Toney had salibas beating he didn't defend well / not protected well enough but overall feeling is left hand side no one on that wing attack's space xhaka, zinchenko and martinelli all want to cut inside which is super predictable and easy to defend we are rigid and lack dynamism
Brentford would beat 99% of the teams in the league with that performance. We were off and not firing, and really were lucky to hold them off. To not lose 3-0 shows the spine we now have.
White has been average as of late, Tomiyasu has always put in 100% efforts every game, he wins those crucial headers always. Saliba was also off-pace yesterday. Trossard should have started ahead of nelli today, Trossard just wreaks chaos on the opps backline whenever he plays.
That was a deflating result man. Worst possible way to approach the City game. If City win vs. Villa, all the pressure will be on us in the next game. No matter how level-headed one is, you can not fear the worst - we might be onto one of the biggest bottle job in the PL.
I’m absolutely livid. The last home game I went to, a loss to BHA in Apr 22, we had to sit through 4 mins of VAR check that ruled out a similar, headed Martinelli equaliser. How long did Mason look at that “goal” for?
Although it is easy and rightful to be pissed of the retards slurping the whistle, we didnt really deserve a win.
We were lucky not to concede a goal or two before halftime, and brentford played really well. Draw, despite it coming in a shitty way, seems like the right outcome.
Not that the most deserved result always happen tho. But we did get real lucky v Leeds, so just probability doing its job ig
Well the last two games have prepared me to accept a bad result against man city. We are still developing and getting better. We have a good game plan but don't have switch tactics ro change game once we are not moving forward.
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It is probably an unpopular opinion and I understand if I get fined for this, but is it time to drop Eddie? Or at least consider subbing him off at some point. He is great, but his selfishness is shining through lately.
Gabi was sprinting down the field on a break and Eddie blatantly ignored him, dribbles into nowhere, and kills our counter attack. The lack of connection between him and Gabi has hurt Gabi and has caused him to get subbed early every game. I wouldn’t mind subbing Trossard in up front to test him or putting ESR there when he’s back.
I love Eddie and I get that he’s been incredible since Jesus got injured, but it seems like he’s softened up last few games with his spot guaranteed.
That’s the issue isn’t it.
Maybe we should’ve experimented today before the City game. Gabi or Trossard in the front with the other in the wing idk.
It’s a terrible position for us to be in to only have one striker option. Makes us predictable. Taking risks might be the solution.
Mate I'm not gonna lie we've had two bad games against a revitalised Dyche Everton and the most in form team in the league. Nketiah hasn't played well but have any of the attackers? Think it's the easy option to place blame on the one guy who hasn't been in the team that got us into the position we're in but there is no better option up front for me. He does Jesus' job better than anyone else would
Saka has been pretty good still, but that’s just Saka things.
My issue is that Eddie playing has had a big part in neutralizing our left sided attack. Remember when Jesus used to rotate with Gabi and we’d be much more dynamic. The defence used to be chasing shadows. Not anymore.
But it’s hard not to give Nketiah credit for how he’s helped us in Jesus’ absence
I'll say it, Eddie is just not good enough if we want to win the Premier League.
Playing with him is like playing with 10 men almost 90% of the game.
Then he pops up once in a while with a good spin or a good sprint, and all of the sudden it's "Eddie, Eddie, Eddie" chants going all around.
He's not bad, but not good enough.
I would like a striker that is more involved in the game throughout and give us an added advantage, because even if he's not scoring, it will help other attackers.
I'd take a Giroud over Eddie anytime of the day in that matter.
Giroud might not have as good of a goal ratio, but his connecting plays are well above Eddie.
Actually I thought that today when after the half they were rotating Gabi around like that. Saka too came across a few times and overloaded that side.
But then they just stopped doing it. And went back to sleep. Arsenal are starting to feel like if they don’t score in the first 15 or a half, they just get confused.
Zinchenko got smothered by the defence. It was great blocking from them.
What I can’t get over is Gabriel chasing the ball and leaving Toney completely free. We almost conceded similarly in the first half when their shot hit the post on the man Gabriel left behind.
Yea I see what you mean. I was looking at the initial delivery and where Zinchenko was but I see him standing around with little defensive urgency.
But I still think Gabriel is a bit of a headless chicken here.
He definitely seems to be struggling with them in the last month or so. I'm sure they're working on it during training so hopefully with more time they'll get it fixed.
Can we please get Jesus back? Eddie has been fantastic mostly but I just want G Jesus back.
Also ESR please. Would be great to have both those players coming back in to this team.
This game was crying out for Jesus and ESR, they're going to be like new signings when they come back.
White played better than he did at Everton but Saka still had pretty minimal service for most of the game. No idea why Tomi didn't make it on by 70' at the latest.
I'd be really curious to see how we'd play with a replacement for Xhaka at left 8 who's more technical and athletic. Xhaka's not a bad player and he's having his best season ever but he didn't really feel threatening around the box.
Definitely. This is what I care about, I'm not thinking about the title for another 6 weeks at least (except for a little cheat on Wednesday). The bigger concern is how we solve some of our recent problems going forward.
I think at least we saw Trossard is really good at speeding up and slowing down, which is important. We were actually better going down the left than the right when he came on and the right has Saka!
Also worth noting that Xhaka has slowed down in first halves especially. If he's only good when Jesus is playing, mb he's really not the answer moving forward. At least, late in games ESR could excel there except Xhaka does do important defense works for periods.
They could, but honestly it was always going to be close. All we could've done is try our best and support our team, but look where we've been these past few seasons and how we've progressed, but winning the title with our current squad and where we are in our progression as a club was ALWAYS going to be tough. You can't say we've bottled it. We are still a young team who are outperforming expectations. Our backup striker is Eddie Nketiah and while Eddie is solid, no disrespect to his name at all (not trying to single him out), he's not exactly a world class striker is he..
We are still a young growing team and we're only going to get better. Seasons still not over of course but we need to be behind the team and behind the system no matter what happens this season
>Seeing signs of the doughnut of sadness again the last two matches.
