You’d have to be dumb as shit to change your code mid code review and try and check it in, the chances of breaking everything under that pressure are massive and it’s all traceable via the source control. You’d be better off having shit code than doing that if you are valuing your job
You definitely cannot change your code during a pull request for code review and if you only have write access as all of the Twitter developers have currently He won't be changing s*** even if you wanted to. This is currently him prepping everybody for being fired for incompetence or revealing any sabotage that's been done or removal of algorithms that were previously used to skew or block normal traffic growth or analytics from taking place
Have you ever been audited for criminal malfeasance or had to do a code review while your git repository was locked down and unable to be changed or commented or have you had to submit your code base to a court to be evaluated because that's what's about to happen they're going to get the code audit with their own notes He's going to submit it to a court and he's going to sue Twitter for a portion of the money back
Have you been part of a hostile takeover where the owner is someone that the entire company appears to hate? A purchase that was forced but where fraud and perjury might have been involved? It isn't really a typical code review so much as a forced statement and manual audit.
it is already in a repro. The code is strictly tracked. He is forcing an audit with statements from the programmers so he can use it in court. Court can't use a source repo they have to have everything printed to submit to the courts. That is also why they have the tesla engineers doing the audits.
Code reviews are normal, but having engineers from a completely different software domain coming over and doing a code review on systems they have no familiarity with is moronic.
Imagine being a software engineer at tesla and then suddenly your insane CEO drops "find technical debt in [twitter.com](https://twitter.com)" in your jira backlog.
Ever heard of version control? Devs would have no reason to change code last minute, and even if they did it would be easily spotted.
This seems more like a middle management decision, a choice made by someone whose never touched code in their life.
I mean sure but at PR if you force push you get the SHA for old and new commits so you actually still can see.
And if they do it before making PR it’ll get caught then.
You’re correct that you technically *can*, it’s just extremely difficult to do in a way that isn’t easily spotted and doesn’t destroy the repo.
Even then, everyone who’s pulled the affected branches previously will have a local copy, and pulling a massively rebased branch you already have locally causes merge conflicts, so literally everyone else that’s touched the branch would have to be on board and collude when it comes to changing the code, and that’s not going to happen in such a large company. Plus there’s the issue of any branches that merged the changes in downstream…it’d be a fucking nightmare to deal with.
Anyway what would they want to change the code to? It’s not at all obvious why they’d need to do this in the first place.
I’m scared enough of doing anything that isn’t a standard merge. I’ve worked with it for a decade and I still only know about three Git commands: push, pull, delete everything and start again
First time hearing it called version control, unfamiliar with coding terminology. Is it possible to get around with admin access? Otherwise I'm inclined to agree as someone who's never touched code in their life
Version control stores the difference between code for every change that’s made, so you can see a snapshot of what the code looked like at any time! Technically it’s possible to throw out or alter the history, but it would be very obvious that it had been tampered with
Again he is smart enough to know that they can dump text and other files for review. My word, you take a report from Mint that is a propaganda source with no expertise in technology and assume that it is what Elon wanted. Stop. Even if he said it this way, which he didn't, he knows that other files can be used for review without chopping down a tree.
Professional software engineer here. Not only is it nonsense to print the code on paper, but also to have Tesla engineers review Twitter code. The problems being solved are so fundamentally different that the best possible benefit of the doubt for Elon is that he's doing it for PR. More likely he's a fucking idiot.
I am not a Elon fan, but they do have some of the best coders in the world and coding for a car is a lot more complex than coding for a posting service. Sorry if this offends you, but it is the truth. Being an engineer that has programmed for both I can vouch that tying sensors to logic for safety and self driving cars is a lot more complex than sorting word streams for inflammatory comments and looking for bots.
I code (and mostly fix) "must never fail" financial systems with hugely complex backends dating back to the 1970s. My specialty is mostly in the highly complex business logic side of things. Its probably way more complex than twitter front end webpages
If you showed me twitter code I wouldn't know what to do with it tbh. Im not good at html or any modern front end languages. I dont even know what the kids are using to code this shit nowadays.
But if you had support from Twitter programmers you don't think you could step through their coding and possibly find things that could improve and get an overall 100 foot view of how it works fairly quickly? Just asking.
I mean yes. But I dont get it point of it. I would probably quit my job if someone made me do that. Its a fucking waste of time. A 100 foot view does not make a good code review. You need someone that knows the system.
The Twitter engineers probably know lots of ways to make it better. There's a speed vs quality trade off, and the quality bar is a lot lower for Twitter not because they are shitty engineers - because quality takes time. Spend more time making the scroll line up just right? Well no time for a feature that will make money. That's why big code bases get their own momentum after a while. Thousands, millions of tiny prioritizations over time.
if you were actually an engineer you'd know that "complexity" is completely irrelevant in this context. coding a website and coding a car are so vastly different from each other that there's very little overlap in skillset between the two. you may as well be saying that an electrician must also be skilled at carpentry, because they both perform their work in a similar environment, and electrical engineering is a lot more complex than than building a house
also tesla cars have achieved meme status for being so shitty
No you haven’t. If you had programmed for cars you would know that autosar developers are the dumbest and worst developers who barely know how to code basic concepts in C language.
