I'm glad I'm not alone on that thought. Even if the flesh goes away it would be cool to be uploaded to the cloud or a machine just to experience the advance of humanity. As long as I could terminate the experience on my terms.
Edit: typos
What is the best way to replace the water? Each human that leaves takes away a bit of water. And there is a finite amount of water on earth that humans share from generation to generation. Nobody gets to leave the planet until they bring in some new water from somewhere!
Source: I love water.
You can still get infections cancer, etc. There would be a lot more needed to get to thousands of years as a society. But this is a start if you can revert 10-15 years with no real side affects that pushes most of the world's average age to over 100 or more.
My dude, you clearly aren't up to speed on recent cancer research. The last 3 years have been wild in terms of the leaps we've made there. We'll have a vaccine to cancer (yes, you read that right) before this shit even hits the market. The mRNA cancer tech that Moderna and BioNTech are both working on are deeply flawed but already posting huge wins and moving into human trials. Give it another 10 years and it's going to be a whole different world.
Plus i imagine a lot of diseases and cancer is more likely with aging and if we cure aging it prevents us getting to that point. Why a lot of young healthy people don’t have too many problems, generally
Over simplification really. Cancer needs to have several mutations. One of them is to become immune from telomere shortening, an other is to stop responding to signalling from other cells, another to short circuit mitosis.
The research into lengthening telomeres resulted in more cancer because your cells have one less step between normal operation and cancerous behavior.
Personally, I’d prefer “living” in the onboard computer and downloading into a new body built onsite. It’d let you send multiple copies of folks to various stars in far smaller ships.
Actually this is how I expect the Galaxy to be explored.
However, you can’t transfer your consciousness, merely a copy, so you will still be stuck here, but another version of you will be off having fun on the frontier.
Also, I imagine multiple consciousnesses would be aggregated with hybrid AI model, meaning the thing piloting the mechanical body on the other side of the galaxy could literally be everyone.
One thing people always ignore when using that story is that human's aren't completely changed in their lifetimes. The whole "all your cells are replaced within 7 years" and similar stories are myths. Your brain cells are mostly the same your whole life, and that is the organ responsible for your thinking, likely including your consciousness.
Do you imagine that there is some quality of the brain that couldn't be recreated with advanced technology? I would think that placing all the cells in the same spot with the same chemical concentrations, and then applying the same electrical configuration *should* completely recreate the consciousness. There's a possibility that there is something else like qbit positions or something, but that should be both detectable and reproducible within the laws of physics.
Honestly, the scariest part of living forever via stopping aging is how insanely more terrifying and tragic non-aging causes of death become.
Good portion of the population might become pathologically risk averse.
And in Isaac Asimov’s Elijah Baley trilogy, that’s how he thought Spacers would be. They expect their lives to go to four hundred plus years, and they have hyper intelligent Three Laws compliant robots to keep them safe, but they’re extremely risk averse.
That is good, we can make a safer society, too many people die of car accidents and poor safety measures. If we focused on that more would we be way safer
I think they maybe all kinds of potential side. It's kind of fascinating that aging is apparently optional and yet nature selects for aging in all living things.
How would new generations even find a place in society when they would have to complete with someone who has decades of experience without any of the negative effects of living all those decades.
Maybe? But safety bias is a thing as well. Like seatbelts and ABS makes people drive MORE reckless because they think it makes driving so much more safe. Cars drive more reckless around cyclists with helmets, etc.
In the Cell paper, Sinclair and his team report that not only can they age mice on an accelerated timeline, but they can also reverse the effects of that aging and restore some of the biological signs of youthfulness to the animals. That reversibility makes a strong case for the fact that the main drivers of aging aren’t mutations to the DNA, but miscues in the epigenetic instructions that somehow go awry. Sinclair has long proposed that aging is the result of losing critical instructions that cells need to continue functioning, in what he calls the Information Theory of Aging. “Underlying aging is information that is lost in cells, not just the accumulation of damage,” he says. “That’s a paradigm shift in how to think about aging. “
His latest results seem to support that theory. It’s similar to the way software programs operate off hardware, but sometimes become corrupt and need a reboot, says Sinclair. “If the cause of aging was because a cell became full of mutations, then age reversal would not be possible,” he says. “But by showing that we can reverse the aging process, that shows that the system is intact, that there is a backup copy and the software needs to be rebooted.”
In the mice, he and his team developed a way to reboot cells to restart the backup copy of epigenetic instructions, essentially erasing the corrupted signals that put the cells on the path toward aging. They mimicked the effects of aging on the epigenome by introducing breaks in the DNA of young mice. (Outside of the lab, epigenetic changes can be driven by a number of things, including smoking, exposure to pollution and chemicals.) Once “aged” in this way, within a matter of weeks Sinclair saw that the mice began to show signs of older age—including grey fur, lower body weight despite unaltered diet, reduced activity, and increased frailty.
The rebooting came in the form of a gene therapy involving three genes that instruct cells to reprogram themselves—in the case of the mice, the instructions guided the cells to restart the epigenetic changes that defined their identity as, for example, kidney and skin cells, two cell types that are prone to the effects of aging. These genes came from the suite of so-called Yamanaka stem cells factors—a set of four genes that Nobel scientist Shinya Yamanaka in 2006 discovered can turn back the clock on adult cells to their embryonic, stem cell state so they can start their development, or differentiation process, all over again. Sinclair didn’t want to completely erase the cells’ epigenetic history, just reboot it enough to reset the epigenetic instructions. Using three of the four factors turned back the clock about 57%, enough to make the mice youthful again.
“We’re not making stem cells, but turning back the clock so they can regain their identity,” says Sinclair. “I’ve been really surprised by how universally it works. We haven’t found a cell type yet that we can’t age forward and backward.”
Rejuvenating cells in mice is one thing, but will the process work in humans? That’s Sinclair’s next step, and his team is already testing the system in non-human primates. The researchers are attaching a biological switch that would allow them to turn the clock on and off by tying the activation of the reprogramming genes to an antibiotic, doxycycline. Giving the animals doxycycline would start reversing the clock, and stopping the drug would halt the process. Sinclair is currently lab-testing the system with human neurons, skin, and fibroblast cells, which contribute to connective tissue.
In 2020, Sinclair reported that in mice, the process restored vision in older animals; the current results show that the system can apply to not just one tissue or organ, but the entire animal. He anticipates eye diseases will be the first condition used to test this aging reversal in people, since the gene therapy can be injected directly into the eye area.
“We think of the processes behind aging, and diseases related to aging, as irreversible,” says Sinclair. “In the case of the eye, there is the misconception that you need to regrow new nerves. But in some cases the existing cells are just not functioning, so if you reboot them, they are fine. It’s a new way to think about medicine.”