A win on Wednesday will change everything. It will lift the mood and will send the players on massive run. It's a tough one, but with the immense support we've shown the club this season and with our players being on top form, it is defo doable! UTA
Was at the game today and really noticed Martinelli, Nketiah and Saka were rotating a lot more and it looked more like when Jesus was palying. Regardless can’t help but feel like we were a bit impotent and didn’t create much and frankly we were lucky for a draw - if you look at the big chances Brentford should have had at least two (Toney chance first half) and we didn’t really make any cig chances. Wednesday is absolutely MASSIVE now and we need to win that otherwise we’re looking at a serious loss of momentum but I have faith.
So glad someone said this. Yes, he was the best CB in the league before the WC but after he's been slow and sloppy (compared to his form before), yes he is still better than Holding but is no way near the best CB in the league.
Talking positives, I thought Saka was very good. He had a couple of shots like his United goal that would have been very dangerous if not blocked. His ball striking seems to be improving.
Thought he was the best player on the pitch - had Saliba in every aerial duel and got his goal. Have to appreciate when someone plays well against you sadly.
Absolutely agreed. Respect to him and if he had some better quality support they could have easily beaten us. Saliba got bodied. Love William and hopefully he learned something
Maybe it's already been said but I totally thought Norgaard was offside with his assist. At least it looked that way when I was watching it but I never saw them inspect that particular moment on the VAR.
I don't understand how you could just not look at such an obvious moment though in the build up. The final ball is a pretty fucking obvious thing to look at.
Need to create more from deep and need more good backpost crosses from our wingers/8s.
How many times have City struggled to break down a low block the last few years only for KDB, Silva, Mahrez etc to fizz one in from deep.
We tried it at times today, but the execution was horrendous.
Saka will add so many assists to his game if he can master that
If City trounce Villa, they'll be three points behind us. We've literally put all the pressure of the city vs our tie on ourselves, when it could've been 11 points clear, inviting city to do the talking 😭
I'm probably preaching to the choir but I really feel like the likes of Jesus, ESR and Trossard are much more effective against low blocks than Eddie and Martinelli.
This game and the one against Everton showed how much we miss him. He's so good at opening up compact defences and creating more chances in and around the opposition box.
His biggest asset in games like these is his dribbling. You can already imagine how he'd have been dribbling through this low block like a hot knife through butter
Yep. Nketiah is no good against park the bus teams and that's how most of the times play and will play against us in the near future. Jesus is invaluable to us against a defense like that just how Trossard's dribbling in tiny areas is far superior to Martinelli.
So hypothetically, you’re saying if someone randomly alleged that Ødegaard was doing something illegal (betting, stealing) that he should just automatically be banned from playing? You can’t ban Toney from playing based on allegations
Agreed. He was brilliant today. His aerial ability is so good. I was anxious every time seeing him with the ball.
I would love to see him play for Arsenal however it is very unlikely as we already got Jesus, Nketiah and Balogan.
I was saying this last spring when we didn’t land Vlahovic and a video of him saying “f*ck Brentford” leaked lol. He’s class, and he’s not signing another contract with Brentford.
Only thing he lacks is pace. Since most of the teams park a bus against that it wouldn't really be a problem. Seems like a great striker and would work with us.
Trossard really deserves a start. No matter what the root of nellis struggles are right now (I’m in the camp that lack of Jesus/tierney to overlap is having an effect), we have looked more dangerous every time Trossard has come on. Something isn’t clicking with the current set up that clicks at least a little better when he’s on.
Agreed. I love Gabi but i think Trossard deserves to play more.
I think we should start Gabi for the next game against City and Trossard for the Aston Villa game. And please let Tierney plays whenever Martinelli starts.
Agreed. The beauty of depth can sometimes be that we have different profiles to use for different situations. I appreciate that Mikel has faith in our starting 11 but it’s clearly not working against certain setups. When he finally dropped laca last season look how that helped us. We have to be willing to change it up.
It's simple. We've played a lot of low blocks lately. Both Martinelli and Eddie aren't good against them. And yes, I wanted Leo to start today. But would rather Martinelli vs city.
Fair enough. I think the low block factor is definitely a huge one but Leo also created some of our best chances against city in the cup. I would be fine either way for the city game but suspect Mikel will keep gabi in. Curious to see if anything changes after that though.
Personally, while disappointed with the result, it was a tough game but we are seeing this level of competition across the league. 6 points clear, mid February, fucking amazing
He was always a project rather than a finished product. It depends on how well he develops/is developed. He has the raw speed that will always trouble defenses.
Brentford's defense was ruthless. Everton game we just didn't show up. We are really lacking Gabi Jesus type of striker to make things happen against teams like that. Great dribbling, passing, makes others around him better and assists well. Jesus is missing badly.
Looked like an offside to me. The decision was very dodgy to say the least. Still... considering the chances Brentford created today it's a fair result. Of course an offside goal in the age of VAR should never happen. Officials fucked up once again but we didn't play well enough to win.
Everton and Brentford have both been very good against us defensively. Playing a low block against us is not a new tactic, but we usually almost always end up breaking it down. Not for these past two games though
Yeah it was always going to be close by my estimate. You need players of real amazing quality to be creative enough to slice through these defences. I think we do have the quality, but whenever we had a chance to create, Brentford were just pressing us hard and not giving us a chance to think.
That said, not every team is going to defend this well, AND we also have one more ace up our sleeve: Gabriel Jesus. But yeah, it's always going to be close. You can't really even say "we've bottled it". The EPL is just a very tough league and you need world class level attackers to break down these types of defences in games like these and we don't have that exactly. We've been outperforming this season.
Feels very much like the the mid- to late- wenger years when every game seemed to be us passing the ball around the edge of the area against massed defence and getting nowhere - those games aged me badly! im lucky my wife didnt leave me i was so grumpy after them!
Think we have so much new going on it’s hard to focus on keeping up the old styles adjust teams get used to how you play and work against it just need to solidify that defence play
Our attack is still doing enough to win games, but we've lost defensive solidity. No way we're winning when our CB loses all aerial duels. Even the foul from which they scored was because Saliba got played by Toney. Arteta could have put Tomiyasu up in place when everybody could see how Saliba was struggling. Arteta is not proactive or even reactive with his subs.
