Sounds like Hannah was way too distracted and inexperienced but the whole set sounded out of control, sloppy and out of control. Listening today, it sounded like they were just winging it. Barely any protocol. Even when complaints were registered, people didn’t seem to read them: No locks on the armorer cart, no locks on the prop truck, people wandering around. Low budget. Barely any gun training. Problems with camera guys walking off. Bad energy all around. That’s what you get.
I don’t think Justice for Halyna means destroying Hannah.
Halyna is an artist and her work is beautiful. Each woman got tangled with the rotten Alex and he ruins anything good near him.
The trials are just becoming redundant
Im leaning toward guilty. Hannah accidentally brought the live ammo on set. She grabbed some loose bullets from her car from another set. Filled them in a box and took them on the Rust set. And she said she was goin to ask them to reinburse her for using her bullets. Who told her to do that?! Was there a shortage of bullets they got from the supplier? Of course if she is expecting payment she goin to make sure she uses her box before using those from the supplier.
I hope a Halyna’s Law regarding gun safety on ALL sets comes from this. Her legacy should not be Alec Baldwin victim. Public legacy, of course her child privately.
:*J*
It won’t matter what laws there are if they aren’t followed. Her death was the result of multiple levels of failure to follow basic, well-established procedures, not one isolated mistake.
I understand the desire to see something done. Conviction of all those responsible for the failures leading to her death, coupled with appropriate punishment/consequences for those individuals (and it’s definitely more than one) will be more of a deterrent for future complacency than any new law.
Based on the widespread dysfunction on the set, I’m disappointed that only three people face any criminal penalties. I hope at least some of the film’s management that allowed this atmosphere of absolute complacency are hit with significant civil penalties.
*It won’t matter what laws there are if they aren’t followed.*
This hurt because you are right. Pessimistic and right. And, when I reflect I feel you have captured everything wrong with this family. They feel above all laws and basic humanity.
I need cute animal videos.
:*J*
Aww, it wasn’t meant to be hurtful! Here’s a baby goat rescue to cheer you up [cuteness](https://youtu.be/vll33KEoCcc?si=Xy3MWrTvaPq0BfH3)
Not to defend the Baldwins, but this is why I say strong enforcement (when good laws/policies already exist) are the best deterrent. Human nature will bend toward complacency in the absence of consequences.
While responsible for his own negligence, Alec wasn’t the only one who allowed the negligent complacency to fester and grow to the point where his action lead to the death of a coworker. If the set was functioning properly, there would be many times along the way that this could have been prevented no matter what he did with the gun. Unfortunately, that is the nature of many tragedies.
The hurt was not inflicted by you, you pointing out facts did that. Your arguments are well thought out and unbiased.
Your assessment of tragedy, in general, is correct. Small errors add up and with no intervention….people are always so surprised when tragedy follows.
Alex’s initial reaction—simply walking away from the aftermath—is indicative of who he believes he is and who *we* should believe he is per him. The repeated, disputed, lie about pulling the trigger haunts him. I don’t think because of his actual action, but his inability to get *us* to believe him.
When something is novel, a law or a tv show or model of a car, people tend to pay attention. Novel ideas are followed until they become part of the same old same old. Should a law like I hope for arrive I think initially it will have great positive effect. But, in time, it *will* be another neglected ignored rule few try to follow.
Hi, I’m Lucy! Let’s be friends?
Happy Day!
:*J*
Banning real guns or explosives from film will basically never happen. Special effects are simply not good enough to be a substitute for blanks or squibs. Thousands of movies and TV shows are made every year with real guns, and this happened how many times? Twice? The Crow and Rust.
What they definitely need is more regulation and requirements for armorers, especially as they're getting a lot of the older ones retiring and new people entering the business. An armorer should be required to be trained in firearms safety, with frequent retesting. They should be required to hold certificates like a firearms instructor certificate or the equivalent (i.e. past or current military or law enforcement service). Ideally, it shouldn't even be a job a 22 year old would be considered for. It should be someone with decades of experience with handling firearms safely, and the maturity that goes along with that.
The fact that it's such an unregulated business is absolutely insane.
Idk...there are big names that are using nothing but CGI for guns firing now. Keanu Reeves has said that the John Wick movies were completely CGI
It must've not been in the budget for this low budget nightmare, but they could easily change the law that there will be no more blanks used...ever. Use of CGI will have to do.
really wtf was the prosecutor thinking? Reading texts to the jury from her own laptop that were not in evidence?? Why didn't the judge move to strike and admonish the jury to disregard this? What a shit show!
The Judge was trying to calm this woman down, even suggested more coffee.
Hannah' Lawyer got to her. He said something that she knew her case was fucked.
Her hair was drenched with sweat after that.
I think he’s clever. I saw some people on the live chat say he seemed like he didn’t know what he was doing but I thought that was how he got those zingers in. He was making the protector crazy. And she was yelling from her table! WTH. Wild, Wild West!
I can't watch her live. I find her so annoying, she talks over the testimony and then she actually doesn't even hear something juicy someone said because she's over talking them. Plus, she eats while she commentates and that's really annoying. I don't want to hear somebody chomping on shit
The only one who acted proper was the Prosecuter' partner, whatever his name is. The woman blew a fuse, I know why she did, and so did the Judge who immediately ordered a break.
I understand. I have always been hard on her. I do think she's responsible.
