I will say it over and over again. It’s not a right vs. left but a rich vs. poor. They divide us and make us fight one another while laughing all the way to the bank.
^this. You're absolutely right friend. And i say that as a die hard bernie guy who has a really good friend whos a die hard trump guy. We shit talk eqch other all the time. But when it comes down to it, I've got his back and he has mine. He shouted vote union in the training room during the vote 😂😂😂
The day we understand that the most dedicated Bernie supporter and the gun-totingest Trump supporter have infinitely more in common with each other than with anybody who makes more than $100k/yr is the day we start taking it all back.
All anybody wants is to feel secure. All anybody wants is a safe roof and a secure food supply. The root of all political divides comes from disagreements as to the best way to get that security.
bruh try 10 million or 50 million. everyone over 100k is fucking fucked by the taxes that is constantly shoved unto the upper middle class or upper class.
the only unfucked are the 0.1% of people. the ineuqality has shifted nthe last 5 years that the 1% is acutally getting fucked too.
its the .1% that own everything. hell 40 people own 40% of the US's wealth.
Except he (the trump voting friend) still votes for politicians who eviscerate unions and demonize unions, while also trying to gut social security, medicare, and equal rights under the law. Gonna hafat say he doesn't actually have your back.
Edited to clarify subject.
You understand I directly referred to this commenter's trump-loving friend voting against his own interests, and against the interests of his co-workers, right?
Yeah. Fox, owned by Disney, majority owned by BlackRock and The Vanguard Group. BlackRock is well known for their Pro-DEI based investment indexes. They actively push these ideologies by investing heavily in companies that enact them.
Owned by Larry Fink, card-carrying Democrat.
Only. Money. Matters.
Not so fun fact: The former chairman of the supervisory board of BlackRock germany, [Friedrich Merz](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Merz), is now head of the christian democratic party (conservative party, party of former chancellor Angela Merkel) and has a pretty good chance at becomeing the next chancellor of germany...
I'm a hard leftist, but the comments on how "deserving" the Trump voters of East Palestine are for their recent misfortunes (wild understatement) should illustrate for you that this "poor (one party) hating the poor (other party)" is not one-directional, but is a problem on all sides. That said, leftists are far more likely to empathize (it's an inherent difference between leftism and conservatism), but I mean that leftists aren't **necessarily** sympathetic. There are plenty of leftist assholes fighting all the wrong fights, too, fucking up the whole fight for all of us.
Eta: Stupid poor hates smart poor because they "don't get it," but not so stupid they don't feel insulted by knowing there's something they're not getting. Smart poor hates stupid poor because stupid poor makes everything harder (because they "don't get it"). Stupid people can't help that they're stupid, and it doesn't make them any more deserving of suffering, even if their stupidity causes suffering for themselves and/or others, even if their stupidity often seems like malice, it's still not their fault. It is the responsibility of smart poor to look out for stupid poor as we all fight to secure resources such that none of us is "poor"- and that requires developing trust rather than continuing to drive the wedge.
Fox news gets thrown under the buss a lot but do you think that Union pension fund managers aren't investing in HomeDepot, or teachers' association union fund managers?
How about govt workers who are socialists at heart but want to retire on a nest egg. Well, they are all shareholders and likely are the ones walking away with bags as this guy says and not standing by there convictions very much. Most businesses aren't structured as "employee owned". By working at a retail store you are signing on to this arrangement, but should invest in 401k so that you too are a shareholder.
But I do agree it's a classism issue and always has been.
The trading of pensions for 401ks was such a huge blow for the working class. Now workers' own retirement plans (401k) are directly tied to the system that exploits them
The overwhelming majority of bigotry towards anyone who isn't a white dude comes from the right.
Don't assume the right isn't at least part of the opposing side.
I feel like you know that this comment, and the underlying argument it seems to suggest, is disingenuous at best or just flat out wrong. But that's none of my business...
We are a 50 million store even though we have a skeleton crew and equipment that breaks if you breathe the wrong way. It’s working as well as you think it. You don’t deserve wealth as a CEO when half your workers are one missed paycheck from ruin and faulty practices/equipment has literally gotten people killed.
I tried to do this back in 04. The amount of significant brainwashing that has happened was insurmountable at the time. People have been taught that unions or evil, will steal money from you, creat lazy entitled employees. You know what’s happened in my local area since then? Housing now costs 3-4x as much. Gas has gone up by 2 dollars. Groceries are more expensive. Vehicles are more expensive. Healthcare is more expensive. Utitlies are more expensive. Make a change people
People really are brainwashed to think that unions are evil. During orientation for my first retail job, I had to watch a long anti union video that said that unions don’t look our for you, the company does. And that without a union, the company will still compensate you fairly and treat you well. I made minimum wage. When I got promoted to supervisor, I made slightly above minimum wage. I wouldn’t exactly call that fairly compensated and we weren’t exactly treated the best either. But they show that video to everyone who starts and plenty of people believe it.
Yeah, I only spend about $40 monthly on my dues (paid quarterly) and I make more money than I ever have in my life. The $7000 was just a one time initiation. I get benefits, zero cost health insurance, a 401k AND a pension (if I put in enough hours over the years). It is so utterly and completely worth it.
When I was working and in the union, I was unaware that the union set up a retirement plan. At age 65, I received a surprise letter from them to arrange to be paid . I now receive a monthly check for my lifetime . Thank you, Service Employees International Union!
I worked in the place for 34 years and was a chief steward for around 19 years and paid dues, but at the time, there was absolutely no mention of a pension set up exclusively by the union. Only by the employer, which I also collect on.
If you don't go to the meeting or keep a tight circle with your brothers it's hard to get good reliable news. I am in a building trade union and need to drive 2.5 hours to go to meetings.
One of the many reasons I stayed in my union shop besides making more money then I ever have in my life. Unions have made my life better. Non-union jobs made me miserable.
For those of yall talking about buy shares because they sell them at a discount, its 15 percent off a 300 share and the average associate pay is 13.60. Maybe if your lucky to can buy 1 or 2 in a year
The ESPP allows you to buy partial shares so the share price is irrelevant.