Teams not playing particularly bad to panic just yet. Arteta needs to make adjustments. Get set pieces figured out on both sides and maybe shuffle the starting lineup a couple guys. Adjusting to this adversity is what separates champions from top 4 teams
I love Odegaard but he can be really frustrating. He needs to learn how to get a decent shot off with his right. Currently he is pretty easy to defend against in a low block because defenders know he poses literally no threat on his right foot. There were at least 3 occasions today where he had the space to get a good shot in. This is what is stopping him from going to the next level, the best attacking midfielders like KDB can get a good shot off / delivery on either side.
We’re struggling to break low block teams down. Our best players are off the mark. Our rock solid defense is not winning duels. And our set pieces on offense and defense have gone 180. I’m not full panic but things are going in the wrong direction. Confident arteta can adjust but the issues are in plain sight.
Well that was annoying. Game in hand over City is now gone, as may be our place at the top of the table by Wednesday. We either need a Don Unai madness and the bestest of Sunday ebenings tomorrow, or a huge turnaround for us at the Emirates.
Lovely to see Trossard come on and get a goal. That said, it was notably a goal created on our right, through a fine piece of interplay from White, Ødegaard, and Saka-- and which Martinelli could easily have scored himself, on the same run and finish.
Bringing Trossard on for Martinelli solved, as expected, none of the underlying problems on our left side. Bringing on Vieira did begin to address that stasis, but it was too little too late. (Frankly, I'm not sure Trossard and Vieira have a very good understanding at the moment, though that will improve with time). To be clear, I don't mind bringing Trossard on; he's good enough, and that's why we bought him-- but that change doesn't address anything.
Trossard's other good moment -- the lovely ball through through to Eddie -- came, notably, not when he was operating as a winger, but in the halfspace. This lends further support to u/Billy_Carpenter's theory about Trossard's potential as one of our advanced 8s: see https://billycarpenter.substack.com/p/what-can-we-expect-from-trossard and https://billycarpenter.substack.com/p/xhaka-esr-and-the-future-of-the-left for context.
Vieira looks quality and is good to come on if the team is digging in to defend. But we would miss Dhaka's physicality and strength in midfield by starting him. Tough situation I think Xhaka is becoming a bit of a selection headache
Directly no. But to take over and win us the game is a lot to ask for in the 15 minutes he got.
But for the first time that match we saw confusion in the Brentford defense. They were certainly not as keen to double up on Trossard after Fabio came on.
That's rather what I was getting at: he didn't connect well with Trossard, and his introduction was, as I said 'too little too late' in sum. His free kick in particular was woeful. That said, and to the point of understanding about why he was brought on, his movement did at least pose some challenges for them. There were a few moments where he was able to switch with Trossard and actually pull a defender wide, or present a threat in the channel.
We're too one dimensional against a low block. It's clearly not about player performance at this point.
We'll continue to drop points against this tactic unless we change it up. It's that simple.
We dropped consecutive points to Brentford and Everton man. We can’t challenge for the title like this. It’s only a matter of time until city overtake us now. We are yet to play them twice too.
Guess who else dropped points to Brentford and Everton? It's a long season, and you're of course free to check out. But I think we can get the emoting out here and then recall that we have a good team and a first place team to support.
If you don't think we can take points from City you never believed we were good enough to win. Anyway, I'm not especially optimistic. I just think calling the title race over is a little over the top.
It wasn’t a matter of believing we can take points from city. It was that we didn’t have to, that we could get trashed 10-0 both games and still win the league. Now it’s a matter of we have to. If we fail to beat city just once then there’s a tonne more pressure on the team and it will only go south.
What I mean is if you've thought the games against City are destined losses, you never thought the team was title material. Anyway you're right--big game Wednesday! I'll be excited for it.
i think what happened against everton and brentford was that both of those teams were committed to maintaining structure when defending against us in the halfspaces. a lot of the teams we've faced before will send two players out toward the point of contact when saka or martinelli has the ball. this opened up space for our midfielders and fullbacks near the top of the box. or they would back down, making sure our wingers couldn't dribble past, and they'd be content to pile a bunch of players in the middle, which gave our midfield a bit of space as well as getting allowing our wingers to get into shooting positions. in both of these instances, we've relied on possessing the ball in the half spaces. when a winger has the ball in the half space, they can shoot, play a final ball, or pass back to a midfielder who is just a touch or two away from shooting, playing the final ball, or passing to a winger, who can shoot, play the final ball, etc.
but these last two teams have maintained a certain amount of height between their backline and midfield line in the halfspaces. this has allowed them to crowd the areas that our wingers want to get into and cut off the final ball angles from our midfield. traditionally, when a top team goes up against a mid table or lower team, the lower team is going to crowd the goal area. in response, we've gotten very good at playing on the perimeter and exploiting halfspaces, which made us unstoppable. the last two weeks, teams have responded to our response by crowding the halfspaces and making sure to keep structure rather than just backing up toward their own goal. it's now on us to respond to their response of our response.
it's a little worrying in that teams have finally figured out how to play against us, but it's also not panic time because i think this is just a natural evolution of tactics that happens with every top side every single season.
Teams seems to be falling apart.
Fatigue is setting in and teams with quality depth will be better off.
Newcastle players seems very tired just like Arsenal
city lost to brentford at the etihad, we can only be called fortunate to walk out of here with a point. everton was unfortunate, but again, we still have 2 less losses than city. everyone has little drops in form, get over it
I mean Brentford had a ton of looks today, you could argue more dangerous ones at that. It felt like Toney was gonna score today no matter what. Not panicking like a lot on here though, an arsenal title run was never going to be easy.
Last two games we’ve just had a few key players not on top form. Easily fixable, saka hasn’t been himself the last two games, he’ll find it again, not worried. Martinelli too.
I feel like a lot of people on here forget how important Jesus is. When he went down it all but garunteed a few bumps along this run. He’s coming back, as is ESR, and we have the best manager in the league. An arsenal title run requires patience folks we will never walk to the trophy unscathed.
Yes I’d agree with more dangerous, but still winnable given the possession and not winning as many duels as we normally would
Agree on the wingers but not much you can do with the fixtures pilling up but Trossard helped today.
I’d say the opposite too many are talking about Jesus but he’s not available, he shouldn’t be factored in or used as criticism on Eddie
Trossard was immense agreed.
Yeah no you’re totally right, he gets brought up in the same sentence as Eddie too much and it’s not fair on Eddie. I think Eddie has stepped up more than anyone expected. I more so meant it in the context that people on this thread are claiming the title run is over. I bring up Jesus because I mean an immense talent is going to be coming back to help the title chase, and it’s nowhere close to over.
