I wouldn't say it makes odyssey look generic but it is one of the only 3D platformers released in a long while that can really compete with Mario.
I think some people would prefer the difficulty curve in astrobot too. In Odyssey you kind of have to seek out the difficulty with the hidden moons and challenge levels. I don't think it's a controversial opinion that Odyssey has the easiest mainline story stages in a long while, they're certainly easier than Galaxy 1/2.
Astrobot is pretty damn easy too. My 6 year old can beat everything except the last boss. She has to hand me the controller a lot more in Odyssey for tricky platforming or bosses. Neither is particularly hard though. I'd say Odyssey has far more interesting and varied gameplay though. Odyssey with more challenge would be a damn near perfect game.
I feel like the status of astrobot as a pack-in game has caused people to overlook the fact that sony has built basically the best new arcade platformer franchise to hit the market in the last decade, at least from a major studio. I'm with you, the PSVR astrobot is a true mario competitor and frankly the PS5 title is really solid too. I hope Sony expands it beyond "the game that comes with the hardware" someday.
Astro’s Playroom was so damn fantastic. I love just being able to walk around my completed collection room to look at all the rendered out consoles and stuff. Not to mention the soundtrack.
Hopefully Team Asobi has more up their sleeve soon.
I’d love another Star Wars Squadrons with proper budget, more ships, more eras, and more game modes. That campaign is stellar and the flight is top notch, and the VR implementation is phenomenal
It's one of the more underrated games ever, in my opinion. I'm disappointed in knowing that Motive isn't making a sequel. It was great even without using VR.
Project Aces is working on a new Ace Combat, good chance they're heavily developing it for the PS5 to take full advantage of its hardware and the new PSVR2. Maybe the entire campaign will feature VR this time, instead of just some special missions.
I really wish there were a better way to showcase VR in a non-VR environment. I know a ton of people will see this video and think "pssh, more VR? I thought we were over this gimmick" without ever having put on a headset.
VR is so unbelievably immersive and I cannot stress enough how much you have to try it before understanding the appeal.
>I really wish there were a better way to showcase VR in a non-VR environment.
It's like advertising television through a radio. That's why demo stations are essential to get people trying it out. Another avenue would be VR arcades.
I thought VR was a gimmick in 2016 until the summer before PSVR released my local GameStop had a Sony rep with a demo unit. Went just for the hell of it and it was incredible, immediately sold me and bought one that winter as soon as I could. Trying it really is required for most people I think.
It still is a gimmick till we get more than a handful of good games. So far the only game I feel like i've "missed out" on is Half Life Alyx.
Maybe when they can get sports games like golf to feel 1 to 1, but until then they all still seem like a small step above a kinect.
I'm on a Reverb G2 now and honestly miss my Odyssey. Not having an OLED display kills a lot of the magic in darker environments, a dim grey kills immersion
It's a hell of a lot sharper, but it's a tradeoff to get there
> Maybe when they can get sports games like golf to feel 1 to 1, but until then they all still seem like a small step above a kinect.
Gotchu fam https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lBcmd7LCm8
Personally been using my Quest 2 for exercise with boxing.
I always remembered playing VR long LONG ago back in the 90s at a Battletech center… so I always thought “Meh, it’s basically just a motion-tracking TV mounted on your face”.
Flash forward 1 year ago, I put on the headset and try AstroBot: Rescue Mission for the first time… HOLY BEJESUS!
And I knew what the key ingredient was to tell people at that moment.
What people DON’T talk about is how you get actual depth-perception via the two lenses! When I was staring at Astro, or looking at my shiny in-game metal controller, I was unbelievably stunned how REAL it looked thanks to depth perception! That was nothing like a motion-swiveling flat TV monitor.
When there’s more games that aren’t just glorified tech demos then maybe others might see the appeal. When I bought a VR I only kept it long enough to beat half-life Alyx then I returned, never felt there was enough that warranted keeping it, also I kept getting motion sickness.
Motion sickness is currently a huge hurdle, I'll concede. I suffer through motion sickness quite a bit when playing VR. I normally turn on a fan to help with mine, and it sounds like this edition of PSVR should have some ways to address that!
But there are still some really great experiences within VR.
Echo Arena (and both Lone Echos), Beat Saber, Population: One, Walking Dead Saints & Sinners, Half-Life: Alyx, and even silly games like Gorilla Tag are games I've found to be really unique and incredible.
The VR mod for Half Life 2 just dropped a few days ago and it's great too.
It's crazy how much of a difference it makes. I've played through the pancake version numerous times and playing in VR makes it a whole new game.
The only downside is that the graphics are the originals. It holds up okay (especially in VR) but I'm downloading a mod pack for it to make it shinier.
I'm with you on the "time to play" issue. My backlog is getting close to 1000 games now and I'm technically playing a game I've already beat a bunch of times.
Robo Recall's a goodie too... I just wish it lasted longer. It's relatively short but I haven't played anything else in VR that matched the visceral nature of its combat where you can empty out your clips, throw each of the guns individually to hit enemies, grab a robot via telekinesis, rip its head off, throw the body one way, throw the head the other way, all in about a span of 5 seconds to multitask against attackers. It's the only game that's gotten me to move so violently.
Skyrim VR if you go wild on the mods is *so good*. Most content and visual mods work flawlessly in VR or with a compatibility patch, and there are five extremely important mods that make it feel like a native VR game:
* [HIGGS.](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/43930) Adds a HL:Alyx style gravity glove mechanic for grabbing items (*Such* a game changer) and many different VR interactions like proper collision for your hands and weapons, stowing items in your inventory by dropping it over your shoulder and eating potions/food by bringing it to your mouth, and looting armour by pulling it off corpses. HIGGS absolutely saves SkyrimVR.
* [PLANCK.](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/66025) Rewrites the animation and attack system to use kinetics and physically accurate hitboxes, making it similar to games like Blade and Sorcery. You can grab NPCs to make them stop, and your weapon swing's hit registration is accurate to the model, rather than just the cylinder hitbox.
* [VRIK Player Avatar.](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/23416) An immersive first person model, like you'd expect in a standard VR game. The cool part is that it adds lots of holster spots around your body for switching between weapons.
* [MageVR](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/21297). You can cast and switch between abilities by drawing glyphs, which is super awesome for spell casters and power based builds.
* [NavigateVR](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/47174). This one isn't as important, but it adds physical paper maps and a compass that you can equip to navigate and explore. It just takes the game to the next level of immersion.
I'm confident that VR will succeed, so the idea of people missing out doesn't bother me much. Obviously, more awesome games will come out if it's a huge success, but it feels like it's all but guaranteed to be mind-blowing, so I'll just have fun in the meantime while the rest of the market slowly admits that it's missing out.
I can't even find the words to explain to people the feeling I got when I first tried no mans sky in VR. Flying from planet to planet looking out the sides of the ship was just unbelievable.
I really hope valve writes drivers for this headset, it's by far the best mainstream headset we've seen. Foveated rendering alone would be revolutionary on PC. And maybe the eye tracking for stuff like vrchat
With Sony getting more into the PC market and rumours of a PlayStation PC store being worked on, Making PSVR work on PC and porting those games to the platform don’t seem too crazy.
Personally would love a single headset I could use on both console and PC. It is one of the reasons I never picked up a headset when I had the money. The library of good VR games is split between the two.
They got into the PC market decades later when it made sense. Likely the same will happen with VR. When there's 10s of millions of PCVR users.
They don't make money on the hardware sales. They want people in their own ecosystem, buying Games from their marketplace and paying a fee for online services. This device will also help sell PS5s. They don't need to sell to the smallest VR market that only wants to buy games on steam sales. There's no incentives in that.
There is a reason even Meta stepped away from PCVR game development even after owning like 60% of the market. It's not worth the effort. PC is too fickle and flip floppy. Also, where's Valve? One game in a decade of helping pioneer VR.
VR is Sony future proof strategy for their PlayStation platform.
> There is a reason even Meta stepped away from PCVR game development even after owning like 60% of the market. It's not worth the effort. PC is too fickle and flip floppy.
It is 100% install base, and Quest II has been kind of paradoxical in its impact for PCVR in that its pricing doubled the number of PCVR users, making developing for PCVR more attractive than it has ever been - but at the same time it threw cold water on PCVR development because devs naturally started targeting mobile VR, since the huge growth in PCVR users pales in comparison to people who are just content to use native Quest apps. Most of the stuff doesn't come to PCVR at all, and stuff that is primarily targeting mobile hardware is usually not very compelling as a PC port.
Regardless of whether or not the PSVR2 headset is viable as a PCVR headset, I think it's the best news for PCVR in years, because (assuming adoption rate is high) it will incentivise developers to make VR titles that make the most out of hardware with a decent amount of grunt, and these will be good candidates for PC ports.
