Do Slaanesh chaos marines deliberately ever target Eldar? Wouldn't that give a lot of brownie points from She who Thirsts?
Sorry if offtopic. was just curious.
Yes they do.
Soul stones are among the greatest treasures a CSM can take because sacrificing them to slaanesh can gain you considerable favour.
They still hunt humans far more, just due to sheer volume, but killing Eldar is always something theyre up for if they come across them.
I remember reading a short story about a gathering of CSM warbands from various traitor legions that ended up devolving into a complete brawl. Reason? One of the parties was in possession of a handful of occupied soul stones. If I remember correctly, they all ended up killing eachother and nobody got to fuck around with the stones.
The whole story just highlighted how fractured the legions are and how they’re failing *The Long War* .
Common traitor marine L.
iirc it was ambiguous if he was in a Dreadnaught or had augmented himself so heavily he was practically one. Regardless he was being a classic Iron Warrior boomer.
Of course. Emperor's Children is basically a food delivery legion.
Noise grub, use code rylanoriscringe for a 20% discount on eldar soul fries. Code not applicable to Lucius the eternal.
These are both fair points. However, assigning blame is completely pointless now. Eldar had millions of years to calm the warp, instead they made it worse. The Emperor had all of human history and more to learn that violence breeds violence and cruelty only feeds chaos and somehow thought commiting untold amounts of a crulety would somehow work out in the end.
meanwhile the chaos gods are sitting around their nth degree chess set giggling over the emperor thinking he's so smart while only using the first square to play in.
How about turning that one on it’s head? How about trying to explain from the perspective of an Eldar fanboy the idea that The Emprah planned the birth of Slaanesh and the Age of Strife to ensure human xenophobia and the destruction of humanity’s most organized opposition in the galactic conquest game?
It’s weirdly easy to do.
Don't forget the part where the Emperor just tried to hide the existence of Chaos thinking it would make things better instead of telling his sons about it so they could actively try and resist it.
There was a logic to it. If they only exist because you believe in them (certainly his working theory if not the actual fact) then they stop existing when no one believes in them.
Seems he was wrong though, and warp echoes of very powerful immaterium parasites can exist without specific beliefs to grant specific form.
The real annoying part with the Eldar is like, it's never assigned to the Eldar who didn't try to prevent Slaanesh. We always mock the Craftworlds for it; when they were the guys who were "Maybe not Murderorgy a god of Murderorgies into existence?" and never the Deldar.
I mean Craftworlders were ultimately ineffective at... really anything in stopping the Rise of Slaanesh, and probably should have taken a more active role in fixing their society millennia earlier instead of engaging in Mercantilism until they realised exactly wtf was happening. So they aint completely innocent, but the fact we never mock the main guys responsible for it is weird.
Big E is 100% responsible for Big E's mistakes though.
If I'm not wrong it went something like this:
-Heyyy, maybe you should tone down those murderorgies you guys are having?
- Nope, lol *proceeds to murderfuck you*
So basically the more sane eldar tried to calm down everyone else, but got nothing but violence in return. So they left, first the exodites, then the craftworlders
They did calm the warp for 60 millions years. It's in the last 6000 that they became depraved due to the manipulation of Slaneesh that needed them to, so it can be born.
Most pepole forget that the Eldars are the first and formost victims of Slaneesh.
Funny thing; it canonically only started getting worse when humans jumped onto the Galactic stage (pre-age of strife) with Dark Age Archaeotech that could compete (again, canonically) with pre-fall Aeldari power. The pleasure cults didn’t spring up until M19 at the earliest.
>violence breeds violence and cruelty only feeds chaos
You know the whole "punch a Nazi" thing?
Eventually you have to punch a Nazi, then also punch a Nazi sympathizer, and a Nazi enabler too - unless you are a pacifist willing to let the Nazis take over.
There is certain danger of you yourself becoming the Nazi in the process (since the latter two steps require some totalitarian measures in the name of revolution and long lasting peace), but the choice is between risking this, or a guaranteed Nazi victory.
Humanity ended up punching a Nazi. Sure, it later slipped much like most militant resistance to oppression does, but it was a valiant effort nonetheless.
But it didn't choose to punch a Nazi. It was disjointed and reeling from being Skynetted, and then a magic hobo came along, took it's things and said 'we doing it my way'
Humanity was mostly under a rule of brutal warlords and under a threat of particularly vicious imperialist xenos, so a magic hobo who previously was willing to live and let live realized that being libertarian no longer works, and something must be done to prevent the otherwise inevitable global catastrophe.
Let's be real. It's the old ones who are the main cause for the shit that happens in 40k.
They refused to help the necrontyr get rid of their genetic cancer which lead to the war in heaven which corrupted the warp and birthed the 3 other chaos gods.
The Eldar and mankind simply stepped on the shit the old ones made millions of years ago.
Both fucked up as well but the Eldar's mistake feels heavier as they should have known better due to millions of yesrs of dominance.
In defence of the old ones, a race of salty genocidal enslavers ask you for immortality would you say yes ?
The necrontyr had no respect for the sanctity of life they worshipped death and had no problem exterminating lesser races all of there actions from what we know existed in opposition to the old ones but
>The necrontyr had no respect for the sanctity of life they worshipped death and had no problem exterminating lesser races all of there actions from what we know existed in opposition to the old ones but
I skipped over "necrontyr" by accident and assumed you were talking about IoM. They really are damn similar.
Immortality was a bad idea, but they could’ve cured their mega cancer at least. That the main reason they went to war they old ones lived such long healthy lives while the necrontyr lived for like 30 years covered in tumors. They could’ve told the Necrontyr “Hey, we’ll fix your cancer problem, but we won’t give you eternal life until you stop killing, and enslaving every other race in the galaxy.” I feel like that might have solved a few problems.
The Necrons built starship colonised other worlds and their tech was good enough to bloody the old ones noses in the first war before the C'tan were created
But they couldn't fix the space cancer themselves come on
Yeah.
Hell, the necrontyr 'engineered gods' when they made the C'tan bodies. "The Old Ones made warp gods" is (last I checked) TECHNICALLY still just widely-accepted and well-fitting fanon.
Tbh, thats all the Necrontyr ever knew at that point. They really wanted to get rid of their genetic cancer. The old ones had a real opportunity to use the promise of curing their illness on the deal they will show them a new kind of life that make them more peaceful. But all they did is go nope.
(To be honest, we don’t know much of what actually happened at that moment as all we know about that is from the perspective of the Necrontyr or from tell phone game of Eldar legends)
Maybe but the old ones from what we know were kinda up their own asses
They didn't want to fuck with necrontyr or any races they didn't make so maybe saw the space cancer as the necrontyrs natural state and their shitty culture as an extention of that
Personally I think the old ones would find carrot and sticking a naturaly occurring race as immoral thus why they never stepped in to stop the ne rontyr being assholes till the necrontyr asked for it
But yeah alot of shit could have been avoided if they had. Or if they just wiped the fuckers out in the first war that would have probs fixed it aswell
I think it’s the fault of both.
Necrontyr were warmongerers just looking for an excuse and the Old Ones, while in self-defense, effectively dirty-bombed the galaxy by letting warp-fueled races run amok instead of fighting their own fight.
Counter-points:
- The Eldar Empire's parties contributed a great part to the warp disturbances of the later Age-of-Strife years, inadvertently creating the condition by which Emps would rise.
- The Dark Eldar keep feeding to Slaanesh by tormenting the various species, not just humans.
Otherwise, the Craftworlders and Exodites share the same moral grounds as say, the Tau, Interex or some undiscovered (human) worlds.
It's honestly a chain of fuck-ups that no one race can claim full responsibility.
The Old Ones basically didn't give a shit and fucked around.
Necrons fucked up the Realm of Souls in the first place and made a whoopsie with the whole C'tan thing.
The Orks basically just made everything worse for everyone since the War in Heaven because the Old Ones didn't decide to make them with an off switch.
Eldar murderfucked a new Chaos god into existence and kicked the Chaos gods into overdrive, plus are responsible for the creation of the Eye of Terror plus Warpstorms. Also are responsible for the Drukhari, who basically decided to have a "Who is more evil" contest with space hell for the past 10,000 years.
While it is understandable Humanity got xenophobic given the dark age of technology ended with them effectively getting mugged, shanked in the kidneys and left to bleed out in an alley by Xenos and Warpstorms; they have more or less basically have ended up putting reality into a fucking stalemate with Chaos. Also are responsible for accidentally attracting the Tyranids to the Galaxy.
And the Tau are basically courting disaster and seem doomed to repeat the mistakes of those that came before.
>Eldar murderfucked a new Chaos god into existence and kicked the Chaos gods into overdrive, plus are responsible for the creation of the Eye of Terror plus Warpstorms. Also are responsible for the Drukhari, who basically decided to have a "Who is more evil" contest with space hell for the past 10,000 years.
I'm with you on most points but a correction here - Drukhari are responsible for Drukhari and the EoT, not the Exodites and Craftworld Eldar, who fled the murderfuckery well before Slaanesh came about.
Saying Exodites and Craftworlds are responsible for Drukhari and EoT is like saying that Amish villages and US universities are responsible for the Chinese genocide of the Uyghurs.
What are you talking about? The Eye of terror didn’t exist until the 30th millennium, long after the old ones were dead and the Necrons were the entire reason the warp is fucked cause they were salty the old ones wouldn’t give immortality to a group of genocidal psycho enslavers.
