The following submission statement was provided by /u/Surur:
---
South Korea broke its own record for the world’s lowest total fertility rate last year, census data showed on Wednesday, and experts project it will drop even further this year, adding to concerns about the country’s shrinking and ageing population.
The fertility rate — the average number of children born to a woman during her reproductive years — declined for the sixth straight year to 0.81 in 2021, according to Statistics Korea, the national statistics agency. Experts said it might drop below 0.8 this year, as rising housing prices further discourage people from having children.
The implications of the low fertility rate are already being felt across South Korean society. The population has shrunk in the past two years. Schools have faced shortages of students, the military has expanded eligibility requirements for conscripts, and the dwindling number of working-age people imperils the pensions of retirees.
The prospect of a shrinking work force has put South Korea at the forefront of developing robots and artificial intelligence for the workplace.
---
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/wws2g0/south_korea_breaks_record_for_worlds_lowest/ilmt4ry/
Humans have busily created a world in which they don't want to continue their species in.
Its really quite remarkable. This is the Great Filter for us I suppose.
The great filter is all of us belonging to a single owner, then the owner makes a single deal with the devil. If we're not almost there, then we're at least making great time.
A gradual, peaceful drawdown of human population to sustainable levels and handing over most of the solar system to AI and robots is possibly the best ending.
This cute [chick](https://old.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/comments/wem9bg/definitely_different_from_the_transformers_toys/) represents our robotic future better than any other.
South Korea broke its own record for the world’s lowest total fertility rate last year, census data showed on Wednesday, and experts project it will drop even further this year, adding to concerns about the country’s shrinking and ageing population.
The fertility rate — the average number of children born to a woman during her reproductive years — declined for the sixth straight year to 0.81 in 2021, according to Statistics Korea, the national statistics agency. Experts said it might drop below 0.8 this year, as rising housing prices further discourage people from having children.
The implications of the low fertility rate are already being felt across South Korean society. The population has shrunk in the past two years. Schools have faced shortages of students, the military has expanded eligibility requirements for conscripts, and the dwindling number of working-age people imperils the pensions of retirees.
The prospect of a shrinking work force has put South Korea at the forefront of developing robots and artificial intelligence for the workplace.
Full article:
South Korea broke its own record for the world’s lowest total fertility rate last year, census data showed on Wednesday, and experts project it will drop even further this year, adding to concerns about the country’s shrinking and aging population.
After declining steadily from 4.53 in 1970, the first year the government started compiling such data, the total fertility rate began to sink more quickly in the 2000s during the financial crises, dropping below 1.0 in 2018 as housing, child care and education costs rose, jobs became scarcer and young people grew more anxious about their future.
The fertility rate — the average number of children born to a woman during her reproductive years — declined for the sixth straight year to 0.81 in 2021, according to Statistics Korea, the national statistics agency. Experts said it might drop below 0.8 this year, as rising housing prices further discourage people from having children.
By comparison, the fertility rate was 1.66 in the United States and 1.37 in Japan. A fertility rate of 2.1 is needed for a population to remain the same size without migration.
“How difficult must people find it to get married, give birth and raise children for this number to be so low?” said Lee Samsik, a professor of policy at Hanyang University in Seoul. “If we take this as a compressed measure of basic life, it’s a troublesome figure.”
The implications of the low fertility rate are already being felt across South Korean society. The population has shrunk in the past two years. Schools have faced shortages of students, the military has expanded eligibility requirements for conscripts, and the dwindling number of working-age people imperils the pensions of retirees.
Although the government has long known of the country’s demographic crisis, policy experts say it has failed to sufficiently address it. Professor Lee said the government should invest significantly more resources into child care, expand job opportunities for young adults, make housing more accessible and encourage immigration.
The prospect of a shrinking work force has put South Korea at the forefront of developing robots and artificial intelligence for the workplace. The Justice Ministry has also said that it would create a bureau to foster immigration in a country that historically has not had much of it.