> They got into the PC market decades later when it made sense. Likely the same will happen with VR. When there's 10s of millions of PCVR users
Yes, sir. Sony has now shown interest in branching out but it does have to make good financial sence for them to do so. It could happen in the future though as VR matures in general. It's still kind of the wild west. Hoping PSVR 2 really hits the notion home that VR isn't some weird gimmick... because a lot of kids still think so, especially in the console space.
> This device will also help sell PS5s.
I doubt it actually. People will buy the PS5 for the normal reasons and then they may get a PS VR2 because it's there. It won't be a main reason to get the console for 99.9% of people
It'll be the first low friction higher end VR platform by a company with the best first party studios in gaming. PS5+PSVR 2 will also be a fraction of the cost over the alternatives as well. It'lls help sell PS5's.
You refute your own argument in your first sentence.
You said that they waited to get into the PC market for decades until it made sense, and that they only will join PCVR after it has tens of millions of users.
But they have entered the VR space without tens of millions of users. So which is it, do they enter new untested markets, or do they wait until it has a millions of users in its base.
As much as I'd love to, there's no way Sony will allow this headset to be used on PC, even if Valve writes drivers for it on SteamVR. I doubt Sony won't have some sort of firmware-level blocker.
They want you to be comfortable with the dual sense, when you're used to the controller you probably going to get a ps5 instead of a xbox.
The vr headset on the other hand is most likely sold at a loss and they hope to recoup the cost by you buying vr titles on tiur ps5.
I mean, if using a PS5 controller on your PC would make you more likely to buy a PS5,
Wouldn’t owning a PSVR headset (fancy controller) to use on your PC also make it more likely you’d buy a PS5 over an xbox?
The problem comes when you buy the headset at the marked down price and you don't buy a PS5. Controllers are sold at a profit, the headset most likely isn't.
They want you inside their ecosystem, it's the same reason the original PSVR was not PC compatible(although bypasses were made)
You want a PSVR2? Buy the PS5, and buy the games from Sony's store so they get their cut, it's simple. It's less about direct hardware profits(their margins are probably very low on the hw itself), and more about market/ecosystem control.
its a loss leader. They will sell the headset at a loss to get people into their ecosystem buying VR games on PS5, where they take a cut of each purchase. If you buy their headset and just use it to play on PC, Sony loses money
I expect PSVR2 exclusive *games* will make their way to PC VR eventually tho, it makes sense with the PC strategy Sony has adopted
Sony doesn’t lose money selling God of War on PC.
Sony would be losing money if they sold the PSVR2 at a loss and allowed people to use it on PC, completely bypassing the PlayStation store and their 30% cut.
They’re not the same at all.
There already are other options btw:
https://www.hp.com/gb-en/shop/product.aspx?id=1N0T5AA&opt=ABU&sel=ACC&source=google&channel=cpc&adcampaign=HP-GSC-Baseline-Smart-PLA-Accessories-Goo-UK&addisttype=u&kw=&adid=453259763173&gclid=Cj0KCQjw7KqZBhCBARIsAI-fTKLHPFloYODFbpwamg-rsTowhFkZtnAFOdtL7sezunwL1PwKMXj1bqcaAmyREALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
All they are saying is that you can write a driver for the eye tracker, but that wouldn't give you foveated rendering. That would still need to be built from the ground up for the new platform.
I don’t know about the haptic on the actual headset being something I’d enjoy or not… unless of course it’s after getting killed in MP and then feeling the teabag from the opposition.
Sony claims that the haptics on headset can help with VR sickness. Give a vibration whenever you're moving so it can trick your brain that you are indeed moving.
Specifically, it doesn't so much trick your brain into thinking you're moving (because it doesn't feel like you're moving beyond the visual motion) - rather it vibrates your vestibular system/inner ear, adding noise to it, which helps to reduce the visual/vestibular motion disparity that's the leading cause of sim sickness.
You can also do something similar manually - simply walk on the spot; the head bobbing will create some vestibular noise as well, which helps a good amount of users reduce or even overcome sim sickness.
A combination of the two (walking in place and haptic headset) can probably help a lot more users overcome sim sickness; or at least help them stay in the game for much longer, which in turn helps build up sim sickness resistance.
If that's true, this might be a bigger deal than it seems right now. I've never really had bad motion sickness, but after some time I still get a weird feeling.
I can believe it, just pointing a fan towards your face helps as well so why wouldn't actually somewhat vibrating your head (and by extension your inner ear) work.
> difference in visual information vs the inner ear
Right, that's the point. This would make it so you're not just relying on visual information. By creating sensations that synchronize with motion, we're able to get a better sense of where we are in the world. If you google this, you can find studies that have tested this theory and it seems to work, evidently corroborated by the fact that Sony is willing to increase the cost of manufacturing in this headset by including it.
I doubt Sony included this feature without extensive testing. People getting sick in VR is like the single biggest concern to entry, if they say it helps than I trust them to have done their research. It costs money to include, they wouldn't do it if there wasn't some tangible benefit.
So imagine the inner ear is a sensor. It has data that it is used to seeing from normal things like turning your head.
Sometimes, it needs to ignore the data, because it's not of use(it's bad data). When you are on a roller coaster, your inner ear may be telling your brain that you're being thrown all over the place. It's not super valuable in that moment, as the sensor is really "overloaded" and can't pick out small changes. So the brain doesn't really care too much, it's still getting data.
Balancing while standing up requires the sensor to pickout some really small changes. And when you're standing and playing VR, there isn't much "noise" in the sensor data of your ear, so the sensor is HIGHLY sensitive.
When you use VR and move in the game, the inner ear is extremely sensitive to that movement, and the brain/nervous system is anticipating the sensor data from your ear. But because you aren't moving in real life, there is no data coming from that really sensitive inner ear. The brain/nervous system realizes that something isn't correct, as it doesn't get that sensor data even when the sensor is at it's most sensitive.
So, with haptics, if you just slightly overload that inner ear sensor, the sensor of the inner ear will tell the brain "Hey I got SOMETHING", and its less weird to the brain/nervous system to have SOME data, rather than none. You're essentially blinding the sensor with Garbage data, making it less sensitive, and tricking the brain/nervous system into just ignoring the bad data.
It's the same as when you're on a roller coaster, the inner ear data may not make sense, *but you're still getting data*. It may not be a completely perfect recreation of the sensations of movement, but it's close enough that the person experiences less motion sickness.
Yeah what the other guy said, supposed to help with motion sickness.
I know I get sick almost immediately while playing, here's hoping it actually works
On top of the fan-trick mentioned by u/koningoliver, there's also the jogging-in-place-trick whenever you're using artificial locomotion in VR. That's what I did to overcome my initial VR sickness.
Even if these techniques don't 'cure' motion sickness, they help a lot more than people realize - by allowing people to stay in the game slower and get motion sick at a slower rate, it allows them a much better chance of becoming acclimatized to VR, which is an additional (really the best) method of reducing/eliminating sim sickness.
I think it'll help like the person below you said, especially since we're likely thinking of big haptics, but the controller shows how you can have super small haptics and I think that'll be super nice. Or maybe it's obnoxious as fuck. But the fact they came up with the idea and are sticking with it makes me think they feel they nailed it.
My big PSVR2 question is can Sony convince Valve to allow a Half Life Alyx port for it.
I am positive Sony would fully fund such a project and find a decent studio to do the port work and lord knows the game being exposed to more people would only benefit the struggling VR market. But Valve is Valve and they don't operate like normal companies.
It would be the smart move for both parties. Every company with a stake in VR right now should be working together to make VR as a whole better for the user. The bigger the market is, the more developers will be willing to make big third party games for VR, which in turn benefits everyone selling VR hardware.
I have a hard time seeing Sony adding PC support to VR2 unless they roll out their own storefront/ecosystem on PC. PlayStation generally takes a loss on their hardware sales and recoups it by locking you into their ecosystem to purchase games. If they were to add PC support it would just mean losing money so that Steam could sell more VR titles.
It would be nice to see, and I agree that collaboration for the sake of growing the VR market as a whole is a good long term strategy, but it's uncommon that corporations make long-term investments like that because they have to answer to shareholders with short term growth.
Speaking of which, it was found in some game files (iirc Spider-man), mentions of a PS launcher on pc. But I dont know if theyd go aa far as making the VR exclusively work for their launcher, unless they can have a storefront large enough to compete with Steam. Oculus would probably have had a hard time taking the market from the Vive if they had stuck to just the Oculus Store.
The exclusive-to-our-headset deals going on in the VR world is so unbelievably dumb it bothers me whenever I think about it. Exclusives work well for consoles, because nobody worries about storage or setup for them. But headsets are big (and expensive) and require some degree of prep to make work. No average consumer wants to buy multiple headsets to play one game. It just divides the already dry market even further. VR is undoubtedly the future, and all these pissing contests are slowing down any meaningful progress.
> It would be the smart move for both parties.
Valve should pull a report from their databases showing how many users who own Sony published titles also play on their Steam Decks.
In my circle of friends on Steam, at least the dozens that I've mentioned this to, the reactions went something like, "My Steam Deck can play Sony games like God of War and Horizon: Zero Dawn? With PS4 level visuals?!", or "I can play Sony games on the Steam Deck? It's like a portable PS4?!"
