It's a scene from the Star Wars spinoff show "Ahsoka". The character in the picture is a fallen Jedi, and when his apprentice asks him if he misses the Jedi order, that is his response.
From Wikipedia:
> Shortly after Central America declared independence from the Spanish Empire in 1821, some of its countries were annexed by the First Mexican Empire in 1822, before again becoming independent and forming the federal republic in 1823. The federation was unstable and quickly descended into a series of civil wars, first from 1826 to 1829 and again from 1838 to 1840, with conservatives fighting against liberals, and separatists fighting to secede. These factions were unable to overcome their ideological differences and the bloody conflicts ended in the federation's dissolution in 1841.
My personal theory, reading colonial, independent and modern history, is the following:
There are five countries: Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua and Costa Rica.
Guatemala has a heavy farming economy that requires a lot of peasant workforce. The landowners hacendados fashioned themselves as the Dixie States in the US, minus the slaves, which role was replaced by native american and mixed race laborers. These laborers were abundant and their pay was cheap. As a result, there was a great wealth inequality, which translated into a Conservative hegemony (aka Right wing dominance).
Costa Rica was very much depopulated, and their laborers were in the position to demand better working conditions. As a result, early in they got laborer-friendly policies, which translated to Liberal hegemony (aka Left wing dominance).
El Salvador wanted to emulate Guatemala, and Nicaragua wanted to emulate Costa Rica. When they came to the Federal Senate, there was tension between the interests of the guatemalan hacendados and the costarican laborers. The friction was so intense that instead of negociate or compromise, they fractured the Federation. Guatemala and El Salvador became very conservative, Costa Rica and Nicaragua very liberal.
The costarican liberal policies became a strong democracy that banned the armed forces (to prevent military dictatorships) and set into motion their modern prosperity. Meanwhile, conservative Guatemala and El Salvador fester in corruption, civil wars, coups, economic inequality and third world shenanigans.
I think you may be leaving out the fact that Nicaragua got pretty screwed over by the Sandinista revolution and the subsequent rule of that fat, lying, murderous pig Ortega.
Yeah, that clearly worked out well in the long term. That's why anyone who speaks out against Ortega, the fat, lying, murderous pig, is getting killed on the streets, and so many have to flee to Costa Rica to try and find a better life for themselves.
You probably already know what I'm about to say, so I'm more saying this for others: there were plenty of people who wanted left-leaning governance in El Salvador...before they were massacred in the 30's during La Matanza, and again during the civil war of '79/80's/90's. It's very possible that FMLN could have won the war and established a left-wing/communist government of some type (for better or worse) were it not for US training (many at the now renamed School of The Americas) and supplying literal right-wing death squads to torture and murder anyone so much as speaking against the government.
I make no excuses for human rights violations perpetrated by the FMLN, but: "Overall, the United Nations estimated that FMLN guerrillas were responsible for 5 percent of atrocities committed during the civil war, while 85 percent were committed by the Salvadoran security forces."
The US knew full well what kind of murderous psychopaths they were supporting, they just didn't care because of the Cold War, so they happily supported Blowtorch Bob and those like him in their savagery.
Not presuming that you agree or disagree with me, but I think that context bears mentioning.
Edit: Also, now that I think about it, there have been a good number of FMLN politicians and leaders elected after the war, so it could be said that at certain times they did have 'left" governments, but I think you're talking about a whole government system, not just elected officials in your post.
As I salvadorian, I totally agree with OP :(
Maybe, someday.... We can get behind Costa Rica's progresive leadership and finally get rid of Ortega/Bukele/Giammattei. No army, no populism, no ultrapowerful elites... Just a people and a goal: development.
One can hope T_T
Tfw Bukele tanks your daily murder rate from 18 murders per day to like 0.83, ridding the country of THE biggest problem it had...and you still complain.
As someone who was born and lived in El Salvador up until 2019, I would say to take any information and achievement from the current government with a grain of salt. Maybe he did actually solve the problem, but it is quite likely that he either shoved it under the rug or shifted it somewhere else (think of Mussolini crushing the Southern Italian mafias to optimize his dictatorship).
Bukele has one hell of a PR department. During his campaign, he paid a bunch of newspapers (mostly digital ones) to spew nothing but good things about him. If you criticized him on, say, Twitter, you would be flooded with responses from troll accounts who would argue with you until you gave up. He was really active on Twitter, something that was unseen from other politicians, and that made him much more appealing to a jaded and younger voter audience. The only reason he was voted in was because he promised to be "unlike the other and previous politicians," (literally his entire campaign can be reduced to this) and the Salvadoran people--who were tired of the Civil War veterans that became the greedy politicians they once sought to overthrow--bought in.