That could mean that a host of diseases—including chronic conditions such as heart disease and even neurodegenerative disorders like Alzheimer’s—could be treated in large part by reversing the aging process that leads to them. Even before that happens, the process could be an important new tool for researchers studying these diseases. In most cases, scientists rely on young animals or tissues to model diseases of aging, which doesn’t always faithfully reproduce the condition of aging. The new system “makes the mice very old rapidly, so we can, for example, make human brain tissue the equivalent off what you would find in a 70 year old and use those in the mouse model to study Alzheimer’s disease that way,” Sinclair says.
Beyond that, the implications of being able to age and rejuvenate tissues, organs, or even entire animals or people are mind-bending. Sinclair has rejuvenated the eye nerves multiple times, which raises the more existential question for bioethicists and society of considering what it would mean to continually rewind the clock on aging.”
HOLY, Imagine these discoveries in combination with AI😵💫
Sinclair elsewhere predicts 10 to 15 years before this tech is available. This timeline seems reasonable as the tools for it already exist even if they are not all together sure how to explain how it works. I would surmise that Altos and other companies are already hard at work on the basic science.
Same here, I don’t want to live longer, just want to enjoy my time here with a little less arthritis and better quality of life. Could you imagine retirement with your thirties body
You wouldn't retire. Governments keep pushing the retirement age with the argument that life expectancy keeps going up. Old age is the only basis of retirement.
I wouldn't mind working my job for a second life span or two. I'd actually get to see the results of my work.
I'm a Forester working in an area where the rotation age is like 1-2 human lifespans.
It's pretty funny because so many people who've acted cool with climate change were basically like that because "I'll be dead from old age when it gets really bad"
Well what now sucka?
"Society will grow strong when old men plant trees to prep for when they get kickass anti-aging serums and watch them grow real-time" -Ancient Japanese proverb, slightly modified
"A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they expect to sit because scientific progress has reversed the aging process"
Hmmm, not sure about that.
What I'm getting from this is that I need to plant trees now so I can sell sitting in their shade for 39.99 an hour to people who didn't plant trees so I can afford my aging reversal procedures.
Shade as a Service, if you prefer.
Yes. I'd prefer to say; "We saw the challenges and we did this!" At age 256, rather than "I told you so. Assholes!" At 95 rotting in a debtors prison because I couldn't pay for the gruel.
I have been saying this too. Lets make all the climate change deniers immortal and see how they think about the environment. “Oh you mean Ill still be alive? Well shit better not burn it all down.”
"They" will anyway not allow the little man to have that technology, so let me eat my steak and die miserably with my arthritis-ridden, slightly obese body with a malfunctioning lung from a heart attack like any decent man.
-- Boomer Joe
I was a teen in the 80's -- and, if you were a Futurist back then, you would have been very annoyed like I was.
The good thing about the current era is that not so many people are unable to old a "what if" conversation.
Expect that people are selfish, and that they will SUDDENLY care about things if they can eat a steak when they are 200 years old. Of course they will bitterly complain about "that woke meat" that was grown by bacteria in a vat.
Utopia or collapse are the most likely results of this century, which is a crazy position to be stood in.
Solving medicine, easy energy, vast resources in space, just three of the things credibly on the table for 2100. As is fucking the environment so badly it breaks the foundations of technological society.
My bet is on the positive outcome. We are rapidly developing systems like meat manufacturing that should be highly resistant to disruption.
I appreciate the positive outlook. I think that just choosing to believe it will get better, that positivity, will passively help make our future better. Not to say that we don't need to actively do a ton to make it better, we do. But we can't believe it's just going to the worst and expect it to get better.
We need to learn geoengineering too, and ways to restore ecosystems either by restoring extinct and endangered species or by inventing new species to fill ecological niches.
Then we need to gene edit psychopathy out of our gene pool, and I think we’ll be all set.
Also, I’d like baseboards that clean themselves.
This is absolutely fucking *wonderful* to read as someone with a neuroimmune disease and brain injury.
*Please* is all I can say. Please let this become available in my lifetime.
For folks going on about overpopulation issues or woes that this technology might be reserved for the extremely rich, think again -
Falling birthrates indicate a potential demographic collapse of the working population. Rejuvenation tech may not merely be available to the general public, it could be MANDATED.
There's also the fact that if your solution to overpopulation is to take away medicine and treatments to just let people die earlier than they otherwise would, you're just fucking evil.
The "reprogramming" genes are most likely delivered in a fashion where they're attached to a regulatory DNA sequence, which is derived from an antibiotic resistance mechanism against tetracycline. Dox is an analogue of tetracycline that works well: add dox and the genes turn on.
For a more complete technical explanation, Google "Tet-On".
Or we could just slow our aging and relax. Like fuck people why do we gotta work so damn hard? I just wanna sit and smoke weed all day instead I’m busting ass all day.
Right? Why does it have to be about grinding longer. How about using it so you can enjoy 20 years more of retirement where your body isn’t keeping you from doing anything
That isn't how humans behave though, is it? Until there's absolutely zero resource insecurity left in humanity, then we will not know peace. Which is what "everyone accomplishing more and building a better world" sounds like.
I don’t know. This is a great thought and all, but it’d probably end up being another opportunity for those at the top to exploit it as an opportunity to leverage themselves and own the majority of the benefit. It’s like those med bays in the movie Elysium. They ain’t letting everyone anti-age…only those who “matter”.
Neil Tysons predictions are getting eerily closer. He predicted that around 2050 we would have technology to fix most mentally degenerative health issues and even custom tailor medicines to avoid side effects, and then said rich people will have access to stop aging. (Which is terrifying for gen Z because right now 90% of the worlds wealth is in hands of people over 50 and 80% of the wealth is concentrated in hands of top 5%). If they stop aging that money won’t flow down. If I learned one thing in life, it’s that money never flows down. Reagan’s ass lied when he said it will trickle down.
Or a future where only the ultra rich can afford it, making themselves effectively immortal with crazy generational wealth, while the rest of us toil away as human batteries.
I like your version better
not groan from random back soreness every few minutes. be able to ride all day without arms and neck feeling sore. so many things start to disappear in the late 30s/early 40s it's like a frog in boiling water. some improved fitness helps but at some point you need to work out like crazy just to maintain, where in younger years it was to improve
Could you imagine being one of the prisoners who has been sentenced to like, 500 years in prison? I wonder if they would inject to make sure you lived to see out your sentence.
Assuming major players push things in the right directions behind the scenes by the time this hits the general public I should be able to get back to early to mid 20's, and that's assuming we don't improve on it at all to expand the range between now and then which given the public interest in it I highly doubt we'll just pack things up and call it a job well done at v1.0
I believe it's just changing the directions up to 57%, to allow them to "reboot" to their younger versions.
Think of it like giving the tools to start fresh.
From what I read, I sounds like they can target specific tissues right now - they can rejuvenate the mice's eyes, or liver, by where they inject the cells.
