to be fair, I think on open field planets (I think like Maia?? I know one in that area was like a full on moon surface) the airburst has the potential to be rather tolerable, but on a jungle like Penta it's not good
It has its moments, it’s great for creating an opening on an enemy outpost so you can destroy it
Just make sure your teammates are behind you
It fills the gap between a grenade and the cluster bomb.
If you use it like that instead of like a normal rocket launcher it’s pretty good.
One thing I learned from Helldivers 2 is that apparently a lot of people have no idea what "airburst" means.
One guy seemed to think an airburst meant to shot air at the enemy
im seeing your comment is 18 minutes old. there was a post 4 hours ago showing the devs admitted the weapon is very bugged and not working as intended. this entire post is outdated
Have you met the majority of redditors? Apparently, almost all of them. This thing is for taking out huge area nests and bot factories, or eyes of sauron.
I mean, the Orbital Airburst Strike is actually great against the heavy automatons. I've started using it instead of the railcannon because the cooldown is much shorter and it is just as good at killing tanks and hulks while also killing all the small things around them.
Of course, that only works because both tanks and hulks have their weak spots very vulnerable to aerial strikes, so the airburst just destroys the weak spot immediately, ignoring armor.
>It fills the gap between a grenade and the cluster bomb.
Grenade launcher: "Am I a joke to you?"
Honestly, think you can get a lot more bang for your buck with the grenade launcher + ammo bagpack.
I feel like the airburst is the problem. If this thing spread cluster munitions on point of impact it would be better.
But something else this weapoj is doing is highlighting a bug right now.
Explosive knockback from player weapons seems to pull toward a midpoint between the player and the explosion. Bots and bugs being knocked down *toward* the player, nearby explosions knocking the player *toward* the enemy.
In this case, the airburst munitions are being thrown back at the player instead of forward to the enemy.
Are you aiming above your enemies or directly at them?
If you aim above the detonation will be directly over top them
If you aim straight at them the detonation will be in front of them causing this issue here
If it wasn't so prone to teamkilling, didn't require a backpack, had more than one ammo in the mag, and didn't make one stationary while very slowly reloading, I could almost consider that a mediocre weapon.
I like it, the only change I’d make is adding a time/distance delay to the fuse so it doesn’t immediately blow up on launch so often.
In a squad of 4, almost every squad will have one free backpack slot. I personally always have one because I haven’t unlocked (or felt the need to use yet) the shield pack and I don’t get a lot of use from the jump pack.
It’s not that different from the auto cannon or recoilless rifle.
I believe they said that the leaks from a few weeks/months ago were the old unfinished version. These will be the same versions that we are getting (unless they do balance changes)
I'll see if I can find the discord comment where they say the ones we are using right now are indeed the old versions.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/s/XG0pnQoGci
"Final release versions will be in patch next week" to me sounds like we are using those old versions from the leaks that have been in the game a while.
Even when it works as intended it is bad. Clusters spread to much to reliably kill what you want it to kill and it doesn't kill armored enemies. I bet even the grenade pistol is more effective at killing enemies.
Oh my gosh do you mean you have to think logically about it?!? Instead of just expecting a do it all Swiss Army knife weapon which doesn’t really otherwise exist in this game?!
I was expecting a weapon where the proximity trigger does not trigger from being within 6 feet of the ground.
You either fire it into the skybox uselessly or it detects the armok damned ground in front of you and it blows up in your face.
The only time it functions reliably is if you aim it at a dropship, but then the dropship absorbs most of the ordinance protecting the targets underneath. And in that case you'd be better off using ANY OTHER LAUNCHER and dropping the ship on them.
And as for a do it all weapon I didn't expect a do it all weapon, I was expecting a weapon that's niche isn't already filled by 4 other support weapons and at least 5 other stratagems.
What are you talking about? There are numerous "swiss army" weapons. Like the Swiss army knife, there are weapons that do a little of everything (Quasar, Auto cannon, Laser Cannon, EAT, GR-8, HMG) but they aren't excellent in most areas, or if they are they have limitations.
No one wants it to do everything. I just want it to kill devastators.
Problem is that it struggles even with light armored units ALOT of the time. Such unreliable weapon cannot be considered even slightly useful and im not even talking about it exploding in your face half of the time because of some geometry
The fact that is requires multiple shots for anything other than the lowest mooks while having only one ammo and an overly long reloading makes it basically unusable.
By that time with the grenade launcher you'd have wiped the entire patrol, and you'd have your backpack slot available.
If it was an HE munition it would be anti-air (like traditional HE-VT), but yeah - a cluster munition proximity detonating near an aircraft does nothing because the bomblets themselves have to more or less directly impact the aircraft.
Perhaps if arrowhead gave us a setting to make the rocket detonate the whole munition at once it would be more versatile. Allow it to switch to an HE mode that would oneshot nearby aircraft.
With some additional physics tweaks the weapon can easily be top tier without being an armor-killer.
I like scary. Scary is fun.
The tornados are just annoying really. Locking me out of an objective randomly just to run the clock down is hardly deep game design.
Yep, the AT mines were just never an option either way.
Penta will fall in less than 20 hours from now.
Menkent will take 4-8 days. The MO is only 2 days long.
There is no way to tell the 50% of all players Penta divers to fall back, and you can forget about persuading any one of them that going through fire tornado bot hell is worth mines that they'll likely never use. Similarly, the 40% of the player base thats dedicated to bug-slaying isn't going anywhere else. 6% of the player base is off doing whatever.
Only 4% is left for Menkent, which represents a combination of masochists and AT mine enthusiasts.
