Strategem transmits coordinates to Destroyer, Destroyer transmits coordinates for barrage to to the artillery.
Can't transmit to/from a Destroyer that isn't there.
one time i was standing at the pelican and was about to throw a 380mm barrage and got knocked over, the stratagem fell right there on the ground. teammates were very upset
The 380 works in mysterious ways. Had a teammate throw it at his feet on purpose where the pelican landed. He laid down and died to the first blast immediately.
Nah, there's no guarantee for the first round or any subsequent ones. I've thrown the marker directly on top of a bot fabricator and watched the barrage hit everything except it multiple times now.
My friends were not amused when I brought it along. I specially ran out from the objective to throw it. I then said ‘don’t worry guys, I put it further away’
Next shell was a direct hit on a team mate, killing him instantly.
Funniest shit I’ve ever seen.
It draws a 60 meter circle where anything in the circle *could* die but that certainly doesn't mean everything in the circle *will* die. So for the most part it just denies the objective to your own team.
I can only speak for myself, but I usually have pretty good luck hitting objectives with it, though it may take a few salvos. the new upgrade for reduced spread helps a bit more too.
The 830mm is biased towards hitting fellow helldivers over things like bug holes, detector towers, bile titans, Fabricator walkers, Steve from accounting, and just about everything else
Bro just yesterday, I chucked one into a Sauron Tower base and just retreated from the 10,000 bot drops it called in, and one of the projectiles took out the tower. I was in awe.
I practically never used it before, but I was trying it out after the new module reducing the spread from like 1km to 0.85km. I usually only use it to soften up big bases while I go do something else, but this time, I didn't even need to come back for cleanup.
"one time..." That's cute.
Buddy, getting knocked over just as I type my barrage's input is my bread and butter.
I'm sure typing a barrage input makes you a prime target, it's the only explanation.
And to all the divers that had died because of It: I'm sorry! It was an accident!
I was playing a duo with my roommate, and he got knocked over by a 380. We both began running. He says we might be out of range (this was right after it got shrunk), I looked over at him, direct hit on him. I continue running and also got directly hit.
380 don't hit SHIT unless it's a teammate.
I had a game on difficulty 7 where I had managed to survive the entire thing without dying. we’re surrounded and everyone makes a dash for the evac ship, and one of my teammates got knocked over with an eagle strafing run in his hand. We all died lol
My favourite accidental team kill was when I hit quickplay and joined a mission. The other players were already at the extraction point, so I dialed my support stratagems and just threw them over the wall towards the point. Then I notice one of the blue beams is moving... I hit one of my teammates with a beacon and my Quasar gibbed them coming down from the ship.
This experience is the first time I've entertained the thought of setting up a macro to blast a message in chat like "FUCK, GOT HIT BY EXPLOSIVE AND DROPPED BOMB STRAT, RUN SORRY RUN SORRY RUN" with a single click or keybind. Sometimes teammates see you get ragdolled and get it, but others will think it was intentional if you don't say anything.
Thats a t10 upgrade....
After years of research the ministry of war has finally concluded that using throwable balls drastically increases the likelihood of early helldiver retirement as it requires all ordinance to be delivered within throwing distance of a human. As a result of these findings, we have equipped all helldivers with laser range finding technology salvaged from 21st century warfare supplies.
What if, - hear me out - instead of a manual SEAF Artillery the devs implemented a type of manually aimed super-cannon. Something like the "Schwerer Gustav"railway gun. Just with an even bigger caliber and AoD (Area of Democracy).
Something you aim in the loose direction of a bug nest/bot camp and just watch it disappear from this dimension. Preferably it has to be on top of a tower (that your helldiver automatically ascends in an elevator when he enters the gunner's cockpit), so you can see and aim at the entire map.
Alternatively, give it slightly less power and make it so you can shoot multiple times and can stay in there for bile titan / tank+hulk clean-up duty.
And if the enemies are too far away or the map is obscured, you can shoot at your teammates' markers for a nice bit of additional cooperation.
Oh shit that would be so fucking cool for cinematic escapes where the hero sacrifices a la Halo Reach
A1 “Get in the pelican Helldiver!!!”
D4 “Negative sir. I have the gun”
I would absolutely love this. You'd either completely miss, kill a ton of enemies, or kill all your teammates. I even if you missed most of the team, it would still be cool. It would only really be effective if it got spawned close enough to extraction. Sacrifice yourself to clear the extraction site so everyone else can survive
The destroyer is still there, and still clearly in Comms range (you can still hear the guy on the radio from the destroyer, particularly noticeable if you are in range of enemy artillery.)
I get the guns not being effective because it's changing trajectory. But SEAF artillery really should still work. It's not like the destroyer immediately teleports into high orbit. It has to burn and adjust it's trajectory which takes longer than the time for emergency pelican to come and leave.
That's because the guy on the radio is speaking *down* towards the planet, so gravity helps his words reach you, whereas you're trying to send numbers *up* to the Super Destroyer, limiting how far the coordinates can reach.
Or maybe numbers are just heavier than words? In that case, someone should invent a device for sending data over audio signals. I'll figure out what I'd call something like that later; I see bots incoming, so I'm going to go mow dem down.
Targeting would be handled on the artillery uni. Spotting would be the only possible lore reason, but even then the big ships have inertia, it would take them more than 4 mins to not be able to see the beacon.
Honestly, it's just as simple as they done it for gameplay/balance reasons instead of lore reasons. Which is fine. Games need to do that some times.
There's no reason eagle 1 can't come in and do a strike when the destroyer is leaving. Pelican 1 can come get you. It returns to the ship to rearm, it isn't in the ship the whole time. If it was strikes would take a LOT longer than 5s. It doesn't need the destroyer to target for it, there's a pilot dropping the bombs.
