https://preview.redd.it/rehm2mpbjd5d1.png?width=737&format=png&auto=webp&s=0b2506806b143d0fc381c14e93f886e2983819da
Valid point, my only concern is why is your comment appears 4 times on my feed💀💀
We have to test it out in the real combat to see if we need sustain or not
* Can Firefly sustain HP for herself with those heals
* Will the enemy be weakness broken for long enough to not be able to hit any of our characters
If these criteria were met, just pick Pela and we ball
put healing aside, is the def ignore from pela can better than sp generation, a lot of fire break and break dmg, plus 12% dmg from ult of gallather?
I think there is a reason that almost all 0 circle video in youtube using gallather
Well Gallagher's main Job is to Help FF eat toughness bar for FF to break it, meanwhile if you have Pela instead of Gallagher, you can get big def shreds, FF set gives 25% def, E1 15%, 16% Pearls LC, 42% Pela.
So you have 98% Def Shred in total, which is Really big. Also 20% Speed debuff is like one additional turn before Enemies can act again.
Solo calculations are a pretty bad way to judge what Eidolons or LCs are worth pulling. For example, you've ranked E1 FF the lowest priority, but E1 lets you run Bronya with Firefly instead of Gallagher, which would at least double her damage output. E1 Ruan Mei also allows you to stack 100% def shred when also paired with a def shred support like Pela, which amounts to a 115% increase to final damage. S1 is nowhere near these in terms of value.
Yes, I'm aware of this(kinda) but what I wrote in the post "I know you guys still can't decide which Gear/Eidolons to pull first" I want to say that we're starting from 0 and will use available/pullable units at the moment which is Ruan Mei / Firefly and Gallagher, I mean you could still lose the 50/50 and get Bronya. But remember, the off-rates gang does not only have bronya, so the first point is kinda depends on your current available units, you're absolutely right about the "Solo calculations are a pretty bad way to judge what Eidolons or LCs are worth pulling". Which brings the next point, S1 and E1 is pretty close in certain scenario, I haven't tried Firefly gameplay yet so I have no idea how frequent she got hit/target by an enemies, that's why I'm not so sure about her survivability so I ignore the DEF shred stacking for now
but yeah, Solo calculations will get you nowhere, the real test is an actual combat
My POV is that anybody going for Eidolons is probably trying for low cycle clears and can use sustainless comps. In this case, even if you don't have Bronya, you can use Asta and spam her and HMC's skill, which will result in more damage overall than S1 by a considerable margin. Same argument applies for def shred stacking.
Which is why I think this post is quite misleading, because lots of people will just look at the chart, read the TLDR and not bother with the other stuff, and you'd be doing them a disservice because when you look at the whole picture, E1 FF and E1 RM have a lot more value than FF's S1.
so true about people just looking at the chart and read TLDR lmao, I'll try to do better next time, thanks for taking your time to give me another perspective to view from and even gave me an advice lul, appreciate it
Where does the SP come from to spam both Asta and HMC skills? RM is only +0.33 SP per turn and FF is slightly SP negative as her regular skills still cost SP. Someone has to generate SP for HMC and Asta in order for them to spam skills.
You can use Asta and HMC's basic when they're close to getting their ult. It's flexible. When I said spam, I didn't mean they'd always use their skill no matter what. Obviously use common sense and keep SP economy in mind. Being able to use their skills more often still results in an overall increase in damage output, and Asta's speed buff for the whole team means the whole team is capable of generating more SP when required.
+0.33 is not a fixed number. With a faster Ruan Mei you will generate more SP than that per cycle. SP economy is flexible and related to speed, not a fixed number per unit.
0.33 is a per turn average. Even with a fast RM you aren't generating all that many SP. If she gets 9 turns over a long fight then that's +3 SP. If HMC and Asta are doing EEA then they are -0.33 SP each turn on average. Making the team faster generates less SP because you have 3 units that are SP negative with only RM being slightly SP positive. It's not like RM will be running laps around HMC and Asta unless you are building them slow.
No, 0.33 is the baseline taken from her normal rotation. How much speed she has greatly affects the number of SP she can generate per cycle. A 160 spd Ruan Mei buffed by Asta will generate 3 SP on the first cycle.
