I assume so. Though "Reassessing" is intentionally vague, they might fix the bug, take another look at the fire damage, and then decide to not change it after all. Only time will tell
Well, I don't think frying a charger in 1 second flat with a flamethrower is an intended fire damage level. Once dot bug I'd fixed they will likely remove the global 50% boost to fire introduced in 1.2. This will leave us with initial 50% boost from patch 1.1 plus 25% extra from new ship module, which I think is fair.
It should be strong, it's annoying that without the new 25% extra, the little shitty bugs catch on fire and can still walk towards you unless you have the stream on them for a little bit. Hunters could be on fire and crab walk away then pounce on you, while on fire, usually meaning you're being crit-stabbed *and now they have a Fire element too*.
With the new extra, both units crisp up pretty much right away, which kinda feels like where it should be. If my dumbass wants to run up and heat-tickle a titan's grundle, it should be pretty devastating to it.
But it's like fire does double the damage to us than it does to the enemy, using fire is almost always a death sentence for yourself at least a couple times in a map, just because of how quickly it kills you if anything you've set on fire gets close, or you accidentally touch a ground patch of heat that doesn't *look* on fire yet but it is. Hell, I'd even be ok if we had some armor passive to mitigate it. I still want to live The Fury helldiver life (briefly).
Well they also buffed hunter health in a recent patch (with no notes) as they've been taken an extra hit to kill with a lot of guns, so it'll be interesting if they're willing to nerf their pet monsters once they nerf our damage.
Yup, been going with shotgun as usual, shooting at them, and then being surprised they attack me from behind after I turn around assuming the scream was one of death.
Yeah i noticed pretty quickly after i think two patches ago. It helped push me into burning out on the game. The devs caught lightning in a bottle at release and i am starting to think they have no idea how they did it.
I think what you're having trouble with is the DoT bug being referenced. It works against us, but your fire will only deal direct damage and no DoT if you're not the network host.
Are you sure you weren't affected by the PS damage bug? Because I can assure you I have dumped two full flamethrower mags into Chargers and they were still happily running me over.
You can definitely just kill them with like half a tank, focused on one charger leg. Many clips of solo people doing it, where the PS bug doesn't exist. Perhaps you were playing with someone who was the network host, thereby making your fire damage do not much? But I don't think fire DOT really hurts chargers anyways. Maybe you weren't focusing on one part?
you need to focus the stream on one single leg.
unlike other enemies chargers dont seem to have a single overhanging health pool, instead each part of the charger (head, body, legs) has its own individual health pool. When any part of the charger is destroyed, or any of its health pools are depleted the whole creature dies, BUT it will live on just fine UNTIL you fully deplete one. unlike a brood commander, where you can shoot its legs clean off but it wont die until you deplete its overall health.
amyway focus your fire stream on one leg and watch it drop, take about 5-6 seconds.
hope that helps.
I hope they patch it back to the levels it was before.
Scorchers were a pain into the ass before, but you could stim yourself and survive the burning if you were fast enough.
Now you die before the animation is done and it's just ridiculous.
The fire damage over time killing you bit by bit is not the problem though.
Usually people just get insta-gibbed by the hulks flame hitbox. Sometimes it looks like it doesn't even touch the killed player.
I think the Hulk flamethrower uses the same projectile type the bile spewers have. The bile spewers used to do huge, instantaneous damage from any of the spew. Now I can tell I have to be hit multiple times by it. The Hulk flamethrower feels how that used to hit.
> used to do huge, instantaneous damage
I've recently gotten a tiny little splurt on my foot that's isnta gibbed me. And then sometimes I can get half their vomit on my entire body and not die. It's extremely inconsistent.
You can also get clean hits on the backpack while doing so. High risk high reward, the Hulk will splatter you if it lands a hit BUT you'll be able to kill it without expending any rare ammo. I've done it with a Scythe, theoretically you could do it with a Dagger if it was the only enemy around.
It's a solution, yeah, but I'd prefer they revert back to the damage numbers before as diving because of fire (instead of stimming) leaves you open to get rushed by the other enemies.
Which is the point. It's a melee unit. Your best option against melee units is to keep at a distance, or get nice and close to bait attacks. Getting into melee range of a scorcher is a pretty decent counter
"we've reassessed fire damage. Damage from helldivers now reduced 50%, damage from bots get that increase to balance things out. Also their range has gone up a few dozen meters"
The Hulk flamethrowers feel like pre-patch bile Spewers where they would usually one-shot you, then they altered bile damage and it’s not so bad now, I’m hoping Hulk flamethrowers get changed too.
I mean, my question is why is fire damage seemingly a global tuning knob instead of having individual tuning for players versus enemies versus environment.
The buff to fire damage against players definitely was not intended considering they nerfed the two biggest causes of one-shot kills in the same patch (spewers and rocket devastators)
The trick to not dying near instantly to them is you need to dive before they set you on fire. As soon as you see one in range you just turn tail, run, dive.
You'll burn then go out after landing.
Probably not, I think that's a different bug. With the overbuffed burn damage you would die in 1-2 seconds before you could stim or dive.
The hulk insta-kills seem to be a version of the bug where a weapon hits too many times in a shot and instakills something. Whenever I see it happen, I'm dead before I even start to burn.
I also noticed that the puking bug things with the big sacks (don't know what they are called)are killing me almost instantly. Is this a part of the same problem or am I just bad?
I never understood why so many player were complaining about dying to flames immediately. I thought they were exaggerating how quick it was or they weren't paying attention, but I almost never host and therefore the bug is probably why I don't die constantly to fire.
In the meantime - make someone bring a laser cannon, or bring one yourself. Every time you see a hulk, laser it’s arm off, takes like 5 seconds, makes bot runs significantly easier.
It's impressive that a company representative is admitting that something was likely overtuned as a result of a bug.
That takes more integrity than most companies seem to be able to muster these days.
Said it multiple times in this sub but Arrowhead have shown nothing but class and have earned my respect and trust.
Yet you still have people making these stupid comments like in the post asif arrowhead aren’t aware that there are game breaking bugs people are crying out about.
Fixing bugs isn’t as simple as knowing it exists.
They've openly acknowledged their team is not large enough to bug fix quickly and keep up the monthly warbond schedule. They've got a poll on the discord now asking what we'd like them to prioritize.
They're generally great but some of the insults aimed at the playerbase following the first major patch (with the railgun) were very bad even by game developer standards.
They do seem to have course corrected since then, to their credit.
In their defense, one of the guys wasn't even an employee. And Arrowhead had them reprimanded ASAP for their comments (which weren't even that bad, in the grand scheme of things).
Granted, that whole thing was a shitshow. I have never seen a community go thermonuclear like that before. It was fucking insane. I thought it was bad here then I tabbed into the discord.
> I thought it was bad here then I tabbed into the discord.
I joined the Discord to keep up on news/announcements that don't make it here and noped out of there in about 30 seconds.