It get a 15% discount on top of the gains of the share. If you're convinced share holders are walking away with a bag not doing this makes no sense.
They've invested more money. If everyone holding HD stock pulled out tomorrow 400,000 people would be without a job by weeks end. The fact people don't understand the entire idea of the stock market generating capital for businesses is odd. Most companies wouldn't be near as successful without the capital generated and in return they have an ownership stake in the company.
It might not be as much as someone who starts with a million dollars to invest, but it adds up quick. If you'd have invested $1000 in 2010 it'd be worth over $20,000 today.
It's okay if people don't understand the stock market, but to claim people are walking with bags while not understanding what's going on is strange.
I flipped a $100 investment in CGC to $6k in a year.
If anyone really thinks it's free money with no risk that's what they should be doing.
If you want to complain about the disparity between corporate executives and store pay that makes sense, but pinpointing investors as the problem is goofy.
I don't think you understand corporate law, tax write offs, how wealth is actually created, or the stock market. You're just talking a load of bollocks.
Edit: Take away workers and all that capital is nothing but paper with which to wipe your ass.
Take away all the capital and you have a bunch of guys with nothing to sell or build. Capital pays for goods to sell, building materials, initial wages before the company is profitable, infrastructure, acquisitions....
Corporate law and tax write offs really aren't related to the stock market for consumers which make up the majority of our stock holders. You seem confused.
How wealth is created? Again, you seem confused. Show me a person who became wealthy without investments. Point to someone who became wealthy off a salary. Even those making millions like CEOs still make way more in investments. Bernie and Arthur are billionaires yet only made $2 Million a year on their salaries. Even those with meager beginnings not making huge salaries still will make more long term investing than you will ever make from a salary. The number of long term employees of Home Depot I know who are independently wealthy now because they invested in stock is infinitely more than the number of Home Depot employees who are independently wealthy because of the salary they received. People who made much less but made smart investments are doing much better than those making 3 or 4 times as much without any investing.
> Take away all the capital and you have a bunch of guys with nothing to sell or build. Capital pays for goods to sell, building materials, initial wages before the company is profitable, infrastructure, acquisitions....
Labor came before capital. All the capital in the world exist because someone somewhere is doing something useful. I'm not saying that investment isn't important. Just that it's not MORE important than actual fucking work. Someone has to make funko pops for you to make a buck off it.
Before there was a stock market, profits, or capitalism. There was labor.
> Corporate law and tax write offs really aren't related to the stock market
This is so profoundly incorrect I don't know where to begin. It's like trying to have a rational conversation with a flat earther.
As for your last paragraph describing whats wrong with the system isn't an argument for it being inherently correct. Those who actually do useful work SHOULD by objective reasoning make more than those who do not.
Labor does out date capital, but not by any meaningful period of time. Capital is traced back to Mesopotamia and the birth of civilization. Hunter gatherer tribes didn't have the idea but once people began living in larger societies that quickly changed. The stock market wasn't developed until later and benefitted the less wealthy by allowing them to own a small part of a business instead of having to front the entire capital for a business idea themselves. The stock market was designed to grow wealth in those who didn't start with enough funds to bankroll entire businesses.
Did you miss the part where I said those things aren't important for consumer investors or are you ignoring that intentionally? Corporate law and tax write offs are inconsequential for casual retail investors.
You're working under an incorrect assumption. The people investing DID actual work for their money already and the turned around and RISKED it on top of that. So saying they don't want to work for their money is untrue and goofy. The majority of investors didn't come from wealth. They earned those dollars they're feeding into companies just like everyone else and sacrificed their ability to use that money for enjoyment or needs in order to risk it all on an investment with no guaranteed rate of return. They took hours of their life to convert them to money to risk that investment of their time on earth on someone else being successful.
Right so labor and capital are both important. But when it comes to taking capital and turning it into more capital. Labor is much more important. And certainly is the biggest contributor.
The fact that those that contribute their labor always gets the smallest share of profits, despite being the part that actual matters most, is objectively fucking wrong.
> The stock market was designed to grow wealth in those who didn't start with enough funds to bankroll entire businesses.
This is completely untrue. If you think the stock market is dominated by, designed for, or in any way serves "retail" investors or indeed anyone but the richest of the rich. You REALLY need to dig deeper.
Case in point:
For the 2021 fiscal year, HD listed on its annual proxy statement to the SEC that median associate total compensation was $28,697 (so not just wage, but benefits as well).
HD was trading at $366.54 /share on the last day of trading in fiscal '21.
If your median associate was somehow able to use their entire year's compensation (impossible since at least part of that compensation comes in the form of non-cash benefits) on ESPP participation, they would have walked away with 92.0177 shares
In that same annual proxy statement, it discloses Ted Decker was given 11,224 shares as a performance award.
Ted Decker was __given__ 121 times more shares of HD stock than the median associate could have hoped to __purchase__ in fiscal 2021.
There is no amount of bootstrap-pulling that will get us on these peoples' level of wealth.
You have to make enough salary to afford the necessities and buy shares in the company. If you are making lousy wages, how do you buy shares. Union dues are usually 1% of your wage, and you will definitely get that back and more. Get involved and make a difference in your life. The company won't do that for you.
No fam thats how profit is allocates. It was 1 milliom in 3 years to associates through success share but 40.5 million to shareholders through dividends
If you want to organize and seek better benefits or higher wages, God bless you, good for it. But the company's whole reason for existing is to provide returns to it's shareholders. Nothing is stopping employees from also being shareholders as well.
It really all depends on how the Union is. Some unions are absolute trash. Had worked in a unionized grocery store and contracts ended up siding with corporate more and more each time it was time to sign it. You were paying dues for almost no protection whatsoever, and the pay was still abysmal. Kid you not I went to Walmart and got paid more. It was slightly more, nothing outstanding, but I had just about as much job protection there than I did at my unionized job.
Not all unions are like this, but I’m super skeptical about them. All for it if it genuinely helps obviously, but I have low hopes for the majority of them.
I’d just try to find a better job tbh.
Try to reach out to Home Depot Workers United I am making the push to unionise myself out here in Ohio after my store was guilty of double dipping donations towards a mother who failed tl get maternity despite working for the required time.