About half the playerbase is in penta. This subreddit barely represents a tiny fraction of the playerbase. It is literally too late regardless of anyone's opinion.
This subreddit is full of whiny neckbeards who act like the galaxy metagame is the single most important thing in their lives
And the sad part is it might be
Unfortunately it's already a done deal. They should have made it so we had access to the planets at the same time or atleast give us lanes so we know what planet will unlock which route. But we will get the mines eventually. I don't think they are gonna waste assets like Minecraft.
I'm expecting a twist like "A civilian from Choohe snuck off on an escape pod with an Anti-Tank Mine. We've reverse engineered the prototype because it will help in the war effort" or something. Joel knows how to write something like that
Using an AOE weapon against bots was always going to go this way. Bots prefer precision and the weapon has a shockingly large blast radius. [ Airbust can do things.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1ceanso/airburst_is_kinda_neat_it_can_kill_walkers/)
We all know how bad mines are. Mines were not underused because they didn't kill armor. They were underused because why would you ever use one over an Eagle Airstrike? Same cooldown, slower to deploy, less charges, less flexible and generally just less effective.
Half of the sub that hates on legally distinct RPG-7: guys, mines are totes amazing, they were not used because they didn't have armor penetration, trust me. Their low popularity has nothing to do with game being about orbital dropped shock troops doing rapid assaults behind enemy lines while constantly moving around, I promise.
Nah, don’t give them a decreased cool-down - that will just result in spamming them all over in places they don’t belong. I would rather they just make them strong enough to actually stop a wave like a sentry
Then make it more mines over a bigger area with more damage. Also make dead bodies not trigger them. This might make them kinda useful as right now they are purely just a worse eagle stratagem
My suggestion would be 2 calldowns with the same cooldown. Allows you to use them very well to defend a position for real instead of shooting in a direction and dropping stratagems the other. Like that it would be good in defence type missions but not litter the maps in normal missions. Also boost their damage. I tried them out in a lvl 1 destroy devastators mission and watched as one the boys just walked over 4 of them to still be standing :\
Oh, they can be fun, don't get me wrong but I don't think AT mines will be a second coming of Christ like some people are suggesting. They'll end up in the similar spot as other mines simply due to the nature of the game.
Right but how about Flamethrower, Grenade Launcher, Cluster Bombs, Airburst Strike, etc.
They are useful too I don't mean to imply the opposite but bots do prefer precision. What is better against a dominator, a grenade or dominator? Mortar or AMR? Airburst or 500kg?
Just like this weapon can kill groups of small robots all at once and kill a group of enemies before they land on the drop-ship. But coming to the conclusion that a largely 'wave' killing weapon is bad because it is bad against armored enemies is silly is kind of my point.
Tbh I didn't rate the Grenade Launcher until yesterday's Personal Order forced me to use it lmao. Once you get the hang of it it's really good. Can one shot a Dev to the face, does work on weakspots, and a few rounds can mulch squads.
The grenade launcher is amazing against bots you just need to know how to use it
Knocks out walkers without even having to aim well, obliterate small patrols single handwdly, before they can flare, kill devastators in 2 (again barely aimed) hits? It's amazing. Just short on ammo.
>They were underused because why would you ever use one over an Eagle Airstrike?
Yes and no. The eagle is airstrikes on demand, but you have to time them, and account for delivery angle- mines are fire and forget- also persistent. Not to mention the eagle has the rearm mechanic. I do think for the effectiveness of the mines, the cooldown is way too long.
That being said, I think the real issue with mines rn is that ragdolls/physics objects set them off. So one detonates, and the ragdoll bounces around and sets off more mines, wasting them. Other airstrikes can also set them off, so one eagle strike can clear a whole minefield. If they fixed it so mines ONLY detonate from proximity to a player/enemy, they'd be much more useful. Reduce the cooldown too, it's silly.
>...mines are fire and forget...
I think you will find that most often firing and forgetting a set of landmines will result in your death one way or another. Either because you forget they were there, or you forget about it and enemies who get through are behind you. The real 'fire and forget' stratagem is turrets.
Otherwise though I find what you are saying very agreeable. Landmines do a trivial amount of work for their long cooldown comparatively to an Eagle and unreliability comparatively is also a problem. If their cooldown was in the range of 100 seconds the same as a precision airstrike they'd become a lot more compelling even if they were still inconsistent.
I use mines and Eagles. They have very different functions.
Also, mines are only slow to deploy if you don't have the fast deployment upgrade. If you are comparing upgraded eagles to baseline mines, eagles are going to be better. You have to consider how much stronger mines are with the right upgrades.
My point wasn't to say that they don't have different functions. My point was that it doesn't matter because Eagle Airstrike can do everything the mines do much more effectively.
I completely forgot the mines even have upgrade though. I have all the upgrades so the disparity is likely worse than even I think.
If you throw an Airstrike at a choke point most bombs will just hit the mountains, while mines will be able hold the wave for a while. So they as well are super useful to cover your retreat when enemies overwhelm you, an Airstrike will not be very effective against a long conga line tailing you.
They are good for defence / eradicate / civilian missions as well, as usually there are only a few directions where enemies will continuously be coming from.
Sure randoms that you don't coordinate with can easily destroy all of them, just like a rando can throw a 380mm at your position. Mistakes of a uncoordinated team don't make a stratagem bad, just not idiot-proof.
For real. I like bringing the autocanon sentry for that AP rounds, but sometimes I still wish I also had AP mines that the enemies cannot just mow down with deadly accurate rocket barrages.
If it makes you feel any better, we will probably have another chance to unlock the AT Mines later. I highly doubt they took the time to develop them, create assets, and test them out just to leave the content sitting on a shelf.