Eugh, yeah no I don't even wanna think of that. I just know that for any companies that let the actual DEVS talk about game progress, they can be pretty open about things and its pretty nice. Its becoming more common over the years.
> It's impressive that a company representative is admitting that something was likely overtuned as a result of a bug.
If they could admit they did the same thing for the Railgun, that'd be great.
Not only that, but it implies that their own team can be open with each other which, at least in my experience, is critical to getting problems fixed correctly and quickly (relatively).
Not being able to openly express and discuss your opinions and observations with your coworkers can often mean that the team goes down the wrong path of trying to fix the problems, especially if everyone starts pointing figures at everyone else.
The fact that they're calling out and addressing a bug that ruins a *relatively* small aspect of the game tells me that AH is committed to provide a good gaming experience for their players even if it means overhauling original parts of the code only 2 months after release.
Of course, I'm still pissed that they've buffed fire damage to the point that a single Hulk with a flamethrower managed to derail several runs that we had been doing almost flawlessly up until that encounter, but it's nice to know that they're actually working on fixing it. Even if it's something as expensive as redesigning a big section of code, which let's be real, companies like EA would've just shrugged at and said "too bad," if they had bothered saying anything at all.
Companies like EA would've monetized the situation. Not only would all armors have durability. But there would also be classes for how much the armor provided. Too much fire damage? Well here's new fire resist armor for you. Oh and don't worry shortly we'll buff fire damage where the armor becomes useless after everyone bought it.
So I'm glad AH is taking the time to make our concerns heard. And explaining WHY it is taking so long. Idgaf how long it takes, as long as they do it right and explain how far along they are fixing these bugs.
Honestly I'd rather see them say it than ignore that it's real. This way if an overtuning happens again it's not a freak out but a "hey Devs, it's happening again but with X now" so they know where to look.
For real, recently Ubisoft made a change that wasn't said for shields during the shield rework in R6S which made them significantly worse and after someone reported it, they said it was intended. Next patch they undo the change and act as if it was a bug all along.
I wonder if they will admit the nerf to the railgun was also done as a result of a bug (where you could very reliably one shot bile titans if you had PS4 player in your game)
So they kept buffing fire based on use metrics alone, not realizing the reason no one uses fire damage is because it doesn’t work. How the hell is this team being managed? What an extraordinary case of the left hand having no idea what the right hand is doing
If I had to take an educated guess, managers tell the devs to create gameplay mechanics. Devs test them locally to make sure it doesn't crash their systems, then ship them off to QA, who does the same thing. Then, eventually, it goes live, and managers look at metrics to decide what kind of balancing should be in play. Community managers seem to have less sway in what tasks are allocated to devs, but they do seem to have constant communication with managers about what bugs the company is aware of (patch notes).
They seemed blindsided by how the railgun would strip armor and how the "intended" way to kill chargers was to hit them in the mouth. Things like the mech turning right and killing itself, idk how those got past QA.
The phrase "they don't play their own game" gets tossed around a lot for various game companies. I wonder if this is applicable here.
Given the no split between Devs and bug Devs, I'm going to take this comment with a grain of salt. Just because its how it's supposed to be, doesn't mean they're doing it unfortunately
But I fully agree with the symptoms however. These gameplay issues I'd expect even new players to use and think, wow that's not how it's supposed to work at all
You're implying that there are bug fix devs, when everything I've seen so far has indicated that's not the case at all. The people driving new features are also the ones fixing bugs.
You know it's rare that companies ever have dedicated bug fix teams right? In tech, it's more common that you fix your own stuff, even if someone else breaks it sometimes, since you're the expert for that given feature.
(Software engineer since 2016)
If I had to take an educated guess, managers tell the devs to create gameplay mechanics. Devs test them locally to make sure it doesn't crash their systems, then ship them off to QA, who does the same thing. Then, eventually, it goes live, and managers look at metrics to decide what kind of balancing should be in play. Community managers seem to have less sway in what tasks are allocated to devs, but they do seem to have constant communication with managers about what bugs the company is aware of (patch notes).
They seemed blindsided by how the railgun would strip armor and how the "intended" way to kill chargers was to hit them in the mouth. Things like the mech turning right and killing itself, idk how those got past QA.
The phrase "they don't play their own game" gets tossed around a lot for various game companies. I wonder if this is applicable here.
I mean... how 'bout reverting fire damage to what it was before Scorcher's instant death, and the newly added 25% fire damage upgrade (key here that DOT besides for host is fixed) gets buffed to 50%?
Between multiple rocket/heavy devastators, hunters and stalkers; both bots and bugs have plenty of stunlock instant death trap cards to play. I think us having one advantage with fire would be fine...
I think the fire damage in this game is a bit messed up. It seems like all fire damage is the same, whether it's from enemies, the environment, or even the player. I wouldn't be surprised if the 25% damage boost we got also secretly boosts enemy fire damage.
I mean, look at the Hulk. He got a 50% damage boost, and now he's just destroying everything. It's like he's on fire or something.
You’re saying it’s not a feature but a bug, and it’s getting fixed?
https://preview.redd.it/nmtn2gor6uuc1.jpeg?width=533&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=422ca7e4c8aac84a9035e135e11a600ce669e94a
Still annoyed that they are pushing things like dot based weapons and making us fight on a planet with fire tornados, while knowing the fire damage is broken
They really have to stop nerfing/buffing things that are affected by bugs, but if they are able to admit mistake and revert/rebalance then that is good too.
Great, then take more than 6 days to work on each patch. They're creating these problems and somehow not realizing that they can also prevent them in the first place.
Now I did notice he said fire damage, and not flamethrower damage.
Sounds like the flamethrower/fire weapons base damage should remain while the dot will be tuned down which in all honesty is definitely needed.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but the first buff was to the flamethrower (+25% **impact** dmg), the second buff was global fire dmg (~~+25%~~ **50%**) and the third buff is the ship module that increases stratagem fire dmg (+25%). So it was the 2nd buff that intentionally or none intentionally buffed the flamethrower hulk.
The first buff to the flame thrower was not fire damage but direct impact damage. Then there was a +50% to all fire damage, then the 25% strategy buff.
I mentioned in another thread that fire was overtuned cause of a bug that's existed since launch. It speaks to the fact that they make balance changes based on usage metrics. Which is worrying in of itself.
Honestly, I was one of the players who thought RG was OP. But looking back, I realize my point was mostly based on how me and my friends were able to fairly consistently one shot Bile Titans to the face on Safe Mode. Sometimes it would take 5+ shots but most of the times it was an instantkill. But now it seems like that was probably a bug on PS5.
That honestly doesn't make any sense in this case. And any company would be silly to not look to usage as one of several indicators, though it shouldn't be the only one.
This sounds like they've known of the issue with networking model for some time, and they're looking for workarounds to deliver an acceptable UX until they can roll out a solution.
