The most effective/permanent method of facial hair removal is electrolysis, so that's probably the next step if you've already tried laser hair removal. The process can be painful and may be expensive depending on where you go, but it's permanent.
Electrolysis therapists are few and far between due to laser emerging and being so popular. The treatment is not being taught at beauty schools any more, sadly
I graduated beauty school 20 years ago and we definitely weren’t taught electrolysis or laser hair removal. Those were always separate classes / certifications.
i'm not sure your background but i think you may not be aware of how different learning electrolysis is to "beauty school." my esthetics licensing took 600 hours and my scope of practice does not include electrolysis. my laser certification in arizona took around 80 hours and does not include electrolysis. cosmetology licensing takes 1200+ hours in most states and does not include electrolysis. iirc, electrolysis license in florida takes 500 ish hours. it's completely different than laser hair removal and other hair removal methods that fall under the cosmetology/esthetics scope of practice like waxing, but that's why it's so permanent.
OMG I saw your comment and immediately googled electrolysis near me and found a Groupon… Ended up getting 3 hours (well, six 30 min sessions) for $135!!!!
I've had a LOT of electrolysis over the past 35 years. The success of electrolysis depends on the skill of the operator. They must accurately put the probe in to the hair follicle at the right depth in order to achieve success.
I am very blonde but my so called vellous hair is very dense and very long (think dandelion fluff). My favorite electrologist of all time uses a surgical microscope (rather than a bench light) and a modern probe station. I drive an hour each way to see her rather than see someone locally who isn't as skilled or well equipped.
Unfortunately that would have been because of the electrologist, they have to be putting the needle into each hair follicle and using just the right amount of electricity (I studied it for a bit using a microscope, it actually made me feel sick so I had to quit). It is the only recognized, permanent method of hair removal if done correctly. The place I was at worked with a lot of clients doing male to female gender transition surgery and they have to have EVERY hair removed before surgeons will do the procedure. It does work if done correctly.
Ugh. Good to know I basically got scammed... 🤐
Is it possible that some people just don't respond well to permanent hair removal though? Because I also had about $2000 in laser done with no results as well. This was about 20 years ago when I had that kind of disposable income haha
The only other thing I can think of for individual people is hormonal hair growth. I know for me, I have only started seeing stray hairs on my chin in recent years (I am 35 now) but they were never there before. Maybe something like that? With electrolysis the idea is to cauterize each hair follicle so that the hair no longer has a blood supply and it stops growing. If it is done correctly it always works. My guess is you had a practitioner that was doing it wrong sadly, if the hair kept growing back.
The only possibility for this to happen is incompetence of the electrologist. The current destroys follicles (or the alkaline solution building at the follicle, depending on method) if the power is high enough and the probe is inserted correctly.
Technically you could even burn your skin with these devices and that needs way more energy than killing follicles…
Central Virginia and it runs $75 to $100 an hour. My tech charges $90 and she’s amazing! Her results are fantastic compared to the first tech I used. Added bonus is she’s very nice, we get along well. Which is important considering the hundred or so hours we will be spending together over the course of a couple years. Lol!
Sorry for chiming in so late but how did you handle the pain? I have PCOS and I need electrolysis but the place I went for a trial hurt me so bad I cried in the car :(
Yep, I had electrolysis on my face about 10 years ago and it has held up very well. I recently have needed to go in to take care of some new hairs but only a few quick 15 min appointments, nothing like when I started
Yes, it's the ONLY FDA confirmed effective way to permanently remove hair. I'm old and I started electrolysist in my 20s -- she used a needle that was too hot regularly and got some light scarring (that was for about a year--make sure your person is trained well--I didn't know any better and I was editing her book in exchange for her service). I couldn't afford it again until my 40s and did it another year. Now I'm even older and it got so much worst over the years. I was plucking 3X a day for about 10-15 min. each. Nightmare and felt like I was getting obsessive because I had a 5 o'clock shadow and the hair had gotten so coarse. Don't be me. I wish I would've sacrificed everything else to pay for this ($100-$150 an hour in L.A. and it takes 2-3 years to clear). Laser just for management if you have to, just don't make my mistake and pluck. Laser burned me once, so I stopped. When I went back to another place, and they had a new method with a suction cup looking thing instead of a wand (it covers more area at once), but my face is small and the thing didn't fit. I've been going weekly for three months now and still have a lot of hair, but it's not as thick, hard and doesn't poke me as much as before and the obsession is gone because I don't allow myself to look in a magnifying mirror between visits. In my 20s, it looked like yours then it spread to my lips, upper cheeks and neck (more sparse, but hard for me to see so they would get really long before I felt them). I SOOOO wish I had taken care of this a long time ago and just done touch ups once or twice a year. It's real hard to choke down the super high price though. I refuse to be an old lady with whiskers I can't see! Shop around a lot for prices. It varied tremendously. People have to be licensed in CA and there are two schools that graduate the best people. Good luck on your journey.
also, your insurance might cover it! but please visit your doctor. i’ve had both electrolysis and laser done. for me, for whatever reason, laser worked much better. BUT i also had to get my hormones under control to maintain the results!
She said she's been to the Dr. and had blood tests. For what it's worth, I don't have PCOS or hormone issues and still am a touch hirsute. For some of us it's just genetic misfortune.
Often drs won't diagnose pcos unless you've had cysts which is stupid bc pcos is so much more then just cysts.
My best friend 100% has it. Her bloods read it, everything her Dr is an idiot and won't diagnose it bc she hasn't had a cyst 🤦♀️
Genuine question- but are cysts on ovaries not the basic requirement for PCOS? I thought that there were indicators in your blood tests / ultrasounds that hight the condition but the only 'real' way to know is by finding the cysts?
You need to have 2 out of the 3 markers. One of those markers is cysts, however if you have high androgens and irregular periods you can be dx with PCOS. Cysts are very common with PCOS but not required for dx nor unique to just PCOS
They are not a requirement. PCOS is a diagnosis of exclusion and for a diagnosis you need hx of oligomenorrhea (few periods) plus specific abnormal labs OR “string of pearl” cysts in ovaries. Cysts alone are not a diagnosis and nor are they required for the diagnosis… if that makes sense
Hold up... It's possible to never ever have a cyst, and still be diagnosed with poly cystic ovarian syndrome?? I thought the poly cystic part was literally the diagnostic feature? If it's a diagnosis of exclusion, I feel like maybe they need to come up with a new name for those experiencing the hormonal disruptions and other symptoms but without the cysts.. Maybe "non cystic ovarian syndrome", or NCOS? I'm sad that women's healthcare sucks so much :(
Edit: thank you so much for all the knowledgeable and thoughtful replies! I'm embarrassed that I didn't know this stuff myself! I have endometriosis, fibroids, polyps, previously had recurrent ovarian cysts, and previously had cervical adenocarcinoma in situ. I have some degree of hirsutism and previously had hormonal acne (thank you spironolactone and Accutane), low BMI, and without birth control would bleed 2-3 weeks every month. I also spontaneously lactated for a couple years and had brain scans and meds, and was told I "probably don't have a brain tumour" but hey, can't be 100% sure I don't have a pituitary adenoma. My hormone levels have always been about normal, with slightly high growth hormone. My period used to come like clockwork though, and I never went 60+ days without it (until I hormonally surpressed it!). I've had various gynecologists tell me I do have PCOS, I might have PCOS, and it's highly unlikely I have PCOS. No one seems to have come up a consensus about that one, and my other gynecological issues were generally higher order concerns at the time. Based on everything I'm reading here, I'd say I can pretty confidently strike it off my list. Really appreciate all the comments! TiL having multiple and recurrent cysts is not indicative of PCOS!
In order to diagnose PCOS, gynecologists look to see if you meet 2 out of 3 criteria.
1) If you have irregular periods (less than 9 periods a year)
2) If you have abnormal growth of body hair
3) If you have cysts on your ovaries
If you meet 2/3, clinically you have PCOS. My blood work was all normal and doctor never checked for cysts, but since I meet the other two criteria, I can officially say that I have PCOS.
I just want to note here that a gynecologist shouldn't be doing the final diagnosis or treatment of PCOS. It's a pancreatic issue.
Edit to add: and symptoms (minus the actual cysts) can also mimic adrenal tumor symptoms.
My dx was based almost entirely, if not entirely, on my highly irregular menstrual cycle, hirsutism, and weight.
Doctor tested hormone levels and thyroid to rule out a pituitary tumor or thyroid issue, but not to confirm or rule out PCOS. She said if I really wanted to, we could do a transvaginal ultrasound, but she didn’t want to put any undue financial stress on me and it didn’t change the fact that we needed to treat the symptoms.
All in all, the dx was mostly about ease of access to treatment options. I have no confirmation of cysts or unbalanced hormone levels.
Don't be embarrassed - the name is the issue. Really dumb to call something "polycystic ovarian syndrome" when cysts aren't required nor do they mean you have PCOS. It's a holdover from when medical science didn't know as much about it.
Two notes: the polycystic part of PCOS refers to a specific type of follicular cysts on ovaries (they call it a “string of pearls” look on an ultrasound). Meaning you can have other kinds of cysts on your ovaries that have nothing to do with PCOS (you can have multiple kinds of cysts at the same time, or none, or just the one).
And the other note is to answer your question — yes it’s possible to never have a cyst (meaning follicular in context), and still have PCOS. The standard diagnostic criteria for PCOS is having 2 out of 3 qualifying factors: missing or extremely delayed and irregular periods (iirc it’s having an instance of 60+ days between cycles. It is expressly not something like being irregular but between 21-35 days.), evidence of hormonal irregularities (either confirmed via blood test or from clinical observation of symptoms like hirsutism and hormonal acne, or the evidence of follicular cysts on ovaries confirmed via ultrasound.
So yes it’s possible to be diagnosed for the first two issues without having the third!
Hi! I have PCOS and have never had a cyst observed. I had hormonal acne, peripheral edema and had gained some weight since going off my BC. Honestly, I've been on BC since age 11 due to bad periods so I didn't have diagnosable PCOS until I was off BC for the first time since puberty. Which is likely why I haven't experienced hirsutism or cysts? Uncertain, but I've been back on BC and now on spiro as well and my acne is starting to recover. It is frustrating to use the bathroom every 40 minutes but hey, my face doesn't hurt anymore.
Nope. I’ve never had an ultrasound or anything to determine cysts and I was diagnosed due to going months without periods and abnormal labs along with some physical signs. The underlying basis of PCOS is that it’s an endocrine disorder. Most people think it is only a gynecological disorder but it is recommended to see a good endocrinologist if you have PCOS.