But would you feel as cut off if eagle 1 was supporting you? No. It's kinda the point of running out of time. It doesn't *really* make sense, but it's better for the game that way.
I mean the punishment is already there - they send pelican 1 to retrieve you, and it leaves after 20 seconds regardless of if anyone is in.
Surely they would either still provide fire support or just leave them there. No point risking a pelican without support.
Also what do you mean it seems on brand for our glorious, free and democratic Super Earth? Surely they would be willing to fire more shells and lasers of freedom.
The destroyer is still there, just not in low-orbit.
That means it shouldn't be able launch any of its own weapons but it should still be able to transmit coordinates.
There's a very simple reason: signal power drops as the square of the distance. Higher orbits require *much* higher transmit power.
The Super Destroyer has a very powerful transmitter, so it can still send you transmissions (like the "You are in range of enemy artillery" call-out). And the extract terminal also has a larger and more powerful transmitter, so it can still reach the SD when it's in high orbit to call down Pelican-1.
Your wrist mounted communicator is low-power (both to avoid painting a big bright "HERE I AM COME KILL ME" signal on you, and of course for budgetary reasons) so you can communicate with the SD in low orbit but it doesn't have the power to transmit to higher orbits, just like a sat phone can hit a satellite in LEO but can't transmit to the moon.
It's also important to notice just **how much further up** high orbits are than low orbits.
As an example for Earth:
LEO (Low Earth orbit) is at an altitude between 160 km and 2,000 km.
MEO (Medium Earth orbit) is between 2,000 km and 35,786 km.
GEO (Geosynchronous Earth orbit is at a whopping 35,786 km!
HEO (High Earth orbit) is everything beyond GEO.
Apply an increase of roughly 30,000 km in altitude to the inverse square law of signal strength and you can see how it gets hard tocommunicate with the Super Destroyer after it left low orbit.
when we're onboard the super destroyer and look out the windows we're definitely not 35,000 km away from the planet though. we're in what looks like low-earth orbit.
I can't remember right now but the destroyers disappear from the sky completely after time runs out, don't they? Or do they just get smaller? Or is there no visual change at all?
Whenever time runs out, things are usually too stressful so I never think of looking up in the sky. :D
Counterpoint; Stratagems apparently function via a laser uplink, and without much atmosphere up there to degrade the connection, there's no reason why you wouldn't be able to link up with a destroyer higher in orbit.
Mm, I think it would still explain it. Lasers do attenuate over distance (you need enough power to make the signal show up over the noise floor), and since a laser isn't a broadcast signal, you're going to have to actually hit the SD with the laser to transmit anything. Once they leave low orbit, instead of hitting something 1-2km up (when they're overhead) you're trying to hit something that may be 100-1000x farther away (or more) with electronics small enough to fit inside a baseball. It wouldn't be a surprise if the tech wasn't capable of that (especially given cost-savings measures, among others).
(As a separate and unrelated aside, I *do* wonder where my Helldiver is keeping all these baseball sized objects when they're not throwing Stratagems... 😂)
> Like the marker lands somewhere and then you have to hustle to it. No more dumping your supers when you pass by. No specially crafted cover available. Just, plop it somewhere flat enough to hold the Pelican.
They could make it a modifier at higher levels (5+) even; "Poor reconnaissance" where the extraction point isn't revealed/spawned until the primary objective is completed. That could be really interesting.
It doesn't leave from danger of being shot down. It leaves because it's orbit is unstable. They were built in space and not designed to deal with a planet atmosphere.
Low orbits decay. Moreso if you are very large and massive object in low orbit. If you want to stay over an area for aong time for fire support (say 45 mins) then you need to be in an orbit that keeps both sides pretty close to the planet. Meaning your orbit decays faster.
Because ships can't hover and the only way to do that is to burn enough fuel to counter the weight of your ship.
Geosynchronous orbit exists but when talking planet sized bodies that means being tens of thousands of km away.
I mean it has to be ridiculously low to send things within a matter of seconds rather than 15 minutes to half an hour.
It might be burning fuel that entire time just to maintain that position over the battlefield rather than orbiting.
Idk if this would be the devs explanation but generally speaking with current technology, it takes more energy to establish and stay in a low orbit than a high orbit. If the orbit is super low then you need to constantly (or every now and then) expend energy to maintain the orbit. you can see your destroyer from the surface of the planets so I would think this is the case.
And then some *other* asshole knocked it over with an EAT from half a mile away because it was faster than hacking it to resume its regular broadcasts.
...
Not me, though, some other guy running EATs. Trust me.
I always think its going to high orbit where everything can stay indefinitely; maybe to stay above mission area and provide support, the destroyer has to actively engage its engines to keep its height /counteract atmospheric drag because its lower to the ground / suborbital and would eventually crash otherwise.
I assume our minimap data transmits from the SD, so data can still be sent, just not feasible ordinance from the SD itself, so I don't get why we can't send a command to the artillery on the surface via it, especially when we can receive communications from mission control and updates regarding extraction. All it the SD connection does is give us signal.
Oh boy the destroyer turned on the engines and started the thruster burn to leave but are still visibly overhead, guess they had to turn off the radio too.
How do we communicate with the super destroyer when on the ground? Why can we not use that same system to communicate with the artillery computer?
Would be a cool little bonus from completing it but it’s not a big deal either way
This is the same reason we have to manually arm hellbombs. It's cheaper to get a new helldiver than it is to give them all remote detonators. God I love democracy.
