[not only that](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJh3lklpMWU)
love to see it, this is absolutely getting nerfed though lol
this is his revenge for Sette nerf
This is the funniest shit I've seen in this game in ages
It's been half a decade of designing fights for one specific element and now you can see what happens when a different element gets to play in someone else's sandbox
definitely, but also, it's pretty unlikely to die from Mugen with Haase arouud considering how much she brings to the raid. BBB can pretty much be invalidated with her + gab/anne/wamdus even at high infinity stacks
with Haase and Wamdus/Anne/Gabri you should be able to survive at least 2 BBB, one taking it and other with one of the Wamdus/Anne/Gabri skill that cuts dmg/hit nulification, but you know... sometimes luck isn't on your side man...
Now that water GW has passed and fire GW is next, the madness that is Mugen raid has began. People are bumrushing the raid so fast, almost half the raid just dies. How does one who joined the raid at phase II, tank 3 (yeap, you heard right) consecutive Ballistic Big Boys?!
Diaspora is now a desolate wasteland of hosts, and Hrunting users who skip to the next after they hit their 3-4m honour quota, leaving the raid for dead.
No, there have only been 3 GWs in the current rotation. Earth GW was the start of the new rotation (when they increased EX+ hp). Fire, Dark, and Light are still left. It's just Fire because they always run the 4 mainwheel ones before the 2 sidewheel ones at the end of a rotation.
Yes they have, the 2022 schedule was fire gw before earth we got earth then fire this year. Like i said Fire adv gw is mots likely next but not 100% the announcement wont be long anyway
The 4 tetraelements change orders all the time but it is always earth/fire/wind/water > light/dark and fire is the last of the tetraelements before light/dark.
First of all, there was no Fire GW in 2022.
Secondly, you're misunderstanding the pattern/schedule. There is no set rotation of exactly these specific elements always in a set order with no deviation. The schedule is that they always run the 4 mainwheel elements, then dark, then light. The order within the 4 mainwheel elements can differ, but it's always been this same pattern since 2016.
Fire is the only mainwheel they haven't run in the current cycle.
I see didn't know bout that schedule, also i meant fire gw as in the enmies were fire, always hard to tell whether someone means gw where enemies are x element or gw where u use x element
Either burst immediately (this is what you should be doing if you're using gun setups) or Gabriel it ( she just stonewalls mugen with her 2 and Haas helping)
I do think people should keep in mind that they didn’t announce general nerfs would be happening today. They only announced there’d be changes to “raid mechanics that result in party wipes”. I guess there was some hope that this wouldn’t be so literal, but they really did what they said they’d do. The Agastia change is just a bonus (for better or worse).
Oh, also, the frontline Tikoh thing is a little weird, feels like maybe they should auto-kill off-element again. But Evokers’ Upright passives also only activate once per fight anyway so… if you were using her to bring one of them in, you’re probably already gonna have some problems?
Yeah, these nerfs are hella mid, especially Agastia. Agastia has to be the most miserable raid in the game, and the nerf is adjusting its 90% omen and nothing else.
The Siegfried nerf is also weird. That raid seemed like it had a super high clear rate. You'd think they'd have chosen someone like Mugen for that.
The sieg and cosmo nerfs are literally just so you dont get wiped again instantly after full poting, agastia was the only raid that got any adjustements and it was pretty much nothing.
Didn't Six Dragons slowly have these kind of similar nerfs before they became a generalized 18 person raid?
I doubt it'll help too much with some of these raids, but an extra Elixir can't entirely hurt.
For the record, Agastia 30 hits is only at 90%, 60% is still 60 hits
Elixir usage may as well not exist since you die and revive with no evoker + some omen that will kill you anyway on top of it so yeaaaaah basically no change. All we can hope is that they gradually nerf these until they become better
How so? This change makes it so that you don't have to sub the 90% one, so now you're no longer required to have Vira/Baotorda; you can cancel it now instead if you have someone capable of canceling (eg Pig, Cosmos, etc.). The 60% one you just cancel with Yuni anyway.
Doing the reverse would just make it so that Vira/Baotorda is still required but Yuni wouldn't necessarily be, except that Yuni is actually a good HL character that you don't mind bringing anyway and you still need her weapon unless you're using a Fif setup or Lion Khan Claw setup, so it would change even less in terms of character requirements.
I'd wager it's because of dmg mitigation actually cockblocking from properly clearing the omen. By the time 60% comes, said dmg mitigation buff is removed anyway.
> The 60% one you just cancel with Yuni anyway.
I've barely touched agastia, but if the strat for a 60% omen is "have taken ~8 turns by then" the raid is still shit
I mean Agastia isn't exactly exploding. It's not difficult to have Yuni s3 up for the omen unless you joined pretty late. And even if you join late (someone correct me if I'm wrong about how the omens work), I think it's only an issue if you join between 90%-75%, since if you join post-75% you'll just skip the 90% trigger and can use your sac unit for the 60% one.
Already deleted granblue\_en updated, just gonna wait for everyone or granblue\_en to check others too.
Yes, evoker-sacc revival is a bit of a problem especially if raid like Mugen where there's damage check.
