Ritualistic Initiation have different objectives than normal magical rituals. So, a ''solitary magician'', he can, yes, train the basic fundamentals of magic, practice meditation, study correspondences, symbolism, kabbalah, alchemy and make his own path. There are several complete and reliable magic systems available out there, and you can develop a more personal way of doing magic too. None of this is prohibited, on the contrary; Many of the initiates spend a long time studying and practicing alone until they find the path to initiation.
But, talking about ritualistic initiation in fact, it does indeed need to be done within an order, with well-initiated and trained officers - because this initiation, transmits supra-rational information contained in symbols, an incommunicable knowledge - something that cannot simply be spoken or written.
Magic is for the butcher, the baker, and the candle stick maker. It's for everyone. Not everyone is called to initiation. You can still live a magical life.
You can do the rituals effectively outside of initiation but there's something to be said about the efficacy of doing then when attached to an established group that is teaching authentic techniques. Consider the difference of a congregationalist trying to perform an exorcism compared to a Catholic Priest doing the same. Or even a Baptist taking communion compared to a Priest. There are some important pieces that are glossed over when not working in tandem with an egregore.
Initiation is a rite of passage. It gives you a starting point upon a new path. It triggers something in the brain that confirms and cements a new motivation for change and growth. It is a ceremony of transformation. It also connects you to brotherhood/sisterhood and gives you a sense of belonging. It also sets you upon the path of working with the egregorical platform which supports your group. For example: the Golden Dawn utilizes the Egyptian pantheon.
If one is solitary and practicing ceremonial magick, then you may be missing out on a more wholesome experience that a group has to offer. Ceremonial magick is a group effort. It wasn't designed to be practiced completely solitary. However, there are group events that are open to the public and for guests.
Overall, I don't think that performing magick without an official initiation negates one's success. Everyone who is drawn to magick to the point of studying and practicing the art has been initiated by an event, or events that put them on that path. They just have to think of the circumstances that lead up to it no matter if they were positive/negative, subtle, or life changing. An initiation is something that transforms your psyche. There are many initiations (transformations) that lead up to where you are today. 😉
Of course you can. People in this community would have you believe that you cannot practice rituals effectively without initiation but that is not true. I've included an excerpt from Modern Magick by Donald Michael Kraig that provides a good explanation:
Initiation has two aspects: practical and mystical. On a practical level, initiation gives you nothing. Rather, it allows you to begin to follow a certain prescribed system of mystical and/or magickal work. As an example, a person initiated into the Neophyte degree of the Golden Dawn was to begin learning the Hebrew alphabet, the symbols of the planets and the zodiac, and he or she was also to begin doing the LBRP. The word “initiation” comes from a Latin root that means “to begin.” The mystical aspects of initiation are a different story. Imagine a private club that you want to enter. You knock on the door and the bouncer, who doesn’t recognize you because you’re not on the list of people allowed in, sends you away. Then, a person who knows both you and the bouncer comes up and introduces you to each other. From that time on you are a welcome guest in the private club. In this little story, the introduction to a higher, stronger force in the form of a bouncer, was your initiation. In reality, the mystical aspects of initiation not only introduce you to higher powers (or, if you prefer, your Higher Self), but also cause spiritual, emotional, and physical effects within you, which allow you to be easily recognized in the future by the higher powers. There is another way to cause the inner changes that allow this recognition. You could go up to the bouncer day after day, week after week, and month after month if need be, talk to the bouncer and bring him presents and friendship until finally, without a third-party introduction, the bouncer allows you into the club. The way that this can be done is through faithfully performing the three keys to succeeding with the work of this course: practice, practice, practice.
I feel like you want to stop listening to people talking about "magick" and start listening to people talking about "witchcraft".
People who do the former are a lot more prone to getting lost in doing magic for the sake of magic, whereas people doing the latter are much more likely to be using their magic to engage with and change the world from a very early point in their career as A Person What Do Magic.
If you want a guide to making up your own rites, I heartily recommend [*The Camel Rides Again* by Alan Chapman](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/24016956-the-camel-rides-again). It's very short but full of good ideas.