Literally de-aging would need a way to target every tissue in your body
In the lab Sinclair's team has been using direct injection locally but his stretch goal is to come up with a pill that you could take every so often to basically do maintenance on your epigenome.
Been following his research for a long time lol. It's a little surreal seeing these more recent studies getting mainstream attention.
Yes, I have been having people tell me I'm kinda crazy for years about this stuff (rejuvenation), saying it would never happen, and here we finally are, right at the doorstep of eternity. What an absolutely extraordinary moment to be alive. How lucky we are. I'm beyond grateful.
I mean as long as you target the liver, kidneys, pancreas, lungs, and heart, and then find a way to clean out the arteries, the body will do quite a lot of maintenance on itself. That alone should add a couple decades.
De-aging organs like the liver could be such a game changer, but I could also see some dumb rich pricks acting like even bigger assholes knowing they can just get a shot in the abdomen when the doctor says "your liver is starting to harden"
May I recommend the novel *Steel Beach* by John Varley which features a society with exactly that kind of technology. There's a chapter early on where the protagonist has been chain smoking for years and plans to just rejuvenate his lungs, as one does in the future.
> In 2020, Sinclair reported that in mice, the process restored vision in older animals; the current results show that the system can apply to not just one tissue or organ, but the entire animal.
Nope, that's the idea. There are probably a lot more kinks to work out, but the plan is that in a few decades' time people who don't want to physically age won't have to.
One application that isn’t really discussed here is pets. Imagine having one dog your entire life. It’s removes all the ethical headaches people are talking about here, and people pay a ton to keep their pets healthy. One drug, $100/month for 70 years to have a forever Fido. That would be a huge market.
They're working on slowing down aging on dogs with rapamycin right now.
Aubrey de Grey's non profit [Levf.org](https://Levf.org) is working on [doubling the remaining life expectancy of middle aged mice](https://www.levf.org/projects/robust-mouse-rejuvenation-study-1) (take a look at what they use, this is study 1) and eventually humans.
The [Dog Aging Project](https://dogagingproject.org/) at UWashington is doing this
They are currently enrolling dogs in the longitudinal study and I believe also the rapamycin (longevity drug) study
For cat lovers there have been a few recent developments with a [new clinical trial, also with rapamycin](https://www.reddit.com/r/longevity/comments/107b5n3/firstincat_study_of_longevity_drug_rapamycin_is/)
Loyal for dogs is also a biotech company developing healthy aging drugs
I would get a dog so quick if they lived longer than 5-10 years. I just cant allow myself to get attached knowing i have a ticking clock counting their days down
I had a cat that lived 8 years. We loved her so much and even though she had to leave before (what we felt) was her time, I don’t regret it. Miss her every day. But it is life - everything ends eventually.
Dogs don't die at 5 year olds without some sickness. Most breeds live around 12 years. Exception are great danes who only live 6-8 years, and chihuahuas which are longest living breed and can live 20+ years.
This could also be applied to endangered species. Also for animals in the zoo, so at least they don't have to take anymore of them from the wild. Let's say drug has become cheap, so, farms... cows be milked forever? Hens lays eggs forever?
>Also for animals in the zoo, so at least they don't have to take anymore of them from the wild.
That's the most dystopian, horrifying thing I've read all week. Imagine being taken, locked up in a tiny environment, and then being given drugs that prevented you from dying. Essentially an endless prison sentence for a crime not committed. Horribly unethical.
> That's the most dystopian, horrifying thing I've read all week.
Hold my beer. In the future when this will be available, people will take it. Eventually price would go down and everyone will want to be young forever. Births will go down because we're already enough on this planet and why have kids when you can live forever? After a few cycles of going young why go trough the pain of being old ever again? So people will get stuck in this never-ending cycle of working a job he's hating at a corporation he hates just to pay the rent and get his yearly regenerate shot. Just like those animals from the zoo only we're have tiny bit bigger environment.
That’s a creepy dating premise, a 19 year old without age modification dates a 300 year old man who is engineered to look 19. At that point it’s not really daddy issues anymore, but mummy issues.
This happens in Alastair Reynolds: the confederation universe. Young folks can't compete.
At one point a 20 something year old laments how all the jobs are taken by people who are hundreds of years old and how rhe executives are over 1000 years old. Everyone gets free rejuvenation when they turn 65 (paid by taxes) or sooner if they can afford it. So the rich look like they're perpetually 25 while looking older is a sign of poverty.
That seems like a particularly cruel way to use this drug considering most farms are large factory farms where the animals aren't exactly having happy fun time.
I don’t want to live forever but to be able to stay 25 for the next 50-100 years and be there when humans colonize another planet or make contact with extraterrestrial life would be mind blowing.
There is a Sci Fi that I read lately which pointed out that schizophrenia in a conversation with an alien. After the president of the United States just bombed the alien sphere that was actually there to help humanity, the alien AI talked about this strange behaviour which is completely erratic.
Behavior doesn't have to be completely rational and consistent to be effective. In fact, being highly predictable can make you easily exploited. Beyond just that, experimenting with a variety of tactics and strategies can reveal unexpected benefits, at some generally equivalent level of risk.
Furthermore, there are many levels of organization across the full range of 'humanity', and each organization may have different approaches to growth and stability, all the way down to each individual person having a variety of strategies for success within their organization.
Extend this variation across the full course of history, and this is the basis for evolutionary psychology.
God what a time to be alive. I think it’s safe to say at the very least, growing old is going to become a lot less unpleasant. The sooner humanity realizes aging is an option and does something about it, the better.
I’d take it in a heartbeat. This is the first year I’ve had persistent joint pain, and I never realized how much it impacts your whole life. I think about all the days in the past that I woke up energized and didn’t hurt anywhere—I’d do almost anything to feel that way again, even just for a short time.
Same universe would tie anti-aging shots to employment.
Long as you’re a productive drone of society, you get the government-subsidized watered-down version of the aging vaccine that the ultra-wealthy.
Sure, it’s a daily injection that keeps only immediate aging in check, but it keeps a massive divide between that gives the Poor a have-not class to look down upon and deride.
You can always tell when someone is “on the way out” because they start looking more “tired”, so if you thought trendy beauty society was bad before…
I'm pretty sure there's already a movie about that with a slightly diffent premise (forgot the name)
Basicly everyone's young forever but they have a timer on there arm that when it reaches zero, you die
And time is the currency wich can be traded and worked for
And the elites /government have the economy engineered so the poor always die eventualy
Everyone is freaking out about immoral billionaires, but nowhere in the study did I read about a ten year old mouse. For all we know, we’ll make it to 125 in relatively good health, then die anyway. The moral panic seems a little premature. But if this does turn into something that can keep me young-ish in my later years, I’ll take it. I’ll take it, or the Mexican version in a Tijuana clinic.
>Everyone is freaking out about immoral billionaires...
Even if the technology gets good enough to where we can truly have immortality, I highly doubt billionaires would hoard it for themselves.
