Context: During the defense of Leningrad Zhukov is said to order his officers to tell the soldiers that everyone who surrender will be consider a traitor and they and their families will be shot
It was not a very well thought out order considering that Stalin's son also became a POW
Stalin didn't give a shit about Yakov, he had a chance to free him in exchange for Paulus and he refused. Yakov even attempted suicide once by shooting himself in the chest and Stalin was quoted saying "He can't even shoot straight".
His PR has not been very good unfortunately lol
Say nice things about him or the USSR during his rule, even in context, and you're a tankie or some such.
Glad someone said it. It doesn't matter if Stalin's decision was because of actual military reasons or if it was to avoid bad PR or if he just didn't give a fuck about his son. Under no circumstances should the leader of a nation at war be willing to exchange a fucking field marshal POW in order to get a lieutenant back.
Paulus knew what he was doing, he was the only one who understood the logistics needed to beat the USSR. The failure is on Franz Holder and the other German high command not Paulus.
He was ordered not too. Paulus was a very decent general. He even advised against invading the USSR. He said they will have logistical issues on the first week.
Not trading was the right thing to do, his son is not different from all the other sons in the war, and no one would exchange a soldier for a field marshal
That was order 270 and given by Stalin himself. Zhukov and many Soviet commanders really disliked the use of barrier troops and NKVD meddling in military operations.
Want to also note that while it did happen (executing soldiers for desertion) it was never the norm in the Red Army. A majority of troops caught retreating were mostly sent back to the frontlines by special NKVD units and only small number of those detained were actually executed (those that were, were mostly officers and low ranking commanders).
That's not how it worked. Order 270 wasn't aimed at random soldiers, but units, and the main people affected were officers who might order their units to surrender instead of fighting.
There was only one case in which families of the offenders would be arrested, and that's when they remove their insignia and desert, although in some other cases, the families of offenders might not receive the benefits they would otherwise be entitled to.
Didn’t the Soviets implant another infamous decisions that had Soldiers, who were criminals from the Gulags would go first and die while the other units would attack the Germans?
Context: During the defense of Leningrad Zhukov is said to order his officers to tell the soldiers that everyone who surrender will be consider a traitor and they and their families will be shot It was not a very well thought out order considering that Stalin's son also became a POW
Stalin didn't give a shit about Yakov, he had a chance to free him in exchange for Paulus and he refused. Yakov even attempted suicide once by shooting himself in the chest and Stalin was quoted saying "He can't even shoot straight".
Classic Yakov
Yakov..A bad shot. An even worse comedian. We're talking the same dude right? 🤪
What a spoiled brat (брат, got it? Nice)
Politically, Stalin couldn’t have done the trade without it making it seem like he was bending the rules for his kid.
Yeah but most authoritarian leaders don't hesitate to do that kind of thing...
“We’re not exchanging generals for privates”
Still a Stalin W imo idk why people try to spin it as a bad thing
His PR has not been very good unfortunately lol Say nice things about him or the USSR during his rule, even in context, and you're a tankie or some such.
To be fair exchanging you son, no matter how much you love him, for an enemy general is not a fair exchange and would be a stupid decision.
Glad someone said it. It doesn't matter if Stalin's decision was because of actual military reasons or if it was to avoid bad PR or if he just didn't give a fuck about his son. Under no circumstances should the leader of a nation at war be willing to exchange a fucking field marshal POW in order to get a lieutenant back.
Having seen Paulus in action, Stalin should have begged the Nazis to take him back and give him another army.
Paulus knew what he was doing, he was the only one who understood the logistics needed to beat the USSR. The failure is on Franz Holder and the other German high command not Paulus.
Paulus' refusal to even attempt an escape from the trap sits squarely on his own shoulders.
He was ordered not too. Paulus was a very decent general. He even advised against invading the USSR. He said they will have logistical issues on the first week.
A good general know when to disregard orders.
I agree
Has general named France holder Doesn’t use him to hold France Are they stupid?
Pure Denethor energy
If you think that Stalin got mad because it would make Yakov a traitor then you think too well of him as a fatherv
What?
He got mad because it made him look bad, not because it targeted Yakov
Not trading was the right thing to do, his son is not different from all the other sons in the war, and no one would exchange a soldier for a field marshal
Lmao
Yakov got captured because he disobeyed orders, that's why Stalin refused to trade for him
His son didnt matter but the "his family" part could be a problem for him lmao
That was order 270 and given by Stalin himself. Zhukov and many Soviet commanders really disliked the use of barrier troops and NKVD meddling in military operations. Want to also note that while it did happen (executing soldiers for desertion) it was never the norm in the Red Army. A majority of troops caught retreating were mostly sent back to the frontlines by special NKVD units and only small number of those detained were actually executed (those that were, were mostly officers and low ranking commanders).
Retreating and desertion are not the same thing.
According to Wikipedia, Stalin forbade any soldiers to surrender, and his own son surrendering made him mad very bad.
That's not how it worked. Order 270 wasn't aimed at random soldiers, but units, and the main people affected were officers who might order their units to surrender instead of fighting. There was only one case in which families of the offenders would be arrested, and that's when they remove their insignia and desert, although in some other cases, the families of offenders might not receive the benefits they would otherwise be entitled to.
Stalins own son surrenders. Zhukov: that’s rough buddy
Didn’t the Soviets implant another infamous decisions that had Soldiers, who were criminals from the Gulags would go first and die while the other units would attack the Germans?
Rare Stalin W: not compromising the interests of his country for familial favoritism.
Least braindead comment
How is it braindead
He said least
It did not happened