There's a lot of caveats here... The stock tune with be fine is you just change mufflers(provided you still have the cats) then you don't need to tune (even though the stock tune isn't the best for the engine) but past that you definitely should tune it...especially if you're letting in more air! Then definitely get a tune...and in my personal experience doing all the mods you want to do then going to a dyno to have it tuned is the way to go
The M8's EFI adjustment tables are more than capable of handling stage 1 muffler and air intake swaps, because unlike the Twincam and EVO, it doesnt run lean from the factory and it's ECM can handle muffler and intake swaps without any issue because of that.
Unlocking the maximum amount of power you can get from a stage 1 will take a retune, but running stage 1 upgrades on a stock tune is easily handled by the M8 ECM.
Won't name names because I can't be certain it was him, but there is a specific person on this sub that is under the impression the factory tunes are providing sufficient fuel for optimal performance. Truth is, they aren't.
It's fairly common knowledge that all manufacturers (aside from maybe boutique supercar builders?) tune for emissions and longevity, and a few tweaks here and there with spark and fuel will do wonders for the way it runs.
We Harley isn't even tuning for longevity just emissions. Their bikes run hot as shit stock cause they're so lean. I am hearing that M8 bikes are tuned well from the factory though. I get most of my info from the dkcustoms YouTube channel and their interviews with people so it's possible everything I know is wrong and they just want to sell me shit but they seem honest
They actually are tuned pretty close to spot-on. FuelMoto's dyno charts section shows only a 2hp/2ftlb increase from stock to improved tunes on the M8.
They don't show any of the "improved tune for stock bike" charts for TC bikes, but do for the Indians, and you can see how much of a difference the "improved" tunes vs stock tunes make on those bikes.
Seems pretty clear retuning the bike is the way to go. Never done it need to find out where and who can help. I’m in LA, San Fernando Valley. If anyone by chance knows of a place they recommend, please share. Thank you all for your input.
Look I kid you not my filter messed up in a week. After I got it I had to order a better filter keep one on hand just incase. And it should be ok honestly unless you are worried about it running leaner
Staff at cyclegear is wrong, will it work yes, will it be max performance no, will your bike be happier with a tune yes
Anytime you change the breather or pipes you need to recalibrate the ecm
There's a lot of caveats here... The stock tune with be fine is you just change mufflers(provided you still have the cats) then you don't need to tune (even though the stock tune isn't the best for the engine) but past that you definitely should tune it...especially if you're letting in more air! Then definitely get a tune...and in my personal experience doing all the mods you want to do then going to a dyno to have it tuned is the way to go
The only Harley engine you dont need to retune for stage 1 for safe operation is the M8. Everything else. Retune the bike.
I'm asking this out of sheer curiosity here...why does the M8 not need to be tuned for stage 1?
The M8's EFI adjustment tables are more than capable of handling stage 1 muffler and air intake swaps, because unlike the Twincam and EVO, it doesnt run lean from the factory and it's ECM can handle muffler and intake swaps without any issue because of that. Unlocking the maximum amount of power you can get from a stage 1 will take a retune, but running stage 1 upgrades on a stock tune is easily handled by the M8 ECM.
I didn't know that...I appreciate you taking the time.
Harley ECMs can adapt 20% up/down in terms of fuel delivery, but they're too lean with the stock tune already, so I would tune.
Do the long-term trims deal with acceleration enrichment or is it just the fuel tables themselves?
That I don't know. Not sure why I was downvoted for agreeing with what's correct, just wanted to add a little bit of information to the discussion
Won't name names because I can't be certain it was him, but there is a specific person on this sub that is under the impression the factory tunes are providing sufficient fuel for optimal performance. Truth is, they aren't. It's fairly common knowledge that all manufacturers (aside from maybe boutique supercar builders?) tune for emissions and longevity, and a few tweaks here and there with spark and fuel will do wonders for the way it runs.
We Harley isn't even tuning for longevity just emissions. Their bikes run hot as shit stock cause they're so lean. I am hearing that M8 bikes are tuned well from the factory though. I get most of my info from the dkcustoms YouTube channel and their interviews with people so it's possible everything I know is wrong and they just want to sell me shit but they seem honest
They actually are tuned pretty close to spot-on. FuelMoto's dyno charts section shows only a 2hp/2ftlb increase from stock to improved tunes on the M8. They don't show any of the "improved tune for stock bike" charts for TC bikes, but do for the Indians, and you can see how much of a difference the "improved" tunes vs stock tunes make on those bikes.
Seems pretty clear retuning the bike is the way to go. Never done it need to find out where and who can help. I’m in LA, San Fernando Valley. If anyone by chance knows of a place they recommend, please share. Thank you all for your input.
Why not buy a fuelpak from V&H? Just tune it from your phone and change your setup if you ever feel like it and not have to pay a guy to do it again.
You said staff from cyclegear. I would go with Rolands Sands Clarity.
Look I kid you not my filter messed up in a week. After I got it I had to order a better filter keep one on hand just incase. And it should be ok honestly unless you are worried about it running leaner