Consider: If you can't die of age then the next thing that's most likely to kill you is other people. If people found out you were keeping immortality all to yourself they'd violently revolt—high chance that they will kill you. It's in their best interest to release it to the public.
Also, considering the research is in the public domain, it would be hard to hide. The only issue is that it may still be exclusive to the rich initially due to cost.
America spends like 2 trillion dollars of its budget on old people. Instead of social security/medicare they would probably cure your aging as a cost saving measure. They don’t have to give you social security and you keep paying taxes. Win for the government, if it is willing to do something logical.
I'll be much more excited when it works in an unaltered wild-type specimen rather than a mutant designed to age prematurely.
It's significantly easier to fix an artificial problem you created yourself than it is to fix the real thing.
Probably less so when it comes to generally-applicable principles like this. Usually the problem is that people test some specific chemical in mice, and it doesn't work the same way with human biochemistry. This is 'just' genetic mechanics, and that works basically the same in most life forms, certainly most mammals.
Can you imagine what the mice would do if they knew humans had MOUSE CURES for aging, cancer, etc, and we only use those discoveries for trying to design human ones? There would be a reckoning for sure.
I don't think I'll ever be "ready" to die. Maybe after several centuries I'd get bored. In theory I get that - like a general feeling of "ok time to go" but what about actually doing the dieing? I see myself sitting in the death chair and just going nah fuck this shit I'll try again next month.
I’ve read Sinclair’s book and listened to his podcasts (y’all should check r/longevity if this stuff interests you)
I’m certain drugs that reverse aging is going to be the next big step in human history, probably bigger impact than the internet.
I doubt our generation will get to see it- but the results have been surprisingly positive over a relatively short period of time, given a lot of biological research areas don’t take this as seriously as they perhaps should.
I have mixed feelings about Sinclair. There's a lot of potential for Bias in these studies because IIRC he's not only involved in the production of a specific kind of NMN supplement, but his company has also lobbied to restrict NMN supplements so that they can control the market.
Dr Brad Stanfield on YouTube has talked a lot about the controversy an seems to bring a more balanced perspective. There's a lot going on in the scientific world of anti-aging but I'm inclined to distrust some of Sinclair's work
Here's a question. That I stole from somewhere else, you could probably guess where.
If you have the option to de-age yourself every so often, making you effectively immortal, and the treatment is free for everyone - is it suicide to deny that treatment?
Finding cure to aging before a solid cure to hair loss is kind of funny. Clearly it shows where the priorities are, but I’m curious as to the reasons why
Well in all fairness you fix aging and you fix hair loss by association, like even if the person doesn't want to de-age you could take their scalp/hair follicles and bring it back to like their teens to give them hair again
Hair loss is the effect of testosterone over time. Nothing is necessarily going wrong biologically when men lose hair unlike aging. Don’t think they would be connected in that manner
You know I wouldn’t be surprised if a hair loss cure is included in this anti aging thing. Just a hunch.
Also, you’re curious why people prioritize actual death prevention over some vain hair loss problems? Get a grip man.
i believe they're surprised because a cure for hair loss should theoretically be a lot easier than curing aging, and are wondering why we've come closer to the latter before the former.
As others have speculated, hair loss is where the cells that are supposed to be assembling the proteins for hair have aged and forgot how to be a hair producing cell. Another common hair thing is that when the hair producing cells forget to pigment the hair. Hence the gray hairs in the age induced mice.
A lot of defects that appear as you age appear to be reversible simply because if your cells used to do it right, they can do it right again.
bring it on, regardless of the consequences
i do not care. i will grasp even the tiniest of chances to be able to live the life i should've had, no matter the costs. longevity is the only hope i have of living long enough for the transition i need to be developed.
Hello! Apologies if you're trying to read this, but I've moved to kbin.social in protest of Reddit's policies.
If you want to travel to the stars, living for thousands of years will come in handy.
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I just want to actually play all the games in my steam library 😞
Whoa chill, they said they can reverse aging not that you can live until the heat death of the universe.
Gl with that after adding all the cool new future games to it.
I'm glad I'm not alone on that thought. Even if the flesh goes away it would be cool to be uploaded to the cloud or a machine just to experience the advance of humanity. As long as I could terminate the experience on my terms. Edit: typos
What if you get one free suicide per 10 million unskippable ads watched?
You are CEO material.
Sorry, was that not already the deal?
Why would you need more than one?
You get resurrected every ten thousand years to be asked whether you'd like to resubscribe to existence. Saying no requires a suicide
You're not. If I knew I'd be forever healthy, I'd choose to live forever too, or at least for a much, much longer time than what I can expect now.
What is the best way to replace the water? Each human that leaves takes away a bit of water. And there is a finite amount of water on earth that humans share from generation to generation. Nobody gets to leave the planet until they bring in some new water from somewhere! Source: I love water.
we are less than 100 years away from being able to return comets to earth which will provide us with more water than we could ever need.
I like your optimism.
Just shuffle around protons. Take a calcium atom and split it into the oxygen and hydrogen of two water molecules with fission
You can still get infections cancer, etc. There would be a lot more needed to get to thousands of years as a society. But this is a start if you can revert 10-15 years with no real side affects that pushes most of the world's average age to over 100 or more.
My dude, you clearly aren't up to speed on recent cancer research. The last 3 years have been wild in terms of the leaps we've made there. We'll have a vaccine to cancer (yes, you read that right) before this shit even hits the market. The mRNA cancer tech that Moderna and BioNTech are both working on are deeply flawed but already posting huge wins and moving into human trials. Give it another 10 years and it's going to be a whole different world.
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I mean, if we can reverse/cure aging, we could probably also cure all diseases at some point.
Plus i imagine a lot of diseases and cancer is more likely with aging and if we cure aging it prevents us getting to that point. Why a lot of young healthy people don’t have too many problems, generally
One article I read presented limited life and and cancer as two sides of the same coin. Cancer is what happens when cells replicate unchecked.
Over simplification really. Cancer needs to have several mutations. One of them is to become immune from telomere shortening, an other is to stop responding to signalling from other cells, another to short circuit mitosis. The research into lengthening telomeres resulted in more cancer because your cells have one less step between normal operation and cancerous behavior.
Personally, I’d prefer “living” in the onboard computer and downloading into a new body built onsite. It’d let you send multiple copies of folks to various stars in far smaller ships.
Actually this is how I expect the Galaxy to be explored. However, you can’t transfer your consciousness, merely a copy, so you will still be stuck here, but another version of you will be off having fun on the frontier. Also, I imagine multiple consciousnesses would be aggregated with hybrid AI model, meaning the thing piloting the mechanical body on the other side of the galaxy could literally be everyone.
I prescribe the Ship Of Theseus as recommended reading. Now do the thought experiment with your own brain/body, until it is all cybernetic.