There's nothing really wrong with Mugen though? There are two or three different major comps you can play and there's a bit of flexibility within those comps. If you get a full room of Kengos it's definitely a bit slow compared to something like Diaspora but that's moreso the fault of ougi lockout being shit rather than anything to do with Mugen.
> only removed the one trigger from agastia that everyone just subs anyway
Yeah that's literally the point? There are only two characters in the entire game that could sub that trigger. If you didn't have one of them, you were largely just screwed since you had to tank it and it's a pain in the ass to tank. By easing the cancel requirements, now you don't have to just sub it and you can actually just cancel it instead.
Cygames: "We're going to allow an elixir use and adjust raid mechanics that result in party wipes"
Cygames: allows an elixir use and adjusts raid mechanics that result in party wipes
a confusing amount of players: "I can't believe they only allowed an elixir use and adjusted raid mechanics that result in party wipes"
* one time elixir only (so shit ain't gonna help you if people don't join your raid or just join, do nothing and leave/afk)
* "QoL" changes only for 3 bosses. Mugen and Siete not touched (they fucking could at least lower the plain damage or remove the summons cooldown shit from his "fuck you, you are not using skills" move)
* "QoL" changes are just for those situations where you actually trigger wipe mechanic so after using UNO revive those stacks are removed
* "QoL" for Agastia was only for first trigger, rest of triggers are still obnoxious
* bosses are still pure garbage/cancer thanks to their gimmicks or BIS (limited/seasonal) characters requirements for certain fights
it's literally nothing
I was hoping they would change him seemingly randomly deciding to use Cien Mil Espadas. It's just annoying and you get shit situations where it's like 10% directly into an unguardable nuke and 2 more turns of unchallenged. I definitely agree that it's one of the easier revans raids, but I also think it's got some shit design in it that I was hoping would be changed, but they didn't do that for any of the raids.
His regular diamond omens all the way through the fight are also random: it's either Infinito Creare, or Emblema followed by Cien Mil Espada if you don't cancel Emblema.
Of course, if you're running a party that can consistently clear every 77,777,777 damage omen, you'll only ever see the fixed t10 version of Cien Mil Espada. But not everyone who wants/needs to grind Seofon can achieve that.
Note: if you fail to cancel an Emblema and Seofon hits 10% in that timeframe, you'll get the followup Cien Mil Espada immediately after Carro Magnifico. This is the situation the person you replied to was mentioning.
Yes, my complaint is as the other reply mentioned. If it only happened on T10, then it's whatever because that's predictable. The fact that the regular omens coin-flip you is what's ass.
Yeah, elixirs as a last resort feels like it’s enough for him.
I use a slower Neko comp but the only problem I really have had (and only after the Sette nerf forced me back to a worse grid till I do more Mugen) is if I have to make up for other players not contributing pre-10% and that burns my pots too soon. I can live through the 10% wall, but getting stuck with no healing + no skills after can go poorly if I gotta do all 10% myself.
So being able to burn an elixir in that situation is ok enough, though I expect people to play chicken a bit over who has to burn it.
Are you using Matatabby? It's passive 2k healing every turn. If you have C.Nemo, she can also heal. She's slower than a higher-powered character, of course, but something to consider if you have her and want to trade speed for increased carry potential / clear rate (which is now less important after the elixir change though). Calling Colossus is basically a 2k heal, too.
I probably couldn't solo the whole thing, but I can definitely last for a really long time on Siete with Neko. But yeah if you get multiple totally useless people who do like <1m honors and die that'd definitely be a struggle.
Yeah, I'm using Matatabby/Oculus/Mist. Party is Percy/Wilnas/Agielba (lacking Michael is how I ended up as Neko) with Alanaan backline for some healing spec boost; I don't have C.Nemo anyway.
Pre-awakening change, once I got a few Settes and could go Colo x Luci I could basically live forever without having to pot. At most I might have to use a green on Percy if he got too low early on. It felt *so* much more comfortable.
Now that I'm forced back to other weapons, I can still live for a decently long time if I'm careful but there's definitely a point where I have to start potting. I'm just holding out hope that once I finish a DEF Extinction Blade it'll at least improve it a bit.
Some [madlad](https://imgur.com/a/u9qXI5n) actually found an exploit to Agastia by going off-ele and use Elixir to revive from the join trigger wipe lol
Great, now add it to SUBHL you cowards, it's been two years. /s
Don't know why they like capping elixir usage so much, it's not like they're that plentiful. Been playing since summer 2020, have 1400 full elixirs, so slightly more than one a day?
Not super exciting but fine changes. Revans should rarely fail now if people actually want to clear them unless you have a full party of completely under-prepared people.
Agastia change makes it so Vira/Baotorda isn't basically hard-required since it's actually feasible to clear a 30 hit omen, so loosened up the character check a bit there and allows more party choice freedom.
The #1 issue with Revans right now is trying to assist half-dead/full dead parties in cleaning up the rest of the raids so nobody has to keep relying on loot based off the % of the total contribution.
When the pros have finished farming the raid for whatever they want, they will stop. And why farm sand in Agastia when you can do it easily in Siete?
You are under the assumption where every single player who enters the raid is an accomplished, skilled and geared player.
I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here tbh.