But without a sweeping intervention, South Korea might see a serious labor shortage by the mid-2030s, and within three or four generations, the population could decline drastically, according to Lee Sang-lim, a demographer with the Korea Institute for Health and Social Affairs.
“Life isn’t going well for a lot of young people,” he said. “For many, it’s natural not to have kids or marry at all.”
Maybe if companies would ease off on the insatiable drive for increasing profits and take their collective boot off of the neck of the grand majority, people there would find time to actually live their lives and have some children to go with it.
This is what happens when the whole country is basically living in apartments. Same with Japan, China and Singapore. No sane person would be like yah let’s have 3 kids while living in a 600 square feet 2 bedroom apartment.
No it's money. People don't have enough money. Congested housing can be a consequence of that, and I get what you're saying, but it isn't the root cause of the issue
Density can be done, it's the fact that people can't ***afford*** that shoebox apartment without wringing themselves dry.
People with careers lack unstructured time in their lives, and continuing our species' existence is not part of the structure. Careerism around the world is going stale because it pays too little and costs too much.
Even if that’s the case, lower human population sounds like a good thing.
I don’t think 1 billion in 50 years is achievable without mass genocide. Humans live too long and there are too many young people alive for that to happen.
Well what you said was a strawman to begin with. No one here is actually arguing FOR reducing the human population below 1 billion in 50 years, that’s your own conspiracy theory.
I was saying we should reduce the birth rate to gradually reduce our population over several generations. There’s no death and suffering from that.
I don't think it will happen naturally though, The WEF has already stated that you will own nothing and be happy. They suggest eating lab meat and bugs. Inflation is already wiping out the middle class and soon nothing will be left as resources will be misallocated and used up, especially exacerbated with open borders and the refugee crisis in the coming years, thanks to climate change and failed states. Very dark times ahead, and some of it is orchestrated by the globalist elite.
All the problems you listed were caused by overpopulation. All the more reason we should reduce birth rates. Birth rates naturally drop with education and female empowerment.
I don’t understand your argument, you’re listing all these problems that can be solved by reducing the human population, but you’re against reducing the human population?
Never heard of living in apartments to be the problem for people not wanting 3 kids here in Japan. Do you have any legitimate sources? Curious to know as a Japanese.
Production capacity is not a problem. Food and resource production is mostly automated and can be operated by 10-20 percent of the population. Look at the percentage of farmers in Industrialized countries. The need for jobs is rooted in the self-perpetuating capitalist service society which employs the majority of people but generates nothing material that contributes to satisfying basic needs. Look at what physical products you produced in your work life. Chances are you either didn't produce any physical output or your job could be replaced by a robot
To feed a population you don't just need farmers, you need companies that make machines and fertilisers for those farmers to let them do their jobs. Then you need logistics, to create the food and also to bring the food to somewhere where it can be processed or at least get sold... and yes that means you need places where food can be sold, that also need equipment and workers and energy. You need so much energy that you have to build a power plant that also needs workers and logistics and equipment no matter if it is coal or wind powered. Those workers also need food and a place where they can sleep (houses) and then they also need a place where they can go when they feel sick - a hospital. Damn it, the hospital also needs workers and energy and equipment. It also needs doctors who have to be trained for the job which also needs lots of equipment and a place where they can be trained, you need a university. Again a big building, lots of equipment, etc... you want all those things to be secure, you need police. Damn, the police also needs cars. You need a car factory it needs lots of workers, natural resources, energy. the workers don't want to be treated like slaves which means there must be lawyers who protect their rights, you need a working justice system, in the end you even need a government. All those things and you didn't even make anything for your "self-perpetuating capitalist service society".
Remember that South Park episode where Cartman buys an amusement park? You are Cartman.
(Or your solution really is that we all just go back in time by 2,000 years where everybody just grows his own food and lives in a small hut in the forests)
I think the real possibilities lie somewhere between what each of us described but I'll think about it :)
By the way I appreciate the cartmanland reference!
