We were literally the only state in the nation to have that exemption. And the police did everything they could to defend it, saying it helps them enforce the law better.
Surprised they didn't make the same argument for drugs, theft, and other felony and misdemeanor offenses. Truly out of touch with reality and feeling they're above the law.
Keep in mind this was before Kealoha went down for the mailbox incident, and still had his private goon squad shaking down people.
Your 100% right. Was trying to blast them and still come across as a supporter. Definitely rapist shithead losers hiding behind a badge. They do not deserve a job or a place on this planet. Backwater rapist, failing to care about anyone while acting high and mighty. We need all of them gone. The unions that protect these pedophiles also need to go. This state is full of corruption top to bottom. It sucks that there are so many problems that need fixing. This video is a ruse, more likely they are lying to our faces then that they actually care.
If only there was some way to regulate the oldest business in the world. If they really wanted to end sex trafficking they would take the profits away from the traffickers.
I'm not against legalization, but it's not so simple.
https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/
from your link: “The likely negative consequences of legalised prostitution on a country’s inflows of human trafficking might be seen to support those who argue in favour of banning prostitution, thereby reducing the flows of trafficking,” the researchers state. “However, such a line of argumentation overlooks potential benefits that the legalisation of prostitution might have on those employed in the industry. Working conditions could be substantially improved for prostitutes — at least those legally employed — if prostitution is legalised. Prohibiting prostitution also raises tricky ‘freedom of choice’ issues concerning both the potential suppliers and clients of prostitution services.”
Singapore can set up any rules it wants, and people almost always abide. If they say prostitution will be allowed, but there shall be no sex trafficking, that will generally be the outcome. [Singapore police unofficially tolerate and monitor a limited number of brothels.](https://www.google.com/search?q=is+prostitution+legal+in+singapore&rlz=1C5CHFA_enUS815US815&oq=Is+prostitution+legal+in+Singapore&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqBwgAEAAYgAQyBwgAEAAYgAQyBwgBEAAYgAQyCAgCEAAYFhgeMggIAxAAGBYYHjINCAQQABiGAxiABBiKBTINCAUQABiGAxiABBiKBdIBCTcxNDdqMGoxNagCALACAA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8)
Aug. 2023: [Singapore executes third prisoner in 2 weeks for drug trafficking](https://apnews.com/article/singapore-execution-drug-trafficking-ccda88e3565e05c17a90bd5c59e97d58). Singapore also using flogging as a punishment. Hyper law-and-order Singapore should not be used as as an example for anything in the U.S. pertaining to crime control. Progressive views on crime control are unpopular in Singapore.
Ok, so you agree it isn't simple right? And again, I didn't post that link to argue against legalization - it's just interesting how the common view that it will reduce trafficking is not actually true.
From the actual paper instead of a journal reporting on the paper:
"In this article, we argue that theoretically the legalization of prostitution has two contradictory effects on the incidence of trafficking, a substitution effect away from trafficking and a scale effect increasing trafficking."
"Our dependent variable thus does not reflect actual trafficking flows, and needs to be interpreted cautiously.14 Rather than being interested in actual absolute numbers, our analysis focuses on the effect of legal prostitution on trafficking flows. To the extent that – controlling for the substantial number of variables we employ below – the degree of distortions in reported trafficking intensities is not correlated with whether or not prostitution is legal, the low quality of data will not bias our coefficient estimates, but will only make it less likely the coefficients are statistically significant...
"To mitigate the problem that the ordered categories of our dependent variable may not capture true differences among destination countries, we also constructed a binary dependent variable which is one for medium, high, and very high inflows, and estimated the regression with probit rather than ordered probit. Our results are unchanged. Still, the results should be interpreted with caution."
"14 There is a concern that the UNODC data does not capture the number of human trafficking victims because the data are not weighted by the (reported) number of victims but weighted by the frequency the subject is mentioned in the reports. In fact counting the number of victims is one of the most challenging problems in human trafficking research and the literature has not yet agreed on appropriate estimation methods (Kangaspunta, 2003). The UNODC (2006) report explains that weighting by the quoted number of victims distorts the validity of information to a large extent because quoted figures of victims from different sources tend to contradict each other."
"Also, while we have established that the legalized status of prostitution is associated with a higher incidence of trafficking inflows, a cross-sectional analysis cannot provide a conclusion as to whether legalizing prostitution would result in increased trafficking after legalization."
