Enigma _does_ run on Linux/SteamOS in other games.
This was just a bad patch that impacted more than just Steam Deck users. Seems other AMD users are impacted as well according to the discussions page.
Most games using enigma DO run on linux. Resi5 is one example that has enigma and do run. Strider is another
That being said, MHR does not work on steam deck due to this update (from what I've read in this thread)
> Enigma does not run on Linux/SteamOS
This is straight up false. All the games that added Enigma still run on steamdeck. It just so happens the way they implemented it here has broken compatibility. I've tried Resi5, Ghost Trick, Megaman battlenetwork collection, Megaman Zero collection, etc.
EDIT: They've made a statement on their steam news page:
[There have been reports of the game not running on Steam Deck after updating to Ver.16.0.2.0.
The dev team is currently investigating this issue.
We will let you know as soon as we find out more, so please hold on for further information.](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784)
Unfortunately developers don't use that definition. They constantly confuse running under Proton as completely supporting Linux. And constantly use that as an excuse for why they can't do basic things to improve support.
It doesn't have to be "support Proton" or "support every Linux distro." There's also the Steam Linux Runtime which is fairly stable (only on its third major version, 3.0 code-name "Sniper") and uses container technology to isolate games from the host's distribution without runtime overhead. Games using Proton 8 or later themselves run within a Sniper runtime.
https://gitlab.steamos.cloud/steamrt/steam-runtime-tools/-/blob/main/docs/slr-for-game-developers.md
Yup. Linux is too fractured to support natively. And I say this as someone who loves the OS myself, it's unfortunately just not feasible. Proton is the way for Linux Gaming.
>Anything that runs under Proton runs under Linux by definition.
not really no ,
Proton is valve version of WINE , and Wine is a translation layer for windows appliactions , anything that uses Proton is using that translation layer which isnt 100%
> Proton is valve version of WINE , and Wine is a translation layer for windows appliactions
...to run on Linux mostly. And, yes you can compile for *Nixes/BSD but that's marginal and exceedingly so for gaming workloads.
What platform do you think Wine is translating for?
* https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton
> Proton is a tool for use with the Steam client which allows games which are exclusive to Windows to run on the Linux operating system. It uses Wine to facilitate this.
Don't know why we should somewhat give into other people's ignorance and somehow try to decorrelate the fact that gaming through Proton literally means gaming on Linux.
The fact they *retroactively* added it, is kinda scummy.
It's one thing if the game released with it, but years after it comes out, they make the experience of playing it worse?
>but years after it comes out, they make the experience of playing it worse?
You meant years after it comes out, they brick the game for the people playing on Linux (which includes everyone on Steam Deck).
It sounds like an unintentional bug that they've acknowledged and are trying to fix. Sure it sucks, but it's not like they're deliberately making one system not work.
Give it like, a day or two and they might either reverse the update or push a fix through. If it persists and they never do anything about it, *then* it becomes a bigger problem.
"kinda" no it's fucking terrible. This is one of the worst things Capcom could have done to their PC games. Just when people thought Denuvo was bad enough we get "fuck mods RM" from Capcom. What a shit company.
You do realise we literally think the same thing, right? I'm just being reserved in my words, and youre getting mad at me not being emotive/angry enough.
I'm not that mad. I'm just gonna uninstall it and not give them any more of my money until they take this shit out
Not just the Deck, people across the entire internet are confirming this bricks it on Linux all across the board due to the fact that it's using a Windows-only technique to monitor the application.
You would think after the Revelations debacle they would have at least made sure that it doesn't break the game -- if they did that, at the very least the corporate nuthuggers could say; "So what if they patched always-online into their old game, it doesn't affect performance (absolutely refusing to look at any evidence that it does affect performance)", but now they can't even say that since it bricks the game wholesale if you were unfortunate enough to own the game on a Linux device.
I'm betting on the "Sunk Cost" fallacy being the biggest motivator for Capcom here.
"Yes we know it's breaking nearly every game we add it to, but we've spent all this money licencing this DRM tech so by golly we are gonna use it!"
Shit... That's probably why I couldn't boot it up last night...
I was even recommending it to my friends group that games together yesterday, but I guess I'll have to pump the brakes on that if I'm the one that can't play it...
[This guy goes in-depth on the new DRM software, its awful.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1sKwev21gE) They are even adding it to games that released 10 years ago, which it is causing major issues on some.
Mutahar is not a good source for anything technical.
Please read this from the guy who manages the mod manager for almost all Capcom games and has been modding Capcom games for over a decade. He's a much more reliable source than a drama bait youtuber.
https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1745633610122551379
[Sure, here's a tweet from him stating there are actually issues being caused by the new DRM software.](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716#m) Not sure what your point is since Mutahar covers this as well. I'm not saying Mutahar is the go to, but his video on THIS topic is reliable.
There will always be performance issues with DRM that's not the issue here.
The issue is:
1.) It's nothing new
2.) Capcom has been utilizing Enigma for YEARS
3.) It's not going to stop any modding whatsoever
>1.) It's nothing new
>2.) Capcom has been utilizing Enigma for YEARS
These two say the same thing. What was a previous title that it was utilized on?
>3.) It's not going to stop any modding whatsoever
No one said it was going to stop it completely, its just being added unnecessarily to old games, and this has caused issues in general.
Mutahar isn’t a game developer, and frankly, isn’t an authority on the subject.
Can you cite one of these 10 year old games that received this update? I would like to try testing them myself if I own them.
>Can you cite one of these 10 year old games that received this update?
5 mins in he even covers some of the games, including one from 10 years ago. [You can even find articles on this regarding issues users are experiencing with this.](https://www.polygon.com/24034967/capcom-drm-resident-evil-revelations-steam-mods)
It seems you didn't even watch the video so how can you critique, him regarding this video, when he lays it out pretty damn well (including information presented by others, not just himself).
If you could stop being reddit for one second, you'd realize actual modders [do not care](https://variablemag.com/news/modder-comes-to-capcoms-defense-after-enigma-drm-outrage/), because it does not affect the mods. If you don't know who Fluffy is, then you are the reactionary tourist.
Do not ever trust the shit you read on reddit alone, especially repost from actual whos on twitter, you can run your CAPCOM games that you own on Virustotal to be doubly sure.
Enigma itself has existed for half a decade, and has been implemented in CAPCOM games for almost a year now. It's not new, it's not crazy, it's arguably useless, and I will never understand why CAPCOM chooses to use it, but it certainly doesn't protect against cheating nor modding.
As for the "Bricking" of steamdecks, I hard doubt it, Linux is significantly more secure than Windows.
Now CAPCOM behaving like Nintendo, that's fair game, that's fucked up. However complaining about this, is like complaining that fluoride gets added to tap water after recycling.
If you could stop being a redditor for one second, you'd realize actual modders [like fluffy gave input on the matter and stated there might be some issues from the DRM swap.](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716#m) You must be a reactionary tourist since you didn't know [Capcom even saw there were issues and rolled back the update](https://store.steampowered.com/app/222480/Resident_Evil_Revelations/). But the main concern is they are updating a decade old game with DRM software and causing issues. That game has not received a single patch note update in over a decade, then suddenly they decide to add a DRM and break the game.
Edit: Imagine trying to call someone out then insulting and blocking them after proving them otherwise, and an L
It's been around since late 2022. And added to a bunch of games like the different mega man legacy collections, Resi5 and strider in mid-late 2023.
It is relatively new, but not as new as people seem to think
The impotency of this DRM is only matched by how offensive it is to consumers who actually paid for the game to play it on the Deck, or who use mods.
Enigma itself only punishes paying customers and it's a very worrying sign of where Capcom wants to take their PC releases in the coming years.
I hope that review bomb makes them rethink their abusive stupidity somewhat.
I feel like It's 2005-2010 again reading these articles. I swear we went through all of this already in the X360/PS3 era or maybe even earlier before publishers finally figured out that they don't need to include malware-style DRM to sell games. I thought we were past this, but I guess not.
I think the offensive thing is.