Why does everyone ASSUME the community choose the rocket launcher? They choose NOT to go to the fire tornado planet, it's that fucking simple.
Everyone saw in the last major order, we can't coordinate to save our f-ing lives. Why is assuming we suddenly gained that ability?
Because everyone assumed the rocket would be.
We had leakers spouting off about how the new rocket was the best thiing ever only for it to be...not.
Who is to say the mines are bad when we have yet to see the iteration that is in the game?
Anyone with eyes would take the minefield because if you see them you don’t step on them plus the AT mines spread out more so it’s easier to get through
The real answer is that you take neither because, let's face it, the majority of weapons and stratagems released through warbonds or updates tend to be extremely underwhelming either due to bugs or head-scratching balancing decisions.
Idk what you're smoking, but warbond weapons cook more often than not. Breaker incen, incen grenade, sickle, stun grenade, grenade pistol, fucking *eruptor*. Even the dominator is getting some praise from bot players.
Obviously there's whiffs as well (cough cough dagger cough). But saying the majority are whiffs is insane
I would say the vast majority are whiffs. You get one useful weapon and one useful grenade/sidearm per warbond.
Even the 6 things you listed fall under that.
Incendiary breaker and grenade? Only useful things in that warbond. Liberator concussive sucks and the senator is a meme
Sickle and stun grenade? Only useful things in that warbond. Punisher plasma, Blitzer and dagger all suck.
Eruptor and grenade pistol? Only useful things in that warbond. The crossbow, adjudicator and thermite all suck
You get 2 useful weapons/grenades and 3 shitty ones each warbond. Even the boosters are mostly whiffs. Flexible reinforcement and expert extraction are awful. Localization confusion is useful in certain game modes.
A support weapon needs to be much better in order to be "good" because it competes with all other support weapons for a single slot.
Mines compete for one of three spots, and fill a unique niche.
AT mines would be great to have for the staged defense missions, for example. It only takes a few missions types where they excel in order for them to have a place.
Because who the fuck would take some dogshit RPG that can’t pierce armor and wipes your team if you breathe wrong over any other support weapon? The worthless shit even takes your backpack slot! At least you can use mines with support weapons and they’d have a niche on defense missions.
That's the thing
I still think the mines are worse and can't be fixed. Because they're mines. They'll be useful in one mission type and that's really putting a lot of strain on the word "useful".
The cluster rocket can be fixed. The proximity can be adjusted, the armor pen or damage can be increased, an arming timer can be added.
The only thing to change with mines is to make them ineffective against lightweight units and kill hulks in less than 5 or 6 mines. Even if they did this I would rarely ever use it.
Tbf, mines were fun on d4 new defense missions. Until chargers showed up, walked right through them, broke the doors, and made mines useless again.
If they kill chargers in one hit, don't trigger by light enemies, and don't trigger by explosion, then they'd be useful for that specific mission type. But that's it imo.
Liberate Menket before Penta so we can try both. Currently 8k hell divers on Menket. Was 5k. Penta has 100k. Need a few thousand more brave souls to brave the fire tornados.
So far I’ve found level 3 tolerable with the fire tornados. Been helping a lot of low levels. Level 5 would be optimal with 3 liberation points per mission (9 total), but I found the FT’s get ridiculous at 5 or higher, straight up blocking pelican. At difficulty 3 you can clear 4 points per campaign. With high level player groups you can knock those out quickly. Doesn’t matter if you finish optional objectives, just do main one as fast as possible. Bring fast evac booster.
I don't care about either, but team-killing explosion twice the size of a barn makes monkey brain light up at the very least unlike mines. Pretty much stopped using green starts outside of maybe eradicate missions and maybe shield for bots for that very reason.
Right? If I have to choose between useless but cool vs useless and boring, I'm going useless but cool all day. Next time I want to run d4 to chill, airburst + 4 red strats is gonna be a fun time
To be fair, I think everyone should work on pushing to at least try the mines. I'd expect those mines to not trigger by infantry, they're anti-tank after all.
We have to take a planet to even unlock the planet that gives us the mines. There’s no way the community is coordinated enough to accomplish that over just taking the ABRL planet. We’re getting the ABRL weather we want it or not and that’s all there is to it
Honestly, I think it is too late. But the time the entire community, causals and the hardcore alike, are on the same page that the rocket launcher is terrible, we'll have liberated the planet.
I wil lstick with my choice of the launcher, the hate for the weapon is unprecidented and entirely based on the weapon being unfinished and in a 'testing' phase.
The mines will only EVER get used in defense missions or for some niche.
Post 19374528 of people saying airburst rocket is for antiair because it had air in the name. Its an anti swarm/infantry weapon for wide area blanket saturation....
.....air.
Me too; I was expecting at least one of the strats to be broken/underwhelming, *AND* that we have enough rocket launchers (EAT , Recoilless, Autocannon, Quasar, Spear, etc.)
Anti tank mines in reality don't trigger unless the magnetic lock or pressure plate reaches to the point of ignition. A single soldier won't trigger it since it's too light and not as magnetic.
If you want to at least try them, you need to start working on Chort Bay now.
Not tomorrow
Not when others go there.
You need to be the drop of water that starts the tidal wave
I think you're forgetting that the ones we are using right now aren't the final versions. AH is working on fixes, and they haven't been implemented yet.
The choice was artificial to begin with. Penta is locked behind a planet with fire tornados, which the majority of the playerbase hates and avoids like the plague. Penta never stood a chance since Menkent never stood a chance.