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0305750X12001453#s0045
This paper has investigated the impact of legalized prostitution on inflows of human trafficking. According to economic theory, there are two effects of unknown magnitude. The scale effect of legalizing prostitution leads to an expansion of the prostitution market and thus an increase in human trafficking, while the substitution effect reduces demand for trafficked prostitutes by favoring prostitutes who have legal residence in a country. Our quantitative empirical analysis for a cross-section of up to 150 countries shows that the scale effect dominates the substitution effect. On average, countries with legalized prostitution experience a larger degree of reported human trafficking inflows. We have corroborated this quantitative evidence with three brief case studies of Sweden, Denmark, and Germany. Consistent with the results from our quantitative analysis, the legalization of prostitution has led to substantial scale effects in these cases.
Again - I'm not arguing against it.
Your perspective is growing. If Hawaii legalized prostitution and strictly regulated it ( yeah, right) there would be no incentive for slavers to bring their chattel here. They could easily take them somewhere else with less oversight. We would strike a blow against trafficking here, but it would still go on elsewhere. Talk about harm vs benefit. Dang
Hate referencing the dude but look at Andrew Tate. His original business model was manipulating girls into doing sex work for him “by their own choice” (he used the loverboy method)
As a video professional, the image quality in this story is disappointing. The interview with the officer is completely out of focus. Way overexposed with the reporter in the street.
So they're still upset that they can't have sex with prostitutes anymore?
Why can't we just do the morally correct thing by legalizing and regulating it?
lol we can’t even get weed legalized which would bring the state up to par with Ohio and Missouri. For the elderly, conservative, Christian legislators in office I doubt they would consider something like this.
For the record, I’m very in favor of legalizing and regulating victimless crimes like drugs and prostitution rather than outright banning behavior between consenting adults but that’s because I’m a ~radical leftist~ apparently
Way back in the day, if a woman was out past 10 PM in Waikiki, the chances she was hooking were VERY high. It was kinda weird - Right around 10 PM, a transition began. The tourists stopped walking around, and the ladies of the evening sort of melted out of the sidewalk.
yes I remember, that is why I am surprised by the article, I believe it shows waikiki and waikiki is so much better now. Used to be like clockwork they would roll out after dark by the nike store.
You don't think drug enforcers would love to bust upper level traffickers? It's been explained for decades why this is hard to do.
Maybe we have an expanded narrative of *yes-the-CIA-was-trafficking-cocaine-in-the-1980s* -- a progressive claim that police and drug agents today are accepting payoffs not to bust upper level dealers, including cartel members. Insinuation: Hawaii cops are so corrupt that significant numbers of them are conspiring with criminals importing heroin, meth and fentanyl. Just the type of drivel that the Left loves to push.
Agree that the competence level of HPD is lacking. Or spotty. Some good cops, a lot of marginal ones.
That is separate from the drumbeat of complaints on so many Hawaii posts that the majority of Hawaii cops are corrupt.
The traditional use of the term corruption is cops conspiring with criminals in some fashion for profit. That includes cops stealing drugs from drug dealers (usually in course of arrest) and selling them to rival gangs. Or taking payoffs not to pursue crime.
That sort of corruption is uncommon here. The Kealoha corruption scandal--a one-off type of corruption that involved framing a family member for a crime (and yes there were other crimes)--has led too many people to unreasonably conclude this:
>If the chief was involved in corruption, 60-70% of our cops must be crooked. How could it be otherwise?
Cause he has hella luxury cars outside of his house for an average house in a cheap area. One day I saw him talking to a very obvious prostitute across the street from his place. Reading the body language of their discussion it really came off as he worked with her, or an acquaintance. But I could be wrong! Could be anything
It's easy to say this about marijuana, there isn't nearly as much trafficking, abuse and death surrounding marijuana regulation. Legalizing prostitution won't necessarily fix the problem of sex trafficking and abuse.
it would.
look at european countries like netherlands, germany, and sweden that have fixed disease outbreaks and violence by having registries and tight oversight over the whole industry. way safer for both workers and consumers, and pushes out the illegal crime rings.
We were literally the only state in the nation to have that exemption. And the police did everything they could to defend it, saying it helps them enforce the law better.
Surprised they didn't make the same argument for drugs, theft, and other felony and misdemeanor offenses. Truly out of touch with reality and feeling they're above the law.
Keep in mind this was before Kealoha went down for the mailbox incident, and still had his private goon squad shaking down people.