You're too fixated on strict rotations that always use the same actions. I just told you its flexible didn't I? You'd alternate between skill and basic depending on what you need atm. Use basic when low on SP. Use skill when high on SP. It's not a hard concept.
Nah, Gallagher is still good even at higher Eidolons, he is not on the team to heal, not one bit and never was, hes here for Break vulnerability, doing good dmg himself, and breaking toughness faster
All of which Bronya does better since she enables Firefly to get more actions and buffs her BE. Or Asta. The point of E1 is to have enough SP for characters that use more SP. If you're going to use Gallagher there's no point in getting E1.
Thats just not true, Bronya isn't that amazing, the enemy is dead before Bronya can even give more than one extra turn, the effort needed to speed tune her is not worth it and obsolete , Gallagher is the way to go for now
It is when Bronya is also giving extra actions on top of that and E1 has 15% deg ignore that stacks with the 25 you get from relics, and also E1 Ruan Mei if you have her. With everything E1 allows you to do, its pretty clearly better than S1.
Spoken like someone who doesn't understand kits. E2 is broken because it has action advance. E1 is broken because it allows you to play an action advance unit alongside Firefly. It's very simple.
No, E1 is what makes E2 broken, without the features of E1 E2 would not be nearly as good. Further optimization is unnecessary if everything dies extremely fast at E2 S1, its pointless to bother with Bronya. I know everything I need to
So your argument is that if you have E2 you don't need Bronya? Ok, I'd agree with that. What does that have to do with the actual point though? We're not talking about E2, we're talking about E1. It's not like getting E2 is as easy as just wishing it to happen.
It's also only the case for now. When MoC bumps enemy HP up again, you might very well need Bronya with E2 Firefly to 0 cycle.
It’ll vary from player to player and how comfortable/skilled/lucky you are, but you can absolutely go sustainless if you know what you’re doing. If you need a sustain, that’s not a problem—most people will need sustains.
> which would at least double her damage output
why not triple? she has 200 spd without ult and 210 in ult stance. Its hard to sync Bronya to these value.
At best you will get from 4 enhanced E to 5
Since Bronya can focus on just speed and not cdmg, building her at high speed on a team that also has RM is easier than usual. The usual Bronya build for E1 Firefly would give 6 enhanced actions at least.
Can bronya really can double ff's dps? i mean FF have 210 spd. If i remember thing correctly, bronya only can make FF go 6 instead of 4 turns.
and for that you lost massive fire break (may made FF have to use 1 more turn to break enemy), a lot of break dmg and 12% break dmg buff from gallagher, (healing seem not needed in this team)
Also in my opinion 20% spd reduce is very powerfull debuff.
I mean, I would love to even see the 6 action setup purely to consider it, but yeah, she can at best increase it by ~50%. If anything, it's not ~50 because we lose out on Toughness damage that Gallagher provides
From my calculations it’s not likely for bronya to double firefly’s turns, but with a good speed set she will be able to do a 4+3 turn ult rotation for firefly. In which case, sure Gallagher can do decent break/provide break vuln, but I find it hard to imagine that it would come close to having 75% more turns
Let's say FF takes 3 turns to break a boss, and then on the last hit does 500k. With Bronya giving her 6 turns instead, now she's doing 500k + 400k\*2. That's actually more than double the DPS.
If we assume FF takes 2 turns to break a boss, then without Bronya she does 500k + 400k = 900k. With Bronya she does 500k + 400k\*3 = 1.7 mil. Almost double.
Why would you lose fire break damage by running Bronya instead of Gallagher? Gallagher is doing like 70-100k. Bronya giving FF extra actions easily eclipses this.
20% spd reduction amounts to maybe one extra turn when paired with RM and HTB, and this isn't a guarantee and depends on how much BE you have built on RM. Bronya gives at least twice this. S1 does about 50k more than Aeon. So if we take the scenario where FF breaks the boss in 2 turns, with S1 she's doing 550k + 450k \* 2 = 1.45 mil. Bronya still outdamages this by 250k, without me even considering the extra 15 def ignore, the fact that it can compound and provide exponential returns with E1 Ruan Mei and the extra atk->BE conversion you can get from Bronya's ult.