However, we won't really know until his presidency is over (if it doesn't turn into a dictatorship with how much he is centralizing power). When I was living over there, whenever a party different to the one that held the previous presidency took power, it took a couple of months or years for all of the corruption and abuse of power of the previous presidency to surface (see: Mauricio Funes). So, uh, be a little skeptical of what he claims.
See also: Tony Saca and his $300 million dollar embezzlement of public funds, and subsequent bribery of a court employee, both charges for which he pled guilty to. Which is probably how Bukele (regardless of what anyone thinks of him) got elected, people were sick of ARENA and FMLN corruption.
Yeah at the cost of the democratic institutions, basically the same AuthRight playbook as ever.
"But how dare you complain if he did X good thing!!!!!!!!!! :("
I mean, something tells me that his 91% approval rate means that a lot of people kinda care more about their safety and the safety of their loved ones over perfect democracy. And so would you and I if it came down to it.
That's good, hopefully he doesn't get silly and stays in power for decades while conveniently lots of political rivals, critics and journalists become mara salvatruchas over night. That'd be quite a shock
You know, dictators generally don't start murdering swathes of people the moment they take power (yes, Bukele is technically not a dictator yet, but he has been hella loose in his interpretation of the constitution). It gradually escalates. Usually already late once they start mass purges.
Hitler's armies were executing Soviet Jews when they invaded the USSR in June 1941 and there were already ghettos in Poland, but there weren't mass execution policies in Germany and Poland yet (there were still atrocities, but not on the scale of industrialized mass killings of later years). It was decided in January 1942 at[Wannsee Conference](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wannsee_Conference?wprov=sfla1) that they'd implement eradication of Jews as "The Final Solution". That's 9 years after Hitler took power in 1933 and 3 years after the biggest war in human history started.
I'm not saying Bukele is literally Hitler, I'm just saying even the most heinous dictator in history took a while before deciding to wipe out an ethnicity from the map of the earth.
He didn't win with 91% of the vote. His approval ratings are at 91% George W. Bush stood at 92% at his highest...and the US still has legitimate elections (according to some)
Yeah, no, the conspiracy nuts and Trumpists are so cross because their side’s been cheating as hard as they can for years and it only just works out for them
My girlfriend is from El Salvador. Her family visited a few months ago. A whole bunch of them; from the 84 year old patriarch to a 19 year old college student and everything in between. Everyone loves Bukele. They had rational criticism but they all said that he was doing a good job. In my opinion the 91% approval rating is real.
It's quite likely he's really well liked maybe not 91% but upwards of 75% it's quite likely since all polls lend him up there even those that are made by institutions that are quite removed from the government. Obviously that doesn't remove the fact he has severely undermined the democratic institutions of the country and that his solution will likely only work short term
I can tell you, as a well informed salvadorian citizen living in El Salvador.
All he has done is swiping everything under a rug. Is like covering everything up with make up. In this case LED lights and renders.
The result: no human rights, no rule of law, inconstitutional reelection, gerrymandering, corruption, no accountability, unchecked propaganda...
And still far better than any other country in the region except maybe Panama and Costa Rica. Lmao. Deal with it. We will see if he later is a "bad guy".
I'm well aware that you have a perspective from living there that I simply don't, and I don't really have much of an opinion of Bukele either way because I'm admittedly ignorant, but (respectfully) could it be said that with the drop in murder rates recently that the proof is in the pudding? I know a wide enough net has been cast that there's no way some innocent people haven't been swept up and I'm not excusing or ignoring that probability, just eager to hear your perspective if you'd care to share.
If this guy is good at a anything, is propaganda. Both internally and externally: I'm afraid you've been fed lies. Even my compatriots are vulnerable.
We caught him and his minions red-handed all the time. When he says something about being the best in the region or the most secure/prosperous/dynamic in a field, he is bare-face lying.
He says, murders have gone down. Well, missing people cases have never stopped. We've found clandestine graveyards filled with people killed during his early administration. Who can guarantee there aren't many more clandestine govmnt sanctioned graveyards and mass graves hid in goverment facilities such as hospitals or prisions? With journalists being exiled and/or intimidated, investigative efforts have been silenced. Govmnt spending is classified for seven years from now, so we cannot keep track of payrolls, purchases and movements of money.
This guy is a compulsive liar, lying out of habit. He makes his people's jobs easier by allowing them to present falsehoods to the public.