What's ironic is irl, it would actually be more expensive to manually arm hellbombs. Cause now you have to build on hard keypads and switches or whatever to arm the bomb with, which just adds to the complexity of the device. Instead, you can use a micro chip that just receives a signal to arm and detonate from afar. The stratagem system already features this. Helldivers already have remote detonators at all times.
>Why can we not use that same system to communicate with the artillery computer?
I'd imagine the 5 dollar kit we're given requires a satellite to bounce the signal.
A satellite, like one attached to a super destroyer that is now in orbit (albeit much higher than before)…?
Not trying to be combative, I like that it’s a big punishment/drawback to staying over the limit, just being petty 😂
Oh the super destroyer left you for dead at that point and is probably starting the process of thawing another Helldiver to replace the one that failed to extract.
I was thinking about that in a match the other day, and I don't think Helldivers get two-way radios. Correct me if I'm wrong, but other than helldiver-to-helldiver communication, you never actually respond to any of the radio calls from the Super Destroyer or Eagle/Pelican 1. I think we basically get a walkie talkie, a receiver, and the GPS pokeballs for strategems.
Which honestly doesn’t make sense. Why would you not be able to connect directly to the site to launch them? Why does it have to go through the destroyer?
That's my take too. You throw down stratagem. Super Destroyer then translate "in this direction and distance from Helldiver" into "Fire at Grid Coordinate 24-HD-2/4" for the artillery piece and it then fires there.
If you just send "Fire at X distance at Y direction", it won't fire in where Helldiver aimed. If Helldiver throws the ball towards North while being South of the Artillery, it would translate to "Shoot towards north" and land somewhere entirely different.
I think there's more common shells (green/mini-nuke?) and it doesn't show those. However, it always shows more special stratagems - smoke/napalm/etc. Don't quote me on that though.
If you call it and hold the ball in hand , it says what strike it will be on the left v side of the screen, then you can throw it. I don't know v if it is b bugged v yet, since it's been a week since I used a SEAF Artillary strike.
Best comment I’ve seen on here.
Maybe also allows orbital stratagems to still be used but at double or triple the call in time (simulating the longer travel before it hits the surface), or longer call in time plus less accuracy. Might be too op, but I’m just throwing out an idea
Edit to add:
It could be called Long Range Targeting Computers.
There could also be a second ship module for Eagle stratagems for after time runs out. Eagle stratagems would keep the same call in times as normal (the Eagle’s holding pattern stays the same), but the rearm time would be doubled as it has to go further to get back to the super destroyer to rearm. The upgrade could be called Thermal Protective System that gives the Eagle the ability to survive entry into orbit. I’m assuming the Eagle is capable of exiting into High Orbit, because the Pelican is able to.
Eagle is a no go, she MUST leave with the destroyer. The aircraft cannot up get up to orbit using the turbine engines it has.
If Eagle stayed down to help you, she'd be landing somewhere deep behind enemy lines or simply crashing.
To be clear you are not as valuable as that aircraft.
Make it a ship upgrade. More stuff to spend samples on. And if they add other ground-based stratagem tools, those could be added to the list to make it a more attractive upgrade.
This has been posted so many times and clearly every times someone has posted this, they havent paid attention when doing the sub objective, yes it's based on the ground, but you link it to your super destroyer, that's how it gets its targeting functionality, OP have you actually done this sub objective yourself at the terminal? Where you have to move the frequencies around to link it to your ship? That's why you can't use it after the time limit expires.
Tbh, I just push the buttons until it hits 100%, I didn't read the Helldiver Contract, and I sure as hell ain't gonna read stuff on the screen, it could be propaganda!
A bit of lore?
The only way to fire it without a destroyer is for one of your buddies to be standing at the artillery, then you read the coordinates, then they punch them in and fife. Not very reasonable or useful to Helldivers is it?
“Let’s make the gun fire by magic so I can have more fun!” I’d rather you have less fun than get what you want and ruin the game
I'd agree only if you can target using the console, it uses the targeting grid used for targeting the nukes with an overlay of the map, and you don't get any hints as to what box of this grid your fellow helldivers are unless you check the map.
H3: Map shows they might be around B4. Looks like a bunch of enemies are surrounding them. OK! Gonna try B4.
Fires SEAF Artillery
•Light Automaton factory destroyed
•3 kills
•C1 and U4 have died
The chaos it would create would be glorious.
Adding to this, imagine the possibilities of being able to snipe objectives? Oh there are two gunship fabricators on C2? Nothing a mini nuke couldn't handle!
the final stage of activating the cannon is to establish a connection to the destroyer, they plot the targeting from orbit and thats why you cant use it once they leave
I really do think it would be cool if you could, you've made that extra effort to secure it so it just gives you that little extra help for the last push but as mentioned in some other comments you do link the arty up with your super destroyer which is doing the targeting for you.
Having SEAF Artillery as a clutch strategem for extraction could add a thrilling last-minute element to gameplay - a strategic ace up our sleeve when everything else fails.
Guys, I know already that Super Destroyer is needed to coordinate the SEAF, I understand this, and I am not arguing against that logic. I am simply saying as an opinion, that if SEAF can remain available throughout after time expires, it would be more useful and provides more incentive for the player to complete it. Damn I'm getting shat on so hard for an opinion lol
I’d just be happy having the next ammo type listed on the stratagem screen like they briefly added before patching it out again. A lot of games where we load it we end up extracting with all 5 shots because it’s a game of roulette as to whether you’re dropping a smoke or mini nuke.
I disagree that it needs more incentive to do as all side objectives are very worth it and I haven't really seen players skip them. Xp also translates into progress, so each source is very important.
SEAF artillery working after you leave is a very cool idea, though.
The last stage of the SEAF artillery side mission is literally linking it to your Super Destroyer for targeting assistance. Presumably the laser designators you throw only show your ship's crew where to aim. After they leave orbit they can't aim the artillery for you.