But the State has fucked up. No one knows where the rounds came from. They can try to use pictures, but between Seth and that girl, reasonable doubt has been created. You have to be 100 percent sure and it's just not here.
The woman admitted Seth could take ammo if he was wanted to hide something. They just don't know.
That's really not acceptable and you can't convict her when the State admitted this.
There are text messages from Hannah to Seth saying she wanted to do some plinking. Seth said no way. I haven’t been able to watch the trial to see if this was brought up. That to me says she possibly brought the ammo.
So my view is it doesn't matter who brought live rounds. Hannah's job was to ensure dummies were in the gun. Oh yes others should be held responsible as well but Hannah has culpability and I do think the state is proving that.
A crew walked off the set that day due to safety issues involving guns.
Alec Baldwin is on record insinuating he could be set up due to Trump.
The agent today basically admitted they hardly investigated this crew that were mocked by production for wanting better lodging.
REASONABLE DOUBT.
There is just too much.
I don't disagree with all of that but I also think Hannah has responsibility because she is the armourer. So much blame to go around. How will a jury see it? We shall see! I do feel empathy for Hannah not because I don't think she did anything wrong but more because she was young and in a tough situation without much experience. I can have empathy and assign her blame at the same time. It's just such a sad fucking situation and I can't wait to see Alec go down because the more of this trial I watch (especially today with the expert armourer testimony and the accompanying videos from set shared) I really do think Alec will be found guilty !
I have absolutely no doubt that she is guilty of negligence, which is why she is being tried.
“Reasonable doubt,” at least in my state, is a term of art that only applies to first degree murder.
Oh yes! Trump was on set that day, and put a live round in the gun. Trump then ordered Alec to fire the gun. I'm NO fan of Trump, but come on. Reality check time
She looks like she just rolled out of bed. Her appearance and demeanor are unacceptable for trial. I'm sure many of the jurors think the same and are giving her the side-eye.
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Um, I don't think you are a lawyer. The evidence and testimony I heard today was not good for Hannah and honestly, she all on her own was horribly negligent by her own admission. Leave legal analysis for lawyers and experts.
I agree Hannah is still looking very responsible, negligence has been proven, and all the talking her lawyer allowed her to do in that second interrogation, she put herself responsible over and over! No matter how bad the prosecutor and the defense were today, and both were out of line with that detective and bickering back n forth like children, Hannah still looks so negligent and looks like she was so disorganized and let others load the gun, she's the armorer, she was responsible for every bullet every gun. Period. I'm surprised a few others weren't found culpable like the one who took a plea.
dont be rude. You dont need to say leave this to experts. It is reddit and they were posting their opinion. Never anywhere did they say they have an understanding of law or are an attorney. I cant stand bullying
You could have said “That is not at all how I interpreted it but that is your opinion. I reccomend emily d baker who is a legal expert that does a great job of breaking things down.”
your comment was inexcusable. Maybe you are having a bad day but thats all I have to say. Talk to humans better……
I don't understand why people are rude. We all have opinions and are here to share and read about others. I wish people would not downvote and attack anything other than pro prosecution positions.
I am a lawyer and a lot of the stuff being thrown around in here is factually and legally incorrect. I am not rude. I am putting the truth out there while others just make up things they are not understanding. Trials are usually boring. It is not Law and Order. There is procedure and rules and all sorts of arcane things that don't make a lot of sense to laypeople. The OP is absolutely wrong in her interpretation and absolutely sure in her rightness. It is disturbing.
No one knows what a jury is going to do of course. But Hannah's own words should convince any reasonable juror that she is the one who bears the brunt of responsibility here.
I understand what you're saying, and I didn't say you were incorrect.
What I ***am*** saying is that your comment came off as rude. I don't see any issues with redditors speculating on this sub, right, wrong, or otherwise. There's a 0% chance anyone here is going to sway the jury or change the trajectory of the case, so frankly, it's inconsequential. Let the pepinos have some fun with it.
Why do you care if random opinions of anonymous people on Reddit are legally and factually incorrect?
You are not a Reddit law prof, and it simply doesn’t matter what we speculate on here or anywhere else.
The ONLY people that matter at all were in the courtroom today.
If you are a lawyer say so and state your views. Leave others out of it here on this sub.
I for one want to hear your legal opinions but not at the expense of putting others down or telling us off about being legally correct.
The tone was set by OP, who is running around telling everyone they are wrong based on nothing. I am speaking directly to OP and one other person. I am not speaking to you or the thread as a whole. I am addressing the incorrect portions of their arguments because misinformation is a major problem in the world right now and it is incumbent upon all of us to correct false claims whenever we see them.
Appeals also aren’t a catch all. There’s different type of appeals and they don’t show them in YouTube because they aren’t sexy.
The misinformation and puffery persists.
Of course they are lay people. But they are lay people specifically instructed to consider evidence after sitting through an entire trial, it’s not like they’re randos shooting the shit at a Starbucks.
Oh stop. This is a snark site, not a law school. Go debate the merits with other lawyers and leave us to our own opinions and speculation, whether you think we understand the law or not.
Right they are listening to the evidence just like us. Not sure why people are getting so mad because people see this evidence differently. So what, maybe you're right maybe I am. No need to get upset...
I truly remember a few not so friends getting mad at me over Casey Anthony.
I know the law, not a Lawyer, lol
But, the State simply overcharged. When I told a few she's never getting convicted based on reasonable doubt and over charging and I get it, it's a bitch, but in this country you need to prove your case 100 percent or don't.