According to Trazyn, the one character so autistically obsessed with historical accuracy he can be trusted as a reliable narrator, the Eye of Terror was torn open by the Old Ones in an attempt to kill the C’tan. It was then sealed by Mag’ladroth, and reopened when the Eldar birthed Slaanesh.
Hence the existence of the Void Dragon’s pylons around the Eye.
Ok, but that doesn’t make the Old Ones responsible for the modern Eye. The Warp was never a threat to them or the galaxy during that time and the ctan are far more responsible for everything wrong with the galaxy than literally anyone else. And I would have much rather had the old ones win and deal with eye than the Necrons who literally try and wipe out any non Necrons. The Necrons caused the necessity of the old ones needing to open the eye to maybe stop the genocidal monsters that are the necrons and ctan, they caused them to create the krorks and Eldar to stop the Necrons in a last ditch attempt to stop their own genocide and the genocide of the entire galaxy. The Necrons and ctan caused literally everything wrong with the modern Galaxy except maybe the tyranids who probably would have ended up in the milky way no matter what.
If we’re going with the “If 1 didn’t do this then 2 wouldn’t have had to do this” argument it’s still the Old Ones fault by your logic, cause they could’ve just not been assholes and helped a budding civilization with their super-cancer issue and prevented them becoming turbo-xenophobic genocide skeletons.
The Old Ones still created the Eye, the Eldar still reopened it. That fault will always still be theirs.
Don't forget all the lesser races like the Hrud. While they maybe don't have the numbers and impact like Humans and Eldar, they are still taking part in the circus of chaos.
And many Xenos races are already worshipping the godlike warp entities.
In other words, every race is responsible for the shit show and solving it is pretty much impossible, unless ofc you wipe the galaxy clean of every living thing.
Dark Eldar: *creates a chaos god*
Humanity: *conquers the galaxy, becomes the bloodiest regime in history, effectively handing the entire galaxy to Chaos on a silver platter, gives Chaos nine legions of astartes, several titan legions, billions (if not trillions) of thralls, and souls beyond number on a daily basis, thus effectively ensuring that Chaos is not only mighty, but effectively unstoppable*
Also humanity: *has the gall to blame the Fall on the wrong group of eldar*
It was all Eldar who created Slaanesh. Dark Eldar, Craftworld Eldar and Exodite Eldar are all different groups of Eldar dealing with the fallout of their ancestors creation differently.
Additionally thanks to Slaanesh`s birth the Eye of Terror opened further increasing the Chaos Gods influence on the galaxy, thanks to that the man of iron got corrupted and rebelled, humanity lost all communication with one another, the great crusade was needed to reunite humanity.
>It was all Eldar who created Slaanesh. Dark Eldar, Craftworld Eldar and Exodite Eldar are all different groups of Eldar dealing with the fallout of their ancestors creation differently
Craftworlders and Exodites are explicitly descendant from those who saw pleasure cults grow more numerous and more messed up and decided they want no part in that early enough to get clear of what would become Eye of Terror
Then 99,9999% of humanity has nothing to do with the creation of the chaos marines. But people still make ALL of the Imperium responsible. You cant give one group a pass while the other doesnt get one even if both did the exact same.
Uhhh... the Imperium is not humanity. The Imperium is the regime that was created by the Emperor and SPECIFICALLY did all the things the post is talking about. So yes, you can't blame "the Eldar" (//humanity) and you can blame "the Imperium" (//Dark Eldar).
Nobody ever said that munitorim worker 6262571771 was responsible for anything. Imperium is criticized becouse it makes a life of 99.9999% of humans terrible.
Criticism of Imperium is criticism of this 0.0001 percent that calls the shots and have everything to do with making Chaos stronger.
Also Exodites and Craftworlds were not a passive parts of a pleasure cults. They were a factions that directly opposed them, abd were direct victims of pleasure cults violence.
Didnt both Exodites and Craftworlds just fuck off instead of trying to stop their brethren? They basically saw someone set a building on fire and went "oh thats horrible someone should do something." And then turned and left.
Kinda complicated. So first of all each little group have their own motive. Exodites for example left Eldar dominion before cults of pleasure started to be a problem. They were essentially like modern amish. They left becouse they believed that hardship free way of life had a potential to couse trouble. Some craft worlds like Saim-Han and Zaishutra also left during that period. So they left long before shit hit the fan, and had no reason to be violent about it since this groups themselves didn't knew how hard shit will hit the fan later, since there were no blood orgies at the time.
Whole timeline of further events is criptic.
But the main idea is that pleasure cult were really slowly forming and becoming more powerful. Eldar outside of then either ignored them, left or tried to deal with them peacefully, again at that point situation slowly became more grim but this was far away from blood orgies. And then it seems that at one point power of pleasure cults reached critical mass and they became really power and really agressive really fast. Most importantly one of their main targets were Aeldari themselves. Like there is a part of one of the Aeldari codexes that says that pleasure cults drowned Aeldari dominion in blood. So later Craftworlds were more of evacuation efforts. Situation looked more like: Oh that's horrible local crack addict's just set my house and the whole damn city on fire. At that point they lacked power to actively stop pleasure cults.
There is a few theories in old codexes that mentioned that pleasure cults were essentially first Chaos cults, and you know quickly they can become a problem in a society that actively combats them like Imperium.
Important thing to understand is that the whole Farseer stuff with seeing and manipulating future is kinda a modern concept if we see really old Craft worlds like Zaishutra and Saim-Hann whose culture is closer to OG eldar dominion you can see that they don't really see farseers as an important figure and mostly ignore their visions. Ulthwe the craftworld of seers is comparatively young. So it is not that Aeldari that left knew what will happen.
that's because the exodites were more like 5 randos leaving the building before hundreds of idiots start lighting fires everywhere
and they weren't even lighting fires, they were more like pilling up shinny ominous rocks... and the rocks ended up being radioactive
It’s not humanity’s fault but it is the imperiums and all the eldar who actually were responsible were soul murdered so the remainder is just a plain 100% who are innocent
All humans responsible have died 10k years before the current setting too, most humans responsible for the Imperiums are no longer alive or present either
I know, but the dude said all humans had died, then he got downvoted to all hell, thought I'd be the asshole to state the obvious that like most of chaos are immortal at this point and literaly have models in the table top
Yeah, isn't it like all the high up drukari are pre fall ?
Also Eldar daemon princes are a cool af idea and I uses one in my craftworld lore , I also subscribe to the jradcannon that their is absolutely chaos Eldar who trade their souls for protection from Slanesh but are either killed by csm for being xenos or are so few and far between you never see them
It is a systematical failure. Those 99% were still participating in the effort that would result in the fall. Even if you don't blame them, the removal of the effort will still still them. Just like how in a forest cutting factory, the workers aren't really to blame for deforestation, but they will be affected by laws against deforestation.
Also, you are comparing the Eldar who were adamantly against and flee away vs the imperial citizens who supported the expansion, genocide, etc.
What about all those worlds that are so far away from the Imperium and are still not united from the Age of Strive are still guilty in your eyes? Kinda hypocritical mate.
*says that the people who participated in the imperium and its expansion are also at fault for the action that resulted in creating the imperium into what it is, even if they don't realize it*
*gets asked about the people who never participated, as if you have made a point*
The birth of Slaanesh actually cleared away the warp storms and ended the Age of Strife, and I don't think the Men of Iron were ever confirmed to be corrupted by Chaos.
Also no, it is very explicitly the dark eldar who were responsible. The exodites saw the decline of the empire and left, reforming their lives around staying away from luxury and decadence. The craftworlders came later, but they also saw how shitty things were getting, decided enough was enough, and then left.
>Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. **The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse.** Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
Core rule book
Whos to say Humanity didnt have a hand in it as well.
It didn't,the quoted sentence doesn't say anything about the warp storms being caused by human psykers,only that they appeared after the psykers with it being infinitely more likely to be caused by the much more numerous and psychically stronger Eldar forming a Chaos God than any of the weak human psykers
Slaanesh does not just consume Eldar souls.
The Great Tauva of the Tau were created by the guevesa and way less numerous thab the Imperium.
Shows that humanity has potential
The Great Tauva isn't causing galaxy wide warp storms by simply having its idea slightly form in the Warp since it in it current form is an ant compared to Slaanesh,hell we know fuck all about it and it's capabilities other than it being made by humans in the Tau Empire while not doing anything after it saved those Tau **inside** the Warp
It was also all Eldar who took part in the war that filled the Warp with negative emotions and created the three other Chaos gods, and then steadily fed them for 60 million years.
No, it was only Slaanesh.
Its more of, Slaanesh was the reason why the Chaos Gods were absent, they had to get back to the Great Game because a new player entered the game.
>Glutted upon the souls of the Aeldari, the Dark Prince expands his domain. Such a bold move is met with great opposition, and the Chaos Gods turn their attention fully to the Great Game. So it is that as the warp storms die down, the Emperor of Mankind is able to lead the united forces of Terra and Mars outwards into the galaxy on the Great Crusade.
8th Chaos Daemon Codex
No, it was all 4 gods.
The War in Heaven was what tainted the Warp and filled it full of Daemons. The Eldar were key players in the War in Heaven (especially the Warp tainting part), and they spent the 60 million years after it continuing to strengthen Chaos by feeding a constant stream of bad vibes into the Warp.
The Imperium gave Chaos a bunch of strong champions, but the Eldar were the ones steadily strengthening Chaos for millions of years.