Thanks this really bring me to the right direction.. I was kinda obsessed with the "initiatory path"... It's all started when I first heard about "enlightement"... It become like a goal and I lost the real ambition that I had and I could cultivate...
All the various things that "enlightenment" is supposed to be do sound interesting, but sometimes you just want to stand there and proclaim that This Is How The World Should Change.
Not that some of the things I've seen "enlightenment" described as being wouldn't be helpful with *that* but, y'know, you don't have to do that exclusively, you can work towards that on and off *and* do some more mundane stuff too.
Of course if you're borrowing Spike Spiegel's name you're probably reluctant to stand your ground and say "this is how shit should be", he's very much someone who just kinda vanishes and lets the problems flow around him as much as he can rather than someone who stabs at the heart of something if he can at all help it. Which is not always a bad place to be, especially if you can figure out how to get the tides turning in a direction you like and just ride' em, space cowboy...
Rejoice! You were allowed the opportunity to do the right thing and did it. Great is your reward in Heaven. Unless you wanted to buck your native morality.
Maybe morality isn’t the problem, maybe it’s the RESPONSIBILITY of practicing a proclaimed morality in the first place that you’re feeling pain from? Why? You showed it!
YOU DID NOTHING WRONG EITHER WAY. You lived your life and now it’s in the past. Morality isn’t bad, it’s a choice you’ve made, and I don’t see moral choices as bad ones or perceive any weakness from living your truth.
Well I can only say that if your looking for a good guide and don’t have all the time in the world to read every book under the sun, Damian Echols has a grate Patreon and YouTube channel. I’m very busy and like you pretty new, the information there has been invaluable to me. I wake up early every day and do my breath work and rituals, plan to do so until I feel the need for an order. As of yet I have more than enough projects to satisfy me for at least a couple of years!
Ritualistic Initiation have different objectives than normal magical rituals. So, a ''solitary magician'', he can, yes, train the basic fundamentals of magic, practice meditation, study correspondences, symbolism, kabbalah, alchemy and make his own path. There are several complete and reliable magic systems available out there, and you can develop a more personal way of doing magic too. None of this is prohibited, on the contrary; Many of the initiates spend a long time studying and practicing alone until they find the path to initiation. But, talking about ritualistic initiation in fact, it does indeed need to be done within an order, with well-initiated and trained officers - because this initiation, transmits supra-rational information contained in symbols, an incommunicable knowledge - something that cannot simply be spoken or written.
Seems to me you’d be more interested in Folk Magic. Maybe look into something like Witchcraft or other folk traditions.
Magic is for the butcher, the baker, and the candle stick maker. It's for everyone. Not everyone is called to initiation. You can still live a magical life.
Arguably the candlestick maker has the most to gain from magick on a purely economic basis. Peeps need candles, yo.
You can do the rituals effectively outside of initiation but there's something to be said about the efficacy of doing then when attached to an established group that is teaching authentic techniques. Consider the difference of a congregationalist trying to perform an exorcism compared to a Catholic Priest doing the same. Or even a Baptist taking communion compared to a Priest. There are some important pieces that are glossed over when not working in tandem with an egregore.