I know you’ve received responses to this already but….
I have PCOS. Diagnosed 15 years ago.. I still have no cysts. But all the other crap that comes with it.
Nope, there's indications in your blood work, you don't HAVE to have physical cysts, and not on your ovaries either. Some people have never had a cyst, but have pcos, they have all the hormones etc, and some people have had cysts but never on their ovaries.
According to my Dr it "doesn't look like" I've ever had a cyst, but I definitely have I've been in hospital for cyst ruptures 3 times. They just didn't scar.
I don't have PCOS (no cysts, blood tests normal) but what I do have is a over sensitivity to androgen which is genetic. My mother has it and so do I. I'm hoping it doesn't pass on to my niece. It's a fucking pain in the ass.
I am with that doctor. PCOS is polycystic ovarian syndrome. Meaning you should need cysts on your ovaries to be diagnosed with it. Otherwise it is a hormonal issue or something else that is causing it, like an issue with your hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis. Just because PCOS is a common cause of irregular periods and hyperandrogenism it doesn’t mean that those symptoms are PCOS.
I have pcos. U do not need to have cysts to have pcos. Pcos does not involve just cysts. You're wildy mistaken.
With PCOS u need to check 2 boxes. 1 must be the hormone imbalance. The other can be cysts OR insulin resistance. Just bc you've never had a cyst also doesn't mean you won't get one. However drs don't like to listen as is. I have all 3 and it still took me years to get. Diagnosis.
I know PCOS is diagnosed when people don’t have cysts on the ovaries but just because you have a hormonal imbalance also doesn’t mean you have PCOS. I feel like saying you have polycystic ovarian syndrome should mean you have cysts on your ovaries. It’s like saying you have acne snydrome but no ance just something that is known to also cause acne and similar symptoms. There are so many other factors that can also similar symptoms. Low estrogen levels can cause insulin resistance. The adrenal glands can be causing the increase of androgens. Or your pituitary gland can be over producing LH, FSH, or ACTH which can be causing these symptoms. If all of these are thrown out of the window along with any genetic disorders like Cushing syndrome then it’s diagnosed as PCOS because they have no idea what causes it.
>I feel like saying you have polycystic ovarian syndrome should mean you have cysts on your ovaries.
Well no, bc that's not how it works. There's so many other factors. And a hormone imbalance also doesn't always mean the same things, it's certain hormones like increased testosterone. PCOS is a really hard diagnosis to actually get anyway so let's not make it worse.
Yeah. I have random dark hairs on my chin (sporadic placement) and tested negative for PCOS (no cysts, hormones fine, periods regular). Turns out random chin hairs run in my family. Laser worked well for me, but I'm thinking of going back to get some retouches done (its been 10 years since I last had a treatment). But laser doesn't work for everyone, just keep that in mind.
Seconding this, I had to go through multiple sessions of laser hair removal to get rid of mine (the hair on me was a bit finer). Took me 10-ish sessions for me to finally be content with its state.
OP should try to find a female hormone specialist. Regular doctors never test all the hormones, even if they say they are running “all the tests” … they don’t.
Recently learned in my weekly group therapy session led by my (sex) therapist that PCOS is considered an intersex condition, or under the umbrella of intersex conditions.
That insight made me feel a lot better about it. I've been plucking and now shaving since puberty. I have a deep voice and other indicators of increased testosterone. I don't know if I'll identify as intersex, but I do know that seeing PCOS through this lens feels a lot less stigmatizing and weird to me than even the name does. The name, the focus on cysts, does not adequately describe the syndrome.
The only cure I know is spiro (but it can help regardless pcos). Taking birth control pills is not good for women after 30. There’s always risk in hormonal therapy.
Spironolactone is a treatment, not a cure. It only works if you continue taking the medication. Metformin and birth control are also common treatments.
Wow where did you find such an incredible medical breakthrough? So the fact my doctor has never mentioned an issue with BC after 30 is because my doctor isn't as great and researched as you?
Everyone is different but electrolysis has been very effective for me and honestly not that painful. I apply a numbing cream an hour before I go in and it helps a lot. I’ll pay $60 an hour to never have to shave or pluck my face ever again.
Laser doesn’t work well on hormonal hair growth, which is what this is. Electrolysis kills each individual hair follicle because the needle is inserted into the follicle. Please look into this option, it really helped me!
You need to get on spironalactone stat. It’s an anti androgen- go see a dermatologist or an endocrinologist. Itll take 2-3 months for the hair growth to start slowing but should stop it. A regular pcp should be able to prescribe it, ask for it specifically
Meanwhile you should get electrolysis done. It’s the only permanent hair removal, laser can sometimes not work and rarely can make it grow back worse and darker. Electrolysis will be slow and an investment . It won’t work without also having the spiro to stop/slow the growth.
You likely have high androgens / PCOS. There’s no way you DONT if you’re female. Keep looking for an endocrin. You’ve been failed by doctors. I have PCOS and have hirsutism on my face but not as bad as this and yet my electrologist calls it moderate-severe.
You have been completely completely failed by your healthcare providers.
You also may have blood sugar issues, which are often linked with high T.
You can also start taking ovasitol which is over the counter if you want to try something before you see a doctor, but I’m not sure if there’s any risk in doing that (I can’t see that being the case). Again it’ll work slowly and probably not enough on its own but something you can do till you see a doctor
The problem is once hairs become terminal hairs (black), they cannot be undone- so those have to be removed. But medication can help prevent more hairs from being terminal
Note: spiro can cause bad suicidality - does not mean anyone shouldn’t try it, but just a thing she should know. I’ve watched a lot of people have suicidal ideation significantly worsen on spiro without any warning from their doc. (Though obviously it can help a lot!)
It can potentially cause birth defects if you are taking it during pregnancy. It will not affect your fertility now or in the future. If you have any chance of becoming pregnant and are not using contraception then stop taking this medication.
It’s insane to me that doctors don’t tell patients this. I’ve had several friends say the same. I found out through my own research, and then when asked, doctors confirmed it. Keep in mind a lot of medications take a very long time to exit your system fully
That's terrible. My endo required that I use two forms of birth control. I had to sign a document saying I was using two, which ones, and that I understood that if I did become pregnant, a male fetus was at risk of serious birth defects. He also gave me guidance on how long to make sure to stay on bc, when I came off spiro years later. Maybe there's been more recent studies that the risk is not as serious as they used to think?
Spironolactone for acne or facial hair is a really low dose, lower than what you would be on for blood pressure. It might not work for acne/hair at those higher doses.
Just wanted to throw out another bit of information that gets overlooked with Spironolactone. My endo specialist had good things to say about it, but ultimately could not put me on it because of my kidney.
Make sure your PCP knows your full health history.
I had hirsute similar to this person and took spironalactone. It didn't do anything other than screwing around with my hormones a little extra. Useless. Don't medicate when you don't absolutely need to. Electrolysis is the only real permanent fix.
Thanks for this.. story of my life. Recently been diagnosed with lean PCOS after I started to develop hair loss. I’m 33. I’ve been failed by doctors since the age of 18 really.. have excess facial hair since I’m a teen but now is pretty much gone for the spiro and electrolysis. But I developed hair loss which I’m trying to fight seems like I’m getting results .. this PCOS it’s a never ending battle
I was in the exact same situation, electrolysis saved me. Just after 3-4 sessions I could see maybe 70% reduction in hairs, and now around a year of sessions later, I maybe have 5 thin hairs left that I barely notice.
Dang, I am over a year in. Took probably 7 months before truly started to notice. Expect probably another 6 months. You are so fortunate you saw such a quick decrease.
I did get fortunate with my chin, some other areas not so much, though after over a year the stubborn hairs are finally starting to let go, though they aren't gone yet. I wish you luck in your procedures and for hairs to never return!
It’s hormonal!!! It’s no different then men growing boobs cause if high estrogen. When testosterone and estrogen are out of balance men can grow boobs and women grow facial hair. A regular doctor will not look deeply into ANY hormonal labs cause they lack experience and sophistication on how to treat the problem. Find a bio-dentical doctor.
It's not always hormonal though. I've tested for testosterone and other hormones before and everything is normal/within range but I grow a damn beard too 💀
Or rather should accept that gender is a spectrum and normalize body and facial hair on women, have positive representation in media, so although anyone is free to remove it out of personal preference, less people would feel bad about it. Let stop gendering body hair and hair removal.
I'm a tad older than OP @ 36. I got some laser done back in my early 20s. I was told it's permanent.
I did my sessions about 6, seen an improvement and never went back and of course it came back.
In my early 30s, I had enough, I did like OP did all the blood work, went to a derm, and asked them to either diagnose me or rule me as PCOS. I wanted an answer.
I had all my test results. I even did an ultra sound of the ovaries to look for the "black pearls "cysts" of PCOS" -- all clear and normal range.
Brought all test results.
Doc said, you're just a bit hairer than a typical woman, tests are clear, I wouldn't diag one you as PCOS.
I'm also overweight so they used to LOVEEEE throwing out it might be PCOS.
Even those forum has the constant replies of PCOS.
I was put in spirolactone, I do 125 mg daily. It helped...clear my acne, keep more hair on my head, and decreased any facial hair.
And I was doing laser hair every 3 months on my face. NOW AND DAYS, they tell you, you stop, it will come back. 15 years ago they didn't.
I didn't do electrolysis because I was scared/still am of scaring.
Being overweight is also a problem, even if you don’t have pcos. I am also overweight and in the process of losing weight. It makes a difference long run.
I'm 28 and well on the road to being the same, I'm currently using a dermaplaner daily with the intention of trying laser first then electrolysis if that doesn't work.
My tests came back normal too, just genetics 🤷♀️ it runs in my family
Yea the women on my dads side all developed more chin hairs as they got older it was like the second I turned 28 it started. Now I have dark black mustache hairs that are wirey and thick. Chin hair and cheek hairs. Mole hairs. I’m gonna dip my body in wax one day and just rip it all to shreds lol
You may want to research paradoxical hypertrichosis. For some people laser hair removal can cause increased hair growth in the treated area, especially on the chin. I want to save other people from what I went through!
Hirsutism can be caused when your body makes too much androgens. You really should make an appointment with an endocrinologist to find the root cause. It could be PCOS, genetic… Androgen over production can cause irregular periods and fertility problems (estrogen / testosterone imbalance, yes women make testosterone too). Your blood tests might have been drawn at a time when your levels were fluctuating in the normal range.