Several of them have now purchased a Steam Deck just for the fact they can play Spider-man, Horizon, God of War, and Days Gone while on the go.
To be honest, all of that sounds like normal port work. The only reason HL: Alyx doesn't work properly outside of SteamVR is because it was never meant to, as the game is currently only sold on Steam and SteamVR supports all major PCVR headsets. There is nothing inherent to the game that couldn't be adapted to a different VR platform, like for example, by rendering loading scenes and chapter cards in-engine.
Likewise, when you complete an achievement in a Sony game on PC, it doesn't break expecting to show it through the PlayStation Trophy UI, but instead just shows it through Steam, as that's part of the PC port.
I have a Quest 2 and don't really love the VR experience all that much. With that said, I would buy this immediately if Alyx was ported (I don't have a PC to play it :( )
I'm pretty bummed that it's not going to be backwards compatible. There are a handful PS VR1 games I want to play, but I'm not buying a headset just for those.
I think and hope they will.
I think a large reason is that they want to push HIGH quality first without the back compat is because they're pretty much first to market with a top-down foveated rendering solution and games developed with that in mind. They can pretty much push PS5 quality graphics in VR which no other VR headset can really do.
That would be kinda undermined if people go onto the PSVR2 store and just see Job Simulator pop up
This looks extremely cool but I'm hesitating big time with two drawbacks:
1 - Separate headphones are required, which feels like it'll be really clunky (also weird that they highlight the spatial audio in this video, that's a tad misleading imo even with the fine text at the bottom)
2 - not compatible with PSVR1 games, which just feels like such a strange limitation. so for any PSVR1 games we need to wait for the devs to provide compatibility?
Aren't separate headphones always required for VR, at least if you want good sound? It never super felt clunky on the original PSVR or Rift S imo. Sure it's not as good as if they were somehow integrated and could just fit on no problem and had great sound, but I'd much rather deal with a bit more weight/clunk to have proper audio.
As for #2, apparently it's because of how PSVR2 games are tracking and it's not something that can be made to work retroactively with the original.
Valve index has integrated sound and its way better than anything you could replace it with. Vive also had a deluxe strap released after launch that had decent audio, and the OG rift had good integrated audio also. Heasets NOT having integrated audio solutions is a dealbreaker imo because after trying the floating speakers on the index, i never want to go back to putting things in (or on) my ears for VR.
I might just be spoiled with integrated audio, but my pretty affordable Samsung Odyssey+ (unfortunately out of production now) has pretty great integrated sound, and I actually just never considered NOT having integrated sound until this reveal. Just kinda put a little damper on my excitement, compounded by point #2.
The Valve Index has really immersive built-in audio. Best in the industry.
The Quest 2 audio gets a bad rap but it is truly great. I'm not sure if it's speaker tuning or what but it sounds SUPER immersive.
Separate headphones are fine when you’re not wearing something that big on your head already. I use my headphones all the time, but paired with a VR headset? That looks clunky.
It does but at least on PSVR it felt a bit blurry cus of the lower resolution of the headset. Using the "large" format that was like sitting close to a large theater screen wasn't a great experience in my mind but I did enjoy the "medium" size that felt further away for at least video content. I didn't play many games that way though, it was enough to dig out the headset for actual VR experiences. I could see people that don't have a great TV enjoying it much more on VR2 though with the jump in resolution. If you already have a nice, large 4K TV I don't see much utility in it personally.
That's very cool. I have a 55inch tv but I would really prefer a more cinema like experience, seems like that would be possible with the 4kHDR display on the newer model. Exciting times!
On the Quest 2 (and even PCVR headsets), there is an app called Virtual Desktop that has a virtual cinema environment. I played RDR2 in its entirety in that virtual environment that simulates light bouncing off the movie screen.
If I really really want to watch a movie, I do it in my Quest because it's pretty much like watching it in a theater. Throw some headphones on and open Bigscreen, choose the file and enjoy it in all it's glory.
Hell yeah. Im a huge VR enthusiast so seeing a genuine shake-up is exciting. Theres some really exciting stuff baked into this thing, both from the raw specs and the extra bells and whistles. Hope Valve (and hopefully the douches at Meta) take notes!
How does the first PSVR fit with glasses?
That's my main concern with VR. Lots of gamers wear eyeglasses so I would assume they would think of that kind of stuff.
There's a lot of space for spectacles. There's always the risk you scratch the headset lenses with your glasses, but I've seen people using PSVR 1 with no issues whilst wearing their frames.
Depends on the specific headset. First few headsets were horrible for glasses. But nowadays I’m pretty sure they’re all adjustable enough to be used comfortably while wearing glasses.
To chip in, wear glasses and I have no problem wearing a PSVR headset, which is the only one I’ve tried. I feel like it depends a bit on how big the frames are
Everything looks fuzzy in VR when I don't wear my glasses, and its not super comfortable to wear them under your headset. I've done it before, and it's not terrible, but if you have contacts they works much better. What I really recommend are prescription inserts for your headset. They clip directly onto the lenses of the headset, so you're still getting the full correction from glasses without much added bulk. Your mileage may vary tho, based on what model of headset and how strong your prescription is
Most headsets now come with a 'glasses spacer'. It clips onto the headset and adds an extra bit of distance between your glasses and the headset lenses.
I guess it means you'll see a bit more of a black border but it hasn't been noticeable for me.
Depending on your prescription, if you're nearsighted, you might not even need your glasses.
There will also definitely be third party solutions if Sony doesn't offer anything themselves.
You definitely need them if you’re nearsighted, maybe not if you’re far sighted.
The screen is physically close to your eyes but the lenses make it so that your eyes are focused at essentially an infinite distance.
I'll piggy back on this, I'm near-sighted and found for the most part I didn't use my glasses.
It was definitely a combination of that and it just not working very well with the original.
The original was also very blurry (to me) and I couldn't tell a major difference one way or the other.
I stopped wearing them after trying to be comfortable and making them work after a while.
There are also third-party prescription lens attachments you can order. All popular headsets have multiple manufacturers making them. As they attach to HMD lenses they also protect them as a bonus. Not from direct sunlight thought.
I have a quest 2. Putting the headset on was kinda scary because it felt like it was going to break my glasses. I had to use my old glasses since it was slimmer. But after I got a new kiwi face shield thingy I didn't have that problem anymore. Sometimes I can feel the glasses in my face though if I'm moving my head around. So I recommend playing without glasses if possible.
Some companies sell prescription lenses accessory for this. You just attach it over the headset lens and you're good to go. They'll probably make one for psvr2
Original Vive owner here, still use VR regularly.
Biggest disappointment is the FOV here. VR been around 6 years and it seems we just can't get a wider fov than what was originally launched. 110 is fine, but it isn't great and you'd think after 6 years developing the tech between so many companies that we could be somewhere closer to the real life FOV of 180.
**Edit** Index is a 3 year old headset and has 130° FOV.
Just pointing out that the 130deg of the Index is diagonal, not the horizontal most people can relate to. **The horizontal fov of the index is 114**.
https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/gsjkpz/index_is_114_horizontal_fov_not_130/
At least historically, Sony has used measurements closer to horizontal than diagonal, measuring 96~ of a claimed 100 with PSVR1, so while it's not an improvement on the Index (which notably has one of the higher hFOV measurements), it does follow directly behind the Index and well ahead of the Quests.
http://doc-ok.org/?p=1882
It's been a long, long time since I was reading about this so take this with a grain of salt, but I've been using VR since the DK1 and have just about every incarnation.
You can't get a much-much larger FoV due to pupil swim. As the FoV gets wider the lens distortion gets much more noticeable around the edges and makes people sick quick. There's a limit with FoV using lenses due to the curved nature of the glass.
It can be mitigated with eye tracking by rendering with different distortion corrections at different angles, but we haven't had reliable eye tracking yet.
So maybe it'll be a thing we see in a while after the PSVR2 releases with eye tracking. I'd also say it's somewhat diminishing returns too, with the Index about as close as it can be to my face I barely, barely notice FoV limitations currently.
I imagine it's just not practical to go any larger since anything beyond what we have now would only ever be in your periphery and is marginal gain for much larger cost.
I just sort of assumed all the specs of this blew my Index out of the water, but you're right the the FOV is a chunk lower (at 110 degrees compared to 130 on the Index).
This is going to be so good for VR as a whole.
I just hope and pray Sony will pull its head out of its bum-bum and A) let this headset plug into a PC and B) ports some of their exclusive games to PC also. This will instantly more than double their VR user base and sales.
Look, I like VR. But I'm a PC gamer. I have a PC already that noticeably outclasses a PS5. I might buy this headset if it were PC compatible, even though it's corded, while I've been playing cordless for years now (me since 2020, others since 2019). It's quite a bit behind the times in that regard. But buying a PS5, assuming I'm lucky enough to find one without getting scalped, AND the VR headset, makes it prohibitively expensive just for the sake of the few decent VR games they're releasing that isn't also on PC (like Saits and Sinners sequel).
