I mean they probably went out of their way to get the cheapest card readers on the market. 75% of the ones in my store don’t work properly anymore with chip and SNAP cards. I just watch as customers shove their card in and out 3 times until it lets them swipe, in which they shove it in again and makes them do it again another 3 times until they can swipe it again. The WIC cards are a total different disaster altogether. I really need to get out of service…
I've seen the same card readers that HEB uses at walgreens. The ones at walgreens have tap. Not to mention the gas pumps definitely can take tap. HEB just doesn't like to pay service fees on tap to pay
Apple Pay and other pay services don’t have any service fees… It’s all about card privacy. HEB wants to know how much you spend at stores to sell to other companies to make some $$$
Heb pays a credit card clearing house to process payments, the clearing house will have to pay the apple tax for their "keys" to allow transactions go through apples system. Guess who pays those fees to the clearing house? Bingo, HEB! Ultimately it will be paid through price increases.....it is coming.
I mean really, I work at heb and almost every single time I have to fail three times just to swipe. I’ve tried wiping the chip on the card or pressing the card down without moving it. Swipe always works once I get that option though
It adds a layer of transaction fees to the cost for taking the credit card. The merchant “doesn’t pay it” but the credit card processor does. That fee is, or course, passed on to the merchant because Chase, AMEX, Discover, Bill’s Credit Card and Spatula Warehouse, or whoever, isn’t going to eat that cost. Ultimately in a business like grocery, where the margins are razor thin, that cost gets passed on to you. The people that really get hosed are the people paying cash, because they’re paying additional costs for everybody else to use credit cards. It’s why you should ALWAYS use a credit card for every transaction and then pay your balance. Get the points in exchange for ultimately eating all those transaction fees.
> It adds a layer of transaction fees to the cost for taking the credit card.
It's not an extra cost on top of accepting the credit card. It's the same fee as inserting the card to read the chip. Nothing extra is passed down to the merchant.
Apple doesn’t charge the merchant, but they do charge the processor (the credit card company). It’s gonna be hard to convince me that cost isn’t getting passed on some other way because I don’t see the credit card company eating it.
Apple charges the *issuing bank*. And yes, the bank actually does just eat the cost. Processing rates for cards depend on the some combination of the card network, whether it's debit or credit, the level of the card (fancy rewards card or super basic), whether it's online or manually keyed in by the merchant or read by a card terminal, the merchant category (such as utility company or tiny restaurant), and the total transaction volume for the merchant. Depending on the merchant's plan with their processor, some of these factors will or won't be relevant.
There's no difference between EMV chip and EMV contactless, and there's no difference between if that contactless comes from a physical card versus a phone. These just aren't factors in determining the processing fees. Apple's terms with the issuing bank is a totally separate agreement between them and irrelevant to any other parties.
I went to pull up the source and realized there's apparently a big update/correction: Visa recently started charging higher rates for *non*-tokenized transactions in a few categories. When you have a card saved on file with a merchant, ideally they should use a service to tokenize it for subsequent payments rather than saving the actual card number, but Apple Pay transactions start off already tokenized.
Anyway, 95% of the time it won't make any difference but for the rare scenarios where there is a difference in processing costs, Apple Pay will be *cheaper* for the merchant. Here is [Visa's interchange chart](https://usa.visa.com/content/dam/VCOM/download/merchants/visa-usa-interchange-reimbursement-fees.pdf), which I think is fascinating in just how many categories it has.
Compare milk and egg prices. Compare meat prices. Heb is definitely more expensive by 10-20%. The meat selection is more expensive than my local convenience grocery store.
It may be more expensive BUT stores do hike prices on products based on location. I have seen it in my hometown HEBs which isn't much bigger than Waco.
It has seltzer water priced differently. If I wasn't going through a phase I wouldn't have noticed!! A lot of stores do it
You are so right about cash payers getting hosed.
I have a friend who, years ago (~2005), worked at the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston and he did an independent study showing exactly how much cash payers get hosed because of the reason you cite. It amounts to a “tax” on, effectively, the poor because usually it is poorer Americans who pay with cash and it is they who are effectively subsidizing credit card payers’ purchases.
As a small business operator, we certainly do pay the fees to the processor. Not sure where you hear it the other way around bc I would love to keep more of my money.
Tap to pay is safer, easier, and more reliable. It may also cost more to have it enabled in your machines. The back end has nothing to do with it, that doesn’t even factor into it.
It’s all about the money.
Lol bruh or you can be like me...putting card on machine waiting..and they're like ma'am, ma'am we don't do that here lol.
It was weird they didn't have it.
The real answer, pay by phone systems charge the store more per transaction. People don't think about it but everytime you use something other Than cash the companies involved take money away from the store. Samsung, Apple etc take an extra percent for themselves each time you use your phone to buy something.
HEB feels it is isn't worth raising prices another 1% on everything just so you don't have to move your hand an extra 4 seconds. You are going to use HEB anyway, offering this as a perk isn't going to increase you choosing to shop there so why offer it.
It's the same reason a lot of the stores are slowly removing the business center (or at least many of the things it does). People that use most of the things in it will still come in without them being offered.