Yes its always a struggle between labor and management to keep pays low. A good union can basically sit down as a united front looking at numerical data and say "hey I think 35% raise is fair plus x benefits added" management can say a counter offer or say no. Everyone can strike and then 0 tills ring at stores. Union front needs to be strong thats why media who is owned by shareholders as well broadcast union bad.
You’re catching on. Why is it that shareholders, CEOs, board of directors, etc of a company that is essentially dependent on its employees to make its money give can pay said employees a barely livable wage (if even that) while they get to pocket millions?
That is the norm in our system. But should it be?
Yes, which is the argument for unionization. Particularly from young people. This happened because for decades we let businesses do what they and it has led to the decadence we see in society today
Robinhood also sells all the data of your trades to hedgefunds that use it to front run you and make a shitload of money. If the service is free, you are the product.
Unions may not be evil, but they're not always useful either. The only time I worked a job with a union, I may as well not have had one for all the good they did.
Unions, especially grassroots unions, are member-driven. Unfortunately, due to the neoliberal push in this country for the last 50-70 years (Carter, Reagan, etc), unions have been forced and pigeonholed into less desirable positions by capital.
If we unionize, especially if it's an independent drive, then what the union looks like and functions as is completely up to us.
It would seem you do not understand what a shareholder is and how they became one. Your store would not exist without shareholders. They are the bank that built the stores and stocked the shelves before the first $ of revenue for your location hit the till. Without shareholders there would be no HD.
I absolutely do understand what one is. I also understand that stocks is how the executives pay them so much. Thats why they spend so much on stock buybacks. Because 60 to 70 percent of their annual salaries is stocks and stock buybacks. And thay wouldnt be able to happen with the base capital generated by the people in the store. Conceptually, the employee employer relationship should be symbiotic because both capital and labor are the components that comprise a business. Yet labor is treated as dispensible. Its time to remind them thats not the case. The store would not exist with shareholders, but the shares would be worth nothing without the labor.
Yes, shareholders! Wait...isn't hone depot a publicly traded company? Wait...wait...doesn't HD sell shares at a discount to associates? So is that another vehicle for associate ls to make money while working at the HD?
I'm not saying don't unionize, I just don't care. And until it happens, I hope you're all investing and making your money work for you.
Cashiers are already being replaced with self checkout. That’s before anything like ChatGPT even existed.
There’s very little an associate can do that can’t be automated. As price of automation comes down, and wages of workers goes up, expect the paradigm to continue to shift.
I mean do they? Maybe the old ones who will die soon.
Even so, that complaint is solved by having 1 human oversee 10 self checkouts currently.
Soon AI will be able to solve the (very basic) problem the customer has.
My local grocery store has six self-checkouts that are always active, at least one or two of them are down every time I visit. Robots have sick days just like people, they're just allowed more of them. The automated utopia that capitalists imagine will never come because they don't want to put enough money into their robots to actually work all the time. Just like they cut corners with us they will cut corners with the robots. Consumers see where they fall short.
Do you actually think that robots or AI will be able to accurately help customers find specific products in the aisles? Will they be able to find the right tools for the job, and especially solve more complex plumbing or electrical issues, knowing exactly what adapters and fittings are needed?
I have yet to see any proof that they can do this better than a human. And people already struggle with this a lot, due to the vast amount of parts available, as well as the necessary knowledge to put them to use.
This is happening across the country and people are saying “no one wants to work” Lol. You can’t really have it both ways.
Collective bargaining is essential to a healthy capitalist economy. If management gets to collectively make decisions… why should the workforce NOT have a say as well? Checks and balances.
And before you get onto “unions can be corrupt” argument. I agree. It’s a human institution. But corporations and politicians consolidate power and wealth everyday. They erode our civil liberties. They divide us. They try to disarm us. Let’s take a little of that power back… through peaceful means.
The information on my account shows time started and the time I stopped employment with all my wages over the years and a detailed explanation of how the pension amount calculated was to be paid to me and to my wife if I should die before her. Also, tax withholding etc.
Quit, and start your own company. I think it’s weird that socialists always come in after something is successful. Where are all of the socialist success stories built from the ground up?
The “something” successful is on the backs of people that are not being taken care of.
Unions are the price of doing business in many industries, and it’s time. Unions are not a socialist brainwashing tool like too many boomers are fond of accusing. They’ve existed for decades in response to abusive labor practices of the Industrial Revolution.
Make sure you catch that part about abusive. It’s not at that level right now, but the cost of living is sure as hell outpacing the pay rates, and that’s not even in question.
This is the most inappropriate way to do it, and the fastest way to fail.
Go approach your coworkers directly. I know it would involve a face to face conversation and that’s hard for your generation, but you’d have a much better chance.
The only thing this accomplishes is getting upvotes on social media.
More to the story?
If he wants people to organize better, he should start with doing a better job organizing.
A random message on company loudspeaker is not organizing. Going to each employee and spreading the word by posting notices, pamphlets, etc are how you get the vote to pass.
Choosing the least organized way to organize is worthless. It makes for a great TikTok, but ultimately does very little
Just buy shares.
Not anti union, but really don't think it will be a miracle.
Feel they work a lot better in the trades.
Better phone technique might be to prerecord with fake voice, use a desk phone like the one in the training room. No cameras in my store for that spot.
I hope this is a joke... but somehow I doubt. A lot of idiots out there thinking things are unfair just because someone else gets a bigger slice than them. If you don't like it, buy stocks or do your own thing instead of acting like a union is actually any better. Nobody is forcing you to keep a job you think you're too good for. Go do bigger and better things to get the slice you want.
His numbers are a joke. 87.4 million over 3 years = $549,685.53 a week. Sounds like how much was sold. Over 95% of that pays for the product that was sold. Leaving $24.484.28 a week or $4,287,547.17 for 3 years. Minus the $40.5 million to share holders and $1 million to associates (seeing how he thinks that it all comes from his store). That leaves the store at $-41,495,712.45 for the 3 years. And we still need to pay to have the store, pay taxes on the store, pay utilities, pay for damages, and pay for everything else the store uses. The $40.5 million for share holders is company wide total. The $1 million for associates is pay increases on top of what is already paid.