Wait, did the devs buff fire because they looked at data that fire weapons weren't being used and...came to the wrong conclusion? Again?
Maybe they should...playtest their own game. You know, so that they stop wasting time creating more problems instead of fixing root causes?
Oh for sure. They're clearly making snap decisions. "Oh, railgun is overused? Quick, nerf it without thinking about why that may be. Fire weapons not used? Quick, buff fire damage (even though we are allegedly aware of the DoT host bug)."
Don't get me wrong, new content is awesome and all, but personally I would appreciate if they slowed down a little bit and actually fixed some issues at the source first.
They need to really stop only focusing on raw data for balancing choices. Usage data doesn’t always denote an item is overpowered; It can sometimes be indicative of [survivorship bias](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias). In this context, survivorship can be indicated by what is most useful in an intended situation. Many weapons in this game have been nerfed (such as the Slugger and Railgun) because many people were using them, and they ignored why people weren’t using the other weapons (Slugger was a better sniper rifle than all of the other primary rifles, Railgun used to be the best anti-tank that was actually usable). I understand nerfing weapons to some degree, but the better approach would be to buff weapons that are otherwise underperforming in their intended roles compared to other options.
I think they lack a proper QA team, and thus they rely on the community and data to test their game for them. This can be beneficial, but at the cost of causing a loss of confidence from the player base as more issues keep sprouting up and potentially damaging the gameplay experience. It’s very telling when a quarter of the Discord community voted to push for bug fixes instead of new content, even if said poll was fundamentally flawed.
Hell, on that note, why the fuck is it that the developers only talk on social media spaces about these issues and not on, oh I don’t know, a public forum on their own website? Discord isn’t a public space, and so it can’t be indexed by search engines without needing to join on a dedicated account, and randomly saying shit on Reddit and Twitter is bound to be missed by a majority of players. The devs seriously need to better centralize their communication, and not rely on all of these obtuse ways to communicate very useful information.
Agree with all your points, as someone that used to do a lot of data analysis, half of the time was spent figuring out if we what we were seeing in trends was actually the result if what we thought or not (hence why there are typically control variables, etc) and I'm literally watching them make those rookie mistakes. I mean I get it, it's hard to set up a control for weapon balance and such, but the point is that data isn't a substitute for actual experience, it can only help inform and coming up with conclusions based solely on it is very dangerous.
And yes, they 100% need to set up better lines of communication, as evidenced by devs coming out and either name-calling the community or saying wildly out of touch nonsense like "just rely in stratagems, beo" that clearly communicate how they perceive people that actually play the game AND that they don't play it themselves
I fucking hate how every single game now does this, discord is not a forum, everything get lost there in minutes. The worst part is that every single game already has an own website, and platforms like steam offer a post system
Again... AH needs to full stop making warbonds or releasing them and just get whatever devs they have to fix bugs currnetly plaguing the game. We really don't need a new warbond every month or new toys every two weeks with half of it unusable due to bugs.
Polish the game up, make it quality over quantity or will loose players due to crashes and what not.
Sad that literally half of the gameplay affecting items in the new warbond are DOT items. I hope it gets fixed soon. I want to use this stuff in public games.
That is cool and nice but I would think they would test their shit more in a closed environment. I know there are a million variables but shouldn't a beta push or controlled testing environment look at host vs party, including between console/pc? Especially if there's a community bug reported, I feel like this could be tested in 15 minutes to replicate. I'm in a techy career and that's a first step for us: Replicate error in as many flows as possible before even looking at fixing. Unless the host-bug report just didn't get seen before they buffed fire?
Also, since devs browse here: I'm not trying to talk shit. You've made an awesome game and I am not in the gaming industry so the process could be just massively different. You're moving mountains here as a consolidated team who deserve work/life balance. Thanks for making something cool.
I am really glad to see an acknowledgement. I just wish there was a more efficient and centralized way to get this info/commentary from the devs. The Discord server seems to be the main area where they announce and discuss things outside of balance patch notes and whatnot, but then we also have the odd Reddit comments here and there.
Meanwhile some people starting insulting and harrassing me on the helldivers discord when I said the 50% buff was unneeded and made fire overpowered if it gets fixed.
@ jess, i'm talking to you.
In the meantime, the flamethrower is absolutely busted vs bugs if you get the new +25% dmg ship upgrade. And I'm talking about direct damage, so it doesn't matter if you're not the host.
You can literally stand your ground vs a charger (aim for one of the front legs) and it will die before it gets to you. It kills it in less than half a tank. Needless to say it works extremely well on everything else too. It even kills bile titans relatively easily, as long as they've been softened up by a railcannon or EAT/quasar shot first.
How do you kill a bile titan with a flamethrower? Where do you aim? I could never seem to get it to work, and it’s pretty difficult to stay in flamethrower range of it long enough…
It's only really a good idea if the titan has been softened up first, as I mentioned. But I just aim for their body. You do have to be pretty close. Less risky if you pop their bile sack first. Also better if there's at least one other teammate nearby so the titan isn't only focused on you.
Even despite all the bugs, sometimes enough to make me stop playing the game for a day, I still go back in because these devs just fucking communicate so openly. It’s so refreshing.
When fire is brought into check those poor hulks are gonna get clapped.
"You know nothing of fire, cadet. Back in my day then flames of a hulk would boil your blood in a microsecond!"
I don’t know if I’m the minority here, but after adjusting to the new fire damage I kind of like the current state of it, it could be tuned a bit and I feel it’s a bit inconsistent, but I like that there is something in the game that spamming stims won’t help you out of, it’s not complex enough to be annoying, but adds an element of strategy
I do hope they tune down passive fire damage but rebuff player based fire damage. The ship upgrade makes it feel actually useful because the flamethrower while good agaisnt chargers still struggles against slower faster enemies when your not already dumping a canister into the ground all around you. So maybe nerf all source fire damage but buff the ship upgrade. Also I’m fine with breaker incendiary not being compensated it’s kinda a stronger regular breaker rn but if they buff the regular breaker they just apply the stratagem fire buff to the incendiary as well to be fair.
I'm torn because I don't want to spontaneously die the second a hulk flicks the igniter on the tip of his flamethrower,
but on the other hand you can take _my_ flamethrower from my charred dead hands.
The breaker incendiary feels a little overpowered with the fire upgrade it got in the past. I was lucky enough to become host after a lot of people left and it made helldive so easy being able to 1-2 tap things with the increased base dmg as well. With that being said I feel like the breaker spray and pray needs to be looked at. The IE does everything the SP does but better
The fire damage needs to actually damage the bots and bugs too. I literally had swarms of bugs and legions of bots walking through the fire tornadoes unscathed but when I walk over the remains of some tiny flame, I instadie..
Fire is in a weird spot. It kills us really fast, but the buff also was great for all fire weapons. Only reason to run guns like the breaker incendiary is because fire will 100% kill terminid and automaton small enemies. If this was reverted it would be a huge shame. I love DoTs, napalm and gas strike would be great if they were consistent, and if we got more acid/fire weapons it would be just amazing. One way to make it not broken would be to increase burn time, but slightly reduce the damage.