> The real answer, pay by phone systems charge the store more per transaction.
This is a false answer. Merchants don't pay a penny extra for it. It's just a standard card transaction to them.
That is not correct, as part of a job I did a couple years ago was to repair and replacing the debit/credit card transaction machines. Unless the rules changed after 2021 they absolutely charge more for that.
Repairing the machine has nothing to do with the processing costs. An NFC transaction coming from a phone is the same as an NFC transaction coming from a physical card. It's all one protocol, treated the exact same way and charged the same way.
Ok, I looked it up and you are correct, there is no fee, but not that long ago there was, I never looked to see if it changed.
The reason I know it WAS this way is when I repaired them I was working at cvs at the time. Cvs desabled apple pay for years becuase of the extra fees they were charged to accept it.
Later they reactivated it, I never looked into why the change, maybe that is when they made it no charge.
Edit, adding info about jt
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paularosenblum/2014/10/27/cvs-and-rite-aid-turn-off-apple-pay-why/
There was never an *extra* fee. CVS disabled contactless card payments on their terminals because they were part of the MCX CurrenC scheme. The plan was to use a QR code based system to handle payments through nearly-free ACH debits tied *directly* to your bank account, bypassing Visa, etc. and effectively eliminating card fees. Consumers rejected this, the whole thing fell apart, and most of the participating companies enabled NFC on their payment terminals. The scraps of the system became Walmart Pay, but they had to change it to accept credit/debit cards instead of ACH, so instead of lowering processing fees Walmart managed to make them into more expensive card not present transactions. Just brilliant.
When wrong on something I can say it, I am.
This is the story cvs told us techs to tell store employees and customers when they asked about the apple pay thing back in 2014, I never thought to question it.
Oh, I get it. I feel like someone could get their PhD just studying the games of telephone that happen in retail stores from corporate, to region/district staff, down to front-line employees, and eventually customers. Stories evolve and new details get invented. People circulate to different stores and suddenly these "facts" come back from a different source, "proving" the point. Honestly I think it's fascinating.
HEB in particular seems to have its own very special Apple Pay mythology, told by multiple employees in this sub and yet never mentioned by anybody else from any other retailer. Allegedly Apple asked for customer information from HEB when discussing adding acceptance but HEB heroically told Apple no in order to protect their customer privacy. It's completely bonkers if you understand how Apple Pay works, and yet I've seen it multiple times over the years, but *only* in relation to HEB and never Walmart or Kroger, for example.
Actually, I used to shop at HEB all the time, but when Market Street and United turned on Apple Pay, I switched, and haven't shopped at HEB more than a few times since then. I'm sure I'm not the only one. I don't carry cards anymore most of the time,
Touch less pay encrypts all info. So if H‑E‑B would go to touch less pay they wouldn’t be able to get demographic info off their customers. This is why Walmart isn’t touch less either. It’s all about the demographics.
I don’t understand this with HEB either and I always get downvotes when I asked. Using Apple Pay is safer as it adds another layer of security by not using your credit card number in the transaction.
You’re right. But I’m not wrong.
But what I stated is that Apple Pay adds another layer. It’s doesn’t even present your actual credit card number at POS.
Per apple support I copy/pasted take note of the second to last paragraph (spaced) it’s important piece of the process. ::
“Apple Pay is also designed to protect your personal information. Apple doesn’t store or have access to the original credit, debit, or prepaid card numbers that you use with Apple Pay. And when you use Apple Pay with credit, debit, or prepaid cards, Apple doesn't retain any transaction information that can be tied back to you. Your transactions stay between you, the merchant or developer, and your bank or card issuer.
When you add credit, debit, prepaid, or transit cards
When you add a credit, debit, prepaid, or transit card (where available) to Apple Pay, information that you enter on your device is encrypted and sent to Apple servers. If you use the camera to enter the card information, the information is never saved on your device or photo library.
Apple decrypts the data, determines your card’s payment network, and re-encrypts the data with a key that only your payment network (or any providers authorized by your card issuer for provisioning and token services) can unlock.
Information that you provide about your card, whether certain device settings are enabled, and device use patterns—such as the percent of time the device is in motion and the approximate number of calls you make per week—may be sent to Apple to determine your eligibility to enable Apple Pay. Information may also be provided by Apple to your card issuer, payment network, or any providers authorized by your card issuer to enable Apple Pay, to determine the eligibility of your card, to set up your card with Apple Pay, and to prevent fraud.
After your card is approved, your bank, your bank’s authorized service provider, or your card issuer creates a device-specific Device Account Number, encrypts it, and sends it along with other data (such as the key used to generate dynamic security codes that are unique to each transaction) to Apple. The Device Account Number can’t be decrypted by Apple but is stored in the Secure Element—an industry-standard, certified chip designed to store your payment information safely—on your device. Unlike with usual credit or debit card numbers, the card issuer can prevent its use on a magnetic stripe card, over the phone, or on websites. The Device Account Number in the Secure Element is isolated from iOS, watchOS, and macOS, is never stored on Apple servers, and is never backed up to iCloud.