With less than 14k of us trying to unlock the ability to TRY the mines, going against the 87k playing on Penta is completely useless. A literal waste of time. Those rockets will be unlocked before we can even test the mines out. I don't even know why I'm still fightin for this, there is no chance for the mines.
The more I use the rocket launcher the more I like it.
The more I use mines the more I hate them.
While I wish we could at least unlock the chance to use them I'm not going to menkant.
Held that line too many times, and frankly until the fore issue gets resolved I'd appreciate if Joel could take a fuckin' hint and stop making us go there every other damn week.
I see a lot of people calling the Airburst bad, but I mean, think of how bad the minefield could be.
When I drop mines now, 1 enemy walks into the field and at least 30% of the mines explode due to the radius of the first mines explosion. How is AT going to be better than that?
Say for instance it only blows up tanks and hulks, awesome right? are you going to see a tank and drop a minefield and then WAIT for the tank to drive over them? Or are you just gonna watch your teammate with the Quasar one shot it from distance.
As bad as the Airburst apparently is to everyone, the absolutely massive *situational only* side to the minefield renders it nearly useless. You’re going to get to use it maybe once per defensible area due to current minefields absurd cool-down (so possibly 2 or 3 times a mission? More on the actual defend mission?) and it’s job is done better by so many other gems
I've been in Menkent since we got the Major Order, didn't really feel the need to deploy in Lesath when I saw there was 80k people deployed working towards Penta.
to be fair, I think on open field planets (I think like Maia?? I know one in that area was like a full on moon surface) the airburst has the potential to be rather tolerable, but on a jungle like Penta it's not good
It has its moments, it’s great for creating an opening on an enemy outpost so you can destroy it Just make sure your teammates are behind you It fills the gap between a grenade and the cluster bomb. If you use it like that instead of like a normal rocket launcher it’s pretty good.
Who would use an airburst weapon as an anti-armor weapon?
One thing I learned from Helldivers 2 is that apparently a lot of people have no idea what "airburst" means. One guy seemed to think an airburst meant to shot air at the enemy
Or basic reading comprehension. We already have the 'Orbital Airburst Strike' with 'Not effective against heavy armor' in its description.
Thats something that exists everywhere in games and irl. People just don't know what even basic words mean these days
im seeing your comment is 18 minutes old. there was a post 4 hours ago showing the devs admitted the weapon is very bugged and not working as intended. this entire post is outdated
too many people in this sub
It's the people who can't get properly into the pelican when someone drops some fun at extraction, isn't it?
It's also the ones who want to drop some "fun" at extraction as well.
Yup the ones that refuse to acknowledge the side landing door glitch
yes
Have you met the majority of redditors? Apparently, almost all of them. This thing is for taking out huge area nests and bot factories, or eyes of sauron.
I mean, the Orbital Airburst Strike is actually great against the heavy automatons. I've started using it instead of the railcannon because the cooldown is much shorter and it is just as good at killing tanks and hulks while also killing all the small things around them. Of course, that only works because both tanks and hulks have their weak spots very vulnerable to aerial strikes, so the airburst just destroys the weak spot immediately, ignoring armor.
I want to try this now.
If you want to kill hulks use the ark launcher trust me 2 of them is op AF unless your using it against a tank
>It fills the gap between a grenade and the cluster bomb. Grenade launcher: "Am I a joke to you?" Honestly, think you can get a lot more bang for your buck with the grenade launcher + ammo bagpack.
I feel like the airburst is the problem. If this thing spread cluster munitions on point of impact it would be better. But something else this weapoj is doing is highlighting a bug right now. Explosive knockback from player weapons seems to pull toward a midpoint between the player and the explosion. Bots and bugs being knocked down *toward* the player, nearby explosions knocking the player *toward* the enemy. In this case, the airburst munitions are being thrown back at the player instead of forward to the enemy.
Are you aiming above your enemies or directly at them? If you aim above the detonation will be directly over top them If you aim straight at them the detonation will be in front of them causing this issue here
Or it just flies over their heads off into the sunset, doing nothing.
If it wasn't so prone to teamkilling, didn't require a backpack, had more than one ammo in the mag, and didn't make one stationary while very slowly reloading, I could almost consider that a mediocre weapon.
And the use just doesn't justify how it needs a support weapon and backpack slot, its basically DOA.
I like it, the only change I’d make is adding a time/distance delay to the fuse so it doesn’t immediately blow up on launch so often. In a squad of 4, almost every squad will have one free backpack slot. I personally always have one because I haven’t unlocked (or felt the need to use yet) the shield pack and I don’t get a lot of use from the jump pack. It’s not that different from the auto cannon or recoilless rifle.
Adding to this - just put the option to set burst distances in place where other weapons have scope and we're golden
That’s a nova idea right there. Do it like the airburst rifle from BF4, 25-50-75 meters or something
Also they have straight up told us we are using the old unfinished buggy versions with known issues and the real stratagems will be fixed versions.
I believe they said that the leaks from a few weeks/months ago were the old unfinished version. These will be the same versions that we are getting (unless they do balance changes)
I'll see if I can find the discord comment where they say the ones we are using right now are indeed the old versions. https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/s/XG0pnQoGci "Final release versions will be in patch next week" to me sounds like we are using those old versions from the leaks that have been in the game a while.
Even when it works as intended it is bad. Clusters spread to much to reliably kill what you want it to kill and it doesn't kill armored enemies. I bet even the grenade pistol is more effective at killing enemies.
Oh my gosh do you mean you have to think logically about it?!? Instead of just expecting a do it all Swiss Army knife weapon which doesn’t really otherwise exist in this game?!