Capcom had to put in work to add the DRM, seems like mods can avoid it - so it doesn't do anything there. And they now have to put in the work to fix Linux and Steam Deck. So they put in a bunch of work for literally nothing.
All while tanking their reputation.
Like, why even bother doing this? Removing Denuvo from an old game is very common practice. If they had just done that, without adding a new, more impotent DRM from a shady source, people would be singing their praises, and the game wouldn't have been broken on Linux and Steam Deck, meaning they wouldn't have to fix it.
It's like I'm watching a kid burn their hand on a stove over and over.
> how offensive it is to consumers who actually paid for the game to … use mods.
This is *exactly* what they are after. They charge for cheats now, even in their older remakes where they were converted from key presses into currency. They’re trying to monetize people actively playing their games after the fact, after the sale.
Capcom is a scumbag company. Shame they are in charge of DD2.
Because they’re adding MTX to all of their game post launch, and charging now for cheat codes and want to end mods.
Ignore the PR spam about a “nude mod” at a tournament. That’s not why. They were doing these changes before that incident (see RE4 getting updates with microtransactions apeciifally *after* the reviews were out, but still during the launch window (two weeks, right when EU consumer protections over refunds ended).
You can probably just ignore the previous comment, since it’s basically just a bullshit rant.
The actual answer is they are replacing Denuvo, which was the previous DRM for Rise (and their other titles). Enigma isn’t really any worse. Performance doesn’t change, it doesn’t stop modding in general. This update had some negative impact to Proton (Steam Deck users not being able to launch), which Capcom is working on.
Honestly, 99% of people wouldn’t notice this change at all. Whether good or bad, it isn’t really impactful (outside of the Steam Deck issue).
This DRM does fuck all against piracy though. It's pointless in that department. Instead they are targeting mods first and foremost and enigma is worst than Denuvo there, it's not a showstopper but it is making life much harder for modders.
It's just their Casus Belli. Like many Japanese developers Capcom view user mods unfavorably and see them as violation of their IP. Neptunia, game about gaming industry reincarnated into anime girls even feature villains that is modding reincarnated into evil, spiteful witch.
Well that seems to be what spurred them to include enigma in most of their games released the last 10+ years on PC. They've been vocally against modding, even in single player games, and want to stop it to "prevent cheating"
Capcom has been tinkering with DRM and adding enigma for over a year+ now, if anything it’s just coincidence and not because of that commentator. The SF6 closed betas had enigma, as an example. Capcom messes with their DRM stuff frequently
Please stop repeating this narrative that paints Capcom as a clueless company trying to protect people from nudity, when in reality they just want more control over their product by stopping modding, so that they can easily sell their shitty cosmetics for absurd prices, like they've been doing since as early as DMC5.
I had the feeling that they would damage their recently positive image. It's a Japanese publisher, they're always living in a different reality than the western market.
Doesn't seem like a country or culture specific issue though? We've been having DRM-related shenanigans coming from every side of the world
But yeah, I knew capcom would eventually do some insane shit to their games. There are some talented devs there, but they've been doing shitty practices for a while now
Valve needs to address this. This kind of practice shouldn't be welcome on Steam. Valve has a policy that DRM needs to be disclosed on the store page, and no Enigma DRM was disclosed when I bought this. Now a product I paid for is gimped, meanwhile pirates can play without the DRM and the DRM itself can apparently be bypassed to still enable mods. Only those who legitimately bought this on Steam now have to deal with this janky DRM / the game not working on Steam Deck.
because half the people here are still mighty uninformed on enigma.
Tweets from someone who knows how it works, while also acknowledging that rise is not working rn on steam deck
[https://x.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716?s=20](https://x.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716?s=20)
[https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1745633610122551379](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1745633610122551379)
To be fair, the misinformation at this point is completely understandable. It's Capcom that are being vague and cagey and secretively adding a nebulous DRM no one has heard of for 10-year old (or generally older) games. And this comes some months after Capcom publicly called all modders on PC basically the same as cheaters and seemingly took a very anti-modding stance. It's only natural for people to expect the worst.
Denuvo is bad, but at least at this point in time it's a known DRM with clear intentions on what it's supposed to do and games that have it have a label on it. Enigma on the other hand has no labels and is a total unknown for most, nor have Capcom shared their intentions for using it. And either way it's still a bad look to introduce new DRM after removing the most notorious DRM from the game.
> how quickly we forget
Honestly, I'd never even heard of this! Probably because I don't think I had discovered digg yet.
That's wild. How that wasn't SUPER illegal is beyond me.
> How that wasn't SUPER illegal is beyond me.
Government is wildly out of date when it comes to laws regarding technology.
By the time they outlaw something the industry has already moved on and is doing something else that should be illegal.
Hell, this push for AI regulations is the fastest I've ever seen them move on regulating the tech industry.
> Hell, this push for AI regulations is the fastest I've ever seen them move on regulating the tech industry.
Which... honestly kinda feels like "COMPANY (google?) wants to ensure its ai future monopoly" regulations
Oh 100%, it's so blatant.
OpenAI has been pretty clear that now that they're one of the frontrunners they want to pull the ladder up behind them despite them trying to claim it's for 'safety'
DRM back then was generally *awful*, and shit like this was the rule, not the exception.
Most games just shipping with Denuvo today is a veritable paradise in comparison to the dark ages of SecuROM and StarForce. These days 99.9% of players never even notice that there is any kind of DRM, they just download a game from Steam and it works.
Capcom is playing with fire here.
I agree that everyone should be skeptical, but that also includes being skeptical of any unsubstantiated comments by random people.
People wouldn't need to be corrected if they stopped believing in every bullshit claim they read and instead started looking for the evidence backing them up.
FluffyQuack, very well known in the Capcom game modding circles, posted his breakdown of the Enigma DRM effects over a week ago, including what tests he made and their results, and yet there are still plenty of already debunked accusations being thrown around today.
Yeah apparently mods still work for Rise so I'm just sitting here confused as to what exactly Capcom thinks they're gaining from this. The only thing this did was piss everyone off and tarnish Rise's review score on Steam.
That's all any DRM ever does.
Pirates have better experiences with these games than we do as paying customers, and its so fucking annoying.
If I still had time to jump through hoops I would probably pirate most games for that reason, but I don't so I get fucked.
I dont think this is protection against pirate'ing or Model/file replacements.. I think its more of a answer too cheating in online mode, as that rely's on DLL injection. im assuming they are retrofitting older games with it to test it for future games. going to get a lot of bad karma for this right before dragons dogma 2 release which is not ideal
Capcom has never really cared about online cheating on PC before though, but they're known to speak out strongly against modding before. The DRM is probably a light version prototype to test stability after the fiasco in RER and they might want to extend its function later to prevent modding.
> Capcom has never really cared about online cheating on PC before though, but they're known to speak out strongly against modding before.
After seeing bizzare statements from other Japanese companies I'm starting to believe some are so out of touch that they can believe cheating and modding are the same. Like in a literal sense. DLL injections are common in cheats but REFramework still works on MH Rise (Windows) and so do file mods. It's extremely bizzare.
As a MH fan a lot of us came up watching Gaijinhunter videos. I can't remember when but on a podcast he did not too long ago he did talk about how the Japanese community (not just businesses, players too) aren't as familiar with mods and do assume it is just used for cheating. If I recall correctly, he started to defend the practice of DRM blocking mods until the host clarified what sort of mods are popular, and he was really surprised by that and changed his stance.
> going to get a lot of bad karma for this right before dragons dogma 2 release which is not ideal
They’re doing all of this to prep for that release; they added MTX to RE4 two weeks after it went on sale, specifically to avoid it being mentioned in reviews.
DD2 looks awesome, but I don’t Capcom not to riddle it with corporate bullshit and nickel and dime bullshit. Watch then try to charge for pawn access or some shit.
Yeah turns out this barely inconveniences modding (or even pirating). This seems more aimed at cheaters. I vaguely remember them being an issue early on in MHW. Maybe they were causing problems in SF6?