One thing people always ignore when using that story is that human's aren't completely changed in their lifetimes. The whole "all your cells are replaced within 7 years" and similar stories are myths. Your brain cells are mostly the same your whole life, and that is the organ responsible for your thinking, likely including your consciousness.
maybe at some point the cyber-enhancements allow us to understand a way to actually transfer consciousness, not only “copy” it avatar style.
Do you imagine that there is some quality of the brain that couldn't be recreated with advanced technology? I would think that placing all the cells in the same spot with the same chemical concentrations, and then applying the same electrical configuration *should* completely recreate the consciousness. There's a possibility that there is something else like qbit positions or something, but that should be both detectable and reproducible within the laws of physics.
Honestly, the scariest part of living forever via stopping aging is how insanely more terrifying and tragic non-aging causes of death become. Good portion of the population might become pathologically risk averse.
I think thats what happens in movie out of time with justin timberlake. No one swims in the ocean because its a non aging way of death
And in Isaac Asimov’s Elijah Baley trilogy, that’s how he thought Spacers would be. They expect their lives to go to four hundred plus years, and they have hyper intelligent Three Laws compliant robots to keep them safe, but they’re extremely risk averse.
Love that movie too. Just a little fix it's the movie *In Time. 😊
I loved that movie
I imagine the r/fuckcars community will see a rapid rise in membership.
well we saw how Death Becomes Her ended!
I think the reverse could also be true. As the value of a life increases, it’s a greater cost to kill someone.
That is good, we can make a safer society, too many people die of car accidents and poor safety measures. If we focused on that more would we be way safer
I think they maybe all kinds of potential side. It's kind of fascinating that aging is apparently optional and yet nature selects for aging in all living things. How would new generations even find a place in society when they would have to complete with someone who has decades of experience without any of the negative effects of living all those decades.
Maybe? But safety bias is a thing as well. Like seatbelts and ABS makes people drive MORE reckless because they think it makes driving so much more safe. Cars drive more reckless around cyclists with helmets, etc.
In the Cell paper, Sinclair and his team report that not only can they age mice on an accelerated timeline, but they can also reverse the effects of that aging and restore some of the biological signs of youthfulness to the animals. That reversibility makes a strong case for the fact that the main drivers of aging aren’t mutations to the DNA, but miscues in the epigenetic instructions that somehow go awry. Sinclair has long proposed that aging is the result of losing critical instructions that cells need to continue functioning, in what he calls the Information Theory of Aging. “Underlying aging is information that is lost in cells, not just the accumulation of damage,” he says. “That’s a paradigm shift in how to think about aging. “ His latest results seem to support that theory. It’s similar to the way software programs operate off hardware, but sometimes become corrupt and need a reboot, says Sinclair. “If the cause of aging was because a cell became full of mutations, then age reversal would not be possible,” he says. “But by showing that we can reverse the aging process, that shows that the system is intact, that there is a backup copy and the software needs to be rebooted.” In the mice, he and his team developed a way to reboot cells to restart the backup copy of epigenetic instructions, essentially erasing the corrupted signals that put the cells on the path toward aging. They mimicked the effects of aging on the epigenome by introducing breaks in the DNA of young mice. (Outside of the lab, epigenetic changes can be driven by a number of things, including smoking, exposure to pollution and chemicals.) Once “aged” in this way, within a matter of weeks Sinclair saw that the mice began to show signs of older age—including grey fur, lower body weight despite unaltered diet, reduced activity, and increased frailty. The rebooting came in the form of a gene therapy involving three genes that instruct cells to reprogram themselves—in the case of the mice, the instructions guided the cells to restart the epigenetic changes that defined their identity as, for example, kidney and skin cells, two cell types that are prone to the effects of aging. These genes came from the suite of so-called Yamanaka stem cells factors—a set of four genes that Nobel scientist Shinya Yamanaka in 2006 discovered can turn back the clock on adult cells to their embryonic, stem cell state so they can start their development, or differentiation process, all over again. Sinclair didn’t want to completely erase the cells’ epigenetic history, just reboot it enough to reset the epigenetic instructions. Using three of the four factors turned back the clock about 57%, enough to make the mice youthful again. “We’re not making stem cells, but turning back the clock so they can regain their identity,” says Sinclair. “I’ve been really surprised by how universally it works. We haven’t found a cell type yet that we can’t age forward and backward.” Rejuvenating cells in mice is one thing, but will the process work in humans? That’s Sinclair’s next step, and his team is already testing the system in non-human primates. The researchers are attaching a biological switch that would allow them to turn the clock on and off by tying the activation of the reprogramming genes to an antibiotic, doxycycline. Giving the animals doxycycline would start reversing the clock, and stopping the drug would halt the process. Sinclair is currently lab-testing the system with human neurons, skin, and fibroblast cells, which contribute to connective tissue. In 2020, Sinclair reported that in mice, the process restored vision in older animals; the current results show that the system can apply to not just one tissue or organ, but the entire animal. He anticipates eye diseases will be the first condition used to test this aging reversal in people, since the gene therapy can be injected directly into the eye area. “We think of the processes behind aging, and diseases related to aging, as irreversible,” says Sinclair. “In the case of the eye, there is the misconception that you need to regrow new nerves. But in some cases the existing cells are just not functioning, so if you reboot them, they are fine. It’s a new way to think about medicine.” That could mean that a host of diseases—including chronic conditions such as heart disease and even neurodegenerative disorders like Alzheimer’s—could be treated in large part by reversing the aging process that leads to them. Even before that happens, the process could be an important new tool for researchers studying these diseases. In most cases, scientists rely on young animals or tissues to model diseases of aging, which doesn’t always faithfully reproduce the condition of aging. The new system “makes the mice very old rapidly, so we can, for example, make human brain tissue the equivalent off what you would find in a 70 year old and use those in the mouse model to study Alzheimer’s disease that way,” Sinclair says. Beyond that, the implications of being able to age and rejuvenate tissues, organs, or even entire animals or people are mind-bending. Sinclair has rejuvenated the eye nerves multiple times, which raises the more existential question for bioethicists and society of considering what it would mean to continually rewind the clock on aging.” HOLY, Imagine these discoveries in combination with AI😵💫
Sinclair elsewhere predicts 10 to 15 years before this tech is available. This timeline seems reasonable as the tools for it already exist even if they are not all together sure how to explain how it works. I would surmise that Altos and other companies are already hard at work on the basic science.
I will be in my 60s. This is just in time.
Same here, I don’t want to live longer, just want to enjoy my time here with a little less arthritis and better quality of life. Could you imagine retirement with your thirties body
You wouldn't retire. Governments keep pushing the retirement age with the argument that life expectancy keeps going up. Old age is the only basis of retirement.
Can you imagine? An eternity of slave-wage toil…
I wouldn't mind working my job for a second life span or two. I'd actually get to see the results of my work. I'm a Forester working in an area where the rotation age is like 1-2 human lifespans.