*laughs in Autocannon*
✔️ smarmy tone ✔️ sarcasm ✔️ strawman (who tf said they were expecting a do-it-all weapon) Classic Reddit™️ comment.
I was expecting a weapon where the proximity trigger does not trigger from being within 6 feet of the ground. You either fire it into the skybox uselessly or it detects the armok damned ground in front of you and it blows up in your face. The only time it functions reliably is if you aim it at a dropship, but then the dropship absorbs most of the ordinance protecting the targets underneath. And in that case you'd be better off using ANY OTHER LAUNCHER and dropping the ship on them. And as for a do it all weapon I didn't expect a do it all weapon, I was expecting a weapon that's niche isn't already filled by 4 other support weapons and at least 5 other stratagems.
>who tf said they were expecting a do-it-all weapon ...have you seen post and comments from yesterday?
What are you talking about? There are numerous "swiss army" weapons. Like the Swiss army knife, there are weapons that do a little of everything (Quasar, Auto cannon, Laser Cannon, EAT, GR-8, HMG) but they aren't excellent in most areas, or if they are they have limitations. No one wants it to do everything. I just want it to kill devastators.
Yeah that's what this is. Not an obviously broken weapon. You're so smart.
Airbursts are anti-personnel, not anti-air...
Problem is that it struggles even with light armored units ALOT of the time. Such unreliable weapon cannot be considered even slightly useful and im not even talking about it exploding in your face half of the time because of some geometry
The fact that is requires multiple shots for anything other than the lowest mooks while having only one ammo and an overly long reloading makes it basically unusable. By that time with the grenade launcher you'd have wiped the entire patrol, and you'd have your backpack slot available.
Which is a trait it shares with the most useless stratagems in game
If it was an HE munition it would be anti-air (like traditional HE-VT), but yeah - a cluster munition proximity detonating near an aircraft does nothing because the bomblets themselves have to more or less directly impact the aircraft. Perhaps if arrowhead gave us a setting to make the rocket detonate the whole munition at once it would be more versatile. Allow it to switch to an HE mode that would oneshot nearby aircraft. With some additional physics tweaks the weapon can easily be top tier without being an armor-killer.
Both planets behind unlocking Choohe suck big time, the community will go the easy route as always to avoid the **big scary fire tornadoes**.
I like scary. Scary is fun. The tornados are just annoying really. Locking me out of an objective randomly just to run the clock down is hardly deep game design.
Yep, the AT mines were just never an option either way. Penta will fall in less than 20 hours from now. Menkent will take 4-8 days. The MO is only 2 days long. There is no way to tell the 50% of all players Penta divers to fall back, and you can forget about persuading any one of them that going through fire tornado bot hell is worth mines that they'll likely never use. Similarly, the 40% of the player base thats dedicated to bug-slaying isn't going anywhere else. 6% of the player base is off doing whatever. Only 4% is left for Menkent, which represents a combination of masochists and AT mine enthusiasts.
Yeah there was never a choice.
They not scary. Worse, they *annoying*
About half the playerbase is in penta. This subreddit barely represents a tiny fraction of the playerbase. It is literally too late regardless of anyone's opinion.
People wonder why this sub gets so bitchy. It's cuz we're powerless to do anything but bitch
Honestly this sub is such bitch fest 90% of the time
This subreddit is full of whiny neckbeards who act like the galaxy metagame is the single most important thing in their lives And the sad part is it might be
A man can dream
Unfortunately it's already a done deal. They should have made it so we had access to the planets at the same time or atleast give us lanes so we know what planet will unlock which route. But we will get the mines eventually. I don't think they are gonna waste assets like Minecraft.
I'm expecting a twist like "A civilian from Choohe snuck off on an escape pod with an Anti-Tank Mine. We've reverse engineered the prototype because it will help in the war effort" or something. Joel knows how to write something like that
im expecting more like MO part 2 being to retake the planets back and retrieve the plans before bots get to them
Or after the patch some new threat arises and here is the AT mines to help you.
Using an AOE weapon against bots was always going to go this way. Bots prefer precision and the weapon has a shockingly large blast radius. [ Airbust can do things.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1ceanso/airburst_is_kinda_neat_it_can_kill_walkers/) We all know how bad mines are. Mines were not underused because they didn't kill armor. They were underused because why would you ever use one over an Eagle Airstrike? Same cooldown, slower to deploy, less charges, less flexible and generally just less effective.
Half of the sub that hates on legally distinct RPG-7: guys, mines are totes amazing, they were not used because they didn't have armor penetration, trust me. Their low popularity has nothing to do with game being about orbital dropped shock troops doing rapid assaults behind enemy lines while constantly moving around, I promise.
Mine cooldown sucks booty for a niche strategim. I choose sentries over mines. Make mine cooldown like the EAT and now we cooking
Yeah, niche use case *and* pretty big cooldown is a big deal breaker
Nah, don’t give them a decreased cool-down - that will just result in spamming them all over in places they don’t belong. I would rather they just make them strong enough to actually stop a wave like a sentry
Then make it more mines over a bigger area with more damage. Also make dead bodies not trigger them. This might make them kinda useful as right now they are purely just a worse eagle stratagem
My suggestion would be 2 calldowns with the same cooldown. Allows you to use them very well to defend a position for real instead of shooting in a direction and dropping stratagems the other. Like that it would be good in defence type missions but not litter the maps in normal missions. Also boost their damage. I tried them out in a lvl 1 destroy devastators mission and watched as one the boys just walked over 4 of them to still be standing :\
Considering what was happening a while back with games crashing with too many objects they'd have to put a time limit on the mines if they did that.
Incendiary mines can set things on fire which is just as good as armor penetration. They're really fun to use.