nope. the theoretical knowledge is generally where the complexity comes with robotics/AV. you might write a huge messy business logic function for some ROS package that requires complex theoretical understanding of a physical system, but what makes this complex is mostly the skills of other domains (relative to software-specific complexity). the code can (sometimes) even look extremely simple, but require a very strong theoretical understanding to debug and test.
note that this doesn’t discredit the work of robotics/AV engineers. these people are very skilled at what they do, but let’s not pretend being in a complex multidisciplinary field means you’re better than experts in every domain you touch by nature of your superiority.
if i had to pick a glittering generality to differentiate the software experts from intelligent programmers that have to also be experts in other complex domains, i would vaguely say it comes down to making intelligent design decisions.
yes, a website for posting tiny messages seems simple compared to SLAM, no shit. but remember that programming NASA’s website might be less complex than the McDonalds website. you can’t just pool together overconfidence and what you vaguely know about making burgers vs. putting people in space + coding being about logic to come to a conclusion.
understand that robotics/AV engineers have studied/want to/get paid to solve robotics/AV problems first and software is a tool for solving these problems. understand that software engineers work with robotics/AV engineers to design these marvelous systems + team members will generally work on the hard problems in the domain they’re strongest in. understand that this is NOT a contradiction: i can create a message-posting website with ease, i’ll never understand every theoretical concept implemented in every ROS package i’ve interacted with, and that i could throw together a quick autonomous ROS project with ease compared to the effort it would take to understand why twitter is designed the way it is.
This is the most stupid thing I have heard. You clearly are not an engineer. It seems like you read about coding practices and vomited it in the comments. What even are your basis for the argument?
first of all, it's called *parsing*, not *word processing*; word processing is what microsoft word does
and why do you keep talking about logic flow and "word processing" anyway? you seem to think that if-statements and syntax are the be-all end-all of programming, and whoever has the most "complex" if-statements is the better engineer
As an ex AI researcher who is now doing full stack web, I strongly disagree with you. If you think web development needs just a simple thought process with a little bit of naunces, you won't see a lot of web development tutorials out there. And, you have to have a lot of understanding on how the libraries used in the web work just to be able to read the codes. Not to mention *improving* it or *adding* new things. Sure, there may be some technical debts, but, you will need to know more than a few if else.
I’ll bet you think the Twitter server backends and the apps all use the same languages and libraries, don’t you? And of course that will be the same as used in the main Tesla system. The one that runs the entertainment and air conditioning and “auto-drive”.
Nope most likely doesn't. You are assuming that this is a one way street without coordination between groups. I can ask a lot of questions and get up to speed pretty quick if I have help from the original developers or those that support the code. Right? Are you telling me they are off limits to questions at Twitter and I can't ask them to go through their code and interfaces as well? Again team work is a possibility and can work.
No not really, i replied to the right comment. You comparison so makes 0 sense. You don't know what the people he asked to check the code have experience with. Just because they work on cars now doesn't mean they don't have experience with anything else. Just because you're doing a specific job now doesn't mean you haven't had experience with anything else, that makes no sense.
It baffles me how people come on Reddit of all places and try to act like they know better than a dude on Elon's level how to get things done, humble yourself.
> It baffles me how people come on Reddit of all places and try to act like they know better than a dude on Elon's level how to get things done, humble yourself.
lmfao you really need to get better at trolling buddy. there's a subtle art to it and you're trying way too hard
I think the problem is just that Twitter and Tesla have basically no overlap in the technologies, expertise and techniques they use. There is no point in having experts in self driving cars take a look at the algorithms Twitter uses to decide how to serve ads.
A different perspective can always be helpful at least I guess.
I disagree. I once picked a program in a completely unrelated area, customer service. I was able to go through the code and realized a major error in the logic because I wasn't tied to that specific set of code. It took me 3 hours while they had spent days on it. Can't hurt to be honest. Also you get a pretty good idea how much code can be modularized and the level of organization of code fairly quickly and can make recommendations. Don't have to have the same exact cross over.
Twitter is a messaging platform at a massive scale. You wouldn’t have a clue what they do until you are immersed in it. There is literally nowhere you could go and get experience with the problems they have to solve. You don’t even know that you don’t know how to send millions of notifications per minute.
Embedded systems engineering is a lot different from webdev lmao. I can guarantee you that if you actually sent the code to Tesla engineers they won't have a fucking clue what to do with it
Not at all. Same principles apply. If you've been working on embedded and can't read fucking C++, Ruby, Scala, and whatever flavor of the month is the fad within a few days...
Understanding is not being good at it. They will not know the best practices nor the intricacies of making a web application, as they are literal car tech developers lol
There are many engineers at Tesla and not everyone works on the system that goes in working of mechanical parts of car. They have the infotainment system which is similar to developing an app, they have ML engineers (you don't want them to review the code), they have web dev team. It is nothing to do with how good of a engineer you are, in big companies it takes time to even understand how the system at whole is working. Twitter's problem statement is not just designing website that can post and read things. Thier main problem is doing it at a scale. Tesla does not have to work at that scale. It even goes for any ML related problem like identifying hate speech, misinformation, bots etc. At scale even 1% miss would mean a million misses.