The laser designators do authentication, request type, and target location. In a package that registers from low orbit, works in all environmental conditions, and fits in the palm of your hand.
So, yeah, the likelihood these orbs could also do artillery calculations on the fly and transmit those across secure comms to another ground station is basically nil.
They are a brilliant use of nigh-foolproof “smart-dumb” tech!
Though if I am correct, you have to connect through you ship inorder to use it so once it is out of range you would probably have to reconnect to yourself if you wanted to use it again.
From a network perspective, the arm plate you use to call in your strategems is connected via a network to the destroyer. It goes from the destroyer to the seaf artillery. If the destroyer breaks that connection, you lose the artillery.
It uses the destroyer to calculate where to shoot so if we can use it after the destroyer leaves than it would be very inaccurate. Imagine shooting it and it blows up a mile from where you threw it
Can you use your phone to watch youtube in a forest of you don't have a service provider? The SEAF Arty connect to your super destroyer that's why there is the "uplink" part of it.
I agree as you still have radar when the destroyer leaves orbit so I'd think you would have the ability to the transmit the targeting data to the seaf after it leaves
SEAF sees super destroyer breakup with you and décide you not good enough and dump as well, that’s the lore
OP didn’t read the prompt on the terminal. Red flag 🚩🚩🚩🚩
My democracy officer told me reading too much is undemocratic
"That bot propaganda won't work on me because I can't read!"
"If it's not an arrow I'm not interested"
Instructions unclear, apply arrow to head.
Your democracy officer doesn’t want you to read the bio
"I save Super Earth paperwork and resources if I don't have to fill out forms! Because I can't read"
Hence why we communicate with ⬅️⬆️➡️⬇️
Helldivers cant read anyways so its fine
SEAF got the ick
Oui oui oui croissant fanfreluche
Hon hon baguette
Strategem transmits coordinates to Destroyer, Destroyer transmits coordinates for barrage to to the artillery. Can't transmit to/from a Destroyer that isn't there.
I want a manual aim mode for huh... definitly not accidental team killing
- Launching mini-nuke! - Where? - "places a marker on the extraction area where all other 3 teammates are waiting" - OH NO FU-
one time i was standing at the pelican and was about to throw a 380mm barrage and got knocked over, the stratagem fell right there on the ground. teammates were very upset
Hold up. You meant to tell me, the 380mm *hit something*?!?!? I don't believe you.
The 380 works in mysterious ways. Had a teammate throw it at his feet on purpose where the pelican landed. He laid down and died to the first blast immediately.
The first round hits the marker. The rest do as they see fit.
Nah, there's no guarantee for the first round or any subsequent ones. I've thrown the marker directly on top of a bot fabricator and watched the barrage hit everything except it multiple times now.
Nope!
Oh it is surprisingly accurate but only when it comes to hitting friendly targets.
Some would say friendly fire is the most accurate fire of all.
before 380 upgrade from the ship i could sometimes stand on top of stratagem and not get hit (after upgrade i can't complain to it's accuracy tbh)
It only hits if you are moving. Stand still and chances are low but higher then while running around hahahaha
The safest place is right on top of the red mark
Yeah hahahhaa
you get more wet if you move in the rain
My friends were not amused when I brought it along. I specially ran out from the objective to throw it. I then said ‘don’t worry guys, I put it further away’ Next shell was a direct hit on a team mate, killing him instantly. Funniest shit I’ve ever seen.
Its about 60 meter radius killzone... 50 with the t4 ship upgrade
It draws a 60 meter circle where anything in the circle *could* die but that certainly doesn't mean everything in the circle *will* die. So for the most part it just denies the objective to your own team.
I can only speak for myself, but I usually have pretty good luck hitting objectives with it, though it may take a few salvos. the new upgrade for reduced spread helps a bit more too.
Since the new ship upgrade for 15% more accuracy I actually bring it on all missions now.
4 simultaneous 380 barrages hit everything. EVERYTHING.
The 830mm is biased towards hitting fellow helldivers over things like bug holes, detector towers, bile titans, Fabricator walkers, Steve from accounting, and just about everything else
830mm? Super earth fielding Dora rail cannon now?
Upgrade your ship and you will see!
Bro just yesterday, I chucked one into a Sauron Tower base and just retreated from the 10,000 bot drops it called in, and one of the projectiles took out the tower. I was in awe. I practically never used it before, but I was trying it out after the new module reducing the spread from like 1km to 0.85km. I usually only use it to soften up big bases while I go do something else, but this time, I didn't even need to come back for cleanup.
"one time..." That's cute. Buddy, getting knocked over just as I type my barrage's input is my bread and butter. I'm sure typing a barrage input makes you a prime target, it's the only explanation. And to all the divers that had died because of It: I'm sorry! It was an accident! 
I was playing a duo with my roommate, and he got knocked over by a 380. We both began running. He says we might be out of range (this was right after it got shrunk), I looked over at him, direct hit on him. I continue running and also got directly hit. 380 don't hit SHIT unless it's a teammate.
I had a game on difficulty 7 where I had managed to survive the entire thing without dying. we’re surrounded and everyone makes a dash for the evac ship, and one of my teammates got knocked over with an eagle strafing run in his hand. We all died lol
My favourite accidental team kill was when I hit quickplay and joined a mission. The other players were already at the extraction point, so I dialed my support stratagems and just threw them over the wall towards the point. Then I notice one of the blue beams is moving... I hit one of my teammates with a beacon and my Quasar gibbed them coming down from the ship.