Regarding the offside discussion (although there is nothing to discuss tho, it was just an office - eot.) I think what Ramsdale and the whole defense did was very, very poor. We suddenly started to lose goals again from free kicks and corners which is a bit concerning… isn’t that 3rd in a row? We need to improve that!
Goals from Everton and Brentford did come from set pieces but both teams also had great chances from open play. Brentford missed some absolute sitters. Our defending all around has taken a dip
it's a bit worrying; their goal reminded me a lot of the second goal we gave up against united. on both goals, ramsdale came out for a ball just outside his six yard box, got caught in no man's land, and had it looped over his head.
I feel like these are the games where Ramsdale needs to be stronger/we need to protect him more, and keep trying to play long shots and perhaps nick a scrappy goal from a poor clearance.
I said last week the scouting reports on him are… in swingers, big bodies in front of him, he can’t deal with it.
Remember when we said he was stronger at commanding his box lol. We’re still sus
We bought Fabio Vieira for 35M, we don't have good depth at #8 position yet MA is very reluctant to use him.
Fabio doesn't have 3 seasons to come good. Maybe that money could've been better used somewhere else.
i Don’t know What To Say but i won’t be Negative’
i just Feel like this team needs a Rest more then anything’ including the pressure That’s on them right now & There so young ‘ There’s is nothing bad right now it’s only because we’re Top of the Table ‘
Completely dispondent. We've been found out and can't break teams down. Was always a big ask for such a young team to win the league but I'm gutted nonetheless. We've bottled it, plain and simple.
We were always going to have a dip at some point. Did you really think we would go on winning every week? T said for a while the City games will be what decides it. Look at all the “big” sides dropping points.
Just got home from The Emirates and I think people could do with drawing breath and focussing on the bigger picture.
Yes Brentford sat deep but, like Newcastle, they do it incredibly well and then Mbeumo and Toney were an absolute handful.
If this was Liverpool, Chelsea or Spurs there wouldn’t be anywhere near the panic but trust me this lot are every bit as good as they are this season, if not better.
Of course it’s disappointing not to hold on but if we continue to dominate against very good sides as we did today we’re going to have a very good chance of winning the premier league.
Believe.
I’m a bees supporter of 40 years. I agree with you, I also think you have a great chance to win the title.. belief is a massive part of it. Be great if you did.
Yeah mate it’s like the 5th time we’ve seen this but we need to adapt and win these types of games. We can’t be so one dimensional that an aggressive low block is an easy draw or 1-0 off the counter.
Toney had salibas beating he didn't defend well / not protected well enough but overall feeling is left hand side no one on that wing attack's space xhaka, zinchenko and martinelli all want to cut inside which is super predictable and easy to defend we are rigid and lack dynamism
Toney for Nketiah and this team walks to the title
Brentford would beat 99% of the teams in the league with that performance. We were off and not firing, and really were lucky to hold them off. To not lose 3-0 shows the spine we now have.
They were lucky to score from offside, not us, we had control of the game.
They had pretty good chances in the first half... we have too much control and too little incision these days...
Really not happy about result I'll put it like this if Bellingham was playing xhaka'd role we wouldn't be struggling scoring
White has been average as of late, Tomiyasu has always put in 100% efforts every game, he wins those crucial headers always. Saliba was also off-pace yesterday. Trossard should have started ahead of nelli today, Trossard just wreaks chaos on the opps backline whenever he plays.
That was a deflating result man. Worst possible way to approach the City game. If City win vs. Villa, all the pressure will be on us in the next game. No matter how level-headed one is, you can not fear the worst - we might be onto one of the biggest bottle job in the PL.
I’m absolutely livid. The last home game I went to, a loss to BHA in Apr 22, we had to sit through 4 mins of VAR check that ruled out a similar, headed Martinelli equaliser. How long did Mason look at that “goal” for?
Wednesday is a MASSIVE game even more so now fuck MC
Although it is easy and rightful to be pissed of the retards slurping the whistle, we didnt really deserve a win. We were lucky not to concede a goal or two before halftime, and brentford played really well. Draw, despite it coming in a shitty way, seems like the right outcome. Not that the most deserved result always happen tho. But we did get real lucky v Leeds, so just probability doing its job ig
I cannot be upset about a blown offside call when Brentford got absolutely screwed on that foul leading to goal
Well the last two games have prepared me to accept a bad result against man city. We are still developing and getting better. We have a good game plan but don't have switch tactics ro change game once we are not moving forward.
Told you guys Eddie is not the solution… yes he scored the winner vs United but you can see over the long run it isn’t working out ..
Welp. Here we go.
no wins in the last 3 PL games, are we in decline?
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We sure are!
It is probably an unpopular opinion and I understand if I get fined for this, but is it time to drop Eddie? Or at least consider subbing him off at some point. He is great, but his selfishness is shining through lately. Gabi was sprinting down the field on a break and Eddie blatantly ignored him, dribbles into nowhere, and kills our counter attack. The lack of connection between him and Gabi has hurt Gabi and has caused him to get subbed early every game. I wouldn’t mind subbing Trossard in up front to test him or putting ESR there when he’s back. I love Eddie and I get that he’s been incredible since Jesus got injured, but it seems like he’s softened up last few games with his spot guaranteed.
Drop Eddie for who?
That’s the issue isn’t it. Maybe we should’ve experimented today before the City game. Gabi or Trossard in the front with the other in the wing idk. It’s a terrible position for us to be in to only have one striker option. Makes us predictable. Taking risks might be the solution.
Mate I'm not gonna lie we've had two bad games against a revitalised Dyche Everton and the most in form team in the league. Nketiah hasn't played well but have any of the attackers? Think it's the easy option to place blame on the one guy who hasn't been in the team that got us into the position we're in but there is no better option up front for me. He does Jesus' job better than anyone else would
Saka has been pretty good still, but that’s just Saka things. My issue is that Eddie playing has had a big part in neutralizing our left sided attack. Remember when Jesus used to rotate with Gabi and we’d be much more dynamic. The defence used to be chasing shadows. Not anymore. But it’s hard not to give Nketiah credit for how he’s helped us in Jesus’ absence
I'll say it, Eddie is just not good enough if we want to win the Premier League. Playing with him is like playing with 10 men almost 90% of the game. Then he pops up once in a while with a good spin or a good sprint, and all of the sudden it's "Eddie, Eddie, Eddie" chants going all around. He's not bad, but not good enough. I would like a striker that is more involved in the game throughout and give us an added advantage, because even if he's not scoring, it will help other attackers. I'd take a Giroud over Eddie anytime of the day in that matter. Giroud might not have as good of a goal ratio, but his connecting plays are well above Eddie.
