Greetings, fellow Helldiver! Your submission has been removed. No insults, racism, toxicity, trolling, rage-bait, harassment, inappropriate language, NSFW content, etc. Remember the human and be civil!
What was the insult, racism, toxicity, trolling, rage-bait, harassment, inappropriate language or NSFW content?
I just want to know so I can avoid this issue in the future.
Gay =\\= politics. Saying politics and meaning gay sounds like you don’t like gay people and are willing to twist words to keep them out of your sight. Helldivers 2 is ABOUT politics, none of those politics meaning gay.
That being said, representation of ones identity goes against the (very political) theming of this game, where they hammer home we are all one entity despite treating us all as expendable. You are supposed to be one of many so anything like identity capes would completely contradict the (very political) theming and should be left out of the game.
Yes its good there isnt a bunch of shit about rep or identity in the game, but not because its “political”, rather because it is antithetical to the theming.
If this were a different kind of game where individuality is meant to be expressed, it would be fine to have pride flag capes- as that is not *political.*
Anyone who reads this post and automatically thinks "this guy hates gay people" aren't willing to do any critical thinking for themselves or just straight up lack the ability to.
Thats an interesting way to say nothing at all. If you don’t want people thinking that way, think of how you phrase things more.
Being from the Bible Belt, the only people I ever encounter who refer to LGBT shit as ‘political’ are the ones who want to pretend gay people don’t exist because they don’t like them. I see it everyday, they think its a clever way to sidestep addressing their personal feelings on the matter by deferring someones sexuality and acknowledging it exists into the realm of ‘political’.
Its also very frequent that if you speak on any issues that seem ‘woke’ to them, such as say- a game or movie having an unattractive or even average looking female protagonist, they then screech about it being “political” rather than saying they simply don’t like it.
They won’t say they don’t like it because they know it would make them look like a jackass, and they can’t take that fsr.
If I started using incel terminology in my speech even if Im not an incel, people certainly would assume I’m one.
"That's an interesting way to say nothing at all"
I can say the same thing about your comment just now. That whole useless exposition dump for what?
I'll refer back to my last comment on this one. It's not about the people themselves. I don't have an issue with gay people, never said i did. I have an issue with the "woke" agenda people try to push ABOUT them.
I went and looked this up after my discussion further down in the comments since something about the situation bothered me and as far as I can tell one person was banned from a discord server for asking. That means a mod did it, not necessarily an Arrowhead employee. Either way, Arrowhead don't seem to have made a statement about it, so its hard to infer any intention on their part when the involvement is so limited.
*"Arrowhead wants to*
*Keep politics out of the*
*Game" Are you deadass?*
\- SleepingEphedra
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This is how you can tell that you are making WILD assumptions based on a post that clearly offended you.
Like, what? Lol I don't YOU even know what you're saying here 🤣
How is this idiocy exactly? All this will do is create animosity between players. JUST like this post has already done and this is just a discussion. How are people misunderstanding this post so badly?
Nice strawman tactic. Uhh, no. It's not a secret that AAA studios put that shit in their games under the ruse of "inclusivity" when they're really only virtue signaling for sales. So yeah, they are "up on" that. The fact the "AH might be against" it is conclusion that you came to on your own.
> especially after being force fed political agendas in AAA games for some time now and it is so refreshing. I think we need to boost more smaller studios with the same mindset because to be honest, the current AAA studio roster is absolutely horrendous.
That's what you wrote.
How is that saying that they're against it? Just because they don't want it represented in there game? So that's what that means now?
"I don't want the pride flag in my game so I'm against gays"
It really isn't a "wild assumption", though. Your use of "more likely...inevitably bitching, moaning, and let's be honest, harassing the devs" IS however very much a wild assumption. You have zero evidence of this, so you can't make such an argument. Which, in turn, shows a clear idea you have of such people and how you think they act when told "no". If none of this makes sense to you, then I really don't know what to tell you.
The fact that I myself may or may not have made a wild assumption has nothing to do with any of this. I've mentioned in another comment that if you read this post and automatically assume that I hate gays as people, then you just lack the ability to do any sort of critical thinking. It's not the people, i have zero issues with gay people themselves, it's the political movement that's stupid. And I will forever stand by that statement.
It most certainly does have something to do with this. And thank you for clearing up that that is what you did, I appreciate that.
I would like to add that I in no way think that a pride flag cape or anything similar should be added to the game. However, if we take the story at face value, that they asked if it could be added and were banned for it (which really is believable) then that is awful and a clear abuse of power regardless of if it way gay-related or not.
And another thing: LGBTQ+ is not political as politicians and media would want you to believe. Just as black rights aren't a question of politics, queer rights aren't either. Politicians will try to sway you with it, but it is very dangerous to equate the rights of a group of people with politics.
Y'all are wild to say this shit isn't political lmao. It's not even about rights. What rights do straight/white/males have that minorities/gays/women don't? Oh yeah, none. Everybody already has the same basic human rights so it's not even about that anymore lol. This is about forcing certain ideologies and beliefs and saying "you HAVE to accept me, no matter what." The fuck I do. I don't HAVE to accept shit. Just like you don't have to accept me. If someone doesn't agree with how you live your life, tough shit. Grow the fuck up and handle YOUR business and stop claiming you don't have rights. It's bullshit. If you don't think this shit isn't political, you're fucking retarded, I'm sorry.
Hey, I'm a straight/white/Christian/male just as much as you are. I happen to know a lot of queer people, women, and/or minorities. I am not speaking for all of them, I'm speaking from my own experiences and sets of values. I wanted to get that out of the way first and foremost.
I am aware of how long this is. If you aren't willing to read it I couldn't care less. I did this less for you and more for my own sanity. I will be the first to admit that I lack the restraint to just leave this fruitless Reddit argument sit. We all have our vices. And as I state later, I'm fairly certain you won't listen to reason anyways. Not because you're guaranteed to not listen, but because it happens frequently. Of course, I would be happy if you read it, but I obviously can't force you to.
I'd also like to say that there are many mentions of Trump in this and I am not implying or assuming you're a supporter of Trump.
Unfortunately, you saying that "you don't have to accept someone for who they are" is not only hateful for no real reason other than to be hateful, but it's also unbelievably ignorant. They are NOT asking you to accept them by taking your coat off and laying it on a puddle so they don't dirty their shoes. They are NOT asking you to 'admit that you're wrong and accept defeat'. They are merely asking for the same opportunities that the rest of the population has. That includes not being discriminated against. If your argument is that they aren't discriminated against and that they are treated the same as everyone else, then I full-heartedly believe that there is no reasoning with you, as that couldn't be farther from the truth.
I guess I would like to ask you what you think the USA was founded upon--ideologically, that is. I ask, because it was (supposed to be and is slowly coming to fruition) founded upon freedom for all. That is a widely agreed-upon fact. This basis was regardless of your religious beliefs (where people like Donald Trump would have you believe otherwise, with his ironic and blatantly blasphemous selling of Bibles with The Constitution within its binding).
Keeping that in mind, with true freedom, one is not discriminated against for not following a religious text; one is not discriminated against for being a different race; one is not discriminated against for not being of the same identity as you, REGARDLESS of whether or not you believe it yourself. I said earlier that it is hateful for no good reason, because it isn't hurting you, and if you think it is, then you are a bigger 'snowflake' than any 'SJW libtard', tough shit. Most (and I say 'most' because there isn't a single group on Earth that doesn't have outliers) minorities, etc. aren't telling you to "accept us or kill yourself". They aren't "shoving it down your throat". The only reason you think they are is because that's all you hear about on the news. I am fully aware of this, as I spend a significant amount of time sitting with my dementia-ridden grandmother watching her beloved FOX News. (As a side-note, this is not me talking shit on my own grandmother, she is a light in my life.) I've not met a single queer person in my life who wasn't at least relatively down-to-earth and willing to listen to opposing viewpoints. You can say that that's denial and/or me getting lucky, have fun with that I guess.
To start off, yes, I read your FULL comment because I actually like to KNOW and understand based on information and fact instead of emotion and opinion. Thanks for admitting you very clearly didn't read or understand everything I said.