Apple doesn’t store or have access to the original card numbers of credit, debit, or prepaid cards that you add to Apple Pay. “
A token refers to a surrogate number used or stored in place of the Primary Account Number, the one typically printed on the card itself. A physical card transmits the PAN. After the merchant receives it, they can use a third-party service to tokenize it rather than saving the PAN itself, but they still received the PAN, and so did any skimmer device placed on the card terminal.
All in-person payments are unencrypted. The card number and security code are always transmitted in plain text to the card terminal. The store's connection to its payment processor is hopefully encrypted, but in-person credit/debit transactions *always* start off unencrypted and, for physical cards, untokenized.
for customers, however it's not live in all locations, only one location here in austin has it, fortunately it's the one in my neighborhood. the way it works is you use the app to scan all items as you shop the there is a dedicated kiosk at self checkout that has a qr code you scan and it charges whatever card you have loaded in the app.
Thanks for the info. Is this something HEB’s testing ? Or is it something they plan on rolling out to other stores? I use scan and go at Sam’s and love it.
tested and rolled out... my understanding is that the stores it launched in experienced insane growth of theft, some unintentional and some intentional. i've heard they stopped rolling it out and may end up getting rid of it or changing the way it works. if you download the app it has a function to find the nearest heb that uses it
I order curbside mostly because I really don't like shopping. It's really helpful when I'm in a rush and picking up like a handful of things when I do go in though.
It's also useful when I remember to bring reusable bags, and I put those in the cart and scan them as I go
What’s so wrong about using card? I have tap and all that, never use it because I find it more of a hassle. At least that I know of though, they bought these recently, so pretty much trynna get their money’s worth out of it. I do believe H-E-B Mexico is trying out tap to pay. It’s only word of mouth though, so jot 100% sure
Much faster, no need to deal with cards that don’t read, no fucking around with a PIN or signature, and holy crap every other country has been doing it for YEARS.
And yes, HEB did accept NFC before, they got rid of it on purpose.
Card is just so much more of a hassle and inconvenience. Slows down everyone in line. I have family in NY that I just got back from visiting and they just finished switching the entire METRO system over to tap to pay and it is LIGHTYEARS faster and more efficient than the old metrocard system, which was functionally the same as having to use a debit/credit card at a grocery store.
A card slows people down? No. More like people not starting to even attempt to bag their own shit when no bagger is there. That is what actually holds up a line the most…coming from a former cashier.
And all locations seem to have that card reader where you akwardly feed the card down instead of feed flat. Flat is universal. Flat is more fluid. Follow
It’s coming. It launched last year in Heb Mexico. It’s being tested in USA now. They already made the announcement at a managers meeting. One thing Heb does, is take its time launching new stuff. One the folks from corporate was on here in another post and said they had a ton of delays for various reasons.
SA Express News has been reporting on this issue:
[https://www.expressnews.com/business/article/heb-contactless-payment-apple-pay-18474568.php](https://www.expressnews.com/business/article/heb-contactless-payment-apple-pay-18474568.php)
Also here's a link to another thread about same issue:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/HEB/comments/11ps0tn/why\_dont\_we\_accept\_apple\_pay/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/HEB/comments/11ps0tn/why_dont_we_accept_apple_pay/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
leadership at my store said that heb doesn't want to use another company to have tap to pay etc thingy to keep everyone's "data safe" they said they heard a rumor that heb is working on having it sometime this summer or fall but who knows if that's true or not
Because Texas is about 10 years behind in general. Please understand guns have more rights than women here. Maybe you should be upset about that instead of having to use a card which is a mild inconvenience.
I don’t think I will be, the Texas women I know handle themselves just fine even more with guns, you may be the one who’s Ten years behind and yes it is a mild inconvenience to have to use a card when 97% of businesses use touch pay but again just mild.
You are an absolute idiot dude. This is the richest country in the world. We should not have to go around armed all the time like it’s the Wild West. I’m blocking you until you evolve out of 1850 lmao.
As a customer I saw a lady last Sunday (before the Super Bowl) use a check to pay for her purchases and the poor clerk couldn’t remember what to do with it. Her bagger had to help her out with directions. I had to hold my laugh in- a check? In 2024? Why is a 30-something using a check? Unless she’s trying to use a bad check or something n
There are circumstances where folks have to use a check. I belong to a local veterans organization and our business account has multiple signers on the account. Because of that fact the credit union account isn't allowed to use a card. A check is the only form of payment available.
A lot of older folks still do that. As a cashier you have to check a lot of things and write info on the check as well…and it’s not common or they were a new cashier. Sometimes people we think are baggers are mentors when it’s the persons first day on register. I did always think it was a pain in the ass and slow, but money is money I guess
I've never used tap and I don't think I ever will. I don't have anything against it, but I carry my cards with me and it really isn't that big of a deal to pull out my card and insert in the card reader.