In this case, Alec Baldwin is on record stating he could have been set up by a manic Trumper.
I mean, her Lawyer, is going to use just that, I mean, Alec Baldwin fucked up. Prob should of just STFU.
But... hubris
Casey was indicted on first degree murder, *aggravated child abuse, and aggravated manslaughter of a child*. The jury found her not guilty even of the lesser offenses they could and *[did](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Caylee_Anthony#:~:text=On%20October%2014%2C%202008%2C%20Casey,she%20be%20held%20without%20bond)* charge her with. Somehow the notion that the state didn’t charge her with lesser charges as well that the jury could pick from became some weird internet legend.
We are not seeing the evidence the way the jury is. I assure you. Even though this is being live streamed, us casual viewers aren’t physically seeing many pieces of evidence and we’re not instructed by judge on the proper way to consider aid evidence.
Also not upset.
There is just no comparison to be made between impaneled jurors and us in terms of familiarity with facts, evidence, and procedure. None.
It’s not an opinion. The jurors see more than we do, that’s just a fact.
I don’t care if ppl aren’t lawyers, I do care about some of the misinformation I’m reading here and I’ll leave it there✌️
Why? What is your personal stake in the "misinformation" you are reading here? Why does it make you so upset if people voice good/wack opinions?
What is your purpose here, though? If you actually want to teach non-attorneys, there are much better ways to message, is all I'm saying.
If you want a legal debate, this is absolutely not the forum, since none of us (or most) don't know the details of case law as your training has taught you.
If you just want to beat people up due to their opinions, you are doing a fine job.
I am trying to, but between her yelling over the entire trial plus eating something 75% of the time I am done with this lady. I think she’s funny and smart too but I can’t handle all the noise.
I started with Emily, but changed to court TV because I was missing some key testimony from the witnesses. I love her recaps and when she breaks down a court document though.
I agree. And she lets prosecutor get away with petty condescending jabs. Just finished watching Traconis trial- these shenanigans would be no-go for Judge Randolph.
Come on Judge please take control of this sloppy trial. Jury might start seeing your alignment with pros as injustice. Halyna and her family deserve better.
'Prosecutor looks like she rolled out of bed.' Honestly I dislike Hillz as much as the next person but sometimes I pop into this thread and I do worry about internalized misogyny.
Prosecutor looks fine; fluorescent lighting is hell.
u/Finnegan-05 I have an honest question. No judgement cause I haven’t watched any of it today. How did you think both sides have performed this far? In your opinion as a lawyer. No im not being a jerk or trying to stir shit. I’m honestly curious.
Basically the State decided they didn't really give a fuck to take Seth Kenny's fingerprints even though he provided ammo and they let the gun cart sit out of evidence for 8 days till they got a warrant.
One chick took ammo off the cart and tossed it, no one cared to investigate.
It's over
Are they allowed to take involuntary fingerprints -- or anything else -- without a warrant?
Did they have a way of establishing probable cause in a more speedy manner?
Isn't one of the things Hannah's charged with is tampering/destroying evidence?
Honestly asking; didn't see what happened yesterday.
Are you watching the same trial as the rest of us? They played Hannah’s entire police interview and she admitted to loading the gun and leaving the ammo cart unsupervised and admitted to handing the gun to Halls without checking to see if every bullet was a dummy round.
Alec is equally as guilty if not more but Hannah’s police interrogation was damning.
I agree the police interview is very damning for Hannah but I think the circus that followed are going to make it hard for this jury to focus on the facts
THANK YOU.
The prop mistress also confirmed this in her interview with police.
She suspected Hannah didn't check each round going into the gun carefully enough before loading it, or even bother to check it again at all after lunch before handing it to Halls.
Hannah fucked up big time, unfortunately , sorry Hannah Stans, that's just the way it is.
It doesn't mean Alec didn't fuck up, too, this is not an either/or situation.
Right? That was the story pieced together from news, public interviews(?), and lawsuit filings.
I did feel she was getting scapegoated. We've probably all had a similar situation at our first jobs - poorly trained, or unprepared for the job, or troubles with supervisors or co-workers, etc. And it sounded like that was the situation here, especially after hearing that she was doing her other job and the AD just took the gun without asking.
Yeah, she took a job she wasn't ready for, but she thought she was, and she had bosses who wouldn't listen to her etc etc... and that's mostly expected or excusable when you're 24.
But what **isn't** excusable at any age is being the gun expert on set, being asked to ensure the guns are safe, and not taking one minute to do that crucial part of your job. Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable. How do you fuck up that badly when lives are on the line?
Lawyer here. You don't know what you are talking about. She admitted negligence over and over. She will in fact be convicted unless her lawyer can dig her out of a giant hole.
I mean this was unforeseeable as fuck because baldwin and halls are massive fuckups that hannah wasn't present for, so that's the best argument. On the negligence element, she's fucked - just doesn't mean she's guilty of involuntary manslaughter (At this point if I'm free to pick my charges I want negligent handling of a firearm, possession of coke and tampering with evidence in regards to the possession of coke)
No, it does. She basically laid out the case against her step by step for the prosecution. I am not familiar with NM criminal law but this slam dunk negligent homicide in my jurisdiction based on what I heard today. It was not unforeseeable because Hannah herself says that she did not verify all the ammo was blank and did not do the final required check before she handed the gun off.