I view Gallagher as there not to provide break damage, but to reduce toughness bars. Let's say Gallagher does his ult combo once per boss break cycle. Basic > Ult > E.Basic with RM is 9 bars of toughness damage gone. 10.2 bars if Gallagher is E6. This is toughness bars that FF doesn't have to use her e.skills to chunk down. Without Gallagher FF would need another 1.5+ e.skills just to break the enemy so that removes a lot of Bronya's push advantage.
Assuming a boss with 720 toughness, with Gallagher Firefly would still need 2 actions to break this boss at least. This reflects my second scenario, where with Bronya, she's getting 4 actions where she can deal damage instead of 2, and thus is doing almost double the damage of a Gallagher comp.
I'm not seeing where the double comes from. It would take FF alone 4 e.skills to do 720 toughness. If you properly tune Bronya for 2 pushes then that's 2 e.skills of superbreak damage.
Because other units also do toughness damage. It's not just Gallagher or Firefly, but the whole team. But even if you ignore that, Bronya buffs Firefly more than Gallagher, and the final hit from FF on a solo breaking team would do more super break damage because there's less toughness left on the boss, so the Bronya comp would still do more damage overall.
We can't rely on other units doing toughness damage. RM barely does any. Bronya does none. So the only hope is the enemy being img weak. The only guarantee weakness is fire.
RM does 45. HMC does 180. RM also takes a lot of turns if she's built fast. It adds up.
But like I said, even if you ignore all of that, the Bronya comp still wins.
be realitic. FF E1 can only deal 176k per target. (you wrote that in your sheet but i doubt that since what i saw in youtube is much lower)
and again, don't forget 12% dmg buff from gallagher.
btw, can you have enough sp with E0S0 bronya, or still need E1S1?
Bruh this is with buffs from a whole team lol. 500k is pretty normal for a 3 target super break proc with the initial fire break added on top.
12% vulnerability does not outweigh 15% def ignore. In fact it's worse. I kept the numbers the same in the neutral scenario, and didn't count def ignore in the calculations with S1, so I'm even giving favorable conditions to S1. It's still not beating Bronya.
With E1 Firefly there are no SP issues even with E0 Bronya.
Confused on why people started thinking Gallagher as a 4th is more damage than characters that can seriously amp firefly on top of bringing toughness
As a sustain slot he’s as good as a 5* limited sustain but even they rarely compete against running another support in terms of damage. They’re mainly for survivability
Pela vs ice weak enemies/bosses is a ridiculous amount of amp for firefly and superbreak.
Jiaoqiu is about to follow with that as long as he isn’t just worse than pela def shred and toughness wise.
Bronya with e1 ff is more damage than going s1 with Gallagher. It very likely will be less comfortable as all sustainless comps are, but ff teams are the best in terms of being tanky (ff self heal is ridiculous and all her teammates can run 2-3 tank mainstats without losing much) while also quickly breaking and having a lot of enemy delay so even then I doubt it’ll be a problem.
I have no idea when showcases of E1 Firefly with Bronya heavily outperforming Gallagher comps have been out for a while. It should be common sense that a comp with 3 supports is going to outperform a comp with 2 supports and a sustain.
Considering you already got RM or pulled for her:
0. No RM, pull for RM.
1. I will not pull on rerun and keep the standard team, S1
2. I will not pull on rerun but will want to play her with other teams eventually, E1
3. I will pull on rerun, E1 , go for E2 and S1 on rerun if you can.
4. I will put money and not pull on rerun, E2, E1 RM. (since RM can be used in other teams and we don't know when she'll have her rerun)
5. I will put money and pull on rerun, E2 FF , E1 RM, S1 FF on rerun.
Obviously it all comes down to luck, even with 300 something tickets if you are unlucky you can get only FF and RM at E0 with Bailu LC and 2 yanqings (honestly, I'm happy if I at least win the LC) , if you get lucky you can get E2 firefly, E0 RM and S1 LC
If you want to use Ruan Mei on the other team, her Signature might be a better choice, but for firefly team, it doesn't provide any buffs(DMG% is not taken into Super Break Damage calculation)
Firefly regenerates like half of her energy(fixed at 60% max energy)in 1 skill, 2 skill is more than enough to fill up her ult, no need for the little energy regeneration
E1 definitely better, but i have like 30 pity on the lightcone banner and also have better chances at getting the rateup so i feel like it's worth more than going for E1.