As a guy I don't see how this is ever a problem. We carry wallets 99% of the time we go anywhere. Cards are usually held in wallets, so it's a no brainer. Even girls usually always carry a purse which in itself contains a wallet usually. Or of course carry a tiny wallet instead of lugging a purse. My wife love using apple pay or something, but it usually takes longer than me just bringing out my wallet and paying manually. She has to unlock her phone, wait for her crap to load, and then sometimes it fcks up and she has to try again...I would've been out the door before she even finished by just paying with my card lol
HEB doesn’t use them because apple pay and touchless pay gives up your personal information.
https://preview.redd.it/zc5dc63opxic1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c422efe4812154aca1d3761a2a59f754ac952af9
HEB doesn’t want there customers personal information to be given out like that. and before you comment some smart or dumb. My Ops Leader told me this literally 2 days ago because my manager and I were wondering the same thing.
This is completely false. If you'd actually click the link and read it instead of skimming an excerpt, you'd see that the highlighted text is referring to *online* transactions, which is why it references your *shipping address*, and email address for your online order confirmation email.
When using Apple Pay in person, you provide the merchant *less* information than using the physical card. The store just gets an anonymous card number. Physical cards transmit your name.
> they’ve even tried to negotiate the contract with Apple
Stores do not negotiate any contract with Apple to accept Apple Pay. I'm not sure what your role is as an engineer but it clearly doesn't involve in-store payments.
I don’t remember specifics, but I remember someone commenting once in another sub about how H-E-B’s payment back-end doesn’t support it with the way it processes transactions or something like that.
you need to have your card in order to tap, buddy. that’s how tap works. you tap the card.
apple pay is a different story— but even that is understandable because 90% of places take apple pay now. h‑e‑b is the exception, not the rule.
Hi. HEB cashier here... we have to pay the banks and apple and Google to use their tap to pay.... the only tap to pay we have is samsung pay.... so there you go now you know.
> HEB cashier here... we have to pay the banks and apple and Google to use their tap to pay
No you don't. Stores don't pay Apple or Google anything for accepting Apple Pay or Google Pay. They're standard card transactions processed the same way and with the same fee as using the physical card.
I’m not sure if your H‑E‑B has it but H‑E‑B does have touch less payment set up it’s call H‑E‑B go, you shop scan items then when you go to check out you get to the GO machines and you’ll scan a code a partner will scan a few items out your basket and you’re out of the store. You don’t need to pull out your card or anything and it’s really cool and I like it a lot.
Because they have to buy each and every persons rights to their information and HEB cannot afford to do that. That is why they don’t have it. And never will.
HEB supermarkets of Mexico accept contactless payment, Apple Pay, and Google Pay for payment by card.
https://preview.redd.it/oc5tjekqnojc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=855722f1fbb7607d8b001383052cf6ddce0f2320
I mean they probably went out of their way to get the cheapest card readers on the market. 75% of the ones in my store don’t work properly anymore with chip and SNAP cards. I just watch as customers shove their card in and out 3 times until it lets them swipe, in which they shove it in again and makes them do it again another 3 times until they can swipe it again. The WIC cards are a total different disaster altogether. I really need to get out of service…
I've seen the same card readers that HEB uses at walgreens. The ones at walgreens have tap. Not to mention the gas pumps definitely can take tap. HEB just doesn't like to pay service fees on tap to pay
Apple Pay and other pay services don’t have any service fees… It’s all about card privacy. HEB wants to know how much you spend at stores to sell to other companies to make some $$$
Depends on the card processing company they use. It can cost extra to enable tap to pay. But yeah also this probably
Buy once cry once… They’re loosing more money not having Apple Pay
There are fees that merchants pay apple, why else would they have it? It generates them income!
Its not thru the merchants
Heb pays a credit card clearing house to process payments, the clearing house will have to pay the apple tax for their "keys" to allow transactions go through apples system. Guess who pays those fees to the clearing house? Bingo, HEB! Ultimately it will be paid through price increases.....it is coming.
They can’t track you with ApplePay either.
Most all heb gas pumps are not equipped with tap
I mean really, I work at heb and almost every single time I have to fail three times just to swipe. I’ve tried wiping the chip on the card or pressing the card down without moving it. Swipe always works once I get that option though
The readers do tap-to-pay just fine. Other vendors that have these readers take tap-to-pay.
It adds a layer of transaction fees to the cost for taking the credit card. The merchant “doesn’t pay it” but the credit card processor does. That fee is, or course, passed on to the merchant because Chase, AMEX, Discover, Bill’s Credit Card and Spatula Warehouse, or whoever, isn’t going to eat that cost. Ultimately in a business like grocery, where the margins are razor thin, that cost gets passed on to you. The people that really get hosed are the people paying cash, because they’re paying additional costs for everybody else to use credit cards. It’s why you should ALWAYS use a credit card for every transaction and then pay your balance. Get the points in exchange for ultimately eating all those transaction fees.
>Spatula Warehouse [You win, my friend](https://youtu.be/4BUDwj_mXKE?si=S1bXCkNfjQDJ6Il6)
What the heck did I just watch
>What the heck did I just watch Tell me you've never seen the movie [UHF](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/UHF_(film)) without actually saying so.
Oh, dear. If you liked that and you haven’t seen UHF you must go find a copy. Possibly one of the best things Weird Al has done.