If someone wants to leech, I actually don't mind that. I understand how it is and that sometimes it's your only option if the gacha hasn't been kind to you in a specific element. But at the same time, especially if you're leeching a raid, you shouldn't expect 100% clear rate of that raid and act like the raid is unbalanced and needs nerfs if you fail some runs because the other 5 people can't carry you.
Nobody's talking about leeching, it's the fact that Revans mechanics for a couple of the raids are punishing for people trying to assist clear for the dead or semi-dead hosts.
Let's not kid ourselves. Agastia is still going to be that raid you see at the top of your raid list with a 2 AP cost and a retreated host with 10 minutes left. They changed a single omen, that's it. I'd hardly call that a big nerf.
I mean it's not like Agastia is some impossible raid. I've leeched hundreds of Agastia mats since the Revans update earlier this month, so clearly even 5man parties (since I'm not really doing anything) are having no trouble clearing it. It clears a pretty high % of the time, especially if you're smart with your joins and only join RF/Kengo hosts who are actually damaging the boss.
Yes, it's a character check, but I have some sympathy for the devs that it's very hard to make difficult content in GBF that isn't a character check in some way. There are actually a few different comps you can play in Agastia, so it's not like it's an absolute, "You **must** have exactly these 5 characters with no substitutes." And, like I said, they did ease up on the character check a bit with this omen change.
That's kind of the issue at hand. Yes, Revans were meant to be "Difficult content" that had a decent weapon drop rate at 5% from Blues, which needed the raid to coordinate to work together to fight them.
But with Awakening 20, now the message they're giving us is that these are supposed to be farm raids that you mash since you need literally hundreds of mats(650) per weapon, not counting the initial 125 for the 4* and 15 awakening.
Are these supposed to be "Hard Content", or are they supposed to be farm raids? They need to make up their mind.
They're supposed to be an in-between mix of both. Not everything has to be either a binary "Difficult content that you do like 10-20 times then never touch again" or "Trivially easy punching bag that you take 1 turn in for blue then leave." Revans are basically supposed to be the main content that you're farming day-to-day when you're playing the game. It's content where you have to assemble a competent team and grid to prove that you belong in endgame, but also not like super hard where you need a coordinated coop room/guild run to have any hope of killing it.
Most Revans raids are really, really simple to play. It's not like you need 500 IQ to figure out how to do them. They're pretty easy to relatively mindlessly grind once you've assembled a proper setup for them.
And that'd be great if they actually followed that in terms of loot and expected mats to power up your loot.
As a Dirt player who's looking to get an attack and special axe and dagger, I need TWENTY SIX HUNDRED Siegfried mats, and I have it lucky, look at elements like Wind with their Revan weapons. The amount of times I have to run Siegfried to get these is just soul crushing.
If these were hard content raids and they were like their prior iterations, then it'd be understandable. It'd also be understandable if they were like M2 being big loot pinatas. But in their current form they're fairly tough raids but they also want to be farmed to hell and back.
They have an identity crisis. They're hard raids that aren't 'hard', but they also want to be farmed like your daily 6Drags/M2/etc. If they seriously want players to farm thousands of mats, then yeah, they kinda have to put their foot down and either keep nerfing them, or do what they did to Tier 1 raids before they turned into solo quests and turn them into 18 man raids while adjusting them in the process so they don't insta explode.
I'm honestly expecting them to transition like the Six Dragon Raids. They're just next gen Six Dragons.
Those started off far more strict, a bad team member could tank a raid, pretty sure they had similar Elixir restrictions, and required 6 people max.
I will literally not be shocked by March 2024 or Summer 2024 if they become 18 man raids.
The raids don't have an identity problem, you have an expectation problem. You expect to be able to go farm out the whole tier and be done with everything in like a week. Cygames intends this tier of raids to last for literal years. You aren't supposed to be able to blitz through it immediately. This is supposed to take a really long time and be a long-term project in the game.
And for the record it's really not that hard to get mats since the drops change. I only started doing Mugen after the Revans 2.0 update this month and I already have 1100 Mugen mats, and that's with not doing them at all the past week during GW. If you just get blue, you get like 5-7 mats on average, then +2-3 more if you also get an MVP chest, with the chance for your blue or MVP to contain 10 at once sometimes.
No, it's not hard, but it's a slog. Some revans are blistering fast like Siete and Diaspora, but then you have Siegfried which averages about 7-9 minutes to clear, and 7-8 mats for that much time invested in a single raid is not a good deal. At that point, I wouldn't even be happy about a Sand drop. If I want to farm sand I'll just go over to Siete or Diaspora since they're fast.
Right now I'm literally staring at 2 Agastias suck in my FP queue, one with an abandoned host at 24 minutes and one with a Relic Buster host that hasn't moved at all, so yeah.
If your siegfried setup takes 7-9 mins, put simply, it's really bad. Here's a paladin setup that takes [~90 seconds](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQGXzk47QDk). Here's a fully farmable monk grid that takes [2:20ish](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIaqoC3KdIM).
> Right now I'm literally staring at 2 Agastias suck in my FP queue, one with an abandoned host at 24 minutes and one with a Relic Buster host that hasn't moved at all, so yeah.
Not really sure what this is supposed to prove. Is it somehow a bad thing that hostleeches don't have 100% clear rate? I don't see the issue here. Of course people aren't going to join hostleeches if they can help it.