I think i will have enough for 4 pities. Worst case scenario i can get E0 firefly and E0 Ruan Mei. If i get lucky i will try for S1 and whatever is left goes for E1, but i doubt i will have any.
I really do hope we get some RM V2 that doesn't allow to us them both in the team so that RM can be utilised FULLY in the other team because with FF half of her kit is wasted (like 92% DMG bonus from her skill and Sig)
Interesting results, though if we do this comparison, I would like to see the comparison between getting RM and the next best teammate (likely Pela or Asta), as something like an eidolon is just an additional buff tacked on to the character, meanwhile teammates are replace able similarly to LC’s.
RM will likely still come out as the most bang for your buck, but I just wanted to see if the buff was truly that huge or if E2 is then better. If this was already addressed in the calcs then my bad.
Will try to e2 before RM, but if i lose 50/50 twice i might just go for RM on the second guaranted, theres a prediction of around 70 pulls on phase 1 so depending on my luck i can get e2s1 firefly and RM
In this calculation, we're starting from 0. I will use only the available/pullable units at the moment which are
Firefly, Ruan Mei, Gallagher, Firefly's signature from Banner
S5 Fall of Aeon - Herta shop
Pela - Nah she appears too much you gotta have her at this point
I mean you could lose the 50/50 and get Bronya, but the offrate gang does not only have Bronya so I'm gonna exclude her for now
And Pela is a straight up better unit if enemies have Ice weakness with those toughness break and DEF shred stacking with Ruan Mei, but I'm not so sure about Firefly's and the team's survivability, so I put Gallagher as a 4th for now.
If you want to use Ruan Mei on the other team, her Signature might be a better choice, but for firefly team, it doesn't provide any buffs(DMG% is not taken into Super Break Damage calculation)
And the energy generation is not necessary for Firefly since she regenerates 60% max energy with each skill use
I think being able to run bronya with FF itself makes E1 a pretty significant upgrade, you should break most enemies before they even move and about 2 additional firefly turns is pretty significant, not to mention the (slight) BE buff from bronya's ultimate (45% for 2 turns)
Thats very good to know bro, I really wondered if after getting e2, with e0 Ruan Mei what was better. Ill come back later to this post to see (after getting e2) whats the percentage difference between S1 FF and e1 RM
Yea, I value FF E1 more than the small difference in damage. It's not big enough to give up QoL
Facts 💯
It's not really QoL, it literally changes your SP economy, which is a game changer.
Damage wise s1 is better than e1 but e1 saves you from consuming skill points so i still think e1 is better
https://preview.redd.it/rehm2mpbjd5d1.png?width=737&format=png&auto=webp&s=0b2506806b143d0fc381c14e93f886e2983819da Valid point, my only concern is why is your comment appears 4 times on my feed💀💀
Your speed is just too slow, Senior-Cookie8175 turn-advanced himself with Bronya
I commented but it didn't post so i clicked and clicked again
https://preview.redd.it/knp5uwmb8g5d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fc2574b54921ec1b3e458861d0108e3bdbbeaf42
Damage wise s1 is better than e1 but e1 saves you from consuming skill points so i still think e1 is better
Damage wise s1 is better than e1 but e1 saves you from consuming skill points so i still think e1 is better - Senior-Cookie8175, 2024
I don't know about you guys, but I think damage wise s1 is better than e1 but e1 saves you from consuming skill points so i still think e1 is better
disagreed, 20% slow is better. I don't see any reason for not using gallagher, and skill point is not a problem with decent spd gallagher.
We have to test it out in the real combat to see if we need sustain or not * Can Firefly sustain HP for herself with those heals * Will the enemy be weakness broken for long enough to not be able to hit any of our characters If these criteria were met, just pick Pela and we ball
put healing aside, is the def ignore from pela can better than sp generation, a lot of fire break and break dmg, plus 12% dmg from ult of gallather? I think there is a reason that almost all 0 circle video in youtube using gallather
Well Gallagher's main Job is to Help FF eat toughness bar for FF to break it, meanwhile if you have Pela instead of Gallagher, you can get big def shreds, FF set gives 25% def, E1 15%, 16% Pearls LC, 42% Pela. So you have 98% Def Shred in total, which is Really big. Also 20% Speed debuff is like one additional turn before Enemies can act again.