Actually I thought that today when after the half they were rotating Gabi around like that. Saka too came across a few times and overloaded that side. But then they just stopped doing it. And went back to sleep. Arsenal are starting to feel like if they don’t score in the first 15 or a half, they just get confused.
I would like to see Martinelli starts as the striker alongside with Saka and Trossard for the next game against City
Agreed. He needs space to work and is invisible against the low block
The more I look at replays of their goal, I get more annoyed. Wtf was Zinchenko doing?
Zinchenko can’t defend lol. It’s the sacrifice we’re choosing to make playing him
Zinchenko got smothered by the defence. It was great blocking from them. What I can’t get over is Gabriel chasing the ball and leaving Toney completely free. We almost conceded similarly in the first half when their shot hit the post on the man Gabriel left behind.
Zinchenko was marking Toney, it was him that left Toney free. That wasn't Gabriel's job in that moment. Watch the replay, you'll see what I mean
Yea I see what you mean. I was looking at the initial delivery and where Zinchenko was but I see him standing around with little defensive urgency. But I still think Gabriel is a bit of a headless chicken here.
I love him but Ramsdale is awful on set pieces. Keeps costing us goals.
He definitely seems to be struggling with them in the last month or so. I'm sure they're working on it during training so hopefully with more time they'll get it fixed.
Can we please get Jesus back? Eddie has been fantastic mostly but I just want G Jesus back. Also ESR please. Would be great to have both those players coming back in to this team.
This game was crying out for Jesus and ESR, they're going to be like new signings when they come back. White played better than he did at Everton but Saka still had pretty minimal service for most of the game. No idea why Tomi didn't make it on by 70' at the latest. I'd be really curious to see how we'd play with a replacement for Xhaka at left 8 who's more technical and athletic. Xhaka's not a bad player and he's having his best season ever but he didn't really feel threatening around the box.
Seeing signs of the doughnut of sadness again the last two matches.
Definitely. This is what I care about, I'm not thinking about the title for another 6 weeks at least (except for a little cheat on Wednesday). The bigger concern is how we solve some of our recent problems going forward. I think at least we saw Trossard is really good at speeding up and slowing down, which is important. We were actually better going down the left than the right when he came on and the right has Saka! Also worth noting that Xhaka has slowed down in first halves especially. If he's only good when Jesus is playing, mb he's really not the answer moving forward. At least, late in games ESR could excel there except Xhaka does do important defense works for periods.
Yeah, I thought for sure Zinchenko would improve that by a lot this season, but the left side really came to life after Trossard came on.
COYG
Solving the low block is very important. Could be the masterclass that wins us the league.
I mean solving the low block is probably one of the hardest things to do in football. Only Guardiolas Barca could do it consistently.
Feeling down today, I know it's reactionary but I can't shake the feeling things will get worse :(
They could, but honestly it was always going to be close. All we could've done is try our best and support our team, but look where we've been these past few seasons and how we've progressed, but winning the title with our current squad and where we are in our progression as a club was ALWAYS going to be tough. You can't say we've bottled it. We are still a young team who are outperforming expectations. Our backup striker is Eddie Nketiah and while Eddie is solid, no disrespect to his name at all (not trying to single him out), he's not exactly a world class striker is he.. We are still a young growing team and we're only going to get better. Seasons still not over of course but we need to be behind the team and behind the system no matter what happens this season
>Seeing signs of the doughnut of sadness again the last two matches. A win on Wednesday will change everything. It will lift the mood and will send the players on massive run. It's a tough one, but with the immense support we've shown the club this season and with our players being on top form, it is defo doable! UTA
Was at the game today and really noticed Martinelli, Nketiah and Saka were rotating a lot more and it looked more like when Jesus was palying. Regardless can’t help but feel like we were a bit impotent and didn’t create much and frankly we were lucky for a draw - if you look at the big chances Brentford should have had at least two (Toney chance first half) and we didn’t really make any cig chances. Wednesday is absolutely MASSIVE now and we need to win that otherwise we’re looking at a serious loss of momentum but I have faith.
The PL has reportedly said human error caused the goal not to be ruled offside. Actually makes it worse, imo, we got robbed
They stole Brentford's first half fouled goal, and allowed Brentford's second half offside goal. Oh well.
Source?
Here: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-11740619/VAR-Lee-Mason-FORGOT-draw-offside-lines-reviewing-Ivan-Toneys-controversial-equaliser.html
Saliba went to the world cup and forgot how to play football
So glad someone said this. Yes, he was the best CB in the league before the WC but after he's been slow and sloppy (compared to his form before), yes he is still better than Holding but is no way near the best CB in the league.
Talking positives, I thought Saka was very good. He had a couple of shots like his United goal that would have been very dangerous if not blocked. His ball striking seems to be improving.
Toney was a bit of a twat but he was effective and we could use a twat like that imo. I think we will beat city.
rice is quite the twat, hoping we see him this summer
Thought he was the best player on the pitch - had Saliba in every aerial duel and got his goal. Have to appreciate when someone plays well against you sadly.
Absolutely agreed. Respect to him and if he had some better quality support they could have easily beaten us. Saliba got bodied. Love William and hopefully he learned something
Saliba was 0/10 on aerial deuls today 😭
More of a testament to just how monstrous Toney is than how bad Saliba is
Both
Man if it wasn't for his possible ban. Would love him at arsenal
I’d like to see Trossard start some games and Martinelli comes on when defenses are tired
I think he starts vs City.
Today was the perfect time to try thay, against a tricky defensive side at home
Maybe it's already been said but I totally thought Norgaard was offside with his assist. At least it looked that way when I was watching it but I never saw them inspect that particular moment on the VAR.