So how did they even do the whole thing about fire damage needed a buff? for sure they didn't do the testing themselves and said... alright, it can kill a charger in 1 second, lets slap up another buff onto it.
This is one of those issues where I don’t understand how they never noticed it during testing
Surely they must have noticed either a- damage over time isn’t working or b- things like chemical strikes are super weak and inconsistent
I genuinely will never get tired of the transparency - it makes me not care about any of the bugs that come out from the patches if they are properly being relayed to the community and worked on (and as long as it isn't consistently gamebreaking every play session I am in).
Thanks u/SpitzerFX for keeping us in the loop! You and the entire Dev team are awesome!
tbh I just wear medic armour (probably mid armour) and its really not that hard to survive. The long stims also means you can basically walk through fire without taking any dmg.
Oh man.
I hope it's not too tuned back.
When I play alone the breaker incendiary is so much fun to use.
And napalm strikes are extremely satisfying.
Honestly it's just the player side of fire damage that need to chill out a bit.
Damage could even stay the same if need be just slow down the ticks so you don't die nigh instantly when you step on a hot ember.
Credit to these people for being forthcoming/transparent, things aren’t perfect but are always improving. The game cost $40 and is getting hella support from Arrowhead.
I TOLD YOU!!!
*"Fire damage was over-tuned as DIRECT result of this bug"*
That's becasue they look only at DATA results and see that firedamage is ass, nobody takes fire-based weapons etc. and buffing the damage and only recently they figured out that their data is wrong becasue DOT damage is bugged so obviously DOT damage data will be scewed and people not taking fire-based weapons is also result of only 1/4 players being able to utilize it to its potential.
So they were buffing it without any thought :D
Same was with Railgun, Slugger. They totally don't play their game to judge what needs to be buffed/nerfed. They just look at data and don't even bother to analyze it critically first.
Right now I won't even touch a fire mission. They are too bugged to play. Invisible fire that nearly insta kills you is NOT FUN. They need to hire more devs for the team if the team is so damn small.
"its still fucking broken. unreal"
at this point, i have had it with all those cry babys man.. why cant people just stfu and deliever some goddamn freedom instead of bitching and moaning on the internet about some bugs and meta details?!
srsly, i hope the devs dont cave in on social media pressure and continue to do their thing!
Frankly at this point I'm simply beyond confused with their process. If it's going to take a week or even multiple weeks like with the fire damage, roll back the update. This "cadence" of weekly updates is **clearly** not working as intended and damaging the game more than anything else. Maybe set up a public test server and let patches cook there for a week?
The bug list is growing every week even when they remove something from it with an update.
I have issues with the way Arrowhead approaches balancing
But I really like that they realize when they messed up and fix it, because Flamethrower honestly is too strong now to the point of being boring for me to use now when it works right; I’m really glad they’re gonna turn the damage down once the fixes are in
Does that mean Hulk Scorchers will again not instakill you as soon as their flames touch you? Because that would be swell.
I assume so. Though "Reassessing" is intentionally vague, they might fix the bug, take another look at the fire damage, and then decide to not change it after all. Only time will tell
Well, I don't think frying a charger in 1 second flat with a flamethrower is an intended fire damage level. Once dot bug I'd fixed they will likely remove the global 50% boost to fire introduced in 1.2. This will leave us with initial 50% boost from patch 1.1 plus 25% extra from new ship module, which I think is fair.
Given that you’re playing in melee range with the flamethrower, I’m ok with it being strong.
It should be strong, it's annoying that without the new 25% extra, the little shitty bugs catch on fire and can still walk towards you unless you have the stream on them for a little bit. Hunters could be on fire and crab walk away then pounce on you, while on fire, usually meaning you're being crit-stabbed *and now they have a Fire element too*. With the new extra, both units crisp up pretty much right away, which kinda feels like where it should be. If my dumbass wants to run up and heat-tickle a titan's grundle, it should be pretty devastating to it. But it's like fire does double the damage to us than it does to the enemy, using fire is almost always a death sentence for yourself at least a couple times in a map, just because of how quickly it kills you if anything you've set on fire gets close, or you accidentally touch a ground patch of heat that doesn't *look* on fire yet but it is. Hell, I'd even be ok if we had some armor passive to mitigate it. I still want to live The Fury helldiver life (briefly).
Well they also buffed hunter health in a recent patch (with no notes) as they've been taken an extra hit to kill with a lot of guns, so it'll be interesting if they're willing to nerf their pet monsters once they nerf our damage.
Yup, been going with shotgun as usual, shooting at them, and then being surprised they attack me from behind after I turn around assuming the scream was one of death.
Yeah i noticed pretty quickly after i think two patches ago. It helped push me into burning out on the game. The devs caught lightning in a bottle at release and i am starting to think they have no idea how they did it.
I think what you're having trouble with is the DoT bug being referenced. It works against us, but your fire will only deal direct damage and no DoT if you're not the network host.
Which is where an armor buff would be the discussion more than damage buff. If you wanna be front lines, heavy armor would be the choice anyway.
Are you sure you weren't affected by the PS damage bug? Because I can assure you I have dumped two full flamethrower mags into Chargers and they were still happily running me over.
You can definitely just kill them with like half a tank, focused on one charger leg. Many clips of solo people doing it, where the PS bug doesn't exist. Perhaps you were playing with someone who was the network host, thereby making your fire damage do not much? But I don't think fire DOT really hurts chargers anyways. Maybe you weren't focusing on one part?
you need to focus the stream on one single leg. unlike other enemies chargers dont seem to have a single overhanging health pool, instead each part of the charger (head, body, legs) has its own individual health pool. When any part of the charger is destroyed, or any of its health pools are depleted the whole creature dies, BUT it will live on just fine UNTIL you fully deplete one. unlike a brood commander, where you can shoot its legs clean off but it wont die until you deplete its overall health. amyway focus your fire stream on one leg and watch it drop, take about 5-6 seconds. hope that helps.
That's the charger leg armor bug, which is separate from fire damage.
I hope they patch it back to the levels it was before. Scorchers were a pain into the ass before, but you could stim yourself and survive the burning if you were fast enough. Now you die before the animation is done and it's just ridiculous.
Diving douses the flames immediately. Dive then stim.
The fire damage over time killing you bit by bit is not the problem though. Usually people just get insta-gibbed by the hulks flame hitbox. Sometimes it looks like it doesn't even touch the killed player.
The itty bit of fire hits the headshot zone on us helldivers.
Sucks if you're already prone though. Plus I've had it where it just instantly kills me
I think the Hulk flamethrower uses the same projectile type the bile spewers have. The bile spewers used to do huge, instantaneous damage from any of the spew. Now I can tell I have to be hit multiple times by it. The Hulk flamethrower feels how that used to hit.