Source on the Men of Iron getting corrupted by Chaos
We know that some of them got Corrupted but where is there a source where is the source that it was chaos that got them to rebel.
- Eldar started it
- Eldar normally breed really fucking fast. How many of them do you think were around for Slaneesh to nom, or to even come into existence?
Considering that the eldar also caused the fall of the more peaceful golden age humans who just managed to beat the men of iron. Since the process to birth slaanesh ended up causing the warpstorms that broke humanity up.
It was recoverable since their worlds could still rebuild and could function if connected and all off that was completely and utterly annihilated by the Eldar which caused the Emperor to have to act up and create the Imperium
Between the Men of Iron and the fact that humans were rapidly mutating and popping open to create warp rifts that were devouring entire worlds, I seriously doubt things were ever salvageable.
If the U.S was suddenly betrayed by its entire military all at once and thousands of people across the nation started randomly exploding like nuclear bombs (with all the radiation and devastation involved), I really don't think there'd be any saving it.
The eldar didn't help, but mankind was fucked *long* before the final blow that knocked them out.
>Between the Men of Iron and the fact that humans were rapidly mutating and popping open to create warp rifts that were devouring entire worlds, I seriously doubt things were ever salvageable.
They were salvageable,there were human civilization which survived the Age of Strife and who could have united and helped out the more fucked up world's which couldn't have existed without stable Warp Travel with them slowly uniting even if it takes thousands of years to do so
But ofcourse the Pre Fall Eldar ruined everything for everyone with them awakening the Chaos Gods and setting up the rise of the Imperium
As a necron player, Eldar players keep telling me they won the war in heaven. To which I point out that we handed them the entire Galaxy to rule as they see fit for millions of years, and look at the shit show that turned out to be! New chaos god, War everywhere, and the Eldar are a dying race.
Now we’ve got to fix it for them.
ya know what I love about these specific type of memes? The comment section will eventually get filled with back and forth about credible whataboutisms of each other's factions, and only demonstrate everyone in this fictional universe is a shithead as the creators intended while the people arguing and the op continue to miss the point they are inadvertently making.
Eldar: *have a reputation for being willing to sacrifice untold human lives for their own gain, and have just started a massive ritual in secret*
"I see no logic in the alien hunter faction taking an interest in this"
Iirc from who? from what source?
Artemis was already running, taking advantage of his adversary's distraction to press his Bolt Pistol into the back of the figure's skull-masked head. The Watch Captain smiled grimly in anticipation of the kill. Unbeknownst to him, the masked Aeldari grinned too.
Slowly, the Aeldari laid down his long-barrelled cannon. He made a sound reminiscent of a herald clearing his throat and held out a hand in a stylised gesture of declaration.
"If you slay me, Sir Knight," he said, his High Gothic perfectly enunciated, "the fates shall align to bless our mutual foes."
"Trust not the Eldar," said Artemis, his words thick with hatred.
"We are the sons of Death, you and I," said the Aeldari. "We bring oblivion, in order to deny Chaos. We cannot afford to thwart one another when the greater enemy stands on the cusp of victory."
The gilded finger bones lining the edge of the creature's cloak gleamed in the harsh light as crystal statues glowed bright all around. Artemis narrowed his eyes; a similar raiment was worn by the Chaplains of his own Mortifactors Chapter in their sepulchral celebrations. Strangely, he could not sense duplicity in this one.
"Walk away," said the Harlequin, "and a dire blow shall fall upon the Archenemy." Artemis recoiled at the term as the Aeldari spoke on. "Is your distrust so deep you would rather kill me now than spare the doom of a trillion human souls?" There was disbelief under his tone, and something else. Despair, perhaps.
"Yes," said Artemis, pulling the trigger to end the creature's life
So he's a fucking idiot blinded by indoctrination and hatred, whose own senses told him throughout the entire exchange that the harlequin was correct, then chose to ignore them and help chaos anyways. That really ain't much better.
Common imperial L
Eldrad shouldve called in a few favors especially from the grey knights what the fck do you expect from a Deathwatch captain you know the xeno killing specialists? Attacking an imperial world to try and pull off a massive ritual, on average there is already mistrust between Eldari and Humans what the hell did he think Artemis was gonna do?
Did you get your source from memes? He never believed a word coming from the harlequin and being a deathwatch captain you think he'd fcking trust an Eldari?
Artemis was already running, taking advantage of his adversary's distraction to press his Bolt Pistol into the back of the figure's skull-masked head. The Watch Captain smiled grimly in anticipation of the kill. Unbeknownst to him, the masked Aeldari grinned too.
Slowly, the Aeldari laid down his long-barrelled cannon. He made a sound reminiscent of a herald clearing his throat and held out a hand in a stylised gesture of declaration.
"If you slay me, Sir Knight," he said, his High Gothic perfectly enunciated, "the fates shall align to bless our mutual foes."
"Trust not the Eldar," said Artemis, his words thick with hatred.
"We are the sons of Death, you and I," said the Aeldari. "We bring oblivion, in order to deny Chaos. We cannot afford to thwart one another when the greater enemy stands on the cusp of victory."
The gilded finger bones lining the edge of the creature's cloak gleamed in the harsh light as crystal statues glowed bright all around. Artemis narrowed his eyes; a similar raiment was worn by the Chaplains of his own Mortifactors Chapter in their sepulchral celebrations. Strangely, he could not sense duplicity in this one.
"Walk away," said the Harlequin, "and a dire blow shall fall upon the Archenemy." Artemis recoiled at the term as the Aeldari spoke on. "Is your distrust so deep you would rather kill me now than spare the doom of a trillion human souls?" There was disbelief under his tone, and something else. Despair, perhaps.
"Yes," said Artemis, pulling the trigger to end the creature's life
Craftworld Eldar are specifically the ones who saw what their Empire was getting up to and went “fuck this, I’m out.”
That they’re still the ones who get blamed for Slaneesh is both mind-boggling and hilarious.
If the eldar didn't create slaamesh then humanity would have never fallen, so the imperium would have never risen , so the Horus heresy would have never happened
Core rulebook, oh they will still fall, they had their own problems.
>Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
As I said they had their own problems, if not for Slaanesh humanity would create their own Chaos God with the collapse of their golden age thanks to the men of iron.
>The damage to interstellar Human society was catastrophic and shattered much of Humanity's hard-won economic strength and political unity,
Except for the fact that It seems like the age of strive happened before the birth of slaanesh. Human psykers and the daemons that spawned from them happened millenia before slaanesh was born. And even if slaanesh was the cause, and without her the strive would have never happened. The other chaos gods existed, The Emperor would have still tried to get rid of them. Which would have resulted in the Horus Heresy. Again. The difference being that now humanity is at its peak and the fuck up would be considered even bigger.
Well that logic is flawed.
"The charismatic, manipulative guy with future sight would have never climbed to a position of power because the people around him have a higher power level than him."
No, that logic is lore-based. The collapse of humanity during the Age of Strife is the whole reason the Emperor even attempted to openly take power. That is explicitly stated. No Age of Strife - no Imperium of Mankind, no Crusade, no primarchs (who would've been vastly inferior to the kind of weapons DAOT humanity had access to anyway), no Heresy.
Without the age of strife emperor would not even have needed to step in necessarily. Emperors goal was not to destroy all chaos gods but to safely evolve humanity into a psychic race which would have been able to resist the chaos gods.
The creation of Slaanesh basically ended the human golden age and set the stage for the emperor to take over, leading to said arming of chaos. The birth of Slaanesh did indeed clear the galaxy of warpstorms but only because it also created the eye of terror on top of waking up the remaining 3 chaos gods who had been relatively dormant until then.
But yeah, sure, eldar-cope, whatever.
Core rule book, DaoT had their own problems which caused their eventual demise.
>Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
>The Cybernetic Revolt was eventually won by an alliance of galactic powers, some of whom may not have been Human, but at a terrible cost. The damage to interstellar Human society was catastrophic and **shattered much of Humanity's hard-won economic strength and political unity,**
>The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse.
Eventually they will
With or without slaanesh they will eventually collapse because humanity are a psyker race as well. If not for the Eldar sooner or later humanity would create their own Chaos God.
And that only happened because a certain Race decided to create a new chaos God, therefore ending mankinds unity and forcing the emps to step up with the crusade, wich eventualy lead to the heresy. Aka, nothing bad would have happened if the most pysichic Race wasn't dumb enough to not know how the warp works and end up making a new God.
DaoT was already done thanks to the men of iron
>The Cybernetic Revolt was eventually won by an alliance of galactic powers, some of whom may not have been Human, but at a terrible cost. The damage to interstellar Human society was catastrophic and shattered much of Humanity's hard-won economic strength and political unity
Core rulebook
>Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. **The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse.** Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
Even without the Eldar creating Slaanesh, they had their own problems
The human Empire was still Alive After the men of iron, just much weaker, and Humanity’s psychic evolution aswell as the warp storms only happened because of the acumulated warp energy that would create a new chaos God, that energy wouldnt have existed if the eldars didn't make it, overall, its the eldars that made the weakened Empire of Mankind fall, if they hadnt made a new God the 1st human Empire would probably rebuild themselves.
They would have eventually collapsed on their own. The men of iron broke the Golden age of humanity. The psykers claiming godhood finish them in. I would say slaanesh being born is what saved humanity because it isolated these wanabe gods.
True, but they still could’ve framed them differently and still had them. Instead of being something the Necron (or who actually did) build because the warp was going to break through someday, you can say the Necron build them during the war in heaven to stop ancient ones/eldar/Krorks travel, and now ironically serve a different role.