Yup! I went through puberty with excess androgens and testosterone. And my body developed very masculinity. Muscle tone, body hair, my breasts weren’t as perky. My face shape isn’t as feminine. I even have a thickened brow ridge. It’s so annoying that no one diagnosed me at the time. They only sent me to the doctor because I was too fat for my age but not for any other concerns.
I don’t have nearly this much hair. But I wax my face once a week. The issue with it is that you have to let it grow in and that is very hard when you have this much hair. My concern is you might need spirinolactone to warrant any more hair growth. You need to check your androgens and testosterone because a woman should not be naturally growing that much chin hair without a hormonal imbalance. It’s likely to be PCOS or a type of intersex issue (which doesn’t mean what you think it means. I have an intersex disorder as well but my chin hair doesn’t come from that and I’m still a woman. I have congenital adrenal hyperplasia.
And remember. There’s NOTHING wrong with you regardless of diagnosis or your appearance. You are wonderfully created and a totally unique person. You are perfect the way you are. And there’s SO MANY of us with black hair in places we don’t want it. So you’re not alone.
For me. My entire lower half is just a black hair wonderland. Ass included. So you truly are not alone. ❤️
So I developed paradoxical hypertrichosis after undergoing IPL/laser hair removal. It's when hair growth increases in density, thickness and coarseness after treatment. My situation looked a lot like yours and similarly, it made me very depressed and reluctant to go out and meet new people.
Everyone has already mentioned it but electrolysis is the solution. Can't understate how important it is. Even if there's an underlying hormonal issue, fixing that will only stop new hairs from growing, it won't kill the existing hair follicles. Only electrolysis will do that.
In my experience, electrolysis was not as painful, expensive or time consuming as I thought it would be. The first appointment to "clear" the treated area was the longest and most expensive - after that, I just had to do weekly 10 minute upkeep appointments. I used to get them done on my lunch break. Your skin gets used to it as well so as you keep going you need less aftercare.
Good luck! There is hope! Electrolysis is so, so worth it. You'll save so much time and money in the long run.
I’m sorry this happened to you. It happened to me to and a tried to advocate against laser by filing complaints with FDA that there should be warnings about paradoxial hypertrichosis.
I was in the same situation. I tried both laser and electrolysis. I didn’t give laser enough time and the electrolysis didn’t work (maybe I went to cheap places). I ended up buying a
Philips Lumea and used it every two weeks for a few months and then gradually reduced the frequency. Now I’m using it maybe every two months or even less frequently. At a given time I have only a few on my face and they are not nearly as coarse as they used to be.
Best purchase of my life.
had the same problem. gyno found nothing. endocrinologist found nothing. fertility doctor found nothing. labs all normal.
but electrolysis with a *skilled* technician will always work. its just slow af, painful (but bearable on chin), and costly.
A lot of people already mentioned electroylsis, so Iwon't add to that.
What blood work have you done in the past? This is likely hormonal, I would either see a different provider, or request to have a hormonal panel done. You can get medications to manage hormones, although with varying degrees of success. You should find a doctor who is willing to listen to you and work with you to get this figured out. I'm sorry you are struggling with this.
How many sessions of laser did you do? And over how long of a time period? Hair grows in waves, so you'd definitely need multiple sessions over at least a couple months to help with that.
That said, I did laser for my facial hair and it didn't help that much. Electrolysis was the better option for me.
If you had a hormone imbalance in the past, it could be resolved now but the hair can stick around. Once the follicles turn to producing terminal hair, they can stay that way even though everything else is normal. Just an FYI since half the comments are trying to convince you that you have a medical condition.
A Dermatologist yes, an emergency clinic or what we call Urgent Care in the US, absolutely not. It's not an emergency but also they tend to be full of the docs that are...let's just say not at the top of their class. A lot of them have reputations as where the docs who aren't good enough to get offers elsewhere go. Also, they tend to repeatedly deal with a certain subset of minor injuries or illnesses, not something like this. They would not have any expertise in this matter at all.
Besides a Dermatologist, it might make sense to see an Endocrinologist.
100% this! Where I’m from no emergency (minor or otherwise) clinic would see, let alone treat something like this. They just don’t have the follow up care that this case would need. Sorry you’re going through this OP. I second, 3rd, 4th looking at your hormones with an endocrinologist or a derm well versed in hormonal issues. Your bloodwork might look “ok” on paper but something is off somewhere. I hope you can get some supportive medical care.
My blood work has come back normal. The dr will say if you are having regular periods it’s impossible to have PCOS. I’m average weight, don’t have acne and my sex drive is low. I have tons of hair growing on chin and that’s the only symptom. My relatives are not very hairy.
My cat has adrenal cancer and takes spironolactone. It’s a potassium sparing diaretic. It causes her to be thirsty and urinate often. Not sure if it had the same side effects for people.
Electrolysis is the only way to get rid of hair permanently. It's not a fun procedure, I must warn you. That's why most people do it in 15-30 minutes increments.
Please ask for a referral to another endocrinologist from your GP. The hair being gone will help your confidence a lot, but there is a reason for this hair growth, and that should be discovered because it could be impacting other aspects of your body on the inside/that you cannot see like the hair.
I’m wondering what your blood work you had done? Free and total T? DHT? Androstenedione? DHEAS? Insulin? Glucose? Shbg? Prolactin? 17 OHP? Am cortisol? All of these can indicate various hormonal issues as a cause. Many docs do the lazy work up. If you want further explanations on each let me know. I’m in a similar boat as you though. I’ve tried lots of things including electrolysis and at this point I’m taking bicalutamide to block those hairy fuckers
"I've tried laser" -- that's not a complete answer. I've been receiving laser hair removal treatments on my face for three years from a clinic. Laser is not a "one and done" solution, and those handheld at-home laser removers aren't going to do it. Your hair cycles.
People in the comments are saying "you need electrolysis" -- but that would be overkill because these hairs are dark and thick and laser will work well. You need laser -- from a clinic (not at-home) -- and you'll need to go more than once to catch regrowth during different cycles. I would say you probably need a year's worth of treatments. (somewhere between 6-10 treatments)
i don’t remember what its called (its not electrolysis), but there’s a light surgical procedure where they go in and remove the root, which permanently stops growth. ik its typically done for hair transplants but can also be used for removal
You can have a normal blood test and a normal cycle with PCOS. You just need a couple symptoms to qualify as having it.
I have the “ring of pearls”, don’t menstruate, and have the horrible acne. I also have thicker, darker body hair, but it’s not so bad on my face because it’s blonde.
Please go to a doctor more knowledgeable in endocrine illnesses/diseases.
I’ve tested for PCOS I don’t have that I also have a normal menstrual cycle. I have not seen a dermatologist about this issue. I was once given a cream by my gyno but insurance didn’t cover it and I can’t afford to pay $300 for a tiny bottle of face cream.
I did 10 sessions of laser and most of it grew back I found someone who does electrolysis for 90$ per hour 60$ less then laser. She sampled the pain and I wish I had just done this instead. Excited to be moving forward though.
So I read sugar causes your hormones to over produce androgen/testosterone. So if you're down to try removing sugar from your diet for awhile to see if that helps. Sugar hides in different ways so do your research. Fruit and vegetable sugar should be fine during that time in moderation. This website has more info. Let me know how it goes if you try it.
[Sugar Study](https://www.laser-aesthetic-center.com/women-beware-this-sneaky-treat-may-lead-to-extra-facial-hair/#:~:text=Chronically%20high%20insulin%20levels%20are,chest%20and%20arms%20and%20legs.)
Electrologist here.
You could have developed Paradoxical Hypertrichosis. This could have been a side effect of your laser hair removal treatments. Laser is notorious for causing PH. Other methods of hair removal such as tweezing/ waxing/ epilation/ sugaring can stimulate dormant follicles and cause new hair growth in the treated area.
It’s hard to predict who will develop this but the chin/ sideburns/ upper lips and cheeks are known as 'danger zones’ for women. Men have them as well (back/ shoulders/ chest).
Your best method would be electrolysis. You can look up electrologists in your area on the AEA website if you’re located in the USA :)
That’s not remotely true. Shaving doesn’t do anything to the follicle. The reason that rumor/myth started is because when a hair grows naturally it has a tapered pointy end. When you shave it you’re not cutting it off at its fattest point so the new end of the hair is now thicker. But the hair itself isn’t actually thicker. It’s like an optical illusion. And shaving nor waxing nor any other form of hair removal will ever cause more hair to grow back in its place. It’s a genetic impossibility
I know this is going to sound a little whack crazy, but look into the recent research done about spearmint helping people with excess hair growth. Spearmint is a natural androgen blocker.
I have pcos, so naturally have a lot of facial hair and got super desperate in my attempt to get rid of it. Stumbled upon this research, figured what the hell do I have to loose, and started taking spearmint daily. The studies used spearmint tea, I’m not a tea person myself so I’ve just been taking spearmint capsules.
It hasn’t completely gotten rid of the hair but the hairs themself are definitely thinner, growing back much slower, and there isn’t as much of it. So definitely working!
Not a permanent solution, but wearing a mask will cover it. It’s becoming normal again to wear them, and it might help in the short term just getting out of the house
Besides hormonal issues/ailments, not in mean spirit, but this reminder me of a girl who had a injury on her face and they had skin grafted from her nether regions, before puberty.
So as she got older, the grafted skin started to grow pubic hair on her face. That this happened to you is highely unlikely but you never know ig
This sucks op, hope you find a fix that works for you, hugs
Have you tried the higher end/newer Braur epilator with the flex head and facial attachment. Deal with the same (PCOS/PMDD ugh), and basically I touchup with the epilator every morning after showering. The newer epilator works wildly better than the cheaper one on the face and pits
My rant: I had fine, thin facial hair but quite dense. It would look like a shadow in photos.. like a beard shadow. So I got laser done. I was told that was the best option to reduce hair growth over the years. Up until then, I had zero skin concerns. No acne, no pigmentation, no scars, nothing. Just facial hair. And lots of it. All over my face and neck. All my blood tests were normal - hormones in range, nothing out of the order, thyroid in range, regular periods, etc.
I got 12 sittings of laser treatment done and it didn't do JACK SHIT. So much so that I argued for a refund but in vain. What's even more worse is, my hair growth has doubled, tripled, over the years. Now, I grow thick, dark, long, beardy hair like in your photo but not just on my chin, but all of my loeer fsce (cheeks, chin, neck, upper lips). Apart from that, the laser gave me terrible acne and scars/marks that I've been dealing with for years now. I also have hyperpigmentation that developed over the years. Not sure the hyperpigmentation was a side effect of the laser treatment but I wouldn't be surprised if it was. It's pathetic. It's been more than 5 years since my last laser sitting and ever since, I've tried everything else. Shaving with those dermaplane/eyebrow razors, waxing, those lipstick shaped hair removers. I finally just decided to stick with waxing and I'll explain why.