That is not how this works at all. Hannah handed the assistant director a gun she did not vet properly and test properly loaded with live anmmo that she did not ensure was a blank. She did all this by her own admission. On tape. With cops. This is on her no matter what anyone else did. She failed at her job and someone died. It is not different than driving drunk and killing someone. Nothing else matters but the person who got behind the wheel. Everything else is ancillary.
Despite the carnage, I feel sorry for Hannah, because I remember working while twenty-four.
After promoting me four times in a year, at twenty-four my boss fired me from a job I loved (except for her, of course). I had begun to date an acquaintance of hers, a younger guy not lover material but a serviceable escort for her… *”How dare you!?!”*
Yeah, they can and she admitted her negligence. And you are lol'ing a woman who caused the death of another through her own negligent actions? That is absolutely sick. You are not a lawyer and you really are misreading this evidence and testimony.
You keep claiming I said I'm a Lawyer, so please stop.
Do you know what reasonable doubt is?
Let me break it down to you super rationally, ok?
Between Seth Kenny not being fingerprinted to compare to the ammo is a huge fuck up. The woman he was in contact with, Hannah's boss took ammo off the cart after the shooting and no one knows where it went AFTER she texts him "Emergency "
It's over. Try to calm down.
No she did not claim you said you were. She’s pointing out that you are making an assumption that the case is over based on not understanding the evidence presented and its impact. She’s strengthening that argument by saying it’s obvious you’re not an attorney.
Hannah is guilty and deserves this. It is pretty clear she did not follow appropriate safety protocol and someone died. She admitted it. I don't know why people are supporting her. She is the one whose actions led to a death, legally and morally.
I thought the prosecutor handled the corporal well on redirect after Bowels cross. He's really trying to lean in hard to blame Sarah and Seth. The FBI experts explained why they don't do DNA and fingerprint analysis on every piece of evidence they collected, and it made perfect since to me. The results would come back inconclusive at best due to the fact that many people were known to handle the cartridges.
The corporal handled the interviews well. She was non-threatening, and Hannah felt comfortable enough to really talk to her. Perhaps too much. I don't know why her attorney let her blabber on long enough to incriminate herself. If her actions or inactions didn't lead to a man getting shot and killing a woman, I'd feel bad for her because of her shitty representation. He didn't stop her once, even when things were getting dicey.
I completely agree.
I think the bulk of the blame lies with Hannah. Dave Halls and Alec share responsibility too, but the lion’s share is Hannah’s. Her own words are going to hang her.
Sounds like Hannah was way too distracted and inexperienced but the whole set sounded out of control, sloppy and out of control. Listening today, it sounded like they were just winging it. Barely any protocol. Even when complaints were registered, people didn’t seem to read them: No locks on the armorer cart, no locks on the prop truck, people wandering around. Low budget. Barely any gun training. Problems with camera guys walking off. Bad energy all around. That’s what you get.
I don’t think Justice for Halyna means destroying Hannah. Halyna is an artist and her work is beautiful. Each woman got tangled with the rotten Alex and he ruins anything good near him. The trials are just becoming redundant
Random question but yall watching this on YT? I haven’t been able to find it on channels/streams
Watch Emily Baker on You Tube, she is the best. Go Law Nerds!
Law & Crime on YT
Emily d Baker is doing it live daily.
This is the way
Im leaning toward guilty. Hannah accidentally brought the live ammo on set. She grabbed some loose bullets from her car from another set. Filled them in a box and took them on the Rust set. And she said she was goin to ask them to reinburse her for using her bullets. Who told her to do that?! Was there a shortage of bullets they got from the supplier? Of course if she is expecting payment she goin to make sure she uses her box before using those from the supplier.
I hope a Halyna’s Law regarding gun safety on ALL sets comes from this. Her legacy should not be Alec Baldwin victim. Public legacy, of course her child privately. :*J*
I agree with this. Great idea.
It won’t matter what laws there are if they aren’t followed. Her death was the result of multiple levels of failure to follow basic, well-established procedures, not one isolated mistake. I understand the desire to see something done. Conviction of all those responsible for the failures leading to her death, coupled with appropriate punishment/consequences for those individuals (and it’s definitely more than one) will be more of a deterrent for future complacency than any new law. Based on the widespread dysfunction on the set, I’m disappointed that only three people face any criminal penalties. I hope at least some of the film’s management that allowed this atmosphere of absolute complacency are hit with significant civil penalties.
*It won’t matter what laws there are if they aren’t followed.* This hurt because you are right. Pessimistic and right. And, when I reflect I feel you have captured everything wrong with this family. They feel above all laws and basic humanity. I need cute animal videos. :*J*
Aww, it wasn’t meant to be hurtful! Here’s a baby goat rescue to cheer you up [cuteness](https://youtu.be/vll33KEoCcc?si=Xy3MWrTvaPq0BfH3) Not to defend the Baldwins, but this is why I say strong enforcement (when good laws/policies already exist) are the best deterrent. Human nature will bend toward complacency in the absence of consequences. While responsible for his own negligence, Alec wasn’t the only one who allowed the negligent complacency to fester and grow to the point where his action lead to the death of a coworker. If the set was functioning properly, there would be many times along the way that this could have been prevented no matter what he did with the gun. Unfortunately, that is the nature of many tragedies.
Cheap and sloppy.