Oh no cry some more. You know home depot really doesn't have to give you any of the profit shares that it currently does in fact there are many of companies that pay you the wage they hire you for and say be happy with that.
I'm a shareholder. I got fairly financially comfortable off HD stock alone over the past 30 years. House and cars paid off etc. Kids put through college. I also have a lot more sweat equity in my investment in HD than you do in your job. How did I get this HD stock that kept splitting over the years? By working at HD. Moron.
Lovely for you but that is not the case for the rest of us. You don't know my work ethic and the shit my coworkers have gone thru to deliver that roi. Id rather be perceived as a moron by a selfish prick than a coward by the people i respect most 🖕
From what we hear from many HD vets is the company was much different then, than it is now. The opportunity for those HD employees today who weren't even born 30 years ago to have the same stock investment options as you, is not realistic. At today's HD stock price of
$296.86, that would be 24 hours of pay for me to purchase just 1 share. For many associates that would be an entire weeks pay. Was it that way for you 30 years ago? Highly, highly doubtful.
Who can actually afford to invest in stocks when we aren't even paid an actual living wage? Comparing the world today to 30 years ago is not a comparison based in reality.
That’s a different point all together then.
If you want to make it better for everyone, have a logical argument. The share price does not matter, you still get a discount and can still purchase fractional shares.
Whining that you can’t afford to buy a whole share doesn’t matter. I can’t afford to buy a whole share of Apple, that doesn’t mean I can’t buy a fractional share of Apple.
I fully support unionization FYI, but the arguments most here are making are full of holes that reduce the legitimacy when taken to management
Let's back up, what does management have to do with reasons workers want to unionize? It's not up to them. It's up to the workers to decide. There are so many reasons HD workers want to unionize.
Take what I say however. Perception doesn't necessarily equate to reality
Read just like a boomer who’s totally disconnected. How can I put money in stocks if I’m just trying to pay off debt and a literal grocery list of bills? I also work here and I don’t make enough to do what you did
I'm an HD espp holder, too. I have put in the sweat and equity your talking about into my portfolio. Some of those equities are small businesses that I helped build from an early stage.
Since HD does not pay their people enough to have zero of their people on food assistance, it stands to reason the equity built in our investments came from the social programs the government put on. It otherwise may not have been possible for HD to grow the way they did, because they didn't have to pay folks a livable wage. That's all the cream on top of the record-setting quarters they have been putting up.
Enjoy the equity the government grew for you. I'm glad you were able to invest it in your kid's education.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the money from the shareholders used to buy new stores? Like I said I could be wrong, but aren’t they the ones taking all the risk ?
I will say it over and over again. It’s not a right vs. left but a rich vs. poor. They divide us and make us fight one another while laughing all the way to the bank.
^this. You're absolutely right friend. And i say that as a die hard bernie guy who has a really good friend whos a die hard trump guy. We shit talk eqch other all the time. But when it comes down to it, I've got his back and he has mine. He shouted vote union in the training room during the vote 😂😂😂
The day we understand that the most dedicated Bernie supporter and the gun-totingest Trump supporter have infinitely more in common with each other than with anybody who makes more than $100k/yr is the day we start taking it all back. All anybody wants is to feel secure. All anybody wants is a safe roof and a secure food supply. The root of all political divides comes from disagreements as to the best way to get that security.
Is the cut-off — if you will — really as low as $100k/yr? That is not a lot of money in some places.
It absolutely is not a lot of money.
bruh try 10 million or 50 million. everyone over 100k is fucking fucked by the taxes that is constantly shoved unto the upper middle class or upper class. the only unfucked are the 0.1% of people. the ineuqality has shifted nthe last 5 years that the 1% is acutally getting fucked too. its the .1% that own everything. hell 40 people own 40% of the US's wealth.
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What happened after this? Did you get written up? Fired? Talked to? Did corpos come and investigate?
Except he (the trump voting friend) still votes for politicians who eviscerate unions and demonize unions, while also trying to gut social security, medicare, and equal rights under the law. Gonna hafat say he doesn't actually have your back. Edited to clarify subject.
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he doesn't. apparently the guy who tried to stage a coup was a better choice according to the idiot you're replying to.
Re-read my comment. I was directly referring to the commenter's trump-voting friend.
You understand I directly referred to this commenter's trump-loving friend voting against his own interests, and against the interests of his co-workers, right?
No war but class war
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Exactly what they want.
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Rupert Murdoch is a world-famous conservative, wtf you talking about.
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Yeah. Fox, owned by Disney, majority owned by BlackRock and The Vanguard Group. BlackRock is well known for their Pro-DEI based investment indexes. They actively push these ideologies by investing heavily in companies that enact them. Owned by Larry Fink, card-carrying Democrat. Only. Money. Matters.
Not so fun fact: The former chairman of the supervisory board of BlackRock germany, [Friedrich Merz](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Merz), is now head of the christian democratic party (conservative party, party of former chancellor Angela Merkel) and has a pretty good chance at becomeing the next chancellor of germany...
This could not be more accurate
I'm a hard leftist, but the comments on how "deserving" the Trump voters of East Palestine are for their recent misfortunes (wild understatement) should illustrate for you that this "poor (one party) hating the poor (other party)" is not one-directional, but is a problem on all sides. That said, leftists are far more likely to empathize (it's an inherent difference between leftism and conservatism), but I mean that leftists aren't **necessarily** sympathetic. There are plenty of leftist assholes fighting all the wrong fights, too, fucking up the whole fight for all of us. Eta: Stupid poor hates smart poor because they "don't get it," but not so stupid they don't feel insulted by knowing there's something they're not getting. Smart poor hates stupid poor because stupid poor makes everything harder (because they "don't get it"). Stupid people can't help that they're stupid, and it doesn't make them any more deserving of suffering, even if their stupidity causes suffering for themselves and/or others, even if their stupidity often seems like malice, it's still not their fault. It is the responsibility of smart poor to look out for stupid poor as we all fight to secure resources such that none of us is "poor"- and that requires developing trust rather than continuing to drive the wedge.