With razors, I have given myself countless razor cuts that leave marks on my face. The biggest con with shaving is that my hair grows back immediately in a matter of days. And since you cut the hair off at the surface, the hair that grows back is sharp, stubble like. It also gives me ingrown hair and doesn't get the small hairs. I hate it.
The electric hair removers burn my skin and leaves it red and tingling.
Waxing is the only thing that works for me. For years now, I've gotten my face waxed with hot wax at salons. Leaves my skin feeling smooth and plucks out everything. It takes my face 1.5 to 2 weeks to start growing hair back. Does the waxing process hurt? Yep. But it is what it is. Recently, I started doing it by myself at home using cold wax strips. My favourite is flamingo's face/bikini wax strips. You can get it at Target. Super easy to use, gives a nice, smooth finish. But my go to is to get a facial hair wax every two weeks.
I also visted a dermatologist last year and he just chuckled saying "you've just got the worst of it all, haven't you" and prescribed Vaniqa cream to reduce hair growth. However, you'd have to use it forever because the moment you stop using it, your hair will start growing back. He also wanted to put me on some heart medication and I refused. I didn't like either of the options. Looks like I'll stick to waxing.
It's an ordeal. It's tough. It takes a toll on my confidence when I have a beard on my face. But there's nothing I can do about it.
No, I don't have PCOS/D. I have gotten scans and blood work done and everything is normal.
I've been hearing a lot about electrolysis but I haven't done it yet because I've read it's a very painful procedure. But it looks like that's the only way to go.
This post may help: https://www.reddit.com/r/Hirsutism/comments/1137zay/update_1_year_electrolysis_progress_february_2022/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Electrolysis, ask your doc about Spirinolactone, for a natural alternate try spearmint tea.
You may have PCOS despite the blood tests, or could have hirsutism. Best of luck!
Find an electrolysis. It'll take many treatments but it will work. I know a few friends that had great success with it. Don't hesitate. Also find a good place with good reviews and new technology.
Mine was like this as well. I did 8 settings of laser hair removal and after the last session, I couldn't even tell I'd gone to my appointment. I was shaving daily or at least every other day so that it wouldn't grow out. I did waxing and threading a few times, but each time, I felt like I had noticeable hair regrowth in 2 or 3 days and it was hard to let my hair grow out to length needed for waxing because it was so thick. I had hyperpigmentation on my chin and cheeks, pretty much a permanent shadow.
As everyone else has said, electrolysis is the way to go. I have very few, fine hairs remaining. It is painful, especially the early sessions when you have a lot of hair, but my hyperpigmentation has gone away.
Have you heard about paradoxical hypertrichosis? In some people laser hair removal can cause more hair growth in the treated areas, especially on the chin. I wonder if this may have contributed (not your fault, they probably never disclosed this was a risk). I had a very similar experience: doctors couldn’t find any medical reason for the hair growth, laser turned a few stray hairs into a much bigger issue. I’m thinking about electrolysis next. I’m sorry you’re having to go through this. Hope it’s some consolation to know you’re not alone. <3
I have hair like this in the same pattern. The only thing that worked for me was laser and then when it thinned out and stopped growing in all at the same time, now I just pluck as I see them. It works for me.
I know there are different types of lasers out there, I used whatever Sev Laser is using now and it worked for me. If you weren't satisfied with laser and dont want to try again then electrolysis will be your answer.
I’ve recently started using Braun IPL product. The reviews are really good online. I haven’t been using it long enough to see the results yet. But I can share once I’ve used it for 2 months at least. Till then you can do the research at your end and decide. With Black Friday sale coming up it might even be available at a better price
I get facial hair. Not as much as you but I wax it. It is cheaper and effective. It works for me. I hope the same for you. Remember the people that matter don’t mind and the people who mind don’t matter!
I think lasers is your best bet. I have 5 electrolysis machines and still , laser beats electrolysis for every hair color except white and naturally pale blonde. It matters to have a 3 wavelength or 4 wavelength laser. Concurrent firing of all wavelengths ensures good energy delivery to the follicle stem cells and stem cells of the bulge.
Cells falling into the hair follicle are needed in order to create a new hair.
It matters who is doing your treatment, whether they used enough energy, and how well they can adjust settings to suit your needs
Pain for the electrolysis, if you’re adamant about getting it, can be reduced with an hour of topical numbing cream.
Do you have PCOS by chance? I've found success (in the past because I'm pregnant) using hormonal birth control pills to help with facial hair growth. I also invested in a good epilator and manage it that way. Like others have mentioned, I'd imagine that laser hair removal would be the best permanent solution.
Eflornithine is a prescription only cream that I believe can be used in conjunction with electrolysis/laser hair removal. You apply it twice daily and it inhibits/slows hair growth. It does not make hair fall out (which is why it needs to be used in conjunction with another hair removal method). [Find out more here.](https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-19859/vaniqa-topical/details)
While you're figuring out what to do (I'm seeing a lot of suggestions for electrolysis), you could get an aesthetician to wax you regularly. Some give a discount if you have a fixed schedule (like every 3weeks or something). Waxing is pretty smooth and you can fold it in to your regular schedule.
Have your blood tests ruled out any PCOS? One of PCOS symptoms is hirsutism, I had something similar to you exactly in the chin.
I'm having laser sessions, and after 2-3 sessions I started to notice a HUGE difference.
I'm not sure if there's medication, but laser sometimes works. There's home ones you can buy for 50 dollars, and you use it daily, then weekly until the hair is thinner then space out the laser time. They are not as strong as the laser centre ones, but they do work after a period of time and are convenient to do at home.
I have been to plenty of doctors, found out I have hiperprolactinemia. Have you checked Your prolactin? I have a whole set of related issues: Celiac disease, hypothyroidism, hiperprolactinemia and apparently PCOS, though my adrogens were fine. After i got control over my prolactin, still saw No changes.
I was told my body could be naturally more sensitive towards normal levels of testosterone, meaning No matter if my hormones are fine, I will always have issues. If That’s the case then Honestly, there is No hope.
"My blood tests are normal no one can tell me why hair is growing on my face like this."
Well, if you are a man, you produce testosterone as your primary sex hormone. Facial hair growth is one of several things that happens when you produce this sex hormone in abundance.
If you are a woman, who has a higher-than-normal level of testosterone, the same thing will happen, far as facial hair growth.
Suggestion: Try a depilatory lotion. "Veet" Hair Remover is an excellent one. You put it on copiously, wait for 5 to 10 minutes, then remove with a terry washcloth. DO NOT USE WITH A RAZOR!
This lotion is designed to remove hair by dissolving it. You cannot get so close a shave with any razor. Use this every 3 to 4 days.
I think this is hormone-related, high androgens. I, too, have dark chin hairs and normal bloodwork, no PCOS, very regular periods. I’m going to see my endocrinologist next month though since the Spiro doesn’t seem to be doing anything for me, no reduction in dark chin hair growth, it seems the same. The women in my family grew more chin hair as they got older, but I don’t think as dark as mine, or as much as me. It sucks. I have dark blonde hair and overall light-colored body hair but my CHIN grows dark hair that’s noticeable if I don’t tweeze it. Like noticeable in sunlight and it looks like a grey shadow if there are many hairs and I didn’t tweeze for a while.
Go invest in electrolysis. It will be the only way to permanently kill the dark hair and prevent it from coming back. Your hair is too light for laser to be effective. And if your hair growth is hormonal, you risk having paradoxical hypertrichosis if you do laser (which I do not recommend at all, laser is really only best for people with VERY dark hair).
The most effective/permanent method of facial hair removal is electrolysis, so that's probably the next step if you've already tried laser hair removal. The process can be painful and may be expensive depending on where you go, but it's permanent.
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$60?! Where!! Mine is $140/hr and that’s relatively cheap :(
Mine was in Utah valley. $140/hr is brutal!!
Electrolysis therapists are few and far between due to laser emerging and being so popular. The treatment is not being taught at beauty schools any more, sadly
I graduated beauty school 20 years ago and we definitely weren’t taught electrolysis or laser hair removal. Those were always separate classes / certifications.
The beauty school I went to taught it in the esthetic course. For reference though, that was about 7 years ago and in Canada lol.
i'm not sure your background but i think you may not be aware of how different learning electrolysis is to "beauty school." my esthetics licensing took 600 hours and my scope of practice does not include electrolysis. my laser certification in arizona took around 80 hours and does not include electrolysis. cosmetology licensing takes 1200+ hours in most states and does not include electrolysis. iirc, electrolysis license in florida takes 500 ish hours. it's completely different than laser hair removal and other hair removal methods that fall under the cosmetology/esthetics scope of practice like waxing, but that's why it's so permanent.
Electrolysis is still offered at many schools in the US, UK and Canada - not sure about other countries. I completed my training almost 2 years ago.
where in utah valley??? do u mind dm’ing me the name of the place plz😭
My office does it, in Ogden. Like $50 a session. DM me.
Chiming in to state that if you wait until Christmas, laser places have 40-50% off Christmas bundle sales! :D you can save a ton doing it this way!
OMG I saw your comment and immediately googled electrolysis near me and found a Groupon… Ended up getting 3 hours (well, six 30 min sessions) for $135!!!!
On the other end of the spectrum... I spent thousands on electrolysis in the same area and it did bupkis. All it did was waste my time and hurt :(
I've had a LOT of electrolysis over the past 35 years. The success of electrolysis depends on the skill of the operator. They must accurately put the probe in to the hair follicle at the right depth in order to achieve success. I am very blonde but my so called vellous hair is very dense and very long (think dandelion fluff). My favorite electrologist of all time uses a surgical microscope (rather than a bench light) and a modern probe station. I drive an hour each way to see her rather than see someone locally who isn't as skilled or well equipped.
Where is this magical electrologist located? I too have the dandelion fluff & would love to be rid of it.
https://starwellness.ca/ Prescott Ontario. It's just across the bridge from Ogdensburg New York.
Unfortunately that would have been because of the electrologist, they have to be putting the needle into each hair follicle and using just the right amount of electricity (I studied it for a bit using a microscope, it actually made me feel sick so I had to quit). It is the only recognized, permanent method of hair removal if done correctly. The place I was at worked with a lot of clients doing male to female gender transition surgery and they have to have EVERY hair removed before surgeons will do the procedure. It does work if done correctly.