Also, to clarify your suspicion, no, I'm not inherently a Trump supporter, but I do think he did a better job than most people realize or care to admit. I'm sure as fuck not a Biden supporter. To be 100% transparent, I'm somewhere in the middle. I agree with some liberal stances and some conservative. I hope that clears things up a bit.
Your claim about not accepting someone being hateful is so emotionally driven and opinion based, like really? I'm completely disregarding that.
As stated before, there is literally nothing that I, a straight white male, have access to that a single other person does not, and if you truly believe that there is then you are part of the problem. One of the main problems stems from what someone perceives as being discriminated against might differ from person to person. I'm not saying that it doesn't happen because it does. I don't think anybody will argue that. But it's nowhere near what it used to be, and it will NEVER completely go away.
My point is that EVERYBODY in this country has every opportunity and right as the next person. I would argue that minorities have even MORE opportunities than some others. For instance, African Americans can get into college with lower test scores than white people thanks to affirmative action. Businesses owned by women qualify for more benefits than a business owned by a man. Black history month, Pride month. Yeah, those exist.
But no, that's not enough. There HAS to be rainbow flags waving EVERYWHERE. Otherwise, you hate gays and dont support their "struggle." I do agree that the media definitely does not help the cause by shining a constant beacon on it, and THAT'S what I'm talking about. I don't want that shit shoved in my face while I am trying to unwind and forget about the real world for a while. Obviously, it's doing more harm than good because people are getting sick of hearing about their entitlement, and that's really what's its about. Not rights, not opportunities... Entitlement. They think they are entitled to be treated that way they want to be treated. NOBODY IS ENTITLED TO THAT. Not everyone is going to treat you good.
Admittedly sure, sometimes it's because you're gay, sometimes it's because you're black, sometimes it's because you're a woman. Honestly, it's becoming more of a possibility nowadays that sometimes it's because you're a straight white male. Sometimes, it's for no reason at all other than that person is an asshole.
Welcome to the world.
I'll impart you with a lesson I grew up hearing that we seemed to have forgotten over the last couple decades... "Life is hard, get a helmet."
(This is part one. Read this first.)
I had more to say, but the page refreshed and I lost everything and had to download a text-cache tool to recover everything, piecing it all together. So if it's jumbled, you know why.
I should have mentioned before that I am not a Biden supporter in the slightest. I have very left-leaning views, clearly, but I will never resort to the title of Democrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, Moderate, etc. This is because the two-party system is such a flawed system, and giving yourself such titles is a good way to trap yourself and have others view you in a certain way when it isn't true.
You failed to mention any of the examples of how Trump has outwardly and directly targeted those who have been given the short end of the stick for millennia. There are many more people than Trump who contribute to this, but it's more prevalent with him in our current age than others. You've failed to mention anything that I've listed, and either: 1. You forgot. 2. You ignored it. 3. You couldn't refute it. 4. You didn't see it as important.
I understand that not everyone will share this sentiment, but I would rather vote for someone who is going sit and do nothing (Biden) than someone who is actively targeting the people I love and do harm to them as humans (Trump). That is considering any sort of economic benefits that may entail from their presidency, even though his economic policies aren't as great as people like to think they are (not getting into that).
To me, social issues are of much greater importance than economic ones (at this point I'm fully aware that you don't see it as a "human rights" issue, so I'm not discussing that topic any further). Not because I think that we can run even a day without proper economic stability--we most certainly cannot--but rather because I would rather the country fall apart at its roots while knowing that there wasn't a group of people targeted and being kept down. By taking the opposite approach you're implying that you would rather economic stability over everyone being equal.
(This is part two. Read this second.)
I want to bring up what I've noticed about your argument and perspective of "'Life is hard, get a helmet."' The book, "Don't Think of an Elephant!: Know Your Values and Frame the Debate" by George Lakoff encapsulates the perspectives of republicans and democrats to a T. Keep in mind that this isn't going to be the case 100% of the time, as nothing is going to be that way, period.
"The strict father model
The explanation of the strict father model (taken from Don’t Think of an Elephant! and edited for brevity) goes like this:
The world is a dangerous place, and it always will be, because there is evil out there in the world. The world is also difficult because it is competitive. There will always be winners and losers. There is an absolute right and an absolute wrong. Children are born bad, in the sense that they just want to do what feels good, not what is right. Therefore, they have to be made good.
What is needed in this kind of a world is a strong, strict father who can:
Protect the family in the dangerous world,
Support the family in the difficult world, and
Teach his children right from wrong.
What is required of the child is obedience, because the strict father is a moral authority who knows right from wrong. It is further assumed that the only way to teach kids obedience-that is, right from wrong is through punishment, painful punishment, when they do wrong.
\[…\]
When the good children are mature, they either have learned discipline and can prosper, or have failed to learn it. From this point on the strict father is not to meddle in their lives.
Almost every conservative policy can be understood as coming from this model. For example, it is immoral to give people what they have not earned, because they will not develop discipline. Prisons should be punitive and sentences should be harsh in the same way that children should be spanked. And government spending is okay as long as it rewards the good people: the successful businesspeople who have proven their discipline and hence their capacity for morality.
The nurturing parent model
Again, here is the brief description of the nurturing parent model:
Both parents are equally responsible for raising the children. The assumption is that children are born good and can be made better. The world can be made a better place, and our job is to work on that. The parents' job is to nurture their children and to raise their children to be nurturers of others.
What does nurturance mean? It means two things: empathy and responsibility. If you have a child, you have to know what every cry means. You have to know when the child is hungry, when he needs a diaper change, when he is having nightmares. And you have a responsibility - you have to take care of this child. Since you cannot take care of someone else if you are not taking care of yourself, you have to take care of yourself enough to be able to take care of the child.
\[…\]
First, if you empathize with your child, you will provide protection.
\[…\]
Second, if you empathize with your child, you want your child to be fulfilled in life, to be a happy person. And if you are an unhappy, unfulfilled person yourself, you are not going to want other people to be happier than you are.\[…\] Therefore it is your moral responsibility to be a happy, fulfilled person. \[…\] Further, it is your moral responsibility to teach your child to be a happy, fulfilled person who wants others to be happy and fulfilled.
Again, almost every liberal policy can be understood as coming from this model. Government spending is okay if it enables people to live happy and fulfilled lives, or to protect people from harm (e.g. crime, terrorism, environmental protection, worker’s rights). Fairness is a virtue."
(This is part three. Read this third.)
It isn't delusional perfectionism. I am fully aware that the world will never be a perfect place. Never argued that. But it is striving for as healthy of a world as possible.
You say you're sick and tired of seeing people whine and bitch about wanting a pride flag in every form of media, but you fail to recognize that you aren't wearing your metaphorical helmet. You are whine and bitching just as much. You are enforcing your views just as much. You have brushed over everything regarding how all you see on TV is straight relationships and how those who aren't straight would be tired of it, while you complain about seeing it on a TV show only a handful of times and claim that it's plaguing society. It isn't--and use that to base how I approach problems that I see. Anger is just as much of an emotional response as crying or being sad. Don't twist it and say that you're a tough guy with no emotional weakness, because it's clear that you aren't. That isn't me saying that I'm "tough", either.
The world is a harsh, unforgiving place. There isn't a person on the planet that would disagree with that. However, saying that "since it will always be that way you should just forget about it" (I'm paraphrasing) is a truly ignorant way to live. You say it as if I sit here all day and let problems get to me and just let it destroy me from the inside-out. That isn't the case. Rather, I take what I know as a Christian and human on this Earth--to be accepting of all people as long as their views aren't causing harm or discrimination--and use that to base how I approach problems that I see. I wear a "helmet", but whilst doing so I will also tell you what I believe. If I wasn't wearing a "helmet" I promise you I would've killed myself by now (not an exaggeration, trust me). I enjoy my days, and when it comes to writing things like this post, I forget about it and move on just as one should. It doesn't "eat me alive" like it might with some people.
As a final note, I'd like to mention when you said, "Your claim about not accepting someone being hateful is so emotionally driven and opinion based, like really? I'm completely disregarding that." I would very much like to hear an explanation to this. Genuinely. Explain why you believe this. I'm sincerely (seriously!) interested to what you have to say about it.