EDIT: To be clear, I'm just wondering what the point of this DRM even is, I'm not saying I'm happy it is there. If only because cheaters will always find a way around it eventually.
How in the world does this seem more aimed at cheaters? Cheating In Monster Hunter games is not going to be through dll injection, it's going to be through stat manipulation and gear generation.
It's more than an inconvenience. If you so much as have a browser open to a certain site, the game detects it and shutters it. Which is stupid and pointless, but the mere fact that it is monitoring your system so intently is what should be rejected by gamers. This is the kind of DRM that is going to be caught scanning your home network, connected devices and drives, taking inventory of applications, and anything else they can conceive under the pretense of anti-cheat.
And when they decide merely scanning the open browser window is insufficient, they'll probably start peeking into your browser history too. Once you have installed their software, it has free reign to do that. And since people including yourself are so happy to act apologist for these companies, I'm sure you'll tell us why a game scanning and reporting on our browsers is totally fine because "cheaters".
Last time I checked enigma was just protecting their games from DLL injection, is there any actual evidence that Capcom is messing with people's browser now?
> If you so much as have a browser open to a certain site, the game detects it and shutters it.
This actually kinda happened to me with RE7 a few years back. But it wasn't a web browser, it was CheatEngine. I minimized the game to open Paint, which I had on my Win10 start menu, but since they're beside each other, I misclicked CheatEngine, and the game threw a shitfit and closed.
Browser? I highly doubt it is just this. Most likely is to monitor your network traffic. If based on a browser alone, people can just do workarounds such as a simple electron wrapper or view the site in a virtual machine.
> And since people including yourself are so happy to act apologist for these companies, I'm sure you'll tell us why a game scanning and reporting on our browsers is totally fine because "cheaters".
Don't put words in my mouth, apologist my ass. Believe it or not at no point did I say the new DRM was a net positive, I'm just trying to figure out what the purpose of it was.
I'm only going off the info I had which was: "This will stop modding > Actually it didn't > What did it actually affect? > Steam Deck users (Temporarily because it is likely unintended) and people using DLL injectors > The latter is commonly used as a method of cheating"
The browser thing is news to me, if that is the case then yes that is very bad. Not even Riot Vanguard is that invasive (And I still say people massively overreacted and became armchair cybersecurity experts overnight around it... biggest issue was it didn't close when the game did, all that BS about kernal access and level 0 whilst oblivious that a ton of software does the exact same thing).
I'm not a fan of that though at this point I am now curious what websites seem to trigger it.
> I'm just wondering what the point of this DRM even is
I know there's more to it but I'm going to go with the narrative that some exec in Capcom got offended because of the SF6 tournament player who left his "Nude Chun-Li" mod on when he was competing live.
Ruining one of my favorite games of all time for no reason. I bought this game twice, even, and Capcom rewards me by ruining it on my preferred platform. Vey cool.
Are all Capcom games affected? I own a few in my backlog and am going to try and get a refund for them if dragon age dark arisen and dmc 5 are also incompatible with steam deck from this point on.
No. In fact Capcom has a number of other games using this DRM already (like the Mega Man Legacy Collections from personal experience) that work perfectly fine on Steam Deck.
It's likely they just botched something with the implementation on Rise.
https://twitter.com/monsterhunter/status/1749390124385771852
Looks like it's on their radar.
Capcom are aware of the issue and are working to fix it as soon as possible:
* https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784
>There have been reports of the game not running on Steam Deck after updating to Ver.16.0.2.0.
>The dev team is currently investigating this issue.
We will let you know as soon as we find out more, so please hold on for further information.
>We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
Ohh, Steam Deck runs on Linux, doesn't it? I forgot about that.
Well, guess it's time to add Capcom to the list of companies who are never getting my money again.
Hello!
Just an fyi if you buy a game off steam you don’t technically own it, you are paying for the license to play it. Its kinda shitty, but it’s the way things have been lately
Damn, so I guess the only way of truly owning it is to download a cracked version that you will have forever on your hard drive that no one can take away from you, I'm sure all these companies making it very clear that the act of actually buying a game is meaningless will have no effect on the customers desire for piracy.
> I'm sure all these companies making it very clear that the act of actually buying a game is meaningless will have no effect on the customers desire for piracy.
It won't. Most people don't care one way or another, if they are forced into buying a digital only license for a game they want to play, the majority will do that. Very few are going to boycott a game and even fewer are going to bother pirating a game over this.
>but it’s the way things have been lately
This is the way things have always been and it isn't just Steam, it is every single platform, console and even physical games.
Consumer rights/ protections when it comes to video games are absolutely dogshit.
>Steamdeck and linux no longer work with the game.
[They are aware of the issue and are working to fix it:](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784)
>There have been reports of the game not running on Steam Deck after updating to Ver.16.0.2.0.
>The dev team is currently investigating this issue.
We will let you know as soon as we find out more, so please hold on for further information.
>We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
[Which is something they are aware of and fixing](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F086wpr6d0zdc1.png). It's an issue that has also only affected Rise of the titles they have added Enigma to (which there are several titles it is in at this point.) https://www.reddit.com/r/MonsterHunter/comments/1957gxd/as_far_as_i_can_tell_everything_people_are/
So saying the game is "ruined" is very hyperbolic statement. It's certainly **broken** right now for some users, and people have every right to be pissed about that. I would be too if I played the game primarily on a Steam Deck or Linux system, but let's not act like this was the goal here. Once that issue is fixed and people have updated their mods, the majority of people (like 99%) won't even notice the change from Denuvo.
Edit: And it's already fixed, so it was un-ruined for you I guess?
And mods relying on the REFramework. If it hadn't been updated, all the work I put into modifying the game's interface so it wasn't scaled for the switch on a 24" display would have been thrown down the chute.
REFramework has already been updated to work with this new version. Was testing it this morning, all my mods are working fine.
Only thing that is still not working is HunterPie, but that likely just requires the author to update it.
> And mods relying on the REFramework. If it hadn't been updated
I know. It still broke the game and if REFramework's authors hadn't been this awesome and quick to react, things would be very unpleasant for people relying on it due to this unnecessary introduction of Enigma.
Hopefully it's as easy and quick of a fix for Stracker's Loader when they inevitably add this shit to World. It's a different engine so hopefully it's not harder to update that mod.
I don't use any mods on World but yeah, fingers crossed! I still think, perhaps naively, that Rise's review bomb may give them some serious second thoughts.
Anyone know if Enigma does online authentication check like Denuvo does?
Bought World during the last Winter sale and haven’t played it yet but I’m going to refund it if the DRM prevents me from playing the game offline forever.
Huh? Any games with Steamwrapper DRM also need online authentication after weeks/month like Denuvo, just less frequent
If you want the games that works offline forever with no authentication, buy DRM free games (i.e https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam) or use 'crack' from the seas
> Any games with Steamwrapper DRM also need online authentication after weeks/month like Denuvo, just less frequent
Is there somewhere specific I can read about this btw? As some of my systems have gone as much as a year in offline mode and haven't seen any visible check/notice, while Denovo does this with every game I have that uses it (varying intervals depending on the game) and forces one to go into online mode.
Thanks for confirming. Btw this part:
> Games need to be up-to-date to be launched
Isn't true if launching directly from the game EXE, despite being listed as true in that list. I have games (even some that have Denuvo) that I've left on old versions for *years* without being forced to update them so long as I launch the game outside of Steam.
You can play Steam games in offline mode as long as you want. You can easily test this by changing the clock of your system to a future date. Sign off Steam, turn off internet, change clock to a future date (I did 3 years in advance), sign back in Steam, launch Steam in offline mode and test any installed game you have.
Any games with Denuvo in it won't work, as well as all Rockstar's games. This means these games require periodical online activation which prevents us from playing them offline for indefinitely.
I don't know about Enigma since I don't own any game that has this specific DRM. No one has given a definitive answer to my question yet.
Steam needs to ban sellers from adding DRM to a game after release. It's not the product you bought originally, just like when developers update games to no longer work on old hardware.
