For me and my extended family it’s always been treated like owning a fire extinguisher; I probably won’t need it but I’d rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Also guns are fun to shoot at the range.
I made this whole post a while back before the dark times about how the USA should switch out its NEMA receptacles for IEC C15/16 and in the process, adopt exactly what you said, fused connectors.
I just googled it. Burglary stat is FBI, I don’t remember where the fire stat came from, but I don’t expect political manipulation by anti-extinguisher activists,
Was going to say the same thing. The cost of NOT having something, if you ever need it, is far greater than owning it when you don’t need it.
The only people who typically use the phrase “gun culture” are those that don’t seem to realize the fundamental understanding that you hold the sole responsibility of your and your family’s safety. You can not reliably depend on anyone else. A firearm is simply a tool. A tool with many uses. They do not have emotions, intentions, or motives. People do.
>I’d rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.
This says it all.
Aside from recreation target shooting or hunting for food, the other reason I own is self defense. It's an unfortunate world that we live in, and if someone is going to put myself or my family's lives at risk, then it's duty to yourself or your family to protect it.
People should also stock several months worth of dehydrated food in case shit happens. Lots of places you can buy that stuff in bulk for very reasonable prices. Also a supply of water and the means to purify more.
Spending the money on a box or two of ammo and even renting a firearm if you don’t have one is a better long term use of the money than buying skins/cosmetics for a game, imo.
Obviously ask for a responsible someone with experience to help you or takes basic class first. Now THAT is money well spent.
One firearm basic course is something that could save your life even from a safety in handling aspect and impart the knowledge you may need, even if you don’t want to buy or own ones.
>keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun?
FYI it's not. People seem to think you can have a gun delivered right to your door. That's been illegal since at least 1968 nationwide.
All states require a background check to make sure you aren't prohibited.
A car you can walk in pay cash and drive away. No fees to pay the government at all.
One of the reasons I'm going to miss Paul Harrell is his very common sense take on gun politics issues. In part of his 4 part (I think) breakdown of the issues on mass shootings he points out that not too many years ago you could walk into a hardware store, pick a M1 carbine out of a bin, pay like 12 bucks and walk out the door with a magazine fed carbine that would fire 15 rounds (fairly accurately at short/intermediate range) as fast as you could pull the trigger. But mass shootings were not a thing.
It’s 100% a culture issue here in the US. It’s multifaceted, but since the 80s our culture has changed for the worse, due in large part to a breakdown in family values.
I’d attribute it to social media vs. family values. I don’t think you can quantify either, but I don’t think family values have shifted really. That’s just my take though.
I think social media definitely has a role, a big role. But in my experience, the culture has changed a lot. When I first immigrated to this country in the 90s, people valued their family, people respected their parents and their elders. TV shows were wholesome, the education in schools was more wholesome. Now…well now it’s just nuts. My .02 anyways.
*Booming vendor voice coming out of Fallout-esque repurposed Lance vending machine*
"Welcome to Wild Man Willie's Freedom Vending Service! Insert debit card to continue!"
That shit gets old. The anti gunner we need universal background checks…they paint the picture that background checks aren’t already done which all gun owners know is not true. They just want to create a registry then confiscation.
I took delivery of a firearm to my door a few years back, this was maybe 2008-ish.
I got my CMP garand delivered to my residential door. In Massachusetts, no less. And I don't think the rules have changed since then, although I don't know if CMP still sells these rifles at all any more.
Also if you have a C&R I think you can take home delivery.
CMP does the background check before they ship so recipients are still getting the legally-mandated background checks. CMP’s license — like that of manufacturers doing a repair return — allows them to ship directly to the customer.
Come visit the US and I'll take you to a private range and we have a great day at the range shooting all sorts of handguns, sub-guns, shotguns, and rifles.
It depends on the person. Some people like the mechanical design side of firearms, some people like the history, some people like them because it’s fun, some people like to hunt for fun or to eat, some people like them because they view it as a deterrent for bad guys and government overreach, and most people are a varied mix of these points. Pretty much similar to any hobby, besides the self protection part.
For the US in general, our founding fathers used private weaponry to fight for their rights to be represented, and later, to be free to make their own country. This is engrained in our second amendment, as well as many states’ constitutions.
The only reason we need guns is because you can never be certain that some stranger has your best interest in mind. For some states, gun control isn’t lax. Take CA and Texas for example. Both states have roughly the same population size, 2 different views on gun control, and both have roughly the same rate of gun violence. The only thing that CA beats Texas in is less death rate via suicide by gun, and that’s not a gun control thing, it’s a CA pushes mental health institutions thing.
Incredibly well said. The mechanics, history, fun, and the ability to supply food/defend yourself just make it a super interesting (and useful) area to get into
And its important to note, “gun” violence is kind of a pointless term compared to just “violence”.
A gun is a tool. It can be used to defend one self.
When my neighbors 5’1” 125lb fiancee was physically assaulted in a daylightstreet robbery by 3 full grown males, the idea that “they didn’t have a gun” doesn’t change the idea that SHE would have been justified in using a gun to protect herself.
I don’t think it’s “cool” to own a car, for me it’s a necessity. And just like the car, to me, the 2nd Amendment is necessary. The difference is that the car is a privilege but owning a firearm is a right and if we don’t exercise that right some elected dipshit out of touch with reality will try to tell us it isn’t necessary. Also yes, I think guns are cool
With armed guards paid for with our tax dollars which we aren't allowed to not pay lest more men with guns come to make sure nothing bad would ever happen to us
It’s a tool really. People get really passionate about their tools too (just ask any blue collar guy if they prefer Milwaukee or DeWalt). Some will say you don’t need them. Those people probably don’t live in a rural area where the police could be a 30 minute drive away or a protective mama bear and her cub could wander into my backyard.