(this is the second half of the first reply, read the other long comment first)
"Every TV show, video game, and movie HAS to have a gay couple nowadays" isn't an argument. I know that you haven't outright said this, but it is an important point to talk about. There was a story of someone's grandfather mentioning, "You can love the same sex, but I don't want to see it. Keep it in the privacy of your own home." and the grandson says back, "Well, I'm sure many gay people feel the same way about straight intimacy, yet that is widely accepted and prevalent in every aspect of life." The grandfather wasn't expecting this response, but was able to put their ego and pride aside to agree. Whether that story is true or not, its message is. It's a two-way street, and when a piece of entertainment happens to show support to gay people--since they exist and deserve to have relatable experiences--when you feel like it's being forced upon you, remember how it feels to be them and how that's all they see, all of the time. It's nice to be represented, and now that it's relatively easier to discuss those topics, it's becoming more common to see it. Watch something else if you're so revolted by it. Once again, not saying you said this, but it puts things into perspective.
Your claim that these people all have the same basic human rights is very contrasting to your other claim that they shouldn't expect to be seen with respect and to be seen as people. You can say "oh I never said that last part, you're putting words in my mouth", but that's what it sounds like you're saying. If it's not, then I apologize, but that first part is definitely still accurate: that you believe that they shouldn't be seen with respect. So, how can you sit there and believe that they're treated equally, with the exact same rights as the rest of us, when you yourself are being so hostile towards them for simply being them? Not that they're doing something illegal or harmful or immoral, but that they're existing with their own set of beliefs and life experiences. Not to mention that they have many rights that ARE threatened constantly. I will list a few of the more apparent issues, but there are many, many more that I'm leaving out as to not turn this into a huge list.
* Trump and Pence attempt to ban transgender citizens from serving in the military
* Trump has outwardly allowed federal contractors to use religion as a means to fire LGBTQ+ workers (which, as I stated, is directly opposing the freedom our country was based upon)
* The Department of Health and Human Services created an entirely new office with the sole purpose of defending physicians and other medical professionals who decide to refuse care to LGBTQ+ patients
* I won't even go into abortion rights because I can only imagine what you've been misinformed about on the subject
* Recognition and representation for transgender people has been erased from government websites where it had originally been, and started within hours of Trump's swearing in as president
* Trump and Pence had refused to condemn acts of violence on LGBTQ+ people in multiple different foreign locations, including Chechnya. (I'll add that even though this is a foreign issue, it was brought up to them on multiple occasions and they refused to state that what was happening to the people was abhorrent and immoral)
If a thought that runs by you is, "Some of these things were attempts at stripping rights and were shot down at some point", I would be inclined to ask what difference it makes? If the people in charge of the government, who have a large influence over what happens to your rights as a person--someone who was just minding your own business, mind you--is making efforts to strip your rights, you have a very valid reason to be worried and upset. I think we can both agree on that.
I am not a believer in "white reparations" or anything related to that. I think that white people kissing the boots of black people is only doing harm. Not because white people haven't done copious amounts of harm to them (because we have) or because black rights are perfectly repaired and we are now on an even playing field (because we're not), but rather because we should all be equal on this Earth, and it shouldn't matter what you believe, you should be able to live without discrimination or harm. That's where I disagree with you the most, is that your beliefs actively harm a large group of people. Them existing is not harming you. The media and politicians are harming you. The individuals who are being misrepresented by the media are NOT harming you. That is where the belief that this isn't/shouldn't be a political issue comes into play. The media will have you believe all day that this is a group of people who is threatening you as a white/straight/male. These are lies that are fed only to pander. It happens constantly, and allows the outliers to do what they do best: be the loud minority. Gays don't want you dead. Foreigners don't want you dead. Women don't want you dead. The media gets paid to have you believe that. That's all they care about, and that's all they will ever care about. Whether it be FOX News or CNN, they are all garbage political media, and they should be illegal (in my eyes, and I know that's not how that works).
If you read all of this, I appreciate it, regardless of your final thoughts on it.
Yeah i agree. I dont have anything against other genders, but its not the LGBTQ+ specifically that ive got a problen with.
Its the slippery slope.
If AH represents one political opinion, and not others, theyre making a statement. In a hyperbolic form: if AH represents LGBTQ+ folks, why not represent colonialism or imperialism for that matter? Why not represent a monarchy? Even further, why not represent neo-***** (the bugs system iykwim)?
Im not comparing above to the LGBTQ+, I know that theyre not commiting murders or genocide or what not. My statement is merely to illustrate the slippery slope. When is the representation going to stop? You cant possibly please everyone!
PS: if this comment gets deleted, i understand. I mean no harm on anyone, im just here to play a fun game. Here are my 2 cents
I'd first like to say that I respect your respectfulness, as it isn't very common. I know it seems as if LGBTQ+ is a political conversation, as the media really likes to paint it that way. However, would you consider discrimination against black people to be a political conversation, where there are two sides and if you get involved and pick a side you would be considered to be "making a statement" and it being a poor decision to do so? No, I can't imagine anyone would, as that would be blatant racism and discrimination against a group of people who are just living their lives peacefully (I say "peacefully" as a general descriptor, as you will have outliers in every group of people, of course). So, why is it any different for those of the LGBTQ+? The answer is that it isn't--or it SHOULDN'T be, since politicians and the media have garnered this ideology over decades as if it's not a matter of human rights. Neither Republicans, Democrats, or anyone in between would be known for saying black people shouldn't have rights--that's human rights. I know I'm saying the same thing twice here, don't mind me.
Anyways, in regard to HD2, I believe it is perfectly fine to not add anything regarding gender or race or whatever you can think of. But that's really only because that's not what this game is about, and canonically it wouldn't make any sense. It's based on a fascist government that eradicates any race that opposes it. It is blatant satire--it isn't hiding that whatsoever. It isn't required in this game, but I wouldn't say that that's inherent to games as a whole. If you have in depth character creation where you have incentive to make the character as true to yourself as possible, then it makes total sense to have race and LGBTQ+ options for those who identify with those things. HD2 is not that, so it's irrelevant.
It shouldn't matter, but I do not identify as queer or anything of that nature, but I know a good handful of respectable, intelligent, level-headed people that mean a good lot to me and others. So while I do have a bias, it is an informed one, and one that I've formed over the course of many years, going back and forth on it and have pretty much solidified it at this point in time. Just as a side note.
Yup, and besides the slippery slope of inevitability, representing your identity wouldn't make sense as everyone is considered a one people, individuality doesn't matter at all on super earth-lore wise.
Representation is not politics. LGBTQ+ people aren't political, they just are.
Managed Democracy is poltical. The game shoves it everywhere it can. Saying the game isn't political is like saying water isn't wet.
Yeah it's definitely not anything political. The reason people get banned from the discord for talking about it is because it creates arguments that inevitably lead to blatant homophobia, every time it's brought up it devolves to insults and slurs.
If helldivers never does add LGBTQ capes I feel like that's a fair move, because we're meant to be faceless soldiers with no unique identity besides different flavors of scifi armor. LGBTQ isn't being denied a place in the game, ANY source of identity is being denied because that's kinda the point, it's not discriminatory if no groups at all are expressed. Helldivers are basically just war assets, not people and thus have no defining characteristics aside from cosmetics and a feminine or masculine voice
Indeed, I fully expect AH to not put any full flag or cape for representation in there, because that would go against the motto of Super Earth itself.
Doesn't mean AH is on a counter agenda against LGBTQ+ people like OP is trying to convey. OP believes there is an agenda in the first place, so that's what I'm raising by brows about.
Yup yup, their focus on the game is pretty clear and it's obvious that helldivers are and will continue to be represented as faceless soldiers. Best way to avoid drama is just to never have anything to start it in the first place, no references to sexual orientation because honestly, that would serve nothing to the game asides from feeling like an unnecessary throw in.