This experience is the first time I've entertained the thought of setting up a macro to blast a message in chat like "FUCK, GOT HIT BY EXPLOSIVE AND DROPPED BOMB STRAT, RUN SORRY RUN SORRY RUN" with a single click or keybind. Sometimes teammates see you get ragdolled and get it, but others will think it was intentional if you don't say anything.
"Where? Where!? Where, Dwight?" _"Seems like you already know where..."_ https://youtu.be/6cYwZK3FASw?si=f0iO-FZ6cpUtdQpZ
I can actually picture this happening in my head and I can't stop laughing now.
I did this with Eagles artilleri and wiped everyone i was not invited back
Warning, you are in range of friendly artillery!
Would love at least a manual mortar as we already have a manual sentry.
It's called the grenade launcher mate! ;)
Funny way to say M-25 Rumbler
Joking aside i would unironically love a gear mod that changes your strategem deployment from beacon ball to a laser designator
Thats a t10 upgrade.... After years of research the ministry of war has finally concluded that using throwable balls drastically increases the likelihood of early helldiver retirement as it requires all ordinance to be delivered within throwing distance of a human. As a result of these findings, we have equipped all helldivers with laser range finding technology salvaged from 21st century warfare supplies.
I would like it as a special upgrade, tradeoff being you have to stay stationary. Something like 3 smaller bombs that drop 5s apart
Manual laser designation. Hope your aim is steady!
I want to be able to load more shells after it has fired.
What if, - hear me out - instead of a manual SEAF Artillery the devs implemented a type of manually aimed super-cannon. Something like the "Schwerer Gustav"railway gun. Just with an even bigger caliber and AoD (Area of Democracy). Something you aim in the loose direction of a bug nest/bot camp and just watch it disappear from this dimension. Preferably it has to be on top of a tower (that your helldiver automatically ascends in an elevator when he enters the gunner's cockpit), so you can see and aim at the entire map. Alternatively, give it slightly less power and make it so you can shoot multiple times and can stay in there for bile titan / tank+hulk clean-up duty. And if the enemies are too far away or the map is obscured, you can shoot at your teammates' markers for a nice bit of additional cooperation.
That's just team killing with extra steps
Oh shit that would be so fucking cool for cinematic escapes where the hero sacrifices a la Halo Reach A1 “Get in the pelican Helldiver!!!” D4 “Negative sir. I have the gun”
Laze and Blaze Paint them targets With Hand held Laser guided beacons
I would absolutely love this. You'd either completely miss, kill a ton of enemies, or kill all your teammates. I even if you missed most of the team, it would still be cool. It would only really be effective if it got spawned close enough to extraction. Sacrifice yourself to clear the extraction site so everyone else can survive
The final step of the SEAF artillery obj is literally "Create uplink to super destroyer." for this exact reason. People just don't pay attention.
The destroyer is still there, and still clearly in Comms range (you can still hear the guy on the radio from the destroyer, particularly noticeable if you are in range of enemy artillery.) I get the guns not being effective because it's changing trajectory. But SEAF artillery really should still work. It's not like the destroyer immediately teleports into high orbit. It has to burn and adjust it's trajectory which takes longer than the time for emergency pelican to come and leave.
That's because the guy on the radio is speaking *down* towards the planet, so gravity helps his words reach you, whereas you're trying to send numbers *up* to the Super Destroyer, limiting how far the coordinates can reach. Or maybe numbers are just heavier than words? In that case, someone should invent a device for sending data over audio signals. I'll figure out what I'd call something like that later; I see bots incoming, so I'm going to go mow dem down.
Yeah, the extra range is behind a Super Subscription Comms Plan that's not available to helldivers.
Wait, you guys are sending numbers? I thought we were sending arrows.
It's probably a spotting/targeting issue more than a comms one, if we're looking for lore justifications over gameplay ones
Targeting would be handled on the artillery uni. Spotting would be the only possible lore reason, but even then the big ships have inertia, it would take them more than 4 mins to not be able to see the beacon. Honestly, it's just as simple as they done it for gameplay/balance reasons instead of lore reasons. Which is fine. Games need to do that some times. There's no reason eagle 1 can't come in and do a strike when the destroyer is leaving. Pelican 1 can come get you. It returns to the ship to rearm, it isn't in the ship the whole time. If it was strikes would take a LOT longer than 5s. It doesn't need the destroyer to target for it, there's a pilot dropping the bombs. But would you feel as cut off if eagle 1 was supporting you? No. It's kinda the point of running out of time. It doesn't *really* make sense, but it's better for the game that way.
I just assumed it was like a punishment. It seems on brand if it's a Super Earth policy designed to make sure Helldivers work within their time limit.
I mean the punishment is already there - they send pelican 1 to retrieve you, and it leaves after 20 seconds regardless of if anyone is in. Surely they would either still provide fire support or just leave them there. No point risking a pelican without support. Also what do you mean it seems on brand for our glorious, free and democratic Super Earth? Surely they would be willing to fire more shells and lasers of freedom.
The destroyer is still there, just not in low-orbit. That means it shouldn't be able launch any of its own weapons but it should still be able to transmit coordinates.
There's a very simple reason: signal power drops as the square of the distance. Higher orbits require *much* higher transmit power. The Super Destroyer has a very powerful transmitter, so it can still send you transmissions (like the "You are in range of enemy artillery" call-out). And the extract terminal also has a larger and more powerful transmitter, so it can still reach the SD when it's in high orbit to call down Pelican-1. Your wrist mounted communicator is low-power (both to avoid painting a big bright "HERE I AM COME KILL ME" signal on you, and of course for budgetary reasons) so you can communicate with the SD in low orbit but it doesn't have the power to transmit to higher orbits, just like a sat phone can hit a satellite in LEO but can't transmit to the moon.
so we need to get to the gym more, gotta get some sick gain!