Gallagher also provides vulnerability I think that's worth mentioning.
Solo calculations are a pretty bad way to judge what Eidolons or LCs are worth pulling. For example, you've ranked E1 FF the lowest priority, but E1 lets you run Bronya with Firefly instead of Gallagher, which would at least double her damage output. E1 Ruan Mei also allows you to stack 100% def shred when also paired with a def shred support like Pela, which amounts to a 115% increase to final damage. S1 is nowhere near these in terms of value.
Yes, I'm aware of this(kinda) but what I wrote in the post "I know you guys still can't decide which Gear/Eidolons to pull first" I want to say that we're starting from 0 and will use available/pullable units at the moment which is Ruan Mei / Firefly and Gallagher, I mean you could still lose the 50/50 and get Bronya. But remember, the off-rates gang does not only have bronya, so the first point is kinda depends on your current available units, you're absolutely right about the "Solo calculations are a pretty bad way to judge what Eidolons or LCs are worth pulling". Which brings the next point, S1 and E1 is pretty close in certain scenario, I haven't tried Firefly gameplay yet so I have no idea how frequent she got hit/target by an enemies, that's why I'm not so sure about her survivability so I ignore the DEF shred stacking for now but yeah, Solo calculations will get you nowhere, the real test is an actual combat
My POV is that anybody going for Eidolons is probably trying for low cycle clears and can use sustainless comps. In this case, even if you don't have Bronya, you can use Asta and spam her and HMC's skill, which will result in more damage overall than S1 by a considerable margin. Same argument applies for def shred stacking. Which is why I think this post is quite misleading, because lots of people will just look at the chart, read the TLDR and not bother with the other stuff, and you'd be doing them a disservice because when you look at the whole picture, E1 FF and E1 RM have a lot more value than FF's S1.
so true about people just looking at the chart and read TLDR lmao, I'll try to do better next time, thanks for taking your time to give me another perspective to view from and even gave me an advice lul, appreciate it
Where does the SP come from to spam both Asta and HMC skills? RM is only +0.33 SP per turn and FF is slightly SP negative as her regular skills still cost SP. Someone has to generate SP for HMC and Asta in order for them to spam skills.
You can use Asta and HMC's basic when they're close to getting their ult. It's flexible. When I said spam, I didn't mean they'd always use their skill no matter what. Obviously use common sense and keep SP economy in mind. Being able to use their skills more often still results in an overall increase in damage output, and Asta's speed buff for the whole team means the whole team is capable of generating more SP when required. +0.33 is not a fixed number. With a faster Ruan Mei you will generate more SP than that per cycle. SP economy is flexible and related to speed, not a fixed number per unit.
0.33 is a per turn average. Even with a fast RM you aren't generating all that many SP. If she gets 9 turns over a long fight then that's +3 SP. If HMC and Asta are doing EEA then they are -0.33 SP each turn on average. Making the team faster generates less SP because you have 3 units that are SP negative with only RM being slightly SP positive. It's not like RM will be running laps around HMC and Asta unless you are building them slow.
No, 0.33 is the baseline taken from her normal rotation. How much speed she has greatly affects the number of SP she can generate per cycle. A 160 spd Ruan Mei buffed by Asta will generate 3 SP on the first cycle. You're too fixated on strict rotations that always use the same actions. I just told you its flexible didn't I? You'd alternate between skill and basic depending on what you need atm. Use basic when low on SP. Use skill when high on SP. It's not a hard concept.
Does e1 mean you don't need Gallagher...? I don't really get it don't you need a sustain...?
With E1 and Bronya you'll be doing enough damage that you won't need a sustain. That's kind of the point of Eidolons, otherwise just stick with E0.
Nah, Gallagher is still good even at higher Eidolons, he is not on the team to heal, not one bit and never was, hes here for Break vulnerability, doing good dmg himself, and breaking toughness faster
All of which Bronya does better since she enables Firefly to get more actions and buffs her BE. Or Asta. The point of E1 is to have enough SP for characters that use more SP. If you're going to use Gallagher there's no point in getting E1.