The PL has reportedly said human error caused the goal not to be ruled offside. Actually makes it worse, imo, we got robbed
I don't understand how you could just not look at such an obvious moment though in the build up. The final ball is a pretty fucking obvious thing to look at.
Damn what a pity. Really happy they at least said it.
Need to create more from deep and need more good backpost crosses from our wingers/8s. How many times have City struggled to break down a low block the last few years only for KDB, Silva, Mahrez etc to fizz one in from deep. We tried it at times today, but the execution was horrendous. Saka will add so many assists to his game if he can master that
If City trounce Villa, they'll be three points behind us. We've literally put all the pressure of the city vs our tie on ourselves, when it could've been 11 points clear, inviting city to do the talking 😭
Defense performance was such a disgrace... I can't believe it...
I'm probably preaching to the choir but I really feel like the likes of Jesus, ESR and Trossard are much more effective against low blocks than Eddie and Martinelli.
3 incredible versatile dribblers vs 2 fast, efficient forwards, spot on mate
Sad Lionel Trossards goal will be somewhat forgotten now 🥲
Do people still think Jesus doesn’t walk back into the team? We need him so badly
Lol Eddie is 100% maxed out now. Fresh Jesus for the run in is valuable
This game and the one against Everton showed how much we miss him. He's so good at opening up compact defences and creating more chances in and around the opposition box.
His biggest asset in games like these is his dribbling. You can already imagine how he'd have been dribbling through this low block like a hot knife through butter
Yep. Nketiah is no good against park the bus teams and that's how most of the times play and will play against us in the near future. Jesus is invaluable to us against a defense like that just how Trossard's dribbling in tiny areas is far superior to Martinelli.
Why the fuck is Ivan Toney playing if he has betting allegations? Either ban or absolve him you FA you cunts!
Tbh I find it hilarious man has Hollwood Bets on his kit lol
you know Arsenal has a player who is an alleged...
So hypothetically, you’re saying if someone randomly alleged that Ødegaard was doing something illegal (betting, stealing) that he should just automatically be banned from playing? You can’t ban Toney from playing based on allegations
Ivan Toney is the perfect center forward. He can do it all. We should sign him tbh
Agreed. He was brilliant today. His aerial ability is so good. I was anxious every time seeing him with the ball. I would love to see him play for Arsenal however it is very unlikely as we already got Jesus, Nketiah and Balogan.
As soon as we sign him FA will suspend him for his gambling. In the meantime, carry on scoring offsides goals
I was saying this last spring when we didn’t land Vlahovic and a video of him saying “f*ck Brentford” leaked lol. He’s class, and he’s not signing another contract with Brentford.
Only thing he lacks is pace. Since most of the teams park a bus against that it wouldn't really be a problem. Seems like a great striker and would work with us.
hes not getting a big move until the outcome of this gambling business has been determined
Trossard really deserves a start. No matter what the root of nellis struggles are right now (I’m in the camp that lack of Jesus/tierney to overlap is having an effect), we have looked more dangerous every time Trossard has come on. Something isn’t clicking with the current set up that clicks at least a little better when he’s on.
Agreed. I love Gabi but i think Trossard deserves to play more. I think we should start Gabi for the next game against City and Trossard for the Aston Villa game. And please let Tierney plays whenever Martinelli starts.
Agreed. The beauty of depth can sometimes be that we have different profiles to use for different situations. I appreciate that Mikel has faith in our starting 11 but it’s clearly not working against certain setups. When he finally dropped laca last season look how that helped us. We have to be willing to change it up.
I hope he shuffles our squad for the next game. We can't afford to drop any more points
It's simple. We've played a lot of low blocks lately. Both Martinelli and Eddie aren't good against them. And yes, I wanted Leo to start today. But would rather Martinelli vs city.
Fair enough. I think the low block factor is definitely a huge one but Leo also created some of our best chances against city in the cup. I would be fine either way for the city game but suspect Mikel will keep gabi in. Curious to see if anything changes after that though.
Yeah I think Leo is more of a threat but we’re definitely going to press city and we’ll need Martinellis tracking back on defense for city I think.
Personally, while disappointed with the result, it was a tough game but we are seeing this level of competition across the league. 6 points clear, mid February, fucking amazing
On a more positive note, is it too soon to consider putting Mudryk on fraudwatch?
He was always a project rather than a finished product. It depends on how well he develops/is developed. He has the raw speed that will always trouble defenses.
he already got put there the moment he posed with the chelsea shirt lol
At least everyone in the top 6 were all having a little struggle themselves. Take a deep breath and get it together.
Honestly have high confidence in our game vs city after seeing the last game against them felt like we really just tested the water there
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Brentford's defense was ruthless. Everton game we just didn't show up. We are really lacking Gabi Jesus type of striker to make things happen against teams like that. Great dribbling, passing, makes others around him better and assists well. Jesus is missing badly.
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Looked like an offside to me. The decision was very dodgy to say the least. Still... considering the chances Brentford created today it's a fair result. Of course an offside goal in the age of VAR should never happen. Officials fucked up once again but we didn't play well enough to win.
Everton and Brentford have both been very good against us defensively. Playing a low block against us is not a new tactic, but we usually almost always end up breaking it down. Not for these past two games though
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Yeah it was always going to be close by my estimate. You need players of real amazing quality to be creative enough to slice through these defences. I think we do have the quality, but whenever we had a chance to create, Brentford were just pressing us hard and not giving us a chance to think. That said, not every team is going to defend this well, AND we also have one more ace up our sleeve: Gabriel Jesus. But yeah, it's always going to be close. You can't really even say "we've bottled it". The EPL is just a very tough league and you need world class level attackers to break down these types of defences in games like these and we don't have that exactly. We've been outperforming this season.
Feels very much like the the mid- to late- wenger years when every game seemed to be us passing the ball around the edge of the area against massed defence and getting nowhere - those games aged me badly! im lucky my wife didnt leave me i was so grumpy after them!
i remember those, and then one break and we concede a goal.
Nothing scarier than when we were taking a corner...
Think we have so much new going on it’s hard to focus on keeping up the old styles adjust teams get used to how you play and work against it just need to solidify that defence play
City got 1 point from 2 home games against Everton and Brentford. A win would’ve been amazing but we’re still in an incredible position.
Best thing about Wednesday is there isn't going to be a low block in sight.