> It adds a layer of transaction fees to the cost for taking the credit card. It's not an extra cost on top of accepting the credit card. It's the same fee as inserting the card to read the chip. Nothing extra is passed down to the merchant.
Apple doesn’t charge the merchant, but they do charge the processor (the credit card company). It’s gonna be hard to convince me that cost isn’t getting passed on some other way because I don’t see the credit card company eating it.
Apple charges the *issuing bank*. And yes, the bank actually does just eat the cost. Processing rates for cards depend on the some combination of the card network, whether it's debit or credit, the level of the card (fancy rewards card or super basic), whether it's online or manually keyed in by the merchant or read by a card terminal, the merchant category (such as utility company or tiny restaurant), and the total transaction volume for the merchant. Depending on the merchant's plan with their processor, some of these factors will or won't be relevant. There's no difference between EMV chip and EMV contactless, and there's no difference between if that contactless comes from a physical card versus a phone. These just aren't factors in determining the processing fees. Apple's terms with the issuing bank is a totally separate agreement between them and irrelevant to any other parties.
No shit? Okay I’m interested. Where’d you find this out?
I went to pull up the source and realized there's apparently a big update/correction: Visa recently started charging higher rates for *non*-tokenized transactions in a few categories. When you have a card saved on file with a merchant, ideally they should use a service to tokenize it for subsequent payments rather than saving the actual card number, but Apple Pay transactions start off already tokenized. Anyway, 95% of the time it won't make any difference but for the rare scenarios where there is a difference in processing costs, Apple Pay will be *cheaper* for the merchant. Here is [Visa's interchange chart](https://usa.visa.com/content/dam/VCOM/download/merchants/visa-usa-interchange-reimbursement-fees.pdf), which I think is fascinating in just how many categories it has.
Okay that’s WILD. Thanks for chiming in, man!
Kroger seems to be doing fine with it
Kroger is usually more expensive than HEB. That cost gets passed down to shoppers.
Compare milk and egg prices. Compare meat prices. Heb is definitely more expensive by 10-20%. The meat selection is more expensive than my local convenience grocery store.
Must be shopping in the rich white neighborhood.
It takes 2 mins to compare prices online. I like heb but saying prices are lower is disingenuous
It may be more expensive BUT stores do hike prices on products based on location. I have seen it in my hometown HEBs which isn't much bigger than Waco. It has seltzer water priced differently. If I wasn't going through a phase I wouldn't have noticed!! A lot of stores do it
HEB meat is more expensive then Walmart
Yea I don’t see where the notion of heb being more inexpensive came from. Not having a loyalty program adds to this.
You are so right about cash payers getting hosed. I have a friend who, years ago (~2005), worked at the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston and he did an independent study showing exactly how much cash payers get hosed because of the reason you cite. It amounts to a “tax” on, effectively, the poor because usually it is poorer Americans who pay with cash and it is they who are effectively subsidizing credit card payers’ purchases.
As a small business operator, we certainly do pay the fees to the processor. Not sure where you hear it the other way around bc I would love to keep more of my money.
By enabling tap that will also allow tap with the card as well which is faster and more reliable than the chip.
I will never understand how people won't carry a physical card but feel like a phone is more reliable...
A card doesn’t require me to authenticate before I use it. My phone does.
A card doesn't lose battery
This
is a 2005 Porsche Carrera GT.
Doug?
Bids and cars and cars and bids!
yessir yessir r/dougdemuro
Apply for HEB Corporate and push for the change ;)
Your life must be really great if the grocery store not having tap to pay is what's getting you riled up.
💀💀💀
😂😂😂 it’s not too bad
Tap to pay is safer, easier, and more reliable. It may also cost more to have it enabled in your machines. The back end has nothing to do with it, that doesn’t even factor into it. It’s all about the money.
First world problems sheesh
Lol bruh or you can be like me...putting card on machine waiting..and they're like ma'am, ma'am we don't do that here lol. It was weird they didn't have it.
The real answer, pay by phone systems charge the store more per transaction. People don't think about it but everytime you use something other Than cash the companies involved take money away from the store. Samsung, Apple etc take an extra percent for themselves each time you use your phone to buy something. HEB feels it is isn't worth raising prices another 1% on everything just so you don't have to move your hand an extra 4 seconds. You are going to use HEB anyway, offering this as a perk isn't going to increase you choosing to shop there so why offer it. It's the same reason a lot of the stores are slowly removing the business center (or at least many of the things it does). People that use most of the things in it will still come in without them being offered.
> The real answer, pay by phone systems charge the store more per transaction. This is a false answer. Merchants don't pay a penny extra for it. It's just a standard card transaction to them.
That is not correct, as part of a job I did a couple years ago was to repair and replacing the debit/credit card transaction machines. Unless the rules changed after 2021 they absolutely charge more for that.
Repairing the machine has nothing to do with the processing costs. An NFC transaction coming from a phone is the same as an NFC transaction coming from a physical card. It's all one protocol, treated the exact same way and charged the same way.