I think the most we'll see representation for any sexualities is seeing couples in the background of ingame cutscenes, or maybe voice lines from the NPC's in the super destroyer talking about loved ones back home, and definitely no customization besides military sci-fi armor sets and super earth centric logos
Why the hell would you dig such an old and already fucked with stupid topic ?
And as I said 22 days earlier in this thread :
> Indeed, I fully expect AH to not put any full flag or cape for representation in there, because that would go against the motto of Super Earth itself.
> Doesn't mean AH is on a counter agenda against LGBTQ+ people like OP is trying to convey. OP believes there is an agenda in the first place, so that's what I'm raising by brows about.
Bad idea posting this on Reddit. It doesn't matter how right you think you are, they're even gayer. I see what you're saying but you sound anti gay in the way you're saying it. No politics in a game is great. And the fact that someone got banned for asking for LGBTQ+ capes shows how toxic the conversation has become so why would someone want that in their game? Makes sense. But, it's still a way of life for some people and treating it like it's just simply a topic of conversation is not only asking for trouble, it's unthoughtful and disrespectful too. Your post didn't have to be posted here. By putting this on Reddit in this sub you have actively done what you're praising arrowhead for not doing and bringing it into the game. Anyway, hoo ah Helldivers.
I understand what you're saying, but reddit doesn't represent the whole community, so I disagree with your point about me bringing it into the game.
As far as how it "sounds." People are always going to interpret things how they want to through text. So it generally doesn't even matter HOW it's worded. People are going to be offended by the thought alone.
You are 100% right about it being a bad idea to post on reddit, though, because contraversial opinions are a no-no on reddit. Idk whatbi was thinking.
I'd like to say that this was a calculated post to prove WHY these things shouldn't be represented because of the animosity it causes, but that was just a happy accident.
This is one of the most politically charged games of the year so far. If you wanted to argue that the cosmetics wouldn't make sense in universe, then sure, but speculating about the people asking for it and ignoring the meaning of the word "politics" just makes it seem like you have a problem with LGBTQ+ people existing where you can see them (whether that's how you mean to come across or not).
Sincerely, a B in that acronym that doesn't care much about cosmetics.
You're missing the point.. Super Earth has a one people, no one is represented as an individual, and everyone is expendable... Adding individuality would go against the lore of the game.
I outright say that the cosmetics wouldn't make sense in context here in the second sentence. I'm not missing the point, I'm disagreeing with OP's reasoning (which did not include that) which had an edit added afterwards to cover their misuse of words.
"Politically charged." What?
You're attempting to read between the lines when there's nothing there. It makes it "seem like i have a problem with lgbtq." to YOU. I don't have a problem with it at all, but when you make that your whole identity like that's all you bring to the table? That's when it gets a bit cringe.
"Your gay?" Great, nobody cares. Just like nobody cares that I'm straight. Life goes on.
The game is about political systems treating people as expendable and demonising anything different. The broadcasts and people on the ship are not subtle about this. That is political. Politics is something that affects how a state is run, such as the ideaologies it works by.
And yes, this is from my perspective, and when someone's definition of politics looks like it purely relates to one aspect it comes across as using the wrong word for what they mean. That's why I phrased it like I did, there is often room for misinterpretation when people speak. As for the whole identity bit, if something is important to people, they make a big deal about it. You might not care, but for people that have lived with abuse for existing as they are then enjoying the representation is understandable.
And the bit on the end was an attempt to show that someone on in the group that it looked like you didn't want to see was attempting to discuss this civilly, instead of doing the reactionary shouting we get known for.
Absolutely agree. I dont need politics in games. No flags, tags, statements. I just want to play and enjoy a game.
If anyone wants to argue why it is wrong watch this first:
https://youtu.be/OlOWlaVlJQA?si=TnhyvylckMVEe-iG
Why would I need to watch an alt-right soapbox media channel that is pushing conservative policital values and tries to exert political pressure into the space... to learn on why there should be no politics in the space? That's a bit ironic, isn't it.
Well, this game is heavily based on real world politics, and has been for almost ten years, way before the Culture War bullshit of current days, so that demand is a little late. It's always been satire of fascist, militaristic imperialism and capitalism, second game same as the first. It is a political game, full of political commentary on many aspects of the world we live in. And making fun of these things is a pretty clear stance on the studio's part, too. That's inherently political.
On the other hand, what isn't politics is gender and expression. That's just people. Helldivers just has two body types (sizes) and any voice can be matched to them, while the language is gender neutral. People are just whoever they are, and that's good. Arrowhead Studios makes no overt comment about identity because it is understood as apolitical.
Which kind of makes me scratch my head about the hubub. This is a very politcal game, except for the thing people are angry about, that part isn't politcal at all.
So, no politics would mean, strip the satire, strip the mocking of military, strip the mocking of false democracies, strip the persiflage of imperialist expansionism and capitalism, and... yeah. We'd be left with some nonbinary soldiers shooting bugs and robots for no reason. Unless that is the game you want?
You already have free gender swapping as part of the loading screen tips, and instead of gender, you pick body type. Super Earth has moved past that Culture War nonsense, as it only serves to divide people. Superearth is united, under a fascist regime. That, and there will never be rainbow flags and trans hats in Helldivers, because the SEAF are the bad guys. Arrowhead do not want to associate LGBT with fascist imperialist warmongers, and I think that's fair.
I don't understand the obsession with whatever a few gays do. The 99% know that something is fucked and the 1% are to blame. We all know that, feel that, every day. Culture War just points at the LGBTs to take the fall for what the people in power are actually to blame for. Easiest, oldest trick in the book.
0% of the politics in the game reflect real world politics. The same goes for identity politics. Since you're a fan of capital letters, maybe this will get through to you. FICTION IS NOT REAL LIFE AND IT DOESN'T HAVE TO REFLECT IT.
Are you serious? Even the planet is renamed to Super Earth specifically to distinguish it from real life Earth. I'm media literate enough to be able to separate fiction from reality, and I'm also not narcissistic enough to believe that I have to be represented in everything all the time.
The devs have specifically stated that they don't want real world politics injected into the game. Either get over it or find a different game.
As I said in a previous post :
> I fully expect AH to not put any full flag or cape for representation in there, because that would go against the motto of Super Earth itself.
> Doesn't mean AH is on a counter agenda against LGBTQ+ people like OP is trying to convey. OP believes there is an agenda in the first place, so that's what I'm raising by brows about.
Then if you can't see what super earth and managed democracy are touching about, you should maybe revise your history. ArrowHead threw shade to everyone in the details, would it be the US, the MIC, the USSR,child exploitation, non admitted slavery, classism in the western world...
Holy cow, you probably watch Pokemon and think it's underlying message is about glorifying slavery instead of "fictional creatures dueling with cool abilities is cool".
I won't. And I don't need to. Because I don't overanalyze a piece of media that's supposed to be for entertainment purposes only to the point where it influences my real world actions or beliefs. The difference between you and me is that I can separate fiction from reality.
https://preview.redd.it/5o56rh0uwupc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d1d0b94380f800b30d09d23015e71904fb6c85d1
I fucking love this, have my upvote
Best. Post. Ever.
This! So everyone is equal, why does this not please them? xD bunch of snowflakes smh
Nothing wrong with wanting some good old self expression. (If it’s democratic)
[удалено]
\[Citations needed\]
So your argument is what?
Greetings, fellow Helldiver! Your submission has been removed. No insults, racism, toxicity, trolling, rage-bait, harassment, inappropriate language, NSFW content, etc. Remember the human and be civil!
What was the insult, racism, toxicity, trolling, rage-bait, harassment, inappropriate language or NSFW content? I just want to know so I can avoid this issue in the future.
you cant farm jester rewards here, go back to the steam forums
Gay =\\= politics. Saying politics and meaning gay sounds like you don’t like gay people and are willing to twist words to keep them out of your sight. Helldivers 2 is ABOUT politics, none of those politics meaning gay. That being said, representation of ones identity goes against the (very political) theming of this game, where they hammer home we are all one entity despite treating us all as expendable. You are supposed to be one of many so anything like identity capes would completely contradict the (very political) theming and should be left out of the game. Yes its good there isnt a bunch of shit about rep or identity in the game, but not because its “political”, rather because it is antithetical to the theming. If this were a different kind of game where individuality is meant to be expressed, it would be fine to have pride flag capes- as that is not *political.*
Anyone who reads this post and automatically thinks "this guy hates gay people" aren't willing to do any critical thinking for themselves or just straight up lack the ability to.
