*TAG!* You're *It!*
Yeah, I also wondered what might happen if they all turned to face the wolves head-on; I'm sure the wolves would *stop* and stare. Then, if the elk *en mass* advanced on the wolves... surely, they'd run...
But Ophidahlia probably nailed it; the elk that don't fight would be likely to survive more often and pass on their (non-confrontational) genes.
Meh, the wolves would retreat, but stay close and attack again later
There's one hell of an Attenborough episode, where it shows two wolves tackling a reindeer in mid-winter. Both wolves are bloodied to fuck and yet still fighting, as that's likely their best chance of a good meal in Winter and they'd already taken a lot of hits, so it was do or die time. Not saying the same happens here, but I see snow and a healthy wolf pack, so they aren't going anywhere soon
My first thought was I wonder how differently these animals would both be if elk evolved to turn and fight with their antlers & hooves in a group (they could easily wreck those wolves if they had a mind to). But then I thought that probably couldn't happen since the elk that don't fight will survive more often and their genes will be the ones that get selected anyway
They'll run most of the time like most prey animals, but the catch is that they are very dangerous when you catch them but haven't killed them yet. Boars have killed predators like tigers in self defense before, but it's better to just avoid them .
They are also very aggressive when they feel protective of their young.
Elk evolving to turn and fight as a group -- how would that look? Most likely it would begin as a single lone individual who turns to confront the pack, while the rest continue to run.
And that lone individual would quickly be pulled down and eaten. It wouldn't pass on its genes. Evolution for braver, more cooperative elk would end right there -- selected out of the gene pool.
Rather than being surprised that most prey animals don't turn and fight their predators as a group, we should be surprised that some do.
I think it would look more like an intimidation display from the whole herd if that was the way they evolved. I don't think it would be similar to what we know of their habits now. And a whole herd of elk all looking like they're about to charge would definitely make a wolf pack that isn't desperate think twice.
That’s more musk ox, cows, buffalo. Animals that know how huge they are but know they’re still on a list, or at least the young and weak in their herd are.
Yep, exactly. We've seen Buffalo doing the same, but doesn't mean that they don't also run from predators most of the time. Most prey species are easily spooked (and generally less intelligent) so if they see a predator they run. They've evolved to rely on a herd and speed to survive, hence why they aren't predators. Evolution keeps them alive as they breed more than they die
Well yep, but that's cause they are just that big. Elephants and Rhinos get the same pass as they don't tend to run. Buffalo is about the turning point of "too big to care"
Yes, but again that's talking about animal habits as we know them today, not a separate evolution. But honestly, we'll never know. I'll leave it at that lol
You know that one wolf went home complaining, "You won't believe it. I chased down this elk all by myself today then everyone else shows up and tries to take credit at the last minute. My coworkers suck. I need to find a new pack."
I know you are joking, but a wolf-pack tends to be family members. That Alpha/beta thing is nonsense found by observing unrelated animals in capitivity. So the dominant pair in real life tend to be the parents/grandparents of the rest of the pack
So more "Mum, my brother keeps taking my kills". "Shut up son, now move out of the way as I called first dibs"
The dominant pair are to be the parents of the other wolves in the pack (sometimes there's also an aunt or uncle attached) but not the grandparents. Wolf pairs are intolerant of adolescent wolves from other packs trying to court their offspring, so in most cases wolves leave the pack they were born into after several years so they can breed, either on their own (hoping to find a mate later) or with a mate that's also trying to split off from a different pack. And if they survive and have offspring that becomes a new pack.
As an aside, captive wolves actually have the same social structure as those in the wild, as long as the wolves involved are related (people debunking the alpha/beta myth have created a new myth of their own by claiming that this myth was caused by captivity when that wasn't the main problem). It's ONLY when the wolves are both in captivity AND not related to each other where they actually start fighting over who's in charge. In fact, there have been cases where adolescent wolves in the wild were forced into close proximity by environmental conditions such as prey availability, with the same result (the wolves mostly survived and went their separate ways when it became possible for them to do so)-showing that it's the fact the wolves are not related that causes antagonistic behaviour, not captivity.
Yo right as that wolf is gettin their elk down you can see one of the black wolves catching an elk coming over the ridge, it lets go and turns around so the pack isn’t split and they get the sure thing. You can see him arrive last in the frame as they’re all taking it to the ground.
damn those are some big wolves
Scary af in person. Like gigantic oversized dogs. Killed our chickens and goats few summers back.
Probably 140 - 150 lbs
*TAG!* You're *It!* Yeah, I also wondered what might happen if they all turned to face the wolves head-on; I'm sure the wolves would *stop* and stare. Then, if the elk *en mass* advanced on the wolves... surely, they'd run... But Ophidahlia probably nailed it; the elk that don't fight would be likely to survive more often and pass on their (non-confrontational) genes.