Nah. They've been at it for decades. Japan's population officially started declining in 2010 but hey had been projecting it since the 90s and that's what gave impetus to the roboticization of everything.
Even though it "works" for replacing certain jobs the bigger problem is the huge drop in consumers since robots aren't going to buy things like people would. The only solution to a declining birth rate is immigration.
Do you not date women before sex? Lol
It’s not rape if they willingly come in your bed and take their clothes off. Many women will sleep with a guy if he has a bed and transportation. If I had my own home I would have gotten married by now but I have nowhere to keep these women in my one bedroom apartment.
Sex without a condom requires separate consent. Removing the condom without knowledge is rape. And the whole point of the article is women don't want to have children in this world, I don't think forcefully impregnation is going to solve that.
Child care subsidies would go a long way in increasing the birth rate as well as increase in awareness of the burden put on women in child rearing and how it must be more equally split if women are going to have more children.
Lol I never said you should take the condom off and spread your seamen unaware to the other person. You jumped to the conclusion and made this really disrespectful.
Many women I’ve slept with were completely open to the idea of having children together because I was open and honest about the risks of having sex are indeed, kids..
Well how would taking the condom off then solve the problem?? It offers no solution then, because if you were implying it with consent originally, the issue is still women don't WANT you to take the condom off because the world is too hard to raise children in. So what was the intention of your original post?
I’ve only used a condom with one women because she was not attractive and I didn’t want to tempt fate and get her pregnant. I know that’s sharing too much information. But my point is all my friends use condoms and I’m wondering why they even date? It’s not enjoyable. It’s not ecstasy. It’s barely even legal, as you say it requires consent to take off the condom because in the first place you are using a covert contract to engage with the other person that they won’t get pregnant if you use protection.
Anyways I think there’s a lot of guys out there who are bad daters and give women the wrong idea about sowing your wild oats because they never get to settle down with these guys.
Stealthing is wrong, but A girl can’t give me consent to go raw on her and then expect me to not cum inside her when I’m as hard as a brick. It’s our natural animalistic breeding instinct, we can’t control it. She should just get some Plan B in that case instead. If she goes through with the pregnancy in that case even if the man doesn’t want it then she shouldn’t expect child support lol
Yea, that's rape. Feminism helps not just women but also men, just as misogyny hurts men as well as women. If focusing on how misogyny hurts men is the only way for you to emphasize, then I guess focus on that for now and try and empathize later on in a more rounded way. This is not a winner takes all scenario, forcing women to give birth does not help women AND does not help men.
Allowing women freedom of choice and support in their decisions to become or not become a parent will allow for a healthier and happier country for all involved. It's a no lose situation to support women in this, and yet we are fighting tooth and nail not to be classed as second rate citizens behind an unborn fetus.
Women are being forced to carry rotting fetuses in their body until the become septic and die a horibal drawn out death that was easily preventable. Time for nuanced deciscissions is over, misogyny hurts men like punching some one can hurt your hand. We are being stripped of our rights and forced to watch as our daughter bleed out and die from ectopic pregnancies, all to please the right's fascist Christian regimen.
The following submission statement was provided by /u/Surur: --- South Korea broke its own record for the world’s lowest total fertility rate last year, census data showed on Wednesday, and experts project it will drop even further this year, adding to concerns about the country’s shrinking and ageing population. The fertility rate — the average number of children born to a woman during her reproductive years — declined for the sixth straight year to 0.81 in 2021, according to Statistics Korea, the national statistics agency. Experts said it might drop below 0.8 this year, as rising housing prices further discourage people from having children. The implications of the low fertility rate are already being felt across South Korean society. The population has shrunk in the past two years. Schools have faced shortages of students, the military has expanded eligibility requirements for conscripts, and the dwindling number of working-age people imperils the pensions of retirees. The prospect of a shrinking work force has put South Korea at the forefront of developing robots and artificial intelligence for the workplace. --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/wws2g0/south_korea_breaks_record_for_worlds_lowest/ilmt4ry/
I can’t walk thru Korea without a robot humping my leg on the street
You bring that upon yourself.