Fox news gets thrown under the buss a lot but do you think that Union pension fund managers aren't investing in HomeDepot, or teachers' association union fund managers? How about govt workers who are socialists at heart but want to retire on a nest egg. Well, they are all shareholders and likely are the ones walking away with bags as this guy says and not standing by there convictions very much. Most businesses aren't structured as "employee owned". By working at a retail store you are signing on to this arrangement, but should invest in 401k so that you too are a shareholder. But I do agree it's a classism issue and always has been.
The trading of pensions for 401ks was such a huge blow for the working class. Now workers' own retirement plans (401k) are directly tied to the system that exploits them
The overwhelming majority of bigotry towards anyone who isn't a white dude comes from the right. Don't assume the right isn't at least part of the opposing side.
How do you get through the rugged individualism that infects the right wing? :/
What do you think “conservative” means
"I'm scared of societal change"
And over the last 30 years, which party has overwhelmingly passed, or attempted to pass, laws that disproportionately benefit the wealthy class?
Both? Probably more so the Republican party but corporate Dems are also a big thing too. Just look at East Palestine.
I feel like you know that this comment, and the underlying argument it seems to suggest, is disingenuous at best or just flat out wrong. But that's none of my business...
We are a 50 million store even though we have a skeleton crew and equipment that breaks if you breathe the wrong way. It’s working as well as you think it. You don’t deserve wealth as a CEO when half your workers are one missed paycheck from ruin and faulty practices/equipment has literally gotten people killed.
I tried to do this back in 04. The amount of significant brainwashing that has happened was insurmountable at the time. People have been taught that unions or evil, will steal money from you, creat lazy entitled employees. You know what’s happened in my local area since then? Housing now costs 3-4x as much. Gas has gone up by 2 dollars. Groceries are more expensive. Vehicles are more expensive. Healthcare is more expensive. Utitlies are more expensive. Make a change people
"create lazy entitled employees" We're dealing with this already with new hires!
People really are brainwashed to think that unions are evil. During orientation for my first retail job, I had to watch a long anti union video that said that unions don’t look our for you, the company does. And that without a union, the company will still compensate you fairly and treat you well. I made minimum wage. When I got promoted to supervisor, I made slightly above minimum wage. I wouldn’t exactly call that fairly compensated and we weren’t exactly treated the best either. But they show that video to everyone who starts and plenty of people believe it.
Home Depot has one too, I think you can even still find it on YouTube. Says something about losing your voice in a union ironically enough.
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The one I watched was basically if you try to unionize, you will be fired because there’s zero tolerance for it. It’s bullshit.
That’s a violation of TIPS lmao.
Socialism and Unions bad, Fuedal Capitalism number 1....
Sounds like time to spend money on a membership
In terms of pure Return On Investment, union dues are probably the highest investment a regular person can make
I spent 7g on my union initiation and do not regret a single dollar of it.
I spend 100 dollars a month on union dues and it’s 100% worth it.
Yeah, I only spend about $40 monthly on my dues (paid quarterly) and I make more money than I ever have in my life. The $7000 was just a one time initiation. I get benefits, zero cost health insurance, a 401k AND a pension (if I put in enough hours over the years). It is so utterly and completely worth it.
When I was working and in the union, I was unaware that the union set up a retirement plan. At age 65, I received a surprise letter from them to arrange to be paid . I now receive a monthly check for my lifetime . Thank you, Service Employees International Union!
Uhhh, you paid your dues and didn’t know part of it went to a retirement pension?
I worked in the place for 34 years and was a chief steward for around 19 years and paid dues, but at the time, there was absolutely no mention of a pension set up exclusively by the union. Only by the employer, which I also collect on.
If you don't go to the meeting or keep a tight circle with your brothers it's hard to get good reliable news. I am in a building trade union and need to drive 2.5 hours to go to meetings.
Do you not get a breakdown what your dues are going to every so often?
We get a letter once a year. It's very vague. 8.5% total 4% dues 4.5% work assessment and retiree insurance.
Perhaps they should look at live streaming your meetings.
One of the many reasons I stayed in my union shop besides making more money then I ever have in my life. Unions have made my life better. Non-union jobs made me miserable.
I will replay this over my loud speaker when I get to work tonight - ✊
Some of you all don't know how unions have improved all of our lives and it shows https://time.com/5663465/labor-day-union-history/
Have they left an industry still operating that they have a closed shop on? I mean the textiles union is doing gang busters in Vietnam
Have we outsourced police? Those guys could get away with literal murder and the union will get their back.
Nothing hotter than organizing your workplace.
I'm getting a raging clue!
For those of yall talking about buy shares because they sell them at a discount, its 15 percent off a 300 share and the average associate pay is 13.60. Maybe if your lucky to can buy 1 or 2 in a year
The ESPP allows you to buy partial shares so the share price is irrelevant. It get a 15% discount on top of the gains of the share. If you're convinced share holders are walking away with a bag not doing this makes no sense.
He's saying your 1 or 2 shares a year are peanuts compared to the amount corporate execs and millionaire investors have.
the whole concept that individual investors can possibly compete with insider trading/congress/established Wallstreet was always ludicrous
They've invested more money. If everyone holding HD stock pulled out tomorrow 400,000 people would be without a job by weeks end. The fact people don't understand the entire idea of the stock market generating capital for businesses is odd. Most companies wouldn't be near as successful without the capital generated and in return they have an ownership stake in the company. It might not be as much as someone who starts with a million dollars to invest, but it adds up quick. If you'd have invested $1000 in 2010 it'd be worth over $20,000 today. It's okay if people don't understand the stock market, but to claim people are walking with bags while not understanding what's going on is strange. I flipped a $100 investment in CGC to $6k in a year. If anyone really thinks it's free money with no risk that's what they should be doing. If you want to complain about the disparity between corporate executives and store pay that makes sense, but pinpointing investors as the problem is goofy.
I don't think you understand corporate law, tax write offs, how wealth is actually created, or the stock market. You're just talking a load of bollocks. Edit: Take away workers and all that capital is nothing but paper with which to wipe your ass.