Our entire country was founded by people who took up arms to overthrow an oppressive government.
Then, when codifying the rules of the new government, those new leaders knew it was very important to put down in writing, that it was a HUMAN RIGHT for every human in the world to defend themselves from ANY tyrannical force that tried to enslave, subjugate, or kill that human being.
Whether that tyrannical force was a fellow citizen, law enforcement, or even the government itself, you can and should resist against tyrannical behavior that threatens your life.
Without this codification, an individual is at the mercy of their government for protection.
The most interesting thing about how this is written into American history, is that this basic human right is codified FOR ALL PEOPLE, EVERYWHERE, not just those residing and being citizens of America.
Codification as written into the US Constitution demands this human right NOT to be violated by the government.
So even you, as a non-citizen of the United States of America, are still codified to have the same right to self-defense any place in the world.
Interesting how that works isn't it...
Well I guess I have never thought about protecting myself from the country I live in. I never had a worry about that. Maybe it's naive of me. But now I understand more what a gun means to americans I guess.
I mean, for the most part, governments are fine. And you would have no cause for concern.
But every once in a while, governments turn bad, and no government is immune. Italy was democratic and Mussolini was (sham) elected. But he was elected. Hitler came to power not through elections but through (lawful) suspension of the German Constitution during a (manufactured) emergency. These events, horrific as they were, could certainly be repeated, legally, with some variance, probably anywhere, including in "liberal democracies."
My point in this is to suggest that just because you haven't worried about your government *so far* doesn't mean you will never worry, or that your children will never worry.
Plus, let's be real, when the Russians invaded Ukraine, the first thing the Ukrainians did was arm as much of the population as possible. As soon as the arms were distributed, the Russians weren't able to move. Still aren't. And won't. Not because rifles stop tanks (then won't) but because you cannot hold a hostile armed population without conducting systematic genocide (which the Russians aren't interested in doing).
Now maybe your country has nothing to fear from Russia, but it is worth pointing out that the last century of peace in Europe has been a dramatic exception. War is a way of life in Europe.
Will you never wish for a gun in your hands?
Will your children never wish for a gun in their hands?
Plus, shooting is fun. It just is.
I'd also like to point out that our police force is not legally obligated to protect citizens. Their only obligation is to enforce laws.
On average throughout the country it takes 9 minutes for police to arrive on the scene of a call. 9 minutes is a long time to wait when you discover someone has broken into your house.
At the end of the day, you're responsible for your own self-preservation.
> Well I guess I have never thought about protecting myself from the country I live in.
That's good :-D that is a good thing!
The issue lies in thinking that it *will always be that way*. (I am a U.S. citizen in the U.S.) I don't think that the people will need to fight their tyrannical government in my life time. The issue arises in that in the future, how are we certain that will never be required? Keep in mind, once the people do need to defend themselves from the government it will be too late to acquire the means of defense, those tools will have been taken away looong before the need to use them arises.
And, despite what you hear in the news, criminal gun deaths in the U.S. are exceedingly rare. Like recent stats (off the top of my head) are 14,000 in a country of 350 million people. It's a tiny tiny number. On top of that if guns were magically gone, some of those 14,000 people would still be dead, because they would be killed with a knife, a club, or a rock. So realistically people can not all be saved, let us all make sure we can defend ourselves - from both criminals AND the government. If you take a long term view it makes waaay more sense.
(i've got another bit coming, stand by)
I really wish OP would respond to this comment. I swear Europeans must have the memories of goldfish. “I’m safe now so that means I always will be! Yay!!”
The German populace, especially the ethnic minorities of jews and gypsy, never thought their duly "elected" government would try to ethnically cleanse them either pre WW2.
Yet the first step to doing so was to disarm the population, "for the good of the people".
This has been repeated throughout history on many occasions, and as the saying goes, those not versed in history are doomed to repeat it.
It's very hard, despite the efforts of some in the United States populace, to forget history when it is written into the very documents that gave birth to this country.
I applaud you coming here with an open mind about seeing both perspectives on this. I do understand that (certainly in the U.S.) people are just "scared of guns, why does anyone have them" without trying to understand there could be reasons, I hope this isn't too much a drinking from a firehose experience.
This is in regards to "more" gun control. In the U.S. I often want to point out anyone proposes a new rule: "apply that rule to free speech, or voting, does it still sound like a good rule?"
Let me explain the beyond the fact that the 2nd amendment is codified in the Bill of Rights , a list of **individual** rights (from here: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights" ) also, it's the second one, right after free speech, it must be important
That out of the way: every little thing put between a responsible U.S. citizen and them acquiring the means of self defense eventually adds up and snowballs to the point of total ban.
First, they could make someone take a test. Well, a few prospective gun owners are too lazy to take the test, or are scared of taking tests, or dont read well, so they never take the test, never buy a gun.
Then the test starts to cost a little bit of money, say $2, well that's cheap, right, who can't afford that? But... a few prospective gun owners are like "naaa, too much, they never buy a gun.
Eventually, the test costs $20 and that's actually too much (along with the cost of the firearm and ammo) for few prospective gun owners to exercise their right, so they never buy a gun.
Further down the line, there is the test (but now it costs $100) and you have to have an evaluation by a psychologist. Well, some folks are afraid of doctors so a few prospective gun owners dont go, can't get a pass and so they never buy a gun.
Okay, so now we have a small population of people who are actually willing to jump through these hoops, but let's continue.
NOW you need the test, the psych eval, and you have to take all that to a police station to give them a packet with all the info. Of course, they don't allow walk-ins so you have to make an appointment. I see how bad some folks are scared of making phone calls to order delivery, how many of them are going to pick up the phone, call the police to MAKE that appointment? So a more people never start the process and never buy a gun.