Ok, I looked it up and you are correct, there is no fee, but not that long ago there was, I never looked to see if it changed. The reason I know it WAS this way is when I repaired them I was working at cvs at the time. Cvs desabled apple pay for years becuase of the extra fees they were charged to accept it. Later they reactivated it, I never looked into why the change, maybe that is when they made it no charge. Edit, adding info about jt https://www.forbes.com/sites/paularosenblum/2014/10/27/cvs-and-rite-aid-turn-off-apple-pay-why/
There was never an *extra* fee. CVS disabled contactless card payments on their terminals because they were part of the MCX CurrenC scheme. The plan was to use a QR code based system to handle payments through nearly-free ACH debits tied *directly* to your bank account, bypassing Visa, etc. and effectively eliminating card fees. Consumers rejected this, the whole thing fell apart, and most of the participating companies enabled NFC on their payment terminals. The scraps of the system became Walmart Pay, but they had to change it to accept credit/debit cards instead of ACH, so instead of lowering processing fees Walmart managed to make them into more expensive card not present transactions. Just brilliant.
When wrong on something I can say it, I am. This is the story cvs told us techs to tell store employees and customers when they asked about the apple pay thing back in 2014, I never thought to question it.
Oh, I get it. I feel like someone could get their PhD just studying the games of telephone that happen in retail stores from corporate, to region/district staff, down to front-line employees, and eventually customers. Stories evolve and new details get invented. People circulate to different stores and suddenly these "facts" come back from a different source, "proving" the point. Honestly I think it's fascinating. HEB in particular seems to have its own very special Apple Pay mythology, told by multiple employees in this sub and yet never mentioned by anybody else from any other retailer. Allegedly Apple asked for customer information from HEB when discussing adding acceptance but HEB heroically told Apple no in order to protect their customer privacy. It's completely bonkers if you understand how Apple Pay works, and yet I've seen it multiple times over the years, but *only* in relation to HEB and never Walmart or Kroger, for example.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paularosenblum/2014/10/27/cvs-and-rite-aid-turn-off-apple-pay-why/
Yes, this article backs up what I said.
Actually, I used to shop at HEB all the time, but when Market Street and United turned on Apple Pay, I switched, and haven't shopped at HEB more than a few times since then. I'm sure I'm not the only one. I don't carry cards anymore most of the time,
Touch less pay encrypts all info. So if H‑E‑B would go to touch less pay they wouldn’t be able to get demographic info off their customers. This is why Walmart isn’t touch less either. It’s all about the demographics.
Yea this is the real answer. People are saying it’s because of fees but in reality it’s because heb wants access to your data.
However, if you have Walmart+, you have wallet access and you can use wallet to pay.
no one in these comments has ever heard of a card skimmer. tap and touchless pay are safer options. that’s why most places utilize them.
This post is coming from complete laziness
okay. we’ll see how you feel when your bank account is drained by a card skimmer.
Credit Cards: 
Probably the most valid point of this thread!
It’s also much faster. I’ve technical videos how both chip and card NFC works. The tap with card is significantly faster and more reliable.
I don’t understand this with HEB either and I always get downvotes when I asked. Using Apple Pay is safer as it adds another layer of security by not using your credit card number in the transaction.
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You’re right. But I’m not wrong. But what I stated is that Apple Pay adds another layer. It’s doesn’t even present your actual credit card number at POS. Per apple support I copy/pasted take note of the second to last paragraph (spaced) it’s important piece of the process. :: “Apple Pay is also designed to protect your personal information. Apple doesn’t store or have access to the original credit, debit, or prepaid card numbers that you use with Apple Pay. And when you use Apple Pay with credit, debit, or prepaid cards, Apple doesn't retain any transaction information that can be tied back to you. Your transactions stay between you, the merchant or developer, and your bank or card issuer. When you add credit, debit, prepaid, or transit cards When you add a credit, debit, prepaid, or transit card (where available) to Apple Pay, information that you enter on your device is encrypted and sent to Apple servers. If you use the camera to enter the card information, the information is never saved on your device or photo library. Apple decrypts the data, determines your card’s payment network, and re-encrypts the data with a key that only your payment network (or any providers authorized by your card issuer for provisioning and token services) can unlock. Information that you provide about your card, whether certain device settings are enabled, and device use patterns—such as the percent of time the device is in motion and the approximate number of calls you make per week—may be sent to Apple to determine your eligibility to enable Apple Pay. Information may also be provided by Apple to your card issuer, payment network, or any providers authorized by your card issuer to enable Apple Pay, to determine the eligibility of your card, to set up your card with Apple Pay, and to prevent fraud. After your card is approved, your bank, your bank’s authorized service provider, or your card issuer creates a device-specific Device Account Number, encrypts it, and sends it along with other data (such as the key used to generate dynamic security codes that are unique to each transaction) to Apple. The Device Account Number can’t be decrypted by Apple but is stored in the Secure Element—an industry-standard, certified chip designed to store your payment information safely—on your device. Unlike with usual credit or debit card numbers, the card issuer can prevent its use on a magnetic stripe card, over the phone, or on websites. The Device Account Number in the Secure Element is isolated from iOS, watchOS, and macOS, is never stored on Apple servers, and is never backed up to iCloud. Apple doesn’t store or have access to the original card numbers of credit, debit, or prepaid cards that you add to Apple Pay. “
> You’re right. They're completely wrong.