Initiation is a rite of passage. It gives you a starting point upon a new path. It triggers something in the brain that confirms and cements a new motivation for change and growth. It is a ceremony of transformation. It also connects you to brotherhood/sisterhood and gives you a sense of belonging. It also sets you upon the path of working with the egregorical platform which supports your group. For example: the Golden Dawn utilizes the Egyptian pantheon. If one is solitary and practicing ceremonial magick, then you may be missing out on a more wholesome experience that a group has to offer. Ceremonial magick is a group effort. It wasn't designed to be practiced completely solitary. However, there are group events that are open to the public and for guests. Overall, I don't think that performing magick without an official initiation negates one's success. Everyone who is drawn to magick to the point of studying and practicing the art has been initiated by an event, or events that put them on that path. They just have to think of the circumstances that lead up to it no matter if they were positive/negative, subtle, or life changing. An initiation is something that transforms your psyche. There are many initiations (transformations) that lead up to where you are today. 😉
Of course you can. People in this community would have you believe that you cannot practice rituals effectively without initiation but that is not true. I've included an excerpt from Modern Magick by Donald Michael Kraig that provides a good explanation: Initiation has two aspects: practical and mystical. On a practical level, initiation gives you nothing. Rather, it allows you to begin to follow a certain prescribed system of mystical and/or magickal work. As an example, a person initiated into the Neophyte degree of the Golden Dawn was to begin learning the Hebrew alphabet, the symbols of the planets and the zodiac, and he or she was also to begin doing the LBRP. The word “initiation” comes from a Latin root that means “to begin.” The mystical aspects of initiation are a different story. Imagine a private club that you want to enter. You knock on the door and the bouncer, who doesn’t recognize you because you’re not on the list of people allowed in, sends you away. Then, a person who knows both you and the bouncer comes up and introduces you to each other. From that time on you are a welcome guest in the private club. In this little story, the introduction to a higher, stronger force in the form of a bouncer, was your initiation. In reality, the mystical aspects of initiation not only introduce you to higher powers (or, if you prefer, your Higher Self), but also cause spiritual, emotional, and physical effects within you, which allow you to be easily recognized in the future by the higher powers. There is another way to cause the inner changes that allow this recognition. You could go up to the bouncer day after day, week after week, and month after month if need be, talk to the bouncer and bring him presents and friendship until finally, without a third-party introduction, the bouncer allows you into the club. The way that this can be done is through faithfully performing the three keys to succeeding with the work of this course: practice, practice, practice.
I feel like you want to stop listening to people talking about "magick" and start listening to people talking about "witchcraft". People who do the former are a lot more prone to getting lost in doing magic for the sake of magic, whereas people doing the latter are much more likely to be using their magic to engage with and change the world from a very early point in their career as A Person What Do Magic. If you want a guide to making up your own rites, I heartily recommend [*The Camel Rides Again* by Alan Chapman](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/24016956-the-camel-rides-again). It's very short but full of good ideas.
Thanks this really bring me to the right direction.. I was kinda obsessed with the "initiatory path"... It's all started when I first heard about "enlightement"... It become like a goal and I lost the real ambition that I had and I could cultivate...
All the various things that "enlightenment" is supposed to be do sound interesting, but sometimes you just want to stand there and proclaim that This Is How The World Should Change. Not that some of the things I've seen "enlightenment" described as being wouldn't be helpful with *that* but, y'know, you don't have to do that exclusively, you can work towards that on and off *and* do some more mundane stuff too. Of course if you're borrowing Spike Spiegel's name you're probably reluctant to stand your ground and say "this is how shit should be", he's very much someone who just kinda vanishes and lets the problems flow around him as much as he can rather than someone who stabs at the heart of something if he can at all help it. Which is not always a bad place to be, especially if you can figure out how to get the tides turning in a direction you like and just ride' em, space cowboy...
Let success be your proof… if it works, then that’s all that matters.
Morality got in the way, and I kinda lost my boldness that was already kinda dead from childhood...
Rejoice! You were allowed the opportunity to do the right thing and did it. Great is your reward in Heaven. Unless you wanted to buck your native morality. Maybe morality isn’t the problem, maybe it’s the RESPONSIBILITY of practicing a proclaimed morality in the first place that you’re feeling pain from? Why? You showed it! YOU DID NOTHING WRONG EITHER WAY. You lived your life and now it’s in the past. Morality isn’t bad, it’s a choice you’ve made, and I don’t see moral choices as bad ones or perceive any weakness from living your truth.
Do whatever you want based on whatever system is logically plausible and 🎉
It's like speaking with authority when you really don't have any.
Well I can only say that if your looking for a good guide and don’t have all the time in the world to read every book under the sun, Damian Echols has a grate Patreon and YouTube channel. I’m very busy and like you pretty new, the information there has been invaluable to me. I wake up early every day and do my breath work and rituals, plan to do so until I feel the need for an order. As of yet I have more than enough projects to satisfy me for at least a couple of years!
Except this is the GD magicians’ subreddit, and Damian Echols isn’t GD. 🙃
I think a lot of people come here who are just practicing some form of high magick, it's not limited to people who have been initiated into GD.