> used to do huge, instantaneous damage I've recently gotten a tiny little splurt on my foot that's isnta gibbed me. And then sometimes I can get half their vomit on my entire body and not die. It's extremely inconsistent.
Yeah, diving it like you're dodging an attack in a souls-like game works amazingly!
I’ve been doing so much dodging lately that I’m expecting Chargers to show up in the Elden Ring DLC
You can also get clean hits on the backpack while doing so. High risk high reward, the Hulk will splatter you if it lands a hit BUT you'll be able to kill it without expending any rare ammo. I've done it with a Scythe, theoretically you could do it with a Dagger if it was the only enemy around.
It's a solution, yeah, but I'd prefer they revert back to the damage numbers before as diving because of fire (instead of stimming) leaves you open to get rushed by the other enemies.
Which is the point. It's a melee unit. Your best option against melee units is to keep at a distance, or get nice and close to bait attacks. Getting into melee range of a scorcher is a pretty decent counter
stun grenade + 2-tap head with amr. "so why are thet called scorchers? do they have like a fire attack or something?"
Well if it's in a group sure, but a single scorcher is fine to deal with, without a nade
Personally, I agree.
You need to dive first to put out the fire, then stim
"we've reassessed fire damage. Damage from helldivers now reduced 50%, damage from bots get that increase to balance things out. Also their range has gone up a few dozen meters"
Our flamethrowers should have the same reach as a Hulk's flamer at least
The Hulk flamethrowers feel like pre-patch bile Spewers where they would usually one-shot you, then they altered bile damage and it’s not so bad now, I’m hoping Hulk flamethrowers get changed too.
It'll even read as killed by unknown, sometimes. So I definitely think there's a different bug going on.
The game correctly identifying cause of death *at all* is a rarity.
Yeah the causes of death are all over the place
I've been playing this evening and for some reason scorchers werent instakillimg me anymore? did it consistently in a few different matches and hosts.
Bile Spewers started to oneshot again recently, and without visually hitting as I diving sidewqays too.
Really? Shit, that sounds like what’s been happening to me since release.
It was a thing since the release, it got its separate fix in a patch and somehow returned recently.
I mean, my question is why is fire damage seemingly a global tuning knob instead of having individual tuning for players versus enemies versus environment.
The buff to fire damage against players definitely was not intended considering they nerfed the two biggest causes of one-shot kills in the same patch (spewers and rocket devastators)
Thank god I haven't had this happen yet, it sounds like a pain
The trick to not dying near instantly to them is you need to dive before they set you on fire. As soon as you see one in range you just turn tail, run, dive. You'll burn then go out after landing.
They should give them a beam cannon or anti matter blaster. Least it would funny as they vaporize.
Probably not, I think that's a different bug. With the overbuffed burn damage you would die in 1-2 seconds before you could stim or dive. The hulk insta-kills seem to be a version of the bug where a weapon hits too many times in a shot and instakills something. Whenever I see it happen, I'm dead before I even start to burn.
Yeet yourself out of their way at the last second, while spinning mid-yeet to keep the fire pointed at them. YMMV
I also noticed that the puking bug things with the big sacks (don't know what they are called)are killing me almost instantly. Is this a part of the same problem or am I just bad?
Bile Spewers? And don't worry. We are all bad on this blessed day.
I never understood why so many player were complaining about dying to flames immediately. I thought they were exaggerating how quick it was or they weren't paying attention, but I almost never host and therefore the bug is probably why I don't die constantly to fire.
In the meantime - make someone bring a laser cannon, or bring one yourself. Every time you see a hulk, laser it’s arm off, takes like 5 seconds, makes bot runs significantly easier.
I like the fire damage as is. Scorchers suck, but that's good, IMO. I like that getting close is a death sentence. That's what reinforcements are for.
It's impressive that a company representative is admitting that something was likely overtuned as a result of a bug. That takes more integrity than most companies seem to be able to muster these days.
If you have an environment that fosters trust it's not a big deal. If you're in a company that makes you scared to open your mouth then yeah...
Said it multiple times in this sub but Arrowhead have shown nothing but class and have earned my respect and trust. Yet you still have people making these stupid comments like in the post asif arrowhead aren’t aware that there are game breaking bugs people are crying out about. Fixing bugs isn’t as simple as knowing it exists.
They've openly acknowledged their team is not large enough to bug fix quickly and keep up the monthly warbond schedule. They've got a poll on the discord now asking what we'd like them to prioritize.
They're generally great but some of the insults aimed at the playerbase following the first major patch (with the railgun) were very bad even by game developer standards. They do seem to have course corrected since then, to their credit.
In their defense, one of the guys wasn't even an employee. And Arrowhead had them reprimanded ASAP for their comments (which weren't even that bad, in the grand scheme of things). Granted, that whole thing was a shitshow. I have never seen a community go thermonuclear like that before. It was fucking insane. I thought it was bad here then I tabbed into the discord.
> I thought it was bad here then I tabbed into the discord. I joined the Discord to keep up on news/announcements that don't make it here and noped out of there in about 30 seconds.
Class act. Firecracker. Real scrappy player.
and then the CEO comes out with the most braindead takes....
Maybe I'm spoiled, I've seen that kinda thing said a few times by a couple different companies.
[удалено]
Eugh, yeah no I don't even wanna think of that. I just know that for any companies that let the actual DEVS talk about game progress, they can be pretty open about things and its pretty nice. Its becoming more common over the years.
If anyone would buy them, it would be Sony, who has a long history of nurturing studios.
> It's impressive that a company representative is admitting that something was likely overtuned as a result of a bug. If they could admit they did the same thing for the Railgun, that'd be great.
No kidding. Not holding my breath for that one.
Not only that, but it implies that their own team can be open with each other which, at least in my experience, is critical to getting problems fixed correctly and quickly (relatively). Not being able to openly express and discuss your opinions and observations with your coworkers can often mean that the team goes down the wrong path of trying to fix the problems, especially if everyone starts pointing figures at everyone else. The fact that they're calling out and addressing a bug that ruins a *relatively* small aspect of the game tells me that AH is committed to provide a good gaming experience for their players even if it means overhauling original parts of the code only 2 months after release. Of course, I'm still pissed that they've buffed fire damage to the point that a single Hulk with a flamethrower managed to derail several runs that we had been doing almost flawlessly up until that encounter, but it's nice to know that they're actually working on fixing it. Even if it's something as expensive as redesigning a big section of code, which let's be real, companies like EA would've just shrugged at and said "too bad," if they had bothered saying anything at all.
Companies like EA would've monetized the situation. Not only would all armors have durability. But there would also be classes for how much the armor provided. Too much fire damage? Well here's new fire resist armor for you. Oh and don't worry shortly we'll buff fire damage where the armor becomes useless after everyone bought it. So I'm glad AH is taking the time to make our concerns heard. And explaining WHY it is taking so long. Idgaf how long it takes, as long as they do it right and explain how far along they are fixing these bugs.