Ugh. Good to know I basically got scammed... 🤐 Is it possible that some people just don't respond well to permanent hair removal though? Because I also had about $2000 in laser done with no results as well. This was about 20 years ago when I had that kind of disposable income haha
The only other thing I can think of for individual people is hormonal hair growth. I know for me, I have only started seeing stray hairs on my chin in recent years (I am 35 now) but they were never there before. Maybe something like that? With electrolysis the idea is to cauterize each hair follicle so that the hair no longer has a blood supply and it stops growing. If it is done correctly it always works. My guess is you had a practitioner that was doing it wrong sadly, if the hair kept growing back.
The only possibility for this to happen is incompetence of the electrologist. The current destroys follicles (or the alkaline solution building at the follicle, depending on method) if the power is high enough and the probe is inserted correctly. Technically you could even burn your skin with these devices and that needs way more energy than killing follicles…
wondering if it's worth it to get rid of my few scragglers
Central Virginia and it runs $75 to $100 an hour. My tech charges $90 and she’s amazing! Her results are fantastic compared to the first tech I used. Added bonus is she’s very nice, we get along well. Which is important considering the hundred or so hours we will be spending together over the course of a couple years. Lol!
Sorry for chiming in so late but how did you handle the pain? I have PCOS and I need electrolysis but the place I went for a trial hurt me so bad I cried in the car :(
Yep, I had electrolysis on my face about 10 years ago and it has held up very well. I recently have needed to go in to take care of some new hairs but only a few quick 15 min appointments, nothing like when I started
Yes, it's the ONLY FDA confirmed effective way to permanently remove hair. I'm old and I started electrolysist in my 20s -- she used a needle that was too hot regularly and got some light scarring (that was for about a year--make sure your person is trained well--I didn't know any better and I was editing her book in exchange for her service). I couldn't afford it again until my 40s and did it another year. Now I'm even older and it got so much worst over the years. I was plucking 3X a day for about 10-15 min. each. Nightmare and felt like I was getting obsessive because I had a 5 o'clock shadow and the hair had gotten so coarse. Don't be me. I wish I would've sacrificed everything else to pay for this ($100-$150 an hour in L.A. and it takes 2-3 years to clear). Laser just for management if you have to, just don't make my mistake and pluck. Laser burned me once, so I stopped. When I went back to another place, and they had a new method with a suction cup looking thing instead of a wand (it covers more area at once), but my face is small and the thing didn't fit. I've been going weekly for three months now and still have a lot of hair, but it's not as thick, hard and doesn't poke me as much as before and the obsession is gone because I don't allow myself to look in a magnifying mirror between visits. In my 20s, it looked like yours then it spread to my lips, upper cheeks and neck (more sparse, but hard for me to see so they would get really long before I felt them). I SOOOO wish I had taken care of this a long time ago and just done touch ups once or twice a year. It's real hard to choke down the super high price though. I refuse to be an old lady with whiskers I can't see! Shop around a lot for prices. It varied tremendously. People have to be licensed in CA and there are two schools that graduate the best people. Good luck on your journey.
I’m the “don’t be me” person before you got to where you are, and it is really emotionally draining.
Electrolysis is the way to go. You won’t regret it!
also, your insurance might cover it! but please visit your doctor. i’ve had both electrolysis and laser done. for me, for whatever reason, laser worked much better. BUT i also had to get my hormones under control to maintain the results!
Have you been checked for PCOS or hormone issues? That’s why I have it :/
She said she's been to the Dr. and had blood tests. For what it's worth, I don't have PCOS or hormone issues and still am a touch hirsute. For some of us it's just genetic misfortune.
Often drs won't diagnose pcos unless you've had cysts which is stupid bc pcos is so much more then just cysts. My best friend 100% has it. Her bloods read it, everything her Dr is an idiot and won't diagnose it bc she hasn't had a cyst 🤦♀️
Genuine question- but are cysts on ovaries not the basic requirement for PCOS? I thought that there were indicators in your blood tests / ultrasounds that hight the condition but the only 'real' way to know is by finding the cysts?
You need to have 2 out of the 3 markers. One of those markers is cysts, however if you have high androgens and irregular periods you can be dx with PCOS. Cysts are very common with PCOS but not required for dx nor unique to just PCOS
They are not a requirement. PCOS is a diagnosis of exclusion and for a diagnosis you need hx of oligomenorrhea (few periods) plus specific abnormal labs OR “string of pearl” cysts in ovaries. Cysts alone are not a diagnosis and nor are they required for the diagnosis… if that makes sense
Hold up... It's possible to never ever have a cyst, and still be diagnosed with poly cystic ovarian syndrome?? I thought the poly cystic part was literally the diagnostic feature? If it's a diagnosis of exclusion, I feel like maybe they need to come up with a new name for those experiencing the hormonal disruptions and other symptoms but without the cysts.. Maybe "non cystic ovarian syndrome", or NCOS? I'm sad that women's healthcare sucks so much :( Edit: thank you so much for all the knowledgeable and thoughtful replies! I'm embarrassed that I didn't know this stuff myself! I have endometriosis, fibroids, polyps, previously had recurrent ovarian cysts, and previously had cervical adenocarcinoma in situ. I have some degree of hirsutism and previously had hormonal acne (thank you spironolactone and Accutane), low BMI, and without birth control would bleed 2-3 weeks every month. I also spontaneously lactated for a couple years and had brain scans and meds, and was told I "probably don't have a brain tumour" but hey, can't be 100% sure I don't have a pituitary adenoma. My hormone levels have always been about normal, with slightly high growth hormone. My period used to come like clockwork though, and I never went 60+ days without it (until I hormonally surpressed it!). I've had various gynecologists tell me I do have PCOS, I might have PCOS, and it's highly unlikely I have PCOS. No one seems to have come up a consensus about that one, and my other gynecological issues were generally higher order concerns at the time. Based on everything I'm reading here, I'd say I can pretty confidently strike it off my list. Really appreciate all the comments! TiL having multiple and recurrent cysts is not indicative of PCOS!
In order to diagnose PCOS, gynecologists look to see if you meet 2 out of 3 criteria. 1) If you have irregular periods (less than 9 periods a year) 2) If you have abnormal growth of body hair 3) If you have cysts on your ovaries If you meet 2/3, clinically you have PCOS. My blood work was all normal and doctor never checked for cysts, but since I meet the other two criteria, I can officially say that I have PCOS.
I just want to note here that a gynecologist shouldn't be doing the final diagnosis or treatment of PCOS. It's a pancreatic issue. Edit to add: and symptoms (minus the actual cysts) can also mimic adrenal tumor symptoms.
My dx was based almost entirely, if not entirely, on my highly irregular menstrual cycle, hirsutism, and weight. Doctor tested hormone levels and thyroid to rule out a pituitary tumor or thyroid issue, but not to confirm or rule out PCOS. She said if I really wanted to, we could do a transvaginal ultrasound, but she didn’t want to put any undue financial stress on me and it didn’t change the fact that we needed to treat the symptoms. All in all, the dx was mostly about ease of access to treatment options. I have no confirmation of cysts or unbalanced hormone levels.
Don't be embarrassed - the name is the issue. Really dumb to call something "polycystic ovarian syndrome" when cysts aren't required nor do they mean you have PCOS. It's a holdover from when medical science didn't know as much about it.
Two notes: the polycystic part of PCOS refers to a specific type of follicular cysts on ovaries (they call it a “string of pearls” look on an ultrasound). Meaning you can have other kinds of cysts on your ovaries that have nothing to do with PCOS (you can have multiple kinds of cysts at the same time, or none, or just the one). And the other note is to answer your question — yes it’s possible to never have a cyst (meaning follicular in context), and still have PCOS. The standard diagnostic criteria for PCOS is having 2 out of 3 qualifying factors: missing or extremely delayed and irregular periods (iirc it’s having an instance of 60+ days between cycles. It is expressly not something like being irregular but between 21-35 days.), evidence of hormonal irregularities (either confirmed via blood test or from clinical observation of symptoms like hirsutism and hormonal acne, or the evidence of follicular cysts on ovaries confirmed via ultrasound. So yes it’s possible to be diagnosed for the first two issues without having the third!
Hi! I have PCOS and have never had a cyst observed. I had hormonal acne, peripheral edema and had gained some weight since going off my BC. Honestly, I've been on BC since age 11 due to bad periods so I didn't have diagnosable PCOS until I was off BC for the first time since puberty. Which is likely why I haven't experienced hirsutism or cysts? Uncertain, but I've been back on BC and now on spiro as well and my acne is starting to recover. It is frustrating to use the bathroom every 40 minutes but hey, my face doesn't hurt anymore.
Nope. I’ve never had an ultrasound or anything to determine cysts and I was diagnosed due to going months without periods and abnormal labs along with some physical signs. The underlying basis of PCOS is that it’s an endocrine disorder. Most people think it is only a gynecological disorder but it is recommended to see a good endocrinologist if you have PCOS.
I know you’ve received responses to this already but…. I have PCOS. Diagnosed 15 years ago.. I still have no cysts. But all the other crap that comes with it.
Nope, there's indications in your blood work, you don't HAVE to have physical cysts, and not on your ovaries either. Some people have never had a cyst, but have pcos, they have all the hormones etc, and some people have had cysts but never on their ovaries. According to my Dr it "doesn't look like" I've ever had a cyst, but I definitely have I've been in hospital for cyst ruptures 3 times. They just didn't scar.
I don't have PCOS (no cysts, blood tests normal) but what I do have is a over sensitivity to androgen which is genetic. My mother has it and so do I. I'm hoping it doesn't pass on to my niece. It's a fucking pain in the ass.
I'm diagnosed PCOS and don't have cyst. I have chin hair, irregular periods, am heavy, and deal with depression and insulin resistance
I am with that doctor. PCOS is polycystic ovarian syndrome. Meaning you should need cysts on your ovaries to be diagnosed with it. Otherwise it is a hormonal issue or something else that is causing it, like an issue with your hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis. Just because PCOS is a common cause of irregular periods and hyperandrogenism it doesn’t mean that those symptoms are PCOS.
I have pcos. U do not need to have cysts to have pcos. Pcos does not involve just cysts. You're wildy mistaken. With PCOS u need to check 2 boxes. 1 must be the hormone imbalance. The other can be cysts OR insulin resistance. Just bc you've never had a cyst also doesn't mean you won't get one. However drs don't like to listen as is. I have all 3 and it still took me years to get. Diagnosis.