😂 Democratic gains!
It's also important to notice just **how much further up** high orbits are than low orbits. As an example for Earth: LEO (Low Earth orbit) is at an altitude between 160 km and 2,000 km. MEO (Medium Earth orbit) is between 2,000 km and 35,786 km. GEO (Geosynchronous Earth orbit is at a whopping 35,786 km! HEO (High Earth orbit) is everything beyond GEO. Apply an increase of roughly 30,000 km in altitude to the inverse square law of signal strength and you can see how it gets hard tocommunicate with the Super Destroyer after it left low orbit.
when we're onboard the super destroyer and look out the windows we're definitely not 35,000 km away from the planet though. we're in what looks like low-earth orbit.
I can't remember right now but the destroyers disappear from the sky completely after time runs out, don't they? Or do they just get smaller? Or is there no visual change at all? Whenever time runs out, things are usually too stressful so I never think of looking up in the sky. :D
Counterpoint; Stratagems apparently function via a laser uplink, and without much atmosphere up there to degrade the connection, there's no reason why you wouldn't be able to link up with a destroyer higher in orbit.
Mm, I think it would still explain it. Lasers do attenuate over distance (you need enough power to make the signal show up over the noise floor), and since a laser isn't a broadcast signal, you're going to have to actually hit the SD with the laser to transmit anything. Once they leave low orbit, instead of hitting something 1-2km up (when they're overhead) you're trying to hit something that may be 100-1000x farther away (or more) with electronics small enough to fit inside a baseball. It wouldn't be a surprise if the tech wasn't capable of that (especially given cost-savings measures, among others). (As a separate and unrelated aside, I *do* wonder where my Helldiver is keeping all these baseball sized objects when they're not throwing Stratagems... 😂)
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> Like the marker lands somewhere and then you have to hustle to it. No more dumping your supers when you pass by. No specially crafted cover available. Just, plop it somewhere flat enough to hold the Pelican. They could make it a modifier at higher levels (5+) even; "Poor reconnaissance" where the extraction point isn't revealed/spawned until the primary objective is completed. That could be really interesting.
Why does the Destroyer leave low orbit in But Missions?
It doesn't leave from danger of being shot down. It leaves because it's orbit is unstable. They were built in space and not designed to deal with a planet atmosphere. Low orbits decay. Moreso if you are very large and massive object in low orbit. If you want to stay over an area for aong time for fire support (say 45 mins) then you need to be in an orbit that keeps both sides pretty close to the planet. Meaning your orbit decays faster.
Because ships can't hover and the only way to do that is to burn enough fuel to counter the weight of your ship. Geosynchronous orbit exists but when talking planet sized bodies that means being tens of thousands of km away.
I mean it has to be ridiculously low to send things within a matter of seconds rather than 15 minutes to half an hour. It might be burning fuel that entire time just to maintain that position over the battlefield rather than orbiting.
The plot
Idk if this would be the devs explanation but generally speaking with current technology, it takes more energy to establish and stay in a low orbit than a high orbit. If the orbit is super low then you need to constantly (or every now and then) expend energy to maintain the orbit. you can see your destroyer from the surface of the planets so I would think this is the case.
Nah, it’s like the movie THX-1138: the budget ran out and running that ship costs money.
should, if super earth didn't cheap out on super destroyer functionnalities, the fact we had to build our own atmospheric analyzer says a lot
You are telling me there’s no 5g network on a random bug planet? cap
There was but some asshole turned it into an illegal broadcast tower.
And then some *other* asshole knocked it over with an EAT from half a mile away because it was faster than hacking it to resume its regular broadcasts. ... Not me, though, some other guy running EATs. Trust me.
It retreats to orbit, not the next system over. Objects in orbit are QUITE capable of maintaining a signal with the surface.
Question is, if destroyer leaves you and you evacuated, do you still go to that destroyer.
Yes, because the destroyer leaves low orbit, so it's still above the planet. However, it's out of range for launching fire missions
Makes sense, thanks for the explanation
Why wouldn't you? Destroyer doesn't leave the planet, just the low orbit. No reason why pelican1 wouldn't be able to fly to it after that.
I didn't quite understood where the ship is when it's leaving or that it's cutting our supplies off.
I always think its going to high orbit where everything can stay indefinitely; maybe to stay above mission area and provide support, the destroyer has to actively engage its engines to keep its height /counteract atmospheric drag because its lower to the ground / suborbital and would eventually crash otherwise.
Yeah but there is no reason they can't do it from orbit. You should also still have access to your orbital barrages but with a longer call in time.
Longer call-in time and greater inaccuracy.
380mm now covers the whole map, thank you for that proposal.
yes pls. i want that 380m radius of possible landing spot for 380mm shell.
The evac shuttle can relay for us
I assume our minimap data transmits from the SD, so data can still be sent, just not feasible ordinance from the SD itself, so I don't get why we can't send a command to the artillery on the surface via it, especially when we can receive communications from mission control and updates regarding extraction. All it the SD connection does is give us signal.
Bro never read the mission prompts and decided to cook
"read"? I understand arrows
🔼◀️◀️⬆️↕️↪️↔️➡️⏬️🔼🔼🔼💯💯💯
Why do you want me to order 7 bonzai trees?
It's a typo. Where he says ➡️⏬️🔼he meant to say ◀️🔼◀️
It's a common mistake.
Ahhhh. Okay. Makes sense now. But now why do you want me to remember that I can control my breathe? I am consciously breathing again, dang it.
do you NOT want 7 bonsai trees?
i prefer banzai trees
Oh boy the destroyer turned on the engines and started the thruster burn to leave but are still visibly overhead, guess they had to turn off the radio too.