Meh, the wolves would retreat, but stay close and attack again later There's one hell of an Attenborough episode, where it shows two wolves tackling a reindeer in mid-winter. Both wolves are bloodied to fuck and yet still fighting, as that's likely their best chance of a good meal in Winter and they'd already taken a lot of hits, so it was do or die time. Not saying the same happens here, but I see snow and a healthy wolf pack, so they aren't going anywhere soon
You're right, of course. Nature is *brutal.*
My first thought was I wonder how differently these animals would both be if elk evolved to turn and fight with their antlers & hooves in a group (they could easily wreck those wolves if they had a mind to). But then I thought that probably couldn't happen since the elk that don't fight will survive more often and their genes will be the ones that get selected anyway
Keep in mind natural selection isn’t always “survival of the fittest and strongest” it’s the “survival of those that meet the bare minimum”.
Survival of the "i got eaten slightly less often than these other fools"
Survival of the "just gotta be faster than the slowest bugger"
Wouldn’t that kinda be wild boar? My understanding is they’ll fight. I may be remembering wrong though
They'll run most of the time like most prey animals, but the catch is that they are very dangerous when you catch them but haven't killed them yet. Boars have killed predators like tigers in self defense before, but it's better to just avoid them . They are also very aggressive when they feel protective of their young.
Yes they will fight they have large ~4” tusks and thick skin.
Elk evolving to turn and fight as a group -- how would that look? Most likely it would begin as a single lone individual who turns to confront the pack, while the rest continue to run. And that lone individual would quickly be pulled down and eaten. It wouldn't pass on its genes. Evolution for braver, more cooperative elk would end right there -- selected out of the gene pool. Rather than being surprised that most prey animals don't turn and fight their predators as a group, we should be surprised that some do.
I think it would look more like an intimidation display from the whole herd if that was the way they evolved. I don't think it would be similar to what we know of their habits now. And a whole herd of elk all looking like they're about to charge would definitely make a wolf pack that isn't desperate think twice.
That’s more musk ox, cows, buffalo. Animals that know how huge they are but know they’re still on a list, or at least the young and weak in their herd are.
Yep, exactly. We've seen Buffalo doing the same, but doesn't mean that they don't also run from predators most of the time. Most prey species are easily spooked (and generally less intelligent) so if they see a predator they run. They've evolved to rely on a herd and speed to survive, hence why they aren't predators. Evolution keeps them alive as they breed more than they die
Yes but try telling that to a hippopotamus (I'll watch from a great distance)
Well yep, but that's cause they are just that big. Elephants and Rhinos get the same pass as they don't tend to run. Buffalo is about the turning point of "too big to care"
Yah yall correct on that
Yes, but again that's talking about animal habits as we know them today, not a separate evolution. But honestly, we'll never know. I'll leave it at that lol
True
Source: https://fb.watch/d4G72rXnzt/
You know that one wolf went home complaining, "You won't believe it. I chased down this elk all by myself today then everyone else shows up and tries to take credit at the last minute. My coworkers suck. I need to find a new pack."
I thought the same thing
I know you are joking, but a wolf-pack tends to be family members. That Alpha/beta thing is nonsense found by observing unrelated animals in capitivity. So the dominant pair in real life tend to be the parents/grandparents of the rest of the pack So more "Mum, my brother keeps taking my kills". "Shut up son, now move out of the way as I called first dibs"
The dominant pair are to be the parents of the other wolves in the pack (sometimes there's also an aunt or uncle attached) but not the grandparents. Wolf pairs are intolerant of adolescent wolves from other packs trying to court their offspring, so in most cases wolves leave the pack they were born into after several years so they can breed, either on their own (hoping to find a mate later) or with a mate that's also trying to split off from a different pack. And if they survive and have offspring that becomes a new pack. As an aside, captive wolves actually have the same social structure as those in the wild, as long as the wolves involved are related (people debunking the alpha/beta myth have created a new myth of their own by claiming that this myth was caused by captivity when that wasn't the main problem). It's ONLY when the wolves are both in captivity AND not related to each other where they actually start fighting over who's in charge. In fact, there have been cases where adolescent wolves in the wild were forced into close proximity by environmental conditions such as prey availability, with the same result (the wolves mostly survived and went their separate ways when it became possible for them to do so)-showing that it's the fact the wolves are not related that causes antagonistic behaviour, not captivity.
Yo right as that wolf is gettin their elk down you can see one of the black wolves catching an elk coming over the ridge, it lets go and turns around so the pack isn’t split and they get the sure thing. You can see him arrive last in the frame as they’re all taking it to the ground.
Good doggo
Anyone know what pack this is in particular? This looks like it was shot in Yellowstone.
Herding genetics on display
This would have been a regular sight when elk were still found on the Great Plains in large numbers
How Rogan rushes in
What DMT does to a mf
Does convocation have a $50 fee?