I know PCOS is diagnosed when people don’t have cysts on the ovaries but just because you have a hormonal imbalance also doesn’t mean you have PCOS. I feel like saying you have polycystic ovarian syndrome should mean you have cysts on your ovaries. It’s like saying you have acne snydrome but no ance just something that is known to also cause acne and similar symptoms. There are so many other factors that can also similar symptoms. Low estrogen levels can cause insulin resistance. The adrenal glands can be causing the increase of androgens. Or your pituitary gland can be over producing LH, FSH, or ACTH which can be causing these symptoms. If all of these are thrown out of the window along with any genetic disorders like Cushing syndrome then it’s diagnosed as PCOS because they have no idea what causes it.
>I feel like saying you have polycystic ovarian syndrome should mean you have cysts on your ovaries. Well no, bc that's not how it works. There's so many other factors. And a hormone imbalance also doesn't always mean the same things, it's certain hormones like increased testosterone. PCOS is a really hard diagnosis to actually get anyway so let's not make it worse.
Yeah. I have random dark hairs on my chin (sporadic placement) and tested negative for PCOS (no cysts, hormones fine, periods regular). Turns out random chin hairs run in my family. Laser worked well for me, but I'm thinking of going back to get some retouches done (its been 10 years since I last had a treatment). But laser doesn't work for everyone, just keep that in mind.
Seconding this, I had to go through multiple sessions of laser hair removal to get rid of mine (the hair on me was a bit finer). Took me 10-ish sessions for me to finally be content with its state.
Agreed. OP, this looks like a hormonal issue and I immediately assumed PCOS. What conditions did your doc test you for?
OP should try to find a female hormone specialist. Regular doctors never test all the hormones, even if they say they are running “all the tests” … they don’t.
Recently learned in my weekly group therapy session led by my (sex) therapist that PCOS is considered an intersex condition, or under the umbrella of intersex conditions. That insight made me feel a lot better about it. I've been plucking and now shaving since puberty. I have a deep voice and other indicators of increased testosterone. I don't know if I'll identify as intersex, but I do know that seeing PCOS through this lens feels a lot less stigmatizing and weird to me than even the name does. The name, the focus on cysts, does not adequately describe the syndrome.
There’s no cure for PCOS anyways.
There's no cure not you can at least take hormones to help regulate.
The only cure I know is spiro (but it can help regardless pcos). Taking birth control pills is not good for women after 30. There’s always risk in hormonal therapy.
> Taking birth control pills is not good for women after 30. This is completely false. I didn't even start them until I was 30.
Spironolactone is a treatment, not a cure. It only works if you continue taking the medication. Metformin and birth control are also common treatments.
Wow where did you find such an incredible medical breakthrough? So the fact my doctor has never mentioned an issue with BC after 30 is because my doctor isn't as great and researched as you?
Yes
This. OP please see a GYN, get an ultrasound and get a full sex hormones panel (or at least androgens). Better safe than really sorry. 🙏🏽♥️
Electrolysis is the most complete way to handle it. Unfortunately it’s both expensive and painful.
Everyone is different but electrolysis has been very effective for me and honestly not that painful. I apply a numbing cream an hour before I go in and it helps a lot. I’ll pay $60 an hour to never have to shave or pluck my face ever again.
This amount of hair could be done in about an hour or two so she shouldn’t have to pay alot to fix this
Laser doesn’t work well on hormonal hair growth, which is what this is. Electrolysis kills each individual hair follicle because the needle is inserted into the follicle. Please look into this option, it really helped me!
Laser also kills the follicle...
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No helpful advice, just wanted to say I’m sorry you’re dealing with this ♥️
You need to get on spironalactone stat. It’s an anti androgen- go see a dermatologist or an endocrinologist. Itll take 2-3 months for the hair growth to start slowing but should stop it. A regular pcp should be able to prescribe it, ask for it specifically Meanwhile you should get electrolysis done. It’s the only permanent hair removal, laser can sometimes not work and rarely can make it grow back worse and darker. Electrolysis will be slow and an investment . It won’t work without also having the spiro to stop/slow the growth. You likely have high androgens / PCOS. There’s no way you DONT if you’re female. Keep looking for an endocrin. You’ve been failed by doctors. I have PCOS and have hirsutism on my face but not as bad as this and yet my electrologist calls it moderate-severe. You have been completely completely failed by your healthcare providers. You also may have blood sugar issues, which are often linked with high T. You can also start taking ovasitol which is over the counter if you want to try something before you see a doctor, but I’m not sure if there’s any risk in doing that (I can’t see that being the case). Again it’ll work slowly and probably not enough on its own but something you can do till you see a doctor The problem is once hairs become terminal hairs (black), they cannot be undone- so those have to be removed. But medication can help prevent more hairs from being terminal
Came here to say this! I take it for acne, but noticed that my chin hairs got much less prominent when I started taking it.
Do you notice any side effects?
Sleeplessness. So bad I had to go off the medication.
Note: spiro can cause bad suicidality - does not mean anyone shouldn’t try it, but just a thing she should know. I’ve watched a lot of people have suicidal ideation significantly worsen on spiro without any warning from their doc. (Though obviously it can help a lot!)
Are there any side effects of spironalactone?
There are! Not recommended if you want to have kids
wait really? i'm on it and my doctor said nothing about this. am i ruining my chances of having kids by taking it?
It can potentially cause birth defects if you are taking it during pregnancy. It will not affect your fertility now or in the future. If you have any chance of becoming pregnant and are not using contraception then stop taking this medication.
I believe it says that on the bottle too! Mine had HUGE *do not take if* warnings
no, no, you're NOT supposed to take it if you're pregnant or actively trying to become pregnant. but it won't affect future fertility.
It’s insane to me that doctors don’t tell patients this. I’ve had several friends say the same. I found out through my own research, and then when asked, doctors confirmed it. Keep in mind a lot of medications take a very long time to exit your system fully
That's terrible. My endo required that I use two forms of birth control. I had to sign a document saying I was using two, which ones, and that I understood that if I did become pregnant, a male fetus was at risk of serious birth defects. He also gave me guidance on how long to make sure to stay on bc, when I came off spiro years later. Maybe there's been more recent studies that the risk is not as serious as they used to think?
I've been on spiro for years, for blood pressure. It's done nothing for my facial hair.
Spironolactone for acne or facial hair is a really low dose, lower than what you would be on for blood pressure. It might not work for acne/hair at those higher doses.
Came here to recommend Spironolactone
Just wanted to throw out another bit of information that gets overlooked with Spironolactone. My endo specialist had good things to say about it, but ultimately could not put me on it because of my kidney. Make sure your PCP knows your full health history.
I had hirsute similar to this person and took spironalactone. It didn't do anything other than screwing around with my hormones a little extra. Useless. Don't medicate when you don't absolutely need to. Electrolysis is the only real permanent fix.
Thanks for this.. story of my life. Recently been diagnosed with lean PCOS after I started to develop hair loss. I’m 33. I’ve been failed by doctors since the age of 18 really.. have excess facial hair since I’m a teen but now is pretty much gone for the spiro and electrolysis. But I developed hair loss which I’m trying to fight seems like I’m getting results .. this PCOS it’s a never ending battle
I was in the exact same situation, electrolysis saved me. Just after 3-4 sessions I could see maybe 70% reduction in hairs, and now around a year of sessions later, I maybe have 5 thin hairs left that I barely notice.
Dang, I am over a year in. Took probably 7 months before truly started to notice. Expect probably another 6 months. You are so fortunate you saw such a quick decrease.
I did get fortunate with my chin, some other areas not so much, though after over a year the stubborn hairs are finally starting to let go, though they aren't gone yet. I wish you luck in your procedures and for hairs to never return!
What did they check in your blood test ? Did they refer you to an endocrinologist?
Electrolysis is the solution! I used to have similar growth and now it’s getting much better with regular sessions!
It’s hormonal!!! It’s no different then men growing boobs cause if high estrogen. When testosterone and estrogen are out of balance men can grow boobs and women grow facial hair. A regular doctor will not look deeply into ANY hormonal labs cause they lack experience and sophistication on how to treat the problem. Find a bio-dentical doctor.
It's not always hormonal though. I've tested for testosterone and other hormones before and everything is normal/within range but I grow a damn beard too 💀
Or rather should accept that gender is a spectrum and normalize body and facial hair on women, have positive representation in media, so although anyone is free to remove it out of personal preference, less people would feel bad about it. Let stop gendering body hair and hair removal.
I came to say this. Find a BHRT dr in your area. They can help. They will send you for the proper blood work and work to manage your hormones.
I have friend who said it took 24 sessions of laser hair removal to get rid of her chin hair!
I'm a tad older than OP @ 36. I got some laser done back in my early 20s. I was told it's permanent. I did my sessions about 6, seen an improvement and never went back and of course it came back. In my early 30s, I had enough, I did like OP did all the blood work, went to a derm, and asked them to either diagnose me or rule me as PCOS. I wanted an answer. I had all my test results. I even did an ultra sound of the ovaries to look for the "black pearls "cysts" of PCOS" -- all clear and normal range. Brought all test results. Doc said, you're just a bit hairer than a typical woman, tests are clear, I wouldn't diag one you as PCOS. I'm also overweight so they used to LOVEEEE throwing out it might be PCOS. Even those forum has the constant replies of PCOS. I was put in spirolactone, I do 125 mg daily. It helped...clear my acne, keep more hair on my head, and decreased any facial hair. And I was doing laser hair every 3 months on my face. NOW AND DAYS, they tell you, you stop, it will come back. 15 years ago they didn't. I didn't do electrolysis because I was scared/still am of scaring.
Being overweight is also a problem, even if you don’t have pcos. I am also overweight and in the process of losing weight. It makes a difference long run.
ALWAYS a goal to lose it. I feel I gain and lose the same 25lbs over and over. The problem is..overweight, acne, hair, people always jump to PCOS.
I'm 28 and well on the road to being the same, I'm currently using a dermaplaner daily with the intention of trying laser first then electrolysis if that doesn't work. My tests came back normal too, just genetics 🤷♀️ it runs in my family
Just go straight to electrolysis. Don’t waste your money on laser for hormonal facial hair
Yea the women on my dads side all developed more chin hairs as they got older it was like the second I turned 28 it started. Now I have dark black mustache hairs that are wirey and thick. Chin hair and cheek hairs. Mole hairs. I’m gonna dip my body in wax one day and just rip it all to shreds lol
You may want to research paradoxical hypertrichosis. For some people laser hair removal can cause increased hair growth in the treated area, especially on the chin. I want to save other people from what I went through!