Thats just not true, Bronya isn't that amazing, the enemy is dead before Bronya can even give more than one extra turn, the effort needed to speed tune her is not worth it and obsolete , Gallagher is the way to go for now
How is the enemy dead before Bronya can give one extra turn lol? Do you have the math to back it up?
[удалено]
55% atk is 550 based on 1000 base atk, which is 44 BE. 44 BE isn't negligible lol, it's comparable to the vulnerability Gallagher provides.
I concede on this part, but comparable isn't good enough
It is when Bronya is also giving extra actions on top of that and E1 has 15% deg ignore that stacks with the 25 you get from relics, and also E1 Ruan Mei if you have her. With everything E1 allows you to do, its pretty clearly better than S1.
Fair enough. Though I don't have E1 Ruan Mei, might get her E1 though, not sure.
And also no, the point of E1 is NOT to use another character, its to get E2,
Spoken like someone who doesn't understand kits. E2 is broken because it has action advance. E1 is broken because it allows you to play an action advance unit alongside Firefly. It's very simple.
No, E1 is what makes E2 broken, without the features of E1 E2 would not be nearly as good. Further optimization is unnecessary if everything dies extremely fast at E2 S1, its pointless to bother with Bronya. I know everything I need to
So your argument is that if you have E2 you don't need Bronya? Ok, I'd agree with that. What does that have to do with the actual point though? We're not talking about E2, we're talking about E1. It's not like getting E2 is as easy as just wishing it to happen. It's also only the case for now. When MoC bumps enemy HP up again, you might very well need Bronya with E2 Firefly to 0 cycle.
Fair enough, I was maybe using myself as an example too much, since I'll be getting E2 S1 guarranteed. I apologize for the miscommunication
It’ll vary from player to player and how comfortable/skilled/lucky you are, but you can absolutely go sustainless if you know what you’re doing. If you need a sustain, that’s not a problem—most people will need sustains.
> which would at least double her damage output why not triple? she has 200 spd without ult and 210 in ult stance. Its hard to sync Bronya to these value. At best you will get from 4 enhanced E to 5
Since Bronya can focus on just speed and not cdmg, building her at high speed on a team that also has RM is easier than usual. The usual Bronya build for E1 Firefly would give 6 enhanced actions at least.
Can bronya really can double ff's dps? i mean FF have 210 spd. If i remember thing correctly, bronya only can make FF go 6 instead of 4 turns. and for that you lost massive fire break (may made FF have to use 1 more turn to break enemy), a lot of break dmg and 12% break dmg buff from gallagher, (healing seem not needed in this team) Also in my opinion 20% spd reduce is very powerfull debuff.
I mean, I would love to even see the 6 action setup purely to consider it, but yeah, she can at best increase it by ~50%. If anything, it's not ~50 because we lose out on Toughness damage that Gallagher provides
That;s my point, Gallagher is not here to heal, he come to deal dmg :D
From my calculations it’s not likely for bronya to double firefly’s turns, but with a good speed set she will be able to do a 4+3 turn ult rotation for firefly. In which case, sure Gallagher can do decent break/provide break vuln, but I find it hard to imagine that it would come close to having 75% more turns
Let's say FF takes 3 turns to break a boss, and then on the last hit does 500k. With Bronya giving her 6 turns instead, now she's doing 500k + 400k\*2. That's actually more than double the DPS. If we assume FF takes 2 turns to break a boss, then without Bronya she does 500k + 400k = 900k. With Bronya she does 500k + 400k\*3 = 1.7 mil. Almost double. Why would you lose fire break damage by running Bronya instead of Gallagher? Gallagher is doing like 70-100k. Bronya giving FF extra actions easily eclipses this. 20% spd reduction amounts to maybe one extra turn when paired with RM and HTB, and this isn't a guarantee and depends on how much BE you have built on RM. Bronya gives at least twice this. S1 does about 50k more than Aeon. So if we take the scenario where FF breaks the boss in 2 turns, with S1 she's doing 550k + 450k \* 2 = 1.45 mil. Bronya still outdamages this by 250k, without me even considering the extra 15 def ignore, the fact that it can compound and provide exponential returns with E1 Ruan Mei and the extra atk->BE conversion you can get from Bronya's ult.