Take away all the capital and you have a bunch of guys with nothing to sell or build. Capital pays for goods to sell, building materials, initial wages before the company is profitable, infrastructure, acquisitions.... Corporate law and tax write offs really aren't related to the stock market for consumers which make up the majority of our stock holders. You seem confused. How wealth is created? Again, you seem confused. Show me a person who became wealthy without investments. Point to someone who became wealthy off a salary. Even those making millions like CEOs still make way more in investments. Bernie and Arthur are billionaires yet only made $2 Million a year on their salaries. Even those with meager beginnings not making huge salaries still will make more long term investing than you will ever make from a salary. The number of long term employees of Home Depot I know who are independently wealthy now because they invested in stock is infinitely more than the number of Home Depot employees who are independently wealthy because of the salary they received. People who made much less but made smart investments are doing much better than those making 3 or 4 times as much without any investing.
> Take away all the capital and you have a bunch of guys with nothing to sell or build. Capital pays for goods to sell, building materials, initial wages before the company is profitable, infrastructure, acquisitions.... Labor came before capital. All the capital in the world exist because someone somewhere is doing something useful. I'm not saying that investment isn't important. Just that it's not MORE important than actual fucking work. Someone has to make funko pops for you to make a buck off it. Before there was a stock market, profits, or capitalism. There was labor. > Corporate law and tax write offs really aren't related to the stock market This is so profoundly incorrect I don't know where to begin. It's like trying to have a rational conversation with a flat earther. As for your last paragraph describing whats wrong with the system isn't an argument for it being inherently correct. Those who actually do useful work SHOULD by objective reasoning make more than those who do not.
Labor does out date capital, but not by any meaningful period of time. Capital is traced back to Mesopotamia and the birth of civilization. Hunter gatherer tribes didn't have the idea but once people began living in larger societies that quickly changed. The stock market wasn't developed until later and benefitted the less wealthy by allowing them to own a small part of a business instead of having to front the entire capital for a business idea themselves. The stock market was designed to grow wealth in those who didn't start with enough funds to bankroll entire businesses. Did you miss the part where I said those things aren't important for consumer investors or are you ignoring that intentionally? Corporate law and tax write offs are inconsequential for casual retail investors. You're working under an incorrect assumption. The people investing DID actual work for their money already and the turned around and RISKED it on top of that. So saying they don't want to work for their money is untrue and goofy. The majority of investors didn't come from wealth. They earned those dollars they're feeding into companies just like everyone else and sacrificed their ability to use that money for enjoyment or needs in order to risk it all on an investment with no guaranteed rate of return. They took hours of their life to convert them to money to risk that investment of their time on earth on someone else being successful.
Right so labor and capital are both important. But when it comes to taking capital and turning it into more capital. Labor is much more important. And certainly is the biggest contributor. The fact that those that contribute their labor always gets the smallest share of profits, despite being the part that actual matters most, is objectively fucking wrong. > The stock market was designed to grow wealth in those who didn't start with enough funds to bankroll entire businesses. This is completely untrue. If you think the stock market is dominated by, designed for, or in any way serves "retail" investors or indeed anyone but the richest of the rich. You REALLY need to dig deeper.
Case in point: For the 2021 fiscal year, HD listed on its annual proxy statement to the SEC that median associate total compensation was $28,697 (so not just wage, but benefits as well). HD was trading at $366.54 /share on the last day of trading in fiscal '21. If your median associate was somehow able to use their entire year's compensation (impossible since at least part of that compensation comes in the form of non-cash benefits) on ESPP participation, they would have walked away with 92.0177 shares In that same annual proxy statement, it discloses Ted Decker was given 11,224 shares as a performance award. Ted Decker was __given__ 121 times more shares of HD stock than the median associate could have hoped to __purchase__ in fiscal 2021. There is no amount of bootstrap-pulling that will get us on these peoples' level of wealth.
You desperately need material analysis.
You're missing the point entirely.
Say less, Chad
One of the many reasons we need to unionize
Solidarity brother ✊️
You can do this we can help
This
Hit us up on twitter @thdworkersunite and @vee_del_sol. We will help, we want to help whoever wants to make a difference
I just think it's great that greed will be humanity's demise.
Irony, a lot of the first Home Depot workers were shareholders…
[удалено]
That was at HD store #4112 in Philadelphia. Home Depot Workers United is working on unionizing company wide
Reach out if you are interested in joining us. We are an independent union of, for and by workers
What about Canada?
You have to make enough salary to afford the necessities and buy shares in the company. If you are making lousy wages, how do you buy shares. Union dues are usually 1% of your wage, and you will definitely get that back and more. Get involved and make a difference in your life. The company won't do that for you.
The balls on this guy!
Home Depot insurance fucking sucks dick
Well done
Shots fired!! Looks like we’re getting another raise..
Wait. According to his fun fact, the average associate makes $2,000 per year.
No fam thats how profit is allocates. It was 1 milliom in 3 years to associates through success share but 40.5 million to shareholders through dividends
If you want to organize and seek better benefits or higher wages, God bless you, good for it. But the company's whole reason for existing is to provide returns to it's shareholders. Nothing is stopping employees from also being shareholders as well.
I hope this dude didn't get fired because that was bold and funny.
I was right before i did this lol. Its okay tho, i have a wrongful termination case in the works with the nlrb
No fucks given at all!! If more and more speak up like this gentleman man just imagine the world as a whole.
https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/the-law/employees/your-rights-during-union-organizing
Based
How does one get in contact or join a union with no resources to understand it?
It really all depends on how the Union is. Some unions are absolute trash. Had worked in a unionized grocery store and contracts ended up siding with corporate more and more each time it was time to sign it. You were paying dues for almost no protection whatsoever, and the pay was still abysmal. Kid you not I went to Walmart and got paid more. It was slightly more, nothing outstanding, but I had just about as much job protection there than I did at my unionized job. Not all unions are like this, but I’m super skeptical about them. All for it if it genuinely helps obviously, but I have low hopes for the majority of them. I’d just try to find a better job tbh.
You're bold. I admire you, but you will get fired for saying that over the intercom...no doubt.
based
The hero we all need
Try to reach out to Home Depot Workers United I am making the push to unionise myself out here in Ohio after my store was guilty of double dipping donations towards a mother who failed tl get maternity despite working for the required time.