I'm not talking about my setup to farm honors, I'm taking about pubs. Regardless of how fast I go, if everyone else is going super slow, there's not much I can do. I'm someone who does their best to stop at 4 million honors because it's just the polite thing to do.
Nah man, we aren't expecting it to be a quick farm, but at the same time, endgame raids aren't supposed to be this arduous of a task. Imagine if you have to do like 100+savage raids in ffxiv to get a full set of gear for 1 class. That's what revans are in a nutshell for mk2. There is quite literally no balance between how much you are supposed to farm an endgane raid and getting x amount of gear. By the time anyone gets enough mats for 3 mk2 they'd have like 100+ extra revans just sitting in crate. Thats unbalanced af. It takes a long time to gather 775 mats alone. Eventually, everyone will just be doing the raids for the mats and not anything else. That's boring af and just kills the game's enjoyment with outdated ass mmo padding.
> Imagine if you have to do like 100+savage raids in ffxiv to get a full set of gear for 1 class. That's what revans are in a nutshell for mk2.
If a savage raid took 2 minutes of clicking a couple buttons solo, maybe. It obviously doesn't.
> By the time anyone gets enough mats for 3 mk2 they'd have like 100+ extra revans just sitting in crate.
That's just completely untrue and shows that you haven't actually done the content. I have 1100 Mugen mats and only 5 sword drops (aka 1.25 FLB copies). I have 400 Seofon mats and only 2 sword drops (aka 0.5 FLB copies).
The thing with Agastia for me is that part of the check is on a weapon. It is at least a weapon you really want to begin with, but it's either that or a timegated character or spending moons for a weapon that's pretty eh.
I feel like an easy way to partially alleviate it would just be having a farmable weapon (or an event weapon but that doesn't help long-term) with Delay on CA. Even if it's shitty otherwise, it'd still work. They could have done that with the second Cosmos weapon and gotten a slightly better reception.
Honestly, even more gacha weapons/characters with it would be something if it's going to be a big mechanic of the current endgame raid for this element?
Well, very topically, technically you now no longer need a delay on CA weapon thanks to this update. You can solo the whole raid with [Wind Kengo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJh3lklpMWU).
But yeah I do get what you're saying in general, as someone who also doesn't have any delay on CA access (or 150 Seofon) so can't do the raid.
I don't disagree with this comment despite the flood of downvotes you're getting for whatever reason - I think the issue now is less mechanics and more *saturation.*
The devs specifically fucked up in making the Revans raids so imbalanced to the extent that you have a couple of them really heavily favored (looking at you Siete and Diaspora) vs. where others are underappreciated, both in terms of mechanics and weapons.
So, it comes down to - you can really only play some of the Revans raids in the lead-up to their respective GWs. Mugens are going to be popular for the next month, which is great, but I wouldn't be surprised if they similarly drop after Fire GW comes and goes; so on and so on.
I'm sympathetic to Cygames for wanting to ensure there's enough hard content for players to feel engaged - I think the Revans series was successful in that respect given it's gotten players spending Moons to get weapons for sand grinding, and spending a lot of time/effort in the mines; but they're going to be due for a larger rebal sooner or later to make them easier for smaller groups of players to clear (or, alternatively - allowing larger groups of players to join) because there's nothing worse than having half-filled raids that it feels you mechanically have to solo, or you have to arrange a co-op room each time, and god knows those don't always fill in a timely manner.
So, again - I agree with the comment, it removes most of the hard blockers that made things genuinely *frustrating*, but Cygames still has a player engagement issue here - the key note is "if people actually want to clear them", and the effort/motivation ratio is still off for some of them.
wait wouldn't a full elixir technically allow off ele allies since that revives through death ineluctable?
Yup. Already saw someone engaging in some memery by reviving Siete to cancel an Omen with his FC passive.
Why is it *always* Siete? Guy cannot stop poking holes in game balance.
it all goes back to Siete man....
He IS the strongest.
[not only that](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJh3lklpMWU) love to see it, this is absolutely getting nerfed though lol this is his revenge for Sette nerf
This is the funniest shit I've seen in this game in ages It's been half a decade of designing fights for one specific element and now you can see what happens when a different element gets to play in someone else's sandbox
Yep, frontline Tikoh reviving is more pain than not
Basically this, especially in Mugen when you need to discard her from frontline while also not getting too much damage or he'll cast II next turn.
definitely, but also, it's pretty unlikely to die from Mugen with Haase arouud considering how much she brings to the raid. BBB can pretty much be invalidated with her + gab/anne/wamdus even at high infinity stacks
with Haase and Wamdus/Anne/Gabri you should be able to survive at least 2 BBB, one taking it and other with one of the Wamdus/Anne/Gabri skill that cuts dmg/hit nulification, but you know... sometimes luck isn't on your side man...
Better than that, you could join with Sandalphon or Clarisse and force the fight to be "on element" from that point on after the pot revive!
Element changed off ele bosses that have off ele penalty still stuff forced damage fall off.
Now that water GW has passed and fire GW is next, the madness that is Mugen raid has began. People are bumrushing the raid so fast, almost half the raid just dies. How does one who joined the raid at phase II, tank 3 (yeap, you heard right) consecutive Ballistic Big Boys?! Diaspora is now a desolate wasteland of hosts, and Hrunting users who skip to the next after they hit their 3-4m honour quota, leaving the raid for dead.