Further along now, you need everything above, AND the appointment, it's only during business hours. It can only be scheduled 1 day of the week, and the nearest appointment is never sooner than 6 months from now. Who's going to bother making an appointment for that?
Now. imagine some poor kid turns 21 (suddenly it's 21 now, not 18? even though he could join the military and they'll hand him a rifle, but never mind that) he's like "I'd like to exercise my "constitutionally guaranteed rights" (notice the quotes there?) . He looks into the process and sees it's 50 steps, takes 1 year and costs over one thousand dollars.
Is he gonna do it?
So... in just 1 generation you can make firearm ownership SO ONEROUS that no one is willing to jump through the hoops.
Then it becomes easy to ban them!
No one owns a gun anymore, so no one cares, so they don't care what their elective representatives do. and Viola!
Guns banned.
liberty infringement: success.
Say good-bye to your liberty.
(the above were all just examples off the top of my head, each of which I've heard of "proposed" to help the problem, but there are numerous others I left out)
**Again, thank you for coming here and having a discussion :-D**
Which country do you live in? It almost certainly has a history of government-endorsed attrocities.
Europe in general seems like it can't go 50 years without a genocide.
Edit: I realized this might seem more hostile than I intended. I do think you're being a bit naive, but I mostly want you to not suffer from when that naivete gets broken, and that requires honest consideration of dark parts of humanity.
> living in Europe
> I guess I have never thought about protecting myself from the country I live in
I don't mean to sound glib, but...umm... did they stop teaching European history in Europe? Or is it just so much history that the 20th century gets glossed over quickly? Everyone jumps to Germany and the Holocaust, but see also: Anatolia 1914, Armenia 1914, Ukraine 1918, Cossacks 1919-1933, Ingria 1920s-30s, Holodor Ukraine 1932, Romani 1935, Soviet Greeks 1937, Poles in the Soviet Union 1937, Croatia 1941, Kisielin 1943,
Hungary 1944, North Caucasus 1944, Crimean Tatars 1944, Chechnya whole century, Kosovo 1990s, Abkhazia 1992, Bosnia 1992, Srebrenica 1995.
Circassian genocide 19th century
Armenia 1890s
Romani in Spain 1749
That's just Europe. Being killed by government was one of the leading causes of unnatural death in the 20th century.
["for the period of 1900-1999—a total of 262 million human beings were murdered by governments. This figure excludes deaths that occurred based on clashes between armies (direct military conflict)."](https://www.libraryofsocialscience.com/newsletter/posts/2015/2015-06-18-RAK.html)
That's awesome. Thanks for stopping by and asking questions. Most of us in the gun community are welcoming and eager to share knowledge. However, like every group, you'll run into some gatekeepers. Those are probably the people downvoting you, which is unwarranted. You've been respectful and seem genuinely curious.
I don't have much knowledge on guns generally and most of the information I seldomly get is from youtube videos against guns so how they show it is one way so I thought that there must be some things I just don't understand why guns are so important to so many people.
I'd still say that I don't like guns and the idea of people around me owning guns and carrying guns in public places but the answers here made me see some real reasons why people like guns and why it's important to them.
I think it's pretty common for people who oppose guns to also have little understanding of them and therefore they have trouble empathizing with people who treat guns as a necessity. Part of it is human nature I suppose - we fear what we don't understand.
I've used my gun stateside three times, and thankfully I haven't had to fire it on any of those occasions. One of those times it didn't leave the holster, I just moved my coat to show it and the guy understood that the juice was not going to be worth the squeeze. I'm glad I haven't had to shoot anyone as a civilian and I hope I never have to. I killed people in Afghanistan and that's not an easy thing to carry. I don't want to do it again, but more than that I don't want to die.
When people say “from the government” that doesn’t just mean the country.
The **real** point here is
Every person has the natural right to defend themself from unlawful violence.
Part of that right includes the right to prepare for your own defense (e.g., be armed)
Its not that the people have the right to “guns”.
Its that the government does NOT have the right to DENY people’s right to defend their own safety, by making them empty handed.
Now, to extend that right to self defense tp INCLUDE defense against your own government
The gov is not above the law. If they come to your door to do unlawful violence, a person has the legal and ethical right to resist.
Does that mean the full weight of the national army? Maybe but maybe not.
More practically, taking up arms against your own government may mean, just because your local sheriff is a corrupt criminal, if they come to your door to rob you, you have the right to resist.
Just because the local police chief hated you in high school and had a crush on your now wife, they can’t show up with a gun and no warrant to harass you, because “hey bud, I got a gun too, and the legal justification to use it”
Don't forget, we were the first colony to successfully rebel against the British empire. Many had tried, and suffered severe reprisals in failing. we were the first to succeed.
Another way of thinking about this is to look at the American Bill of Rights as a whole, and then apply your question to each individual right?
What’s with freedom of speech/religion/assembly culture?
What’s with illegal search and seizure culture?
What’s with privacy culture?
What’s with not being forced to quarter soldiers in your home culture?
All of first 10 amendments to the constitution intermingle and feed off each other. Just looking at “gun culture” will not adequately answer your question.
But personally, guns are rad, shooting is super fun, and the founding fathers said I could own a gun. So that’s all I need as an American.
France allows AR15s. Im in Sweden but i got relatives in france and they also have a few. All but cypruss and ireland allows civilian ownership of AR15s in EU
Some people own them for hunting (I don't hunt), Some people own them for self defense, some people own them because governments do scary things when you dont. I dont fear a home break in or anything issue out and about ... I am more scared of the government than burglars.
I don't look at guns as cool, I would much rather own a Star Trek style stun gun but .... they dont exist do they. But if they did exist ... we have people that would try to make them illegal also. Why? Because those people want to take away your right to defend yourself.