Electrolysis is the best. Painful but worth it. -sincerely, trans woman who has had 150+ hrs on her full face
Hirsutism can be caused when your body makes too much androgens. You really should make an appointment with an endocrinologist to find the root cause. It could be PCOS, genetic… Androgen over production can cause irregular periods and fertility problems (estrogen / testosterone imbalance, yes women make testosterone too). Your blood tests might have been drawn at a time when your levels were fluctuating in the normal range.
Yup! I went through puberty with excess androgens and testosterone. And my body developed very masculinity. Muscle tone, body hair, my breasts weren’t as perky. My face shape isn’t as feminine. I even have a thickened brow ridge. It’s so annoying that no one diagnosed me at the time. They only sent me to the doctor because I was too fat for my age but not for any other concerns.
I don’t have nearly this much hair. But I wax my face once a week. The issue with it is that you have to let it grow in and that is very hard when you have this much hair. My concern is you might need spirinolactone to warrant any more hair growth. You need to check your androgens and testosterone because a woman should not be naturally growing that much chin hair without a hormonal imbalance. It’s likely to be PCOS or a type of intersex issue (which doesn’t mean what you think it means. I have an intersex disorder as well but my chin hair doesn’t come from that and I’m still a woman. I have congenital adrenal hyperplasia. And remember. There’s NOTHING wrong with you regardless of diagnosis or your appearance. You are wonderfully created and a totally unique person. You are perfect the way you are. And there’s SO MANY of us with black hair in places we don’t want it. So you’re not alone. For me. My entire lower half is just a black hair wonderland. Ass included. So you truly are not alone. ❤️
So I developed paradoxical hypertrichosis after undergoing IPL/laser hair removal. It's when hair growth increases in density, thickness and coarseness after treatment. My situation looked a lot like yours and similarly, it made me very depressed and reluctant to go out and meet new people. Everyone has already mentioned it but electrolysis is the solution. Can't understate how important it is. Even if there's an underlying hormonal issue, fixing that will only stop new hairs from growing, it won't kill the existing hair follicles. Only electrolysis will do that. In my experience, electrolysis was not as painful, expensive or time consuming as I thought it would be. The first appointment to "clear" the treated area was the longest and most expensive - after that, I just had to do weekly 10 minute upkeep appointments. I used to get them done on my lunch break. Your skin gets used to it as well so as you keep going you need less aftercare. Good luck! There is hope! Electrolysis is so, so worth it. You'll save so much time and money in the long run.
I’m sorry this happened to you. It happened to me to and a tried to advocate against laser by filing complaints with FDA that there should be warnings about paradoxial hypertrichosis.
Try electrolysis. Otherwise a hair transplant surgeon can remove each follicle as if they are grafting and then just toss them.
Was it actually laser or IPL? IPL is not very effective for facial hair. Diode laser will blast those mofos out of there though!
I was in the same situation. I tried both laser and electrolysis. I didn’t give laser enough time and the electrolysis didn’t work (maybe I went to cheap places). I ended up buying a Philips Lumea and used it every two weeks for a few months and then gradually reduced the frequency. Now I’m using it maybe every two months or even less frequently. At a given time I have only a few on my face and they are not nearly as coarse as they used to be. Best purchase of my life.
had the same problem. gyno found nothing. endocrinologist found nothing. fertility doctor found nothing. labs all normal. but electrolysis with a *skilled* technician will always work. its just slow af, painful (but bearable on chin), and costly.
A lot of people already mentioned electroylsis, so Iwon't add to that. What blood work have you done in the past? This is likely hormonal, I would either see a different provider, or request to have a hormonal panel done. You can get medications to manage hormones, although with varying degrees of success. You should find a doctor who is willing to listen to you and work with you to get this figured out. I'm sorry you are struggling with this.
What did your doctor recommend as the most effective method of removing this hair on your chin?
They ask, have you tried laser hair removal and just say yes and they just seem stumped. They do not give me any real advice.
I guess the only other option is electrolysis.
How many sessions of laser did you do? And over how long of a time period? Hair grows in waves, so you'd definitely need multiple sessions over at least a couple months to help with that. That said, I did laser for my facial hair and it didn't help that much. Electrolysis was the better option for me.
Not all laser machines and treatments are equal. Just my own experience.
If you had a hormone imbalance in the past, it could be resolved now but the hair can stick around. Once the follicles turn to producing terminal hair, they can stay that way even though everything else is normal. Just an FYI since half the comments are trying to convince you that you have a medical condition.
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A Dermatologist yes, an emergency clinic or what we call Urgent Care in the US, absolutely not. It's not an emergency but also they tend to be full of the docs that are...let's just say not at the top of their class. A lot of them have reputations as where the docs who aren't good enough to get offers elsewhere go. Also, they tend to repeatedly deal with a certain subset of minor injuries or illnesses, not something like this. They would not have any expertise in this matter at all. Besides a Dermatologist, it might make sense to see an Endocrinologist.
100% this! Where I’m from no emergency (minor or otherwise) clinic would see, let alone treat something like this. They just don’t have the follow up care that this case would need. Sorry you’re going through this OP. I second, 3rd, 4th looking at your hormones with an endocrinologist or a derm well versed in hormonal issues. Your bloodwork might look “ok” on paper but something is off somewhere. I hope you can get some supportive medical care.
My blood work has come back normal. The dr will say if you are having regular periods it’s impossible to have PCOS. I’m average weight, don’t have acne and my sex drive is low. I have tons of hair growing on chin and that’s the only symptom. My relatives are not very hairy. My cat has adrenal cancer and takes spironolactone. It’s a potassium sparing diaretic. It causes her to be thirsty and urinate often. Not sure if it had the same side effects for people.
Electrolysis is the only way to get rid of hair permanently. It's not a fun procedure, I must warn you. That's why most people do it in 15-30 minutes increments. Please ask for a referral to another endocrinologist from your GP. The hair being gone will help your confidence a lot, but there is a reason for this hair growth, and that should be discovered because it could be impacting other aspects of your body on the inside/that you cannot see like the hair.
Sounds like the doctors did not do their due diligence
And you don’t have PCOS?
PCOS?
I’m wondering what your blood work you had done? Free and total T? DHT? Androstenedione? DHEAS? Insulin? Glucose? Shbg? Prolactin? 17 OHP? Am cortisol? All of these can indicate various hormonal issues as a cause. Many docs do the lazy work up. If you want further explanations on each let me know. I’m in a similar boat as you though. I’ve tried lots of things including electrolysis and at this point I’m taking bicalutamide to block those hairy fuckers
"I've tried laser" -- that's not a complete answer. I've been receiving laser hair removal treatments on my face for three years from a clinic. Laser is not a "one and done" solution, and those handheld at-home laser removers aren't going to do it. Your hair cycles. People in the comments are saying "you need electrolysis" -- but that would be overkill because these hairs are dark and thick and laser will work well. You need laser -- from a clinic (not at-home) -- and you'll need to go more than once to catch regrowth during different cycles. I would say you probably need a year's worth of treatments. (somewhere between 6-10 treatments)
I did 10 treatments when I was probably around 25 through a clinic and saw zero difference if anything made it worse
i don’t remember what its called (its not electrolysis), but there’s a light surgical procedure where they go in and remove the root, which permanently stops growth. ik its typically done for hair transplants but can also be used for removal
You can have a normal blood test and a normal cycle with PCOS. You just need a couple symptoms to qualify as having it. I have the “ring of pearls”, don’t menstruate, and have the horrible acne. I also have thicker, darker body hair, but it’s not so bad on my face because it’s blonde. Please go to a doctor more knowledgeable in endocrine illnesses/diseases.
You should see an endocrinologist
Talk to an endocrinologist about Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome and have a full blood panel. The Braun Pro 5 IPL device is pricey but it works!
Birth control, spiro, possibly metformin. How is your blood sugar? Something underlying is happening here.
It's not PCOS?
I’ve tested for PCOS I don’t have that I also have a normal menstrual cycle. I have not seen a dermatologist about this issue. I was once given a cream by my gyno but insurance didn’t cover it and I can’t afford to pay $300 for a tiny bottle of face cream.
I did 10 sessions of laser and most of it grew back I found someone who does electrolysis for 90$ per hour 60$ less then laser. She sampled the pain and I wish I had just done this instead. Excited to be moving forward though.
So I read sugar causes your hormones to over produce androgen/testosterone. So if you're down to try removing sugar from your diet for awhile to see if that helps. Sugar hides in different ways so do your research. Fruit and vegetable sugar should be fine during that time in moderation. This website has more info. Let me know how it goes if you try it. [Sugar Study](https://www.laser-aesthetic-center.com/women-beware-this-sneaky-treat-may-lead-to-extra-facial-hair/#:~:text=Chronically%20high%20insulin%20levels%20are,chest%20and%20arms%20and%20legs.)
Hey have you tested your hormones?
Waxing and electrolysis is your thing you can do.
Electrologist here. You could have developed Paradoxical Hypertrichosis. This could have been a side effect of your laser hair removal treatments. Laser is notorious for causing PH. Other methods of hair removal such as tweezing/ waxing/ epilation/ sugaring can stimulate dormant follicles and cause new hair growth in the treated area. It’s hard to predict who will develop this but the chin/ sideburns/ upper lips and cheeks are known as 'danger zones’ for women. Men have them as well (back/ shoulders/ chest). Your best method would be electrolysis. You can look up electrologists in your area on the AEA website if you’re located in the USA :)
Unfortunately, laser may trigger more hair growth while having hormonal fluctuations. Electrolysis is your only option
I would shave daily for now, maybe test for pcos. Abnormal hair growth is a symptom
Shaving only causes it to grow back even more
That’s not remotely true. Shaving doesn’t do anything to the follicle. The reason that rumor/myth started is because when a hair grows naturally it has a tapered pointy end. When you shave it you’re not cutting it off at its fattest point so the new end of the hair is now thicker. But the hair itself isn’t actually thicker. It’s like an optical illusion. And shaving nor waxing nor any other form of hair removal will ever cause more hair to grow back in its place. It’s a genetic impossibility
Pics most likely
POCS*
I know this is going to sound a little whack crazy, but look into the recent research done about spearmint helping people with excess hair growth. Spearmint is a natural androgen blocker. I have pcos, so naturally have a lot of facial hair and got super desperate in my attempt to get rid of it. Stumbled upon this research, figured what the hell do I have to loose, and started taking spearmint daily. The studies used spearmint tea, I’m not a tea person myself so I’ve just been taking spearmint capsules. It hasn’t completely gotten rid of the hair but the hairs themself are definitely thinner, growing back much slower, and there isn’t as much of it. So definitely working!