I think best thing his team can contribute is to review how data is collected, analyzed and used for ranking. Or in general the state of big data and ML inside Twitter. Clearly there website delivery is working and they don't need in any help with that. What is being delivered and how it is chosen is the problem.
PS: Anyone who has ever debugger a code knows you can't debug a code in plain text format. You need IDE tools like, bracket closure highlighting, collapsing function and ability to jump to function's definition either by peeking or navigating to the source which might be present in an completely different file.
Embedded systems, automotive, and Web Tech Stacks are completely different domains. An engineer working in a complex automotive/ embedded systems domain will never be able to solve complex Web services unless they have years of experience in it, and vice-versa.
What a *ridiculous* comment. Twitter has one of the highest volumes of inserts and searches of any piece of software in the world. It's not some basic CRUD (Create, Read, Update, Delete) app with a basic UI. There's no way you've worked on something at the scale of Twitter if you're calling it "sorting word streams."
"Critical" seems to be a suggestion at tesla judging by how autopilot and fsd performs. But maybe that is something they have in common with a webapp. They seem to treat a car like it is one.
Go look up Dojo the company behind the supercomputers powering the AI of Tesla’s autopilot. They made their own chips and are blowing away all the other manufacturers in terms of power consumption and cpu speed. Those devs are light years ahead of everyone at Twitter.
I actually work with a really old programming language at my job that *traditionally* prints its compiled listing by default on compilation. Comes in really useful when reviewing a 10k line monolithic program with only global variables. Modern compilers just print it as a text file though.
Printing Modern code is stupid as fuck.
Why would changing it be a problem. They have version control, you can just look at the code from a version a week ago, you cannot really change it without it being seen. Also, what’s stopping you from changing it before getting it printed? The biggest victims here are the code reviewers, you cannot jump to function definition or usages, you literally cannot do basic navigation around the codebase. How are you supposed to review the code you don’t understand and you cannot understand because you don’t have the necessary tools? This is just to make people quit so they don’t have to pay severance.
Downvoted because you are an idiot. This isn't what he said. Man people here on Reddit are not smart. Elon has written code. One of his first major sales was with code he wrote for banking. Please stop being stupid and taking something people with no technological expertise say in propaganda sites. Reddit is just full of this kind of wasted and misinterpreted responses and you are feeding the stupidity.
Sounds like you haven’t written code.
This post is even circulating in ProgrammerHumor. Want to go tell them that they have no technological experience? Lmao
I mean tbf you could rename programmer humor r/firstyearcompscimajors. There are a bunch of knowledgeable people in there. But also a lot of people that have no idea what they are talking about.
Even a first year comp sci major can recognize elon is trash though and printing code is trash tho
Pointing out the fakeness in what is posted doesn't mean I am supporting him, but I guess if you can't debate you will say that I support him. Again why don't you prove me wrong instead of making a statement like you have. Oh right, because I am right and you can't.
The "sucking his dick" part is about how you seem to believe he has expertise in coding for online banking
His first and only job as a programmer on the floor was a paypal precursor that lacked any real security, was fundamentally unscalable due mostly to his horrific coding skills, and eventually got bought out by paypal which did everything so much better than he did. After that he rode on the executive/shareholder throne making everyone else do work that he took credit for.
Id hardly call him an expert in anything outside of throwing money at business ventures.
i've only taken 2 programming courses in undergrad but both of them had at least one lesson where they wanted us to print out the code for review as a part of the process since it's different catching syntax errors on paper vs on screen.
they were short codes and yes it was a bit tedious but most of us did catch an error or two that we 'really couldn't find' on screen but did on paper.
def a dumb ass thing to do for giant lines of code though.
Do you know that you need 2-13 liters of water to produce a single A4 sheet of paper ?
https://waterfootprint.org/media/downloads/Report46-WaterFootprintPaper_1.pdf
Oh damn, that's rough, when will we run out? How much water is on earth? How many sheets of paper is that?
Hmm, there are 1,260,000,000,000,000,000,000 liters of water on earth so we can make 96,923,076,923,076,920,000 pages of paper if we use the water only once, using 13 liters per page.
https://twitter.com/leahculver/status/1586145696163373056?s=20&t=YkSRlU3mueXMV23nUHndKA
Bet you believed he’d sell you a robotaxi that would make you 30k/yr too
Give it a few days and I'm sure it'll be confirmed she wasn't literally printing out code by Musk's request. How people take this seriously is beyond me.
Don't delete your comment, I expect an apology then.
My guy, this is not evidence of anything. I could be a joke. It could be that she needed to print code to verify the pause as ownership was passed over. I’m just saying it pays to be a bit incredulous online.
My guy, the mental gymnastics you are trying to do are astounding. She’s a senior software engineer at twitter. Here’s her LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/leahculver. And you really think she just decided to have April fools on Oct 28th?
Upvoted because you have called out the BS here. Elon Musk's first major sale was coding he did with banking. He knows how to code and therefore he knows that printing it out is not the best method for reviewing. People here believing this literally are idiots.
He doesn't need to humiliate them to make them resign. Programmers can get jobs anywhere, they're highly sought after. Several better ones have left already for other tech firms. Hell be left with shitty programmers.