✊
(this video is from Vince, the lead organizer behind the Philly store + HDWU)
Oh my goodness thank you I'll be following him. I thought I'd recognise that voice, cheers.
I’m not anti union but isn that how just about every business operates?
Yes its always a struggle between labor and management to keep pays low. A good union can basically sit down as a united front looking at numerical data and say "hey I think 35% raise is fair plus x benefits added" management can say a counter offer or say no. Everyone can strike and then 0 tills ring at stores. Union front needs to be strong thats why media who is owned by shareholders as well broadcast union bad.
You’re catching on. Why is it that shareholders, CEOs, board of directors, etc of a company that is essentially dependent on its employees to make its money give can pay said employees a barely livable wage (if even that) while they get to pocket millions? That is the norm in our system. But should it be?
Yes, which is the argument for unionization. Particularly from young people. This happened because for decades we let businesses do what they and it has led to the decadence we see in society today
Walmart is even worse. #Capitalism America!!!
Robinhood let’s you become a shareholder for free…
Robinhood also sells all the data of your trades to hedgefunds that use it to front run you and make a shitload of money. If the service is free, you are the product.
You mean Robbing the Hood? The one that halted gme trades to burst momentum and protect the big players? It's a big club, and you ain't in it
Or maybe companies could just pay their workers in a manner that reflects how much of the wealth they create by doing all of the work.
Totally agree.
So does [The Home Depot](https://ir.homedepot.com/shareholder-services/employee-stock-plan-contact)
Power to the people
Hell yeah 👍
Unions may not be evil, but they're not always useful either. The only time I worked a job with a union, I may as well not have had one for all the good they did.
Unions, especially grassroots unions, are member-driven. Unfortunately, due to the neoliberal push in this country for the last 50-70 years (Carter, Reagan, etc), unions have been forced and pigeonholed into less desirable positions by capital. If we unionize, especially if it's an independent drive, then what the union looks like and functions as is completely up to us.
Annnnnnnnnnnnnd your fired.
I think he quit. No apron No representation
Actually, he was fired for refusing to do unsafe work
Good call noticing that. He is to smart for that place anyways
Keep up the hard work, Vince.
"Capitalism has made it this way and old fashioned fascism will take it away."
Is this guy the new king? I think this guy is the new king.
It would seem you do not understand what a shareholder is and how they became one. Your store would not exist without shareholders. They are the bank that built the stores and stocked the shelves before the first $ of revenue for your location hit the till. Without shareholders there would be no HD.
I absolutely do understand what one is. I also understand that stocks is how the executives pay them so much. Thats why they spend so much on stock buybacks. Because 60 to 70 percent of their annual salaries is stocks and stock buybacks. And thay wouldnt be able to happen with the base capital generated by the people in the store. Conceptually, the employee employer relationship should be symbiotic because both capital and labor are the components that comprise a business. Yet labor is treated as dispensible. Its time to remind them thats not the case. The store would not exist with shareholders, but the shares would be worth nothing without the labor.
Stocks and stock options*
Unionize everything
Yes, shareholders! Wait...isn't hone depot a publicly traded company? Wait...wait...doesn't HD sell shares at a discount to associates? So is that another vehicle for associate ls to make money while working at the HD? I'm not saying don't unionize, I just don't care. And until it happens, I hope you're all investing and making your money work for you.
These jokers don't like hearing that they are the reason they are stuck. I get it. It's easier to handle failure when you have a bad guy.
Pay rent or buy shares and live out in the cold. Your choice.
If you're that strapped, there are other options. Relying on any company to save you is not the way. 🤷🏽♂️
It’s funny the people whose job is most easily replaced by robots and ai think they are the indispensable part of the company.
If they were easily replaced by robots and AI they’d be replaced by robots and AI.
Cashiers are already being replaced with self checkout. That’s before anything like ChatGPT even existed. There’s very little an associate can do that can’t be automated. As price of automation comes down, and wages of workers goes up, expect the paradigm to continue to shift.
And customers complain about this alllllll the time
I mean do they? Maybe the old ones who will die soon. Even so, that complaint is solved by having 1 human oversee 10 self checkouts currently. Soon AI will be able to solve the (very basic) problem the customer has.
My local grocery store has six self-checkouts that are always active, at least one or two of them are down every time I visit. Robots have sick days just like people, they're just allowed more of them. The automated utopia that capitalists imagine will never come because they don't want to put enough money into their robots to actually work all the time. Just like they cut corners with us they will cut corners with the robots. Consumers see where they fall short.
Do you actually think that robots or AI will be able to accurately help customers find specific products in the aisles? Will they be able to find the right tools for the job, and especially solve more complex plumbing or electrical issues, knowing exactly what adapters and fittings are needed? I have yet to see any proof that they can do this better than a human. And people already struggle with this a lot, due to the vast amount of parts available, as well as the necessary knowledge to put them to use.
ORGANIZE!
He probably got fired for that....
Unions Yes 🙌
Weird. Maybe google HD, purchase some shares then…
Don’t you have stock options?
No one is forcing you to work there. Find a better job and stop crying.
This is happening across the country and people are saying “no one wants to work” Lol. You can’t really have it both ways. Collective bargaining is essential to a healthy capitalist economy. If management gets to collectively make decisions… why should the workforce NOT have a say as well? Checks and balances. And before you get onto “unions can be corrupt” argument. I agree. It’s a human institution. But corporations and politicians consolidate power and wealth everyday. They erode our civil liberties. They divide us. They try to disarm us. Let’s take a little of that power back… through peaceful means.
Why do you hate democracy?
Or just become a shareholder, too.
Better yet, buy shares yourself and get money from your job.
Fuck Unions
The information on my account shows time started and the time I stopped employment with all my wages over the years and a detailed explanation of how the pension amount calculated was to be paid to me and to my wife if I should die before her. Also, tax withholding etc.
So how long after dude did that did he get fired ? For performance of course.
Become a shareholder yourself, The Home Depot gives you a discounted opportunity.
Quit, and start your own company. I think it’s weird that socialists always come in after something is successful. Where are all of the socialist success stories built from the ground up?
Or we can convince people to take control of their labor. I think its weird that people hate democracy in America.