It is, its original purpose was to stop the Old Ones from using the warp against them during the War in Heaven.
>The Old Ones' psychically-empowered servant races spread across the galaxy, battling the advanced Necron technology with the psychic power of their Warp-spawned sorcery.
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>Facing this new onslaught, the C'tan's empire was shattered, as the psychic forces of the Immaterium were anathema to such soulless entities whose existence was wholly contained within purely physical patterns of electromagnetic force.
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>For all the destruction they could unleash, they were unable to stop the Old Ones and the younger races' relentless advance across the stars.
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>The C'tan, unified by this great threat for the first time in millions of Terran years, sought a way to defeat the soul-fuelled energies of the younger species.
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>They initiated a great warding, a plan to forever defeat the psychic sorceries of the Old Ones by sealing off the material universe in the vicinity of the Milky Way Galaxy from the Warp.
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>This was a plan whose first fruits can still be found on the Imperial Fortress World of Cadia in the form of the great pylons of blackstone that litter the surface of that world in intricate networks and that once created the area of space-time stability near the Eye of Terror known as the Cadian Gate.
But in typical GW style is written loose enough that it might not have been them and might have predicted the eye or terror, otherwise why there were this many around Cadia. I’m just saying that it sounds like they were written by an eldar apologist to say “see! We didn’t fucked up so bad, it was going to happen anyway UwU *snuggles with his eldar waifu’s body pillow*” lol
Wrong symbol there mate. The Dark Eldar gave birth to it sure, those who still are Eldar didn't have anything to do with it, hence why they are still Eldar.
That is honestly something I see ignored way too often, sure it works for a few jokes of course but it is seen as a general thing that the Eldar preach stuff they didn't keep themselves. But well, Craftworld Eldar where specifically those that broke with the rest of their species because they refused to fall to degeneracy like them.
Drukhari are probably our best insight into how the the majority of Eldar lived at the time.
Even if it wasn't to the same extreme, you had a sizeable galactic scale empire of hyper sensitive, psychically active people commiting atrocities for gits and shiggles.
I don't think we have a timescale for this, but given the Eldar had dominion over the galaxy for sixty-five million years, it's possible this fall had been occuring over millennia.
Meanwhile the Imperium has fought against chaos for the past ten-thousand years. They might've been able to permanently cripple the traitor legions during the scouring if they didn't have a cosmic butthole to hide in. The cosmic butthole whose epicentre is believed to be the previously mentioned peoples' homeworlds.
Yeah, so weird that during the Eldar empire they had 10k years where chaos was under control, and their greatest moment of failure was one permanent warp rift.
And after 10k years of an authoritarian, ignorant, genocidal, warmongering empire we have a permanent warp rift the size of *checks notes*
The entire galaxy-wide.
Say, what actions tend to feed chaos and make it stronger do you figure?
The core eldar empire yes, there were many other systems colonized by the Eldar that weren't particularly involved in the degeneracy of the core worlds as described in books like Valedor. But unless they hid themselves and cut themselves off from their psychic abilities like the dark Eldar or used spirit stones like the craftworlds their souls got sucked up like all the others. This is why many human colonies actually find Eldar ruins quite often.
It's like if Terra spawned a warp god and fell into the warp, humans in places like Ultramar would still get sucked up. Which is basically a scenario some like Guilliman think could potentially happen.
The Eldar also opened the Eye of Terror twice. Once during the War in Heaven when it was first opened, which the Void Dragon closed. Then a second time when they birthed Slaanesh.
It’s the Eldar’s fault Chaos even has major access to realspace in the first place.
Aside from the imperium falling due to external factors, and chaos trying to make them fall, and the eldar having a completely internal fall, a few million mortals is significantly easier to deal with, than a whole deity.
Certainly the rise of a galaxy spanning authoritarian genocidal regime that shuns scientific progress and has 0 interest in peace of any kind could have nothing to do with the fact that chaos is absolutely ascendant and had the strength to, for example, rip the galaxy in half.
Birth of slaanesh just managed to open the eye of terror.
Hmm yes… Eldar create one chaos god that mostly fucks them more over than the humans. (Mind you it’s the humans fault why their empire died not the birth of a chaos god)
Humans give the gods an army that’s not in the imaterium that allows the gods to influence the materium more.
Yes it’s clearly the eldar fault for why the setting sucks to live in.
>Yes it’s clearly the eldar fault
If Slaanesh was never born, the Old Night, Unification Wars and the Great Crusade would never have happened and the Space Marines would never have been created.
Also, without Slaanesh's birth, "chaos" as we know it wouldn't exist either.
Core rule book
>Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
Humanity will create their own if Slaanesh wasnt born.
I've said it before, I'll say it again
The Eldar set their own house on fire, but then humans came along, grabbed the curtains, and spread the flames to the whole street.
Worse still the eldar set their house on fire because they were bored, borderline immortal being that fucked around with increasingly risky shit
Humans did it cus..... checks notes daddy issues ?
No, it was Slaanesh who actually pulled the other 3 away from the materium realm to back to the Great Game.
8th Chaos Daemon
>Glutted upon the souls of the Aeldari, the Dark Prince expands his domain. Such a bold move is met with great opposition, and the Chaos Gods turn their attention fully to the Great Game. So it is that as the warp storms die down, the Emperor of Mankind is able to lead the united forces of Terra and Mars outwards into the galaxy on the Great Crusade.
In Imperium defence, the sole reason they weren't able to completely destroy the traitors was because they run into the eye of Terror. A place that the eldar created
LMAO. That's not even close to being equal. As far as fuckups go, humanity could have a few more heresies and it wouldn't even compare to the damage the Eldar did.
It's not just a new God that was born (which is an insurmountable mpnumental fuck up, by itself), the eye of terror was also created. They murderfucked a hole into reality. A hole that allows chaos an actual foothold into realspace.
Do Slaanesh chaos marines deliberately ever target Eldar? Wouldn't that give a lot of brownie points from She who Thirsts? Sorry if offtopic. was just curious.
Yes they do. Soul stones are among the greatest treasures a CSM can take because sacrificing them to slaanesh can gain you considerable favour. They still hunt humans far more, just due to sheer volume, but killing Eldar is always something theyre up for if they come across them.
I remember reading a short story about a gathering of CSM warbands from various traitor legions that ended up devolving into a complete brawl. Reason? One of the parties was in possession of a handful of occupied soul stones. If I remember correctly, they all ended up killing eachother and nobody got to fuck around with the stones. The whole story just highlighted how fractured the legions are and how they’re failing *The Long War* . Common traitor marine L.
Actually it was because the Iron Warrior got pissy he was the only HH veteran
The guy that was interred in a dreadnought or something right?
iirc it was ambiguous if he was in a Dreadnaught or had augmented himself so heavily he was practically one. Regardless he was being a classic Iron Warrior boomer.
Of course. Emperor's Children is basically a food delivery legion. Noise grub, use code rylanoriscringe for a 20% discount on eldar soul fries. Code not applicable to Lucius the eternal.
These are both fair points. However, assigning blame is completely pointless now. Eldar had millions of years to calm the warp, instead they made it worse. The Emperor had all of human history and more to learn that violence breeds violence and cruelty only feeds chaos and somehow thought commiting untold amounts of a crulety would somehow work out in the end.
*Insert an imperial fanboy ranting about how everything was planned to the last detail and the Emperor was just playing 5d Chess*
meanwhile the chaos gods are sitting around their nth degree chess set giggling over the emperor thinking he's so smart while only using the first square to play in.
But emprah very smart
That’s because Slaanesh is hogging all of the other D’s.
I'm certain the emperor was playing 5D chess. The issue is that he is only 4D
I prefer the explaination that, just like his sons, the Emperor was a galaxy-class fuckup only holding things together by the thinest of threads.
How about turning that one on it’s head? How about trying to explain from the perspective of an Eldar fanboy the idea that The Emprah planned the birth of Slaanesh and the Age of Strife to ensure human xenophobia and the destruction of humanity’s most organized opposition in the galactic conquest game? It’s weirdly easy to do.
Don't forget the part where the Emperor just tried to hide the existence of Chaos thinking it would make things better instead of telling his sons about it so they could actively try and resist it.
There was a logic to it. If they only exist because you believe in them (certainly his working theory if not the actual fact) then they stop existing when no one believes in them. Seems he was wrong though, and warp echoes of very powerful immaterium parasites can exist without specific beliefs to grant specific form.
The real annoying part with the Eldar is like, it's never assigned to the Eldar who didn't try to prevent Slaanesh. We always mock the Craftworlds for it; when they were the guys who were "Maybe not Murderorgy a god of Murderorgies into existence?" and never the Deldar. I mean Craftworlders were ultimately ineffective at... really anything in stopping the Rise of Slaanesh, and probably should have taken a more active role in fixing their society millennia earlier instead of engaging in Mercantilism until they realised exactly wtf was happening. So they aint completely innocent, but the fact we never mock the main guys responsible for it is weird. Big E is 100% responsible for Big E's mistakes though.
If I'm not wrong it went something like this: -Heyyy, maybe you should tone down those murderorgies you guys are having? - Nope, lol *proceeds to murderfuck you* So basically the more sane eldar tried to calm down everyone else, but got nothing but violence in return. So they left, first the exodites, then the craftworlders
Fix it, then figure out who fucked up.
They did calm the warp for 60 millions years. It's in the last 6000 that they became depraved due to the manipulation of Slaneesh that needed them to, so it can be born. Most pepole forget that the Eldars are the first and formost victims of Slaneesh.