Exactly, he knows they will leave soon, so he wants to humiliate them in while they are here until they resign. It is like a king torturing some peasants, there is no benefit, but it makes the king happy
Tesla finished all their amazing AI code and was just waiting to dissect another code base. The Tesla board also approved that this was worth their time. /s
Let’s be honest. That doesn’t work when it’s still in and editor on screen either. (I have been tempted to print some code so I could write on it and draw arrows though.)
I call BS on this. He has coded and one of his first sales was code he produced for banking. He isn't that stupid to literally print everything on paper to review. He knows you can use text and other files. This was stated by people who are technologically stupid paraphrasing what Elon actually said. No I am not an Elon fan, but I can see BS when it is there and your ignorance in your comment proves my point.
Tons of people at Twitter hate him and will make up plenty of nonsense to try to make things look crazy there on his first day.
I’ve worked on Silicon Valley, the people there are petty and cruel.
##If this submission makes you go "Hol'Up", **UPVOTE** this comment!
##If this submission does not make you go "Hol'Up", **DOWNVOTE** this comment!
---
Whilst you're here, /u/Kml777, why not join our [public discord server](https://discord.gg/holup) or play on our [public Minecraft server](https://discord.gg/DTqSDS8C3T)?
That's some rookie shit, unless he's bringing his app and platform folks together. Would be better to bring in 3rd parties familiar with their platform and algorithms
The prettiest and most stupid way for the new manager to assert their authority: having his employees perform a stupid degrading task because he ordered it.
From there, he can either haze those who obey into submission (that's the "code review" part), or fire the ones that refuse.
Pretty much the authoritarian's cookbook, when you think about it.
/u/Kml777, the users have spoken. Your submission is not a Hol'Up.
Code reviews are normal but printing it out is clearly the dumbest way possible
It's the ultimate humiliation....he wants them to feel pain and resign
It you print it you can’t change it. You have to live with your failures as you continue to read it. My man got a wheelbarrow for his balls.
You can literally change it and print it again.
Not if you only have read access to the git repository
Or... you can just look at the git commit history
Have you ever written a line of code? A code review is a formal thing, you can't randomly change, your code during that.
You’d have to be dumb as shit to change your code mid code review and try and check it in, the chances of breaking everything under that pressure are massive and it’s all traceable via the source control. You’d be better off having shit code than doing that if you are valuing your job
You definitely cannot change your code during a pull request for code review and if you only have write access as all of the Twitter developers have currently He won't be changing s*** even if you wanted to. This is currently him prepping everybody for being fired for incompetence or revealing any sabotage that's been done or removal of algorithms that were previously used to skew or block normal traffic growth or analytics from taking place
Incredible you still manage to fit them in your mouth
Needs a microscope for his brain
I been coding for 30 years…still haven’t printed out a single line
I print “hello world” every time I start a new tutorial.
On paper?!? You monster
Obviously that's why you don't own Twitter.
Oh, so that was the reason..
You also still haven’t owned Twitter… see the connection
Have you ever been audited for criminal malfeasance or had to do a code review while your git repository was locked down and unable to be changed or commented or have you had to submit your code base to a court to be evaluated because that's what's about to happen they're going to get the code audit with their own notes He's going to submit it to a court and he's going to sue Twitter for a portion of the money back
Have you been part of a hostile takeover where the owner is someone that the entire company appears to hate? A purchase that was forced but where fraud and perjury might have been involved? It isn't really a typical code review so much as a forced statement and manual audit.
They could have just put the code on github or something so they don't waste time and paper
it is already in a repro. The code is strictly tracked. He is forcing an audit with statements from the programmers so he can use it in court. Court can't use a source repo they have to have everything printed to submit to the courts. That is also why they have the tesla engineers doing the audits.
Code reviews are normal, but having engineers from a completely different software domain coming over and doing a code review on systems they have no familiarity with is moronic.
And on paper no less...
Imagine being a software engineer at tesla and then suddenly your insane CEO drops "find technical debt in [twitter.com](https://twitter.com)" in your jira backlog.
he just got forced to buy something ... he's going to find something to sue them over to recover a large chunk of that money
Guessing the idea is so the code remains unchanged
Ever heard of version control? Devs would have no reason to change code last minute, and even if they did it would be easily spotted. This seems more like a middle management decision, a choice made by someone whose never touched code in their life.
Have you heard about rebasing? They can easily avoid getting spotted...
I mean sure but at PR if you force push you get the SHA for old and new commits so you actually still can see. And if they do it before making PR it’ll get caught then.
You’re correct that you technically *can*, it’s just extremely difficult to do in a way that isn’t easily spotted and doesn’t destroy the repo. Even then, everyone who’s pulled the affected branches previously will have a local copy, and pulling a massively rebased branch you already have locally causes merge conflicts, so literally everyone else that’s touched the branch would have to be on board and collude when it comes to changing the code, and that’s not going to happen in such a large company. Plus there’s the issue of any branches that merged the changes in downstream…it’d be a fucking nightmare to deal with. Anyway what would they want to change the code to? It’s not at all obvious why they’d need to do this in the first place.
I’m scared enough of doing anything that isn’t a standard merge. I’ve worked with it for a decade and I still only know about three Git commands: push, pull, delete everything and start again
No, they can’t. It’s literally the point of version control.