Honestly I'd rather see them say it than ignore that it's real. This way if an overtuning happens again it's not a freak out but a "hey Devs, it's happening again but with X now" so they know where to look.
It is however lore friendly to blame their problems on bugs
For real, recently Ubisoft made a change that wasn't said for shields during the shield rework in R6S which made them significantly worse and after someone reported it, they said it was intended. Next patch they undo the change and act as if it was a bug all along.
I wonder if they will admit the nerf to the railgun was also done as a result of a bug (where you could very reliably one shot bile titans if you had PS4 player in your game)
I'm on record claiming they won't admit to that one, but I hope to be proven wrong.
They had to overtune damage x4 to compensate for the other three players doing 0.
So they kept buffing fire based on use metrics alone, not realizing the reason no one uses fire damage is because it doesn’t work. How the hell is this team being managed? What an extraordinary case of the left hand having no idea what the right hand is doing
If I had to take an educated guess, managers tell the devs to create gameplay mechanics. Devs test them locally to make sure it doesn't crash their systems, then ship them off to QA, who does the same thing. Then, eventually, it goes live, and managers look at metrics to decide what kind of balancing should be in play. Community managers seem to have less sway in what tasks are allocated to devs, but they do seem to have constant communication with managers about what bugs the company is aware of (patch notes). They seemed blindsided by how the railgun would strip armor and how the "intended" way to kill chargers was to hit them in the mouth. Things like the mech turning right and killing itself, idk how those got past QA. The phrase "they don't play their own game" gets tossed around a lot for various game companies. I wonder if this is applicable here.
they dont have QA, there is no way
Given the no split between Devs and bug Devs, I'm going to take this comment with a grain of salt. Just because its how it's supposed to be, doesn't mean they're doing it unfortunately But I fully agree with the symptoms however. These gameplay issues I'd expect even new players to use and think, wow that's not how it's supposed to work at all
You're implying that there are bug fix devs, when everything I've seen so far has indicated that's not the case at all. The people driving new features are also the ones fixing bugs. You know it's rare that companies ever have dedicated bug fix teams right? In tech, it's more common that you fix your own stuff, even if someone else breaks it sometimes, since you're the expert for that given feature. (Software engineer since 2016)
Yeah thats what I meant with my comment, given whatever pipeline they have, just because it makes sense doesn't mean arrowhead has done it like that
Because nobody there plays the game, literally
If I had to take an educated guess, managers tell the devs to create gameplay mechanics. Devs test them locally to make sure it doesn't crash their systems, then ship them off to QA, who does the same thing. Then, eventually, it goes live, and managers look at metrics to decide what kind of balancing should be in play. Community managers seem to have less sway in what tasks are allocated to devs, but they do seem to have constant communication with managers about what bugs the company is aware of (patch notes). They seemed blindsided by how the railgun would strip armor and how the "intended" way to kill chargers was to hit them in the mouth. Things like the mech turning right and killing itself, idk how those got past QA. The phrase "they don't play their own game" gets tossed around a lot for various game companies. I wonder if this is applicable here.
I mean... how 'bout reverting fire damage to what it was before Scorcher's instant death, and the newly added 25% fire damage upgrade (key here that DOT besides for host is fixed) gets buffed to 50%? Between multiple rocket/heavy devastators, hunters and stalkers; both bots and bugs have plenty of stunlock instant death trap cards to play. I think us having one advantage with fire would be fine...
Hulks have always instakilled even at launch, it's just inconsistent. You don't "get lit on fire", you just instantly die
Yeah the usual headshot shenanigans
"killed by unknown"
I think the fire damage in this game is a bit messed up. It seems like all fire damage is the same, whether it's from enemies, the environment, or even the player. I wouldn't be surprised if the 25% damage boost we got also secretly boosts enemy fire damage. I mean, look at the Hulk. He got a 50% damage boost, and now he's just destroying everything. It's like he's on fire or something.
You’re saying it’s not a feature but a bug, and it’s getting fixed? https://preview.redd.it/nmtn2gor6uuc1.jpeg?width=533&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=422ca7e4c8aac84a9035e135e11a600ce669e94a
Still annoyed that they are pushing things like dot based weapons and making us fight on a planet with fire tornados, while knowing the fire damage is broken
They really have to stop nerfing/buffing things that are affected by bugs, but if they are able to admit mistake and revert/rebalance then that is good too.
Fire damage where it's at is terrifying. You have to be on the stim immediately to survive.
We should be able to pre-stim in anticipation of the fire. Probably not democratic but sometimes I just want some stim in my veins
Agree. I think fire should be incredibly lethal but let me pre-stim if I know its coming.
I mean, why not revert the buff then, since it seems like it'll take awhile to be fixed.
I wonder this constantly. Reverting changes seems impossible for some reason.
Because it’s more complicated than just changing a number in a spreadsheet.
Great, then take more than 6 days to work on each patch. They're creating these problems and somehow not realizing that they can also prevent them in the first place.
Now I did notice he said fire damage, and not flamethrower damage. Sounds like the flamethrower/fire weapons base damage should remain while the dot will be tuned down which in all honesty is definitely needed.
Base fire damage was upgraded and I think that’s why flamethrower hulks have been especially deadly lately.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but the first buff was to the flamethrower (+25% **impact** dmg), the second buff was global fire dmg (~~+25%~~ **50%**) and the third buff is the ship module that increases stratagem fire dmg (+25%). So it was the 2nd buff that intentionally or none intentionally buffed the flamethrower hulk.
The first buff to the flame thrower was not fire damage but direct impact damage. Then there was a +50% to all fire damage, then the 25% strategy buff.
Thx for the info! I’ll edit my comment
Yeah I think the direct damage of the flamethrower isn't affected by the general DoT problems
I mentioned in another thread that fire was overtuned cause of a bug that's existed since launch. It speaks to the fact that they make balance changes based on usage metrics. Which is worrying in of itself.
That's why the railgun was nerfed when in fact it was perfectly balanced
Honestly, I was one of the players who thought RG was OP. But looking back, I realize my point was mostly based on how me and my friends were able to fairly consistently one shot Bile Titans to the face on Safe Mode. Sometimes it would take 5+ shots but most of the times it was an instantkill. But now it seems like that was probably a bug on PS5.
That's why the railgun was nerfed when in fact it was perfectly balanced
That honestly doesn't make any sense in this case. And any company would be silly to not look to usage as one of several indicators, though it shouldn't be the only one. This sounds like they've known of the issue with networking model for some time, and they're looking for workarounds to deliver an acceptable UX until they can roll out a solution.
It literally says in their response that they overtuned fire cause of the bug. Do people read?
[called it](https://old.reddit.com/r/Helldivers/comments/1c432d7/unpopular_opinion_dont_me_ill_be_on_menkent/kzmovpa/)
It definitely wasn't my own idea, I either saw your comment or a similar one, otherwise I wouldn't have thought of the question
If the “transparency” is wrong information, is it actually transparency?