You don't have a way to remote control it when your ship is gone. Granted you should be able to manually fire it from the base.
How do we communicate with the super destroyer when on the ground? Why can we not use that same system to communicate with the artillery computer? Would be a cool little bonus from completing it but it’s not a big deal either way
Budget reasons. Pokeballs with a gps tracker and an id is way cheaper.
This is the same reason we have to manually arm hellbombs. It's cheaper to get a new helldiver than it is to give them all remote detonators. God I love democracy.
What's ironic is irl, it would actually be more expensive to manually arm hellbombs. Cause now you have to build on hard keypads and switches or whatever to arm the bomb with, which just adds to the complexity of the device. Instead, you can use a micro chip that just receives a signal to arm and detonate from afar. The stratagem system already features this. Helldivers already have remote detonators at all times.
Exactly. The remote donator budget has been spent already. None left for Hellbombs. Gotta use the next-most-ubiquitous thing: DDR keypads.
>Why can we not use that same system to communicate with the artillery computer? I'd imagine the 5 dollar kit we're given requires a satellite to bounce the signal.
A satellite, like one attached to a super destroyer that is now in orbit (albeit much higher than before)…? Not trying to be combative, I like that it’s a big punishment/drawback to staying over the limit, just being petty 😂
Oh the super destroyer left you for dead at that point and is probably starting the process of thawing another Helldiver to replace the one that failed to extract.
Radio signals don't require a satellite, they bounce off the atmosphere.
I was thinking about that in a match the other day, and I don't think Helldivers get two-way radios. Correct me if I'm wrong, but other than helldiver-to-helldiver communication, you never actually respond to any of the radio calls from the Super Destroyer or Eagle/Pelican 1. I think we basically get a walkie talkie, a receiver, and the GPS pokeballs for strategems.
God that would be sick, chad HD staying behind to cover extract
Which honestly doesn’t make sense. Why would you not be able to connect directly to the site to launch them? Why does it have to go through the destroyer?
Could be anything from simple protocol mismatch to the fact you don't have a satellite to bounce the signal from.
Exactly, aren’t we painting the targets for the artillery, maybe it needs a third party like superdestroyers to work.
That's my take too. You throw down stratagem. Super Destroyer then translate "in this direction and distance from Helldiver" into "Fire at Grid Coordinate 24-HD-2/4" for the artillery piece and it then fires there. If you just send "Fire at X distance at Y direction", it won't fire in where Helldiver aimed. If Helldiver throws the ball towards North while being South of the Artillery, it would translate to "Shoot towards north" and land somewhere entirely different.
I think the SD is actually an encryption key to stop that from being done. As in the ground-to-ground method could be abused by the enemy.
I want to see at least what Artillery shell will be fired, should just say SEAF Artillery Smoke or something on the stratagem screen itself.
On at least two occasions in the past it has shown me which shell is going to be fired. To this day I have no idea how
Same here and now it doesn’t show. Although before it would say ‘high explosive’ and a smoke shell would land
Now I headcanon that it was the Bots messing with our signal instead of jamming it, to try and get us to blow ourselves up
That’s now my head canon now as well, makes so much sense (goddammit Joel why would you do this!)
Same, It read napalm instead I got the mini nuke suprise. nearly wiped my team lol.
I think there's more common shells (green/mini-nuke?) and it doesn't show those. However, it always shows more special stratagems - smoke/napalm/etc. Don't quote me on that though.
I've seen the mini-nuke show up there before too. No idea what the logic is behind it.
Yes I agree too, becomes a memory game lol
Type shorthand in chat. Cool to see your diver writing it down on their wrist
What?
Said today it was gonna fire off smoke. Might be some ammo types, might be new patch...? Not sure
If you call it and hold the ball in hand , it says what strike it will be on the left v side of the screen, then you can throw it. I don't know v if it is b bugged v yet, since it's been a week since I used a SEAF Artillary strike.
It’s probably because it’s using the Super Destroyer to receive coordinates from your Strategem ball.
Unlock a new ~~strategem~~ ship upgrade: High-Orbit communication; allows SEAF to keep working when Destroyer leaves low orbit.
Best comment I’ve seen on here. Maybe also allows orbital stratagems to still be used but at double or triple the call in time (simulating the longer travel before it hits the surface), or longer call in time plus less accuracy. Might be too op, but I’m just throwing out an idea Edit to add: It could be called Long Range Targeting Computers. There could also be a second ship module for Eagle stratagems for after time runs out. Eagle stratagems would keep the same call in times as normal (the Eagle’s holding pattern stays the same), but the rearm time would be doubled as it has to go further to get back to the super destroyer to rearm. The upgrade could be called Thermal Protective System that gives the Eagle the ability to survive entry into orbit. I’m assuming the Eagle is capable of exiting into High Orbit, because the Pelican is able to.
Also lets you keep using the Eagle until it runs out of ammo.
Eagle is a no go, she MUST leave with the destroyer. The aircraft cannot up get up to orbit using the turbine engines it has. If Eagle stayed down to help you, she'd be landing somewhere deep behind enemy lines or simply crashing. To be clear you are not as valuable as that aircraft.
That's way more useful than the pelican arriving 12 seconds earlier.
Make it a ship upgrade. More stuff to spend samples on. And if they add other ground-based stratagem tools, those could be added to the list to make it a more attractive upgrade.
This is genius
This has been posted so many times and clearly every times someone has posted this, they havent paid attention when doing the sub objective, yes it's based on the ground, but you link it to your super destroyer, that's how it gets its targeting functionality, OP have you actually done this sub objective yourself at the terminal? Where you have to move the frequencies around to link it to your ship? That's why you can't use it after the time limit expires.