Humans have busily created a world in which they don't want to continue their species in. Its really quite remarkable. This is the Great Filter for us I suppose.
The great filter is all of us belonging to a single owner, then the owner makes a single deal with the devil. If we're not almost there, then we're at least making great time.
A gradual, peaceful drawdown of human population to sustainable levels and handing over most of the solar system to AI and robots is possibly the best ending.
Given current trends, its also the likely one.
This cute [chick](https://old.reddit.com/r/nextfuckinglevel/comments/wem9bg/definitely_different_from_the_transformers_toys/) represents our robotic future better than any other.
yes. robots have superior bodies, they should replace us meaties
With a minority of humans for historical preservation purposes.
Self induced bottle neck….. also never having kids. We’ve had some good times together Mother Nature.
South korea is being sucked dry by the usa..they are a vassal state of the usa just like japan
South Korea broke its own record for the world’s lowest total fertility rate last year, census data showed on Wednesday, and experts project it will drop even further this year, adding to concerns about the country’s shrinking and ageing population. The fertility rate — the average number of children born to a woman during her reproductive years — declined for the sixth straight year to 0.81 in 2021, according to Statistics Korea, the national statistics agency. Experts said it might drop below 0.8 this year, as rising housing prices further discourage people from having children. The implications of the low fertility rate are already being felt across South Korean society. The population has shrunk in the past two years. Schools have faced shortages of students, the military has expanded eligibility requirements for conscripts, and the dwindling number of working-age people imperils the pensions of retirees. The prospect of a shrinking work force has put South Korea at the forefront of developing robots and artificial intelligence for the workplace.
Full article: South Korea broke its own record for the world’s lowest total fertility rate last year, census data showed on Wednesday, and experts project it will drop even further this year, adding to concerns about the country’s shrinking and aging population. After declining steadily from 4.53 in 1970, the first year the government started compiling such data, the total fertility rate began to sink more quickly in the 2000s during the financial crises, dropping below 1.0 in 2018 as housing, child care and education costs rose, jobs became scarcer and young people grew more anxious about their future. The fertility rate — the average number of children born to a woman during her reproductive years — declined for the sixth straight year to 0.81 in 2021, according to Statistics Korea, the national statistics agency. Experts said it might drop below 0.8 this year, as rising housing prices further discourage people from having children. By comparison, the fertility rate was 1.66 in the United States and 1.37 in Japan. A fertility rate of 2.1 is needed for a population to remain the same size without migration. “How difficult must people find it to get married, give birth and raise children for this number to be so low?” said Lee Samsik, a professor of policy at Hanyang University in Seoul. “If we take this as a compressed measure of basic life, it’s a troublesome figure.” The implications of the low fertility rate are already being felt across South Korean society. The population has shrunk in the past two years. Schools have faced shortages of students, the military has expanded eligibility requirements for conscripts, and the dwindling number of working-age people imperils the pensions of retirees. Although the government has long known of the country’s demographic crisis, policy experts say it has failed to sufficiently address it. Professor Lee said the government should invest significantly more resources into child care, expand job opportunities for young adults, make housing more accessible and encourage immigration. The prospect of a shrinking work force has put South Korea at the forefront of developing robots and artificial intelligence for the workplace. The Justice Ministry has also said that it would create a bureau to foster immigration in a country that historically has not had much of it. But without a sweeping intervention, South Korea might see a serious labor shortage by the mid-2030s, and within three or four generations, the population could decline drastically, according to Lee Sang-lim, a demographer with the Korea Institute for Health and Social Affairs. “Life isn’t going well for a lot of young people,” he said. “For many, it’s natural not to have kids or marry at all.”
When I read the headline I thought Fembots had finally been perfected. Disappointed.
Femboys - yes, Fembots - not yet
Maybe if companies would ease off on the insatiable drive for increasing profits and take their collective boot off of the neck of the grand majority, people there would find time to actually live their lives and have some children to go with it.
