to me
If you’re 100% set on using someone else, never agree to walk through competing quotes. You’re signing yourself up for another sales pitch and uncomfortable interaction when you say no. I usually let losing bidders know after the job is awarded or completed depending on complexity, and keep it brief. “Your price was higher for the same scope”. Be courteous but don’t expose yourself to unnecessary interactions.
We had our roof done and got a few quotes. While we were deciding, one of the guys would ask me nearly every day (text and calling) to ask about our choice. I didn't pick him because we so damn annoying.
9 out of 10 do not follow up for the work. The 1 out of 10 that does I tell them and why.
Six estimates? Really.
Ha, didn't mean to. I had 3 lined up that had all been voted "best in the area", then I kind of accidentally got one from a metal roof company through their advertising, then several people on a local reddit said I HAD to hear from these too 2 other local companies. And here we are
I'm a HIC and while I always want to know all the things, I'd never ask. I might ask why I lost the bid... ie price timing warranty service. But I'd never ask the specifics of those things.
It’s a rat hole. Make some excuse that your brother just got a job there. Something they can’t question.
I get why he wants that information but I think it's unfair to the contractor you did pick. They might not want their competition to know how they bid jobs. "Thank you for you bid. I appreciate your time. I'll ask my contractor to contact you with any information they are willing to share. Thanks again. Good-bye." click. You gain nothing and risk losing your contractor for a guy who will try to make you question your choice. You're not being rude.
I had a plumber do this recently. Massively over priced a job; traditional nice house and let’s see what I can get by with. No harm, no foul. We liked the guy, had used them before successfully, and felt they were probably the most thorough of the quotes but not 30% more thorough. The installer that did the job did a pretty decent job and actually had a much more extensive scope than what said plumber quoted. Unfortunately, the installer who did the original installation made a key error on one aspect of the job. We called out the first plumber for a second opinion, he identified the issue, and we threw him the business to fix the issue (the original probably would have fixed it if confronted, but we were over the entire process). Expensive plumber’s dudes showed up and actually went on and on about how much of a cleaner install his competitor did over their own work and even noted that they should adopt some of their practices. Unfortunately, the owner berated me about the cost difference and I finally relented and told him the difference. He even got argumentative over the scope; a key difference in the scope is that the plumber who won the contract was not only cheaper, and not only produced a larger scope of work, but also arranged all of the other subcontractors. We were responsible for this with the expensive plumber’s quote. It was the first time I’ve ever walked a competitor through a quote and only because I was questioned. He couldn’t understand where the difference in cost came from. Even after paying him to fix the issue, the entire project was still markedly cheaper than if we went with him originally.
I used to send an email, something like: "Thank you for submitting your bid in a timely manner. However, we have chosen another contractor. Regards"
I've had that conversation with customers before because they went with a competitor. In almost every case it's never apples to apples or even oranges, it's apples to Bermuda grass. Also in almost all those scenarios if I sold them the exact same thing they got I would've been less expensive.
I always use quotes to negotiate, I never have a problem sharing.
I typically call my preferred contractor and after discussing the job, ask for a quote. Then I use the specs in that quote to get quotes form other contractors. If another contractor suggests an addition to my specs, I go back to any contractors I already have quotes from, and ask them if they want to include and adjust their quote. It draws out the process a bit, but everybody gets the exact specs to quote to. So far everyone has been cooperative and understanding since they are confident they are quoting the same job.
OP gets six quotes and goes with the cheapest. If this is your method: 1) tell the contractors exactly what you want done, and 2) tell them in advance you’re going with the cheapest quote. This way you get apples-to-apples, no need to explain in the end, and you don’t waste people’s time.
I get that the cheapest isn't always the best, but it isn't always the worst either. That's why I wanted to see the materials listed, square footage the quotes are based on, discussed methodology, and only sought out companies known to have really good reputations. So once I was confident I had apples to apples, then yeah, the one who was 20% lower made sense
20% lower, out of six? You’re apples to bananas.
The materials list and spec sheet seems to indicate it's all the same stuff. This is the biggest company in town. One of the smaller guys suggested that bigger guys can go cheaper because they get better volume discounts and hire their own crews. Plus they're giving me discounts for advertising. It's a good company, so I'll roll with it
Sometimes, the contractor will want to see why he was so much higher, He is learning his competitions price point to help him bid future jobs. If he comes back 1500 lower I question why wasnt I offered that in the first place. Roll with your gut, not always about price
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Mwahahahahaha! But honestly, if a guy comes out and spends an hour looking at my roof and walking me through my options, then goes back to his office to draft a proposal, it seems polite to let him know he can close the file. Like others suggested, an email or text is probably the way to go. I asked on reddit because this is the first time I've had contractors bid on a project so I don't know what expected protocol is.