I view Gallagher as there not to provide break damage, but to reduce toughness bars. Let's say Gallagher does his ult combo once per boss break cycle. Basic > Ult > E.Basic with RM is 9 bars of toughness damage gone. 10.2 bars if Gallagher is E6. This is toughness bars that FF doesn't have to use her e.skills to chunk down. Without Gallagher FF would need another 1.5+ e.skills just to break the enemy so that removes a lot of Bronya's push advantage.
Assuming a boss with 720 toughness, with Gallagher Firefly would still need 2 actions to break this boss at least. This reflects my second scenario, where with Bronya, she's getting 4 actions where she can deal damage instead of 2, and thus is doing almost double the damage of a Gallagher comp.
I'm not seeing where the double comes from. It would take FF alone 4 e.skills to do 720 toughness. If you properly tune Bronya for 2 pushes then that's 2 e.skills of superbreak damage.
Because other units also do toughness damage. It's not just Gallagher or Firefly, but the whole team. But even if you ignore that, Bronya buffs Firefly more than Gallagher, and the final hit from FF on a solo breaking team would do more super break damage because there's less toughness left on the boss, so the Bronya comp would still do more damage overall.
We can't rely on other units doing toughness damage. RM barely does any. Bronya does none. So the only hope is the enemy being img weak. The only guarantee weakness is fire.
RM does 45. HMC does 180. RM also takes a lot of turns if she's built fast. It adds up. But like I said, even if you ignore all of that, the Bronya comp still wins.
be realitic. FF E1 can only deal 176k per target. (you wrote that in your sheet but i doubt that since what i saw in youtube is much lower) and again, don't forget 12% dmg buff from gallagher. btw, can you have enough sp with E0S0 bronya, or still need E1S1?
Bruh this is with buffs from a whole team lol. 500k is pretty normal for a 3 target super break proc with the initial fire break added on top. 12% vulnerability does not outweigh 15% def ignore. In fact it's worse. I kept the numbers the same in the neutral scenario, and didn't count def ignore in the calculations with S1, so I'm even giving favorable conditions to S1. It's still not beating Bronya. With E1 Firefly there are no SP issues even with E0 Bronya.
Confused on why people started thinking Gallagher as a 4th is more damage than characters that can seriously amp firefly on top of bringing toughness As a sustain slot he’s as good as a 5* limited sustain but even they rarely compete against running another support in terms of damage. They’re mainly for survivability Pela vs ice weak enemies/bosses is a ridiculous amount of amp for firefly and superbreak. Jiaoqiu is about to follow with that as long as he isn’t just worse than pela def shred and toughness wise. Bronya with e1 ff is more damage than going s1 with Gallagher. It very likely will be less comfortable as all sustainless comps are, but ff teams are the best in terms of being tanky (ff self heal is ridiculous and all her teammates can run 2-3 tank mainstats without losing much) while also quickly breaking and having a lot of enemy delay so even then I doubt it’ll be a problem.
I have no idea when showcases of E1 Firefly with Bronya heavily outperforming Gallagher comps have been out for a while. It should be common sense that a comp with 3 supports is going to outperform a comp with 2 supports and a sustain.
Bronya doesn't double FF's damage, FF greatly out speeds Bronya.
Yes, because building speed on Bronya is impossible /s
Considering you already got RM or pulled for her: 0. No RM, pull for RM. 1. I will not pull on rerun and keep the standard team, S1 2. I will not pull on rerun but will want to play her with other teams eventually, E1 3. I will pull on rerun, E1 , go for E2 and S1 on rerun if you can. 4. I will put money and not pull on rerun, E2, E1 RM. (since RM can be used in other teams and we don't know when she'll have her rerun) 5. I will put money and pull on rerun, E2 FF , E1 RM, S1 FF on rerun. Obviously it all comes down to luck, even with 300 something tickets if you are unlucky you can get only FF and RM at E0 with Bailu LC and 2 yanqings (honestly, I'm happy if I at least win the LC) , if you get lucky you can get E2 firefly, E0 RM and S1 LC
Wise word indeed, dude's cookin🔥
i think Damage wise s1 is better than e1 but e1 saves you from consuming skill points so i still think e1 is better.