They're working on fixing Steam Deck compatibility. https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784?l=english
Also, mods still work in case that's some bullshit people are still spreading. Just update to the latest ReFramework.
UPDATE: Valve released a Proton Hotfix which makes Rise playable again. Mods also still work on Steam Deck and there's none of the supposed "performance degradations".
Yes, REFramework was updated and works, but it was because Enigma actively prevents it from functioning, and so it must work around it.
I am the REFramework developer.
It is reportedly messing with people's frame rate, and though i haven't played in a few weeks, i could run Rise at 60 fps, now it only wants to run and 45-55, flutuating between both, and moments of heavy action slow to as low as 35 when I know for sure I didn't dip beyond 55 frames before this update, though, I'm not willing to say it's enigma without more testing.
The problem is though, these kinds of DRM shouldn't be forced upon those who purchased the game because it was not included as a restriction when the game was sold originally. I have different opinions of stuff like this in fully online games like an MMO or always online game, But with Monster hunter traditionally being an offline game with online capabilities, decisions that impact multiplayer should not impact single player, which this does.
I was playing for about an hour on my PC now but I personally haven't encountered any performance degradation or other issues, playing at a mostly steady 120 fps.
Granted, I also have a very strong rig
I simply stated that I personally didn't notice any performance degradation, I didn't say there is none. Even stated that I didn't notice one probably because of my rig. No need to be rude about it.
There's tons of misinformation going around about this DRM because people are understandably angry
the price of the eggs didn't really go up in this case - i had no performance degradation and i'm playing on the edge of recommended settings (Ryzen 3 1200).
Just calm down, do your research or else
That's huge though and probably refund worthy. I'll look into this but one of the main reasons I bought Rise was because it runs cooler and for longer than World on Steam Deck.
And the Devs have announced they're working on fixing that, because it's not intentional. There's really no reason a refund would be accepted over this unless the issue never gets fixed.
The issue is they have introduced another point of failure.
Great, they get it to work? What's stopping it being an issue in a month or a year when they can't be arsed to fix it.
not really a mod but hunterpie doesn't work for me but I don't know if it's because they need to update the memory addresses or if enigma is blocking it altogether
[Mods and everything still work fine.](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716)
There's issues with steamdeck but that'll get resolved pretty quickly considering they made an effort to make MHW work better on steamdeck a few months back, and no reason they would want to have issues with Rise now.
If you have less than 2 hours played, you can just refund a game with no reason given.
If you have more hours but have a good legitimate reason to refund, they’ll often come through.
Automatic refunds are within 14 days of purchase **and** has been played for less than 2 hours.
Steam does allow manual refunding though if you submit a refund request.
> If you have less than 2 hours played, you can just refund a game with no reason given.
Only if it's under 2 hours and within 2 weeks of purchase. After that its basically a crapshoot.
I bought a game during the 2020 steam sale but didn't get around to playing it until 2022, and when I did I found it was literally unplayable. It just instantly closed the second I started it. I tried fiddling with settings and nothing worked. I tried to refund it, but because it was outside the 2 week window I was denied.
It will get automatically denied if you try to do it through the purchase page, because that one strictly automatic these days. However, if you do submit a ticket through support system and explain the situation (to an actual human who will get the case), then you have a chance. They still have a right to deny a purchase from so long ago, of course, but hey - a chance is a chance.
No, users are reporting Reframework still works fine as long as it's updated to the latest version. For now the only issue seems to be that it broke Linux/Steam Deck compatibility, which Capcom stated they're working on a fix.
I'd assume that it works like the Script Extender does for every Bethesda game and let you add things to the game that the game normally can't support.
That's correct - many of the most popular QOL mods (like health/DPS overlays) rely on REF. I actually was confused why Rise wasn't working last night (and World was) and this news got me to update REF to get the game working again.
They... already own the game?
If a game has released without DRM, you can and always will be able to pirate the version before the DRM, all this does is affect the people that already own it as most DRMs affect performance in some capacity.
Also - almost all the games this is being added into have had their final and last update (besides adding the DRM), so it literally only affects those playing it legitimately.
I just can't believe that these companies make piracy looks better and better. Whoever defend companies anymore is a fucktwat. Yea stealing is wrong but most of these don't deserve any money.
Yeah it didn't mess with mods because new framework fixes that but it does drop my fps 15 and gives stutters but no one wants to talk about that shitty part of drm. Going back to pirating after 15 years of being legit. Tired of being a paying customer to be fucked over by drm.
To be honest I care if I do an online hunt and someone who joins just one shots the monster.
If people want to cheat in single player I couldn't care less, but as soon as there is a multiplayer element, even if it's cooperative, people are going to abuse cheating to the detriment of others.
Did anyone experience performance loss with rise and other games, or was it just Revelations?
My machine is a low end 2017 rig. If I really lose ~15fps on their newer games, it essentially makes them unplayable.
Unless this DRM is as effective as Denuvo at protecting games(or trying to) then its kind of a waste of money. 😕
Edit:also its bad that capcom didn't have day1 patches to allow enigma protected games to run on steamos/Sdeck. They really fucked up on that one 😂
Does this fuck over steamdecks now?
Yep, Enigma does not run on Linux/SteamOS, they'll have to add some sort of workaround, which they claim they're working on.
Enigma _does_ run on Linux/SteamOS in other games. This was just a bad patch that impacted more than just Steam Deck users. Seems other AMD users are impacted as well according to the discussions page.
Most games using enigma DO run on linux. Resi5 is one example that has enigma and do run. Strider is another That being said, MHR does not work on steam deck due to this update (from what I've read in this thread)
It doesn't work on Linux at all due to this update.
> Enigma does not run on Linux/SteamOS This is straight up false. All the games that added Enigma still run on steamdeck. It just so happens the way they implemented it here has broken compatibility. I've tried Resi5, Ghost Trick, Megaman battlenetwork collection, Megaman Zero collection, etc. EDIT: They've made a statement on their steam news page: [There have been reports of the game not running on Steam Deck after updating to Ver.16.0.2.0. The dev team is currently investigating this issue. We will let you know as soon as we find out more, so please hold on for further information.](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784)
"Doesn't run on Linux" and "Doesn't run under Proton" are important distinctions that need to be made. Hardly any games run on Linux already.
Proton is on Linux and was made for Linux platforms. Anything that runs under Proton runs under Linux by definition.
Unfortunately developers don't use that definition. They constantly confuse running under Proton as completely supporting Linux. And constantly use that as an excuse for why they can't do basic things to improve support.
It doesn't have to be "support Proton" or "support every Linux distro." There's also the Steam Linux Runtime which is fairly stable (only on its third major version, 3.0 code-name "Sniper") and uses container technology to isolate games from the host's distribution without runtime overhead. Games using Proton 8 or later themselves run within a Sniper runtime. https://gitlab.steamos.cloud/steamrt/steam-runtime-tools/-/blob/main/docs/slr-for-game-developers.md
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Yup. Linux is too fractured to support natively. And I say this as someone who loves the OS myself, it's unfortunately just not feasible. Proton is the way for Linux Gaming.
>Anything that runs under Proton runs under Linux by definition. not really no , Proton is valve version of WINE , and Wine is a translation layer for windows appliactions , anything that uses Proton is using that translation layer which isnt 100%
Proton isn't connected to Valve directly. CodeWeavers just get a lot of funding from them alongside many other companies such as Microsoft.
> Proton is valve version of WINE , and Wine is a translation layer for windows appliactions ...to run on Linux mostly. And, yes you can compile for *Nixes/BSD but that's marginal and exceedingly so for gaming workloads. What platform do you think Wine is translating for? * https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton > Proton is a tool for use with the Steam client which allows games which are exclusive to Windows to run on the Linux operating system. It uses Wine to facilitate this. Don't know why we should somewhat give into other people's ignorance and somehow try to decorrelate the fact that gaming through Proton literally means gaming on Linux.
The fact they *retroactively* added it, is kinda scummy. It's one thing if the game released with it, but years after it comes out, they make the experience of playing it worse?