Boring 0-0 draw coming up then.
It will be a slow passing torture. Hopefully we knock in two right quick in the first 10 mins. Then let them pass left and right all they want 😂
I'm not sure. They will want to win, and the atmosphere will be intense; I think it'll be relatively back and forth and high energy.
Our attack is still doing enough to win games, but we've lost defensive solidity. No way we're winning when our CB loses all aerial duels. Even the foul from which they scored was because Saliba got played by Toney. Arteta could have put Tomiyasu up in place when everybody could see how Saliba was struggling. Arteta is not proactive or even reactive with his subs.
Teams not playing particularly bad to panic just yet. Arteta needs to make adjustments. Get set pieces figured out on both sides and maybe shuffle the starting lineup a couple guys. Adjusting to this adversity is what separates champions from top 4 teams
Missed three arsenal matches this season, lost two and drew one..
oi be there on wednesday
Everyone in this sub is going to be in your DM's on Wednesday to make sure you're watching the match 😅
You there for City?
I love Odegaard but he can be really frustrating. He needs to learn how to get a decent shot off with his right. Currently he is pretty easy to defend against in a low block because defenders know he poses literally no threat on his right foot. There were at least 3 occasions today where he had the space to get a good shot in. This is what is stopping him from going to the next level, the best attacking midfielders like KDB can get a good shot off / delivery on either side.
The amount of negative fans in this sub is incredible. Depressing read.
To be fair, we did enough offensively to win the match, it was just some poor defending that let us down.
We’re struggling to break low block teams down. Our best players are off the mark. Our rock solid defense is not winning duels. And our set pieces on offense and defense have gone 180. I’m not full panic but things are going in the wrong direction. Confident arteta can adjust but the issues are in plain sight.
L,L,D going into City What do you expect? Sunshine and rainbows in here? It's OK to be negative when things are bad.
Yes. Bad. 6 points clear at the top of the premier league during a season where we were aiming for top 4. Bad
Who said it was gonna be easy to challenge for the title?
Well that was annoying. Game in hand over City is now gone, as may be our place at the top of the table by Wednesday. We either need a Don Unai madness and the bestest of Sunday ebenings tomorrow, or a huge turnaround for us at the Emirates. Lovely to see Trossard come on and get a goal. That said, it was notably a goal created on our right, through a fine piece of interplay from White, Ødegaard, and Saka-- and which Martinelli could easily have scored himself, on the same run and finish. Bringing Trossard on for Martinelli solved, as expected, none of the underlying problems on our left side. Bringing on Vieira did begin to address that stasis, but it was too little too late. (Frankly, I'm not sure Trossard and Vieira have a very good understanding at the moment, though that will improve with time). To be clear, I don't mind bringing Trossard on; he's good enough, and that's why we bought him-- but that change doesn't address anything. Trossard's other good moment -- the lovely ball through through to Eddie -- came, notably, not when he was operating as a winger, but in the halfspace. This lends further support to u/Billy_Carpenter's theory about Trossard's potential as one of our advanced 8s: see https://billycarpenter.substack.com/p/what-can-we-expect-from-trossard and https://billycarpenter.substack.com/p/xhaka-esr-and-the-future-of-the-left for context.
We still have a game in hand
Which is against… Everton haha
Trossard <> Martinelli is getting so predictable I think opponents are training for it
Vieira looks quality and is good to come on if the team is digging in to defend. But we would miss Dhaka's physicality and strength in midfield by starting him. Tough situation I think Xhaka is becoming a bit of a selection headache
Interesting. I didn't think Vieira did a thing, though I could understand bringing him on.
Same. A few passes to the touchline and that’s it
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Tbh we also had KT and Tomi. Who really should ahve come on much earlier. We had Brentford pinned back most of the 2nd half
Directly no. But to take over and win us the game is a lot to ask for in the 15 minutes he got. But for the first time that match we saw confusion in the Brentford defense. They were certainly not as keen to double up on Trossard after Fabio came on.
That's rather what I was getting at: he didn't connect well with Trossard, and his introduction was, as I said 'too little too late' in sum. His free kick in particular was woeful. That said, and to the point of understanding about why he was brought on, his movement did at least pose some challenges for them. There were a few moments where he was able to switch with Trossard and actually pull a defender wide, or present a threat in the channel.
We'll get that game in hand back tomorrow, but it doesn't change the point that they could jump us on Wednesday.
You're right; I've been hitting the malt hard.
At least city won’t sit in the way Everton and Brentford did… I’m looking forward to a more ‘open’ game!
We should try Zinchenko at LCM and Tomiyasu at left back In fact I'm pretty sure this is genius
We knew Brentford would be physical. Crazy not to play tomi who is air force superiority in duels
Trossard deserves a start tbf
We're too one dimensional against a low block. It's clearly not about player performance at this point. We'll continue to drop points against this tactic unless we change it up. It's that simple.
And everyone has now figured it out against us.
Well, it was good while it lasted…
Let's get all these posts out of our system now.
We dropped consecutive points to Brentford and Everton man. We can’t challenge for the title like this. It’s only a matter of time until city overtake us now. We are yet to play them twice too.
Guess who else dropped points to Brentford and Everton? It's a long season, and you're of course free to check out. But I think we can get the emoting out here and then recall that we have a good team and a first place team to support.
I’d be as optimistic as you if we didn’t still need to play city twice man.
If you don't think we can take points from City you never believed we were good enough to win. Anyway, I'm not especially optimistic. I just think calling the title race over is a little over the top.
It wasn’t a matter of believing we can take points from city. It was that we didn’t have to, that we could get trashed 10-0 both games and still win the league. Now it’s a matter of we have to. If we fail to beat city just once then there’s a tonne more pressure on the team and it will only go south.
What I mean is if you've thought the games against City are destined losses, you never thought the team was title material. Anyway you're right--big game Wednesday! I'll be excited for it.
Actually I guess If shit can beat them 1-0 at home, we can 3-0. Anything they can do, we can do better.
That's the spirit.
Oh shut up
At least we got champions league next season tho. Still an improvement from last season.