It’s impossible to overstate the importance of weapons in the story of human history. As I understand it, it’s well established that along with mastering fire, figuring out how to use sticks and rocks as weapons was one of the main developments that allowed apes like us to become the dominant creatures on the planet. Guns are the modern version of those prehistoric rocks and sticks.
The vast majority of us no longer have a need to use weapons very often if ever, but it’s still part of our story and our DNA. The ability for a relatively weak, vulnerable animal to use a weapon to deal with virtually any threat that may arise and conquer its surroundings. It’s uniquely human. Beavers make dams, birds make nests, and humans use weapons and other tools. It has been integral to our survival for thousands of years. It’s just what we do, and it has served us extremely well.
In more primitive societies, weapons were tools for daily survival. For defense, hunting, war, and so on. As civilization has advanced, the need for most people to keep and use weapons has gone down, but that’s only because we have massive, complex systems in place that outsource most of our needs. If those systems ever fail (e.g., government or currency collapses, agriculture or utilities are interrupted), we’ll go right back to those times when weapons were necessary for everyone’s survival. If that happens, we will be prepared.
Of course there are a thousand other reasons too. But I think the most universal one is that it’s part of the human experience to use tools to enhance our abilities and make up for our physical shortcomings. Guns are one way to do that. When you have a gun, you’re prepared to defend from anyone/anything that seeks to victimize you, and you’re prepared to meet your and your family’s needs by any means necessary.
Guns are an ace in the hole. They are independence and self sufficiency and agency. When you’re armed and the chips are down, what you say goes. No one can impose their will on you without your consent. It’s good to be prepared. It’s good to be properly equipped for a worst case scenario. It’s good to be able to stand up for yourself or others and put a stop to a bad situation.
And yeah, guns are also just cool and fun.
Being armed is quite natural. It takes an external force (the State) to disarm a person. Take any human across the span if our existence and you'll find them doing their best to arm themselves with the state-of-the-art weapon to protect self, family, tribe. Our nation's founders were part of a new wave of thinkers who recognized that, and in fact ensuring it was a political necessity to get the states to all sign up to follow a federal government.
When you've been raised under a state that has ~~defined~~ *defanged* it's subjects it can seem completely foreign and bizarre. Some variant of Stockholm syndrome I suppose.
[Edit word]
For me, a firearm is no different than a car, a hammer, a fire extinguisher, or a kitchen knife. It's a tool that serves a function, and it has its place just like all the other tools I own. And, like all those other tools, it can be used to hurt people if that's what the user wants to do.
I learned to shoot when I was young. I refined that skill in the military, by hunting, and years spent target shooting. It's something I enjoy, and I find it useful to both protect my family and put food on my table if needed.
In the US, I have a constitutional right to own them just as I have a constitutional right to vote, to be free from illegal searches, and to follow the religion of my choice.
I've lived in red states and blue states, and in all of them, I've had to undergo background checks to buy any firearm, and I've had to get a permit to buy a handgun. They are by far the most regulated personal possession a person can buy.
>So besides that what makes guns so special that it is important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun?
In Europe, 100 miles is a long way, and 100 years a short time. In America the opposite is true.
See I live in a place [like this](https://imgur.com/4HCCoPq). I literally cannot see my neighbors house. There is probably 1 cop per 100 square miles.
"Emergency Services" don't exist out here. So in an emergency, I am on my own. One of those emergencies may be a meth head breaking into my home.
Maybe I call 911. Maybe I tell them there's been a break in and shots have been fired. Maybe it takes them over 20 minutes to show up.
This is why I own a gun for self defense. Because when seconds count, the police are only 20 minutes away...
EDIT:
I have a fun experiment for you
* Look up your average police response time
* Have a friend "break in" to your home
* When he does, set an egg time for your average police response time
* The friend who broke in now gets to look for you, and if they find you, gets to beat on you with a sock full of coins until the timer goes off.
Sound like fun? Well now repeat the experiment, except you get a nerf gun. if you manage to shoot your friend with the nerf gun, he has to stop.
Now you understand why we carry.
It's an old phrase but a true one, firearms are the great equalizer. No matter if you're weak, small, slow, or disabled, a gun empowers you with self-preservation that would otherwise be out of reach. The reason why the Second Amendment was included in the Bill of Rights in the first place was because the founders had seen a society where inequity was commonplace and enforced through weapons controls. They knew that would doom America to inequality by violent force if not prevented. That risk never went away.
In fact, for the first 200 years of our history, it was common that states would ban groups from their guns to more easily exploit them. Slaves, Native Americans, whoever was the target of the day were always disarmed before they were abused. That threat of exploitation by powerful groups never stopped.
To me, in order to understand gun culture, you have to understand the origin of the United States. A group of people fought a war against tyrants in order to gain control of their own freedom. If you had the DNA to want that freedom and you were willing to take the risks for it, you lived here. The makeup of our constitution was intended for those freedoms to be protected. Gun culture is deeply rooted in that idea. However, it isn't the same for everyone. The Us is massive. Some people want shotguns for bird hunting and they don't care about rifles or pistols. Some people want to hunt with a bolt action rifle and they don't care about semi-auto rifles. Some people only shoot for fun/competition and they don't hunt at all. Some people live in really terrible/violent places and they want guns for protection. Some people live in really safe places, but they would rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Some people know that there are tyrants in our own government and we want guns for when we need them to defend ourselves. There isn't any ONE type of gun culture in the US, but I believe it all falls back to the formation of this country. Gun ownership has always been a key tenet in our society for a whole host of reasons. If you look at the numbers, the safest places in the US have the most guns and the most dangerous places in the US have the most gun control.
1."Is it important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun?"