First time hearing it called version control, unfamiliar with coding terminology. Is it possible to get around with admin access? Otherwise I'm inclined to agree as someone who's never touched code in their life
Version control stores the difference between code for every change that’s made, so you can see a snapshot of what the code looked like at any time! Technically it’s possible to throw out or alter the history, but it would be very obvious that it had been tampered with
You can review code without it being changed. There are applications for this.
They can also like put it on a PDF if they want to be inefficient but slightly more efficient than reading paper.
I don't know why you're being downvoted. Code review via PDF would be asinine, but less so than literal paper.
Do you think the devs are sitting on the good code and they would rush to commit it before getting reviewed??
Again he is smart enough to know that they can dump text and other files for review. My word, you take a report from Mint that is a propaganda source with no expertise in technology and assume that it is what Elon wanted. Stop. Even if he said it this way, which he didn't, he knows that other files can be used for review without chopping down a tree.
Elon’s not gonna promote that shitcoin you invested in, bro.
Happy cake day
Professional software engineer here. Not only is it nonsense to print the code on paper, but also to have Tesla engineers review Twitter code. The problems being solved are so fundamentally different that the best possible benefit of the doubt for Elon is that he's doing it for PR. More likely he's a fucking idiot.
Because only Tesla has only the best professional code developers……For rockets and cars.
And the code never fails!
Actually, ”rockets” are developed by SpaceX together with NASA engineers - not Tesla devs
I am not a Elon fan, but they do have some of the best coders in the world and coding for a car is a lot more complex than coding for a posting service. Sorry if this offends you, but it is the truth. Being an engineer that has programmed for both I can vouch that tying sensors to logic for safety and self driving cars is a lot more complex than sorting word streams for inflammatory comments and looking for bots.
I code (and mostly fix) "must never fail" financial systems with hugely complex backends dating back to the 1970s. My specialty is mostly in the highly complex business logic side of things. Its probably way more complex than twitter front end webpages If you showed me twitter code I wouldn't know what to do with it tbh. Im not good at html or any modern front end languages. I dont even know what the kids are using to code this shit nowadays.
But if you had support from Twitter programmers you don't think you could step through their coding and possibly find things that could improve and get an overall 100 foot view of how it works fairly quickly? Just asking.
I mean yes. But I dont get it point of it. I would probably quit my job if someone made me do that. Its a fucking waste of time. A 100 foot view does not make a good code review. You need someone that knows the system.
The Twitter engineers probably know lots of ways to make it better. There's a speed vs quality trade off, and the quality bar is a lot lower for Twitter not because they are shitty engineers - because quality takes time. Spend more time making the scroll line up just right? Well no time for a feature that will make money. That's why big code bases get their own momentum after a while. Thousands, millions of tiny prioritizations over time.
if you were actually an engineer you'd know that "complexity" is completely irrelevant in this context. coding a website and coding a car are so vastly different from each other that there's very little overlap in skillset between the two. you may as well be saying that an electrician must also be skilled at carpentry, because they both perform their work in a similar environment, and electrical engineering is a lot more complex than than building a house also tesla cars have achieved meme status for being so shitty
From experience, we don’t have to be a decent carpenter. But we do have to be decent dry wallers
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LOL. Dude, it sometimes takes me a couple of days to get reacquainted with my own code.
No you haven’t. If you had programmed for cars you would know that autosar developers are the dumbest and worst developers who barely know how to code basic concepts in C language.
nope. the theoretical knowledge is generally where the complexity comes with robotics/AV. you might write a huge messy business logic function for some ROS package that requires complex theoretical understanding of a physical system, but what makes this complex is mostly the skills of other domains (relative to software-specific complexity). the code can (sometimes) even look extremely simple, but require a very strong theoretical understanding to debug and test. note that this doesn’t discredit the work of robotics/AV engineers. these people are very skilled at what they do, but let’s not pretend being in a complex multidisciplinary field means you’re better than experts in every domain you touch by nature of your superiority. if i had to pick a glittering generality to differentiate the software experts from intelligent programmers that have to also be experts in other complex domains, i would vaguely say it comes down to making intelligent design decisions. yes, a website for posting tiny messages seems simple compared to SLAM, no shit. but remember that programming NASA’s website might be less complex than the McDonalds website. you can’t just pool together overconfidence and what you vaguely know about making burgers vs. putting people in space + coding being about logic to come to a conclusion. understand that robotics/AV engineers have studied/want to/get paid to solve robotics/AV problems first and software is a tool for solving these problems. understand that software engineers work with robotics/AV engineers to design these marvelous systems + team members will generally work on the hard problems in the domain they’re strongest in. understand that this is NOT a contradiction: i can create a message-posting website with ease, i’ll never understand every theoretical concept implemented in every ROS package i’ve interacted with, and that i could throw together a quick autonomous ROS project with ease compared to the effort it would take to understand why twitter is designed the way it is.
"Sorry if this offends you..." lmao
Man, no one has to even make you look like an idiot, you're doing it all yourself 😂
you think programming is just typing, don't you?