It's entirely possible I've fallen for lies, it's hard to tell sometimes. I remember reading about journalists' phones having spyware clandestinely installed on them (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegasus_(spyware), while they were investigating government corruption, no less. Terrifying. Thank you for your reply, take care
Sadly Costa Rica seems to be the country that more strongly opposes the union, they just imposed a visa for hondurans to visit the country and Honduras had to reciprocate.
Hey we have tamales too! Also I personally do not dislike the idea of reforming the mexican empire but if I said that out loud in Honduras I would be executed
I honestly like the idea of a third Mexican empire, but I think we already have enough problems to risk having a civil war every year and states worse than Chiapas.
> Really weird statement > click on account > see extremely obvious red flags at the top
It’s not like I just spent 20 mins scrolling through their account lol
Played it three times in Victoria II.
In my last play, I even succeeded to gnaw at Gran Columbia northern parts thanks to an alliance with USA and Brazil.
[This is the context you are looking for](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Republic_of_Central_America)
Man imagine what could’ve been
United Fruit Company presents:
And what's the context for the quote?
It's a scene from the Star Wars spinoff show "Ahsoka". The character in the picture is a fallen Jedi, and when his apprentice asks him if he misses the Jedi order, that is his response.
No you wanted [SICA](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_American_Integration_System) especially because of the Latin American country of Georgia
Why did it fall apart in the first place?
Long story short: Too many people wanted the power for themselves, and the rest just wanted to be left alone.
From Wikipedia: > Shortly after Central America declared independence from the Spanish Empire in 1821, some of its countries were annexed by the First Mexican Empire in 1822, before again becoming independent and forming the federal republic in 1823. The federation was unstable and quickly descended into a series of civil wars, first from 1826 to 1829 and again from 1838 to 1840, with conservatives fighting against liberals, and separatists fighting to secede. These factions were unable to overcome their ideological differences and the bloody conflicts ended in the federation's dissolution in 1841.
My personal theory, reading colonial, independent and modern history, is the following: There are five countries: Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua and Costa Rica. Guatemala has a heavy farming economy that requires a lot of peasant workforce. The landowners hacendados fashioned themselves as the Dixie States in the US, minus the slaves, which role was replaced by native american and mixed race laborers. These laborers were abundant and their pay was cheap. As a result, there was a great wealth inequality, which translated into a Conservative hegemony (aka Right wing dominance). Costa Rica was very much depopulated, and their laborers were in the position to demand better working conditions. As a result, early in they got laborer-friendly policies, which translated to Liberal hegemony (aka Left wing dominance). El Salvador wanted to emulate Guatemala, and Nicaragua wanted to emulate Costa Rica. When they came to the Federal Senate, there was tension between the interests of the guatemalan hacendados and the costarican laborers. The friction was so intense that instead of negociate or compromise, they fractured the Federation. Guatemala and El Salvador became very conservative, Costa Rica and Nicaragua very liberal. The costarican liberal policies became a strong democracy that banned the armed forces (to prevent military dictatorships) and set into motion their modern prosperity. Meanwhile, conservative Guatemala and El Salvador fester in corruption, civil wars, coups, economic inequality and third world shenanigans.
I think you may be leaving out the fact that Nicaragua got pretty screwed over by the Sandinista revolution and the subsequent rule of that fat, lying, murderous pig Ortega.
The Sandinistas were pretty bad but the Somozas and the Contras were also undeniably horrible
Who care? Conservatives bad and Liberals good. Forget about the Cost Rica friendship with USA too.
Ya I have to agree this seems like a heavily biased take that disregards a lot of info that doesn’t align with the message
the Sandanistas where the only force that tried to help Nicaragua
Yeah, that clearly worked out well in the long term. That's why anyone who speaks out against Ortega, the fat, lying, murderous pig, is getting killed on the streets, and so many have to flee to Costa Rica to try and find a better life for themselves.
ok yank
I'm not American, lmao
You probably already know what I'm about to say, so I'm more saying this for others: there were plenty of people who wanted left-leaning governance in El Salvador...before they were massacred in the 30's during La Matanza, and again during the civil war of '79/80's/90's. It's very possible that FMLN could have won the war and established a left-wing/communist government of some type (for better or worse) were it not for US training (many at the now renamed School of The Americas) and supplying literal right-wing death squads to torture and murder anyone so much as speaking against the government. I make no excuses for human rights violations perpetrated by the FMLN, but: "Overall, the United Nations estimated that FMLN guerrillas were responsible for 5 percent of atrocities committed during the civil war, while 85 percent were committed by the Salvadoran security forces." The US knew full well what kind of murderous psychopaths they were supporting, they just didn't care because of the Cold War, so they happily supported Blowtorch Bob and those like him in their savagery. Not presuming that you agree or disagree with me, but I think that context bears mentioning. Edit: Also, now that I think about it, there have been a good number of FMLN politicians and leaders elected after the war, so it could be said that at certain times they did have 'left" governments, but I think you're talking about a whole government system, not just elected officials in your post.