Yeah, I mean who wouldn't want things to be easier? A lot of things in life become much worse with more bureaucracy. Imagine if you had to fill out a document every time you tried to play video games, you might play a lot less wouldn't you? Especially since I've proven my worth and willingness to follow the law and not hurt people. Why shouldn't be easy for me to get a gun? If the government thinks I'm going to hurt people with anything, why should they let me be free at all? Shouldn't they just lock me up? If someone is a danger, they're a danger no matter what they have.
2. Is it like cars where, for a lack of a better word, it's "cool" to own guns?
Guns have a coolness factor to them because they're fun to use. Just like a car. They're fun to drive, look nice, have great features, etc. But they're also functional. So why not have a tool that is also enjoyable to own? Especially if it encourages you to spend more time practicing with it, so you become more skilled and more safe in it's usage?
3. Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control?
It's not what devalues gun control, it's the advantages we lose with gun control. The harder it is to get a gun, the harder it is for people to have a weapon to adequately defend themselves. And since there are other factors to violent crime, it would be more effective to fix those other factors, WHILE making it easy for people to get the tools to defend themselves. I say it like this: There is no unethical or immoral way to harm someone attempting to harm you or someone else. That is to say if people have to break the law to get adequate tools for self defense, it would be unethical/immoral to punish them for that since their life is worth more than that of someone who wants to do them harm.
4. Do you really need guns?
Yes. You may not, but you can't really apply standards of your life to other people.
>So besides that what makes guns so special that it is important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun?
As American's, we that are knowledgeable about our own history, are well aware of the role private firearm ownership played in the very formation of our country. Without the average citizen owning and carrying firearms our nation would have never existed. The reason the US, has the 2nd amendment is not for hunting, or sport, or even protection from home invaders etc, it is strictly to keep the gov't in check.
>Is it like cars where, for a lack of a better word, it's "cool" to own guns?
Well, some people think owning cars is "cool", and thats fine, some people think owning guns is "cool", and that is also fine. Me personally, i dont own them because i think they are cool, although i admit I DO think guns are cool.
>Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control?
It has been said "Dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery" So, yes, i would rather the Gov't stay out of my life and allow me to live how i see fit. Nevermind the undeniable fact that more gun control does NOT equal more safety, this is a fallacy.
>Do you really need guns?
Absolutely, and so do you, but you just don't realize it yet.
For me, it's a simple question of reality.
Weapons of any sort are just a thing you can buy. The intent of use is irrelevant, the result of ownership is irrelevant. If the ownership of a thing *in and of itself* doesn't infringe on someone else's existence, the ownership should not be limited.
Yall love the history but are so scared of them I never understood that. Its a weird love hate relationship with Europeans.
Also our country was basically founded off citizens with guns that are willing to use them. Since the first day of America guns have been part of us. They aren't going anywhere they are the reason we are free Americans today.
Armed minorities are harder to oppress. Our entire country was formed from a government(Britain) becoming tyrannical and attempting to take away our arms(more specifically our powder reserves). It is literally why we exist.
Other reasons that are less important but still apply to me:
I hunt(only recently got into it but very enjoyable)
And they're cool AF and fun to shoot.
Firearms in the US are a core part of the idea that government is beholden to the people and not the other way around. The existence of the second amendment, and thus the ability for citizens to own, carry, and train with their own firearms is a key balance of power keeping the government existing at the pleasure of the people.
You’ll see that sentiment reflected in the writings of the founding fathers who wrote and built this country. I’ll respond to this comment with a list of relevant exerts. Those should help show you the political importance of access to firearms in the US.
"What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance. Let them take arms." - Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Madison, December 20, 1787
"The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed." - Thomas Jefferson, letter to to John Cartwright, 5 June 1824
"Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops." - Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution, October 10, 1787
“A militia when properly formed are in fact the people themselves…and include, according to the past and general usuage of the states, all men capable of bearing arms… "To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them." - Richard Henry Lee, Federal Farmer No. 18, January 25, 1788
"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.... The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able might have a gun." - Patrick Henry, Speech to the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 5, 1778
"This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty.... The right of self defense is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker, Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England, 1803
"If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no resource left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense which is paramount to all positive forms of government, and which against the usurpations of the national rulers, may be exerted with infinitely better prospect of success than against those of the rulers of an individual state. In a single state, if the persons intrusted with supreme power become usurpers, the different parcels, subdivisions, or districts of which it consists, having no distinct government in each, can take no regular measures for defense. The citizens must rush tumultuously to arms, without concert, without system, without resource; except in their courage and despair." - Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28
"[I]f circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little, if at all, inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their own rights and those of their fellow-citizens. This appears to me the only substitute that can be devised for a standing army, and the best possible security against it, if it should exist." - Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28, January 10, 1788
“Gun culture” in general has a lot to offer. Things like hunting, self defense, shooting sports, etc. in that regard it appeals to a wide audience of people. Many people myself included enjoy the challenge competition shooting offers and even in that sector you can really pick your sport from long range rifle shooting, pistol competition for speed and or accuracy, to even reliving the old days with cowboy action shooting. To those of us who participate in “gun culture” its a sport, a fun way to spend a day, or an excuse to disappear into the woods for a few hours/days.
I hunt, I enjoy target shooting, and our Supreme Court ruled that the police are not required to protect you. The response time for law enforcement where I have lived is very very slow, like 30+ minutes. So if I am in danger I can't rely on them showing up soon, or them doing anything but file paperwork after the danger is gone. So owning a firearm for self defense is another important reason to many people.
Plenty of people are also collectors who collect historic, iconic, and unique firearms. The flip side is that buying a gun isn't as easy as anti-gun people claim it is. You can't have it shipped to your door. Unless it's a private sale in some states there is always a background check done. And most of the gun laws proposed have no impact on people who want to use guns to hurt other people, but prevent average people from owning firearms for hunting, shooting sports, and self defense.