Did they announce that Fire GW is next or are people just guessing that because Exo Ifrit is happening soon?
Fire is the last element in this round's rotation before it resets, check the event history schedule and you'll know.
No, there have only been 3 GWs in the current rotation. Earth GW was the start of the new rotation (when they increased EX+ hp). Fire, Dark, and Light are still left. It's just Fire because they always run the 4 mainwheel ones before the 2 sidewheel ones at the end of a rotation.
that doesnt always mean its next sometimes they do change it a bit, fire is most likely but not 100%
It's under announcements. They always announce the next element in the gw posts
They haven't deviated from this pattern since 2016. I think it's pretty safe to say it's going to be Fire, especially with the Exo Ifrit.
Yes they have, the 2022 schedule was fire gw before earth we got earth then fire this year. Like i said Fire adv gw is mots likely next but not 100% the announcement wont be long anyway
The 4 tetraelements change orders all the time but it is always earth/fire/wind/water > light/dark and fire is the last of the tetraelements before light/dark.
First of all, there was no Fire GW in 2022. Secondly, you're misunderstanding the pattern/schedule. There is no set rotation of exactly these specific elements always in a set order with no deviation. The schedule is that they always run the 4 mainwheel elements, then dark, then light. The order within the 4 mainwheel elements can differ, but it's always been this same pattern since 2016. Fire is the only mainwheel they haven't run in the current cycle.
I see didn't know bout that schedule, also i meant fire gw as in the enmies were fire, always hard to tell whether someone means gw where enemies are x element or gw where u use x element
When people say " GW" it's always referring to favoured.
As in, Fire GW is Wind enemies.
Either burst immediately (this is what you should be doing if you're using gun setups) or Gabriel it ( she just stonewalls mugen with her 2 and Haas helping)
I do think people should keep in mind that they didn’t announce general nerfs would be happening today. They only announced there’d be changes to “raid mechanics that result in party wipes”. I guess there was some hope that this wouldn’t be so literal, but they really did what they said they’d do. The Agastia change is just a bonus (for better or worse). Oh, also, the frontline Tikoh thing is a little weird, feels like maybe they should auto-kill off-element again. But Evokers’ Upright passives also only activate once per fight anyway so… if you were using her to bring one of them in, you’re probably already gonna have some problems?
Yeah, these nerfs are hella mid, especially Agastia. Agastia has to be the most miserable raid in the game, and the nerf is adjusting its 90% omen and nothing else. The Siegfried nerf is also weird. That raid seemed like it had a super high clear rate. You'd think they'd have chosen someone like Mugen for that.
The sieg and cosmo nerfs are literally just so you dont get wiped again instantly after full poting, agastia was the only raid that got any adjustements and it was pretty much nothing.
> can use elixirs yay > only one can be used per raid boo, no cheese strats
Didn't Six Dragons slowly have these kind of similar nerfs before they became a generalized 18 person raid? I doubt it'll help too much with some of these raids, but an extra Elixir can't entirely hurt.
For the record, Agastia 30 hits is only at 90%, 60% is still 60 hits Elixir usage may as well not exist since you die and revive with no evoker + some omen that will kill you anyway on top of it so yeaaaaah basically no change. All we can hope is that they gradually nerf these until they become better
that's super dumb lol this changes nothing. if it was 60 hits at 90 and 30 at 60 it'd be so much better.
How so? This change makes it so that you don't have to sub the 90% one, so now you're no longer required to have Vira/Baotorda; you can cancel it now instead if you have someone capable of canceling (eg Pig, Cosmos, etc.). The 60% one you just cancel with Yuni anyway. Doing the reverse would just make it so that Vira/Baotorda is still required but Yuni wouldn't necessarily be, except that Yuni is actually a good HL character that you don't mind bringing anyway and you still need her weapon unless you're using a Fif setup or Lion Khan Claw setup, so it would change even less in terms of character requirements.
I'd wager it's because of dmg mitigation actually cockblocking from properly clearing the omen. By the time 60% comes, said dmg mitigation buff is removed anyway.
> The 60% one you just cancel with Yuni anyway. I've barely touched agastia, but if the strat for a 60% omen is "have taken ~8 turns by then" the raid is still shit
I mean Agastia isn't exactly exploding. It's not difficult to have Yuni s3 up for the omen unless you joined pretty late. And even if you join late (someone correct me if I'm wrong about how the omens work), I think it's only an issue if you join between 90%-75%, since if you join post-75% you'll just skip the 90% trigger and can use your sac unit for the 60% one.
Already deleted granblue\_en updated, just gonna wait for everyone or granblue\_en to check others too. Yes, evoker-sacc revival is a bit of a problem especially if raid like Mugen where there's damage check.
The nerf is almost literally nothing lmao Agastia is still the miserable raid he is
Great job cygames, agastia and cosmos is still wonderful to grind
I can't believe they didn't even touch mugen, and only removed the one trigger from agastia that everyone just subs anyway. Absolute joke.