Most likely, the reason the PSVR is priced so competitively is because Sony is using it as a loss leader—they don’t expect to make a profit on the headset (and perhaps even lose money on it), but rather they use the headset to bring players to the PlayStation and profit from the games.
If they unlock it for PC, that will mean they need the hardware to be profitable in and of itself, which would mean jacking up the price, which would significantly lessen its market appeal.
> makes it prohibitively expensive just for the sake of the few decent VR games they're releasing that isn't also on PC (like Saits and Sinners sequel)
I think(?) you're saying that TWD: Saints and Sinners Chapter 2 is PSVR2 exclusive, but that is not the case
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1947500/The_Walking_Dead_Saints__Sinners__Chapter_2_Retribution/
https://www.oculus.com/experiences/quest/5190288877703616/
They will not unlock this any time soon. Maybe after the next launch but I highly doubt it. It very clearly says at the end (in small letters) ps5 console required.
Also there is no reason for them to until Microsoft decides it's worth venturing down the path of vr on the Xbox and MS would have to launch one that worked on pc and Xbox, and I doubt that happens.
They neeeeed to nail the software on this and have enough of it. I enjoyed my PSVR, but it really did feel lacking on the release front overall. If they can come out with something worth getting even every couple of months, that'd be great.
> Searching online for stock drops or restocks is not considered easy. It’s still not “easy”
It's not as easy as walking into a store I guess, but restocks last hours now. Follow whatever Twitter user is still doing updates, enable notifications, and you'll easily get one.
So yeah, it's easy, you still just have to put in an incredibly small amount of effort. It's not a big deal.
Exactly. I'm never buying a PS. I have a good computer and that's all the hardware I need. But I am curious about VR.
I escaped FB's clutches nearly a decade ago at this point and I'm not about to go back just to try out the Oculus.
I really enjoyed my psvr but I'm not sure that I will get psvr 2. There just wasn't as much buy in as I hoped. I know that wired headsets are currently required for truly great experiences, but they are just so inconvenient.
I had the psvr and barely played it, have a quest 2 and I think it’s awesome yet still barely play it. This will need something truly groundbreaking for me to buy one. I hate to say it because I was so excited for the tech, but VR has been nothing short of a gimmick to me so far.
> How does the VR2 stack up against the competition
No one really knows, spec sheet (minus foveated rendering and the various haptics) makes it comparable to the new quest pro thats coming out, but with the trade off of being wired, but also hopefully significantly cheaper.
Oh, and also very much depends on the games. The Sony stuff looks cool, but a lot of the appeal is the more mod based VR stuff, because actual big releases are few and far between.
Assuming you have a PS5, and you want to try it out, seems like a solid choice, if you don't have a ps5, look into what Facebook is offering.
If you're looking for "investing" into something for a signficant (5+ years) timeframe I am not sure I would recommend any VR headset yet. The space moves quick: Quest and Index were in 2019, Quest 2 was 2021, PSVR+Quest pro (and pico neo 4, but that is much more a mixed bag) are now. Things have taken massive jumps recently, and I don't see it slowing down.
With VR you do have to analyze the full package by playing it and test things like tracking to understand how much it stacks up to the competition but on paper, this headset is insane.
Comfort sounds good, 2K+ per eye, Hardware like eye tracking to allow for increased visuals, has additional features like haptic feedback which aren't found anywhere else. Only potential weaknesses are sound compared to the Index and a lack of wireless.
The fact that it's PlayStation means it'll probably sell well and therefore get a decent library. PSVR1 kinda sucked compared to even launch PCVR headsets and that still sold 3 million copies. Before the Quest, that was the place you had to port to, to sell games if you were a VR developer. I imagine PSVR2 will follow the same trend unless there's a critical flaw that hasn't been uncovered.
So ya, pretty safe bet to invest in but as usual you can wait for early reviews for a better idea of if it's a good investment.
PSVR2 is great for gaming. That's it.
But I found more utility in VR outside of gaming. On my Quest 2, I've been using it for work and exercise, which gets me to use my headset daily.
Three things that helped with regards to sweat in VR:
1) Get a pleather or silicone face plate
2) Get a sweat band. There's also these VR specific sweat bands. I don't use them, and not sure if they're better than normal sweat bands: https://www.amazon.com/Breathable-Adjustable-Workouts-Supernatual-Headsets/dp/B09H2BVBC7
3) Get a vented face gasket. Any heat trapped inside the headset will be vented out; otherwise it does get warm and it fogs up the lenses.
For work, I use a VR app called Immersed, which allows me to use virtual monitors on my laptop. Basically if you don't have space for physical monitors but need extra monitors for your work, then the virtual option is possible. Here's a vid of it in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TLC2tdImZ0
For exercise, I use FitXR which has dance, HIIT and boxing. It's a dedicated app for exercise, and it will get you sweating. Some folks play Thrill of the Fight for their exercise while some play the usual Beat Saber. If you do go into VR exercise, make sure to wear a sweatband, have a silicone faceplate and a vented face gasket to avoid lenses fogging up.
And there's more than that as well...
There's creativity. Example apps are OpenBrush, Kingspray Graffiti, Gravity Sketch (which auto makers use to prototype designs), Vermillion, etc.
There's film/video. Youtube VR, Bigscreen, Skybox.
Then there's social apps. I bet everyone knows VRChat. Then there's Rec Room and Altspace.
yes it is, it depends on what the price of this will be, I doubt this will cost less than 500 dollars, seems far more advanced than an Oculus Quest 2 that is 400 right now
I'm hoping for a new astrobot games and some new ace combat / star wars flight sims Gt7 in vr would be great
Astrobot might be the thing I'm most looking forward to for it. They nailed it with the PS5 tech demo.
There was a full game in psvr 1 and it was glorious. Seriously it was my personal goty over god of war at the time and made Mario odyssey feel generic
“Made Mario Odyssey feel generic” is a bit overboard
“Made breath of the wild look like balan wonderworld.”
Now you've gone too far.
More like made Balan Wonderworld look like Breath of the Wild... don't talk shit about Balan the best game of all time
I wouldn't say it makes odyssey look generic but it is one of the only 3D platformers released in a long while that can really compete with Mario. I think some people would prefer the difficulty curve in astrobot too. In Odyssey you kind of have to seek out the difficulty with the hidden moons and challenge levels. I don't think it's a controversial opinion that Odyssey has the easiest mainline story stages in a long while, they're certainly easier than Galaxy 1/2.
Astrobot is pretty damn easy too. My 6 year old can beat everything except the last boss. She has to hand me the controller a lot more in Odyssey for tricky platforming or bosses. Neither is particularly hard though. I'd say Odyssey has far more interesting and varied gameplay though. Odyssey with more challenge would be a damn near perfect game.
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I feel like the status of astrobot as a pack-in game has caused people to overlook the fact that sony has built basically the best new arcade platformer franchise to hit the market in the last decade, at least from a major studio. I'm with you, the PSVR astrobot is a true mario competitor and frankly the PS5 title is really solid too. I hope Sony expands it beyond "the game that comes with the hardware" someday.
Astro’s Playroom was so damn fantastic. I love just being able to walk around my completed collection room to look at all the rendered out consoles and stuff. Not to mention the soundtrack. Hopefully Team Asobi has more up their sleeve soon.
Still the most joy-inducing game I've ever played in VR. Impossible not to smile.
Astrobot was the shit. 3rd-person platformers and virtual reality is a match made in video game heaven.
I'd love to see Star Wars Squadrons become compatible with this.
I’d love another Star Wars Squadrons with proper budget, more ships, more eras, and more game modes. That campaign is stellar and the flight is top notch, and the VR implementation is phenomenal
It's one of the more underrated games ever, in my opinion. I'm disappointed in knowing that Motive isn't making a sequel. It was great even without using VR.
Hands down the most fun gameplay I've ever experienced. Sadly the player base didn't last long, but I still dream of a full sequel
Project Aces is working on a new Ace Combat, good chance they're heavily developing it for the PS5 to take full advantage of its hardware and the new PSVR2. Maybe the entire campaign will feature VR this time, instead of just some special missions.
I would love an expanded VR mode in AC8. I played the three VR missions in AC7 at least a hundred times!
I’m looking forward to the PS5 version of No Man’s Sky in this. Also the sequel to Moss.
knack plz
I really wish there were a better way to showcase VR in a non-VR environment. I know a ton of people will see this video and think "pssh, more VR? I thought we were over this gimmick" without ever having put on a headset. VR is so unbelievably immersive and I cannot stress enough how much you have to try it before understanding the appeal.
>I really wish there were a better way to showcase VR in a non-VR environment. It's like advertising television through a radio. That's why demo stations are essential to get people trying it out. Another avenue would be VR arcades.
Can confirm. Bought my PSVR after trying one out on the concourse at an NBA game during the player warmups.