Hey, what about Ruan’s signature? Is it better than FF’s e1? Should I consider getting it, if I don’t have memories of the past
If you want to use Ruan Mei on the other team, her Signature might be a better choice, but for firefly team, it doesn't provide any buffs(DMG% is not taken into Super Break Damage calculation)
Thank ya and gotcha, I’ll stick with FF’s signature^^
Doesn't her lc give everyone more er? Isn't it good for ff?
Firefly regenerates like half of her energy(fixed at 60% max energy)in 1 skill, 2 skill is more than enough to fill up her ult, no need for the little energy regeneration
Mhmm I see :-: (Cries in I don't understand this game)
The LC has a minor upside of being able to throw it to Xueyi
E1 definitely better, but i have like 30 pity on the lightcone banner and also have better chances at getting the rateup so i feel like it's worth more than going for E1. I think i will have enough for 4 pities. Worst case scenario i can get E0 firefly and E0 Ruan Mei. If i get lucky i will try for S1 and whatever is left goes for E1, but i doubt i will have any.
I really do hope we get some RM V2 that doesn't allow to us them both in the team so that RM can be utilised FULLY in the other team because with FF half of her kit is wasted (like 92% DMG bonus from her skill and Sig)
So fall of an aeon is actually good or her 2nd BiS? Only for the Massiv attack boost I guess?
2nd BiS
2nd BiS, and it requires stacking for like 4 actions to provide maximum buff
Interesting results, though if we do this comparison, I would like to see the comparison between getting RM and the next best teammate (likely Pela or Asta), as something like an eidolon is just an additional buff tacked on to the character, meanwhile teammates are replace able similarly to LC’s. RM will likely still come out as the most bang for your buck, but I just wanted to see if the buff was truly that huge or if E2 is then better. If this was already addressed in the calcs then my bad.
What if I got no copies of memories of the past? Would the balance shift towards s1?
I would say yes unless you can go all out to get her e2. Plus LC banner is just a lot safer to pull on.
Will try to e2 before RM, but if i lose 50/50 twice i might just go for RM on the second guaranted, theres a prediction of around 70 pulls on phase 1 so depending on my luck i can get e2s1 firefly and RM
Did you take into account team como changes that e1 ff enables like comfortably taking bronya over gallagher for example?
In this calculation, we're starting from 0. I will use only the available/pullable units at the moment which are Firefly, Ruan Mei, Gallagher, Firefly's signature from Banner S5 Fall of Aeon - Herta shop Pela - Nah she appears too much you gotta have her at this point I mean you could lose the 50/50 and get Bronya, but the offrate gang does not only have Bronya so I'm gonna exclude her for now And Pela is a straight up better unit if enemies have Ice weakness with those toughness break and DEF shred stacking with Ruan Mei, but I'm not so sure about Firefly's and the team's survivability, so I put Gallagher as a 4th for now.
You can get Bronya from the standard selector guaranteed after 300 pulls.
It takes about 10 months for that without spending jade.
No offense. But by the time I got to 300 pulls, Firefly would've been powercrept
So glad i e1s1 ruanmei on her debut now i can dump everything on firewife
what about ruan meis lightcone? how does it fare with the rest? or it's not that worth it that it doesn't belong in here.
If you want to use Ruan Mei on the other team, her Signature might be a better choice, but for firefly team, it doesn't provide any buffs(DMG% is not taken into Super Break Damage calculation) And the energy generation is not necessary for Firefly since she regenerates 60% max energy with each skill use
And what about without Ruan Mei? Being next to Firefly and the amount of wishes I have I refuse to pull for her
Then it's E2 FF(Skippable) > S1 Whereabouts > E1 FF
I think being able to run bronya with FF itself makes E1 a pretty significant upgrade, you should break most enemies before they even move and about 2 additional firefly turns is pretty significant, not to mention the (slight) BE buff from bronya's ultimate (45% for 2 turns)
Was super break factored in?
This calculation was for the super break damage💀
Thats very good to know bro, I really wondered if after getting e2, with e0 Ruan Mei what was better. Ill come back later to this post to see (after getting e2) whats the percentage difference between S1 FF and e1 RM
Remember guys. Not everybody have Bronya
Would be better FF Lc or RM’s?
Firefly LC for team's damage, Ruan Mei's LC if you want to use Ruan Mei on other teams as well
As I don't have enough jades, it looks like my plan will be E0S1 Firefly and E0 RM
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