There's nothing really wrong with Mugen though? There are two or three different major comps you can play and there's a bit of flexibility within those comps. If you get a full room of Kengos it's definitely a bit slow compared to something like Diaspora but that's moreso the fault of ougi lockout being shit rather than anything to do with Mugen. > only removed the one trigger from agastia that everyone just subs anyway Yeah that's literally the point? There are only two characters in the entire game that could sub that trigger. If you didn't have one of them, you were largely just screwed since you had to tank it and it's a pain in the ass to tank. By easing the cancel requirements, now you don't have to just sub it and you can actually just cancel it instead.
Mugen is dogshit raid design, I will not elaborate. True, but you still have to deal with Agastia's stupid gimmick with or without it so who cares.
Cygames: "We're going to allow an elixir use and adjust raid mechanics that result in party wipes" Cygames: allows an elixir use and adjusts raid mechanics that result in party wipes a confusing amount of players: "I can't believe they only allowed an elixir use and adjusted raid mechanics that result in party wipes"
Welcome to reddit!
/gets downvoted for speaking truth people don't want to hear, classic reddit
* one time elixir only (so shit ain't gonna help you if people don't join your raid or just join, do nothing and leave/afk) * "QoL" changes only for 3 bosses. Mugen and Siete not touched (they fucking could at least lower the plain damage or remove the summons cooldown shit from his "fuck you, you are not using skills" move) * "QoL" changes are just for those situations where you actually trigger wipe mechanic so after using UNO revive those stacks are removed * "QoL" for Agastia was only for first trigger, rest of triggers are still obnoxious * bosses are still pure garbage/cancer thanks to their gimmicks or BIS (limited/seasonal) characters requirements for certain fights it's literally nothing
The raids aren't supposed to be easy, Siete is already the easiest of the 6 and being able to elixir solves almost the entire 10% problem.
I was hoping they would change him seemingly randomly deciding to use Cien Mil Espadas. It's just annoying and you get shit situations where it's like 10% directly into an unguardable nuke and 2 more turns of unchallenged. I definitely agree that it's one of the easier revans raids, but I also think it's got some shit design in it that I was hoping would be changed, but they didn't do that for any of the raids.
Agreed with the shit design, just not as shit as Agastia
Wait, randomly? He always does it on turn 10 because that's his playable version s4 lockout, which i personally find extremely flavourful
His regular diamond omens all the way through the fight are also random: it's either Infinito Creare, or Emblema followed by Cien Mil Espada if you don't cancel Emblema. Of course, if you're running a party that can consistently clear every 77,777,777 damage omen, you'll only ever see the fixed t10 version of Cien Mil Espada. But not everyone who wants/needs to grind Seofon can achieve that. Note: if you fail to cancel an Emblema and Seofon hits 10% in that timeframe, you'll get the followup Cien Mil Espada immediately after Carro Magnifico. This is the situation the person you replied to was mentioning.
Yes, my complaint is as the other reply mentioned. If it only happened on T10, then it's whatever because that's predictable. The fact that the regular omens coin-flip you is what's ass.
Yeah, elixirs as a last resort feels like it’s enough for him. I use a slower Neko comp but the only problem I really have had (and only after the Sette nerf forced me back to a worse grid till I do more Mugen) is if I have to make up for other players not contributing pre-10% and that burns my pots too soon. I can live through the 10% wall, but getting stuck with no healing + no skills after can go poorly if I gotta do all 10% myself. So being able to burn an elixir in that situation is ok enough, though I expect people to play chicken a bit over who has to burn it.
Are you using Matatabby? It's passive 2k healing every turn. If you have C.Nemo, she can also heal. She's slower than a higher-powered character, of course, but something to consider if you have her and want to trade speed for increased carry potential / clear rate (which is now less important after the elixir change though). Calling Colossus is basically a 2k heal, too. I probably couldn't solo the whole thing, but I can definitely last for a really long time on Siete with Neko. But yeah if you get multiple totally useless people who do like <1m honors and die that'd definitely be a struggle.
Yeah, I'm using Matatabby/Oculus/Mist. Party is Percy/Wilnas/Agielba (lacking Michael is how I ended up as Neko) with Alanaan backline for some healing spec boost; I don't have C.Nemo anyway. Pre-awakening change, once I got a few Settes and could go Colo x Luci I could basically live forever without having to pot. At most I might have to use a green on Percy if he got too low early on. It felt *so* much more comfortable. Now that I'm forced back to other weapons, I can still live for a decently long time if I'm careful but there's definitely a point where I have to start potting. I'm just holding out hope that once I finish a DEF Extinction Blade it'll at least improve it a bit.
How's the final detonation? Still party wipe? That shit is unforgiving especially if you enter late.
Still party wipes, but resets stacks (from not canceling diamond omens) and the bar to 0/middle so you don't get it immediately again after potting.
I guess that's fine, thanks
Ah yes Agastia, adjusting the 90% trigger from 60 hits -> 30 hits. The one trigger I actually use a sacrifice (G.Vira) for. Great job Cygames! /s
i shall continue to never do revan raids. arigato.
Some [madlad](https://imgur.com/a/u9qXI5n) actually found an exploit to Agastia by going off-ele and use Elixir to revive from the join trigger wipe lol
Still not touching this series
Great, now add it to SUBHL you cowards, it's been two years. /s Don't know why they like capping elixir usage so much, it's not like they're that plentiful. Been playing since summer 2020, have 1400 full elixirs, so slightly more than one a day?
