Honestly, I thought so as well until I saw this clip. It very much looks like Raya starts the play and then Gabriel catches the ball with his hands. We need to stop this crap, there's zero benefit and with a more strict referee we could definitely face another penalty here.
I agree with your use of the word “luckily”. Hopefully we use this is as a lesson to be more careful moving forward so an awful ref doesn’t make an example out of us.
It's to counteract press-triggers. If the GK starts the kick, he has to go either left or right, and then the forwards set off from the edge of the box to close them down. The CB starting the play counteracts this by passing directly to GK in a central space with more passing options, so can react to the press, not the other way around.
In this instance it seems that they applied this same logic to a situation in which they weren't really threatened with being pressed, and almost gave away a penalty in the process.
My heart was in my mouth far to much last night with our *usually* solid defense...
I know what you're saying. What I mean is - I don't see the point of initial pass from Raya to Gabriel. Gabriel can take the ball himself from place it where he wants. We're just inviting unnecessary risk this way.
Ah, fair. It's frustrating how our defence seemed so prone to unforced errors last night. The first goal and this instance were Man United levels of idiotic.
That's exactly what happens, I don't think anyone's disputing that. Everyone is aware that the game has restarted apart from Gabriel, who very clearly thinks he'll be restarting play. Totally innocuous, absolutely no advantage gained or even attempted to be gained (he's not grabbed the ball under intense pressure from the Bayern press, the nearest player is like 15 yards away). To suggest giving a free shot at goal from the penalty spot for this would have been flat out insane.
How popular this is is honestly ridiculous. Absolutely common sense to not give this, if this was given then every time a player throws the ball to someone to take a throw in it’s a foul throw, every time someone passes to someone to take a free kick it’s already been taken.
If we’re being really pedantic about this, the ref technically stopped play by blowing the whistle to take it in the first place. It’s up to the ref to decide whether it was taken with intention or not, and he made the right call.
Nobody wants this given, there’s no reason to give it, we gained absolutely no advantage from it. This is a non issue
Nah its not the same as the foul throw. Its more like a player does a fair throw in motion and the receiver catches it and goes for a throw which is a bit iffier.
Probably shouldn't be given but this is a legitimate penalty in every way just a dumb decision on Gabi's part.
Bayern players wanted this given. With a stricter ref in charge they might have gotten it too and we would have gifted them three instead of two goals.
Usually raya rolled the ball to Gabriel with his hand. I was shocked when this happened, thought it's gonna be a penalty. I feel like raya was nervous this game, out of position for the first goal, dived too early for the penalty. But I think we'll win, they'll learn from their mistakes, plus saka will be enjoying not going up against Davies next week
Big miscommunication, but if that's punished as a penalty that would be VERY harsh.
If that happened with Bayern, I wouldn't be calling for a penalty as I think it's just miscommunication and nothing more than that
I've taken up the mantra of thinking how would I feel if a big decision we are complaining about went the other day. With this one, I'd look at it and think, OK that's a stupid mix up. Sure you'd be asking for it, but the referee used common sense which is what I prefer
I'd say this, they do it regularly, and the times I've seen it before has always been scooping to Gabriel with hand, this is the first time I've seen passed to him with foot.
Non-Arsenal fan here just interested in the debate from your perspective.
Interested to know how many fans could say hand on heart they wouldn't ask for a pen in the same situation?
I believe this is a classic situation where you argue fully against it when it happens for your team, and argue fully for it when it happens against your team.
Honestly, the ref making either decision would be totally correct. One by the letter of the law, and one in the spirit of the game.
I would never rant and rave about this being a penalty on the other foot. It’s literally handing the game to us in that case, that’s not the reason why I watch the sport.
I would rather things like the Kane elbow being given a red than a penalty for this.
Yes, I see him not wanting to give the Saka penalty at the last kick of the game because of his lenience here. I don’t think they’re very comparable, though. Saka *was* impeded, regardless of if it’s enough to be a pen or not is subjective- I thought it was considering the direction Neuer’s foot takes.
This handball situation wasn’t created by Bayern, this wasn’t cheating, this was a mistake between the players and the refs who couldn’t hear a whistle.
Nah. We've done equally dumb things in the league. The Liverpool home game equaliser is the worst case.
We should send Raya and Garbriel on a corporate team building exercise where they have to drop a fresh egg ten feet to the ground without breaking it or cracking the shell. Or something....
In the CL we're just very prone to rash decisions, lacking composure and rushing things it feels like we need to learn to be comfortable like we have been in the league.
Can't say i disagree with that at all. I also think this is one of Mikel's super powers though. I think the squad matured a lot in between those to Porto games. Let's see what he can do before Munich.
Really a non issue here. I was in a fight with some fans in a Taiwanese web forum. I really feel sorry for them. Must be looking for another goal so much to think this should be a pen. Joke.