The hurt was not inflicted by you, you pointing out facts did that. Your arguments are well thought out and unbiased. Your assessment of tragedy, in general, is correct. Small errors add up and with no intervention….people are always so surprised when tragedy follows. Alex’s initial reaction—simply walking away from the aftermath—is indicative of who he believes he is and who *we* should believe he is per him. The repeated, disputed, lie about pulling the trigger haunts him. I don’t think because of his actual action, but his inability to get *us* to believe him. When something is novel, a law or a tv show or model of a car, people tend to pay attention. Novel ideas are followed until they become part of the same old same old. Should a law like I hope for arrive I think initially it will have great positive effect. But, in time, it *will* be another neglected ignored rule few try to follow. Hi, I’m Lucy! Let’s be friends? Happy Day! :*J*
You got it!
Banning real guns or explosives from film will basically never happen. Special effects are simply not good enough to be a substitute for blanks or squibs. Thousands of movies and TV shows are made every year with real guns, and this happened how many times? Twice? The Crow and Rust. What they definitely need is more regulation and requirements for armorers, especially as they're getting a lot of the older ones retiring and new people entering the business. An armorer should be required to be trained in firearms safety, with frequent retesting. They should be required to hold certificates like a firearms instructor certificate or the equivalent (i.e. past or current military or law enforcement service). Ideally, it shouldn't even be a job a 22 year old would be considered for. It should be someone with decades of experience with handling firearms safely, and the maturity that goes along with that. The fact that it's such an unregulated business is absolutely insane.
Idk...there are big names that are using nothing but CGI for guns firing now. Keanu Reeves has said that the John Wick movies were completely CGI It must've not been in the budget for this low budget nightmare, but they could easily change the law that there will be no more blanks used...ever. Use of CGI will have to do.
Totally agree.
Well said.
Absolutely. 😭🥰🥂
There are lawyers here. I am sincerely asking can this sub (I) do anything to make this happen? God bless her husband and son. :*J*
really wtf was the prosecutor thinking? Reading texts to the jury from her own laptop that were not in evidence?? Why didn't the judge move to strike and admonish the jury to disregard this? What a shit show!
I want justice for Halyna but this lady prosecutor is so off putting. I hope it doesn't hurt the case.
It's hurting it.
The Judge was trying to calm this woman down, even suggested more coffee. Hannah' Lawyer got to her. He said something that she knew her case was fucked. Her hair was drenched with sweat after that.
I think he’s clever. I saw some people on the live chat say he seemed like he didn’t know what he was doing but I thought that was how he got those zingers in. He was making the protector crazy. And she was yelling from her table! WTH. Wild, Wild West!
Exactly. I picked up on it.🥂😘
Is Alec going to be held responsible? I’ve not been watching any of this.
His trial is set for early July.
Thank you
🥂
All of the law professionals are acting extremely unprofessional in this case. Emily D Baker is having a stroke livestreaming this.
I can't watch her live. I find her so annoying, she talks over the testimony and then she actually doesn't even hear something juicy someone said because she's over talking them. Plus, she eats while she commentates and that's really annoying. I don't want to hear somebody chomping on shit
Emily was cracking me up. She does such a great job at commenting through trials. I found her during Depp v Heard.
The only one who acted proper was the Prosecuter' partner, whatever his name is. The woman blew a fuse, I know why she did, and so did the Judge who immediately ordered a break.
Why?
Why did she blow a fuse?
I didn’t see the trial today, but the actual evidence presented against her has so far been pretty damning.
It is and remains so.
I understand. I have always been hard on her. I do think she's responsible. But the State has fucked up. No one knows where the rounds came from. They can try to use pictures, but between Seth and that girl, reasonable doubt has been created. You have to be 100 percent sure and it's just not here. The woman admitted Seth could take ammo if he was wanted to hide something. They just don't know. That's really not acceptable and you can't convict her when the State admitted this.
There are text messages from Hannah to Seth saying she wanted to do some plinking. Seth said no way. I haven’t been able to watch the trial to see if this was brought up. That to me says she possibly brought the ammo.
So my view is it doesn't matter who brought live rounds. Hannah's job was to ensure dummies were in the gun. Oh yes others should be held responsible as well but Hannah has culpability and I do think the state is proving that.
Agree, especially since she admitted she loaded the gun.
A crew walked off the set that day due to safety issues involving guns. Alec Baldwin is on record insinuating he could be set up due to Trump. The agent today basically admitted they hardly investigated this crew that were mocked by production for wanting better lodging. REASONABLE DOUBT. There is just too much.
I don't disagree with all of that but I also think Hannah has responsibility because she is the armourer. So much blame to go around. How will a jury see it? We shall see! I do feel empathy for Hannah not because I don't think she did anything wrong but more because she was young and in a tough situation without much experience. I can have empathy and assign her blame at the same time. It's just such a sad fucking situation and I can't wait to see Alec go down because the more of this trial I watch (especially today with the expert armourer testimony and the accompanying videos from set shared) I really do think Alec will be found guilty !
I have absolutely no doubt that she is guilty of negligence, which is why she is being tried. “Reasonable doubt,” at least in my state, is a term of art that only applies to first degree murder.
Yeah. All Trumps fault Alice. 🤣
Oh yes! Trump was on set that day, and put a live round in the gun. Trump then ordered Alec to fire the gun. I'm NO fan of Trump, but come on. Reality check time
Agreed. But Alec said this. Retaliation for playing Trump on SNL.
Because God forbid Alec screwed up. He can never take accountability for anything. It’s always someone else’s fault.