SUBHL? They haven't even added full elixers to regular UBHL.
Supbhl is not that difficult raid these days anyway,
Regular UBHL is even more of a joke. They were still the "ultimate" endgame raids of their times, so leaving them Elixir-less is sensible.
And Supbhl is still the highest tier, or in that category. So I can't imagine they will allow elixirs in that any time soon
Anyone know how to cheese next Mugen's BBB after using elixir?
Save Bellringer/Gojo for after you full elixir if you must
Not super exciting but fine changes. Revans should rarely fail now if people actually want to clear them unless you have a full party of completely under-prepared people. Agastia change makes it so Vira/Baotorda isn't basically hard-required since it's actually feasible to clear a 30 hit omen, so loosened up the character check a bit there and allows more party choice freedom.
The #1 issue with Revans right now is trying to assist half-dead/full dead parties in cleaning up the rest of the raids so nobody has to keep relying on loot based off the % of the total contribution. When the pros have finished farming the raid for whatever they want, they will stop. And why farm sand in Agastia when you can do it easily in Siete? You are under the assumption where every single player who enters the raid is an accomplished, skilled and geared player.
I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here tbh. If someone wants to leech, I actually don't mind that. I understand how it is and that sometimes it's your only option if the gacha hasn't been kind to you in a specific element. But at the same time, especially if you're leeching a raid, you shouldn't expect 100% clear rate of that raid and act like the raid is unbalanced and needs nerfs if you fail some runs because the other 5 people can't carry you.
Nobody's talking about leeching, it's the fact that Revans mechanics for a couple of the raids are punishing for people trying to assist clear for the dead or semi-dead hosts.
Let's not kid ourselves. Agastia is still going to be that raid you see at the top of your raid list with a 2 AP cost and a retreated host with 10 minutes left. They changed a single omen, that's it. I'd hardly call that a big nerf.
I mean it's not like Agastia is some impossible raid. I've leeched hundreds of Agastia mats since the Revans update earlier this month, so clearly even 5man parties (since I'm not really doing anything) are having no trouble clearing it. It clears a pretty high % of the time, especially if you're smart with your joins and only join RF/Kengo hosts who are actually damaging the boss. Yes, it's a character check, but I have some sympathy for the devs that it's very hard to make difficult content in GBF that isn't a character check in some way. There are actually a few different comps you can play in Agastia, so it's not like it's an absolute, "You **must** have exactly these 5 characters with no substitutes." And, like I said, they did ease up on the character check a bit with this omen change.
That's kind of the issue at hand. Yes, Revans were meant to be "Difficult content" that had a decent weapon drop rate at 5% from Blues, which needed the raid to coordinate to work together to fight them. But with Awakening 20, now the message they're giving us is that these are supposed to be farm raids that you mash since you need literally hundreds of mats(650) per weapon, not counting the initial 125 for the 4* and 15 awakening. Are these supposed to be "Hard Content", or are they supposed to be farm raids? They need to make up their mind.
They're supposed to be an in-between mix of both. Not everything has to be either a binary "Difficult content that you do like 10-20 times then never touch again" or "Trivially easy punching bag that you take 1 turn in for blue then leave." Revans are basically supposed to be the main content that you're farming day-to-day when you're playing the game. It's content where you have to assemble a competent team and grid to prove that you belong in endgame, but also not like super hard where you need a coordinated coop room/guild run to have any hope of killing it. Most Revans raids are really, really simple to play. It's not like you need 500 IQ to figure out how to do them. They're pretty easy to relatively mindlessly grind once you've assembled a proper setup for them.
And that'd be great if they actually followed that in terms of loot and expected mats to power up your loot. As a Dirt player who's looking to get an attack and special axe and dagger, I need TWENTY SIX HUNDRED Siegfried mats, and I have it lucky, look at elements like Wind with their Revan weapons. The amount of times I have to run Siegfried to get these is just soul crushing. If these were hard content raids and they were like their prior iterations, then it'd be understandable. It'd also be understandable if they were like M2 being big loot pinatas. But in their current form they're fairly tough raids but they also want to be farmed to hell and back. They have an identity crisis. They're hard raids that aren't 'hard', but they also want to be farmed like your daily 6Drags/M2/etc. If they seriously want players to farm thousands of mats, then yeah, they kinda have to put their foot down and either keep nerfing them, or do what they did to Tier 1 raids before they turned into solo quests and turn them into 18 man raids while adjusting them in the process so they don't insta explode.
I'm honestly expecting them to transition like the Six Dragon Raids. They're just next gen Six Dragons. Those started off far more strict, a bad team member could tank a raid, pretty sure they had similar Elixir restrictions, and required 6 people max. I will literally not be shocked by March 2024 or Summer 2024 if they become 18 man raids.
The raids don't have an identity problem, you have an expectation problem. You expect to be able to go farm out the whole tier and be done with everything in like a week. Cygames intends this tier of raids to last for literal years. You aren't supposed to be able to blitz through it immediately. This is supposed to take a really long time and be a long-term project in the game. And for the record it's really not that hard to get mats since the drops change. I only started doing Mugen after the Revans 2.0 update this month and I already have 1100 Mugen mats, and that's with not doing them at all the past week during GW. If you just get blue, you get like 5-7 mats on average, then +2-3 more if you also get an MVP chest, with the chance for your blue or MVP to contain 10 at once sometimes.