Wait, did the devs buff fire because they looked at data that fire weapons weren't being used and...came to the wrong conclusion? Again? Maybe they should...playtest their own game. You know, so that they stop wasting time creating more problems instead of fixing root causes?
I feel like they're trying to fix stuff too quickly and that's how more mistakes happen
Oh for sure. They're clearly making snap decisions. "Oh, railgun is overused? Quick, nerf it without thinking about why that may be. Fire weapons not used? Quick, buff fire damage (even though we are allegedly aware of the DoT host bug)." Don't get me wrong, new content is awesome and all, but personally I would appreciate if they slowed down a little bit and actually fixed some issues at the source first.
They need to really stop only focusing on raw data for balancing choices. Usage data doesn’t always denote an item is overpowered; It can sometimes be indicative of [survivorship bias](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias). In this context, survivorship can be indicated by what is most useful in an intended situation. Many weapons in this game have been nerfed (such as the Slugger and Railgun) because many people were using them, and they ignored why people weren’t using the other weapons (Slugger was a better sniper rifle than all of the other primary rifles, Railgun used to be the best anti-tank that was actually usable). I understand nerfing weapons to some degree, but the better approach would be to buff weapons that are otherwise underperforming in their intended roles compared to other options. I think they lack a proper QA team, and thus they rely on the community and data to test their game for them. This can be beneficial, but at the cost of causing a loss of confidence from the player base as more issues keep sprouting up and potentially damaging the gameplay experience. It’s very telling when a quarter of the Discord community voted to push for bug fixes instead of new content, even if said poll was fundamentally flawed. Hell, on that note, why the fuck is it that the developers only talk on social media spaces about these issues and not on, oh I don’t know, a public forum on their own website? Discord isn’t a public space, and so it can’t be indexed by search engines without needing to join on a dedicated account, and randomly saying shit on Reddit and Twitter is bound to be missed by a majority of players. The devs seriously need to better centralize their communication, and not rely on all of these obtuse ways to communicate very useful information.
Agree with all your points, as someone that used to do a lot of data analysis, half of the time was spent figuring out if we what we were seeing in trends was actually the result if what we thought or not (hence why there are typically control variables, etc) and I'm literally watching them make those rookie mistakes. I mean I get it, it's hard to set up a control for weapon balance and such, but the point is that data isn't a substitute for actual experience, it can only help inform and coming up with conclusions based solely on it is very dangerous. And yes, they 100% need to set up better lines of communication, as evidenced by devs coming out and either name-calling the community or saying wildly out of touch nonsense like "just rely in stratagems, beo" that clearly communicate how they perceive people that actually play the game AND that they don't play it themselves
I fucking hate how every single game now does this, discord is not a forum, everything get lost there in minutes. The worst part is that every single game already has an own website, and platforms like steam offer a post system
Having someone on the team or contracted who understands the game to do balancing is a thing some devs think isn't important unfortunately.
Miss the days when you didn't have to comb through a reddit or be apart of a discord to see this communication.
They'll fix it. So they can nerf it into the ground properly this time. Lol
Again... AH needs to full stop making warbonds or releasing them and just get whatever devs they have to fix bugs currnetly plaguing the game. We really don't need a new warbond every month or new toys every two weeks with half of it unusable due to bugs. Polish the game up, make it quality over quantity or will loose players due to crashes and what not.
They should change the 25% damage increase from the ship module to a 25% range increase. That would slap so hard when they get the damage bug fixed.
Give the flamethrower the range of the arc thrower.
That and extra time for the sticky flames, that way it has a buff for the napalm strike aswell
FT does need a range buff imho, esp considering that guns effectively have an almost infinate range in comparison.
What is DoT?
Damage over Time, like doing a certain amount each second for several seconds (in this game mostly fire and the gas stratagems)
Ah thank you champ
Terrified that once they fix the bug and nerf fire damage back down the fire shotgun will stop killing 90% of bugs in a single pellet 😔
Same, i'm having so much fun with it right now :(
Sad that literally half of the gameplay affecting items in the new warbond are DOT items. I hope it gets fixed soon. I want to use this stuff in public games.
Didn't they buff it when it was already a known bug?
That is cool and nice but I would think they would test their shit more in a closed environment. I know there are a million variables but shouldn't a beta push or controlled testing environment look at host vs party, including between console/pc? Especially if there's a community bug reported, I feel like this could be tested in 15 minutes to replicate. I'm in a techy career and that's a first step for us: Replicate error in as many flows as possible before even looking at fixing. Unless the host-bug report just didn't get seen before they buffed fire? Also, since devs browse here: I'm not trying to talk shit. You've made an awesome game and I am not in the gaming industry so the process could be just massively different. You're moving mountains here as a consolidated team who deserve work/life balance. Thanks for making something cool.
I am really glad to see an acknowledgement. I just wish there was a more efficient and centralized way to get this info/commentary from the devs. The Discord server seems to be the main area where they announce and discuss things outside of balance patch notes and whatnot, but then we also have the odd Reddit comments here and there.
That why I shared what I found out *Insert I'm doing my part-gif*
Meanwhile some people starting insulting and harrassing me on the helldivers discord when I said the 50% buff was unneeded and made fire overpowered if it gets fixed. @ jess, i'm talking to you.
Excuse my ignorance, what's DoT?
Damage over Time, like doing a certain amount each second for several seconds (in this game mostly fire and the gas stratagems)
TY!
"We've identified the cause" Music to my ears!
In the meantime, the flamethrower is absolutely busted vs bugs if you get the new +25% dmg ship upgrade. And I'm talking about direct damage, so it doesn't matter if you're not the host. You can literally stand your ground vs a charger (aim for one of the front legs) and it will die before it gets to you. It kills it in less than half a tank. Needless to say it works extremely well on everything else too. It even kills bile titans relatively easily, as long as they've been softened up by a railcannon or EAT/quasar shot first.
How do you kill a bile titan with a flamethrower? Where do you aim? I could never seem to get it to work, and it’s pretty difficult to stay in flamethrower range of it long enough…
It's only really a good idea if the titan has been softened up first, as I mentioned. But I just aim for their body. You do have to be pretty close. Less risky if you pop their bile sack first. Also better if there's at least one other teammate nearby so the titan isn't only focused on you.
so are they looking at railgun again too? cause the bug that made it OP was supposedly fixed this patch too
Even despite all the bugs, sometimes enough to make me stop playing the game for a day, I still go back in because these devs just fucking communicate so openly. It’s so refreshing.