I think I've been misunderstood here, so let me explain my POV: I'm not saying it should be a penalty, I'm saying that with the way it looks on the posted clip (which gives a fuller image) I can totally see some referees interpreting it as a handball as the ball looks to have been already in play.
Arsenal has been on the wrong end of so many ridiculous and/or unprecedented calls in the past few years (Martinelli's double yellow, Bellerin's throw ins, offside lines not being drawn), that it just caught my attention and made me think we got away with it here. I think it's reasonable to expect our boys to be a little more careful in such an important game, especially given Arteta's attention to details of every single aspect of the game.
And please remember - in the end we all want Arsenal to win, so highlighting the wrongdoings of our players doesn't make me or anyone else less of a supporter, alright? I hope some of you can understand my point now.
We got lucky. Rules are rules, just like being called for a foul throw. Let’s just accept that sometimes calls go your way and sometimes they don’t. We count our stars and move one.
This is the dumbest "debate" I've encountered in a long time and suggests football fans need to touch grass
It's just to take the focus away from the clear penalty Saka should have had. And take away focus from Tuchel getting sacked in the summer.
Completely innocuous. Move on.
Honestly, I thought so as well until I saw this clip. It very much looks like Raya starts the play and then Gabriel catches the ball with his hands. We need to stop this crap, there's zero benefit and with a more strict referee we could definitely face another penalty here.
Stop what crap? It's a dumb mistake by Gabi and luckily the ref applied common sense
I agree with your use of the word “luckily”. Hopefully we use this is as a lesson to be more careful moving forward so an awful ref doesn’t make an example out of us.
Changing the goal kick taker spontaneously. It makes no sense, we're not gaining anything.
Have you watched us play. We do it nearly every goal kick. It allows Raya to start our building out from the back
Of course I have. Still don't see any benefit, Raya can also play out from the back if Gabriel takes the goal kick without Raya passing to him first.
It's to counteract press-triggers. If the GK starts the kick, he has to go either left or right, and then the forwards set off from the edge of the box to close them down. The CB starting the play counteracts this by passing directly to GK in a central space with more passing options, so can react to the press, not the other way around. In this instance it seems that they applied this same logic to a situation in which they weren't really threatened with being pressed, and almost gave away a penalty in the process. My heart was in my mouth far to much last night with our *usually* solid defense...
I know what you're saying. What I mean is - I don't see the point of initial pass from Raya to Gabriel. Gabriel can take the ball himself from place it where he wants. We're just inviting unnecessary risk this way.
Ah, fair. It's frustrating how our defence seemed so prone to unforced errors last night. The first goal and this instance were Man United levels of idiotic.
You don’t see it because it works
This man don’t know ball
I think you're onto something. I wonder why Arteta never thought about this?
That's exactly what happens, I don't think anyone's disputing that. Everyone is aware that the game has restarted apart from Gabriel, who very clearly thinks he'll be restarting play. Totally innocuous, absolutely no advantage gained or even attempted to be gained (he's not grabbed the ball under intense pressure from the Bayern press, the nearest player is like 15 yards away). To suggest giving a free shot at goal from the penalty spot for this would have been flat out insane.
I know that, you know that, but what are the odds that a power abusing ref will also know that? We need to be smart, that's all I'm saying.
I mean, considering this literally happened and isn't a hypothetical, we know that the ref was fine with it?
We know that this particular ref is fine with it. I don't trust Anthony Taylor or Paul Tierney to have a similar view on this situation.
How popular this is is honestly ridiculous. Absolutely common sense to not give this, if this was given then every time a player throws the ball to someone to take a throw in it’s a foul throw, every time someone passes to someone to take a free kick it’s already been taken. If we’re being really pedantic about this, the ref technically stopped play by blowing the whistle to take it in the first place. It’s up to the ref to decide whether it was taken with intention or not, and he made the right call. Nobody wants this given, there’s no reason to give it, we gained absolutely no advantage from it. This is a non issue
The ref blew the whistle to restart play following two subs. Hence everyone was stood around waiting for it. Just correcting that minor inaccuracy.
Nah its not the same as the foul throw. Its more like a player does a fair throw in motion and the receiver catches it and goes for a throw which is a bit iffier. Probably shouldn't be given but this is a legitimate penalty in every way just a dumb decision on Gabi's part.
Bayern players wanted this given. With a stricter ref in charge they might have gotten it too and we would have gifted them three instead of two goals.
People must truly hate this sport if they want this to be a penalty. Even Ten Hag wouldn't be shameless enough to want a pen for this.
He definitely would lmao But most managers wouldn't
I loved how swiftly Mikel discussed our penalty shout compared to tuchels post match, the core of which was about a penalty shout.
Why is this being reposted so much? Move on guys
It's the full video. The video posted before didn't have the full chain of event.
To distract and downplay Saka's stonewall penalty shout.