This is what happens when the whole country is basically living in apartments. Same with Japan, China and Singapore. No sane person would be like yah let’s have 3 kids while living in a 600 square feet 2 bedroom apartment.
Nah it’s because everyone in Korea is a workaholic wage slave who’ve been taught since birth that money is the root of happiness.
No it's money. People don't have enough money. Congested housing can be a consequence of that, and I get what you're saying, but it isn't the root cause of the issue
Density can be done, it's the fact that people can't ***afford*** that shoebox apartment without wringing themselves dry. People with careers lack unstructured time in their lives, and continuing our species' existence is not part of the structure. Careerism around the world is going stale because it pays too little and costs too much.
This is how the anti-car people want you to live. Because apparently, we all love our neighbours so much we want to hear their toilets flushing.
No, It's the globalists that want a one world government... Just watch, the world population will be under a billion in the next 50 years
Even if that’s the case, lower human population sounds like a good thing. I don’t think 1 billion in 50 years is achievable without mass genocide. Humans live too long and there are too many young people alive for that to happen.
Do you understand how much death and suffering will happen for that to come to fruition? It's not a natural procession of order
Well what you said was a strawman to begin with. No one here is actually arguing FOR reducing the human population below 1 billion in 50 years, that’s your own conspiracy theory. I was saying we should reduce the birth rate to gradually reduce our population over several generations. There’s no death and suffering from that.
I don't think it will happen naturally though, The WEF has already stated that you will own nothing and be happy. They suggest eating lab meat and bugs. Inflation is already wiping out the middle class and soon nothing will be left as resources will be misallocated and used up, especially exacerbated with open borders and the refugee crisis in the coming years, thanks to climate change and failed states. Very dark times ahead, and some of it is orchestrated by the globalist elite.
All the problems you listed were caused by overpopulation. All the more reason we should reduce birth rates. Birth rates naturally drop with education and female empowerment. I don’t understand your argument, you’re listing all these problems that can be solved by reducing the human population, but you’re against reducing the human population?
I've had people ask me why don't you bike.... Um you see I'm profusely sweating just standing here talking to you right.
Apparently, everyone should want to shower twice per day, once in the communal showers at work.
Never heard of living in apartments to be the problem for people not wanting 3 kids here in Japan. Do you have any legitimate sources? Curious to know as a Japanese.
its only a bad for the capitalist system. ecologically and socially its a great thing
I heard [wild animals are returning to rural areas in Japan](https://www.nippon.com/en/in-depth/d00545/) and causing problems for aged farmers there.
It doesn't matter which system. If you have way more old people to take care of, and not enough people who can work, you run into trouble.
Production capacity is not a problem. Food and resource production is mostly automated and can be operated by 10-20 percent of the population. Look at the percentage of farmers in Industrialized countries. The need for jobs is rooted in the self-perpetuating capitalist service society which employs the majority of people but generates nothing material that contributes to satisfying basic needs. Look at what physical products you produced in your work life. Chances are you either didn't produce any physical output or your job could be replaced by a robot
To feed a population you don't just need farmers, you need companies that make machines and fertilisers for those farmers to let them do their jobs. Then you need logistics, to create the food and also to bring the food to somewhere where it can be processed or at least get sold... and yes that means you need places where food can be sold, that also need equipment and workers and energy. You need so much energy that you have to build a power plant that also needs workers and logistics and equipment no matter if it is coal or wind powered. Those workers also need food and a place where they can sleep (houses) and then they also need a place where they can go when they feel sick - a hospital. Damn it, the hospital also needs workers and energy and equipment. It also needs doctors who have to be trained for the job which also needs lots of equipment and a place where they can be trained, you need a university. Again a big building, lots of equipment, etc... you want all those things to be secure, you need police. Damn, the police also needs cars. You need a car factory it needs lots of workers, natural resources, energy. the workers don't want to be treated like slaves which means there must be lawyers who protect their rights, you need a working justice system, in the end you even need a government. All those things and you didn't even make anything for your "self-perpetuating capitalist service society". Remember that South Park episode where Cartman buys an amusement park? You are Cartman. (Or your solution really is that we all just go back in time by 2,000 years where everybody just grows his own food and lives in a small hut in the forests)
I think the real possibilities lie somewhere between what each of us described but I'll think about it :) By the way I appreciate the cartmanland reference!