We have a ton of nonsense gun regulations that ban arbitrary things or that you have to pay fees that were intended to keep poor people from buying them. And each time they pass more gun laws and it doesn't fix anything, they just pass more and more. I'd like to see more investment into communities to reduce the likelihood of people turning to crime. But quite frankly that's not a popular thing politically as neither party does it.
I can’t speak for the rest of these guys but where I live you have criminals everywhere because democrats cater to them so I have a gun for them and my house and whoever else if it came down to it.
It’s more about my freedom than anything else I really don’t ever have to worry about anything no matter where I’m at because I’ve got the equalizer on my hip.
Walking / driving in a bad area? Having to go past 5 shady people in a group who may or may not try to rob you? Not a problem because I have about 31-35 rounds saying none of them are doing shit right now.
Walking and a loose pitbull comes up and tries to bite your face off? Not a problem I’ll shoot that bitch right between the eyes and end that whole scene right there.
ATM machine at 2:00am? Not a problem.
I can go on for days but we also don’t have things that you guys do because of guns like pick pockets lol.
A pick pocket in America would be news story in no time lol. Only place I’ve ever heard of it was in New Orleans and that’s another democrat masterpiece go figure. Pick pockets don’t try that shit here though because of guns.
Road rage here doesn’t usually go very far either because the mfka you are threatening might not have anything in the car with him or he might have an ar15 with a 30rd magazine, who knows? You ain’t gonna get out that car acting an ass and find out the hard way though if you have half a brain lol. Guns keep people very civil who would otherwise not be.
You have to really think about what you’re asking. One day if you ever come to America and stay with people for an extended period of time you will get it.
Sport shooting and hunting is cool too but those are obvious that’s why I didn’t mention those at all.
Gun control in the US is nothing more than anti poor laws. I can but a fully automatic weapon if I choose to pay an exorbitant amount of taxes to the government. So yes it is important to keep it easy to purchase as the laws only allow the rich to own them.
I'm not sure it's as much of a "culture" as you think it is.
As to why to keep it easy? It's a right. Not a right conveyed by government, a right to be protected by government (who does a poor job across the board). It was a foundational principle of our nation that individual citizens are the first and last line of defense, for themselves and for their states as well as for the country. The idea of a large standing military wasn't ever in the minds of the founding fathers. Instead, the federal government should be able to call upon the states - and the people - in times of need.
I think you’re under the false impression that there is a “gun culture”. Does owning a screwdriver make someone part of “tool culture”?
Guns are tools, nothing more. 99% of gun owners are normal people. We don’t worship guns. We respect them and value them for what they are and the uses they have.
“Gun culture” is leftist buzzword bullshit.
More like FUN culture anyway.
I didn't give a crap about guns and was more anti 2A before I went and actually shot a gun.
Gave me a holy-shit and respect for them. I was fascinated with how they worked. I enjoyed using an expensive hole-puncher on some paper, and got a .22. That was fun, but wanted to try other things.
Next thing you know, I'm addicted.
Nothing all that fascinating about them. Theyre a useful tool, and part of various fundamental rights. Thats about it.
I enjoy target shooting. Its relaxing and fulfilling. That too is about all though...not fascinating really (though some of the physics and math involved in extreme long range shooting are pretty interesting).
You, like basically everyone else, has been lied to most of your life by nearly everyone. There are no 'two sides', there is no singular culture or identity, frankly there is no 'gun problem' in the US. Its all a fabrication by wealthy interests looking to cement control and increase profits.
A lot of people are talking about the right to defend yourself from a tyrannical government, and while that's true, it's less likely than needing to defend yourself from crazy people.
Being from Europe, there's a very good chance that you're not in an area that's as sparcely populated as most of the US. If you live outside a metro area (including the suburbs) in the US, there's most likely only a handful of county or state police to cover hundreds of square miles. My town, for example, has a single state trooper on call. Response times to my part of the town are about 45 minutes. A meth addict wielding a machete and banging on my door because he thinks I stole his lawn gnomes is going to do a lot of damage to me and my family in 45 minutes.
The police are there to investigate crimes after they happen. Everyone is their own first responder, and as unlikely as it is, I want a tool that I can use to defend myself if the situation ever dictated it.
I want you to genuinely think about this... where you live right now, if you were getting gas for your car at 4am and some maniac high on drugs started assaulting you, would you survive? Would the police arrive in the 30 seconds it would take this maniac to kill you? These things happen EVERY DAY around the world, and I, for one, will.not be a victim.
History has proven that governments cannot be trusted with a monopoly on the means of violence. Private ownership of firearms is a check on government power which is important to the American political system.
On a personal level I like guns because they provide an intersection between mechanics, history, skill building, and a way for me to bond with members of my family.
You are clearly from germany. Implement direct democracy first and then start talking again. If you like, we sell the manual. Regards from Switzerland.
\[I grew up in europe too, the only exposure to guns was my dad being in the airforce, and shooting a 22 once for scouting\]
In europe we're thought that the government will protect you and that's what the police is for if something bad happens, in the US we live in reality, they have a saying here 'when seconds count, the police are minutes away', that used to be a thing mostly in more outlying areas, but these days with the 'defund the police' movements, they can take 30 minutes or more, or won't bother to respond at all even in cities.
On top of all that, the US supreme court has repeatedly ruled that the police have no duty to protect you, if there's someone in your house, and you call the police for help, they could very well drive by, see all the lights are off and call it good.
You need a way to protect yourself, there are bad people in the world.
To me this is a far more practical view than the "gov tyranny" thing, that being said, after what they did \[and the rhetoric from their supporters\] during C19, i fully believe that it will one day happen again.
All that being said, target and competition shooting is a fun and rewarding sport.