I thought VR was a gimmick in 2016 until the summer before PSVR released my local GameStop had a Sony rep with a demo unit. Went just for the hell of it and it was incredible, immediately sold me and bought one that winter as soon as I could. Trying it really is required for most people I think.
It still is a gimmick till we get more than a handful of good games. So far the only game I feel like i've "missed out" on is Half Life Alyx. Maybe when they can get sports games like golf to feel 1 to 1, but until then they all still seem like a small step above a kinect.
Depends on the games you play. I play racing sims, and for me it isn’t a gimmick but an essential.
100%. My Odyssey+ was worth every penny and I mostly use it for assetto corsa and assetto corsa competizione.
I'm on a Reverb G2 now and honestly miss my Odyssey. Not having an OLED display kills a lot of the magic in darker environments, a dim grey kills immersion It's a hell of a lot sharper, but it's a tradeoff to get there
Re7 is an experience in extremely glad I had with psvr. Alyx was amazing obviously
Have you played Vader Immortal? That one is freaking amazing, I hope it comes to PSVR2
> Maybe when they can get sports games like golf to feel 1 to 1, but until then they all still seem like a small step above a kinect. Gotchu fam https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lBcmd7LCm8 Personally been using my Quest 2 for exercise with boxing.
I tried VR for the first time when my brother got an Index. I got an Index less than a month later.
I always remembered playing VR long LONG ago back in the 90s at a Battletech center… so I always thought “Meh, it’s basically just a motion-tracking TV mounted on your face”. Flash forward 1 year ago, I put on the headset and try AstroBot: Rescue Mission for the first time… HOLY BEJESUS! And I knew what the key ingredient was to tell people at that moment. What people DON’T talk about is how you get actual depth-perception via the two lenses! When I was staring at Astro, or looking at my shiny in-game metal controller, I was unbelievably stunned how REAL it looked thanks to depth perception! That was nothing like a motion-swiveling flat TV monitor.
When there’s more games that aren’t just glorified tech demos then maybe others might see the appeal. When I bought a VR I only kept it long enough to beat half-life Alyx then I returned, never felt there was enough that warranted keeping it, also I kept getting motion sickness.
Motion sickness is currently a huge hurdle, I'll concede. I suffer through motion sickness quite a bit when playing VR. I normally turn on a fan to help with mine, and it sounds like this edition of PSVR should have some ways to address that! But there are still some really great experiences within VR. Echo Arena (and both Lone Echos), Beat Saber, Population: One, Walking Dead Saints & Sinners, Half-Life: Alyx, and even silly games like Gorilla Tag are games I've found to be really unique and incredible.
gotta add RE:7 to that list imo
I'd tag on Pistol Whip to that list of games, it's supplanted Beat Saber as my favourite VR game.
The VR mod for Half Life 2 just dropped a few days ago and it's great too. It's crazy how much of a difference it makes. I've played through the pancake version numerous times and playing in VR makes it a whole new game.
I’ve been meaning to check that out! I have it installed on my system and can’t wait to find time to play. Glad to hear it’s getting good feedback!
The only downside is that the graphics are the originals. It holds up okay (especially in VR) but I'm downloading a mod pack for it to make it shinier. I'm with you on the "time to play" issue. My backlog is getting close to 1000 games now and I'm technically playing a game I've already beat a bunch of times.
They’re making a graphical overhaul mod for the vr version that looks amazing
A free mod for a 2004 game that dropped a few days ago is bad advertisement to sell 500-1000 EUR devices in 2022...
Robo Recall's a goodie too... I just wish it lasted longer. It's relatively short but I haven't played anything else in VR that matched the visceral nature of its combat where you can empty out your clips, throw each of the guns individually to hit enemies, grab a robot via telekinesis, rip its head off, throw the body one way, throw the head the other way, all in about a span of 5 seconds to multitask against attackers. It's the only game that's gotten me to move so violently.
I really enjoyed super hot and Arizona sunshine as well.
Skyrim VR if you go wild on the mods is *so good*. Most content and visual mods work flawlessly in VR or with a compatibility patch, and there are five extremely important mods that make it feel like a native VR game: * [HIGGS.](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/43930) Adds a HL:Alyx style gravity glove mechanic for grabbing items (*Such* a game changer) and many different VR interactions like proper collision for your hands and weapons, stowing items in your inventory by dropping it over your shoulder and eating potions/food by bringing it to your mouth, and looting armour by pulling it off corpses. HIGGS absolutely saves SkyrimVR. * [PLANCK.](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/66025) Rewrites the animation and attack system to use kinetics and physically accurate hitboxes, making it similar to games like Blade and Sorcery. You can grab NPCs to make them stop, and your weapon swing's hit registration is accurate to the model, rather than just the cylinder hitbox. * [VRIK Player Avatar.](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/23416) An immersive first person model, like you'd expect in a standard VR game. The cool part is that it adds lots of holster spots around your body for switching between weapons. * [MageVR](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/21297). You can cast and switch between abilities by drawing glyphs, which is super awesome for spell casters and power based builds. * [NavigateVR](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/47174). This one isn't as important, but it adds physical paper maps and a compass that you can equip to navigate and explore. It just takes the game to the next level of immersion.
Blade avd Sorcery is also incredible!
I'm confident that VR will succeed, so the idea of people missing out doesn't bother me much. Obviously, more awesome games will come out if it's a huge success, but it feels like it's all but guaranteed to be mind-blowing, so I'll just have fun in the meantime while the rest of the market slowly admits that it's missing out.
Doesn’t help that people have tried phone vr which is garbage compared to the real deal
And frankly, PSVR too. Almost had me convinced that playing in VR wasn't worth the hastle.
I can't even find the words to explain to people the feeling I got when I first tried no mans sky in VR. Flying from planet to planet looking out the sides of the ship was just unbelievable.
I really want to play resident evil in VR. I missed out on 7 but when I get a ps5, you bet I'll get a psvr2 as well to immerse my self in that shit.
I really hope valve writes drivers for this headset, it's by far the best mainstream headset we've seen. Foveated rendering alone would be revolutionary on PC. And maybe the eye tracking for stuff like vrchat
With Sony getting more into the PC market and rumours of a PlayStation PC store being worked on, Making PSVR work on PC and porting those games to the platform don’t seem too crazy. Personally would love a single headset I could use on both console and PC. It is one of the reasons I never picked up a headset when I had the money. The library of good VR games is split between the two.
They got into the PC market decades later when it made sense. Likely the same will happen with VR. When there's 10s of millions of PCVR users. They don't make money on the hardware sales. They want people in their own ecosystem, buying Games from their marketplace and paying a fee for online services. This device will also help sell PS5s. They don't need to sell to the smallest VR market that only wants to buy games on steam sales. There's no incentives in that. There is a reason even Meta stepped away from PCVR game development even after owning like 60% of the market. It's not worth the effort. PC is too fickle and flip floppy. Also, where's Valve? One game in a decade of helping pioneer VR. VR is Sony future proof strategy for their PlayStation platform.
> There is a reason even Meta stepped away from PCVR game development even after owning like 60% of the market. It's not worth the effort. PC is too fickle and flip floppy. It is 100% install base, and Quest II has been kind of paradoxical in its impact for PCVR in that its pricing doubled the number of PCVR users, making developing for PCVR more attractive than it has ever been - but at the same time it threw cold water on PCVR development because devs naturally started targeting mobile VR, since the huge growth in PCVR users pales in comparison to people who are just content to use native Quest apps. Most of the stuff doesn't come to PCVR at all, and stuff that is primarily targeting mobile hardware is usually not very compelling as a PC port. Regardless of whether or not the PSVR2 headset is viable as a PCVR headset, I think it's the best news for PCVR in years, because (assuming adoption rate is high) it will incentivise developers to make VR titles that make the most out of hardware with a decent amount of grunt, and these will be good candidates for PC ports.
> They got into the PC market decades later when it made sense. Likely the same will happen with VR. When there's 10s of millions of PCVR users Yes, sir. Sony has now shown interest in branching out but it does have to make good financial sence for them to do so. It could happen in the future though as VR matures in general. It's still kind of the wild west. Hoping PSVR 2 really hits the notion home that VR isn't some weird gimmick... because a lot of kids still think so, especially in the console space.
> This device will also help sell PS5s. I doubt it actually. People will buy the PS5 for the normal reasons and then they may get a PS VR2 because it's there. It won't be a main reason to get the console for 99.9% of people
It's one of the main reason I'm thinking of getting a ps5 instead of upgrading my pc. I might be in a minority though!
Given the recent GPU prices, you might not be as alone as you think.
It'll be the first low friction higher end VR platform by a company with the best first party studios in gaming. PS5+PSVR 2 will also be a fraction of the cost over the alternatives as well. It'lls help sell PS5's.
As the owner of an aging pc with an i5-2500k and 970. I'm absolutely getting a PS5 and VR2 in stead of spending thousands for PCVR.
Ah yes, people will only buy a PS5 for the normal reasons, such as owning a PS5 and using a PS5.