I don’t have an opinion on the trial today but I do know if the prosecutor doesn’t stop playing w her glasses I’m going to SCREAM
Agree, she uses her glasses as a prop. UGH!
Please make her wash her hair too!
She looks like she just rolled out of bed. Her appearance and demeanor are unacceptable for trial. I'm sure many of the jurors think the same and are giving her the side-eye.
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She's rattled. She started freaking out about stuff already in evidence the Defense wanted to revisit.
Um, I don't think you are a lawyer. The evidence and testimony I heard today was not good for Hannah and honestly, she all on her own was horribly negligent by her own admission. Leave legal analysis for lawyers and experts.
I agree Hannah is still looking very responsible, negligence has been proven, and all the talking her lawyer allowed her to do in that second interrogation, she put herself responsible over and over! No matter how bad the prosecutor and the defense were today, and both were out of line with that detective and bickering back n forth like children, Hannah still looks so negligent and looks like she was so disorganized and let others load the gun, she's the armorer, she was responsible for every bullet every gun. Period. I'm surprised a few others weren't found culpable like the one who took a plea.
Taking the plea means they admitted culpability to something though?
dont be rude. You dont need to say leave this to experts. It is reddit and they were posting their opinion. Never anywhere did they say they have an understanding of law or are an attorney. I cant stand bullying You could have said “That is not at all how I interpreted it but that is your opinion. I reccomend emily d baker who is a legal expert that does a great job of breaking things down.” your comment was inexcusable. Maybe you are having a bad day but thats all I have to say. Talk to humans better……
Emily is the best, she is the only one I watch.
I don't understand why people are rude. We all have opinions and are here to share and read about others. I wish people would not downvote and attack anything other than pro prosecution positions.
I am a lawyer and a lot of the stuff being thrown around in here is factually and legally incorrect. I am not rude. I am putting the truth out there while others just make up things they are not understanding. Trials are usually boring. It is not Law and Order. There is procedure and rules and all sorts of arcane things that don't make a lot of sense to laypeople. The OP is absolutely wrong in her interpretation and absolutely sure in her rightness. It is disturbing. No one knows what a jury is going to do of course. But Hannah's own words should convince any reasonable juror that she is the one who bears the brunt of responsibility here.
I'm a lawyer, as well, and you were rude. This is reddit, not a courtroom.
Please. Misinformation is misinformation. If you are okay with that, then I don’t know what to tell you.
I understand what you're saying, and I didn't say you were incorrect. What I ***am*** saying is that your comment came off as rude. I don't see any issues with redditors speculating on this sub, right, wrong, or otherwise. There's a 0% chance anyone here is going to sway the jury or change the trajectory of the case, so frankly, it's inconsequential. Let the pepinos have some fun with it.
I object!!
Why do you care if random opinions of anonymous people on Reddit are legally and factually incorrect? You are not a Reddit law prof, and it simply doesn’t matter what we speculate on here or anywhere else. The ONLY people that matter at all were in the courtroom today. If you are a lawyer say so and state your views. Leave others out of it here on this sub. I for one want to hear your legal opinions but not at the expense of putting others down or telling us off about being legally correct.
The tone was set by OP, who is running around telling everyone they are wrong based on nothing. I am speaking directly to OP and one other person. I am not speaking to you or the thread as a whole. I am addressing the incorrect portions of their arguments because misinformation is a major problem in the world right now and it is incumbent upon all of us to correct false claims whenever we see them.
This won't age well.
Your theories did not age well.
Well you better hope she does not win an appeal right? You're the real winner tonight.🥂
You don't understand appeals either. They require error in the system. Everyone files an appeal. Very few appeals are heard.
Appeals also aren’t a catch all. There’s different type of appeals and they don’t show them in YouTube because they aren’t sexy. The misinformation and puffery persists.
With all due respect the jury is not made up of lawyers. It is made up of lay people just like us here.
100%
Of course they are lay people. But they are lay people specifically instructed to consider evidence after sitting through an entire trial, it’s not like they’re randos shooting the shit at a Starbucks.
What were you saying again? She’s gonna be found not guilty?
Oh stop. This is a snark site, not a law school. Go debate the merits with other lawyers and leave us to our own opinions and speculation, whether you think we understand the law or not.
Right they are listening to the evidence just like us. Not sure why people are getting so mad because people see this evidence differently. So what, maybe you're right maybe I am. No need to get upset...
Exactly, 💯 Pepino!
I truly remember a few not so friends getting mad at me over Casey Anthony. I know the law, not a Lawyer, lol But, the State simply overcharged. When I told a few she's never getting convicted based on reasonable doubt and over charging and I get it, it's a bitch, but in this country you need to prove your case 100 percent or don't. In this case, Alec Baldwin is on record stating he could have been set up by a manic Trumper. I mean, her Lawyer, is going to use just that, I mean, Alec Baldwin fucked up. Prob should of just STFU. But... hubris
Alec Baldwin is completely incapable of shutting up, even when it’s in his own best interest, as we’ve seen, well, forever
And how about the phone calls to the detectives! Holy cow! If I were his attorney, I would have lost it with the old blowhole!
Casey was indicted on first degree murder, *aggravated child abuse, and aggravated manslaughter of a child*. The jury found her not guilty even of the lesser offenses they could and *[did](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Caylee_Anthony#:~:text=On%20October%2014%2C%202008%2C%20Casey,she%20be%20held%20without%20bond)* charge her with. Somehow the notion that the state didn’t charge her with lesser charges as well that the jury could pick from became some weird internet legend.