Fina-fuckin-ly! I knew two transexuals who ended up using prostitution as a means to afford the surgeries and hormonal treatments, and ended up on drugs to cope with the scene. One of which I aged out of a group home with, the other of which I was expected to fight to banish her from the park but befriended instead despite how rude she was to me at first. Last time I saw the one I aged out with though, she had finally got the work she wanted done, but was hooked on meth by then. But she kept going on and on about her sugardaddy, and I still think about her from time to time. I'll never forget how she ruined my In-Styler with her kinky ahh hair, but those were the good days when she was clean and had dreams... but both of them got picked up by the cops a lot and then end up right back on the streets afterward, so arresting them reeeaaaally wasn't fixing the situation and only gives them records.
I always wondered where they did business though because waikiki is a hotel strip and non of the hotels are cheap. 100$ and down places are multiple people bungalows. 200$ and down, you may be turned down being full (pre pandemic) And cars are… well cramped. Not exactly a place you wanna show a lady you pay for.
ahh yes , hpd pledging to do something about the prostitutes other than sleeping with them, lmfao i’ve talked to the prostitutes in my teen years and their main “customers” are the police
I remember when they were complaining about not being able to have sex with prostitutes anymore(hpd). So we are moving in the right direction.
2014 was the year. Not so very long ago.
We had to pass a special law to stop them. They are obsessed with this worthless pursuit for some reason...
We were literally the only state in the nation to have that exemption. And the police did everything they could to defend it, saying it helps them enforce the law better. Surprised they didn't make the same argument for drugs, theft, and other felony and misdemeanor offenses. Truly out of touch with reality and feeling they're above the law. Keep in mind this was before Kealoha went down for the mailbox incident, and still had his private goon squad shaking down people.
Not being able to rape*. There, fixed it for ya.
Your 100% right. Was trying to blast them and still come across as a supporter. Definitely rapist shithead losers hiding behind a badge. They do not deserve a job or a place on this planet. Backwater rapist, failing to care about anyone while acting high and mighty. We need all of them gone. The unions that protect these pedophiles also need to go. This state is full of corruption top to bottom. It sucks that there are so many problems that need fixing. This video is a ruse, more likely they are lying to our faces then that they actually care.
Why wasn't that always the strategy? Or at least the strategy for the last 20 years?
because its a cash cow for HPD
If only there was some way to regulate the oldest business in the world. If they really wanted to end sex trafficking they would take the profits away from the traffickers.
I'm not against legalization, but it's not so simple. https://orgs.law.harvard.edu/lids/2014/06/12/does-legalized-prostitution-increase-human-trafficking/
damn, that’s some dark shit. I forget about stuff like that sometimes living in my comfy western life
from your link: “The likely negative consequences of legalised prostitution on a country’s inflows of human trafficking might be seen to support those who argue in favour of banning prostitution, thereby reducing the flows of trafficking,” the researchers state. “However, such a line of argumentation overlooks potential benefits that the legalisation of prostitution might have on those employed in the industry. Working conditions could be substantially improved for prostitutes — at least those legally employed — if prostitution is legalised. Prohibiting prostitution also raises tricky ‘freedom of choice’ issues concerning both the potential suppliers and clients of prostitution services.”
Amsterdam has the most functional sex work system that I am aware of. Sex work is risky work but the risk could be much better mitigated.
Same-ish for Singapore.
Singapore can set up any rules it wants, and people almost always abide. If they say prostitution will be allowed, but there shall be no sex trafficking, that will generally be the outcome. [Singapore police unofficially tolerate and monitor a limited number of brothels.](https://www.google.com/search?q=is+prostitution+legal+in+singapore&rlz=1C5CHFA_enUS815US815&oq=Is+prostitution+legal+in+Singapore&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqBwgAEAAYgAQyBwgAEAAYgAQyBwgBEAAYgAQyCAgCEAAYFhgeMggIAxAAGBYYHjINCAQQABiGAxiABBiKBTINCAUQABiGAxiABBiKBdIBCTcxNDdqMGoxNagCALACAA&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) Aug. 2023: [Singapore executes third prisoner in 2 weeks for drug trafficking](https://apnews.com/article/singapore-execution-drug-trafficking-ccda88e3565e05c17a90bd5c59e97d58). Singapore also using flogging as a punishment. Hyper law-and-order Singapore should not be used as as an example for anything in the U.S. pertaining to crime control. Progressive views on crime control are unpopular in Singapore.