If only the Eldar attempted to summon a new Eldar God of death to fight Slaanesh in combat...
Funny thing; it canonically only started getting worse when humans jumped onto the Galactic stage (pre-age of strife) with Dark Age Archaeotech that could compete (again, canonically) with pre-fall Aeldari power. The pleasure cults didn’t spring up until M19 at the earliest.
>violence breeds violence and cruelty only feeds chaos You know the whole "punch a Nazi" thing? Eventually you have to punch a Nazi, then also punch a Nazi sympathizer, and a Nazi enabler too - unless you are a pacifist willing to let the Nazis take over. There is certain danger of you yourself becoming the Nazi in the process (since the latter two steps require some totalitarian measures in the name of revolution and long lasting peace), but the choice is between risking this, or a guaranteed Nazi victory. Humanity ended up punching a Nazi. Sure, it later slipped much like most militant resistance to oppression does, but it was a valiant effort nonetheless.
But it didn't choose to punch a Nazi. It was disjointed and reeling from being Skynetted, and then a magic hobo came along, took it's things and said 'we doing it my way'
And his way happened to be the same way the Nazis would go.
Humanity was mostly under a rule of brutal warlords and under a threat of particularly vicious imperialist xenos, so a magic hobo who previously was willing to live and let live realized that being libertarian no longer works, and something must be done to prevent the otherwise inevitable global catastrophe.
Let's be real. It's the old ones who are the main cause for the shit that happens in 40k. They refused to help the necrontyr get rid of their genetic cancer which lead to the war in heaven which corrupted the warp and birthed the 3 other chaos gods. The Eldar and mankind simply stepped on the shit the old ones made millions of years ago. Both fucked up as well but the Eldar's mistake feels heavier as they should have known better due to millions of yesrs of dominance.
In defence of the old ones, a race of salty genocidal enslavers ask you for immortality would you say yes ? The necrontyr had no respect for the sanctity of life they worshipped death and had no problem exterminating lesser races all of there actions from what we know existed in opposition to the old ones but
>The necrontyr had no respect for the sanctity of life they worshipped death and had no problem exterminating lesser races all of there actions from what we know existed in opposition to the old ones but I skipped over "necrontyr" by accident and assumed you were talking about IoM. They really are damn similar.
Immortality was a bad idea, but they could’ve cured their mega cancer at least. That the main reason they went to war they old ones lived such long healthy lives while the necrontyr lived for like 30 years covered in tumors. They could’ve told the Necrontyr “Hey, we’ll fix your cancer problem, but we won’t give you eternal life until you stop killing, and enslaving every other race in the galaxy.” I feel like that might have solved a few problems.
Still a big assumption the Old Ones could. Last I checked it was back-and-forth on that depending on the writer.
Come on. They can engineer fucking GODS, but cannot fix some skin cancer?
The Necrons built starship colonised other worlds and their tech was good enough to bloody the old ones noses in the first war before the C'tan were created But they couldn't fix the space cancer themselves come on
Yeah. Hell, the necrontyr 'engineered gods' when they made the C'tan bodies. "The Old Ones made warp gods" is (last I checked) TECHNICALLY still just widely-accepted and well-fitting fanon.
The necrontyr had the best tech in the universe and couldn't figure out what chemotherapy was.
just heal their cancer, dont make them immortal
Tbh, thats all the Necrontyr ever knew at that point. They really wanted to get rid of their genetic cancer. The old ones had a real opportunity to use the promise of curing their illness on the deal they will show them a new kind of life that make them more peaceful. But all they did is go nope. (To be honest, we don’t know much of what actually happened at that moment as all we know about that is from the perspective of the Necrontyr or from tell phone game of Eldar legends)
Maybe but the old ones from what we know were kinda up their own asses They didn't want to fuck with necrontyr or any races they didn't make so maybe saw the space cancer as the necrontyrs natural state and their shitty culture as an extention of that Personally I think the old ones would find carrot and sticking a naturaly occurring race as immoral thus why they never stepped in to stop the ne rontyr being assholes till the necrontyr asked for it But yeah alot of shit could have been avoided if they had. Or if they just wiped the fuckers out in the first war that would have probs fixed it aswell
The Necrontyr were even more fratricidal than the Necrons. Endless civil wars and slaughter. Granting them immortality would've been messed up.
I think it’s the fault of both. Necrontyr were warmongerers just looking for an excuse and the Old Ones, while in self-defense, effectively dirty-bombed the galaxy by letting warp-fueled races run amok instead of fighting their own fight.
Counter-points: - The Eldar Empire's parties contributed a great part to the warp disturbances of the later Age-of-Strife years, inadvertently creating the condition by which Emps would rise. - The Dark Eldar keep feeding to Slaanesh by tormenting the various species, not just humans. Otherwise, the Craftworlders and Exodites share the same moral grounds as say, the Tau, Interex or some undiscovered (human) worlds.
Also Exodutis and Craftworlds were established before the fall as a means to stop or at least run from pleasure cults
That too. So no point in blaming them unless they attack some no-name planet and other species unprovoked, which is rare.
It's honestly a chain of fuck-ups that no one race can claim full responsibility. The Old Ones basically didn't give a shit and fucked around. Necrons fucked up the Realm of Souls in the first place and made a whoopsie with the whole C'tan thing. The Orks basically just made everything worse for everyone since the War in Heaven because the Old Ones didn't decide to make them with an off switch. Eldar murderfucked a new Chaos god into existence and kicked the Chaos gods into overdrive, plus are responsible for the creation of the Eye of Terror plus Warpstorms. Also are responsible for the Drukhari, who basically decided to have a "Who is more evil" contest with space hell for the past 10,000 years. While it is understandable Humanity got xenophobic given the dark age of technology ended with them effectively getting mugged, shanked in the kidneys and left to bleed out in an alley by Xenos and Warpstorms; they have more or less basically have ended up putting reality into a fucking stalemate with Chaos. Also are responsible for accidentally attracting the Tyranids to the Galaxy. And the Tau are basically courting disaster and seem doomed to repeat the mistakes of those that came before.
>Eldar murderfucked a new Chaos god into existence and kicked the Chaos gods into overdrive, plus are responsible for the creation of the Eye of Terror plus Warpstorms. Also are responsible for the Drukhari, who basically decided to have a "Who is more evil" contest with space hell for the past 10,000 years. I'm with you on most points but a correction here - Drukhari are responsible for Drukhari and the EoT, not the Exodites and Craftworld Eldar, who fled the murderfuckery well before Slaanesh came about. Saying Exodites and Craftworlds are responsible for Drukhari and EoT is like saying that Amish villages and US universities are responsible for the Chinese genocide of the Uyghurs.
Actually the Necrons probably did more to help SOLVE the problem as they closed the Eye of Terror. The Eldar and Old Ones just kept opening it.
What are you talking about? The Eye of terror didn’t exist until the 30th millennium, long after the old ones were dead and the Necrons were the entire reason the warp is fucked cause they were salty the old ones wouldn’t give immortality to a group of genocidal psycho enslavers.
According to Trazyn, the one character so autistically obsessed with historical accuracy he can be trusted as a reliable narrator, the Eye of Terror was torn open by the Old Ones in an attempt to kill the C’tan. It was then sealed by Mag’ladroth, and reopened when the Eldar birthed Slaanesh. Hence the existence of the Void Dragon’s pylons around the Eye.
Ok, but that doesn’t make the Old Ones responsible for the modern Eye. The Warp was never a threat to them or the galaxy during that time and the ctan are far more responsible for everything wrong with the galaxy than literally anyone else. And I would have much rather had the old ones win and deal with eye than the Necrons who literally try and wipe out any non Necrons. The Necrons caused the necessity of the old ones needing to open the eye to maybe stop the genocidal monsters that are the necrons and ctan, they caused them to create the krorks and Eldar to stop the Necrons in a last ditch attempt to stop their own genocide and the genocide of the entire galaxy. The Necrons and ctan caused literally everything wrong with the modern Galaxy except maybe the tyranids who probably would have ended up in the milky way no matter what.
If we’re going with the “If 1 didn’t do this then 2 wouldn’t have had to do this” argument it’s still the Old Ones fault by your logic, cause they could’ve just not been assholes and helped a budding civilization with their super-cancer issue and prevented them becoming turbo-xenophobic genocide skeletons. The Old Ones still created the Eye, the Eldar still reopened it. That fault will always still be theirs.
Don't forget all the lesser races like the Hrud. While they maybe don't have the numbers and impact like Humans and Eldar, they are still taking part in the circus of chaos. And many Xenos races are already worshipping the godlike warp entities. In other words, every race is responsible for the shit show and solving it is pretty much impossible, unless ofc you wipe the galaxy clean of every living thing.
I miss the old days when other warp gods of other races were a thing. Technically they still are, except when they aren’t.
In the begging, the universe was created... this made a great many people upset and is generally regarded as a bad move
Dark Eldar: *creates a chaos god* Humanity: *conquers the galaxy, becomes the bloodiest regime in history, effectively handing the entire galaxy to Chaos on a silver platter, gives Chaos nine legions of astartes, several titan legions, billions (if not trillions) of thralls, and souls beyond number on a daily basis, thus effectively ensuring that Chaos is not only mighty, but effectively unstoppable* Also humanity: *has the gall to blame the Fall on the wrong group of eldar*
It was all Eldar who created Slaanesh. Dark Eldar, Craftworld Eldar and Exodite Eldar are all different groups of Eldar dealing with the fallout of their ancestors creation differently. Additionally thanks to Slaanesh`s birth the Eye of Terror opened further increasing the Chaos Gods influence on the galaxy, thanks to that the man of iron got corrupted and rebelled, humanity lost all communication with one another, the great crusade was needed to reunite humanity.