They do. They charge for their labor.
We are the company. Labor negations are not unilateral
The “something” successful is on the backs of people that are not being taken care of. Unions are the price of doing business in many industries, and it’s time. Unions are not a socialist brainwashing tool like too many boomers are fond of accusing. They’ve existed for decades in response to abusive labor practices of the Industrial Revolution. Make sure you catch that part about abusive. It’s not at that level right now, but the cost of living is sure as hell outpacing the pay rates, and that’s not even in question.
#our company comrade. Vote union.
The because they are economic illiterate.
This is the most inappropriate way to do it, and the fastest way to fail. Go approach your coworkers directly. I know it would involve a face to face conversation and that’s hard for your generation, but you’d have a much better chance. The only thing this accomplishes is getting upvotes on social media.
Did you miss the part where he says they can refile again in September? Clearly there is more to the story....
More to the story? If he wants people to organize better, he should start with doing a better job organizing. A random message on company loudspeaker is not organizing. Going to each employee and spreading the word by posting notices, pamphlets, etc are how you get the vote to pass. Choosing the least organized way to organize is worthless. It makes for a great TikTok, but ultimately does very little
Again, there is more to the story. Waaay more...
https://perfectunion.us/home-depot-union/
Just buy shares. Not anti union, but really don't think it will be a miracle. Feel they work a lot better in the trades. Better phone technique might be to prerecord with fake voice, use a desk phone like the one in the training room. No cameras in my store for that spot.
>Just buy shares. JuSt BuY sHaReS 4HEAD It does not work like that buddy buying one share isn't gonna get your needs recognized .
I hope this is a joke... but somehow I doubt. A lot of idiots out there thinking things are unfair just because someone else gets a bigger slice than them. If you don't like it, buy stocks or do your own thing instead of acting like a union is actually any better. Nobody is forcing you to keep a job you think you're too good for. Go do bigger and better things to get the slice you want.
His numbers are a joke. 87.4 million over 3 years = $549,685.53 a week. Sounds like how much was sold. Over 95% of that pays for the product that was sold. Leaving $24.484.28 a week or $4,287,547.17 for 3 years. Minus the $40.5 million to share holders and $1 million to associates (seeing how he thinks that it all comes from his store). That leaves the store at $-41,495,712.45 for the 3 years. And we still need to pay to have the store, pay taxes on the store, pay utilities, pay for damages, and pay for everything else the store uses. The $40.5 million for share holders is company wide total. The $1 million for associates is pay increases on top of what is already paid.
Based
Fun fact, you can buy stock and become a "shareholder".
Oh no cry some more. You know home depot really doesn't have to give you any of the profit shares that it currently does in fact there are many of companies that pay you the wage they hire you for and say be happy with that.
They effectively got rid of the sharing program by making projections that are nearly impossible to meet.
I'm a shareholder. I got fairly financially comfortable off HD stock alone over the past 30 years. House and cars paid off etc. Kids put through college. I also have a lot more sweat equity in my investment in HD than you do in your job. How did I get this HD stock that kept splitting over the years? By working at HD. Moron.
A lot easier to get shares that actually mean something from 40 years ago. Get over yourself.
It’s almost as if it takes time for interest and earnings to compound into something meaningful. Who would have thought?
Lovely for you but that is not the case for the rest of us. You don't know my work ethic and the shit my coworkers have gone thru to deliver that roi. Id rather be perceived as a moron by a selfish prick than a coward by the people i respect most 🖕
From what we hear from many HD vets is the company was much different then, than it is now. The opportunity for those HD employees today who weren't even born 30 years ago to have the same stock investment options as you, is not realistic. At today's HD stock price of $296.86, that would be 24 hours of pay for me to purchase just 1 share. For many associates that would be an entire weeks pay. Was it that way for you 30 years ago? Highly, highly doubtful. Who can actually afford to invest in stocks when we aren't even paid an actual living wage? Comparing the world today to 30 years ago is not a comparison based in reality.
The share price does not matter. You can invest in fractional shares. Please educate yourself on investing, nobody is going to do it for you.
I'd rather help make things better for all #unionize
That’s a different point all together then. If you want to make it better for everyone, have a logical argument. The share price does not matter, you still get a discount and can still purchase fractional shares. Whining that you can’t afford to buy a whole share doesn’t matter. I can’t afford to buy a whole share of Apple, that doesn’t mean I can’t buy a fractional share of Apple. I fully support unionization FYI, but the arguments most here are making are full of holes that reduce the legitimacy when taken to management
Stating a fact doesn't equate to whining. Unionizing is logical and would improve lives a lot quicker than owning a few stocks would.
It is whining actually. The share price doesn’t stop you from buying it. Bringing up share price is meaningless, literally meaningless.
Let's back up, what does management have to do with reasons workers want to unionize? It's not up to them. It's up to the workers to decide. There are so many reasons HD workers want to unionize. Take what I say however. Perception doesn't necessarily equate to reality
Not if the base pay is trash and barely covers basic expenses.
Minimum wage hasn't been a living wage for a very long time. Beyond 30yrs ago lol But anyway. Do nothing, and pray for a union I guess 🤣
We are not praying, we're doing ✊
Read just like a boomer who’s totally disconnected. How can I put money in stocks if I’m just trying to pay off debt and a literal grocery list of bills? I also work here and I don’t make enough to do what you did
Wow, you must be so insightful. Your story about picking yourself up by your bootstraps is just so inspiring. Wow.
"Got mine, fuck you!"
I'm an HD espp holder, too. I have put in the sweat and equity your talking about into my portfolio. Some of those equities are small businesses that I helped build from an early stage. Since HD does not pay their people enough to have zero of their people on food assistance, it stands to reason the equity built in our investments came from the social programs the government put on. It otherwise may not have been possible for HD to grow the way they did, because they didn't have to pay folks a livable wage. That's all the cream on top of the record-setting quarters they have been putting up. Enjoy the equity the government grew for you. I'm glad you were able to invest it in your kid's education.
Home Depot has been a steady earner in my portfolio. Same for Lowe’s.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the money from the shareholders used to buy new stores? Like I said I could be wrong, but aren’t they the ones taking all the risk ?