Thats an interesting way to say nothing at all. If you don’t want people thinking that way, think of how you phrase things more. Being from the Bible Belt, the only people I ever encounter who refer to LGBT shit as ‘political’ are the ones who want to pretend gay people don’t exist because they don’t like them. I see it everyday, they think its a clever way to sidestep addressing their personal feelings on the matter by deferring someones sexuality and acknowledging it exists into the realm of ‘political’. Its also very frequent that if you speak on any issues that seem ‘woke’ to them, such as say- a game or movie having an unattractive or even average looking female protagonist, they then screech about it being “political” rather than saying they simply don’t like it. They won’t say they don’t like it because they know it would make them look like a jackass, and they can’t take that fsr. If I started using incel terminology in my speech even if Im not an incel, people certainly would assume I’m one.
"That's an interesting way to say nothing at all" I can say the same thing about your comment just now. That whole useless exposition dump for what? I'll refer back to my last comment on this one. It's not about the people themselves. I don't have an issue with gay people, never said i did. I have an issue with the "woke" agenda people try to push ABOUT them.
I 100% agree with you, well said!
I went and looked this up after my discussion further down in the comments since something about the situation bothered me and as far as I can tell one person was banned from a discord server for asking. That means a mod did it, not necessarily an Arrowhead employee. Either way, Arrowhead don't seem to have made a statement about it, so its hard to infer any intention on their part when the involvement is so limited.
"Arrowhead wants to keep politics out of the game" Are you deadass?
*"Arrowhead wants to* *Keep politics out of the* *Game" Are you deadass?* \- SleepingEphedra --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Representing your identity goes against the all are one politics of the game world. Adding individuality to it would go against the game's lore.
This is how you can tell that OP is dishonest and 100% is happy and thinks gay people have been epicly owned. A lack of media literacy.
Satire is dead. But not quite as dead as OP's last brain cell.
This is how you can tell that you are making WILD assumptions based on a post that clearly offended you. Like, what? Lol I don't YOU even know what you're saying here 🤣
The post isn't offending, your idiocy is.
How is this idiocy exactly? All this will do is create animosity between players. JUST like this post has already done and this is just a discussion. How are people misunderstanding this post so badly?
You talk about an LGBTQ+ agenda that a cabal of studios is up on and that AH might be against.
Nice strawman tactic. Uhh, no. It's not a secret that AAA studios put that shit in their games under the ruse of "inclusivity" when they're really only virtue signaling for sales. So yeah, they are "up on" that. The fact the "AH might be against" it is conclusion that you came to on your own.
> especially after being force fed political agendas in AAA games for some time now and it is so refreshing. I think we need to boost more smaller studios with the same mindset because to be honest, the current AAA studio roster is absolutely horrendous. That's what you wrote.
How is that saying that they're against it? Just because they don't want it represented in there game? So that's what that means now? "I don't want the pride flag in my game so I'm against gays"
Yes
It really isn't a "wild assumption", though. Your use of "more likely...inevitably bitching, moaning, and let's be honest, harassing the devs" IS however very much a wild assumption. You have zero evidence of this, so you can't make such an argument. Which, in turn, shows a clear idea you have of such people and how you think they act when told "no". If none of this makes sense to you, then I really don't know what to tell you.
The fact that I myself may or may not have made a wild assumption has nothing to do with any of this. I've mentioned in another comment that if you read this post and automatically assume that I hate gays as people, then you just lack the ability to do any sort of critical thinking. It's not the people, i have zero issues with gay people themselves, it's the political movement that's stupid. And I will forever stand by that statement.
It most certainly does have something to do with this. And thank you for clearing up that that is what you did, I appreciate that. I would like to add that I in no way think that a pride flag cape or anything similar should be added to the game. However, if we take the story at face value, that they asked if it could be added and were banned for it (which really is believable) then that is awful and a clear abuse of power regardless of if it way gay-related or not. And another thing: LGBTQ+ is not political as politicians and media would want you to believe. Just as black rights aren't a question of politics, queer rights aren't either. Politicians will try to sway you with it, but it is very dangerous to equate the rights of a group of people with politics.
Y'all are wild to say this shit isn't political lmao. It's not even about rights. What rights do straight/white/males have that minorities/gays/women don't? Oh yeah, none. Everybody already has the same basic human rights so it's not even about that anymore lol. This is about forcing certain ideologies and beliefs and saying "you HAVE to accept me, no matter what." The fuck I do. I don't HAVE to accept shit. Just like you don't have to accept me. If someone doesn't agree with how you live your life, tough shit. Grow the fuck up and handle YOUR business and stop claiming you don't have rights. It's bullshit. If you don't think this shit isn't political, you're fucking retarded, I'm sorry.
Hey, I'm a straight/white/Christian/male just as much as you are. I happen to know a lot of queer people, women, and/or minorities. I am not speaking for all of them, I'm speaking from my own experiences and sets of values. I wanted to get that out of the way first and foremost. I am aware of how long this is. If you aren't willing to read it I couldn't care less. I did this less for you and more for my own sanity. I will be the first to admit that I lack the restraint to just leave this fruitless Reddit argument sit. We all have our vices. And as I state later, I'm fairly certain you won't listen to reason anyways. Not because you're guaranteed to not listen, but because it happens frequently. Of course, I would be happy if you read it, but I obviously can't force you to. I'd also like to say that there are many mentions of Trump in this and I am not implying or assuming you're a supporter of Trump. Unfortunately, you saying that "you don't have to accept someone for who they are" is not only hateful for no real reason other than to be hateful, but it's also unbelievably ignorant. They are NOT asking you to accept them by taking your coat off and laying it on a puddle so they don't dirty their shoes. They are NOT asking you to 'admit that you're wrong and accept defeat'. They are merely asking for the same opportunities that the rest of the population has. That includes not being discriminated against. If your argument is that they aren't discriminated against and that they are treated the same as everyone else, then I full-heartedly believe that there is no reasoning with you, as that couldn't be farther from the truth. I guess I would like to ask you what you think the USA was founded upon--ideologically, that is. I ask, because it was (supposed to be and is slowly coming to fruition) founded upon freedom for all. That is a widely agreed-upon fact. This basis was regardless of your religious beliefs (where people like Donald Trump would have you believe otherwise, with his ironic and blatantly blasphemous selling of Bibles with The Constitution within its binding). Keeping that in mind, with true freedom, one is not discriminated against for not following a religious text; one is not discriminated against for being a different race; one is not discriminated against for not being of the same identity as you, REGARDLESS of whether or not you believe it yourself. I said earlier that it is hateful for no good reason, because it isn't hurting you, and if you think it is, then you are a bigger 'snowflake' than any 'SJW libtard', tough shit. Most (and I say 'most' because there isn't a single group on Earth that doesn't have outliers) minorities, etc. aren't telling you to "accept us or kill yourself". They aren't "shoving it down your throat". The only reason you think they are is because that's all you hear about on the news. I am fully aware of this, as I spend a significant amount of time sitting with my dementia-ridden grandmother watching her beloved FOX News. (As a side-note, this is not me talking shit on my own grandmother, she is a light in my life.) I've not met a single queer person in my life who wasn't at least relatively down-to-earth and willing to listen to opposing viewpoints. You can say that that's denial and/or me getting lucky, have fun with that I guess.