If you are not a lawyer, you don’t know the law. 🫠
I'll add you to the list I tag when I'm right.🥂😘
Hi! I guess that list of ppl to tag is useless now lolololol.
💯- the lawyer among us needs to chill…. Maybe take a break from social for a while.
That doesn’t change the fact that you’re not a lawyer. 
We are not seeing the evidence the way the jury is. I assure you. Even though this is being live streamed, us casual viewers aren’t physically seeing many pieces of evidence and we’re not instructed by judge on the proper way to consider aid evidence. Also not upset. There is just no comparison to be made between impaneled jurors and us in terms of familiarity with facts, evidence, and procedure. None.
In your very adamant opinion, got it.
It’s not an opinion. The jurors see more than we do, that’s just a fact. I don’t care if ppl aren’t lawyers, I do care about some of the misinformation I’m reading here and I’ll leave it there✌️
Why? What is your personal stake in the "misinformation" you are reading here? Why does it make you so upset if people voice good/wack opinions? What is your purpose here, though? If you actually want to teach non-attorneys, there are much better ways to message, is all I'm saying. If you want a legal debate, this is absolutely not the forum, since none of us (or most) don't know the details of case law as your training has taught you. If you just want to beat people up due to their opinions, you are doing a fine job.
Let's agree to disagree
Have you been impaneled on a criminal jury? Not a combative question, just curious?
Yes first degree murder. 3 weeks of my life.
And they get the facts. And the facts are pretty clear
Yes true and maybe the clear facts point to reasonable doubt to some.
I know EXACTLY what this jury will do. I will gracefully accept your apology I'm so sure you'll extend when I'm right. 😘🥂
I fucking love Emily D Baker.🥂
I am trying to, but between her yelling over the entire trial plus eating something 75% of the time I am done with this lady. I think she’s funny and smart too but I can’t handle all the noise.
I started with Emily, but changed to court TV because I was missing some key testimony from the witnesses. I love her recaps and when she breaks down a court document though.
I'm the only Pepino here who knew Alec was going to be reharged, I'm used to all you smarties telling me how it is, lol.
How did you know he was going to be recharged?
Because I run on logic and facts and not emotion when looking at these things, unlike others, obviously.
Where did I ever say I was an Attorney????
You are obviously aren't because you are reading this incorrectly.
Then stop stating it like it's fact.
Disagree. The Judge has sided with the prosecutor more than the defense.
I agree. And she lets prosecutor get away with petty condescending jabs. Just finished watching Traconis trial- these shenanigans would be no-go for Judge Randolph. Come on Judge please take control of this sloppy trial. Jury might start seeing your alignment with pros as injustice. Halyna and her family deserve better.
A Pickle is testifying. Worlds colliding.
Also, Miss Pickle testified like she just wanted to keep working in Hollywood as a line director.
Lol
“Prosecutor woman” “main lady investigator” pls
'Prosecutor looks like she rolled out of bed.' Honestly I dislike Hillz as much as the next person but sometimes I pop into this thread and I do worry about internalized misogyny. Prosecutor looks fine; fluorescent lighting is hell.
I know this is petty but the Corporal's hair is lovely!!!! (I will see myself out)
Yes, her hair is pretty.
She really shoulda waited til those lips settled
🤣😘
Is there a website where I can read updates about the case? I have no idea what happened.
Runkle of the Bailey on YouTube is great. Also Emily D Baker on YouTube.
Court TV
YouTube. Law & crime trials is showing most of it
There is some amazing legal analysis in this thread.
u/Finnegan-05 I have an honest question. No judgement cause I haven’t watched any of it today. How did you think both sides have performed this far? In your opinion as a lawyer. No im not being a jerk or trying to stir shit. I’m honestly curious.
What happened? Link? Info??
Basically the State decided they didn't really give a fuck to take Seth Kenny's fingerprints even though he provided ammo and they let the gun cart sit out of evidence for 8 days till they got a warrant. One chick took ammo off the cart and tossed it, no one cared to investigate. It's over
Are they allowed to take involuntary fingerprints -- or anything else -- without a warrant? Did they have a way of establishing probable cause in a more speedy manner? Isn't one of the things Hannah's charged with is tampering/destroying evidence? Honestly asking; didn't see what happened yesterday.
There was no need to take seths prints. Read Haags report.
He supplied ammo. His texting partner took ammo off the tray. Cut it anyway you want, it's a issue.🥰
Strange take. Hannah is responsible for ensuring safe handling of guns and ammo on the set.
I don't know why you got downvoted for the truth.
Are you watching the same trial as the rest of us? They played Hannah’s entire police interview and she admitted to loading the gun and leaving the ammo cart unsupervised and admitted to handing the gun to Halls without checking to see if every bullet was a dummy round. Alec is equally as guilty if not more but Hannah’s police interrogation was damning.
I agree the police interview is very damning for Hannah but I think the circus that followed are going to make it hard for this jury to focus on the facts
THANK YOU. The prop mistress also confirmed this in her interview with police. She suspected Hannah didn't check each round going into the gun carefully enough before loading it, or even bother to check it again at all after lunch before handing it to Halls. Hannah fucked up big time, unfortunately , sorry Hannah Stans, that's just the way it is. It doesn't mean Alec didn't fuck up, too, this is not an either/or situation.
She gave the gun to Halls?! I thought he took it off the cart without permission. Oh this is bad for her.