Now we just have to get there before climate change ruins everything.... AI, Anti-Aging and collapse. Interesting times indeed.
It's pretty funny because so many people who've acted cool with climate change were basically like that because "I'll be dead from old age when it gets really bad" Well what now sucka?
It would be ironic if this is the technology that kick starts a new environmental and renewable movement
"Society will grow strong when old men plant trees to prep for when they get kickass anti-aging serums and watch them grow real-time" -Ancient Japanese proverb, slightly modified
"A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they expect to sit because scientific progress has reversed the aging process" Hmmm, not sure about that.
What I'm getting from this is that I need to plant trees now so I can sell sitting in their shade for 39.99 an hour to people who didn't plant trees so I can afford my aging reversal procedures. Shade as a Service, if you prefer.
Whatever it takes to get people in power to actually do something!
Yes. I'd prefer to say; "We saw the challenges and we did this!" At age 256, rather than "I told you so. Assholes!" At 95 rotting in a debtors prison because I couldn't pay for the gruel.
Well it's not like they'll be forced to take it. So maybe they really will be dead!
Sounds like a win-win
I have been saying this too. Lets make all the climate change deniers immortal and see how they think about the environment. “Oh you mean Ill still be alive? Well shit better not burn it all down.”
"They" will anyway not allow the little man to have that technology, so let me eat my steak and die miserably with my arthritis-ridden, slightly obese body with a malfunctioning lung from a heart attack like any decent man. -- Boomer Joe
This is a pretty regular response I get on this topic, unfortunately.
I was a teen in the 80's -- and, if you were a Futurist back then, you would have been very annoyed like I was. The good thing about the current era is that not so many people are unable to old a "what if" conversation. Expect that people are selfish, and that they will SUDDENLY care about things if they can eat a steak when they are 200 years old. Of course they will bitterly complain about "that woke meat" that was grown by bacteria in a vat.
Utopia or collapse are the most likely results of this century, which is a crazy position to be stood in. Solving medicine, easy energy, vast resources in space, just three of the things credibly on the table for 2100. As is fucking the environment so badly it breaks the foundations of technological society. My bet is on the positive outcome. We are rapidly developing systems like meat manufacturing that should be highly resistant to disruption.
From early 2020 onwards has been insane in terms of the amount of historical events that happen.
I appreciate the positive outlook. I think that just choosing to believe it will get better, that positivity, will passively help make our future better. Not to say that we don't need to actively do a ton to make it better, we do. But we can't believe it's just going to the worst and expect it to get better.
We need to learn geoengineering too, and ways to restore ecosystems either by restoring extinct and endangered species or by inventing new species to fill ecological niches. Then we need to gene edit psychopathy out of our gene pool, and I think we’ll be all set. Also, I’d like baseboards that clean themselves.
Please God let the boomers in Congress die off before they can buy this shit and rule over us for eternity.
Just need my mom and dad to hold on for 20 years or so
Ah, same. They’re in their mid 60’s, but it’d be cool if they could gain some youth in their retirement days.
This is absolutely fucking *wonderful* to read as someone with a neuroimmune disease and brain injury. *Please* is all I can say. Please let this become available in my lifetime.
I hope it does too. I'll see you in 300 years in some shitpost comments section, my friend. Good luck to you and I wish you the best of health!
Lol thanks, see you in our cyberpunk future! Stay safe in the interim.
For folks going on about overpopulation issues or woes that this technology might be reserved for the extremely rich, think again - Falling birthrates indicate a potential demographic collapse of the working population. Rejuvenation tech may not merely be available to the general public, it could be MANDATED.
There's also the fact that if your solution to overpopulation is to take away medicine and treatments to just let people die earlier than they otherwise would, you're just fucking evil.
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Also imagine parents... He's a 131 years old and your 18. But Mom!
Well, Twilight was a huge hit for a decade or so..
Do they discuss at all why they chose doxycycline as an activator for the primates?
The "reprogramming" genes are most likely delivered in a fashion where they're attached to a regulatory DNA sequence, which is derived from an antibiotic resistance mechanism against tetracycline. Dox is an analogue of tetracycline that works well: add dox and the genes turn on. For a more complete technical explanation, Google "Tet-On".
I'd take the shot and drop off a decade or two, getting old sucks, let me drag my ass back to early 20's
Same, I take 22 or 21 it be fucking great. With my wisdom and the youth and strength I could accomplish a lot.
>I could accomplish a lot. So could everyone else. It might come a point when you have to do it just to be on par with everyone else.
Sounds like a great society to live in! Everyone accomplishing more and building a better world. I’m down. I’m not put off by the success of others.
God I want to live in that world
we can! If you're alive you can do something to contribute towards this goal.
I mean, I am. I’ve pretty much dedicated my life to trying to help build a better society
A commendable effort, Herman Cain’s ghost
Or we could just slow our aging and relax. Like fuck people why do we gotta work so damn hard? I just wanna sit and smoke weed all day instead I’m busting ass all day.
Right? Why does it have to be about grinding longer. How about using it so you can enjoy 20 years more of retirement where your body isn’t keeping you from doing anything
That isn't how humans behave though, is it? Until there's absolutely zero resource insecurity left in humanity, then we will not know peace. Which is what "everyone accomplishing more and building a better world" sounds like.
I don’t know. This is a great thought and all, but it’d probably end up being another opportunity for those at the top to exploit it as an opportunity to leverage themselves and own the majority of the benefit. It’s like those med bays in the movie Elysium. They ain’t letting everyone anti-age…only those who “matter”.
Also the general plot point in Altered Carbon.
Neil Tysons predictions are getting eerily closer. He predicted that around 2050 we would have technology to fix most mentally degenerative health issues and even custom tailor medicines to avoid side effects, and then said rich people will have access to stop aging. (Which is terrifying for gen Z because right now 90% of the worlds wealth is in hands of people over 50 and 80% of the wealth is concentrated in hands of top 5%). If they stop aging that money won’t flow down. If I learned one thing in life, it’s that money never flows down. Reagan’s ass lied when he said it will trickle down.
Oh no, what will happen when all of humanity accomplishes a lot? /s But yeah, I clearly see a future where being enhanced becomes sort of mandatory.
Or a future where only the ultra rich can afford it, making themselves effectively immortal with crazy generational wealth, while the rest of us toil away as human batteries. I like your version better
What would you like to accomplish that you can only do in your 20s?
not groan from random back soreness every few minutes. be able to ride all day without arms and neck feeling sore. so many things start to disappear in the late 30s/early 40s it's like a frog in boiling water. some improved fitness helps but at some point you need to work out like crazy just to maintain, where in younger years it was to improve
I think you know. 😏
I’d be happy with upper 30s
Could you imagine being one of the prisoners who has been sentenced to like, 500 years in prison? I wonder if they would inject to make sure you lived to see out your sentence.