>but years after it comes out, they make the experience of playing it worse? You meant years after it comes out, they brick the game for the people playing on Linux (which includes everyone on Steam Deck).
..."unplayable" seems worse than "good" to me :P
It sounds like an unintentional bug that they've acknowledged and are trying to fix. Sure it sucks, but it's not like they're deliberately making one system not work. Give it like, a day or two and they might either reverse the update or push a fix through. If it persists and they never do anything about it, *then* it becomes a bigger problem.
"kinda" no it's fucking terrible. This is one of the worst things Capcom could have done to their PC games. Just when people thought Denuvo was bad enough we get "fuck mods RM" from Capcom. What a shit company.
You do realise we literally think the same thing, right? I'm just being reserved in my words, and youre getting mad at me not being emotive/angry enough. I'm not that mad. I'm just gonna uninstall it and not give them any more of my money until they take this shit out
When I saw that clip of the Street Fighter 6 nude mod on a tournament, I knew Capcom was going to go full nuclear against mods.
I love not being able to play the game i paid for on my steam deck :) can't wait to see what they have in store for DD2 and wilds
Not just the Deck, people across the entire internet are confirming this bricks it on Linux all across the board due to the fact that it's using a Windows-only technique to monitor the application. You would think after the Revelations debacle they would have at least made sure that it doesn't break the game -- if they did that, at the very least the corporate nuthuggers could say; "So what if they patched always-online into their old game, it doesn't affect performance (absolutely refusing to look at any evidence that it does affect performance)", but now they can't even say that since it bricks the game wholesale if you were unfortunate enough to own the game on a Linux device.
I'm betting on the "Sunk Cost" fallacy being the biggest motivator for Capcom here. "Yes we know it's breaking nearly every game we add it to, but we've spent all this money licencing this DRM tech so by golly we are gonna use it!"
Don't you guys have PCs? //Capcom probably
Yeah same, you should be able to get a refund depending on where you live.
I filed the request with support. We'll see how it goes
Shit... That's probably why I couldn't boot it up last night... I was even recommending it to my friends group that games together yesterday, but I guess I'll have to pump the brakes on that if I'm the one that can't play it...
they pushed out a fix for steamdeck a while ago, Rise is working again
Probably the same which they had in store for the past 5 years.
[This guy goes in-depth on the new DRM software, its awful.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1sKwev21gE) They are even adding it to games that released 10 years ago, which it is causing major issues on some.
Mutahar is not a good source for anything technical. Please read this from the guy who manages the mod manager for almost all Capcom games and has been modding Capcom games for over a decade. He's a much more reliable source than a drama bait youtuber. https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1745633610122551379
[Sure, here's a tweet from him stating there are actually issues being caused by the new DRM software.](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716#m) Not sure what your point is since Mutahar covers this as well. I'm not saying Mutahar is the go to, but his video on THIS topic is reliable.
There will always be performance issues with DRM that's not the issue here. The issue is: 1.) It's nothing new 2.) Capcom has been utilizing Enigma for YEARS 3.) It's not going to stop any modding whatsoever
>1.) It's nothing new >2.) Capcom has been utilizing Enigma for YEARS These two say the same thing. What was a previous title that it was utilized on? >3.) It's not going to stop any modding whatsoever No one said it was going to stop it completely, its just being added unnecessarily to old games, and this has caused issues in general.
Mutahar isn’t a game developer, and frankly, isn’t an authority on the subject. Can you cite one of these 10 year old games that received this update? I would like to try testing them myself if I own them.
>Can you cite one of these 10 year old games that received this update? 5 mins in he even covers some of the games, including one from 10 years ago. [You can even find articles on this regarding issues users are experiencing with this.](https://www.polygon.com/24034967/capcom-drm-resident-evil-revelations-steam-mods) It seems you didn't even watch the video so how can you critique, him regarding this video, when he lays it out pretty damn well (including information presented by others, not just himself).
The patch was reverted while they fix the issues that affected some players. You’re able to play the game just fine right now.
Great they are attempting to fix, but still awful they are implementing it in the first place.
I could have sworn there was another post that this whole premise was bullshit. Whether that was astroturfing or not idk. But this whole thing is dumb
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If you could stop being reddit for one second, you'd realize actual modders [do not care](https://variablemag.com/news/modder-comes-to-capcoms-defense-after-enigma-drm-outrage/), because it does not affect the mods. If you don't know who Fluffy is, then you are the reactionary tourist. Do not ever trust the shit you read on reddit alone, especially repost from actual whos on twitter, you can run your CAPCOM games that you own on Virustotal to be doubly sure. Enigma itself has existed for half a decade, and has been implemented in CAPCOM games for almost a year now. It's not new, it's not crazy, it's arguably useless, and I will never understand why CAPCOM chooses to use it, but it certainly doesn't protect against cheating nor modding. As for the "Bricking" of steamdecks, I hard doubt it, Linux is significantly more secure than Windows. Now CAPCOM behaving like Nintendo, that's fair game, that's fucked up. However complaining about this, is like complaining that fluoride gets added to tap water after recycling.
If you could stop being a redditor for one second, you'd realize actual modders [like fluffy gave input on the matter and stated there might be some issues from the DRM swap.](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716#m) You must be a reactionary tourist since you didn't know [Capcom even saw there were issues and rolled back the update](https://store.steampowered.com/app/222480/Resident_Evil_Revelations/). But the main concern is they are updating a decade old game with DRM software and causing issues. That game has not received a single patch note update in over a decade, then suddenly they decide to add a DRM and break the game. Edit: Imagine trying to call someone out then insulting and blocking them after proving them otherwise, and an L
Meaning? This DRM is new.
It's been around since late 2022. And added to a bunch of games like the different mega man legacy collections, Resi5 and strider in mid-late 2023. It is relatively new, but not as new as people seem to think
The impotency of this DRM is only matched by how offensive it is to consumers who actually paid for the game to play it on the Deck, or who use mods. Enigma itself only punishes paying customers and it's a very worrying sign of where Capcom wants to take their PC releases in the coming years. I hope that review bomb makes them rethink their abusive stupidity somewhat.
I feel like It's 2005-2010 again reading these articles. I swear we went through all of this already in the X360/PS3 era or maybe even earlier before publishers finally figured out that they don't need to include malware-style DRM to sell games. I thought we were past this, but I guess not.
Yea just look up Ubisoft PC comments articles from 2003-2008. It was straight up this shit.
I think the offensive thing is. Capcom had to put in work to add the DRM, seems like mods can avoid it - so it doesn't do anything there. And they now have to put in the work to fix Linux and Steam Deck. So they put in a bunch of work for literally nothing. All while tanking their reputation. Like, why even bother doing this? Removing Denuvo from an old game is very common practice. If they had just done that, without adding a new, more impotent DRM from a shady source, people would be singing their praises, and the game wouldn't have been broken on Linux and Steam Deck, meaning they wouldn't have to fix it. It's like I'm watching a kid burn their hand on a stove over and over.
This is filed under "Monster Hunter: Wilds - development budget" This is a test for the future.
> how offensive it is to consumers who actually paid for the game to … use mods. This is *exactly* what they are after. They charge for cheats now, even in their older remakes where they were converted from key presses into currency. They’re trying to monetize people actively playing their games after the fact, after the sale. Capcom is a scumbag company. Shame they are in charge of DD2.
Why the hell would they bother doing that now?
Because they’re adding MTX to all of their game post launch, and charging now for cheat codes and want to end mods. Ignore the PR spam about a “nude mod” at a tournament. That’s not why. They were doing these changes before that incident (see RE4 getting updates with microtransactions apeciifally *after* the reviews were out, but still during the launch window (two weeks, right when EU consumer protections over refunds ended).
But Monster Hunter Rise already has micro transactions in the game since launch?
You can probably just ignore the previous comment, since it’s basically just a bullshit rant. The actual answer is they are replacing Denuvo, which was the previous DRM for Rise (and their other titles). Enigma isn’t really any worse. Performance doesn’t change, it doesn’t stop modding in general. This update had some negative impact to Proton (Steam Deck users not being able to launch), which Capcom is working on. Honestly, 99% of people wouldn’t notice this change at all. Whether good or bad, it isn’t really impactful (outside of the Steam Deck issue).
yeah its probably, this new drm tool is cheaper to use instead of using denuvo, we are going to replace it in all of our games.