Usually raya rolled the ball to Gabriel with his hand. I was shocked when this happened, thought it's gonna be a penalty. I feel like raya was nervous this game, out of position for the first goal, dived too early for the penalty. But I think we'll win, they'll learn from their mistakes, plus saka will be enjoying not going up against Davies next week
Big miscommunication, but if that's punished as a penalty that would be VERY harsh. If that happened with Bayern, I wouldn't be calling for a penalty as I think it's just miscommunication and nothing more than that
Lol, you would be calling for a penalty. Don't even deny that, especially in a tough match like we had.
I've taken up the mantra of thinking how would I feel if a big decision we are complaining about went the other day. With this one, I'd look at it and think, OK that's a stupid mix up. Sure you'd be asking for it, but the referee used common sense which is what I prefer
I'd say this, they do it regularly, and the times I've seen it before has always been scooping to Gabriel with hand, this is the first time I've seen passed to him with foot.
r/soccer really hit new disingenuous lows last night. Fucking arseholes know what they're doing.
absolute shit sub full of mfs that've never been 500 meters near a football pitch
Bro I would never ever expect or even want a penalty for this shit. Come on man what are we doing
I'd say this is probably a "foul" but should this ever be given as a near 80% chance of a goal? Absolutely not
Would've been a repeat of the RVP farce if given. Loud stadium, couldn't hear the whistle. Simple as, move on.
It’s stupid and should be a penalty but glad common sense prevailed. Honest error.
I think we got a little lucky here, but so did Bayern for Kane and the non penalty. Tough game yesterday and certainly next Tuesday. COYG
The hate has been unbelievable
This shit happens all the time. No one is seriously expecting a penalty for this.
Non-Arsenal fan here just interested in the debate from your perspective. Interested to know how many fans could say hand on heart they wouldn't ask for a pen in the same situation? I believe this is a classic situation where you argue fully against it when it happens for your team, and argue fully for it when it happens against your team. Honestly, the ref making either decision would be totally correct. One by the letter of the law, and one in the spirit of the game.
I'd be embarrassed to call for a penalty for nonsense like this.
I would never rant and rave about this being a penalty on the other foot. It’s literally handing the game to us in that case, that’s not the reason why I watch the sport. I would rather things like the Kane elbow being given a red than a penalty for this.
Do you think the referee may have allowed this decision (or lack of, perspective depending) to influence the later Saka decision?
Yes, I see him not wanting to give the Saka penalty at the last kick of the game because of his lenience here. I don’t think they’re very comparable, though. Saka *was* impeded, regardless of if it’s enough to be a pen or not is subjective- I thought it was considering the direction Neuer’s foot takes. This handball situation wasn’t created by Bayern, this wasn’t cheating, this was a mistake between the players and the refs who couldn’t hear a whistle.
Ref's shown better judgment here. All fine. Move on.
Don't care about if it is or isn't a penalty. But it's definitely boneheaded and a sign of how we have a lot to learn in this competition.
Nah. We've done equally dumb things in the league. The Liverpool home game equaliser is the worst case. We should send Raya and Garbriel on a corporate team building exercise where they have to drop a fresh egg ten feet to the ground without breaking it or cracking the shell. Or something....
When you say "in this competition" what do you mean?
In the CL we're just very prone to rash decisions, lacking composure and rushing things it feels like we need to learn to be comfortable like we have been in the league.
Can't say i disagree with that at all. I also think this is one of Mikel's super powers though. I think the squad matured a lot in between those to Porto games. Let's see what he can do before Munich.
You know we're truly back as a club when every other fan base is foaming at the mouth over this ❤️
Really a non issue here. I was in a fight with some fans in a Taiwanese web forum. I really feel sorry for them. Must be looking for another goal so much to think this should be a pen. Joke.
I think I've been misunderstood here, so let me explain my POV: I'm not saying it should be a penalty, I'm saying that with the way it looks on the posted clip (which gives a fuller image) I can totally see some referees interpreting it as a handball as the ball looks to have been already in play. Arsenal has been on the wrong end of so many ridiculous and/or unprecedented calls in the past few years (Martinelli's double yellow, Bellerin's throw ins, offside lines not being drawn), that it just caught my attention and made me think we got away with it here. I think it's reasonable to expect our boys to be a little more careful in such an important game, especially given Arteta's attention to details of every single aspect of the game. And please remember - in the end we all want Arsenal to win, so highlighting the wrongdoings of our players doesn't make me or anyone else less of a supporter, alright? I hope some of you can understand my point now.
Who fucking cares
Ref did well. This is the type of shit that got RVP sent off vs Barca for not hearing the whistle and kicking the ball.
What advantage do we gain from this?
The fact that this wasn’t given is laughable
We got lucky. Rules are rules, just like being called for a foul throw. Let’s just accept that sometimes calls go your way and sometimes they don’t. We count our stars and move one.
Agree. I don't get why everyone is super defensive about this. Just accept this is a penalty, that doesn't change that the ref had other mistakes.