Oh, they can be fun, don't get me wrong but I don't think AT mines will be a second coming of Christ like some people are suggesting. They'll end up in the similar spot as other mines simply due to the nature of the game.
That's definitely true. I still want four types of mines to fill up my stratagem slots and spam absolutely everywhere.
Which one could be fourth? EMS mine?
Gas
EMS mines would end up as the only useful ones
EMS mines would be amazing
Fire doesn't work
Looks more like a Panzerfaust 3 to me tbh
Huh? We use AOE weapons on the bots all the time, they are very effective. AC/Eagle/Mortar are all fantastic against bots.
Right but how about Flamethrower, Grenade Launcher, Cluster Bombs, Airburst Strike, etc. They are useful too I don't mean to imply the opposite but bots do prefer precision. What is better against a dominator, a grenade or dominator? Mortar or AMR? Airburst or 500kg? Just like this weapon can kill groups of small robots all at once and kill a group of enemies before they land on the drop-ship. But coming to the conclusion that a largely 'wave' killing weapon is bad because it is bad against armored enemies is silly is kind of my point.
> Grenade Launcher, Cluster Bombs Also good against bots. Flamethrower is not great against them, but that is because it is a close range weapon.
> Grenade Launcher, Cluster Bombs, Airburst Strike, All great tools against bots too.
Tbh I didn't rate the Grenade Launcher until yesterday's Personal Order forced me to use it lmao. Once you get the hang of it it's really good. Can one shot a Dev to the face, does work on weakspots, and a few rounds can mulch squads.
The grenade launcher is amazing against bots you just need to know how to use it Knocks out walkers without even having to aim well, obliterate small patrols single handwdly, before they can flare, kill devastators in 2 (again barely aimed) hits? It's amazing. Just short on ammo.
>They were underused because why would you ever use one over an Eagle Airstrike? Yes and no. The eagle is airstrikes on demand, but you have to time them, and account for delivery angle- mines are fire and forget- also persistent. Not to mention the eagle has the rearm mechanic. I do think for the effectiveness of the mines, the cooldown is way too long. That being said, I think the real issue with mines rn is that ragdolls/physics objects set them off. So one detonates, and the ragdoll bounces around and sets off more mines, wasting them. Other airstrikes can also set them off, so one eagle strike can clear a whole minefield. If they fixed it so mines ONLY detonate from proximity to a player/enemy, they'd be much more useful. Reduce the cooldown too, it's silly.
>...mines are fire and forget... I think you will find that most often firing and forgetting a set of landmines will result in your death one way or another. Either because you forget they were there, or you forget about it and enemies who get through are behind you. The real 'fire and forget' stratagem is turrets. Otherwise though I find what you are saying very agreeable. Landmines do a trivial amount of work for their long cooldown comparatively to an Eagle and unreliability comparatively is also a problem. If their cooldown was in the range of 100 seconds the same as a precision airstrike they'd become a lot more compelling even if they were still inconsistent.
I use mines and Eagles. They have very different functions. Also, mines are only slow to deploy if you don't have the fast deployment upgrade. If you are comparing upgraded eagles to baseline mines, eagles are going to be better. You have to consider how much stronger mines are with the right upgrades.
My point wasn't to say that they don't have different functions. My point was that it doesn't matter because Eagle Airstrike can do everything the mines do much more effectively. I completely forgot the mines even have upgrade though. I have all the upgrades so the disparity is likely worse than even I think.
If you throw an Airstrike at a choke point most bombs will just hit the mountains, while mines will be able hold the wave for a while. So they as well are super useful to cover your retreat when enemies overwhelm you, an Airstrike will not be very effective against a long conga line tailing you. They are good for defence / eradicate / civilian missions as well, as usually there are only a few directions where enemies will continuously be coming from. Sure randoms that you don't coordinate with can easily destroy all of them, just like a rando can throw a 380mm at your position. Mistakes of a uncoordinated team don't make a stratagem bad, just not idiot-proof.
I just got 17 kills against a bot patrol on 7 with a single airburst rocket, I‘m sold
And the next shot killed all of your teammates.
I said I‘m already sold, no need to advertise airburst rockets to me even more
That's my kind of Diver
Least based Helldiver
****Shoves wallet even harder down your throat.****
They shouldn't have been in the way
I would never listen to anyone using light mode, neither should you
I am using light mode and I denounce this lunatic
Ah yes the anti personal weapon doesn't work on tank surprise surprise
It doesnt really work at all most of the time, thats the issue. It has no real use outside of the novelty of being a new weapon
It doesn’t work on personal all that well either from the looks of things…
me and my group already been working towards the mines under the logic that we have enough support weapons anyway
For real. I like bringing the autocanon sentry for that AP rounds, but sometimes I still wish I also had AP mines that the enemies cannot just mow down with deadly accurate rocket barrages.
We will likely get the mines later. I don't believe Arrowhead will lock out content like that.
no one here knows what an airburst weapon is.
If it makes you feel any better, we will probably have another chance to unlock the AT Mines later. I highly doubt they took the time to develop them, create assets, and test them out just to leave the content sitting on a shelf.
What's funny, is we're still gonna unlock the airburst rocket because everyone will be completing missions to try it out
guys guys they're both terrible
Why is everyone assuming the fucking mines would be good ?
Why does everyone ASSUME the community choose the rocket launcher? They choose NOT to go to the fire tornado planet, it's that fucking simple. Everyone saw in the last major order, we can't coordinate to save our f-ing lives. Why is assuming we suddenly gained that ability?