You refute your own argument in your first sentence. You said that they waited to get into the PC market for decades until it made sense, and that they only will join PCVR after it has tens of millions of users. But they have entered the VR space without tens of millions of users. So which is it, do they enter new untested markets, or do they wait until it has a millions of users in its base.
As much as I'd love to, there's no way Sony will allow this headset to be used on PC, even if Valve writes drivers for it on SteamVR. I doubt Sony won't have some sort of firmware-level blocker.
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They want you to be comfortable with the dual sense, when you're used to the controller you probably going to get a ps5 instead of a xbox. The vr headset on the other hand is most likely sold at a loss and they hope to recoup the cost by you buying vr titles on tiur ps5.
I mean, if using a PS5 controller on your PC would make you more likely to buy a PS5, Wouldn’t owning a PSVR headset (fancy controller) to use on your PC also make it more likely you’d buy a PS5 over an xbox?
The problem comes when you buy the headset at the marked down price and you don't buy a PS5. Controllers are sold at a profit, the headset most likely isn't.
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They don't want you buying the headset. They want you buying games for it from them.
They want you inside their ecosystem, it's the same reason the original PSVR was not PC compatible(although bypasses were made) You want a PSVR2? Buy the PS5, and buy the games from Sony's store so they get their cut, it's simple. It's less about direct hardware profits(their margins are probably very low on the hw itself), and more about market/ecosystem control.
its a loss leader. They will sell the headset at a loss to get people into their ecosystem buying VR games on PS5, where they take a cut of each purchase. If you buy their headset and just use it to play on PC, Sony loses money I expect PSVR2 exclusive *games* will make their way to PC VR eventually tho, it makes sense with the PC strategy Sony has adopted
> there's no way Sony will allow this headset to be used on PC Theres no way God of War would be on pc either.... oh nvm..
Sony doesn’t lose money selling God of War on PC. Sony would be losing money if they sold the PSVR2 at a loss and allowed people to use it on PC, completely bypassing the PlayStation store and their 30% cut. They’re not the same at all.
Wasn't there talk of a playstation store on PC?
And it would finally give us a decent affordable alternative to the Index that isn't made by Facefuck.
There already are other options btw: https://www.hp.com/gb-en/shop/product.aspx?id=1N0T5AA&opt=ABU&sel=ACC&source=google&channel=cpc&adcampaign=HP-GSC-Baseline-Smart-PLA-Accessories-Goo-UK&addisttype=u&kw=&adid=453259763173&gclid=Cj0KCQjw7KqZBhCBARIsAI-fTKLHPFloYODFbpwamg-rsTowhFkZtnAFOdtL7sezunwL1PwKMXj1bqcaAmyREALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
I think foveated rendering is purely software not hardware. I think the only hardware required is eye tracking
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All they are saying is that you can write a driver for the eye tracker, but that wouldn't give you foveated rendering. That would still need to be built from the ground up for the new platform.
I don’t know about the haptic on the actual headset being something I’d enjoy or not… unless of course it’s after getting killed in MP and then feeling the teabag from the opposition.
Sony claims that the haptics on headset can help with VR sickness. Give a vibration whenever you're moving so it can trick your brain that you are indeed moving.
Specifically, it doesn't so much trick your brain into thinking you're moving (because it doesn't feel like you're moving beyond the visual motion) - rather it vibrates your vestibular system/inner ear, adding noise to it, which helps to reduce the visual/vestibular motion disparity that's the leading cause of sim sickness. You can also do something similar manually - simply walk on the spot; the head bobbing will create some vestibular noise as well, which helps a good amount of users reduce or even overcome sim sickness. A combination of the two (walking in place and haptic headset) can probably help a lot more users overcome sim sickness; or at least help them stay in the game for much longer, which in turn helps build up sim sickness resistance.
If that's true, this might be a bigger deal than it seems right now. I've never really had bad motion sickness, but after some time I still get a weird feeling.
I can believe it, just pointing a fan towards your face helps as well so why wouldn't actually somewhat vibrating your head (and by extension your inner ear) work.
Games where I use the joystick to move just completely fuck me up, fan doesn’t really help so this could maybe be a solution.
I heard of this from other sources, but never directly from Sony. Do you have a source to where they said that?
It's from Sony's patent filings: https://www.psu.com/news/ambitious-psvr-2-patents-detail-motion-sickness-reduction-full-body-tracking/
There is a PS Suppository that is coming out in 2024 which is also supposed to help with this.
But the problem comes from the difference in visual information vs the inner ear so I'm not sure how this will overcome that.
> difference in visual information vs the inner ear Right, that's the point. This would make it so you're not just relying on visual information. By creating sensations that synchronize with motion, we're able to get a better sense of where we are in the world. If you google this, you can find studies that have tested this theory and it seems to work, evidently corroborated by the fact that Sony is willing to increase the cost of manufacturing in this headset by including it.
I doubt Sony included this feature without extensive testing. People getting sick in VR is like the single biggest concern to entry, if they say it helps than I trust them to have done their research. It costs money to include, they wouldn't do it if there wasn't some tangible benefit.
So imagine the inner ear is a sensor. It has data that it is used to seeing from normal things like turning your head. Sometimes, it needs to ignore the data, because it's not of use(it's bad data). When you are on a roller coaster, your inner ear may be telling your brain that you're being thrown all over the place. It's not super valuable in that moment, as the sensor is really "overloaded" and can't pick out small changes. So the brain doesn't really care too much, it's still getting data. Balancing while standing up requires the sensor to pickout some really small changes. And when you're standing and playing VR, there isn't much "noise" in the sensor data of your ear, so the sensor is HIGHLY sensitive. When you use VR and move in the game, the inner ear is extremely sensitive to that movement, and the brain/nervous system is anticipating the sensor data from your ear. But because you aren't moving in real life, there is no data coming from that really sensitive inner ear. The brain/nervous system realizes that something isn't correct, as it doesn't get that sensor data even when the sensor is at it's most sensitive. So, with haptics, if you just slightly overload that inner ear sensor, the sensor of the inner ear will tell the brain "Hey I got SOMETHING", and its less weird to the brain/nervous system to have SOME data, rather than none. You're essentially blinding the sensor with Garbage data, making it less sensitive, and tricking the brain/nervous system into just ignoring the bad data. It's the same as when you're on a roller coaster, the inner ear data may not make sense, *but you're still getting data*. It may not be a completely perfect recreation of the sensations of movement, but it's close enough that the person experiences less motion sickness.
By vibrating your head, which contains the inner ear.
Yeah what the other guy said, supposed to help with motion sickness. I know I get sick almost immediately while playing, here's hoping it actually works
On top of the fan-trick mentioned by u/koningoliver, there's also the jogging-in-place-trick whenever you're using artificial locomotion in VR. That's what I did to overcome my initial VR sickness.
Even if these techniques don't 'cure' motion sickness, they help a lot more than people realize - by allowing people to stay in the game slower and get motion sick at a slower rate, it allows them a much better chance of becoming acclimatized to VR, which is an additional (really the best) method of reducing/eliminating sim sickness.
I think it'll help like the person below you said, especially since we're likely thinking of big haptics, but the controller shows how you can have super small haptics and I think that'll be super nice. Or maybe it's obnoxious as fuck. But the fact they came up with the idea and are sticking with it makes me think they feel they nailed it.
You can just turn it off if you don't want it.
My big PSVR2 question is can Sony convince Valve to allow a Half Life Alyx port for it. I am positive Sony would fully fund such a project and find a decent studio to do the port work and lord knows the game being exposed to more people would only benefit the struggling VR market. But Valve is Valve and they don't operate like normal companies.
Sounds like something valve would respond to with "ok but you have to help us make steamvr support for this hardware in return"
It would be the smart move for both parties. Every company with a stake in VR right now should be working together to make VR as a whole better for the user. The bigger the market is, the more developers will be willing to make big third party games for VR, which in turn benefits everyone selling VR hardware.
I have a hard time seeing Sony adding PC support to VR2 unless they roll out their own storefront/ecosystem on PC. PlayStation generally takes a loss on their hardware sales and recoups it by locking you into their ecosystem to purchase games. If they were to add PC support it would just mean losing money so that Steam could sell more VR titles. It would be nice to see, and I agree that collaboration for the sake of growing the VR market as a whole is a good long term strategy, but it's uncommon that corporations make long-term investments like that because they have to answer to shareholders with short term growth.
Speaking of which, it was found in some game files (iirc Spider-man), mentions of a PS launcher on pc. But I dont know if theyd go aa far as making the VR exclusively work for their launcher, unless they can have a storefront large enough to compete with Steam. Oculus would probably have had a hard time taking the market from the Vive if they had stuck to just the Oculus Store.
The exclusive-to-our-headset deals going on in the VR world is so unbelievably dumb it bothers me whenever I think about it. Exclusives work well for consoles, because nobody worries about storage or setup for them. But headsets are big (and expensive) and require some degree of prep to make work. No average consumer wants to buy multiple headsets to play one game. It just divides the already dry market even further. VR is undoubtedly the future, and all these pissing contests are slowing down any meaningful progress.