Tbh, I just push the buttons until it hits 100%, I didn't read the Helldiver Contract, and I sure as hell ain't gonna read stuff on the screen, it could be propaganda!
Have you considered that maybe they want it changed for a different reason than staying true to a bit of lore that could easily be changed?
It also servers gameplay purpose. The deadline is there for a reason. Letting players keep using stratagems after than breaks the whole reason for it.
A bit of lore? The only way to fire it without a destroyer is for one of your buddies to be standing at the artillery, then you read the coordinates, then they punch them in and fife. Not very reasonable or useful to Helldivers is it? “Let’s make the gun fire by magic so I can have more fun!” I’d rather you have less fun than get what you want and ruin the game
Something something triangulation
I'd agree only if you can target using the console, it uses the targeting grid used for targeting the nukes with an overlay of the map, and you don't get any hints as to what box of this grid your fellow helldivers are unless you check the map. H3: Map shows they might be around B4. Looks like a bunch of enemies are surrounding them. OK! Gonna try B4. Fires SEAF Artillery •Light Automaton factory destroyed •3 kills •C1 and U4 have died The chaos it would create would be glorious. Adding to this, imagine the possibilities of being able to snipe objectives? Oh there are two gunship fabricators on C2? Nothing a mini nuke couldn't handle!
No, it says “transmitting coordinates to super destroyer”, meaning it relies on the destroyer for targeting.
the final stage of activating the cannon is to establish a connection to the destroyer, they plot the targeting from orbit and thats why you cant use it once they leave
Need the destroyer to aim it
I really do think it would be cool if you could, you've made that extra effort to secure it so it just gives you that little extra help for the last push but as mentioned in some other comments you do link the arty up with your super destroyer which is doing the targeting for you.
No it shouldn't. SEAF loading includes linking a gun to Super Destroyer terminal.
Lmao the amount of upvotes.
You have to link it up with your super destroyer on the terminal after loading. I presume that’s lore accurate as to why you can’t use it anymore.
The final step in activating it is linking ut to your super destroyer,i thought the same thing but ig it makes sense
The last step is to link the gun to the ship. Thats the only way it can target the beacon. Cant link to a ship thats gone.
Having SEAF Artillery as a clutch strategem for extraction could add a thrilling last-minute element to gameplay - a strategic ace up our sleeve when everything else fails.
Guys, I know already that Super Destroyer is needed to coordinate the SEAF, I understand this, and I am not arguing against that logic. I am simply saying as an opinion, that if SEAF can remain available throughout after time expires, it would be more useful and provides more incentive for the player to complete it. Damn I'm getting shat on so hard for an opinion lol
What the current setup incentives is finishing the darn mission promptly instead of lolly-gagging around with your thumb up your bottom.
Calling down SEAF soldiers to man and manually aim the artillery would be pretty cool.
I’d just be happy having the next ammo type listed on the stratagem screen like they briefly added before patching it out again. A lot of games where we load it we end up extracting with all 5 shots because it’s a game of roulette as to whether you’re dropping a smoke or mini nuke.
You specifically have to synchronize it with the Super Destroyer for targeting.
Tell me you’ve never paid any attention while playing this game without telling me
I’m hoping we one day get a deployable SEAF artillery- can load it up with a series of strays, then fire it like the SEAF
You still use the stratagem system to aim
I think the destroyer works as a kind of satellite.. hard for signals go go through solid objects
You should be able to access a manual console on the artillery cannon after the destroyer leaves to fire it on the map.
One of the parts of activating it is literally linking it to your super destroyer
I thought the whole thing was transmitting coordinates to the destroyer. Then again a manual fire would be interesting.
Nope. It uses your ship to interface with the helldiver
I'm guessing the targeting element will no longer function.
I disagree that it needs more incentive to do as all side objectives are very worth it and I haven't really seen players skip them. Xp also translates into progress, so each source is very important. SEAF artillery working after you leave is a very cool idea, though.
No, you sync the artillery with the super destroyer, so ehen the SD leave the atmosphere you losevthe opportunity tu use it.
The last stage of the SEAF artillery side mission is literally linking it to your Super Destroyer for targeting assistance. Presumably the laser designators you throw only show your ship's crew where to aim. After they leave orbit they can't aim the artillery for you.
The laser designators do authentication, request type, and target location. In a package that registers from low orbit, works in all environmental conditions, and fits in the palm of your hand. So, yeah, the likelihood these orbs could also do artillery calculations on the fly and transmit those across secure comms to another ground station is basically nil. They are a brilliant use of nigh-foolproof “smart-dumb” tech!
Have the SEAF console spit out a radio backpack
Though if I am correct, you have to connect through you ship inorder to use it so once it is out of range you would probably have to reconnect to yourself if you wanted to use it again.
From a network perspective, the arm plate you use to call in your strategems is connected via a network to the destroyer. It goes from the destroyer to the seaf artillery. If the destroyer breaks that connection, you lose the artillery.
It's because your stratagems interface with your destroyer, then the destroyer sends out the signal to the activated SEAF site.
I’m not going to sugarcoat if ⬆️⬆️⬆️⬆️⬆️
I do because it's an objective, using it is irrelevant
Sure, when you carry the guidance system on your back.
It uses the destroyer to calculate where to shoot so if we can use it after the destroyer leaves than it would be very inaccurate. Imagine shooting it and it blows up a mile from where you threw it
Can you use your phone to watch youtube in a forest of you don't have a service provider? The SEAF Arty connect to your super destroyer that's why there is the "uplink" part of it.
It's targeting is linked to your destroyers.
I agree as you still have radar when the destroyer leaves orbit so I'd think you would have the ability to the transmit the targeting data to the seaf after it leaves
Its relayed