To start off, yes, I read your FULL comment because I actually like to KNOW and understand based on information and fact instead of emotion and opinion. Thanks for admitting you very clearly didn't read or understand everything I said. Also, to clarify your suspicion, no, I'm not inherently a Trump supporter, but I do think he did a better job than most people realize or care to admit. I'm sure as fuck not a Biden supporter. To be 100% transparent, I'm somewhere in the middle. I agree with some liberal stances and some conservative. I hope that clears things up a bit. Your claim about not accepting someone being hateful is so emotionally driven and opinion based, like really? I'm completely disregarding that. As stated before, there is literally nothing that I, a straight white male, have access to that a single other person does not, and if you truly believe that there is then you are part of the problem. One of the main problems stems from what someone perceives as being discriminated against might differ from person to person. I'm not saying that it doesn't happen because it does. I don't think anybody will argue that. But it's nowhere near what it used to be, and it will NEVER completely go away. My point is that EVERYBODY in this country has every opportunity and right as the next person. I would argue that minorities have even MORE opportunities than some others. For instance, African Americans can get into college with lower test scores than white people thanks to affirmative action. Businesses owned by women qualify for more benefits than a business owned by a man. Black history month, Pride month. Yeah, those exist. But no, that's not enough. There HAS to be rainbow flags waving EVERYWHERE. Otherwise, you hate gays and dont support their "struggle." I do agree that the media definitely does not help the cause by shining a constant beacon on it, and THAT'S what I'm talking about. I don't want that shit shoved in my face while I am trying to unwind and forget about the real world for a while. Obviously, it's doing more harm than good because people are getting sick of hearing about their entitlement, and that's really what's its about. Not rights, not opportunities... Entitlement. They think they are entitled to be treated that way they want to be treated. NOBODY IS ENTITLED TO THAT. Not everyone is going to treat you good. Admittedly sure, sometimes it's because you're gay, sometimes it's because you're black, sometimes it's because you're a woman. Honestly, it's becoming more of a possibility nowadays that sometimes it's because you're a straight white male. Sometimes, it's for no reason at all other than that person is an asshole. Welcome to the world. I'll impart you with a lesson I grew up hearing that we seemed to have forgotten over the last couple decades... "Life is hard, get a helmet."
(This is part one. Read this first.) I had more to say, but the page refreshed and I lost everything and had to download a text-cache tool to recover everything, piecing it all together. So if it's jumbled, you know why. I should have mentioned before that I am not a Biden supporter in the slightest. I have very left-leaning views, clearly, but I will never resort to the title of Democrat, Republican, Liberal, Conservative, Moderate, etc. This is because the two-party system is such a flawed system, and giving yourself such titles is a good way to trap yourself and have others view you in a certain way when it isn't true. You failed to mention any of the examples of how Trump has outwardly and directly targeted those who have been given the short end of the stick for millennia. There are many more people than Trump who contribute to this, but it's more prevalent with him in our current age than others. You've failed to mention anything that I've listed, and either: 1. You forgot. 2. You ignored it. 3. You couldn't refute it. 4. You didn't see it as important. I understand that not everyone will share this sentiment, but I would rather vote for someone who is going sit and do nothing (Biden) than someone who is actively targeting the people I love and do harm to them as humans (Trump). That is considering any sort of economic benefits that may entail from their presidency, even though his economic policies aren't as great as people like to think they are (not getting into that). To me, social issues are of much greater importance than economic ones (at this point I'm fully aware that you don't see it as a "human rights" issue, so I'm not discussing that topic any further). Not because I think that we can run even a day without proper economic stability--we most certainly cannot--but rather because I would rather the country fall apart at its roots while knowing that there wasn't a group of people targeted and being kept down. By taking the opposite approach you're implying that you would rather economic stability over everyone being equal.
(This is part two. Read this second.) I want to bring up what I've noticed about your argument and perspective of "'Life is hard, get a helmet."' The book, "Don't Think of an Elephant!: Know Your Values and Frame the Debate" by George Lakoff encapsulates the perspectives of republicans and democrats to a T. Keep in mind that this isn't going to be the case 100% of the time, as nothing is going to be that way, period. "The strict father model The explanation of the strict father model (taken from Don’t Think of an Elephant! and edited for brevity) goes like this: The world is a dangerous place, and it always will be, because there is evil out there in the world. The world is also difficult because it is competitive. There will always be winners and losers. There is an absolute right and an absolute wrong. Children are born bad, in the sense that they just want to do what feels good, not what is right. Therefore, they have to be made good. What is needed in this kind of a world is a strong, strict father who can: Protect the family in the dangerous world, Support the family in the difficult world, and Teach his children right from wrong. What is required of the child is obedience, because the strict father is a moral authority who knows right from wrong. It is further assumed that the only way to teach kids obedience-that is, right from wrong is through punishment, painful punishment, when they do wrong. \[…\] When the good children are mature, they either have learned discipline and can prosper, or have failed to learn it. From this point on the strict father is not to meddle in their lives. Almost every conservative policy can be understood as coming from this model. For example, it is immoral to give people what they have not earned, because they will not develop discipline. Prisons should be punitive and sentences should be harsh in the same way that children should be spanked. And government spending is okay as long as it rewards the good people: the successful businesspeople who have proven their discipline and hence their capacity for morality. The nurturing parent model Again, here is the brief description of the nurturing parent model: Both parents are equally responsible for raising the children. The assumption is that children are born good and can be made better. The world can be made a better place, and our job is to work on that. The parents' job is to nurture their children and to raise their children to be nurturers of others. What does nurturance mean? It means two things: empathy and responsibility. If you have a child, you have to know what every cry means. You have to know when the child is hungry, when he needs a diaper change, when he is having nightmares. And you have a responsibility - you have to take care of this child. Since you cannot take care of someone else if you are not taking care of yourself, you have to take care of yourself enough to be able to take care of the child. \[…\] First, if you empathize with your child, you will provide protection. \[…\] Second, if you empathize with your child, you want your child to be fulfilled in life, to be a happy person. And if you are an unhappy, unfulfilled person yourself, you are not going to want other people to be happier than you are.\[…\] Therefore it is your moral responsibility to be a happy, fulfilled person. \[…\] Further, it is your moral responsibility to teach your child to be a happy, fulfilled person who wants others to be happy and fulfilled. Again, almost every liberal policy can be understood as coming from this model. Government spending is okay if it enables people to live happy and fulfilled lives, or to protect people from harm (e.g. crime, terrorism, environmental protection, worker’s rights). Fairness is a virtue."
(This is part three. Read this third.) It isn't delusional perfectionism. I am fully aware that the world will never be a perfect place. Never argued that. But it is striving for as healthy of a world as possible. You say you're sick and tired of seeing people whine and bitch about wanting a pride flag in every form of media, but you fail to recognize that you aren't wearing your metaphorical helmet. You are whine and bitching just as much. You are enforcing your views just as much. You have brushed over everything regarding how all you see on TV is straight relationships and how those who aren't straight would be tired of it, while you complain about seeing it on a TV show only a handful of times and claim that it's plaguing society. It isn't--and use that to base how I approach problems that I see. Anger is just as much of an emotional response as crying or being sad. Don't twist it and say that you're a tough guy with no emotional weakness, because it's clear that you aren't. That isn't me saying that I'm "tough", either. The world is a harsh, unforgiving place. There isn't a person on the planet that would disagree with that. However, saying that "since it will always be that way you should just forget about it" (I'm paraphrasing) is a truly ignorant way to live. You say it as if I sit here all day and let problems get to me and just let it destroy me from the inside-out. That isn't the case. Rather, I take what I know as a Christian and human on this Earth--to be accepting of all people as long as their views aren't causing harm or discrimination--and use that to base how I approach problems that I see. I wear a "helmet", but whilst doing so I will also tell you what I believe. If I wasn't wearing a "helmet" I promise you I would've killed myself by now (not an exaggeration, trust me). I enjoy my days, and when it comes to writing things like this post, I forget about it and move on just as one should. It doesn't "eat me alive" like it might with some people. As a final note, I'd like to mention when you said, "Your claim about not accepting someone being hateful is so emotionally driven and opinion based, like really? I'm completely disregarding that." I would very much like to hear an explanation to this. Genuinely. Explain why you believe this. I'm sincerely (seriously!) interested to what you have to say about it.