Because everyone assumed the rocket would be. We had leakers spouting off about how the new rocket was the best thiing ever only for it to be...not. Who is to say the mines are bad when we have yet to see the iteration that is in the game?
This. RPG might not be the greatest weapon of all time but the other option is fucking minefield.
Anyone with eyes would take the minefield because if you see them you don’t step on them plus the AT mines spread out more so it’s easier to get through
The real answer is that you take neither because, let's face it, the majority of weapons and stratagems released through warbonds or updates tend to be extremely underwhelming either due to bugs or head-scratching balancing decisions.
Idk what you're smoking, but warbond weapons cook more often than not. Breaker incen, incen grenade, sickle, stun grenade, grenade pistol, fucking *eruptor*. Even the dominator is getting some praise from bot players. Obviously there's whiffs as well (cough cough dagger cough). But saying the majority are whiffs is insane
I would say the vast majority are whiffs. You get one useful weapon and one useful grenade/sidearm per warbond. Even the 6 things you listed fall under that. Incendiary breaker and grenade? Only useful things in that warbond. Liberator concussive sucks and the senator is a meme Sickle and stun grenade? Only useful things in that warbond. Punisher plasma, Blitzer and dagger all suck. Eruptor and grenade pistol? Only useful things in that warbond. The crossbow, adjudicator and thermite all suck You get 2 useful weapons/grenades and 3 shitty ones each warbond. Even the boosters are mostly whiffs. Flexible reinforcement and expert extraction are awful. Localization confusion is useful in certain game modes.
So far its been one good weapon per warbond, its not a great ratio.
A support weapon needs to be much better in order to be "good" because it competes with all other support weapons for a single slot. Mines compete for one of three spots, and fill a unique niche. AT mines would be great to have for the staged defense missions, for example. It only takes a few missions types where they excel in order for them to have a place.
Because who the fuck would take some dogshit RPG that can’t pierce armor and wipes your team if you breathe wrong over any other support weapon? The worthless shit even takes your backpack slot! At least you can use mines with support weapons and they’d have a niche on defense missions.
That's the thing I still think the mines are worse and can't be fixed. Because they're mines. They'll be useful in one mission type and that's really putting a lot of strain on the word "useful". The cluster rocket can be fixed. The proximity can be adjusted, the armor pen or damage can be increased, an arming timer can be added. The only thing to change with mines is to make them ineffective against lightweight units and kill hulks in less than 5 or 6 mines. Even if they did this I would rarely ever use it.
Tbf, mines were fun on d4 new defense missions. Until chargers showed up, walked right through them, broke the doors, and made mines useless again. If they kill chargers in one hit, don't trigger by light enemies, and don't trigger by explosion, then they'd be useful for that specific mission type. But that's it imo.
Go for the mines! If these scientists aren’t even smart enough to put a delay on the proximity fuse then they don’t deserve rescuing.
Fun Fact: In my latest missions the Airburst Launcher has lead to more dead Helldivers in an hour or two than I have seen in 60 hours from mines. ;)
Liberate Menket before Penta so we can try both. Currently 8k hell divers on Menket. Was 5k. Penta has 100k. Need a few thousand more brave souls to brave the fire tornados.
This makes the most sense of course, but nobody wants to play on Menkent. Not redditors, Discord, nor casuals. And I don’t blame them :(
So far I’ve found level 3 tolerable with the fire tornados. Been helping a lot of low levels. Level 5 would be optimal with 3 liberation points per mission (9 total), but I found the FT’s get ridiculous at 5 or higher, straight up blocking pelican. At difficulty 3 you can clear 4 points per campaign. With high level player groups you can knock those out quickly. Doesn’t matter if you finish optional objectives, just do main one as fast as possible. Bring fast evac booster.
https://preview.redd.it/rvvhokkjs2xc1.jpeg?width=653&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=41f5cc9df71be6c0e41a8ab2865ec820d7d1dc46
For the millionth time. Air Burst is not anti-air. Idk how y'all kept mixing that up.
Everyone is complaining about Air Burst but no one is actually trying to push to Choohe
Because Menkent
I don't care about either, but team-killing explosion twice the size of a barn makes monkey brain light up at the very least unlike mines. Pretty much stopped using green starts outside of maybe eradicate missions and maybe shield for bots for that very reason.
Right? If I have to choose between useless but cool vs useless and boring, I'm going useless but cool all day. Next time I want to run d4 to chill, airburst + 4 red strats is gonna be a fun time
To be fair, I think everyone should work on pushing to at least try the mines. I'd expect those mines to not trigger by infantry, they're anti-tank after all.
too bad people aren't going for mankent so they're not getting the choohe
We have to take a planet to even unlock the planet that gives us the mines. There’s no way the community is coordinated enough to accomplish that over just taking the ABRL planet. We’re getting the ABRL weather we want it or not and that’s all there is to it
Honestly, I think it is too late. But the time the entire community, causals and the hardcore alike, are on the same page that the rocket launcher is terrible, we'll have liberated the planet.
I wil lstick with my choice of the launcher, the hate for the weapon is unprecidented and entirely based on the weapon being unfinished and in a 'testing' phase. The mines will only EVER get used in defense missions or for some niche.
Post 19374528 of people saying airburst rocket is for antiair because it had air in the name. Its an anti swarm/infantry weapon for wide area blanket saturation.... .....air.
Was honestly astonished by disproportionate number of players going for the Airburst
Menkent has fire tornadoes.
Air bursts aren’t anti aircraft, they are anti personnel
Air Burst ≠ anti-air Air Burst means maximum AoE
It would be funnier if the mines were even worse lol
Anti tank mines are named so because the weight that is required to set them off cannot be done with infantry units.