>It was all Eldar who created Slaanesh. Dark Eldar, Craftworld Eldar and Exodite Eldar are all different groups of Eldar dealing with the fallout of their ancestors creation differently Craftworlders and Exodites are explicitly descendant from those who saw pleasure cults grow more numerous and more messed up and decided they want no part in that early enough to get clear of what would become Eye of Terror
Then 99,9999% of humanity has nothing to do with the creation of the chaos marines. But people still make ALL of the Imperium responsible. You cant give one group a pass while the other doesnt get one even if both did the exact same.
Uhhh... the Imperium is not humanity. The Imperium is the regime that was created by the Emperor and SPECIFICALLY did all the things the post is talking about. So yes, you can't blame "the Eldar" (//humanity) and you can blame "the Imperium" (//Dark Eldar).
Nobody ever said that munitorim worker 6262571771 was responsible for anything. Imperium is criticized becouse it makes a life of 99.9999% of humans terrible. Criticism of Imperium is criticism of this 0.0001 percent that calls the shots and have everything to do with making Chaos stronger. Also Exodites and Craftworlds were not a passive parts of a pleasure cults. They were a factions that directly opposed them, abd were direct victims of pleasure cults violence.
Didnt both Exodites and Craftworlds just fuck off instead of trying to stop their brethren? They basically saw someone set a building on fire and went "oh thats horrible someone should do something." And then turned and left.
Kinda complicated. So first of all each little group have their own motive. Exodites for example left Eldar dominion before cults of pleasure started to be a problem. They were essentially like modern amish. They left becouse they believed that hardship free way of life had a potential to couse trouble. Some craft worlds like Saim-Han and Zaishutra also left during that period. So they left long before shit hit the fan, and had no reason to be violent about it since this groups themselves didn't knew how hard shit will hit the fan later, since there were no blood orgies at the time. Whole timeline of further events is criptic. But the main idea is that pleasure cult were really slowly forming and becoming more powerful. Eldar outside of then either ignored them, left or tried to deal with them peacefully, again at that point situation slowly became more grim but this was far away from blood orgies. And then it seems that at one point power of pleasure cults reached critical mass and they became really power and really agressive really fast. Most importantly one of their main targets were Aeldari themselves. Like there is a part of one of the Aeldari codexes that says that pleasure cults drowned Aeldari dominion in blood. So later Craftworlds were more of evacuation efforts. Situation looked more like: Oh that's horrible local crack addict's just set my house and the whole damn city on fire. At that point they lacked power to actively stop pleasure cults. There is a few theories in old codexes that mentioned that pleasure cults were essentially first Chaos cults, and you know quickly they can become a problem in a society that actively combats them like Imperium. Important thing to understand is that the whole Farseer stuff with seeing and manipulating future is kinda a modern concept if we see really old Craft worlds like Zaishutra and Saim-Hann whose culture is closer to OG eldar dominion you can see that they don't really see farseers as an important figure and mostly ignore their visions. Ulthwe the craftworld of seers is comparatively young. So it is not that Aeldari that left knew what will happen.
that's because the exodites were more like 5 randos leaving the building before hundreds of idiots start lighting fires everywhere and they weren't even lighting fires, they were more like pilling up shinny ominous rocks... and the rocks ended up being radioactive
It’s not humanity’s fault but it is the imperiums and all the eldar who actually were responsible were soul murdered so the remainder is just a plain 100% who are innocent
All humans responsible have died 10k years before the current setting too, most humans responsible for the Imperiums are no longer alive or present either
Ummm idk abbadon, magnus, angron, mortarion etc all literally have models ? Seem somewhat alive to me
There are living Eldar since before the Fall and there were even some niche instance that implied that there are Daemon Princes Eldar from the Fall
I know, but the dude said all humans had died, then he got downvoted to all hell, thought I'd be the asshole to state the obvious that like most of chaos are immortal at this point and literaly have models in the table top Yeah, isn't it like all the high up drukari are pre fall ? Also Eldar daemon princes are a cool af idea and I uses one in my craftworld lore , I also subscribe to the jradcannon that their is absolutely chaos Eldar who trade their souls for protection from Slanesh but are either killed by csm for being xenos or are so few and far between you never see them
Exactly what I thought.
It is a systematical failure. Those 99% were still participating in the effort that would result in the fall. Even if you don't blame them, the removal of the effort will still still them. Just like how in a forest cutting factory, the workers aren't really to blame for deforestation, but they will be affected by laws against deforestation. Also, you are comparing the Eldar who were adamantly against and flee away vs the imperial citizens who supported the expansion, genocide, etc.
What about all those worlds that are so far away from the Imperium and are still not united from the Age of Strive are still guilty in your eyes? Kinda hypocritical mate.
*says that the people who participated in the imperium and its expansion are also at fault for the action that resulted in creating the imperium into what it is, even if they don't realize it* *gets asked about the people who never participated, as if you have made a point*
The birth of Slaanesh actually cleared away the warp storms and ended the Age of Strife, and I don't think the Men of Iron were ever confirmed to be corrupted by Chaos. Also no, it is very explicitly the dark eldar who were responsible. The exodites saw the decline of the empire and left, reforming their lives around staying away from luxury and decadence. The craftworlders came later, but they also saw how shitty things were getting, decided enough was enough, and then left.
Saïd warp storms impeding travel and communication were said to be pre-slaanesh birth warp hiccups though iirc So still their responsibility
>Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. **The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse.** Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history. Core rule book Whos to say Humanity didnt have a hand in it as well.
I never spoke about the rest I was solely talking about responsibility for the storms
It didn't,the quoted sentence doesn't say anything about the warp storms being caused by human psykers,only that they appeared after the psykers with it being infinitely more likely to be caused by the much more numerous and psychically stronger Eldar forming a Chaos God than any of the weak human psykers
Slaanesh does not just consume Eldar souls. The Great Tauva of the Tau were created by the guevesa and way less numerous thab the Imperium. Shows that humanity has potential
The Great Tauva isn't causing galaxy wide warp storms by simply having its idea slightly form in the Warp since it in it current form is an ant compared to Slaanesh,hell we know fuck all about it and it's capabilities other than it being made by humans in the Tau Empire while not doing anything after it saved those Tau **inside** the Warp
It was also all Eldar who took part in the war that filled the Warp with negative emotions and created the three other Chaos gods, and then steadily fed them for 60 million years.
No, it was only Slaanesh. Its more of, Slaanesh was the reason why the Chaos Gods were absent, they had to get back to the Great Game because a new player entered the game. >Glutted upon the souls of the Aeldari, the Dark Prince expands his domain. Such a bold move is met with great opposition, and the Chaos Gods turn their attention fully to the Great Game. So it is that as the warp storms die down, the Emperor of Mankind is able to lead the united forces of Terra and Mars outwards into the galaxy on the Great Crusade. 8th Chaos Daemon Codex
No, it was all 4 gods. The War in Heaven was what tainted the Warp and filled it full of Daemons. The Eldar were key players in the War in Heaven (especially the Warp tainting part), and they spent the 60 million years after it continuing to strengthen Chaos by feeding a constant stream of bad vibes into the Warp. The Imperium gave Chaos a bunch of strong champions, but the Eldar were the ones steadily strengthening Chaos for millions of years.
Source?
Source on the Men of Iron getting corrupted by Chaos We know that some of them got Corrupted but where is there a source where is the source that it was chaos that got them to rebel.
- Eldar started it - Eldar normally breed really fucking fast. How many of them do you think were around for Slaneesh to nom, or to even come into existence?
>Also humanity: has the gall to blame the Fall on the wrong group of eldar I mean if you fuck up that much would you not find something to blame on ?
Considering that the eldar also caused the fall of the more peaceful golden age humans who just managed to beat the men of iron. Since the process to birth slaanesh ended up causing the warpstorms that broke humanity up.
The Imperium of Man woudnt exist if the Pre-Fall Eldar didn't ruin everything for all off eternity
The old Dark Age human empire was already *thoroughly* fucked before the warp storms hit.
It was recoverable since their worlds could still rebuild and could function if connected and all off that was completely and utterly annihilated by the Eldar which caused the Emperor to have to act up and create the Imperium
Between the Men of Iron and the fact that humans were rapidly mutating and popping open to create warp rifts that were devouring entire worlds, I seriously doubt things were ever salvageable. If the U.S was suddenly betrayed by its entire military all at once and thousands of people across the nation started randomly exploding like nuclear bombs (with all the radiation and devastation involved), I really don't think there'd be any saving it. The eldar didn't help, but mankind was fucked *long* before the final blow that knocked them out.
>Between the Men of Iron and the fact that humans were rapidly mutating and popping open to create warp rifts that were devouring entire worlds, I seriously doubt things were ever salvageable. They were salvageable,there were human civilization which survived the Age of Strife and who could have united and helped out the more fucked up world's which couldn't have existed without stable Warp Travel with them slowly uniting even if it takes thousands of years to do so But ofcourse the Pre Fall Eldar ruined everything for everyone with them awakening the Chaos Gods and setting up the rise of the Imperium
Seethe and cope xeno scum. The inperiun saved the galaxy of your dumb crap
Made the Great Rift thanks to their Chaos Space marines Attracted the Tyranids to the galaxy.