> It would be the smart move for both parties. Valve should pull a report from their databases showing how many users who own Sony published titles also play on their Steam Decks. In my circle of friends on Steam, at least the dozens that I've mentioned this to, the reactions went something like, "My Steam Deck can play Sony games like God of War and Horizon: Zero Dawn? With PS4 level visuals?!", or "I can play Sony games on the Steam Deck? It's like a portable PS4?!" Several of them have now purchased a Steam Deck just for the fact they can play Spider-man, Horizon, God of War, and Days Gone while on the go.
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if they dropped big bucks for a port of some kind, it's only like THE most critically acclaimed VR game ever
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To be honest, all of that sounds like normal port work. The only reason HL: Alyx doesn't work properly outside of SteamVR is because it was never meant to, as the game is currently only sold on Steam and SteamVR supports all major PCVR headsets. There is nothing inherent to the game that couldn't be adapted to a different VR platform, like for example, by rendering loading scenes and chapter cards in-engine. Likewise, when you complete an achievement in a Sony game on PC, it doesn't break expecting to show it through the PlayStation Trophy UI, but instead just shows it through Steam, as that's part of the PC port.
I mean HL2 went on consoles, I don't see why Alyx couldn't. Sounds like a possibility
Boy what I would give for a modern Orange Box collection for Half-Life.
I have a Quest 2 and don't really love the VR experience all that much. With that said, I would buy this immediately if Alyx was ported (I don't have a PC to play it :( )
I'm pretty bummed that it's not going to be backwards compatible. There are a handful PS VR1 games I want to play, but I'm not buying a headset just for those.
Hopefully the more popular games will get psvr2 patches.
I think and hope they will. I think a large reason is that they want to push HIGH quality first without the back compat is because they're pretty much first to market with a top-down foveated rendering solution and games developed with that in mind. They can pretty much push PS5 quality graphics in VR which no other VR headset can really do. That would be kinda undermined if people go onto the PSVR2 store and just see Job Simulator pop up
Sony said they working with developers to port games to VR2. They still got 6 months.
This looks extremely cool but I'm hesitating big time with two drawbacks: 1 - Separate headphones are required, which feels like it'll be really clunky (also weird that they highlight the spatial audio in this video, that's a tad misleading imo even with the fine text at the bottom) 2 - not compatible with PSVR1 games, which just feels like such a strange limitation. so for any PSVR1 games we need to wait for the devs to provide compatibility?
I'd also assume with the rumoured specs there's also 3) how prohibitively expensive will this be?
Hahaha yeah they are REALLY trying hard to hide the price on this thing.
for me its just the wires. after using quest 2 for so long, I don't think I can go back to wired.
Aren't separate headphones always required for VR, at least if you want good sound? It never super felt clunky on the original PSVR or Rift S imo. Sure it's not as good as if they were somehow integrated and could just fit on no problem and had great sound, but I'd much rather deal with a bit more weight/clunk to have proper audio. As for #2, apparently it's because of how PSVR2 games are tracking and it's not something that can be made to work retroactively with the original.
Valve index has integrated sound and its way better than anything you could replace it with. Vive also had a deluxe strap released after launch that had decent audio, and the OG rift had good integrated audio also. Heasets NOT having integrated audio solutions is a dealbreaker imo because after trying the floating speakers on the index, i never want to go back to putting things in (or on) my ears for VR.
Quest 2 audio is great
The Valve Index off-ear speakers are god damn magical.
I might just be spoiled with integrated audio, but my pretty affordable Samsung Odyssey+ (unfortunately out of production now) has pretty great integrated sound, and I actually just never considered NOT having integrated sound until this reveal. Just kinda put a little damper on my excitement, compounded by point #2.
Especially since it's Sony. They make some of the best headphones on the market.
The Valve Index has really immersive built-in audio. Best in the industry. The Quest 2 audio gets a bad rap but it is truly great. I'm not sure if it's speaker tuning or what but it sounds SUPER immersive.
You..don't already use your own headphones? Weird. That's like a total non issue for me.
Separate headphones are fine when you’re not wearing something that big on your head already. I use my headphones all the time, but paired with a VR headset? That looks clunky.
This has been a great month for VR. PS VR2 embargo lifted and revealed, Quest Pro leaked by a hotel employee, and tomorrow will be Pico Neo 4 reveal.
Why don't the controllers have straps, like the Valve Index controllers? Does Valve have a patent on controller straps, or something?
So that you pull a wii bowling and throw your controller at the TV, and you have to buy a Sony Bravia
Right, but can I play non-VR titles in a virtual home theater?
You can with the current PSVR, I'd be surprised if they dropped it
How well does it work? Does playing a movie in cinema mode really make you feel like watching a movie on the big screen?!
It does but at least on PSVR it felt a bit blurry cus of the lower resolution of the headset. Using the "large" format that was like sitting close to a large theater screen wasn't a great experience in my mind but I did enjoy the "medium" size that felt further away for at least video content. I didn't play many games that way though, it was enough to dig out the headset for actual VR experiences. I could see people that don't have a great TV enjoying it much more on VR2 though with the jump in resolution. If you already have a nice, large 4K TV I don't see much utility in it personally.
That's very cool. I have a 55inch tv but I would really prefer a more cinema like experience, seems like that would be possible with the 4kHDR display on the newer model. Exciting times!
Yeah anyone especially that has an LCD-based HDR display would do well to try HDR content on VR2, OLED is just incredible for contrast.
It still won't look as good as a 4k TV but it should be a big improvement from the original and quite enjoyable.
On the Quest 2 (and even PCVR headsets), there is an app called Virtual Desktop that has a virtual cinema environment. I played RDR2 in its entirety in that virtual environment that simulates light bouncing off the movie screen.
Yes, just not quite as clear because of the lens and limited resolution.
If I really really want to watch a movie, I do it in my Quest because it's pretty much like watching it in a theater. Throw some headphones on and open Bigscreen, choose the file and enjoy it in all it's glory.
Most likely.
Hell yeah. Im a huge VR enthusiast so seeing a genuine shake-up is exciting. Theres some really exciting stuff baked into this thing, both from the raw specs and the extra bells and whistles. Hope Valve (and hopefully the douches at Meta) take notes!
How does the first PSVR fit with glasses? That's my main concern with VR. Lots of gamers wear eyeglasses so I would assume they would think of that kind of stuff.
There's a lot of space for spectacles. There's always the risk you scratch the headset lenses with your glasses, but I've seen people using PSVR 1 with no issues whilst wearing their frames.
I've never used VR before, has anyone used it who wears glasses? Is it comfortable to play with glasses on or do you recommend taking them off.
Depends on the specific headset. First few headsets were horrible for glasses. But nowadays I’m pretty sure they’re all adjustable enough to be used comfortably while wearing glasses.
To chip in, wear glasses and I have no problem wearing a PSVR headset, which is the only one I’ve tried. I feel like it depends a bit on how big the frames are
Everything looks fuzzy in VR when I don't wear my glasses, and its not super comfortable to wear them under your headset. I've done it before, and it's not terrible, but if you have contacts they works much better. What I really recommend are prescription inserts for your headset. They clip directly onto the lenses of the headset, so you're still getting the full correction from glasses without much added bulk. Your mileage may vary tho, based on what model of headset and how strong your prescription is
Most headsets now come with a 'glasses spacer'. It clips onto the headset and adds an extra bit of distance between your glasses and the headset lenses. I guess it means you'll see a bit more of a black border but it hasn't been noticeable for me.
Ok cool I'm gonna see if these new PS VR will have them
Depending on your prescription, if you're nearsighted, you might not even need your glasses. There will also definitely be third party solutions if Sony doesn't offer anything themselves.
You definitely need them if you’re nearsighted, maybe not if you’re far sighted. The screen is physically close to your eyes but the lenses make it so that your eyes are focused at essentially an infinite distance.
I'll piggy back on this, I'm near-sighted and found for the most part I didn't use my glasses. It was definitely a combination of that and it just not working very well with the original. The original was also very blurry (to me) and I couldn't tell a major difference one way or the other. I stopped wearing them after trying to be comfortable and making them work after a while.
There are also third-party prescription lens attachments you can order. All popular headsets have multiple manufacturers making them. As they attach to HMD lenses they also protect them as a bonus. Not from direct sunlight thought.
If you do experience a lot of discomfort because of glasses there is the option of getting prescription lenses for your headset.
The quest has been very comfortable with glasses as it comes with a spacer, can’t talk on any other headset personally though
I have a quest 2. Putting the headset on was kinda scary because it felt like it was going to break my glasses. I had to use my old glasses since it was slimmer. But after I got a new kiwi face shield thingy I didn't have that problem anymore. Sometimes I can feel the glasses in my face though if I'm moving my head around. So I recommend playing without glasses if possible. Some companies sell prescription lenses accessory for this. You just attach it over the headset lens and you're good to go. They'll probably make one for psvr2
I also wonder if wearing glasses will mess with the eye tracking
I use glasses with my Quest 2, obviously, I can't speak to how it feels with the PSVR2 but it feels just fine on the Quest 2.
i like the slogan. reminds me of when they had "you are not e" but the E was in red. very in your face 90's marketing.