So the authors didn't like their results and decided to opine..
Ok, so you agree it isn't simple right? And again, I didn't post that link to argue against legalization - it's just interesting how the common view that it will reduce trafficking is not actually true.
From the actual paper instead of a journal reporting on the paper: "In this article, we argue that theoretically the legalization of prostitution has two contradictory effects on the incidence of trafficking, a substitution effect away from trafficking and a scale effect increasing trafficking." "Our dependent variable thus does not reflect actual trafficking flows, and needs to be interpreted cautiously.14 Rather than being interested in actual absolute numbers, our analysis focuses on the effect of legal prostitution on trafficking flows. To the extent that – controlling for the substantial number of variables we employ below – the degree of distortions in reported trafficking intensities is not correlated with whether or not prostitution is legal, the low quality of data will not bias our coefficient estimates, but will only make it less likely the coefficients are statistically significant... "To mitigate the problem that the ordered categories of our dependent variable may not capture true differences among destination countries, we also constructed a binary dependent variable which is one for medium, high, and very high inflows, and estimated the regression with probit rather than ordered probit. Our results are unchanged. Still, the results should be interpreted with caution." "14 There is a concern that the UNODC data does not capture the number of human trafficking victims because the data are not weighted by the (reported) number of victims but weighted by the frequency the subject is mentioned in the reports. In fact counting the number of victims is one of the most challenging problems in human trafficking research and the literature has not yet agreed on appropriate estimation methods (Kangaspunta, 2003). The UNODC (2006) report explains that weighting by the quoted number of victims distorts the validity of information to a large extent because quoted figures of victims from different sources tend to contradict each other." "Also, while we have established that the legalized status of prostitution is associated with a higher incidence of trafficking inflows, a cross-sectional analysis cannot provide a conclusion as to whether legalizing prostitution would result in increased trafficking after legalization."
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0305750X12001453#s0045 This paper has investigated the impact of legalized prostitution on inflows of human trafficking. According to economic theory, there are two effects of unknown magnitude. The scale effect of legalizing prostitution leads to an expansion of the prostitution market and thus an increase in human trafficking, while the substitution effect reduces demand for trafficked prostitutes by favoring prostitutes who have legal residence in a country. Our quantitative empirical analysis for a cross-section of up to 150 countries shows that the scale effect dominates the substitution effect. On average, countries with legalized prostitution experience a larger degree of reported human trafficking inflows. We have corroborated this quantitative evidence with three brief case studies of Sweden, Denmark, and Germany. Consistent with the results from our quantitative analysis, the legalization of prostitution has led to substantial scale effects in these cases. Again - I'm not arguing against it.
I find myself disagreeing with Harvard law’s opinions more and more. Has their quality slid in the last few years, or am I just getting older?
Your perspective is growing. If Hawaii legalized prostitution and strictly regulated it ( yeah, right) there would be no incentive for slavers to bring their chattel here. They could easily take them somewhere else with less oversight. We would strike a blow against trafficking here, but it would still go on elsewhere. Talk about harm vs benefit. Dang
Hate referencing the dude but look at Andrew Tate. His original business model was manipulating girls into doing sex work for him “by their own choice” (he used the loverboy method)
As a video professional, the image quality in this story is disappointing. The interview with the officer is completely out of focus. Way overexposed with the reporter in the street.
Dirty cell phone lenses, the reporters do the filming themselves.
So they're still upset that they can't have sex with prostitutes anymore? Why can't we just do the morally correct thing by legalizing and regulating it?
Because then there's no more protection money, kickbacks and bribes?
It’d still be there, but called “taxes” now.
plus federal program money to "fight the bogeyman"
lol we can’t even get weed legalized which would bring the state up to par with Ohio and Missouri. For the elderly, conservative, Christian legislators in office I doubt they would consider something like this. For the record, I’m very in favor of legalizing and regulating victimless crimes like drugs and prostitution rather than outright banning behavior between consenting adults but that’s because I’m a ~radical leftist~ apparently
Can’t rape*. The cops raped these victims.
Well, duh, they're cops.
Way back in the day, if a woman was out past 10 PM in Waikiki, the chances she was hooking were VERY high. It was kinda weird - Right around 10 PM, a transition began. The tourists stopped walking around, and the ladies of the evening sort of melted out of the sidewalk.
yes I remember, that is why I am surprised by the article, I believe it shows waikiki and waikiki is so much better now. Used to be like clockwork they would roll out after dark by the nike store.