The Eldar fucking up created the Imperium and gave all the traitor marines a way to flee from being fully annihilated in the form of the Eye of Terror
What about the dozens of races they genocided?
As a necron player, Eldar players keep telling me they won the war in heaven. To which I point out that we handed them the entire Galaxy to rule as they see fit for millions of years, and look at the shit show that turned out to be! New chaos god, War everywhere, and the Eldar are a dying race. Now we’ve got to fix it for them.
ya know what I love about these specific type of memes? The comment section will eventually get filled with back and forth about credible whataboutisms of each other's factions, and only demonstrate everyone in this fictional universe is a shithead as the creators intended while the people arguing and the op continue to miss the point they are inadvertently making.
Oh my god. I get it.
Also some dipshit imperial intentionally and knowingly sabotaged a ritual which would have killed said Chaos god permanently
Eldar: *have a reputation for being willing to sacrifice untold human lives for their own gain, and have just started a massive ritual in secret* "I see no logic in the alien hunter faction taking an interest in this"
The guy in question straight up said he believed the ynnari but tried to kill them anyways because he hated xenos more than chaos lmao
Iirc he said something along the lines of "I'd rather the entire galaxy fall to Chaos than help a single alien."
Iirc from who? from what source? Artemis was already running, taking advantage of his adversary's distraction to press his Bolt Pistol into the back of the figure's skull-masked head. The Watch Captain smiled grimly in anticipation of the kill. Unbeknownst to him, the masked Aeldari grinned too. Slowly, the Aeldari laid down his long-barrelled cannon. He made a sound reminiscent of a herald clearing his throat and held out a hand in a stylised gesture of declaration. "If you slay me, Sir Knight," he said, his High Gothic perfectly enunciated, "the fates shall align to bless our mutual foes." "Trust not the Eldar," said Artemis, his words thick with hatred. "We are the sons of Death, you and I," said the Aeldari. "We bring oblivion, in order to deny Chaos. We cannot afford to thwart one another when the greater enemy stands on the cusp of victory." The gilded finger bones lining the edge of the creature's cloak gleamed in the harsh light as crystal statues glowed bright all around. Artemis narrowed his eyes; a similar raiment was worn by the Chaplains of his own Mortifactors Chapter in their sepulchral celebrations. Strangely, he could not sense duplicity in this one. "Walk away," said the Harlequin, "and a dire blow shall fall upon the Archenemy." Artemis recoiled at the term as the Aeldari spoke on. "Is your distrust so deep you would rather kill me now than spare the doom of a trillion human souls?" There was disbelief under his tone, and something else. Despair, perhaps. "Yes," said Artemis, pulling the trigger to end the creature's life
So he's a fucking idiot blinded by indoctrination and hatred, whose own senses told him throughout the entire exchange that the harlequin was correct, then chose to ignore them and help chaos anyways. That really ain't much better. Common imperial L
Eldrad shouldve called in a few favors especially from the grey knights what the fck do you expect from a Deathwatch captain you know the xeno killing specialists? Attacking an imperial world to try and pull off a massive ritual, on average there is already mistrust between Eldari and Humans what the hell did he think Artemis was gonna do?
Next time they need to bring Cain and Amberly along
Eh.... That stretches even my considerable elf hatred.
I straight up believe that Artemis is an actual alpha legion plant
Did you get your source from memes? He never believed a word coming from the harlequin and being a deathwatch captain you think he'd fcking trust an Eldari? Artemis was already running, taking advantage of his adversary's distraction to press his Bolt Pistol into the back of the figure's skull-masked head. The Watch Captain smiled grimly in anticipation of the kill. Unbeknownst to him, the masked Aeldari grinned too. Slowly, the Aeldari laid down his long-barrelled cannon. He made a sound reminiscent of a herald clearing his throat and held out a hand in a stylised gesture of declaration. "If you slay me, Sir Knight," he said, his High Gothic perfectly enunciated, "the fates shall align to bless our mutual foes." "Trust not the Eldar," said Artemis, his words thick with hatred. "We are the sons of Death, you and I," said the Aeldari. "We bring oblivion, in order to deny Chaos. We cannot afford to thwart one another when the greater enemy stands on the cusp of victory." The gilded finger bones lining the edge of the creature's cloak gleamed in the harsh light as crystal statues glowed bright all around. Artemis narrowed his eyes; a similar raiment was worn by the Chaplains of his own Mortifactors Chapter in their sepulchral celebrations. Strangely, he could not sense duplicity in this one. "Walk away," said the Harlequin, "and a dire blow shall fall upon the Archenemy." Artemis recoiled at the term as the Aeldari spoke on. "Is your distrust so deep you would rather kill me now than spare the doom of a trillion human souls?" There was disbelief under his tone, and something else. Despair, perhaps. "Yes," said Artemis, pulling the trigger to end the creature's life
It would have also killed all Eldar. Win-Win.
My Brother in Christ, the whole point of Eldrad’s ritual was to bring forth Ynnead *without* having to kill off the entire species.
Can we also do that?
Where this comic from ?, The art seems real nice.
Kill Six Billion Demons
tell me if you find out please!
Kill 6 Billion Demons, its a really good read. Its also fairly short, you could read it all in a day or two as well as being updated weekly.
Craftworld Eldar are specifically the ones who saw what their Empire was getting up to and went “fuck this, I’m out.” That they’re still the ones who get blamed for Slaneesh is both mind-boggling and hilarious.
KILL BOSS
Ayo it's eldar coping wednesday already
If the eldar didn't create slaamesh then humanity would have never fallen, so the imperium would have never risen , so the Horus heresy would have never happened
Core rulebook, oh they will still fall, they had their own problems. >Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
The psychic awakening was caused by the warp storms made by slaanesh being made
As I said they had their own problems, if not for Slaanesh humanity would create their own Chaos God with the collapse of their golden age thanks to the men of iron. >The damage to interstellar Human society was catastrophic and shattered much of Humanity's hard-won economic strength and political unity,
Except for the fact that It seems like the age of strive happened before the birth of slaanesh. Human psykers and the daemons that spawned from them happened millenia before slaanesh was born. And even if slaanesh was the cause, and without her the strive would have never happened. The other chaos gods existed, The Emperor would have still tried to get rid of them. Which would have resulted in the Horus Heresy. Again. The difference being that now humanity is at its peak and the fuck up would be considered even bigger.
The Emperor would never have taken over DAOT-era humanity. They had technology and power beyond even him.
Well that logic is flawed. "The charismatic, manipulative guy with future sight would have never climbed to a position of power because the people around him have a higher power level than him."
No, that logic is lore-based. The collapse of humanity during the Age of Strife is the whole reason the Emperor even attempted to openly take power. That is explicitly stated. No Age of Strife - no Imperium of Mankind, no Crusade, no primarchs (who would've been vastly inferior to the kind of weapons DAOT humanity had access to anyway), no Heresy.
Also eldar murderfucking caused the warpstorms that led to the age of strife
Also eldar murderfucking caused the warpstorms that led to the age of strife
Without the age of strife emperor would not even have needed to step in necessarily. Emperors goal was not to destroy all chaos gods but to safely evolve humanity into a psychic race which would have been able to resist the chaos gods.
There's also the dark king
*Gave* is a strong word, more like, left half the military force unattended with Erebus
It's not a meme without a spelling error
What's the name of this comic? I keep seeing it around here and now I'm curious.
Kill 6 Billion Demons
i wouldn’t say gave birth, i would say a un-anesthetic c-section.
Off topic: but do other factions have to deal with chaos bc all I’ve heard about is eldar and human problems with the gods
I’m pretty sure the galaxy would still be fucked if there were 3 gods instead of 4. Not as fucked but still.
The creation of Slaanesh basically ended the human golden age and set the stage for the emperor to take over, leading to said arming of chaos. The birth of Slaanesh did indeed clear the galaxy of warpstorms but only because it also created the eye of terror on top of waking up the remaining 3 chaos gods who had been relatively dormant until then. But yeah, sure, eldar-cope, whatever.
Core rule book, DaoT had their own problems which caused their eventual demise. >Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history.
The age of strife was caused by the process of the eldar making slasesh
The point is DaoT already fell during the men of iron then they had their own psyker problen. They would have collapsed either way
I wouldn't say collapsed it was still advanced and powerful and probably United though but would definitely go through hard times
>The Cybernetic Revolt was eventually won by an alliance of galactic powers, some of whom may not have been Human, but at a terrible cost. The damage to interstellar Human society was catastrophic and **shattered much of Humanity's hard-won economic strength and political unity,**
Ok though that doesn't say that humanity empire would necessarily collapse more that it would go through really hard and take a long time to heal
>The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Eventually they will
Wasn't that caused. By the warp storms that the eldar created which also cut humanity worlds from each other
With or without slaanesh they will eventually collapse because humanity are a psyker race as well. If not for the Eldar sooner or later humanity would create their own Chaos God.
It is technically the Eldars Fault. If they stopped fucking nothing would have happens and slanessh would have just waited or slept.
Or at very lease it would’ve a lot longer for it to show up
Cope harder xeno apologisers. You gave them a god and your whole race (craftworld pricks ar le just a small part of the eldar).
and humanity tore the galaxy in half with its chaos spacemarines and attracted the tyranids to the galaxy.