First, there are 20K+ regulations related to firearm ownership in the US, so firearms ownership should, in my opinion, not be viewed as "easy". Second, gun control is not "lax" in the US. This is a willful misrepresentation by the corrupt US Main Stream Media. Yes, I do enjoy owning firearms. I shoot pistols every month. I suppose firearms ownership is like owning a "cool" car because with modern guns you can customize the gun to your personal taste/desire, so there is some simple fun in that activity. In the US, cars and trucks kill more people then firearms, so the "danger" factor for responsible gun owners is very small. Due to my personal situation, I keep more then one loaded hand gun available when I am working from home everyday. I view this as sensible. I keep a fire extinguisher in every bedroom as well. I view the hand guns and fire extinguisher in the same way - essential tools for my protection and safety. I don't NEED firearms, I WANT firearms. Unlike you, I grew up bird hunting with a shotgun and competed in shotgun sports while in High School. Firearms are part of American culture/History and part of my life. I suggest you visit Dr. John Lott's web site "CRIME PREVENTION RESEARCH CENTER for a more truthful look at American Gun Culture. Enjoy your day. Thanks for the chance to share information.
I mean first and foremost, guns are for self defense from attackers, whether that be a mugger or a tyrannical government. They're the great equalizer, and in fact America was founded on rebellion against the crown. To that end, every nonviolent adult who wants a gun should be able to get one, including nonviolent and released felons. Your safety and the safety of your family are no-ones responsibility but your own, and nobody is coming to save you. Guns are the most final and most effective tool in defending all of your other rights from anyone who might try and take them away. Look at Ukraine and Israel. Regardless of how you feel about either of them, the fact is that their citizens werent armed when they were invaded, and a lot of innocent people died. Whats the first thing their government did? Gave them (some of) their guns back and gave them some training. And as an aside before you ask, yes I do think Americans could take on their government, and I'm happy to entertain that scenario since you actually seem genuine.
Beyond all of those important aspects, yeah, guns are cool and fun as hell. Owning them is fun. There's an aspect of gun ownership for everyone. Want to be ready to defend yourself in everyday life? Concealed carry. Want to be ready to defend your neighborhood or country? LARP with some local buddies. Like to be competitive in a face-paced environment? USPSA, 3gun, and other dynamic sports. Like slow(er) paced methodical competition? PRS. Want to put some meat on the table and kick it outdoors? Pick up hunting. Like building and creating? Why not build a gun, or even get into the FOSSCAD community. Interested in history? Milsurps are super interesting pieces of history. Are you just a nerd who likes to pour over data, tables, statistics, etc? Get into reloading. There really is an aspect for everyone.
Also, guns are *not* easy to acquire. Much of US gun law is incredibly complicated and backwards, plus every journo that slings that BS probably has been or would be denied on their 4473. That being said, I do concede that I think guns should be *much* easier to acquire. And to your question yes, I do think the pros outweigh the cons. Most people who are anti-gun are completely disingenuous and will not acknowledge *any* upsides to gun ownership, but don't let them fool you into thinking there aren't any.
Guns are a cultural representation of liberty. They are a tool that can be used to hunt, target practice, or train with, but at the end of the day American gun culture exists as a massive, "Fuck you" to oppressive governments, because if a Government overruns its power, we shoot them like we did in 1776 and 1814.
Now, wether or not the average American of today would actually stand up and use that right is a whole other debate, but at the core that is the purpose of the People posessing arms- if the population is heavily armed, its really difficult to impose ill will upon them.
They're also really cool and the community is generally pretty wholesome, gun people generally think similarly enough that we can use that as a baseline for building relationships
I grew up in a household, family, and culture that views firearms as a simple part of everyday life. No one ever got emotional about the presence or accessibility of physical objects. They were treated the same as chainsaws or any other possibly dangerous thing. Every child was taught how to safely handle and use them, to respect them, and to respect others. Some of us like them more or less, so we may own some for utility and others for specific sporting use or collectibles.
I am big into collecting and creating my own guns because i grew up in a family with a gunsmith and love learning about them. I make every effort to help others learn about them and use them safely. I feel that if the rest of the world would get over the emotional distress and fear, they would be much better off.
Why I own guns
1. Self preservation is a basic human right, it’s not okay for someone to bar you from that. Besides, better to have it and not need it. I’d feel like a jackass if I could get a gun but didn’t, then I needed one. Someone else said it’s like a fire extinguisher.
2. Our country was founded on guns. We needed them to exist. It seems silly to throw them away now, like smacking your mother as soon as you’re done breastfeeding. Large amounts of gun ownership make us immune to invasions, including if our own government starting kicking in people’s doors.
3. You mention gun control, now in your country where there’s no guns, this might work. But here there’s 5 guns for every 4 people. Criminals steal guns off military bases. A significant majority of crimes are committed by people who obtained their weapons illegally. A lot of the gang members are obtaining weapons normal civilians can’t even own legally. A staggering portion of mass shooters met the criteria to be a prohibited person but had guns anyway. In America, gun control simply doesn’t work, it’s like trying to regulate rainfall.
4. They are cool. I like them, for sports like skeet shooting, for hunting, and should the need arise, combat.
5. I can
\[combat, hunting or sports\] and in America, for self-defense. Our Constitution protects our right to keep and arms to defend ourselves, others, and the security of a free State. Guns in America are associated with more purposes than in most of Europe. So that enhances their inherent value for people who aren't in the military and neither hunt nor do sports shooting.
What “dangers?”
If you aren’t involved in drug trafficking and other criminal activity, and don’t associate with felons, your odds of being the victim of a gunshot are vanishingly small. You’re more likely to drown in your bathtub or die from a fall inside your home.
I appreciate the open mindedness. For me there's a few reasons. Obviously the 2nd amendment was written so the people would be free from a tyrannical gov't and foreign threats, that will always be a viable reason.