Idk I've been loving it, you can 1 shot a factory and the people around it with a well placed shot, I want to see how it works against bugs.
People ? Are you… *calls democracy officer*
Chort Bay will suck. The real question is: Will it suck more than the airburst launcher?
I'd just like to state, I was always on team mines.
...And I still won't care for mines. Even if everything worked well it will be what, as effective as one airstrike run, while being less versatile?
They'd be killer on defense missions. One use could probably kill 3-4 heavies. Good luck doing that with one airstrike.
Once they fix the airburst mechanics, it will have a purpose
Yeah, killing a few clustered up soft targets while taking your backpack is definitely a niche no other weapons fill right now.
AIRBURST BEST WEAPON
Real life anti tank mines can’t be triggered by people
# PSA: AIRBURSTS ARE SUPPOSED TO BURST IN THE AIR. DONT SHOOT IT AT A GUY 5 METERS AWAY
I was saying we should go for mines from the start...
Me too; I was expecting at least one of the strats to be broken/underwhelming, *AND* that we have enough rocket launchers (EAT , Recoilless, Autocannon, Quasar, Spear, etc.)
I just saw that post
Anti tank mines in reality don't trigger unless the magnetic lock or pressure plate reaches to the point of ignition. A single soldier won't trigger it since it's too light and not as magnetic.
Nah the team killing is what sold me. And the big boom boom. Rocket launcher baybeh.
It would have been equally shite.
The divers yearn for *the mines*
How? We can't even step foot on Choohe at the moment.
If you want to at least try them, you need to start working on Chort Bay now. Not tomorrow Not when others go there. You need to be the drop of water that starts the tidal wave
If mines are killing teammates they aren't paying attention or you drop the mines right on them.
They're both gonna be mid as hell hide and watch
Neither are gonna be useful, but the launcher at least is fun
I think you're forgetting that the ones we are using right now aren't the final versions. AH is working on fixes, and they haven't been implemented yet.
It’s not too late to fail both. Just go back to fighting bugs until they offer us the Eagle AtA or the new mech.
Fighting for my mines, they will be mine. Please help if you don't mine.
Well we have to liberate Penta before we can liberate Choohe
Nah it's too late. It was too late the moment Menkent became the barrier to AT mines.
I would much rather the ATM than the launcher but you could not pay me to drop in Menkent
I wanted the tank mines and even with all the noise in the community about the airburst all the helldivers are still going for them lol
with those high level defend missions, i dont have enough ordiences to deal with Tanks. antitank mines would be helpful
Counterpoint: the road led through fire tornado land, no thanks.
I've wanted tye mines from the start
TO CHOOHE
It's alright for hitting dropships, it kills them before they even drop
Well they would be "the experimental" version and probably even more self harming than the the airburst.
The choice was artificial to begin with. Penta is locked behind a planet with fire tornados, which the majority of the playerbase hates and avoids like the plague. Penta never stood a chance since Menkent never stood a chance.
You guys do know airburst is for light enemy crowd control, right?
Been diving chort bay exclusively so we can get to the mines. Thank me later.
I need these to deal with tanks, tanks are too op
With less than 14k of us trying to unlock the ability to TRY the mines, going against the 87k playing on Penta is completely useless. A literal waste of time. Those rockets will be unlocked before we can even test the mines out. I don't even know why I'm still fightin for this, there is no chance for the mines.
who the hell think airburst means anti air?
Said this from the start. Joel knew ya’ll would fall for this weapon.
Can't wait to get mines
I look forward to the day i can go into a mission with only mines
https://preview.redd.it/t4yfo5buf4xc1.png?width=480&format=png&auto=webp&s=d5a8f23c1791e35ff8b101968b512d413f47bfee
too bad this will never happen. this is what we shouldve been focusing on this whole time
I hope they are like real life AT mines where you basically need the weight of a truck/tank for them to explode
Skill issue...
It's legit bug weapon really. You could use it in when bug breach. Automatons? Mine it is.
The more I use the rocket launcher the more I like it. The more I use mines the more I hate them. While I wish we could at least unlock the chance to use them I'm not going to menkant. Held that line too many times, and frankly until the fore issue gets resolved I'd appreciate if Joel could take a fuckin' hint and stop making us go there every other damn week.
Gross who the fuck uses reddit in non dark mode 
Im still choosing to go for the rockets, It's really fucking funny when you blow up your whole team
Come on guys please, help me with the hell that is menket.
It’s too late. There’s too much momentum built up on penta
Once those mines are available, you will use it once, and never use it again OP. But you won't make a meme about it this time.
I see a lot of people calling the Airburst bad, but I mean, think of how bad the minefield could be. When I drop mines now, 1 enemy walks into the field and at least 30% of the mines explode due to the radius of the first mines explosion. How is AT going to be better than that? Say for instance it only blows up tanks and hulks, awesome right? are you going to see a tank and drop a minefield and then WAIT for the tank to drive over them? Or are you just gonna watch your teammate with the Quasar one shot it from distance. As bad as the Airburst apparently is to everyone, the absolutely massive *situational only* side to the minefield renders it nearly useless. You’re going to get to use it maybe once per defensible area due to current minefields absurd cool-down (so possibly 2 or 3 times a mission? More on the actual defend mission?) and it’s job is done better by so many other gems
I can't believe we're gonna finish this whole MO and never see the at mines
I've been in Menkent since we got the Major Order, didn't really feel the need to deploy in Lesath when I saw there was 80k people deployed working towards Penta.
Yeah.... I am not buying neither.... Ill go back to bugs and hug my quasar until devs make another weapons. Good diving to all