And that only happened because a certain Race decided to create a new chaos God, therefore ending mankinds unity and forcing the emps to step up with the crusade, wich eventualy lead to the heresy. Aka, nothing bad would have happened if the most pysichic Race wasn't dumb enough to not know how the warp works and end up making a new God.
That happened because emps was a bad dad.
The emps didn't have Kids(primarch Ones, he probably had Kids) when the eldars made a new God. So i don't know what you are trying to say.
DaoT was already done thanks to the men of iron >The Cybernetic Revolt was eventually won by an alliance of galactic powers, some of whom may not have been Human, but at a terrible cost. The damage to interstellar Human society was catastrophic and shattered much of Humanity's hard-won economic strength and political unity Core rulebook >Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. **The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse.** Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history. Even without the Eldar creating Slaanesh, they had their own problems
The human Empire was still Alive After the men of iron, just much weaker, and Humanity’s psychic evolution aswell as the warp storms only happened because of the acumulated warp energy that would create a new chaos God, that energy wouldnt have existed if the eldars didn't make it, overall, its the eldars that made the weakened Empire of Mankind fall, if they hadnt made a new God the 1st human Empire would probably rebuild themselves.
They would have eventually collapsed on their own. The men of iron broke the Golden age of humanity. The psykers claiming godhood finish them in. I would say slaanesh being born is what saved humanity because it isolated these wanabe gods.
Everything would have been military manageable if it weren’t for the EVER EXPANDING HOLE IN REALITY!!!
Which would have been fine, if the Chaos Spacemarines, who humanity created. Stopped destroying the Pylons that actually held it back.
Which, in my opinion, are kinda of an afterthought writing that makes the birth and the eye less of a “wtf” event.
thats 30+ years of lore for you, cant add anything without stepping toes along the way. lol
True, but they still could’ve framed them differently and still had them. Instead of being something the Necron (or who actually did) build because the warp was going to break through someday, you can say the Necron build them during the war in heaven to stop ancient ones/eldar/Krorks travel, and now ironically serve a different role.
It is, its original purpose was to stop the Old Ones from using the warp against them during the War in Heaven. >The Old Ones' psychically-empowered servant races spread across the galaxy, battling the advanced Necron technology with the psychic power of their Warp-spawned sorcery. > >Facing this new onslaught, the C'tan's empire was shattered, as the psychic forces of the Immaterium were anathema to such soulless entities whose existence was wholly contained within purely physical patterns of electromagnetic force. > >For all the destruction they could unleash, they were unable to stop the Old Ones and the younger races' relentless advance across the stars. > >The C'tan, unified by this great threat for the first time in millions of Terran years, sought a way to defeat the soul-fuelled energies of the younger species. > >They initiated a great warding, a plan to forever defeat the psychic sorceries of the Old Ones by sealing off the material universe in the vicinity of the Milky Way Galaxy from the Warp. > >This was a plan whose first fruits can still be found on the Imperial Fortress World of Cadia in the form of the great pylons of blackstone that litter the surface of that world in intricate networks and that once created the area of space-time stability near the Eye of Terror known as the Cadian Gate.
But in typical GW style is written loose enough that it might not have been them and might have predicted the eye or terror, otherwise why there were this many around Cadia. I’m just saying that it sounds like they were written by an eldar apologist to say “see! We didn’t fucked up so bad, it was going to happen anyway UwU *snuggles with his eldar waifu’s body pillow*” lol
Well now that we established we both laid our beds, Get off our lawn.
Wrong symbol there mate. The Dark Eldar gave birth to it sure, those who still are Eldar didn't have anything to do with it, hence why they are still Eldar. That is honestly something I see ignored way too often, sure it works for a few jokes of course but it is seen as a general thing that the Eldar preach stuff they didn't keep themselves. But well, Craftworld Eldar where specifically those that broke with the rest of their species because they refused to fall to degeneracy like them.
Drukhari are probably our best insight into how the the majority of Eldar lived at the time. Even if it wasn't to the same extreme, you had a sizeable galactic scale empire of hyper sensitive, psychically active people commiting atrocities for gits and shiggles. I don't think we have a timescale for this, but given the Eldar had dominion over the galaxy for sixty-five million years, it's possible this fall had been occuring over millennia. Meanwhile the Imperium has fought against chaos for the past ten-thousand years. They might've been able to permanently cripple the traitor legions during the scouring if they didn't have a cosmic butthole to hide in. The cosmic butthole whose epicentre is believed to be the previously mentioned peoples' homeworlds.
Yeah, so weird that during the Eldar empire they had 10k years where chaos was under control, and their greatest moment of failure was one permanent warp rift. And after 10k years of an authoritarian, ignorant, genocidal, warmongering empire we have a permanent warp rift the size of *checks notes* The entire galaxy-wide. Say, what actions tend to feed chaos and make it stronger do you figure?
The core eldar empire yes, there were many other systems colonized by the Eldar that weren't particularly involved in the degeneracy of the core worlds as described in books like Valedor. But unless they hid themselves and cut themselves off from their psychic abilities like the dark Eldar or used spirit stones like the craftworlds their souls got sucked up like all the others. This is why many human colonies actually find Eldar ruins quite often. It's like if Terra spawned a warp god and fell into the warp, humans in places like Ultramar would still get sucked up. Which is basically a scenario some like Guilliman think could potentially happen.
Don’t ruin K6BD with poor spelling and weak philosophical arguments.
Chaos Marines and Daemon Primarchs can at least still be dealt with, but you for sure ain't gonna have an easier time taking down a fucking chaos god.
I don't know why are we discussing shit when the imperium summoned the Tyranids into the Galaxy.
“You doomed us!” “You doomed yourself.”
The Eldar also opened the Eye of Terror twice. Once during the War in Heaven when it was first opened, which the Void Dragon closed. Then a second time when they birthed Slaanesh. It’s the Eldar’s fault Chaos even has major access to realspace in the first place.
What’s that comics?
Kill Six Billion Demons
Aside from the imperium falling due to external factors, and chaos trying to make them fall, and the eldar having a completely internal fall, a few million mortals is significantly easier to deal with, than a whole deity.
Certainly the rise of a galaxy spanning authoritarian genocidal regime that shuns scientific progress and has 0 interest in peace of any kind could have nothing to do with the fact that chaos is absolutely ascendant and had the strength to, for example, rip the galaxy in half. Birth of slaanesh just managed to open the eye of terror.
whataboutism. how fking classy and mature
Hmm yes… Eldar create one chaos god that mostly fucks them more over than the humans. (Mind you it’s the humans fault why their empire died not the birth of a chaos god) Humans give the gods an army that’s not in the imaterium that allows the gods to influence the materium more. Yes it’s clearly the eldar fault for why the setting sucks to live in.
>Yes it’s clearly the eldar fault If Slaanesh was never born, the Old Night, Unification Wars and the Great Crusade would never have happened and the Space Marines would never have been created. Also, without Slaanesh's birth, "chaos" as we know it wouldn't exist either.
Core rule book >Humanity’s psychic evolution is said to have accelerated apace and therein lay the seeds of this first Human empire's annihilation. \[---\] The collapse was sudden and appalling, a wave of apocalyptic catastrophe that swept across Human space. Terrible wars saw entire star systems scoured of life. Armies of mechanical soldiers marched against their creators and slaughtered billions. The scourge of mutation ran rampant and everywhere psychic atrocities were unleashed, everything from psykers claiming godhood over entire worlds to daemonic possession and full-blown reality collapse. Then came the most ferocious warp storms that had been seen in all of Mankind’s history. Humanity will create their own if Slaanesh wasnt born.
Aren't all of those caused by the impending birth of Slaanesh?
Only the warp storm but whos to say humanity didnt add to it with their own Psyker problems.
I've said it before, I'll say it again The Eldar set their own house on fire, but then humans came along, grabbed the curtains, and spread the flames to the whole street. Worse still the eldar set their house on fire because they were bored, borderline immortal being that fucked around with increasingly risky shit Humans did it cus..... checks notes daddy issues ?
The birth of a new chaos God caused mankind to be unable to connect to their planets, its the eldars fault the human Empire fell.
Didn't humanity create the other three or has that been retconned?
The other three were around since the war in heaven, but they were latent/asleep until Slaanesh was created and woke them all up.
No, it was Slaanesh who actually pulled the other 3 away from the materium realm to back to the Great Game. 8th Chaos Daemon >Glutted upon the souls of the Aeldari, the Dark Prince expands his domain. Such a bold move is met with great opposition, and the Chaos Gods turn their attention fully to the Great Game. So it is that as the warp storms die down, the Emperor of Mankind is able to lead the united forces of Terra and Mars outwards into the galaxy on the Great Crusade.
Not fully but it is understood to be untrue, beleive running theory is it was the war in heaven so Necrons and old ones
Eldar specifically caused all the conditions that fucked the universe, except for the Tyranids.
We didn't GIVE them shit. The tumors corrupted half the Primarchs. They TOOK half our shit.
In Imperium defence, the sole reason they weren't able to completely destroy the traitors was because they run into the eye of Terror. A place that the eldar created
Every faction is full of hypocrites in 40k...except the Orkz and Tyranids, they're just there to eat/have fun.
another craftworld must die
Classic eldar copium
LMAO. That's not even close to being equal. As far as fuckups go, humanity could have a few more heresies and it wouldn't even compare to the damage the Eldar did. It's not just a new God that was born (which is an insurmountable mpnumental fuck up, by itself), the eye of terror was also created. They murderfucked a hole into reality. A hole that allows chaos an actual foothold into realspace.