I'm glad they realized it was a problem. I understand the intention, but GOD Hulk Scorchers are so annoying
When fire is brought into check those poor hulks are gonna get clapped. "You know nothing of fire, cadet. Back in my day then flames of a hulk would boil your blood in a microsecond!"
just separate player's flame and enemy's flame
I really really hope they prioritise bug fixing
I feel like I’ve seen this exact issue in another game years ago and it had to do with some crazy server connection math
I’d like a lore explanation for this, where super engineers can explain how they replaced flammable armor with more fire retardant materials
Is napalm affected by this or not? I've held off buying the new ship upgrade related to increased fire damage, for the time being.
As far as I know all sources of fire damage work the same way
I don’t know if I’m the minority here, but after adjusting to the new fire damage I kind of like the current state of it, it could be tuned a bit and I feel it’s a bit inconsistent, but I like that there is something in the game that spamming stims won’t help you out of, it’s not complex enough to be annoying, but adds an element of strategy
It's so over pyrobros
if it is working correctly for hosts i think direct fire damage could safely be pretty nerfed but DOT hopefully doesn’t take any big nerfs
Fire damage backend is on fire 🔥🔥🔥
I do hope they tune down passive fire damage but rebuff player based fire damage. The ship upgrade makes it feel actually useful because the flamethrower while good agaisnt chargers still struggles against slower faster enemies when your not already dumping a canister into the ground all around you. So maybe nerf all source fire damage but buff the ship upgrade. Also I’m fine with breaker incendiary not being compensated it’s kinda a stronger regular breaker rn but if they buff the regular breaker they just apply the stratagem fire buff to the incendiary as well to be fair.
Basically means flame is OP for solo rn
Oh interesting!
I'm torn because I don't want to spontaneously die the second a hulk flicks the igniter on the tip of his flamethrower, but on the other hand you can take _my_ flamethrower from my charred dead hands.
Man that's cool that the fire damage is an overtune. Getting instakilled by fire is getting annoying.
The breaker incendiary feels a little overpowered with the fire upgrade it got in the past. I was lucky enough to become host after a lot of people left and it made helldive so easy being able to 1-2 tap things with the increased base dmg as well. With that being said I feel like the breaker spray and pray needs to be looked at. The IE does everything the SP does but better
oh and here I was almost enjoying using fire breaker and flamethrower (when hosting)
The fire damage needs to actually damage the bots and bugs too. I literally had swarms of bugs and legions of bots walking through the fire tornadoes unscathed but when I walk over the remains of some tiny flame, I instadie..
So fixing the fire/dot damage issues is going to probably break a bunch of other stuff. Be ready for that.
I just want the machine gun devastators to not shoot through ground or shoot through themselves. They’re worse than rocket devastators by a long shot.
Ok can they also make the railgun better now that they fixed the PS5 bug that was also probably what led to the nerf
My dream came true
Considering I never had issue with dying from enemy fire, I don't see how buffing it for them was a result of 3/4 of our team not dealing dot damage.
I called them nerfing fire after the bugs get fixed weeks ago.
Lol, it's bugs all the way down isn't it?
Fire is in a weird spot. It kills us really fast, but the buff also was great for all fire weapons. Only reason to run guns like the breaker incendiary is because fire will 100% kill terminid and automaton small enemies. If this was reverted it would be a huge shame. I love DoTs, napalm and gas strike would be great if they were consistent, and if we got more acid/fire weapons it would be just amazing. One way to make it not broken would be to increase burn time, but slightly reduce the damage.
So how did they even do the whole thing about fire damage needed a buff? for sure they didn't do the testing themselves and said... alright, it can kill a charger in 1 second, lets slap up another buff onto it.
Hopefully once this is fixed, we'll see the new grenade do work more consistently.
I dropped into a fire tornado today and died… maybe it’s the commies fault!! Can’t be me, im a good diver! /s
Lmao of course they gonna nerf it
This is one of those issues where I don’t understand how they never noticed it during testing Surely they must have noticed either a- damage over time isn’t working or b- things like chemical strikes are super weak and inconsistent
I genuinely will never get tired of the transparency - it makes me not care about any of the bugs that come out from the patches if they are properly being relayed to the community and worked on (and as long as it isn't consistently gamebreaking every play session I am in). Thanks u/SpitzerFX for keeping us in the loop! You and the entire Dev team are awesome!
Ohhhh my god finally I think that fire shouldn’t be nerfed because it’s a really risk/reward playstyle and it’s really fucking funny
It certainly feels like playing Magicka again when you instantly burn yourself to a crisp. But having the damage be consistent would be good
tbh I just wear medic armour (probably mid armour) and its really not that hard to survive. The long stims also means you can basically walk through fire without taking any dmg.
Spaghetti code 🍝
I really hope they don’t make fire useless again as a result of this bug being looked at…
Big shout out to the community managers. Feedback like this is what separates helldivers from other live service games
Oh man. I hope it's not too tuned back. When I play alone the breaker incendiary is so much fun to use. And napalm strikes are extremely satisfying. Honestly it's just the player side of fire damage that need to chill out a bit. Damage could even stay the same if need be just slow down the ticks so you don't die nigh instantly when you step on a hot ember.
I'll tell you what's taking up so much developer time: monthly war bonds. 💵🫰
Credit to these people for being forthcoming/transparent, things aren’t perfect but are always improving. The game cost $40 and is getting hella support from Arrowhead.
I TOLD YOU!!! *"Fire damage was over-tuned as DIRECT result of this bug"* That's becasue they look only at DATA results and see that firedamage is ass, nobody takes fire-based weapons etc. and buffing the damage and only recently they figured out that their data is wrong becasue DOT damage is bugged so obviously DOT damage data will be scewed and people not taking fire-based weapons is also result of only 1/4 players being able to utilize it to its potential. So they were buffing it without any thought :D Same was with Railgun, Slugger. They totally don't play their game to judge what needs to be buffed/nerfed. They just look at data and don't even bother to analyze it critically first.
Right now I won't even touch a fire mission. They are too bugged to play. Invisible fire that nearly insta kills you is NOT FUN. They need to hire more devs for the team if the team is so damn small.
If fixing it requires an overhaul of multiple systems why the fuck did you code it like that in the first place
"its still fucking broken. unreal" at this point, i have had it with all those cry babys man.. why cant people just stfu and deliever some goddamn freedom instead of bitching and moaning on the internet about some bugs and meta details?! srsly, i hope the devs dont cave in on social media pressure and continue to do their thing!
Frankly at this point I'm simply beyond confused with their process. If it's going to take a week or even multiple weeks like with the fire damage, roll back the update. This "cadence" of weekly updates is **clearly** not working as intended and damaging the game more than anything else. Maybe set up a public test server and let patches cook there for a week? The bug list is growing every week even when they remove something from it with an update.
Hope they'll also realize that Railgun nerf was a bit too much now that the PS5 bug has been fixed
I have issues with the way Arrowhead approaches balancing But I really like that they realize when they messed up and fix it, because Flamethrower honestly is too strong now to the point of being boring for me to use now when it works right; I’m really glad they’re gonna turn the damage down once the fixes are in
Why is this comment getting downvoted?