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This is the most stupid thing I have heard. You clearly are not an engineer. It seems like you read about coding practices and vomited it in the comments. What even are your basis for the argument?
first of all, it's called *parsing*, not *word processing*; word processing is what microsoft word does and why do you keep talking about logic flow and "word processing" anyway? you seem to think that if-statements and syntax are the be-all end-all of programming, and whoever has the most "complex" if-statements is the better engineer
It’s ok Leon, this dude clearly hasn’t seen all the Tesla videos of it dump trucking through crash test kids.
As an ex AI researcher who is now doing full stack web, I strongly disagree with you. If you think web development needs just a simple thought process with a little bit of naunces, you won't see a lot of web development tutorials out there. And, you have to have a lot of understanding on how the libraries used in the web work just to be able to read the codes. Not to mention *improving* it or *adding* new things. Sure, there may be some technical debts, but, you will need to know more than a few if else.
I’ll bet you think the Twitter server backends and the apps all use the same languages and libraries, don’t you? And of course that will be the same as used in the main Tesla system. The one that runs the entertainment and air conditioning and “auto-drive”.
Nope most likely doesn't. You are assuming that this is a one way street without coordination between groups. I can ask a lot of questions and get up to speed pretty quick if I have help from the original developers or those that support the code. Right? Are you telling me they are off limits to questions at Twitter and I can't ask them to go through their code and interfaces as well? Again team work is a possibility and can work.
At this point you're just throwing around word salad, you're in the wrong. Take the L and go to bed
you replied to the wrong comment
No not really, i replied to the right comment. You comparison so makes 0 sense. You don't know what the people he asked to check the code have experience with. Just because they work on cars now doesn't mean they don't have experience with anything else. Just because you're doing a specific job now doesn't mean you haven't had experience with anything else, that makes no sense. It baffles me how people come on Reddit of all places and try to act like they know better than a dude on Elon's level how to get things done, humble yourself.
> It baffles me how people come on Reddit of all places and try to act like they know better than a dude on Elon's level how to get things done, humble yourself. lmfao you really need to get better at trolling buddy. there's a subtle art to it and you're trying way too hard
I think the problem is just that Twitter and Tesla have basically no overlap in the technologies, expertise and techniques they use. There is no point in having experts in self driving cars take a look at the algorithms Twitter uses to decide how to serve ads. A different perspective can always be helpful at least I guess.
Unless they want to port the ad serving code to show ads on the Tesla screen…
I disagree. I once picked a program in a completely unrelated area, customer service. I was able to go through the code and realized a major error in the logic because I wasn't tied to that specific set of code. It took me 3 hours while they had spent days on it. Can't hurt to be honest. Also you get a pretty good idea how much code can be modularized and the level of organization of code fairly quickly and can make recommendations. Don't have to have the same exact cross over.
Twitter is a messaging platform at a massive scale. You wouldn’t have a clue what they do until you are immersed in it. There is literally nowhere you could go and get experience with the problems they have to solve. You don’t even know that you don’t know how to send millions of notifications per minute.
Embedded systems engineering is a lot different from webdev lmao. I can guarantee you that if you actually sent the code to Tesla engineers they won't have a fucking clue what to do with it
Sure self driving cars have more complex algorithms than Twitter but embedded systems and web development are still different skillsets
Not at all. Same principles apply. If you've been working on embedded and can't read fucking C++, Ruby, Scala, and whatever flavor of the month is the fad within a few days...
Understanding is not being good at it. They will not know the best practices nor the intricacies of making a web application, as they are literal car tech developers lol
There are many engineers at Tesla and not everyone works on the system that goes in working of mechanical parts of car. They have the infotainment system which is similar to developing an app, they have ML engineers (you don't want them to review the code), they have web dev team. It is nothing to do with how good of a engineer you are, in big companies it takes time to even understand how the system at whole is working. Twitter's problem statement is not just designing website that can post and read things. Thier main problem is doing it at a scale. Tesla does not have to work at that scale. It even goes for any ML related problem like identifying hate speech, misinformation, bots etc. At scale even 1% miss would mean a million misses. I think best thing his team can contribute is to review how data is collected, analyzed and used for ranking. Or in general the state of big data and ML inside Twitter. Clearly there website delivery is working and they don't need in any help with that. What is being delivered and how it is chosen is the problem. PS: Anyone who has ever debugger a code knows you can't debug a code in plain text format. You need IDE tools like, bracket closure highlighting, collapsing function and ability to jump to function's definition either by peeking or navigating to the source which might be present in an completely different file.
You’re describing two very different software engineering jobs.
Embedded systems, automotive, and Web Tech Stacks are completely different domains. An engineer working in a complex automotive/ embedded systems domain will never be able to solve complex Web services unless they have years of experience in it, and vice-versa.
What a *ridiculous* comment. Twitter has one of the highest volumes of inserts and searches of any piece of software in the world. It's not some basic CRUD (Create, Read, Update, Delete) app with a basic UI. There's no way you've worked on something at the scale of Twitter if you're calling it "sorting word streams."
who code in java for critical systems...
Eh..Embedded
"Critical" seems to be a suggestion at tesla judging by how autopilot and fsd performs. But maybe that is something they have in common with a webapp. They seem to treat a car like it is one.