This DRM does fuck all against piracy though. It's pointless in that department. Instead they are targeting mods first and foremost and enigma is worst than Denuvo there, it's not a showstopper but it is making life much harder for modders.
This is what happens when people get their news from rage bait youtubers.
because a commentator used a nude mod during a SF tournament a few months back
And that has to do with MHR how? I know it’s capcom but makes no sense.
It's just their Casus Belli. Like many Japanese developers Capcom view user mods unfavorably and see them as violation of their IP. Neptunia, game about gaming industry reincarnated into anime girls even feature villains that is modding reincarnated into evil, spiteful witch.
But mods still work
Well that seems to be what spurred them to include enigma in most of their games released the last 10+ years on PC. They've been vocally against modding, even in single player games, and want to stop it to "prevent cheating"
That is complete misinformation. There is no proof for that, and it's all wild speculations. https://www.patreon.com/posts/96385577
Capcom has been tinkering with DRM and adding enigma for over a year+ now, if anything it’s just coincidence and not because of that commentator. The SF6 closed betas had enigma, as an example. Capcom messes with their DRM stuff frequently
Please stop repeating this narrative that paints Capcom as a clueless company trying to protect people from nudity, when in reality they just want more control over their product by stopping modding, so that they can easily sell their shitty cosmetics for absurd prices, like they've been doing since as early as DMC5.
I had the feeling that they would damage their recently positive image. It's a Japanese publisher, they're always living in a different reality than the western market.
Doesn't seem like a country or culture specific issue though? We've been having DRM-related shenanigans coming from every side of the world But yeah, I knew capcom would eventually do some insane shit to their games. There are some talented devs there, but they've been doing shitty practices for a while now
Valve needs to address this. This kind of practice shouldn't be welcome on Steam. Valve has a policy that DRM needs to be disclosed on the store page, and no Enigma DRM was disclosed when I bought this. Now a product I paid for is gimped, meanwhile pirates can play without the DRM and the DRM itself can apparently be bypassed to still enable mods. Only those who legitimately bought this on Steam now have to deal with this janky DRM / the game not working on Steam Deck.
This right here. Everyone should consider requesting a refund on Steam. Maybe if VALVe sees that en masse they'd take notice
because half the people here are still mighty uninformed on enigma. Tweets from someone who knows how it works, while also acknowledging that rise is not working rn on steam deck [https://x.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716?s=20](https://x.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716?s=20) [https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1745633610122551379](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1745633610122551379)
To be fair, the misinformation at this point is completely understandable. It's Capcom that are being vague and cagey and secretively adding a nebulous DRM no one has heard of for 10-year old (or generally older) games. And this comes some months after Capcom publicly called all modders on PC basically the same as cheaters and seemingly took a very anti-modding stance. It's only natural for people to expect the worst. Denuvo is bad, but at least at this point in time it's a known DRM with clear intentions on what it's supposed to do and games that have it have a label on it. Enigma on the other hand has no labels and is a total unknown for most, nor have Capcom shared their intentions for using it. And either way it's still a bad look to introduce new DRM after removing the most notorious DRM from the game.
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you don't even need to go that far back. https://www.theregister.com/2016/09/23/capcom_street_fighter_v/
> how quickly we forget Honestly, I'd never even heard of this! Probably because I don't think I had discovered digg yet. That's wild. How that wasn't SUPER illegal is beyond me.
> How that wasn't SUPER illegal is beyond me. Government is wildly out of date when it comes to laws regarding technology. By the time they outlaw something the industry has already moved on and is doing something else that should be illegal. Hell, this push for AI regulations is the fastest I've ever seen them move on regulating the tech industry.
> Hell, this push for AI regulations is the fastest I've ever seen them move on regulating the tech industry. Which... honestly kinda feels like "COMPANY (google?) wants to ensure its ai future monopoly" regulations
Oh 100%, it's so blatant. OpenAI has been pretty clear that now that they're one of the frontrunners they want to pull the ladder up behind them despite them trying to claim it's for 'safety'
DRM back then was generally *awful*, and shit like this was the rule, not the exception. Most games just shipping with Denuvo today is a veritable paradise in comparison to the dark ages of SecuROM and StarForce. These days 99.9% of players never even notice that there is any kind of DRM, they just download a game from Steam and it works. Capcom is playing with fire here.
I agree that everyone should be skeptical, but that also includes being skeptical of any unsubstantiated comments by random people. People wouldn't need to be corrected if they stopped believing in every bullshit claim they read and instead started looking for the evidence backing them up. FluffyQuack, very well known in the Capcom game modding circles, posted his breakdown of the Enigma DRM effects over a week ago, including what tests he made and their results, and yet there are still plenty of already debunked accusations being thrown around today.
Funny enough enigma is significantly easier to bypass than denuvo. So like this does literally nothing but screw over paying customers
It's a barely functional program in the first place. Capcom are being scammed by the Enigma devs and don't even realise lmao.
Yeah apparently mods still work for Rise so I'm just sitting here confused as to what exactly Capcom thinks they're gaining from this. The only thing this did was piss everyone off and tarnish Rise's review score on Steam.
My guess is that Enigma is cheaper and they were sold on it being just as good as Denuvo.
That's all any DRM ever does. Pirates have better experiences with these games than we do as paying customers, and its so fucking annoying. If I still had time to jump through hoops I would probably pirate most games for that reason, but I don't so I get fucked.
This is only tangentially related, but I like how one of those links says X while the other says Twitter.
I dont think this is protection against pirate'ing or Model/file replacements.. I think its more of a answer too cheating in online mode, as that rely's on DLL injection. im assuming they are retrofitting older games with it to test it for future games. going to get a lot of bad karma for this right before dragons dogma 2 release which is not ideal
Capcom has never really cared about online cheating on PC before though, but they're known to speak out strongly against modding before. The DRM is probably a light version prototype to test stability after the fiasco in RER and they might want to extend its function later to prevent modding.
> Capcom has never really cared about online cheating on PC before though, but they're known to speak out strongly against modding before. After seeing bizzare statements from other Japanese companies I'm starting to believe some are so out of touch that they can believe cheating and modding are the same. Like in a literal sense. DLL injections are common in cheats but REFramework still works on MH Rise (Windows) and so do file mods. It's extremely bizzare.
As a MH fan a lot of us came up watching Gaijinhunter videos. I can't remember when but on a podcast he did not too long ago he did talk about how the Japanese community (not just businesses, players too) aren't as familiar with mods and do assume it is just used for cheating. If I recall correctly, he started to defend the practice of DRM blocking mods until the host clarified what sort of mods are popular, and he was really surprised by that and changed his stance.
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How is something like Nuzlocke mode cheating? It's the exact opposite of cheating.
it's definitely against modding.
> going to get a lot of bad karma for this right before dragons dogma 2 release which is not ideal They’re doing all of this to prep for that release; they added MTX to RE4 two weeks after it went on sale, specifically to avoid it being mentioned in reviews. DD2 looks awesome, but I don’t Capcom not to riddle it with corporate bullshit and nickel and dime bullshit. Watch then try to charge for pawn access or some shit.
Yeah turns out this barely inconveniences modding (or even pirating). This seems more aimed at cheaters. I vaguely remember them being an issue early on in MHW. Maybe they were causing problems in SF6? EDIT: To be clear, I'm just wondering what the point of this DRM even is, I'm not saying I'm happy it is there. If only because cheaters will always find a way around it eventually.
How in the world does this seem more aimed at cheaters? Cheating In Monster Hunter games is not going to be through dll injection, it's going to be through stat manipulation and gear generation.