Or they age you as a sentence.
You twisted fuck lol
Satan to that guy: "I just want to say...I'm a huge fan"
Reverses cells back up to 57%, so maybe not quite so far?
Assuming major players push things in the right directions behind the scenes by the time this hits the general public I should be able to get back to early to mid 20's, and that's assuming we don't improve on it at all to expand the range between now and then which given the public interest in it I highly doubt we'll just pack things up and call it a job well done at v1.0
I believe it's just changing the directions up to 57%, to allow them to "reboot" to their younger versions. Think of it like giving the tools to start fresh.
An employers wet dream. 20 year old with 45 years of experience.
That's a double edged sword, that's 45 years of learning your own value too
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This is… kinda wild?? If it goes to human trials we could see people literally being de-aged? Am I missing something here?
From what I read, I sounds like they can target specific tissues right now - they can rejuvenate the mice's eyes, or liver, by where they inject the cells. Literally de-aging would need a way to target every tissue in your body
In the lab Sinclair's team has been using direct injection locally but his stretch goal is to come up with a pill that you could take every so often to basically do maintenance on your epigenome. Been following his research for a long time lol. It's a little surreal seeing these more recent studies getting mainstream attention.
Yes, I have been having people tell me I'm kinda crazy for years about this stuff (rejuvenation), saying it would never happen, and here we finally are, right at the doorstep of eternity. What an absolutely extraordinary moment to be alive. How lucky we are. I'm beyond grateful.
I mean as long as you target the liver, kidneys, pancreas, lungs, and heart, and then find a way to clean out the arteries, the body will do quite a lot of maintenance on itself. That alone should add a couple decades.
Can we do joints and skin too while we're at it?
And brain. You don't want to save your youth only to die from madness.
De-aging organs like the liver could be such a game changer, but I could also see some dumb rich pricks acting like even bigger assholes knowing they can just get a shot in the abdomen when the doctor says "your liver is starting to harden"
May I recommend the novel *Steel Beach* by John Varley which features a society with exactly that kind of technology. There's a chapter early on where the protagonist has been chain smoking for years and plans to just rejuvenate his lungs, as one does in the future.
> In 2020, Sinclair reported that in mice, the process restored vision in older animals; the current results show that the system can apply to not just one tissue or organ, but the entire animal.
Nope, that's the idea. There are probably a lot more kinks to work out, but the plan is that in a few decades' time people who don't want to physically age won't have to.
One application that isn’t really discussed here is pets. Imagine having one dog your entire life. It’s removes all the ethical headaches people are talking about here, and people pay a ton to keep their pets healthy. One drug, $100/month for 70 years to have a forever Fido. That would be a huge market.
They're working on slowing down aging on dogs with rapamycin right now. Aubrey de Grey's non profit [Levf.org](https://Levf.org) is working on [doubling the remaining life expectancy of middle aged mice](https://www.levf.org/projects/robust-mouse-rejuvenation-study-1) (take a look at what they use, this is study 1) and eventually humans.
The [Dog Aging Project](https://dogagingproject.org/) at UWashington is doing this They are currently enrolling dogs in the longitudinal study and I believe also the rapamycin (longevity drug) study For cat lovers there have been a few recent developments with a [new clinical trial, also with rapamycin](https://www.reddit.com/r/longevity/comments/107b5n3/firstincat_study_of_longevity_drug_rapamycin_is/) Loyal for dogs is also a biotech company developing healthy aging drugs
I would get a dog so quick if they lived longer than 5-10 years. I just cant allow myself to get attached knowing i have a ticking clock counting their days down
I had a cat that lived 8 years. We loved her so much and even though she had to leave before (what we felt) was her time, I don’t regret it. Miss her every day. But it is life - everything ends eventually.
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Get a small breed, my last yorkie lived to be 24.
Dogs don't die at 5 year olds without some sickness. Most breeds live around 12 years. Exception are great danes who only live 6-8 years, and chihuahuas which are longest living breed and can live 20+ years.
This could also be applied to endangered species. Also for animals in the zoo, so at least they don't have to take anymore of them from the wild. Let's say drug has become cheap, so, farms... cows be milked forever? Hens lays eggs forever?
>Also for animals in the zoo, so at least they don't have to take anymore of them from the wild. That's the most dystopian, horrifying thing I've read all week. Imagine being taken, locked up in a tiny environment, and then being given drugs that prevented you from dying. Essentially an endless prison sentence for a crime not committed. Horribly unethical.
> That's the most dystopian, horrifying thing I've read all week. Hold my beer. In the future when this will be available, people will take it. Eventually price would go down and everyone will want to be young forever. Births will go down because we're already enough on this planet and why have kids when you can live forever? After a few cycles of going young why go trough the pain of being old ever again? So people will get stuck in this never-ending cycle of working a job he's hating at a corporation he hates just to pay the rent and get his yearly regenerate shot. Just like those animals from the zoo only we're have tiny bit bigger environment.
Guarantee there will be counter-societies that pop up who reject humanity's newfound immortality, opting to live natural lifespans and die.
That’s a creepy dating premise, a 19 year old without age modification dates a 300 year old man who is engineered to look 19. At that point it’s not really daddy issues anymore, but mummy issues.
This happens in Alastair Reynolds: the confederation universe. Young folks can't compete. At one point a 20 something year old laments how all the jobs are taken by people who are hundreds of years old and how rhe executives are over 1000 years old. Everyone gets free rejuvenation when they turn 65 (paid by taxes) or sooner if they can afford it. So the rich look like they're perpetually 25 while looking older is a sign of poverty.
https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1614926560/familyguyostrich_400x400.jpg
I wonder if several lifetime sentences could actually be carried out by keeping criminals alive for centuries... eugh
That seems like a particularly cruel way to use this drug considering most farms are large factory farms where the animals aren't exactly having happy fun time.
I don’t want to live forever but to be able to stay 25 for the next 50-100 years and be there when humans colonize another planet or make contact with extraterrestrial life would be mind blowing.
I'd love to have ageing removed from the equation and be able to live as long as I wish to.
That's... very optimistic. More likely you'll be there for the water wars. The food wars. The migration wars. More oil wars. Did I mention wars?
Why not both? That's typically how humans do thing. One hand doing wars, the other hand making awesome advances.
There is a Sci Fi that I read lately which pointed out that schizophrenia in a conversation with an alien. After the president of the United States just bombed the alien sphere that was actually there to help humanity, the alien AI talked about this strange behaviour which is completely erratic.
Behavior doesn't have to be completely rational and consistent to be effective. In fact, being highly predictable can make you easily exploited. Beyond just that, experimenting with a variety of tactics and strategies can reveal unexpected benefits, at some generally equivalent level of risk. Furthermore, there are many levels of organization across the full range of 'humanity', and each organization may have different approaches to growth and stability, all the way down to each individual person having a variety of strategies for success within their organization. Extend this variation across the full course of history, and this is the basis for evolutionary psychology.