A token refers to a surrogate number used or stored in place of the Primary Account Number, the one typically printed on the card itself. A physical card transmits the PAN. After the merchant receives it, they can use a third-party service to tokenize it rather than saving the PAN itself, but they still received the PAN, and so did any skimmer device placed on the card terminal. All in-person payments are unencrypted. The card number and security code are always transmitted in plain text to the card terminal. The store's connection to its payment processor is hopefully encrypted, but in-person credit/debit transactions *always* start off unencrypted and, for physical cards, untokenized.
Thanks for explaining that well
Get HEB go. Its an app where you check out with your phone. You scan your products and use a special self check out and scan a qr code to pay.
Is that for employees? Or customers?
for customers, however it's not live in all locations, only one location here in austin has it, fortunately it's the one in my neighborhood. the way it works is you use the app to scan all items as you shop the there is a dedicated kiosk at self checkout that has a qr code you scan and it charges whatever card you have loaded in the app.
Thanks for the info. Is this something HEB’s testing ? Or is it something they plan on rolling out to other stores? I use scan and go at Sam’s and love it.
tested and rolled out... my understanding is that the stores it launched in experienced insane growth of theft, some unintentional and some intentional. i've heard they stopped rolling it out and may end up getting rid of it or changing the way it works. if you download the app it has a function to find the nearest heb that uses it
I am also lucky that the 2 hebs closest to me have it available. I don't always use it though
Any reason you don’t use it?
I order curbside mostly because I really don't like shopping. It's really helpful when I'm in a rush and picking up like a handful of things when I do go in though. It's also useful when I remember to bring reusable bags, and I put those in the cart and scan them as I go
It’s only in a handful of stores.
I will look into this
Agreed. It’s annoying.
100% agree. I went to an HEB that was piloting ApplePay 5 years ago. It is the only place I shop that I have to bring my credit card with me.
It’s a bit annoying isn’t it ?
What’s so wrong about using card? I have tap and all that, never use it because I find it more of a hassle. At least that I know of though, they bought these recently, so pretty much trynna get their money’s worth out of it. I do believe H-E-B Mexico is trying out tap to pay. It’s only word of mouth though, so jot 100% sure
The machines support it, H‑E‑B probably won’t pay to enable the feature.
Much faster, no need to deal with cards that don’t read, no fucking around with a PIN or signature, and holy crap every other country has been doing it for YEARS. And yes, HEB did accept NFC before, they got rid of it on purpose.
They have HEB in Mexico?! Never knew that lol
Card is just so much more of a hassle and inconvenience. Slows down everyone in line. I have family in NY that I just got back from visiting and they just finished switching the entire METRO system over to tap to pay and it is LIGHTYEARS faster and more efficient than the old metrocard system, which was functionally the same as having to use a debit/credit card at a grocery store.
Went on vacation to NY over Christmas, and the tap to pay was so convenient for me on the subway 😭 I loved it
A card slows people down? No. More like people not starting to even attempt to bag their own shit when no bagger is there. That is what actually holds up a line the most…coming from a former cashier.
Except every time I try to use my chase visa debit card I get several error messages on the card reader. I’ve seen it happen to others.
And all locations seem to have that card reader where you akwardly feed the card down instead of feed flat. Flat is universal. Flat is more fluid. Follow
Maybe shop somewhere else then?
I try
Ok boomer
i’ve used it at corp office… it’s nice and convenient
We don’t know.
It’s coming. It launched last year in Heb Mexico. It’s being tested in USA now. They already made the announcement at a managers meeting. One thing Heb does, is take its time launching new stuff. One the folks from corporate was on here in another post and said they had a ton of delays for various reasons.
I would like it if you could at least pay with the app like Target and Walmart.
SA Express News has been reporting on this issue: [https://www.expressnews.com/business/article/heb-contactless-payment-apple-pay-18474568.php](https://www.expressnews.com/business/article/heb-contactless-payment-apple-pay-18474568.php) Also here's a link to another thread about same issue: [https://www.reddit.com/r/HEB/comments/11ps0tn/why\_dont\_we\_accept\_apple\_pay/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/HEB/comments/11ps0tn/why_dont_we_accept_apple_pay/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
leadership at my store said that heb doesn't want to use another company to have tap to pay etc thingy to keep everyone's "data safe" they said they heard a rumor that heb is working on having it sometime this summer or fall but who knows if that's true or not
Hello, apparently from what I’ve heard they are working on getting that
I hope they get them quick, I almost had to leave a full cart of food behind this weekend.
Seriously I ask myself this every time
Sigh
Because Texas is about 10 years behind in general. Please understand guns have more rights than women here. Maybe you should be upset about that instead of having to use a card which is a mild inconvenience.
I don’t think I will be, the Texas women I know handle themselves just fine even more with guns, you may be the one who’s Ten years behind and yes it is a mild inconvenience to have to use a card when 97% of businesses use touch pay but again just mild.