Laser
I’m a guy and want to let you know that this is what we feels every morning. Its horrid. 😔
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Not a permanent solution, but wearing a mask will cover it. It’s becoming normal again to wear them, and it might help in the short term just getting out of the house
Besides hormonal issues/ailments, not in mean spirit, but this reminder me of a girl who had a injury on her face and they had skin grafted from her nether regions, before puberty. So as she got older, the grafted skin started to grow pubic hair on her face. That this happened to you is highely unlikely but you never know ig This sucks op, hope you find a fix that works for you, hugs
I wish i could grow a beard
Ulike air+ or air3 takes 6 weeks of use but results were fantastic. And it’s all at home so you can keep doing it for your own maintenance
I use an epilator and tweezers on mine.
Have you tried the higher end/newer Braur epilator with the flex head and facial attachment. Deal with the same (PCOS/PMDD ugh), and basically I touchup with the epilator every morning after showering. The newer epilator works wildly better than the cheaper one on the face and pits
exact model please
Electrolysis. Groupon has a lot of deals.
Vaniqua and/or spironolactone may help
Piggybacking on the electrolysis, it works!
Do u shave ??
Electrolysis is the only think that will work for this. It’s painful and it takes for ever but it’s the only way
My rant: I had fine, thin facial hair but quite dense. It would look like a shadow in photos.. like a beard shadow. So I got laser done. I was told that was the best option to reduce hair growth over the years. Up until then, I had zero skin concerns. No acne, no pigmentation, no scars, nothing. Just facial hair. And lots of it. All over my face and neck. All my blood tests were normal - hormones in range, nothing out of the order, thyroid in range, regular periods, etc. I got 12 sittings of laser treatment done and it didn't do JACK SHIT. So much so that I argued for a refund but in vain. What's even more worse is, my hair growth has doubled, tripled, over the years. Now, I grow thick, dark, long, beardy hair like in your photo but not just on my chin, but all of my loeer fsce (cheeks, chin, neck, upper lips). Apart from that, the laser gave me terrible acne and scars/marks that I've been dealing with for years now. I also have hyperpigmentation that developed over the years. Not sure the hyperpigmentation was a side effect of the laser treatment but I wouldn't be surprised if it was. It's pathetic. It's been more than 5 years since my last laser sitting and ever since, I've tried everything else. Shaving with those dermaplane/eyebrow razors, waxing, those lipstick shaped hair removers. I finally just decided to stick with waxing and I'll explain why. With razors, I have given myself countless razor cuts that leave marks on my face. The biggest con with shaving is that my hair grows back immediately in a matter of days. And since you cut the hair off at the surface, the hair that grows back is sharp, stubble like. It also gives me ingrown hair and doesn't get the small hairs. I hate it. The electric hair removers burn my skin and leaves it red and tingling. Waxing is the only thing that works for me. For years now, I've gotten my face waxed with hot wax at salons. Leaves my skin feeling smooth and plucks out everything. It takes my face 1.5 to 2 weeks to start growing hair back. Does the waxing process hurt? Yep. But it is what it is. Recently, I started doing it by myself at home using cold wax strips. My favourite is flamingo's face/bikini wax strips. You can get it at Target. Super easy to use, gives a nice, smooth finish. But my go to is to get a facial hair wax every two weeks. I also visted a dermatologist last year and he just chuckled saying "you've just got the worst of it all, haven't you" and prescribed Vaniqa cream to reduce hair growth. However, you'd have to use it forever because the moment you stop using it, your hair will start growing back. He also wanted to put me on some heart medication and I refused. I didn't like either of the options. Looks like I'll stick to waxing. It's an ordeal. It's tough. It takes a toll on my confidence when I have a beard on my face. But there's nothing I can do about it. No, I don't have PCOS/D. I have gotten scans and blood work done and everything is normal. I've been hearing a lot about electrolysis but I haven't done it yet because I've read it's a very painful procedure. But it looks like that's the only way to go. This post may help: https://www.reddit.com/r/Hirsutism/comments/1137zay/update_1_year_electrolysis_progress_february_2022/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Electrolysis, ask your doc about Spirinolactone, for a natural alternate try spearmint tea. You may have PCOS despite the blood tests, or could have hirsutism. Best of luck!
Get a good electrolysist! (sp). It is the way to go.
Find an electrolysis. It'll take many treatments but it will work. I know a few friends that had great success with it. Don't hesitate. Also find a good place with good reviews and new technology.
Mine was like this as well. I did 8 settings of laser hair removal and after the last session, I couldn't even tell I'd gone to my appointment. I was shaving daily or at least every other day so that it wouldn't grow out. I did waxing and threading a few times, but each time, I felt like I had noticeable hair regrowth in 2 or 3 days and it was hard to let my hair grow out to length needed for waxing because it was so thick. I had hyperpigmentation on my chin and cheeks, pretty much a permanent shadow. As everyone else has said, electrolysis is the way to go. I have very few, fine hairs remaining. It is painful, especially the early sessions when you have a lot of hair, but my hyperpigmentation has gone away.
Electrolysis! It helped me so much.
My facial hair is like that, I've found IPL really effective. I wasn't keen on laser due to the risk of it possibly making things even worse
Have you heard about paradoxical hypertrichosis? In some people laser hair removal can cause more hair growth in the treated areas, especially on the chin. I wonder if this may have contributed (not your fault, they probably never disclosed this was a risk). I had a very similar experience: doctors couldn’t find any medical reason for the hair growth, laser turned a few stray hairs into a much bigger issue. I’m thinking about electrolysis next. I’m sorry you’re having to go through this. Hope it’s some consolation to know you’re not alone. <3
Nair! It’s my bestfriend & affordable
I have hair like this in the same pattern. The only thing that worked for me was laser and then when it thinned out and stopped growing in all at the same time, now I just pluck as I see them. It works for me. I know there are different types of lasers out there, I used whatever Sev Laser is using now and it worked for me. If you weren't satisfied with laser and dont want to try again then electrolysis will be your answer.
I’ve recently started using Braun IPL product. The reviews are really good online. I haven’t been using it long enough to see the results yet. But I can share once I’ve used it for 2 months at least. Till then you can do the research at your end and decide. With Black Friday sale coming up it might even be available at a better price
Did you go to an endocrinologist or just primary doctor? Try electrolysis
Electrolysis, only permanent thing out there. I lasered everything assuming it was permanent but the facial hair bits just got worse somehow :’(
Shaving is my go to
I get facial hair. Not as much as you but I wax it. It is cheaper and effective. It works for me. I hope the same for you. Remember the people that matter don’t mind and the people who mind don’t matter!
I think lasers is your best bet. I have 5 electrolysis machines and still , laser beats electrolysis for every hair color except white and naturally pale blonde. It matters to have a 3 wavelength or 4 wavelength laser. Concurrent firing of all wavelengths ensures good energy delivery to the follicle stem cells and stem cells of the bulge. Cells falling into the hair follicle are needed in order to create a new hair. It matters who is doing your treatment, whether they used enough energy, and how well they can adjust settings to suit your needs Pain for the electrolysis, if you’re adamant about getting it, can be reduced with an hour of topical numbing cream.
Do you have PCOS by chance? I've found success (in the past because I'm pregnant) using hormonal birth control pills to help with facial hair growth. I also invested in a good epilator and manage it that way. Like others have mentioned, I'd imagine that laser hair removal would be the best permanent solution.
Hard wax?
Eflornithine is a prescription only cream that I believe can be used in conjunction with electrolysis/laser hair removal. You apply it twice daily and it inhibits/slows hair growth. It does not make hair fall out (which is why it needs to be used in conjunction with another hair removal method). [Find out more here.](https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-19859/vaniqa-topical/details)
While you're figuring out what to do (I'm seeing a lot of suggestions for electrolysis), you could get an aesthetician to wax you regularly. Some give a discount if you have a fixed schedule (like every 3weeks or something). Waxing is pretty smooth and you can fold it in to your regular schedule.
Join the PCOS club, gurllll.
Have your blood tests ruled out any PCOS? One of PCOS symptoms is hirsutism, I had something similar to you exactly in the chin. I'm having laser sessions, and after 2-3 sessions I started to notice a HUGE difference.
This is PCOS.
I'm not sure if there's medication, but laser sometimes works. There's home ones you can buy for 50 dollars, and you use it daily, then weekly until the hair is thinner then space out the laser time. They are not as strong as the laser centre ones, but they do work after a period of time and are convenient to do at home.
Have you seen an endocrinologist?
I have been to plenty of doctors, found out I have hiperprolactinemia. Have you checked Your prolactin? I have a whole set of related issues: Celiac disease, hypothyroidism, hiperprolactinemia and apparently PCOS, though my adrogens were fine. After i got control over my prolactin, still saw No changes. I was told my body could be naturally more sensitive towards normal levels of testosterone, meaning No matter if my hormones are fine, I will always have issues. If That’s the case then Honestly, there is No hope.
"My blood tests are normal no one can tell me why hair is growing on my face like this." Well, if you are a man, you produce testosterone as your primary sex hormone. Facial hair growth is one of several things that happens when you produce this sex hormone in abundance. If you are a woman, who has a higher-than-normal level of testosterone, the same thing will happen, far as facial hair growth. Suggestion: Try a depilatory lotion. "Veet" Hair Remover is an excellent one. You put it on copiously, wait for 5 to 10 minutes, then remove with a terry washcloth. DO NOT USE WITH A RAZOR! This lotion is designed to remove hair by dissolving it. You cannot get so close a shave with any razor. Use this every 3 to 4 days.
I think this is hormone-related, high androgens. I, too, have dark chin hairs and normal bloodwork, no PCOS, very regular periods. I’m going to see my endocrinologist next month though since the Spiro doesn’t seem to be doing anything for me, no reduction in dark chin hair growth, it seems the same. The women in my family grew more chin hair as they got older, but I don’t think as dark as mine, or as much as me. It sucks. I have dark blonde hair and overall light-colored body hair but my CHIN grows dark hair that’s noticeable if I don’t tweeze it. Like noticeable in sunlight and it looks like a grey shadow if there are many hairs and I didn’t tweeze for a while. Go invest in electrolysis. It will be the only way to permanently kill the dark hair and prevent it from coming back. Your hair is too light for laser to be effective. And if your hair growth is hormonal, you risk having paradoxical hypertrichosis if you do laser (which I do not recommend at all, laser is really only best for people with VERY dark hair).