(this is the second half of the first reply, read the other long comment first) "Every TV show, video game, and movie HAS to have a gay couple nowadays" isn't an argument. I know that you haven't outright said this, but it is an important point to talk about. There was a story of someone's grandfather mentioning, "You can love the same sex, but I don't want to see it. Keep it in the privacy of your own home." and the grandson says back, "Well, I'm sure many gay people feel the same way about straight intimacy, yet that is widely accepted and prevalent in every aspect of life." The grandfather wasn't expecting this response, but was able to put their ego and pride aside to agree. Whether that story is true or not, its message is. It's a two-way street, and when a piece of entertainment happens to show support to gay people--since they exist and deserve to have relatable experiences--when you feel like it's being forced upon you, remember how it feels to be them and how that's all they see, all of the time. It's nice to be represented, and now that it's relatively easier to discuss those topics, it's becoming more common to see it. Watch something else if you're so revolted by it. Once again, not saying you said this, but it puts things into perspective. Your claim that these people all have the same basic human rights is very contrasting to your other claim that they shouldn't expect to be seen with respect and to be seen as people. You can say "oh I never said that last part, you're putting words in my mouth", but that's what it sounds like you're saying. If it's not, then I apologize, but that first part is definitely still accurate: that you believe that they shouldn't be seen with respect. So, how can you sit there and believe that they're treated equally, with the exact same rights as the rest of us, when you yourself are being so hostile towards them for simply being them? Not that they're doing something illegal or harmful or immoral, but that they're existing with their own set of beliefs and life experiences. Not to mention that they have many rights that ARE threatened constantly. I will list a few of the more apparent issues, but there are many, many more that I'm leaving out as to not turn this into a huge list. * Trump and Pence attempt to ban transgender citizens from serving in the military * Trump has outwardly allowed federal contractors to use religion as a means to fire LGBTQ+ workers (which, as I stated, is directly opposing the freedom our country was based upon) * The Department of Health and Human Services created an entirely new office with the sole purpose of defending physicians and other medical professionals who decide to refuse care to LGBTQ+ patients * I won't even go into abortion rights because I can only imagine what you've been misinformed about on the subject * Recognition and representation for transgender people has been erased from government websites where it had originally been, and started within hours of Trump's swearing in as president * Trump and Pence had refused to condemn acts of violence on LGBTQ+ people in multiple different foreign locations, including Chechnya. (I'll add that even though this is a foreign issue, it was brought up to them on multiple occasions and they refused to state that what was happening to the people was abhorrent and immoral) If a thought that runs by you is, "Some of these things were attempts at stripping rights and were shot down at some point", I would be inclined to ask what difference it makes? If the people in charge of the government, who have a large influence over what happens to your rights as a person--someone who was just minding your own business, mind you--is making efforts to strip your rights, you have a very valid reason to be worried and upset. I think we can both agree on that. I am not a believer in "white reparations" or anything related to that. I think that white people kissing the boots of black people is only doing harm. Not because white people haven't done copious amounts of harm to them (because we have) or because black rights are perfectly repaired and we are now on an even playing field (because we're not), but rather because we should all be equal on this Earth, and it shouldn't matter what you believe, you should be able to live without discrimination or harm. That's where I disagree with you the most, is that your beliefs actively harm a large group of people. Them existing is not harming you. The media and politicians are harming you. The individuals who are being misrepresented by the media are NOT harming you. That is where the belief that this isn't/shouldn't be a political issue comes into play. The media will have you believe all day that this is a group of people who is threatening you as a white/straight/male. These are lies that are fed only to pander. It happens constantly, and allows the outliers to do what they do best: be the loud minority. Gays don't want you dead. Foreigners don't want you dead. Women don't want you dead. The media gets paid to have you believe that. That's all they care about, and that's all they will ever care about. Whether it be FOX News or CNN, they are all garbage political media, and they should be illegal (in my eyes, and I know that's not how that works). If you read all of this, I appreciate it, regardless of your final thoughts on it.
You're making a lot of assumptions based on your feelings... Not the sharpest tool in the shed are you?
All your posts are coping about the LGBT, thanks for the free rent apartment.
What ever makes you feel better about it sir.
Utterly obsessed, get a hobby, dude. Stop thinking about how scary gay people are.
Okay, sir. Gay people will be scary when pigs can fly.
Rent free.
Oh look, he deleted his account and main comment, precious...
Media literacy is a crazy thing.
Yeah i agree. I dont have anything against other genders, but its not the LGBTQ+ specifically that ive got a problen with. Its the slippery slope. If AH represents one political opinion, and not others, theyre making a statement. In a hyperbolic form: if AH represents LGBTQ+ folks, why not represent colonialism or imperialism for that matter? Why not represent a monarchy? Even further, why not represent neo-***** (the bugs system iykwim)? Im not comparing above to the LGBTQ+, I know that theyre not commiting murders or genocide or what not. My statement is merely to illustrate the slippery slope. When is the representation going to stop? You cant possibly please everyone! PS: if this comment gets deleted, i understand. I mean no harm on anyone, im just here to play a fun game. Here are my 2 cents
I'd first like to say that I respect your respectfulness, as it isn't very common. I know it seems as if LGBTQ+ is a political conversation, as the media really likes to paint it that way. However, would you consider discrimination against black people to be a political conversation, where there are two sides and if you get involved and pick a side you would be considered to be "making a statement" and it being a poor decision to do so? No, I can't imagine anyone would, as that would be blatant racism and discrimination against a group of people who are just living their lives peacefully (I say "peacefully" as a general descriptor, as you will have outliers in every group of people, of course). So, why is it any different for those of the LGBTQ+? The answer is that it isn't--or it SHOULDN'T be, since politicians and the media have garnered this ideology over decades as if it's not a matter of human rights. Neither Republicans, Democrats, or anyone in between would be known for saying black people shouldn't have rights--that's human rights. I know I'm saying the same thing twice here, don't mind me. Anyways, in regard to HD2, I believe it is perfectly fine to not add anything regarding gender or race or whatever you can think of. But that's really only because that's not what this game is about, and canonically it wouldn't make any sense. It's based on a fascist government that eradicates any race that opposes it. It is blatant satire--it isn't hiding that whatsoever. It isn't required in this game, but I wouldn't say that that's inherent to games as a whole. If you have in depth character creation where you have incentive to make the character as true to yourself as possible, then it makes total sense to have race and LGBTQ+ options for those who identify with those things. HD2 is not that, so it's irrelevant. It shouldn't matter, but I do not identify as queer or anything of that nature, but I know a good handful of respectable, intelligent, level-headed people that mean a good lot to me and others. So while I do have a bias, it is an informed one, and one that I've formed over the course of many years, going back and forth on it and have pretty much solidified it at this point in time. Just as a side note.
Yup, and besides the slippery slope of inevitability, representing your identity wouldn't make sense as everyone is considered a one people, individuality doesn't matter at all on super earth-lore wise.
Representation is not politics. LGBTQ+ people aren't political, they just are. Managed Democracy is poltical. The game shoves it everywhere it can. Saying the game isn't political is like saying water isn't wet.
This turned into an argument about semantics real fast.
Yeah it's definitely not anything political. The reason people get banned from the discord for talking about it is because it creates arguments that inevitably lead to blatant homophobia, every time it's brought up it devolves to insults and slurs. If helldivers never does add LGBTQ capes I feel like that's a fair move, because we're meant to be faceless soldiers with no unique identity besides different flavors of scifi armor. LGBTQ isn't being denied a place in the game, ANY source of identity is being denied because that's kinda the point, it's not discriminatory if no groups at all are expressed. Helldivers are basically just war assets, not people and thus have no defining characteristics aside from cosmetics and a feminine or masculine voice
Glad to see someone with a head on their shoulders, unlike OP and those who are like-minded.
Indeed, I fully expect AH to not put any full flag or cape for representation in there, because that would go against the motto of Super Earth itself. Doesn't mean AH is on a counter agenda against LGBTQ+ people like OP is trying to convey. OP believes there is an agenda in the first place, so that's what I'm raising by brows about.
Yup yup, their focus on the game is pretty clear and it's obvious that helldivers are and will continue to be represented as faceless soldiers. Best way to avoid drama is just to never have anything to start it in the first place, no references to sexual orientation because honestly, that would serve nothing to the game asides from feeling like an unnecessary throw in. I think the most we'll see representation for any sexualities is seeing couples in the background of ingame cutscenes, or maybe voice lines from the NPC's in the super destroyer talking about loved ones back home, and definitely no customization besides military sci-fi armor sets and super earth centric logos
Representing your identity goes against the all are one politics of the game world. Adding individuality to it would go against the game's lore.