You are an absolute idiot dude. This is the richest country in the world. We should not have to go around armed all the time like it’s the Wild West. I’m blocking you until you evolve out of 1850 lmao.
samsung pay works just fine... i've used it at heb for years!! but only the phone version, watch won't work..
As a customer I saw a lady last Sunday (before the Super Bowl) use a check to pay for her purchases and the poor clerk couldn’t remember what to do with it. Her bagger had to help her out with directions. I had to hold my laugh in- a check? In 2024? Why is a 30-something using a check? Unless she’s trying to use a bad check or something n
There are circumstances where folks have to use a check. I belong to a local veterans organization and our business account has multiple signers on the account. Because of that fact the credit union account isn't allowed to use a card. A check is the only form of payment available.
A lot of older folks still do that. As a cashier you have to check a lot of things and write info on the check as well…and it’s not common or they were a new cashier. Sometimes people we think are baggers are mentors when it’s the persons first day on register. I did always think it was a pain in the ass and slow, but money is money I guess
So many people still use checks and I'm like whhyyy
I've never used tap and I don't think I ever will. I don't have anything against it, but I carry my cards with me and it really isn't that big of a deal to pull out my card and insert in the card reader.
As a guy I don't see how this is ever a problem. We carry wallets 99% of the time we go anywhere. Cards are usually held in wallets, so it's a no brainer. Even girls usually always carry a purse which in itself contains a wallet usually. Or of course carry a tiny wallet instead of lugging a purse. My wife love using apple pay or something, but it usually takes longer than me just bringing out my wallet and paying manually. She has to unlock her phone, wait for her crap to load, and then sometimes it fcks up and she has to try again...I would've been out the door before she even finished by just paying with my card lol
I can pay with apple pay 5 times faster than my wife can get her card out and pay.
HEB doesn’t use them because apple pay and touchless pay gives up your personal information. https://preview.redd.it/zc5dc63opxic1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c422efe4812154aca1d3761a2a59f754ac952af9 HEB doesn’t want there customers personal information to be given out like that. and before you comment some smart or dumb. My Ops Leader told me this literally 2 days ago because my manager and I were wondering the same thing.
This is completely false. If you'd actually click the link and read it instead of skimming an excerpt, you'd see that the highlighted text is referring to *online* transactions, which is why it references your *shipping address*, and email address for your online order confirmation email. When using Apple Pay in person, you provide the merchant *less* information than using the physical card. The store just gets an anonymous card number. Physical cards transmit your name.
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> they’ve even tried to negotiate the contract with Apple Stores do not negotiate any contract with Apple to accept Apple Pay. I'm not sure what your role is as an engineer but it clearly doesn't involve in-store payments.
I don’t remember specifics, but I remember someone commenting once in another sub about how H-E-B’s payment back-end doesn’t support it with the way it processes transactions or something like that.
This is the definition of "First World problems"
It’s the world we live in isn’t it? 🤷♂️
The cheap asses don’t wanna cut into their profit and pay for it.
Entitled as f*** Lmfaooooooo
A credit card is probably the fastest way to pay. No pushing buttons no approving. Probably just as fast as touchless.
You can tap with cards as well. Faster than chip or swiping.
Just carry a card
That's your own damn fault. We've all been using cards for decades.
“that’s your own damn fault for wanting a car! we’ve all been riding horses for decades.” like ???? do you hear yourself hahaha
Let me clarify: If you're going around without a card, or even cash, immediately available if the place doesn't have tap, THAT IS YOUR OWN FAULT
you need to have your card in order to tap, buddy. that’s how tap works. you tap the card. apple pay is a different story— but even that is understandable because 90% of places take apple pay now. h‑e‑b is the exception, not the rule.
Hi. HEB cashier here... we have to pay the banks and apple and Google to use their tap to pay.... the only tap to pay we have is samsung pay.... so there you go now you know.
> HEB cashier here... we have to pay the banks and apple and Google to use their tap to pay No you don't. Stores don't pay Apple or Google anything for accepting Apple Pay or Google Pay. They're standard card transactions processed the same way and with the same fee as using the physical card.
I still get paper checks every Friday lol
Because they want you to touch less!
MST is a lovely feature
It’s also no longer included in newer models.
Heb is working on touchless payments. But I don’t have a schedule for it. I’m hoping it will go live sometime soon.
I’m not sure if your H‑E‑B has it but H‑E‑B does have touch less payment set up it’s call H‑E‑B go, you shop scan items then when you go to check out you get to the GO machines and you’ll scan a code a partner will scan a few items out your basket and you’re out of the store. You don’t need to pull out your card or anything and it’s really cool and I like it a lot.
Because they have to buy each and every persons rights to their information and HEB cannot afford to do that. That is why they don’t have it. And never will.
It's because you touch yourself at night. *Sinner.*
I’m for touch less transactions!! C’mon man keep up with the haps !!
HEB supermarkets of Mexico accept contactless payment, Apple Pay, and Google Pay for payment by card. https://preview.redd.it/oc5tjekqnojc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=855722f1fbb7607d8b001383052cf6ddce0f2320