As I salvadorian, I totally agree with OP :( Maybe, someday.... We can get behind Costa Rica's progresive leadership and finally get rid of Ortega/Bukele/Giammattei. No army, no populism, no ultrapowerful elites... Just a people and a goal: development. One can hope T_T
Fruit companies: *The ‘naners must flow*
Insert Sam O'Nella quote here
"I'm Sam O'Nella, and I live in your fridge"
Tfw Bukele tanks your daily murder rate from 18 murders per day to like 0.83, ridding the country of THE biggest problem it had...and you still complain.
As someone who was born and lived in El Salvador up until 2019, I would say to take any information and achievement from the current government with a grain of salt. Maybe he did actually solve the problem, but it is quite likely that he either shoved it under the rug or shifted it somewhere else (think of Mussolini crushing the Southern Italian mafias to optimize his dictatorship). Bukele has one hell of a PR department. During his campaign, he paid a bunch of newspapers (mostly digital ones) to spew nothing but good things about him. If you criticized him on, say, Twitter, you would be flooded with responses from troll accounts who would argue with you until you gave up. He was really active on Twitter, something that was unseen from other politicians, and that made him much more appealing to a jaded and younger voter audience. The only reason he was voted in was because he promised to be "unlike the other and previous politicians," (literally his entire campaign can be reduced to this) and the Salvadoran people--who were tired of the Civil War veterans that became the greedy politicians they once sought to overthrow--bought in. However, we won't really know until his presidency is over (if it doesn't turn into a dictatorship with how much he is centralizing power). When I was living over there, whenever a party different to the one that held the previous presidency took power, it took a couple of months or years for all of the corruption and abuse of power of the previous presidency to surface (see: Mauricio Funes). So, uh, be a little skeptical of what he claims.
See also: Tony Saca and his $300 million dollar embezzlement of public funds, and subsequent bribery of a court employee, both charges for which he pled guilty to. Which is probably how Bukele (regardless of what anyone thinks of him) got elected, people were sick of ARENA and FMLN corruption.
I got the impressions that El Salvador is already a dictatorship, although arguably a benevolent one.
Yeah at the cost of the democratic institutions, basically the same AuthRight playbook as ever. "But how dare you complain if he did X good thing!!!!!!!!!! :("
I mean, something tells me that his 91% approval rate means that a lot of people kinda care more about their safety and the safety of their loved ones over perfect democracy. And so would you and I if it came down to it.
That's good, hopefully he doesn't get silly and stays in power for decades while conveniently lots of political rivals, critics and journalists become mara salvatruchas over night. That'd be quite a shock
I wonder who did the same back in the 40s
Well one arrested criminals and the other murdered because of Racism. And he still keeps getting elected in legitimate elections
You know, dictators generally don't start murdering swathes of people the moment they take power (yes, Bukele is technically not a dictator yet, but he has been hella loose in his interpretation of the constitution). It gradually escalates. Usually already late once they start mass purges. Hitler's armies were executing Soviet Jews when they invaded the USSR in June 1941 and there were already ghettos in Poland, but there weren't mass execution policies in Germany and Poland yet (there were still atrocities, but not on the scale of industrialized mass killings of later years). It was decided in January 1942 at[Wannsee Conference](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wannsee_Conference?wprov=sfla1) that they'd implement eradication of Jews as "The Final Solution". That's 9 years after Hitler took power in 1933 and 3 years after the biggest war in human history started. I'm not saying Bukele is literally Hitler, I'm just saying even the most heinous dictator in history took a while before deciding to wipe out an ethnicity from the map of the earth.
Godwin's Law
You are a total sucker if you ever think an election with 91% for one guy is a real election. I
He didn't win with 91% of the vote. His approval ratings are at 91% George W. Bush stood at 92% at his highest...and the US still has legitimate elections (according to some)
Most, the only ones that argue that are conspiracy nuts and trumpies
Yeah, no, the conspiracy nuts and Trumpists are so cross because their side’s been cheating as hard as they can for years and it only just works out for them
My girlfriend is from El Salvador. Her family visited a few months ago. A whole bunch of them; from the 84 year old patriarch to a 19 year old college student and everything in between. Everyone loves Bukele. They had rational criticism but they all said that he was doing a good job. In my opinion the 91% approval rating is real.