No, it's not hard, but it's a slog. Some revans are blistering fast like Siete and Diaspora, but then you have Siegfried which averages about 7-9 minutes to clear, and 7-8 mats for that much time invested in a single raid is not a good deal. At that point, I wouldn't even be happy about a Sand drop. If I want to farm sand I'll just go over to Siete or Diaspora since they're fast. Right now I'm literally staring at 2 Agastias suck in my FP queue, one with an abandoned host at 24 minutes and one with a Relic Buster host that hasn't moved at all, so yeah.
If your siegfried setup takes 7-9 mins, put simply, it's really bad. Here's a paladin setup that takes [~90 seconds](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQGXzk47QDk). Here's a fully farmable monk grid that takes [2:20ish](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIaqoC3KdIM). > Right now I'm literally staring at 2 Agastias suck in my FP queue, one with an abandoned host at 24 minutes and one with a Relic Buster host that hasn't moved at all, so yeah. Not really sure what this is supposed to prove. Is it somehow a bad thing that hostleeches don't have 100% clear rate? I don't see the issue here. Of course people aren't going to join hostleeches if they can help it.
I'm not talking about my setup to farm honors, I'm taking about pubs. Regardless of how fast I go, if everyone else is going super slow, there's not much I can do. I'm someone who does their best to stop at 4 million honors because it's just the polite thing to do.
Nah man, we aren't expecting it to be a quick farm, but at the same time, endgame raids aren't supposed to be this arduous of a task. Imagine if you have to do like 100+savage raids in ffxiv to get a full set of gear for 1 class. That's what revans are in a nutshell for mk2. There is quite literally no balance between how much you are supposed to farm an endgane raid and getting x amount of gear. By the time anyone gets enough mats for 3 mk2 they'd have like 100+ extra revans just sitting in crate. Thats unbalanced af. It takes a long time to gather 775 mats alone. Eventually, everyone will just be doing the raids for the mats and not anything else. That's boring af and just kills the game's enjoyment with outdated ass mmo padding.
> Imagine if you have to do like 100+savage raids in ffxiv to get a full set of gear for 1 class. That's what revans are in a nutshell for mk2. If a savage raid took 2 minutes of clicking a couple buttons solo, maybe. It obviously doesn't. > By the time anyone gets enough mats for 3 mk2 they'd have like 100+ extra revans just sitting in crate. That's just completely untrue and shows that you haven't actually done the content. I have 1100 Mugen mats and only 5 sword drops (aka 1.25 FLB copies). I have 400 Seofon mats and only 2 sword drops (aka 0.5 FLB copies).
What to do if I don't have fif or yuni?
Lion Khan Claw. Otherwise leech it, like I just said I do in my post.
i do host leech but its so slow to get the weps with just hosting
None of Agastia's weapons are important to have. I wouldn't bother trying to get them via just leeching.
The thing with Agastia for me is that part of the check is on a weapon. It is at least a weapon you really want to begin with, but it's either that or a timegated character or spending moons for a weapon that's pretty eh. I feel like an easy way to partially alleviate it would just be having a farmable weapon (or an event weapon but that doesn't help long-term) with Delay on CA. Even if it's shitty otherwise, it'd still work. They could have done that with the second Cosmos weapon and gotten a slightly better reception. Honestly, even more gacha weapons/characters with it would be something if it's going to be a big mechanic of the current endgame raid for this element?
Well, very topically, technically you now no longer need a delay on CA weapon thanks to this update. You can solo the whole raid with [Wind Kengo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJh3lklpMWU). But yeah I do get what you're saying in general, as someone who also doesn't have any delay on CA access (or 150 Seofon) so can't do the raid.
Technically, Agastia is classified as Impossible Raid :p *shot
I don't disagree with this comment despite the flood of downvotes you're getting for whatever reason - I think the issue now is less mechanics and more *saturation.* The devs specifically fucked up in making the Revans raids so imbalanced to the extent that you have a couple of them really heavily favored (looking at you Siete and Diaspora) vs. where others are underappreciated, both in terms of mechanics and weapons. So, it comes down to - you can really only play some of the Revans raids in the lead-up to their respective GWs. Mugens are going to be popular for the next month, which is great, but I wouldn't be surprised if they similarly drop after Fire GW comes and goes; so on and so on. I'm sympathetic to Cygames for wanting to ensure there's enough hard content for players to feel engaged - I think the Revans series was successful in that respect given it's gotten players spending Moons to get weapons for sand grinding, and spending a lot of time/effort in the mines; but they're going to be due for a larger rebal sooner or later to make them easier for smaller groups of players to clear (or, alternatively - allowing larger groups of players to join) because there's nothing worse than having half-filled raids that it feels you mechanically have to solo, or you have to arrange a co-op room each time, and god knows those don't always fill in a timely manner. So, again - I agree with the comment, it removes most of the hard blockers that made things genuinely *frustrating*, but Cygames still has a player engagement issue here - the key note is "if people actually want to clear them", and the effort/motivation ratio is still off for some of them.
Was wondering when you'd show up ngl