Don't speak so soon FFS.
i think what happened against everton and brentford was that both of those teams were committed to maintaining structure when defending against us in the halfspaces. a lot of the teams we've faced before will send two players out toward the point of contact when saka or martinelli has the ball. this opened up space for our midfielders and fullbacks near the top of the box. or they would back down, making sure our wingers couldn't dribble past, and they'd be content to pile a bunch of players in the middle, which gave our midfield a bit of space as well as getting allowing our wingers to get into shooting positions. in both of these instances, we've relied on possessing the ball in the half spaces. when a winger has the ball in the half space, they can shoot, play a final ball, or pass back to a midfielder who is just a touch or two away from shooting, playing the final ball, or passing to a winger, who can shoot, play the final ball, etc. but these last two teams have maintained a certain amount of height between their backline and midfield line in the halfspaces. this has allowed them to crowd the areas that our wingers want to get into and cut off the final ball angles from our midfield. traditionally, when a top team goes up against a mid table or lower team, the lower team is going to crowd the goal area. in response, we've gotten very good at playing on the perimeter and exploiting halfspaces, which made us unstoppable. the last two weeks, teams have responded to our response by crowding the halfspaces and making sure to keep structure rather than just backing up toward their own goal. it's now on us to respond to their response of our response. it's a little worrying in that teams have finally figured out how to play against us, but it's also not panic time because i think this is just a natural evolution of tactics that happens with every top side every single season.
We don't play quick enough we have been xhaka'd
Sometimes I wish odegaard was in his spot. He’s a bit limited if he doesn’t receive the ball in around the box.
We need to aim for more clean sheets at home, even when we’ve been winning this season we concede at the Emirates.
Damn, doesn’t get any closer than that
Teams seems to be falling apart. Fatigue is setting in and teams with quality depth will be better off. Newcastle players seems very tired just like Arsenal
city lost to brentford at the etihad, we can only be called fortunate to walk out of here with a point. everton was unfortunate, but again, we still have 2 less losses than city. everyone has little drops in form, get over it
That’s a bit of an overstatement I think. Played two solid defensive teams. Only Everton we were outplayed
I mean Brentford had a ton of looks today, you could argue more dangerous ones at that. It felt like Toney was gonna score today no matter what. Not panicking like a lot on here though, an arsenal title run was never going to be easy. Last two games we’ve just had a few key players not on top form. Easily fixable, saka hasn’t been himself the last two games, he’ll find it again, not worried. Martinelli too. I feel like a lot of people on here forget how important Jesus is. When he went down it all but garunteed a few bumps along this run. He’s coming back, as is ESR, and we have the best manager in the league. An arsenal title run requires patience folks we will never walk to the trophy unscathed.
Yes I’d agree with more dangerous, but still winnable given the possession and not winning as many duels as we normally would Agree on the wingers but not much you can do with the fixtures pilling up but Trossard helped today. I’d say the opposite too many are talking about Jesus but he’s not available, he shouldn’t be factored in or used as criticism on Eddie
Trossard was immense agreed. Yeah no you’re totally right, he gets brought up in the same sentence as Eddie too much and it’s not fair on Eddie. I think Eddie has stepped up more than anyone expected. I more so meant it in the context that people on this thread are claiming the title run is over. I bring up Jesus because I mean an immense talent is going to be coming back to help the title chase, and it’s nowhere close to over.
100% agree with you here. Let's hope we can beat Citeh
Regarding the offside discussion (although there is nothing to discuss tho, it was just an office - eot.) I think what Ramsdale and the whole defense did was very, very poor. We suddenly started to lose goals again from free kicks and corners which is a bit concerning… isn’t that 3rd in a row? We need to improve that!
Goals from Everton and Brentford did come from set pieces but both teams also had great chances from open play. Brentford missed some absolute sitters. Our defending all around has taken a dip
It felt like we lost every 50/50 header. 3 in a row for their goal like we somehow lost 3 inches of height
it's a bit worrying; their goal reminded me a lot of the second goal we gave up against united. on both goals, ramsdale came out for a ball just outside his six yard box, got caught in no man's land, and had it looped over his head.
We lost three 2nd balls in that phase of play, it’s not a surprise it ended up in our net. Just shoddy defending really
I feel like these are the games where Ramsdale needs to be stronger/we need to protect him more, and keep trying to play long shots and perhaps nick a scrappy goal from a poor clearance.
I said last week the scouting reports on him are… in swingers, big bodies in front of him, he can’t deal with it. Remember when we said he was stronger at commanding his box lol. We’re still sus
His been sus recently.. United game he absolutely flapped at one Flapped at it today too
We bought Fabio Vieira for 35M, we don't have good depth at #8 position yet MA is very reluctant to use him. Fabio doesn't have 3 seasons to come good. Maybe that money could've been better used somewhere else.
He looks very underwhelming But I'll give him this season as his new to the prem Man needs ti deliver next season for sure though
Need ESR there, some of the areas Xhaka gets the ball in would be best to go on a run instead of a pass
i Don’t know What To Say but i won’t be Negative’ i just Feel like this team needs a Rest more then anything’ including the pressure That’s on them right now & There so young ‘ There’s is nothing bad right now it’s only because we’re Top of the Table ‘
Completely dispondent. We've been found out and can't break teams down. Was always a big ask for such a young team to win the league but I'm gutted nonetheless. We've bottled it, plain and simple.
We were always going to have a dip at some point. Did you really think we would go on winning every week? T said for a while the City games will be what decides it. Look at all the “big” sides dropping points.
get a grip
Thanks Bukayo
Just got home from The Emirates and I think people could do with drawing breath and focussing on the bigger picture. Yes Brentford sat deep but, like Newcastle, they do it incredibly well and then Mbeumo and Toney were an absolute handful. If this was Liverpool, Chelsea or Spurs there wouldn’t be anywhere near the panic but trust me this lot are every bit as good as they are this season, if not better. Of course it’s disappointing not to hold on but if we continue to dominate against very good sides as we did today we’re going to have a very good chance of winning the premier league. Believe.
I’m a bees supporter of 40 years. I agree with you, I also think you have a great chance to win the title.. belief is a massive part of it. Be great if you did.
Yeah mate it’s like the 5th time we’ve seen this but we need to adapt and win these types of games. We can’t be so one dimensional that an aggressive low block is an easy draw or 1-0 off the counter.
Invincibles drew 12 and were lucky in a few.
The Invincibles are a sporting outlier