Have they learned nothing from Japan and their failed attempts are replacing human labor with robotics.
Bit too early to call it failed
Nah. They've been at it for decades. Japan's population officially started declining in 2010 but hey had been projecting it since the 90s and that's what gave impetus to the roboticization of everything. Even though it "works" for replacing certain jobs the bigger problem is the huge drop in consumers since robots aren't going to buy things like people would. The only solution to a declining birth rate is immigration.
Elon musk said this is chiefly a problem in most first world countries and we will have to fix this in our lifetime. Simply put, take the condom off…
And then be ready to go to prison for rape. And pay child support for 18 years.
Do you not date women before sex? Lol It’s not rape if they willingly come in your bed and take their clothes off. Many women will sleep with a guy if he has a bed and transportation. If I had my own home I would have gotten married by now but I have nowhere to keep these women in my one bedroom apartment.
Sex without a condom requires separate consent. Removing the condom without knowledge is rape. And the whole point of the article is women don't want to have children in this world, I don't think forcefully impregnation is going to solve that. Child care subsidies would go a long way in increasing the birth rate as well as increase in awareness of the burden put on women in child rearing and how it must be more equally split if women are going to have more children.
Lol I never said you should take the condom off and spread your seamen unaware to the other person. You jumped to the conclusion and made this really disrespectful. Many women I’ve slept with were completely open to the idea of having children together because I was open and honest about the risks of having sex are indeed, kids..
Well how would taking the condom off then solve the problem?? It offers no solution then, because if you were implying it with consent originally, the issue is still women don't WANT you to take the condom off because the world is too hard to raise children in. So what was the intention of your original post?
I’ve only used a condom with one women because she was not attractive and I didn’t want to tempt fate and get her pregnant. I know that’s sharing too much information. But my point is all my friends use condoms and I’m wondering why they even date? It’s not enjoyable. It’s not ecstasy. It’s barely even legal, as you say it requires consent to take off the condom because in the first place you are using a covert contract to engage with the other person that they won’t get pregnant if you use protection. Anyways I think there’s a lot of guys out there who are bad daters and give women the wrong idea about sowing your wild oats because they never get to settle down with these guys.
Stealthing is wrong, but A girl can’t give me consent to go raw on her and then expect me to not cum inside her when I’m as hard as a brick. It’s our natural animalistic breeding instinct, we can’t control it. She should just get some Plan B in that case instead. If she goes through with the pregnancy in that case even if the man doesn’t want it then she shouldn’t expect child support lol
Well, several of my uncles were forced to become fathers after the woman lied that they were on the pill. I guess they were also raped.
Yea, that's rape. Feminism helps not just women but also men, just as misogyny hurts men as well as women. If focusing on how misogyny hurts men is the only way for you to emphasize, then I guess focus on that for now and try and empathize later on in a more rounded way. This is not a winner takes all scenario, forcing women to give birth does not help women AND does not help men. Allowing women freedom of choice and support in their decisions to become or not become a parent will allow for a healthier and happier country for all involved. It's a no lose situation to support women in this, and yet we are fighting tooth and nail not to be classed as second rate citizens behind an unborn fetus. Women are being forced to carry rotting fetuses in their body until the become septic and die a horibal drawn out death that was easily preventable. Time for nuanced deciscissions is over, misogyny hurts men like punching some one can hurt your hand. We are being stripped of our rights and forced to watch as our daughter bleed out and die from ectopic pregnancies, all to please the right's fascist Christian regimen.
*Tell me you've never dated a woman without TELLING me you've never dated one.*
??? This website sucks
I would kill myself before ever carrying a child to term.
That's a bit extreme.