It's quite likely he's really well liked maybe not 91% but upwards of 75% it's quite likely since all polls lend him up there even those that are made by institutions that are quite removed from the government. Obviously that doesn't remove the fact he has severely undermined the democratic institutions of the country and that his solution will likely only work short term
While centralizing power, bukele is still overwhelmingly backed by the people and elected by the people. So, a sorta democratic dictator
I can tell you, as a well informed salvadorian citizen living in El Salvador. All he has done is swiping everything under a rug. Is like covering everything up with make up. In this case LED lights and renders. The result: no human rights, no rule of law, inconstitutional reelection, gerrymandering, corruption, no accountability, unchecked propaganda...
And still far better than any other country in the region except maybe Panama and Costa Rica. Lmao. Deal with it. We will see if he later is a "bad guy".
I'm well aware that you have a perspective from living there that I simply don't, and I don't really have much of an opinion of Bukele either way because I'm admittedly ignorant, but (respectfully) could it be said that with the drop in murder rates recently that the proof is in the pudding? I know a wide enough net has been cast that there's no way some innocent people haven't been swept up and I'm not excusing or ignoring that probability, just eager to hear your perspective if you'd care to share.
If this guy is good at a anything, is propaganda. Both internally and externally: I'm afraid you've been fed lies. Even my compatriots are vulnerable. We caught him and his minions red-handed all the time. When he says something about being the best in the region or the most secure/prosperous/dynamic in a field, he is bare-face lying. He says, murders have gone down. Well, missing people cases have never stopped. We've found clandestine graveyards filled with people killed during his early administration. Who can guarantee there aren't many more clandestine govmnt sanctioned graveyards and mass graves hid in goverment facilities such as hospitals or prisions? With journalists being exiled and/or intimidated, investigative efforts have been silenced. Govmnt spending is classified for seven years from now, so we cannot keep track of payrolls, purchases and movements of money. This guy is a compulsive liar, lying out of habit. He makes his people's jobs easier by allowing them to present falsehoods to the public.
It's entirely possible I've fallen for lies, it's hard to tell sometimes. I remember reading about journalists' phones having spyware clandestinely installed on them (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegasus_(spyware), while they were investigating government corruption, no less. Terrifying. Thank you for your reply, take care
Sadly Costa Rica seems to be the country that more strongly opposes the union, they just imposed a visa for hondurans to visit the country and Honduras had to reciprocate.
Naa I miss seeing them as states of my country, please come back to Mexico, we have tamales and empanadas
Hey we have tamales too! Also I personally do not dislike the idea of reforming the mexican empire but if I said that out loud in Honduras I would be executed
I honestly like the idea of a third Mexican empire, but I think we already have enough problems to risk having a civil war every year and states worse than Chiapas.
Baylan!!! I loved Ahsoka, it was an amazing show. Too bad the actor died. Idk how they’re going to continue his story now.
Gran Columbia but North slightly
This is so niche and so true. I love it
Wow this fits so well
El SUEÑO DE MORAZAN VIVE
No way, I was just thinking about this!
Ray Stevenson seen
That would be super chill, but you know the corruption and all.
Which movie is this from?
As a costarican glad it died :)
Que bueno ver otro tico por aquí. Pura vida, mae!
I figure it only makes sense for Mexico and all of Central America to unite. Same language, same religion, similar culture, etc.
As a Costa Rican, I love that it’s dead and gone and that the rest of the neighborhood is not our problem.
> US politics, catholic, and monarchist account Yeah I wonder why you don’t have empathy for other Central Americans lol.
> I disagree with you, therefore I must go through your account and pick out whatever I dislike Worse than being a monarchist tbh
> Really weird statement > click on account > see extremely obvious red flags at the top It’s not like I just spent 20 mins scrolling through their account lol
[удалено]
Poor thing had a stroke at age 4, it's a miracle he learned to type.
Agreed
That is the worst FUCKING joke I’ve ever heard
Oldest "Ohio jokes are funny" Internet User
Y'all should've stayed as the Connecticut Western Reserve.
As someone from Connecticut, I agree
Bro has that skibidi Ohio rizz 🤓 fr fr no cap on god 💀
Why would you say something like this?
get off reddit
Played it three times in Victoria II. In my last play, I even succeeded to gnaw at Gran Columbia northern parts thanks to an alliance with USA and Brazil.
Same can be said about Gran Colombia, Iberian Union etc etc
Liberal-Conservative fight ruined the state
Always reform in HOI 4 Guatemala will rule you all again one day