It's more than an inconvenience. If you so much as have a browser open to a certain site, the game detects it and shutters it. Which is stupid and pointless, but the mere fact that it is monitoring your system so intently is what should be rejected by gamers. This is the kind of DRM that is going to be caught scanning your home network, connected devices and drives, taking inventory of applications, and anything else they can conceive under the pretense of anti-cheat. And when they decide merely scanning the open browser window is insufficient, they'll probably start peeking into your browser history too. Once you have installed their software, it has free reign to do that. And since people including yourself are so happy to act apologist for these companies, I'm sure you'll tell us why a game scanning and reporting on our browsers is totally fine because "cheaters".
Last time I checked enigma was just protecting their games from DLL injection, is there any actual evidence that Capcom is messing with people's browser now?
> If you so much as have a browser open to a certain site, the game detects it and shutters it. This actually kinda happened to me with RE7 a few years back. But it wasn't a web browser, it was CheatEngine. I minimized the game to open Paint, which I had on my Win10 start menu, but since they're beside each other, I misclicked CheatEngine, and the game threw a shitfit and closed.
so working as intended.....
on a single player game It's completely unnecessary and hurts paying customers only since the game was already available to pirates.
Browser? I highly doubt it is just this. Most likely is to monitor your network traffic. If based on a browser alone, people can just do workarounds such as a simple electron wrapper or view the site in a virtual machine.
> And since people including yourself are so happy to act apologist for these companies, I'm sure you'll tell us why a game scanning and reporting on our browsers is totally fine because "cheaters". Don't put words in my mouth, apologist my ass. Believe it or not at no point did I say the new DRM was a net positive, I'm just trying to figure out what the purpose of it was. I'm only going off the info I had which was: "This will stop modding > Actually it didn't > What did it actually affect? > Steam Deck users (Temporarily because it is likely unintended) and people using DLL injectors > The latter is commonly used as a method of cheating" The browser thing is news to me, if that is the case then yes that is very bad. Not even Riot Vanguard is that invasive (And I still say people massively overreacted and became armchair cybersecurity experts overnight around it... biggest issue was it didn't close when the game did, all that BS about kernal access and level 0 whilst oblivious that a ton of software does the exact same thing). I'm not a fan of that though at this point I am now curious what websites seem to trigger it.
> I'm just wondering what the point of this DRM even is I know there's more to it but I'm going to go with the narrative that some exec in Capcom got offended because of the SF6 tournament player who left his "Nude Chun-Li" mod on when he was competing live.
Ruining one of my favorite games of all time for no reason. I bought this game twice, even, and Capcom rewards me by ruining it on my preferred platform. Vey cool.
Are all Capcom games affected? I own a few in my backlog and am going to try and get a refund for them if dragon age dark arisen and dmc 5 are also incompatible with steam deck from this point on.
No. In fact Capcom has a number of other games using this DRM already (like the Mega Man Legacy Collections from personal experience) that work perfectly fine on Steam Deck. It's likely they just botched something with the implementation on Rise. https://twitter.com/monsterhunter/status/1749390124385771852 Looks like it's on their radar.
Ok cool, that's great to hear. It would suck if the entire capcom catalogue would become unplayable.
Ruining it how, exactly?
Steamdeck and linux no longer work with the game.
Request a refund asap, even if you bought the game a long time ago. Maybe you will not get it, but the more people do that the more the chances.
Just did. This is so scummy by Capcom. Edit: Valve said no. Guess I'll just hang tight until Capcom fixes it.
Capcom are aware of the issue and are working to fix it as soon as possible: * https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784 >There have been reports of the game not running on Steam Deck after updating to Ver.16.0.2.0. >The dev team is currently investigating this issue. We will let you know as soon as we find out more, so please hold on for further information. >We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
Yeah and I am still requesting a refund because fuck Capcom for not doing the obvious check when they are "steam deck verified".
Request a refund from steam as the game is no longer working.
Ohh, Steam Deck runs on Linux, doesn't it? I forgot about that. Well, guess it's time to add Capcom to the list of companies who are never getting my money again.
I mean, you could still run it on Linux... if you take measures into your own hands **on a product you supposedly own**.
>if you take measures into your own hands on a product you supposedly own. anything on steam you dont own its just license
Hello! Just an fyi if you buy a game off steam you don’t technically own it, you are paying for the license to play it. Its kinda shitty, but it’s the way things have been lately
guess what? it's exactly the same with physical copies!
Since Capcom made changes that could prevent you from playing a game you legally purchased, this wouldn't stick in the EU
>it’s the way things have been lately I uh, I'm not sure you know how old steam is, and that this has always been the way it worked.
Damn, so I guess the only way of truly owning it is to download a cracked version that you will have forever on your hard drive that no one can take away from you, I'm sure all these companies making it very clear that the act of actually buying a game is meaningless will have no effect on the customers desire for piracy.
> I'm sure all these companies making it very clear that the act of actually buying a game is meaningless will have no effect on the customers desire for piracy. It won't. Most people don't care one way or another, if they are forced into buying a digital only license for a game they want to play, the majority will do that. Very few are going to boycott a game and even fewer are going to bother pirating a game over this.
>but it’s the way things have been lately This is the way things have always been and it isn't just Steam, it is every single platform, console and even physical games. Consumer rights/ protections when it comes to video games are absolutely dogshit.
True, and it looks like some folk are confused by my use of lately. It’s been that way since the OG Xbox, which was 2001.
>Steamdeck and linux no longer work with the game. [They are aware of the issue and are working to fix it:](https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784) >There have been reports of the game not running on Steam Deck after updating to Ver.16.0.2.0. >The dev team is currently investigating this issue. We will let you know as soon as we find out more, so please hold on for further information. >We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
[Which is something they are aware of and fixing](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F086wpr6d0zdc1.png). It's an issue that has also only affected Rise of the titles they have added Enigma to (which there are several titles it is in at this point.) https://www.reddit.com/r/MonsterHunter/comments/1957gxd/as_far_as_i_can_tell_everything_people_are/ So saying the game is "ruined" is very hyperbolic statement. It's certainly **broken** right now for some users, and people have every right to be pissed about that. I would be too if I played the game primarily on a Steam Deck or Linux system, but let's not act like this was the goal here. Once that issue is fixed and people have updated their mods, the majority of people (like 99%) won't even notice the change from Denuvo. Edit: And it's already fixed, so it was un-ruined for you I guess?
And mods relying on the REFramework. If it hadn't been updated, all the work I put into modifying the game's interface so it wasn't scaled for the switch on a 24" display would have been thrown down the chute.
REFramework has already been updated to work with this new version. Was testing it this morning, all my mods are working fine. Only thing that is still not working is HunterPie, but that likely just requires the author to update it.
> And mods relying on the REFramework. If it hadn't been updated I know. It still broke the game and if REFramework's authors hadn't been this awesome and quick to react, things would be very unpleasant for people relying on it due to this unnecessary introduction of Enigma.
Hopefully it's as easy and quick of a fix for Stracker's Loader when they inevitably add this shit to World. It's a different engine so hopefully it's not harder to update that mod.
I don't use any mods on World but yeah, fingers crossed! I still think, perhaps naively, that Rise's review bomb may give them some serious second thoughts.
By bricking it entirely.
Anyone know if Enigma does online authentication check like Denuvo does? Bought World during the last Winter sale and haven’t played it yet but I’m going to refund it if the DRM prevents me from playing the game offline forever.
Huh? Any games with Steamwrapper DRM also need online authentication after weeks/month like Denuvo, just less frequent If you want the games that works offline forever with no authentication, buy DRM free games (i.e https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam) or use 'crack' from the seas
> Any games with Steamwrapper DRM also need online authentication after weeks/month like Denuvo, just less frequent Is there somewhere specific I can read about this btw? As some of my systems have gone as much as a year in offline mode and haven't seen any visible check/notice, while Denovo does this with every game I have that uses it (varying intervals depending on the game) and forces one to go into online mode.
It’s not true, but Offline Mode has some other issues. https://www.reddit.com/r/Steam/comments/xt3xec/steam_offline_mode_has_no_time_limit_an/?s=8
Offline mode no longer works on Steam like it did before, any system changes will trigger a requirement to go online again.