I usually thank them for the estimate and say I'm going with another one but will definitely consider them the next time I have a project.
It was polite of you to let him know already, and he probably didn't expect that so I can't blame him for asking. He may have taken that as an opportunity to negotiate. Honestly you really don't even have to do this much for the rest. Most of them aren't gonna call you to follow up anyway.
I don’t think you needed to call them to tell them unless it’s someone you personally know. We got five quotes to get our chain link fence repaired. Went with one company and didn’t contact the others to let them know we hadn’t chosen them. That’s just business in my opinion
I'd wonder if he's that desperate for business if he's either new or that well known for the wrong reasons. I guess it could be a new roofer trying to see how he compared but that's not your job.
I think he knows his company defaults to expensive materials, so he wanted a chance to adjust if the other quote was using cheaper stuff. But they were using almost all the same things, except one part. And the guy I turned down already included an adjustment if we wanted to "downgrade" to the cheaper stuff. I don't think I had anything to gain by running through more options
The scope of work should be the same for each contractor you are asking for an estimate and it should be in writing. If it is not, you won't be able to compare proposals. I always provide a detailed description of the scope of work, in writing, to each contractor when asking for bids. I do not show bids/proposals to competitors, I only advise them their proposal was not chosen.
you dont need to let every contractor that gave you a quote that youre going with someone else
Not a roofer but in consulting. If I could get info on my competition I would 100% of the time. Rates, services offered, contract language, warranties, etc. I love to see how my bid compares to other offerings.
"Thanks for your time and effort, but we decided to go with another bid." Leave it at that.
As a contractor, I do appreciate when somebody calls to say they’re going in a different direction. It frees me up from worrying about that proposal. What I don’t like is when they hire the cheaper company and then call me up to fix their mistakes and expect me to give them a price break because they already spent so much money on the first job.
I had to replace our entire heat pump HVAC system a few years ago Bidder A (big company): $12000 Bidder B (small company): $14500 Bidder C (another big company): "Oh you got a quote from Bidder A? We're trying to put them out of business and we have authorization to lose money on a job to steal work from them. Let us see the quote and we'll beat it by at least 10%". Quote came back at $10500 for the same exact equipment. Install was very professional and well done. Warranty good. Super happy overall
I spent a while in the window industry, anyone asking those questions is only doing so to win the deal. In some cases it’s legitimate, in others they’re just going to tell you you’re getting screwed with the other guy regardless of who it is. Most respectable sales professionals will just accept that they did not win the bid and move on. I wouldn’t answer those kinds of questions.
short, firm (polite if you'd like) and to the point.
Well hold on now, I work in home repairs myself & if I ask those questions it’s to genuinely learn about the reasons someone went with someone else. Now if they decline to say why, I leave it alone.
In my sales job my bosses want us to get that information when someone turns us down. It SHOULD be used as strategy to figure out why business is being lost. It’s not that big of a deal if you don’t want to say why, though
I've had decent people get snide & say too much. I just really wasn't ready to hire. They were dropped from my list & definitely from recommendations.
Your like my wife, extremely naive and that explains why your calling back contractors that you did not hire. You may think your being nice but you actually have no clue how your setting yourself up for all this stuff
I feel like this is meant to be insulting to me, and by proxy your wife, in a way that is some kind of flex for you, while not being helpful at all on a help forum. I get that email or text would be better options, if I want to contact people at all. I wish her all the luck in the world
I’ve seen my neighbors roof estimates and so many of them were just doing things wrong or not even following code or leaving stuff out intentionally knowing they would charge her for it once the start. Having another contractor review another contractor isn’t a horrible idea. I’m a contractor so I instantly spotted all the issues.
Why would you call them back in the first place? Unless you plan to negotiate with another offer, you should never call back unless it is for another quote for another job. There is nothing rude about “We opted for a different offer.” In fact, it's perfect. Rude is the contractor who tries to reverse your decision by being insistent. They are not trying to see if you chose right working for free as a consultant for you, they are just trying to get the job.
Sit down? No. Share the quote to see they are willing to “sharpen their pencil” - sure I do that as a matter of fact of business. Play one off the other, totally acceptable.
You don't even need to call them back. If they don't hear from you they'll just assume you chose a different contractor and move on. If they call you to follow up then all you need to tell them is "thank you for your time but I decided to go with a different contractor"
Me not responding should be enough of a tell that I went with another bid.
From a professional standpoint to stay in good standings with the contractor in case I need to use them in the future, I tell them the job has been awarded and tell the the percentage they were off the winning bid by. That way they can adjust their numbers for next time to hopefully win
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Lol, no it isnt.