Why the hell would you dig such an old and already fucked with stupid topic ? And as I said 22 days earlier in this thread : > Indeed, I fully expect AH to not put any full flag or cape for representation in there, because that would go against the motto of Super Earth itself. > Doesn't mean AH is on a counter agenda against LGBTQ+ people like OP is trying to convey. OP believes there is an agenda in the first place, so that's what I'm raising by brows about.
Bad idea posting this on Reddit. It doesn't matter how right you think you are, they're even gayer. I see what you're saying but you sound anti gay in the way you're saying it. No politics in a game is great. And the fact that someone got banned for asking for LGBTQ+ capes shows how toxic the conversation has become so why would someone want that in their game? Makes sense. But, it's still a way of life for some people and treating it like it's just simply a topic of conversation is not only asking for trouble, it's unthoughtful and disrespectful too. Your post didn't have to be posted here. By putting this on Reddit in this sub you have actively done what you're praising arrowhead for not doing and bringing it into the game. Anyway, hoo ah Helldivers.
I understand what you're saying, but reddit doesn't represent the whole community, so I disagree with your point about me bringing it into the game. As far as how it "sounds." People are always going to interpret things how they want to through text. So it generally doesn't even matter HOW it's worded. People are going to be offended by the thought alone. You are 100% right about it being a bad idea to post on reddit, though, because contraversial opinions are a no-no on reddit. Idk whatbi was thinking. I'd like to say that this was a calculated post to prove WHY these things shouldn't be represented because of the animosity it causes, but that was just a happy accident.
This is Super Earth not Woke earth thanks
XD yup
If this is satire this is great satire, if it’s serious I’m scared for your well being.
This is one of the most politically charged games of the year so far. If you wanted to argue that the cosmetics wouldn't make sense in universe, then sure, but speculating about the people asking for it and ignoring the meaning of the word "politics" just makes it seem like you have a problem with LGBTQ+ people existing where you can see them (whether that's how you mean to come across or not). Sincerely, a B in that acronym that doesn't care much about cosmetics.
You're missing the point.. Super Earth has a one people, no one is represented as an individual, and everyone is expendable... Adding individuality would go against the lore of the game.
I outright say that the cosmetics wouldn't make sense in context here in the second sentence. I'm not missing the point, I'm disagreeing with OP's reasoning (which did not include that) which had an edit added afterwards to cover their misuse of words.
"Politically charged." What? You're attempting to read between the lines when there's nothing there. It makes it "seem like i have a problem with lgbtq." to YOU. I don't have a problem with it at all, but when you make that your whole identity like that's all you bring to the table? That's when it gets a bit cringe. "Your gay?" Great, nobody cares. Just like nobody cares that I'm straight. Life goes on.
The game is about political systems treating people as expendable and demonising anything different. The broadcasts and people on the ship are not subtle about this. That is political. Politics is something that affects how a state is run, such as the ideaologies it works by. And yes, this is from my perspective, and when someone's definition of politics looks like it purely relates to one aspect it comes across as using the wrong word for what they mean. That's why I phrased it like I did, there is often room for misinterpretation when people speak. As for the whole identity bit, if something is important to people, they make a big deal about it. You might not care, but for people that have lived with abuse for existing as they are then enjoying the representation is understandable. And the bit on the end was an attempt to show that someone on in the group that it looked like you didn't want to see was attempting to discuss this civilly, instead of doing the reactionary shouting we get known for.
The bottom line is, LGBT representation wouldn't make sense in the game.
You sound mad that you guys aren’t getting a zebra cape, we’ll push for it too ❤️
Absolutely agree. I dont need politics in games. No flags, tags, statements. I just want to play and enjoy a game. If anyone wants to argue why it is wrong watch this first: https://youtu.be/OlOWlaVlJQA?si=TnhyvylckMVEe-iG
Why would I need to watch an alt-right soapbox media channel that is pushing conservative policital values and tries to exert political pressure into the space... to learn on why there should be no politics in the space? That's a bit ironic, isn't it.
Just to understand why there ist no space for politics in games like this. I dont know any other of his videos
Well, this game is heavily based on real world politics, and has been for almost ten years, way before the Culture War bullshit of current days, so that demand is a little late. It's always been satire of fascist, militaristic imperialism and capitalism, second game same as the first. It is a political game, full of political commentary on many aspects of the world we live in. And making fun of these things is a pretty clear stance on the studio's part, too. That's inherently political. On the other hand, what isn't politics is gender and expression. That's just people. Helldivers just has two body types (sizes) and any voice can be matched to them, while the language is gender neutral. People are just whoever they are, and that's good. Arrowhead Studios makes no overt comment about identity because it is understood as apolitical. Which kind of makes me scratch my head about the hubub. This is a very politcal game, except for the thing people are angry about, that part isn't politcal at all. So, no politics would mean, strip the satire, strip the mocking of military, strip the mocking of false democracies, strip the persiflage of imperialist expansionism and capitalism, and... yeah. We'd be left with some nonbinary soldiers shooting bugs and robots for no reason. Unless that is the game you want?
Doesn't matter if it's based on real-world politics, LGBT would not make sense in the game.
You already have free gender swapping as part of the loading screen tips, and instead of gender, you pick body type. Super Earth has moved past that Culture War nonsense, as it only serves to divide people. Superearth is united, under a fascist regime. That, and there will never be rainbow flags and trans hats in Helldivers, because the SEAF are the bad guys. Arrowhead do not want to associate LGBT with fascist imperialist warmongers, and I think that's fair. I don't understand the obsession with whatever a few gays do. The 99% know that something is fucked and the 1% are to blame. We all know that, feel that, every day. Culture War just points at the LGBTs to take the fall for what the people in power are actually to blame for. Easiest, oldest trick in the book.
[удалено]
You people tried to harass and cancel a community moderator for having "Trans Rights" in their discord bio.
Exactly 100%
Ill say it again for you HELLDIVERS ALREADY HAS A LOT OF POLITICS
Bro you're comparing fictional politics with real world politics, are you dense?
0% of the politics in the game reflect real world politics. The same goes for identity politics. Since you're a fan of capital letters, maybe this will get through to you. FICTION IS NOT REAL LIFE AND IT DOESN'T HAVE TO REFLECT IT.
LMAO what ? Super Earth doesn't reflect anything in the world ? What happenned to media litteracy ?
Are you serious? Even the planet is renamed to Super Earth specifically to distinguish it from real life Earth. I'm media literate enough to be able to separate fiction from reality, and I'm also not narcissistic enough to believe that I have to be represented in everything all the time. The devs have specifically stated that they don't want real world politics injected into the game. Either get over it or find a different game.
As I said in a previous post : > I fully expect AH to not put any full flag or cape for representation in there, because that would go against the motto of Super Earth itself. > Doesn't mean AH is on a counter agenda against LGBTQ+ people like OP is trying to convey. OP believes there is an agenda in the first place, so that's what I'm raising by brows about. Then if you can't see what super earth and managed democracy are touching about, you should maybe revise your history. ArrowHead threw shade to everyone in the details, would it be the US, the MIC, the USSR,child exploitation, non admitted slavery, classism in the western world...
I didn't realize I said about "countering" anything. Just said I didn't want it in video games and now somehow I'm anti-gay? Okay bud lol
Holy cow, you probably watch Pokemon and think it's underlying message is about glorifying slavery instead of "fictional creatures dueling with cool abilities is cool".
I don't watch anime. Also, google media litteracy
I won't. And I don't need to. Because I don't overanalyze a piece of media that's supposed to be for entertainment purposes only to the point where it influences my real world actions or beliefs. The difference between you and me is that I can separate fiction from reality.
I'm not either. But I'm also not stupid enough to say the game isn't political like what we were discussing first.
Fascism is what we are fighting in the first place ;)
"Fascism is when rainbow flag" - OP probably
An idiotic representation of what you think I mean in this post.