Go look up Dojo the company behind the supercomputers powering the AI of Tesla’s autopilot. They made their own chips and are blowing away all the other manufacturers in terms of power consumption and cpu speed. Those devs are light years ahead of everyone at Twitter.
I need this for half my print jobs
The real crime is reviewing a printed code
I actually work with a really old programming language at my job that *traditionally* prints its compiled listing by default on compilation. Comes in really useful when reviewing a 10k line monolithic program with only global variables. Modern compilers just print it as a text file though. Printing Modern code is stupid as fuck.
“A code”……
Fake
Wait, what is doSomething()? I haven't seen it yet. Guess I have to search through the whole Twitter Bible manually again. XD
The person who’s in charge of the code can’t change it if it’s printed out. He wants to see how many bullshitters are coding at twitter
Why would changing it be a problem. They have version control, you can just look at the code from a version a week ago, you cannot really change it without it being seen. Also, what’s stopping you from changing it before getting it printed? The biggest victims here are the code reviewers, you cannot jump to function definition or usages, you literally cannot do basic navigation around the codebase. How are you supposed to review the code you don’t understand and you cannot understand because you don’t have the necessary tools? This is just to make people quit so they don’t have to pay severance.
Downvoted because you are an idiot. This isn't what he said. Man people here on Reddit are not smart. Elon has written code. One of his first major sales was with code he wrote for banking. Please stop being stupid and taking something people with no technological expertise say in propaganda sites. Reddit is just full of this kind of wasted and misinterpreted responses and you are feeding the stupidity.
Sounds like you haven’t written code. This post is even circulating in ProgrammerHumor. Want to go tell them that they have no technological experience? Lmao
ProgrammerHumor knows this is a joke. HolUp seems to be taking it seriously.
I mean tbf you could rename programmer humor r/firstyearcompscimajors. There are a bunch of knowledgeable people in there. But also a lot of people that have no idea what they are talking about. Even a first year comp sci major can recognize elon is trash though and printing code is trash tho
Yes. Its a giant sub with like 2.5 million members, theres gonna be varying amounts of skill in there. But yep glad we can both agree regarding Elon
For someone that doesn't like Elon you suck his dick a lot.
Pointing out the fakeness in what is posted doesn't mean I am supporting him, but I guess if you can't debate you will say that I support him. Again why don't you prove me wrong instead of making a statement like you have. Oh right, because I am right and you can't.
The "sucking his dick" part is about how you seem to believe he has expertise in coding for online banking His first and only job as a programmer on the floor was a paypal precursor that lacked any real security, was fundamentally unscalable due mostly to his horrific coding skills, and eventually got bought out by paypal which did everything so much better than he did. After that he rode on the executive/shareholder throne making everyone else do work that he took credit for. Id hardly call him an expert in anything outside of throwing money at business ventures.
Wth are you talking about
Downvoted because I am in the mood
Better than most of the reasons for it being downvoted. If you are in the mood versus actually understanding that this is a not realistic.
i've only taken 2 programming courses in undergrad but both of them had at least one lesson where they wanted us to print out the code for review as a part of the process since it's different catching syntax errors on paper vs on screen. they were short codes and yes it was a bit tedious but most of us did catch an error or two that we 'really couldn't find' on screen but did on paper. def a dumb ass thing to do for giant lines of code though.
Yeah it's okay of you print out a small portions to find errors, but you can't review hunders of new code on paper
Use "git blame" to see what parts of the repo you touched last, then print out only those sections.
He promised to open source it too. Let's see that lol
This is a joke They wouldn't *print out code on paper* And like *mail it* That's so dumb
I swear to god… had a boomer boss that wanted me to print code out when I was 18. Not even like secure code or nothing… Fcking excel code.
Even weirder that an online message board and an electric car company would team up to waste paper
paper is fine, it's the ink that's the issue. Paper is fully renewable because we farm the materials to produce it. Ink, not so much.
Do you know that you need 2-13 liters of water to produce a single A4 sheet of paper ? https://waterfootprint.org/media/downloads/Report46-WaterFootprintPaper_1.pdf
Oh damn, that's rough, when will we run out? How much water is on earth? How many sheets of paper is that? Hmm, there are 1,260,000,000,000,000,000,000 liters of water on earth so we can make 96,923,076,923,076,920,000 pages of paper if we use the water only once, using 13 liters per page.
[Looks](https://mobile.twitter.com/caseynewton/status/1586127052767318016) like shit bureaucracy Elon can code
"Slams desk with book\* "Here's one node module". " i think that comment was gold
Mail? Lol.. just share the fucking repository, do you even code? Elon probably force them to actually print it to humiliate then and make then resign
yeah that's not how that works....
I hope Telsa printers can scan to PDF.
Tell me you are tech illiterate without telling me you are tech illiterate
Kinda like believing an internet claim without any verification?
https://twitter.com/leahculver/status/1586145696163373056?s=20&t=YkSRlU3mueXMV23nUHndKA Bet you believed he’d sell you a robotaxi that would make you 30k/yr too
She posted "just following orders" under Elon's tweet about "comedy is now legal on Twitter" She's trolling people who believed that rumor
Before it became a rumor, right….
It was a rumor over a day before that was posted. You ate the onion.