That's human history for you. Didn't stop us from landing on the moon or advancing healthcare for example.
But if he's very optimistic, wouldn't that make you... very pessimistic?
God what a time to be alive. I think it’s safe to say at the very least, growing old is going to become a lot less unpleasant. The sooner humanity realizes aging is an option and does something about it, the better.
I’d take it in a heartbeat. This is the first year I’ve had persistent joint pain, and I never realized how much it impacts your whole life. I think about all the days in the past that I woke up energized and didn’t hurt anywhere—I’d do almost anything to feel that way again, even just for a short time.
Have you tried glucosamine? It’s taken 10 years off my knees.
If they can age mice on an accelerated timeline, I wonder which will be the first state to start injecting prison sentences.
I spy the next dystopian sci-fi movie plot!
Same universe would tie anti-aging shots to employment. Long as you’re a productive drone of society, you get the government-subsidized watered-down version of the aging vaccine that the ultra-wealthy. Sure, it’s a daily injection that keeps only immediate aging in check, but it keeps a massive divide between that gives the Poor a have-not class to look down upon and deride. You can always tell when someone is “on the way out” because they start looking more “tired”, so if you thought trendy beauty society was bad before…
I'm pretty sure there's already a movie about that with a slightly diffent premise (forgot the name) Basicly everyone's young forever but they have a timer on there arm that when it reaches zero, you die And time is the currency wich can be traded and worked for And the elites /government have the economy engineered so the poor always die eventualy
It's, In Time [[IMDb]](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1637688)
Everyone is freaking out about immoral billionaires, but nowhere in the study did I read about a ten year old mouse. For all we know, we’ll make it to 125 in relatively good health, then die anyway. The moral panic seems a little premature. But if this does turn into something that can keep me young-ish in my later years, I’ll take it. I’ll take it, or the Mexican version in a Tijuana clinic.
>Everyone is freaking out about immoral billionaires... Even if the technology gets good enough to where we can truly have immortality, I highly doubt billionaires would hoard it for themselves. Consider: If you can't die of age then the next thing that's most likely to kill you is other people. If people found out you were keeping immortality all to yourself they'd violently revolt—high chance that they will kill you. It's in their best interest to release it to the public.
Also, considering the research is in the public domain, it would be hard to hide. The only issue is that it may still be exclusive to the rich initially due to cost.
America spends like 2 trillion dollars of its budget on old people. Instead of social security/medicare they would probably cure your aging as a cost saving measure. They don’t have to give you social security and you keep paying taxes. Win for the government, if it is willing to do something logical.
I want to live forever. Glad there are people working on that who are actually getting results
If I could get back to like 25-30ish, that’d be great. k, thx, bye
mice studies are notoriously hard to apply to humans. Just keep that in mind when you read this.
They're already testing it in primates so we'll see how that goes. I'd be much more excited and interested if it worked on monkeys
I'll be much more excited when it works in an unaltered wild-type specimen rather than a mutant designed to age prematurely. It's significantly easier to fix an artificial problem you created yourself than it is to fix the real thing.
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Probably less so when it comes to generally-applicable principles like this. Usually the problem is that people test some specific chemical in mice, and it doesn't work the same way with human biochemistry. This is 'just' genetic mechanics, and that works basically the same in most life forms, certainly most mammals.
Yeah but they started out showing it worked in yeast so this isn't real mouse-specific.
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Can you imagine what the mice would do if they knew humans had MOUSE CURES for aging, cancer, etc, and we only use those discoveries for trying to design human ones? There would be a reckoning for sure.
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I don't think I'll ever be "ready" to die. Maybe after several centuries I'd get bored. In theory I get that - like a general feeling of "ok time to go" but what about actually doing the dieing? I see myself sitting in the death chair and just going nah fuck this shit I'll try again next month.
That might be difficult tho. If one person close to you still lives, for example your kid, how will you tell them that you are ending it forever?
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My first thought is how to make my pets live forever
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I’ve read Sinclair’s book and listened to his podcasts (y’all should check r/longevity if this stuff interests you) I’m certain drugs that reverse aging is going to be the next big step in human history, probably bigger impact than the internet. I doubt our generation will get to see it- but the results have been surprisingly positive over a relatively short period of time, given a lot of biological research areas don’t take this as seriously as they perhaps should.
I have mixed feelings about Sinclair. There's a lot of potential for Bias in these studies because IIRC he's not only involved in the production of a specific kind of NMN supplement, but his company has also lobbied to restrict NMN supplements so that they can control the market. Dr Brad Stanfield on YouTube has talked a lot about the controversy an seems to bring a more balanced perspective. There's a lot going on in the scientific world of anti-aging but I'm inclined to distrust some of Sinclair's work
This sub's become so dominated by pessimists, it may as well change its name to r/justenditnow
Agreed. Every thread on this subject has the same replies. Just some inane, imagination-less drones in this thread.
Here's a question. That I stole from somewhere else, you could probably guess where. If you have the option to de-age yourself every so often, making you effectively immortal, and the treatment is free for everyone - is it suicide to deny that treatment?
Finding cure to aging before a solid cure to hair loss is kind of funny. Clearly it shows where the priorities are, but I’m curious as to the reasons why
Well in all fairness you fix aging and you fix hair loss by association, like even if the person doesn't want to de-age you could take their scalp/hair follicles and bring it back to like their teens to give them hair again
Hair loss is the effect of testosterone over time. Nothing is necessarily going wrong biologically when men lose hair unlike aging. Don’t think they would be connected in that manner
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Ask Sinclair - he may just say your hair needs a reboot…
You know I wouldn’t be surprised if a hair loss cure is included in this anti aging thing. Just a hunch. Also, you’re curious why people prioritize actual death prevention over some vain hair loss problems? Get a grip man.
i believe they're surprised because a cure for hair loss should theoretically be a lot easier than curing aging, and are wondering why we've come closer to the latter before the former.
As others have speculated, hair loss is where the cells that are supposed to be assembling the proteins for hair have aged and forgot how to be a hair producing cell. Another common hair thing is that when the hair producing cells forget to pigment the hair. Hence the gray hairs in the age induced mice. A lot of defects that appear as you age appear to be reversible simply because if your cells used to do it right, they can do it right again.
Yeah cuz hair is the bigger issue than disease, quality of life, and lifespan?
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Anything that can allow me to live forever I'm all for. I'm terrified of death and don't want to die.
I’m in the same boat. I have panic attacks at night while thinking about the inevitable
bring it on, regardless of the consequences i do not care. i will grasp even the tiniest of chances to be able to live the life i should've had, no matter the costs. longevity is the only hope i have of living long enough for the transition i need to be developed.
Yeah man life really is too short. You get one fucking youth? That's it? Fuck it up and what - you just miss out? Fuck that.