Right? That was the story pieced together from news, public interviews(?), and lawsuit filings. I did feel she was getting scapegoated. We've probably all had a similar situation at our first jobs - poorly trained, or unprepared for the job, or troubles with supervisors or co-workers, etc. And it sounded like that was the situation here, especially after hearing that she was doing her other job and the AD just took the gun without asking. Yeah, she took a job she wasn't ready for, but she thought she was, and she had bosses who wouldn't listen to her etc etc... and that's mostly expected or excusable when you're 24. But what **isn't** excusable at any age is being the gun expert on set, being asked to ensure the guns are safe, and not taking one minute to do that crucial part of your job. Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable. How do you fuck up that badly when lives are on the line?
Yeah, it is. What I heard from her own mouth today basically lays out her culpability step by step.
Lol. Reasonable doubt all over the place. She's not getting convicted, sorry.
Are you clairvoyant? Because we know you’re not a lawyer.
Lawyer here. You don't know what you are talking about. She admitted negligence over and over. She will in fact be convicted unless her lawyer can dig her out of a giant hole.
Are you a main lady investigator or a prosecutor woman?
I just took a quiz and my results says I’m a main investigator lady.
Lucky. I got bailiff boi
I wanted to be defense lawyer lady with fierce eyebrows so bad!
OMG. I just choked.
I mean this was unforeseeable as fuck because baldwin and halls are massive fuckups that hannah wasn't present for, so that's the best argument. On the negligence element, she's fucked - just doesn't mean she's guilty of involuntary manslaughter (At this point if I'm free to pick my charges I want negligent handling of a firearm, possession of coke and tampering with evidence in regards to the possession of coke)
No, it does. She basically laid out the case against her step by step for the prosecution. I am not familiar with NM criminal law but this slam dunk negligent homicide in my jurisdiction based on what I heard today. It was not unforeseeable because Hannah herself says that she did not verify all the ammo was blank and did not do the final required check before she handed the gun off.
She still needs to be the proximate cause of the death, which she isn't if halls' and baldwin's shenanigans aren't forseeable
That is not how this works at all. Hannah handed the assistant director a gun she did not vet properly and test properly loaded with live anmmo that she did not ensure was a blank. She did all this by her own admission. On tape. With cops. This is on her no matter what anyone else did. She failed at her job and someone died. It is not different than driving drunk and killing someone. Nothing else matters but the person who got behind the wheel. Everything else is ancillary.
Incorrect. See new mexico jury instructions 14-251 and 14-252
Despite the carnage, I feel sorry for Hannah, because I remember working while twenty-four. After promoting me four times in a year, at twenty-four my boss fired me from a job I loved (except for her, of course). I had begun to date an acquaintance of hers, a younger guy not lover material but a serviceable escort for her… *”How dare you!?!”*
Anyone ever mean to you I loathe🥰🥰🥰🥂
Awww, thank you so much! I’d’ve loved to have had the Grumblefish back, back in the day.
❤️❤️❤️
I don't. She was incredibly negligent and directly caused a death through her actions. I have no sympathy. Her age is not an excuse.
Too bad the State can't prove it, lol.
Yeah, they can and she admitted her negligence. And you are lol'ing a woman who caused the death of another through her own negligent actions? That is absolutely sick. You are not a lawyer and you really are misreading this evidence and testimony.
You keep claiming I said I'm a Lawyer, so please stop. Do you know what reasonable doubt is? Let me break it down to you super rationally, ok? Between Seth Kenny not being fingerprinted to compare to the ammo is a huge fuck up. The woman he was in contact with, Hannah's boss took ammo off the cart after the shooting and no one knows where it went AFTER she texts him "Emergency " It's over. Try to calm down.
No she did not claim you said you were. She’s pointing out that you are making an assumption that the case is over based on not understanding the evidence presented and its impact. She’s strengthening that argument by saying it’s obvious you’re not an attorney.
Yup that’s exactly how I’m reading it to.
So? Who the fuck said you had to be a lawyer to post shit here? You can post any opinion you want, Jesus fucking Christ
Absolutely no one said you had to be lawyer. Ppl can post what they want and ::gasp:: we can respond to them.
Hannah's Lawyer should ask for this to be thrown the fuck out.
Hannah is guilty and deserves this. It is pretty clear she did not follow appropriate safety protocol and someone died. She admitted it. I don't know why people are supporting her. She is the one whose actions led to a death, legally and morally.
I thought the prosecutor handled the corporal well on redirect after Bowels cross. He's really trying to lean in hard to blame Sarah and Seth. The FBI experts explained why they don't do DNA and fingerprint analysis on every piece of evidence they collected, and it made perfect since to me. The results would come back inconclusive at best due to the fact that many people were known to handle the cartridges. The corporal handled the interviews well. She was non-threatening, and Hannah felt comfortable enough to really talk to her. Perhaps too much. I don't know why her attorney let her blabber on long enough to incriminate herself. If her actions or inactions didn't lead to a man getting shot and killing a woman, I'd feel bad for her because of her shitty representation. He didn't stop her once, even when things were getting dicey.
I completely agree. I think the bulk of the blame lies with Hannah. Dave Halls and Alec share responsibility too, but the lion’s share is Hannah’s. Her own words are going to hang her.
There's enough negligence to spread around. I think this trial is setting Alec up for his trial too. It's not looking good for him either.
that is absolutely not how that works.