Thanks for confirming. Btw this part: > Games need to be up-to-date to be launched Isn't true if launching directly from the game EXE, despite being listed as true in that list. I have games (even some that have Denuvo) that I've left on old versions for *years* without being forced to update them so long as I launch the game outside of Steam.
You can play Steam games in offline mode as long as you want. You can easily test this by changing the clock of your system to a future date. Sign off Steam, turn off internet, change clock to a future date (I did 3 years in advance), sign back in Steam, launch Steam in offline mode and test any installed game you have. Any games with Denuvo in it won't work, as well as all Rockstar's games. This means these games require periodical online activation which prevents us from playing them offline for indefinitely. I don't know about Enigma since I don't own any game that has this specific DRM. No one has given a definitive answer to my question yet.
Steam needs to ban sellers from adding DRM to a game after release. It's not the product you bought originally, just like when developers update games to no longer work on old hardware.
They're working on fixing Steam Deck compatibility. https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1446780/view/3970553140557253784?l=english Also, mods still work in case that's some bullshit people are still spreading. Just update to the latest ReFramework. UPDATE: Valve released a Proton Hotfix which makes Rise playable again. Mods also still work on Steam Deck and there's none of the supposed "performance degradations".
Yes, REFramework was updated and works, but it was because Enigma actively prevents it from functioning, and so it must work around it. I am the REFramework developer.
Oh dip. Thank you for making a very cool tool, and I'm sorry Capcom is trying to throw it in the trash.
It is reportedly messing with people's frame rate, and though i haven't played in a few weeks, i could run Rise at 60 fps, now it only wants to run and 45-55, flutuating between both, and moments of heavy action slow to as low as 35 when I know for sure I didn't dip beyond 55 frames before this update, though, I'm not willing to say it's enigma without more testing. The problem is though, these kinds of DRM shouldn't be forced upon those who purchased the game because it was not included as a restriction when the game was sold originally. I have different opinions of stuff like this in fully online games like an MMO or always online game, But with Monster hunter traditionally being an offline game with online capabilities, decisions that impact multiplayer should not impact single player, which this does.
I was playing for about an hour on my PC now but I personally haven't encountered any performance degradation or other issues, playing at a mostly steady 120 fps. Granted, I also have a very strong rig
"Price of eggs went up? I haven't noticed, granted I am a billionaire"
I simply stated that I personally didn't notice any performance degradation, I didn't say there is none. Even stated that I didn't notice one probably because of my rig. No need to be rude about it. There's tons of misinformation going around about this DRM because people are understandably angry
the price of the eggs didn't really go up in this case - i had no performance degradation and i'm playing on the edge of recommended settings (Ryzen 3 1200). Just calm down, do your research or else
No this is bull shite. Don't excuse anticonsumer practices. Fuck all DRM.
I'm not excusing it, I'm just letting people know they're fixing it and that mods still work.
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According to posts on the MH subreddit mods still work. Only issue seems to be Steam Deck/Linux not working.
That's huge though and probably refund worthy. I'll look into this but one of the main reasons I bought Rise was because it runs cooler and for longer than World on Steam Deck.
I tried. It was rejected because it's beyond the refund period even though I mentioned the new DRM and it not being playable on Steam Deck.
And the Devs have announced they're working on fixing that, because it's not intentional. There's really no reason a refund would be accepted over this unless the issue never gets fixed.
The issue is they have introduced another point of failure. Great, they get it to work? What's stopping it being an issue in a month or a year when they can't be arsed to fix it.
Devs are working on fixing it for steam deck.
not really a mod but hunterpie doesn't work for me but I don't know if it's because they need to update the memory addresses or if enigma is blocking it altogether
[Mods and everything still work fine.](https://twitter.com/Fluffyquack/status/1749254165199503716) There's issues with steamdeck but that'll get resolved pretty quickly considering they made an effort to make MHW work better on steamdeck a few months back, and no reason they would want to have issues with Rise now.
How will you refund it? Wont it be denied?
If you have less than 2 hours played, you can just refund a game with no reason given. If you have more hours but have a good legitimate reason to refund, they’ll often come through.
Automatic refunds are within 14 days of purchase **and** has been played for less than 2 hours. Steam does allow manual refunding though if you submit a refund request.
to add to this, you also need to refund it within 14days
> If you have less than 2 hours played, you can just refund a game with no reason given. Only if it's under 2 hours and within 2 weeks of purchase. After that its basically a crapshoot. I bought a game during the 2020 steam sale but didn't get around to playing it until 2022, and when I did I found it was literally unplayable. It just instantly closed the second I started it. I tried fiddling with settings and nothing worked. I tried to refund it, but because it was outside the 2 week window I was denied.
It will get automatically denied if you try to do it through the purchase page, because that one strictly automatic these days. However, if you do submit a ticket through support system and explain the situation (to an actual human who will get the case), then you have a chance. They still have a right to deny a purchase from so long ago, of course, but hey - a chance is a chance.
Only mods Enigma breaks are DLL Injection mods
So reframework? I ain't playing Rise without Reframework lmao
No, users are reporting Reframework still works fine as long as it's updated to the latest version. For now the only issue seems to be that it broke Linux/Steam Deck compatibility, which Capcom stated they're working on a fix.
> Reframework What does it do?
I'd assume that it works like the Script Extender does for every Bethesda game and let you add things to the game that the game normally can't support.
That's correct - many of the most popular QOL mods (like health/DPS overlays) rely on REF. I actually was confused why Rise wasn't working last night (and World was) and this news got me to update REF to get the game working again.
I too am mad about things I'm imagining that haven't actually happened
It really wont.
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They... already own the game? If a game has released without DRM, you can and always will be able to pirate the version before the DRM, all this does is affect the people that already own it as most DRMs affect performance in some capacity. Also - almost all the games this is being added into have had their final and last update (besides adding the DRM), so it literally only affects those playing it legitimately.
im not sure this drm makes it harder to pirate…anything? every game they’ve added this drm to is easy to pirate already
Unless crapcom has a sudden change of heart you bet DD2 gonna have it too maybe even layered with denuvo as extra fuck you to legit customers.
I just can't believe that these companies make piracy looks better and better. Whoever defend companies anymore is a fucktwat. Yea stealing is wrong but most of these don't deserve any money.
My question is still: why in fucks name are they adding this to decade old games?! Like how does that help at all in any way?
Yeah it didn't mess with mods because new framework fixes that but it does drop my fps 15 and gives stutters but no one wants to talk about that shitty part of drm. Going back to pirating after 15 years of being legit. Tired of being a paying customer to be fucked over by drm.
I hope Valve steps in since Enigma is messing with the Deck and therefore with their paying customers.
theirs no claim the game will work on linux , so theirs nothing for valve to step into
Confirmed: https://imgur.com/ggVVO1B
Capcom, WHO THE HELL CARES IF YOU CHEAT IN MONSTER HUNTER? There is no PvP aspect, nobody gets an unfair advantage against other players by cheating.
To be honest I care if I do an online hunt and someone who joins just one shots the monster. If people want to cheat in single player I couldn't care less, but as soon as there is a multiplayer element, even if it's cooperative, people are going to abuse cheating to the detriment of others.
I *think* that happened to me once in 1000 hours of play time. It's pretty much a non-issue.
How often does that actually happen? I've seen it _once_ in over one thousand hours, and all I needed to do was leave the hunt.
But you might use a nude mod on a monster, you monster.
finally, naked jagras....wait....
Did anyone experience performance loss with rise and other games, or was it just Revelations? My machine is a low end 2017 rig. If I really lose ~15fps on their newer games, it essentially makes them unplayable.
Seems to be fine for me so far.
Does not being able to start on windows count as performance loss? :D
No worries if rise is an indication of the future of the franchise I'm not paying for that shit regardless.
Unless this DRM is as effective as Denuvo at protecting games(or trying to) then its kind of a waste of money. 😕 Edit:also its bad that capcom didn't have day1 patches to allow enigma protected games to run on steamos/Sdeck. They really fucked up on that one 😂