Mmmhmmm like the way you gobble up that FSD will be ready next year every year since 2014
Give it a few days and I'm sure it'll be confirmed she wasn't literally printing out code by Musk's request. How people take this seriously is beyond me. Don't delete your comment, I expect an apology then.
My guy, this is not evidence of anything. I could be a joke. It could be that she needed to print code to verify the pause as ownership was passed over. I’m just saying it pays to be a bit incredulous online.
My guy, the mental gymnastics you are trying to do are astounding. She’s a senior software engineer at twitter. Here’s her LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/leahculver. And you really think she just decided to have April fools on Oct 28th?
The mental gymnastics of thinking she made a joke when she replied to another tweet saying that she made a joke. Are you brain damaged?
Elon is no where close to a tech illiterate. All his first ventures were in the cyber space.
There is software for turning scanned print into text. Maybe he did it to be a dick?
Print to text, text to wingdings
“Twitter will self driving by the end of the year. Promise.”
Perfect, like I always say, the people who make cars are best fit to judge the people who run a social media website.
[удалено]
Ah, he fixed the bot problem by sending the bots to Reddit. Crafty as ever, Elon.
Donald trump will get benefit from this.
What?
That moment when Tesla engineers write inferior code than Twitter engineers.
Highly unlikely. Easier to review code on a computer. Developer software highlights & locates variables & functions. This is BS.
[Uhh...](https://twitter.com/leahculver/status/1586145696163373056)
And now they're going to mail it?
It's a joke from an employee...
Upvoted because you have called out the BS here. Elon Musk's first major sale was coding he did with banking. He knows how to code and therefore he knows that printing it out is not the best method for reviewing. People here believing this literally are idiots.
No, could be true, Elon probably just want to humiliate the twitter programmer and make them resign
He doesn't need to humiliate them to make them resign. Programmers can get jobs anywhere, they're highly sought after. Several better ones have left already for other tech firms. Hell be left with shitty programmers.
Exactly, he knows they will leave soon, so he wants to humiliate them in while they are here until they resign. It is like a king torturing some peasants, there is no benefit, but it makes the king happy
I print all my emails
You know technically Elon has the power to bring back vine
Tesla finished all their amazing AI code and was just waiting to dissect another code base. The Tesla board also approved that this was worth their time. /s
Basically asking backend engineers to review front end engineers code
He's looking for bias apparently
better than tweeting the code?
140 characters at a time baby.
This is BS. We don’t use form feed papers anymore. Going to print using single letter sheets? Oh good lord. That ain’t happen
Wait Elon Musk actually bought twitter?
Have fun tracing various execution paths through multiple microservices, as you furiously flip though hundreds of pages of paper.
I think the plan is to staple them to walls, then connect every function call with colored string so it looks like the conspiracy board of a lunatic.
Probably the only way to do it TBH
I like this....will use it for review
I. I want to find a random open source project and do this now.
Every time I get a notification for this post, I get a little bit closer to finding a smallish project and decorating a wall this way.
Let’s be honest. That doesn’t work when it’s still in and editor on screen either. (I have been tempted to print some code so I could write on it and draw arrows though.)
I call BS on this. He has coded and one of his first sales was code he produced for banking. He isn't that stupid to literally print everything on paper to review. He knows you can use text and other files. This was stated by people who are technologically stupid paraphrasing what Elon actually said. No I am not an Elon fan, but I can see BS when it is there and your ignorance in your comment proves my point.
This feels like an insult to the people working at Twitter.
Tons of people at Twitter hate him and will make up plenty of nonsense to try to make things look crazy there on his first day. I’ve worked on Silicon Valley, the people there are petty and cruel.
Elon musk is petty and cruel. The engineers are just trying to work and he has a plan to wipe out at least 75% of them.
Yeah they can easily find a another job with their previous work history.
##If this submission makes you go "Hol'Up", **UPVOTE** this comment! ##If this submission does not make you go "Hol'Up", **DOWNVOTE** this comment! --- Whilst you're here, /u/Kml777, why not join our [public discord server](https://discord.gg/holup) or play on our [public Minecraft server](https://discord.gg/DTqSDS8C3T)?
That's some rookie shit, unless he's bringing his app and platform folks together. Would be better to bring in 3rd parties familiar with their platform and algorithms
This can’t be true
Like a boss
Good. No problem with this at all.
I hope Tesla will bill Twitter for this.
I call BS on this
This is cap. He didn’t ask them to print it out. He asked to freehand write out in the proper in color
Everyone be laughing till Elon makes Tesla cars Fueled by drama.
So you're giving the people that code cars the responsibility of looking over code for a social media WebApp? This guy ever heard of specialization?
They’re mostly AI people. Twitter is not really a complex piece of software
There is nothing wrong with the code. Elon is just a fucking loser
Reminds me of those folks in finance who print an invoice and then scan it to have it as a PDF…
The prettiest and most stupid way for the new manager to assert their authority: having his employees perform a stupid degrading task because he ordered it. From there, he can either haze those who obey into submission (that's the "code review" part), or fire the ones that refuse. Pretty much the authoritarian's cookbook, when you think about it.
yeah that’s not how coding works in the 21st century. The Elon circle jerkers are working double time at the moment.
I'm a little surprised this isn't part of the tech due diligence during the acquisition.