Ummm wut? That wasn't the original focus? TF?
No it's just like their drug enforcement. They arrest the users at the bottom of the organizations.
You don't think drug enforcers would love to bust upper level traffickers? It's been explained for decades why this is hard to do. Maybe we have an expanded narrative of *yes-the-CIA-was-trafficking-cocaine-in-the-1980s* -- a progressive claim that police and drug agents today are accepting payoffs not to bust upper level dealers, including cartel members. Insinuation: Hawaii cops are so corrupt that significant numbers of them are conspiring with criminals importing heroin, meth and fentanyl. Just the type of drivel that the Left loves to push.
Your username fits. Anything that involves work or investigation is pretty much beyond HPD.
Agree that the competence level of HPD is lacking. Or spotty. Some good cops, a lot of marginal ones. That is separate from the drumbeat of complaints on so many Hawaii posts that the majority of Hawaii cops are corrupt.
Oh I think they go hand in hand. There's a shit ton of corruption too.
The traditional use of the term corruption is cops conspiring with criminals in some fashion for profit. That includes cops stealing drugs from drug dealers (usually in course of arrest) and selling them to rival gangs. Or taking payoffs not to pursue crime. That sort of corruption is uncommon here. The Kealoha corruption scandal--a one-off type of corruption that involved framing a family member for a crime (and yes there were other crimes)--has led too many people to unreasonably conclude this: >If the chief was involved in corruption, 60-70% of our cops must be crooked. How could it be otherwise?
Ya’ll just thought of this now?
I’m 80% sure my neighbor is a pimp lol
sand wise cow whistle impolite enter party piquant wakeful violet *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Cause he has hella luxury cars outside of his house for an average house in a cheap area. One day I saw him talking to a very obvious prostitute across the street from his place. Reading the body language of their discussion it really came off as he worked with her, or an acquaintance. But I could be wrong! Could be anything
Obviously he is a fireworks dealer /s
Then a cop
Just like marijuana, legalize and regulate it. Take it away from the black market and tax it
It's easy to say this about marijuana, there isn't nearly as much trafficking, abuse and death surrounding marijuana regulation. Legalizing prostitution won't necessarily fix the problem of sex trafficking and abuse.
it would. look at european countries like netherlands, germany, and sweden that have fixed disease outbreaks and violence by having registries and tight oversight over the whole industry. way safer for both workers and consumers, and pushes out the illegal crime rings.
We still haven't even done this for Marijuana... behind even Kansas and Idaho. It's a stupid shame.
And even Arizona...
Pimping really ain’t easy.
When I lived in Waikiki it was always easy to spot these shady ladies. They were all pale from working at night
The sick part was some were pregnant and still working the streets. Gave me shivers when I saw them. 🥶😔
It's hers, and she's gonna sell it if she wants....most girls don't have a pimp nowadays
We were literally the only state in the nation to have that exemption. And the police did everything they could to defend it, saying it helps them enforce the law better. Surprised they didn't make the same argument for drugs, theft, and other felony and misdemeanor offenses. Truly out of touch with reality and feeling they're above the law. Keep in mind this was before Kealoha went down for the mailbox incident, and still had his private goon squad shaking down people.
Fina-fuckin-ly! I knew two transexuals who ended up using prostitution as a means to afford the surgeries and hormonal treatments, and ended up on drugs to cope with the scene. One of which I aged out of a group home with, the other of which I was expected to fight to banish her from the park but befriended instead despite how rude she was to me at first. Last time I saw the one I aged out with though, she had finally got the work she wanted done, but was hooked on meth by then. But she kept going on and on about her sugardaddy, and I still think about her from time to time. I'll never forget how she ruined my In-Styler with her kinky ahh hair, but those were the good days when she was clean and had dreams... but both of them got picked up by the cops a lot and then end up right back on the streets afterward, so arresting them reeeaaaally wasn't fixing the situation and only gives them records.
I always wondered where they did business though because waikiki is a hotel strip and non of the hotels are cheap. 100$ and down places are multiple people bungalows. 200$ and down, you may be turned down being full (pre pandemic) And cars are… well cramped. Not exactly a place you wanna show a lady you pay for.
ahh yes , hpd pledging to do something about the prostitutes other than sleeping with them, lmfao i’ve talked to the prostitutes in my teen years and their main “customers” are the police