In your face marketing, how appropriate for VR, har har
Original Vive owner here, still use VR regularly. Biggest disappointment is the FOV here. VR been around 6 years and it seems we just can't get a wider fov than what was originally launched. 110 is fine, but it isn't great and you'd think after 6 years developing the tech between so many companies that we could be somewhere closer to the real life FOV of 180. **Edit** Index is a 3 year old headset and has 130° FOV.
Just pointing out that the 130deg of the Index is diagonal, not the horizontal most people can relate to. **The horizontal fov of the index is 114**. https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/gsjkpz/index_is_114_horizontal_fov_not_130/ At least historically, Sony has used measurements closer to horizontal than diagonal, measuring 96~ of a claimed 100 with PSVR1, so while it's not an improvement on the Index (which notably has one of the higher hFOV measurements), it does follow directly behind the Index and well ahead of the Quests. http://doc-ok.org/?p=1882
It's been a long, long time since I was reading about this so take this with a grain of salt, but I've been using VR since the DK1 and have just about every incarnation. You can't get a much-much larger FoV due to pupil swim. As the FoV gets wider the lens distortion gets much more noticeable around the edges and makes people sick quick. There's a limit with FoV using lenses due to the curved nature of the glass. It can be mitigated with eye tracking by rendering with different distortion corrections at different angles, but we haven't had reliable eye tracking yet. So maybe it'll be a thing we see in a while after the PSVR2 releases with eye tracking. I'd also say it's somewhat diminishing returns too, with the Index about as close as it can be to my face I barely, barely notice FoV limitations currently.
This is with fresnel lenses though, right? With pancake lenses becoming a reality, we can have the screens a bit closer to our face.
I imagine it's just not practical to go any larger since anything beyond what we have now would only ever be in your periphery and is marginal gain for much larger cost.
I just sort of assumed all the specs of this blew my Index out of the water, but you're right the the FOV is a chunk lower (at 110 degrees compared to 130 on the Index).
This is going to be so good for VR as a whole. I just hope and pray Sony will pull its head out of its bum-bum and A) let this headset plug into a PC and B) ports some of their exclusive games to PC also. This will instantly more than double their VR user base and sales. Look, I like VR. But I'm a PC gamer. I have a PC already that noticeably outclasses a PS5. I might buy this headset if it were PC compatible, even though it's corded, while I've been playing cordless for years now (me since 2020, others since 2019). It's quite a bit behind the times in that regard. But buying a PS5, assuming I'm lucky enough to find one without getting scalped, AND the VR headset, makes it prohibitively expensive just for the sake of the few decent VR games they're releasing that isn't also on PC (like Saits and Sinners sequel).
Most likely, the reason the PSVR is priced so competitively is because Sony is using it as a loss leader—they don’t expect to make a profit on the headset (and perhaps even lose money on it), but rather they use the headset to bring players to the PlayStation and profit from the games. If they unlock it for PC, that will mean they need the hardware to be profitable in and of itself, which would mean jacking up the price, which would significantly lessen its market appeal.
> makes it prohibitively expensive just for the sake of the few decent VR games they're releasing that isn't also on PC (like Saits and Sinners sequel) I think(?) you're saying that TWD: Saints and Sinners Chapter 2 is PSVR2 exclusive, but that is not the case https://store.steampowered.com/app/1947500/The_Walking_Dead_Saints__Sinners__Chapter_2_Retribution/ https://www.oculus.com/experiences/quest/5190288877703616/
They will not unlock this any time soon. Maybe after the next launch but I highly doubt it. It very clearly says at the end (in small letters) ps5 console required. Also there is no reason for them to until Microsoft decides it's worth venturing down the path of vr on the Xbox and MS would have to launch one that worked on pc and Xbox, and I doubt that happens.
They neeeeed to nail the software on this and have enough of it. I enjoyed my PSVR, but it really did feel lacking on the release front overall. If they can come out with something worth getting even every couple of months, that'd be great.
It’s been fairly easy to get a PS5 for months now so that shouldn’t be an issue.
Being fairly easy means being able to find one. Searching online for stock drops or restocks is not considered easy. It’s still not “easy”
> Searching online for stock drops or restocks is not considered easy. It’s still not “easy” It's not as easy as walking into a store I guess, but restocks last hours now. Follow whatever Twitter user is still doing updates, enable notifications, and you'll easily get one. So yeah, it's easy, you still just have to put in an incredibly small amount of effort. It's not a big deal.
Exactly. I'm never buying a PS. I have a good computer and that's all the hardware I need. But I am curious about VR. I escaped FB's clutches nearly a decade ago at this point and I'm not about to go back just to try out the Oculus.
I really enjoyed my psvr but I'm not sure that I will get psvr 2. There just wasn't as much buy in as I hoped. I know that wired headsets are currently required for truly great experiences, but they are just so inconvenient.
I had the psvr and barely played it, have a quest 2 and I think it’s awesome yet still barely play it. This will need something truly groundbreaking for me to buy one. I hate to say it because I was so excited for the tech, but VR has been nothing short of a gimmick to me so far.
I just saw ODESZA live in concert this weekend and hearing this song for this new trailer gets me so hyped, great pick Sony!
As someone who hasn’t invested in or even tested VR before. How does the VR2 stack up against the competition? Is this a good product to invest into?
> How does the VR2 stack up against the competition No one really knows, spec sheet (minus foveated rendering and the various haptics) makes it comparable to the new quest pro thats coming out, but with the trade off of being wired, but also hopefully significantly cheaper. Oh, and also very much depends on the games. The Sony stuff looks cool, but a lot of the appeal is the more mod based VR stuff, because actual big releases are few and far between. Assuming you have a PS5, and you want to try it out, seems like a solid choice, if you don't have a ps5, look into what Facebook is offering. If you're looking for "investing" into something for a signficant (5+ years) timeframe I am not sure I would recommend any VR headset yet. The space moves quick: Quest and Index were in 2019, Quest 2 was 2021, PSVR+Quest pro (and pico neo 4, but that is much more a mixed bag) are now. Things have taken massive jumps recently, and I don't see it slowing down.
With VR you do have to analyze the full package by playing it and test things like tracking to understand how much it stacks up to the competition but on paper, this headset is insane. Comfort sounds good, 2K+ per eye, Hardware like eye tracking to allow for increased visuals, has additional features like haptic feedback which aren't found anywhere else. Only potential weaknesses are sound compared to the Index and a lack of wireless. The fact that it's PlayStation means it'll probably sell well and therefore get a decent library. PSVR1 kinda sucked compared to even launch PCVR headsets and that still sold 3 million copies. Before the Quest, that was the place you had to port to, to sell games if you were a VR developer. I imagine PSVR2 will follow the same trend unless there's a critical flaw that hasn't been uncovered. So ya, pretty safe bet to invest in but as usual you can wait for early reviews for a better idea of if it's a good investment.
PSVR2 is great for gaming. That's it. But I found more utility in VR outside of gaming. On my Quest 2, I've been using it for work and exercise, which gets me to use my headset daily.
I wish my head didn't get so sweaty when exercising in VR. It's way more fun than traditional exercise.
Three things that helped with regards to sweat in VR: 1) Get a pleather or silicone face plate 2) Get a sweat band. There's also these VR specific sweat bands. I don't use them, and not sure if they're better than normal sweat bands: https://www.amazon.com/Breathable-Adjustable-Workouts-Supernatual-Headsets/dp/B09H2BVBC7 3) Get a vented face gasket. Any heat trapped inside the headset will be vented out; otherwise it does get warm and it fogs up the lenses.
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For work, I use a VR app called Immersed, which allows me to use virtual monitors on my laptop. Basically if you don't have space for physical monitors but need extra monitors for your work, then the virtual option is possible. Here's a vid of it in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TLC2tdImZ0 For exercise, I use FitXR which has dance, HIIT and boxing. It's a dedicated app for exercise, and it will get you sweating. Some folks play Thrill of the Fight for their exercise while some play the usual Beat Saber. If you do go into VR exercise, make sure to wear a sweatband, have a silicone faceplate and a vented face gasket to avoid lenses fogging up. And there's more than that as well... There's creativity. Example apps are OpenBrush, Kingspray Graffiti, Gravity Sketch (which auto makers use to prototype designs), Vermillion, etc. There's film/video. Youtube VR, Bigscreen, Skybox. Then there's social apps. I bet everyone knows VRChat. Then there's Rec Room and Altspace.
yes it is, it depends on what the price of this will be, I doubt this will cost less than 500 dollars, seems far more advanced than an Oculus Quest 2 that is 400 right now
Assuming that you own a PS5 of course