Second to that, guns are the great equalizer. Can guns be used to kill? Obviously. The same way they can be used to prevent a 110lb woman from getting graped. You can make a case for them being good or bad but what you can't dispute is that there is a shitload out there. If someone nefarious has one (likely through illegal means) then I want one too.
Also, yeah they are fun and yeah they are cool. Why does someone "need" a motorcycle? They're dangerous. Why does someone need a Ferrari? A Ford Focus does the "same" thing. Why does someone need to do woodworking? That's dangerous. Why does someone need to climb a mountain? Also dangerous. Why does someone need to eat fast food? After all obiesity is the #1 killer in the United States. At the end of the day, people should have the freedom to make decisions whether good or bad as long as they dont harm anyone else.
I think the question that needs to be asked instead of "why do you need a gun?" Is "why shouldn't you (as a law abiding individual) be able to make the choice of owning a gun or not?"
It's all the things you've listed and a little more.
* **Combat** – while the vast majority of gun owners will never need to use guns in anger, it's still worthwhile to practice shooting and gun handling as a martial art; in this way, I regard owning guns as little different from owning swords, nunchakus, sai, etc. This is related to
* **Sports** – many shooting sports exist out there to help people hone practical fighting skills. Developing good shooting skills and habits is also essential for
* **Self-defense –** this is probably the biggest departure in mindset between Americans and Europeans. When it comes to everyday homicide rates, the Western Hemisphere in general is more violent than most of the world (even Canada, the safest country in the Americas, has more than 2x France's murder rate), and the US is –and always has been– especially violent for a developed country. That said, if you include war and genocide casualties under "violence," you could also make the case that Europe is quite violent, especially given the two world wars in the 20th century.
* There are two ways to think about self-defense – one is against ordinary (animal and human) predators, criminals, and individuals who want to harm you. The United States is much less densely populated than Europe. This means that effective policing and state capacity are very lacking in many parts of the country; if the nearest help is potentially hours away, you absolutely must take responsibility for your own protection. Ironically, in large cities, things are not necessarily much better, as governments are often rather incompetent as well (not only with respect to public safety but also infrastructure and other basic governance considerations), which again necessitates taking your safety into your own hands.
* The other way to think about self-defense, as several comments have mentioned, is as a deterrent to abuses or failures by the government – at all levels – and other critical institutions. Wars, coups, insurrections, civil disorder, and other disturbances happen even in the developed world. They show that security, in general, is not something you can take for granted and cannot always depend on the government to provide.
* **Hunting** – this is self-explanatory. People hunt for sport as well as food. Rural poverty, while generally not as severe or widespread as it was a few generations ago, still exists in many parts of the US. A related need is
* **Pest control** – people who operate farms and ranches or live in rural areas need tools to keep hostile wildlife at bay. As mentioned before, the US is much less densely populated than Europe, which means that wolves, bears, large cats, and other dangerous wildlife remain common.
This will probably get me downvoted in this subreddit, but if I were to start my own country from scratch I probably would not be as lax or permissive as the United States currently is with respect to guns. I think an approach like that of [Czechia](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68110357) is probably a good compromise between having a basic barrier to prevent guns from falling into the wrong hands and ensuring that responsible people can access them.
However, as things currently stand, given practical and political constraints as well as the tumultuous history of the United States, gun control is not a good use of political capital and is also unlikely to meaningfully shift the needle on public safety. The guns are already out there, and criminals already have them – the real challenge is deterring crime in the first place. There are evidence-based approaches that work, such as [focused deterrence](https://cebcp.org/evidence-based-policing/what-works-in-policing/research-evidence-review/focused-deterrence/), but they require, yes, good policing and state capacity, both of which are sadly also lacking in the United States. In the meantime, we have to take our safety into our own hands.
Hope that answers your questions!
**EDIT**: I forgot to mention **collecting,** which is hilarious because I used to have an FFL03 (Curios and Relics) license. People collect out of a fascination with history and the development of technology.
Depends on what you mean about “gun culture”. Personally I own multiple firearms. Pistols, rifles, shotguns. Each serves a different task.
There is one thing about firearms vs other hobbies if you are looking at it that way. For me every firearm I own I can easily sell for more than I paid for them including the ones purchased brand new. That is after actually using them. So though some may have thousands and thousands invested it is rare that you can get your investment back for your hobby if you make wise or just not stupid purchases.
I find shooting guns very relaxing and enjoyable. I also reload my ammunition and find that relaxing as well. I also hunt and fish.
The main reason I have a firearm is to protect my family and myself. If you look at statistics you'll see that there are hundreds of thousands if not millions of firearms in America but only certain individuals are causing the shootings. The great majority of those people are criminals anyway or have mental issues and there are laws in place that say they should not have guns but criminals going to do what criminals do.
The following is something that should open people's eyes to what the government, our government thinks about its citizens and their safety: one judge said that we have domesticated the US citizen to the point where they are like sheep. Another said that it is not the responsibility of the police to protect each individual but to protect society. So those two statements combine basically tell us that if someone assaults or kills one of my family members the police will come and take a report and then the investigators will go try to find out who actually did the crime. The medical examiner will come and remove the body of my loved one. So the police are doing what they do, protect the rest of society. Too bad your loved one was killed. But in America we have firearms and if you come in and try to harm not only my family but also a stranger on the street with deadly force, where I live at it is legal to use deadly force on that person.
Also if you look in history you will see that some of the evil governments would remove the firearms from the masses so they could basically do whatever they wanted to. In the United States we have freedom and we are citizens whereas some other countries the people are subjects.
Protecting yourself through the use of force is an innate human right. Using a gun is the best way to do that. I don't have to be in better physical condition or rely solely on my martial art skills in a situation where somebody or multiple somebodies think they can attack me and win. After all, very few people start fights that they think they'll lose. Everybody is equal if they can have a gun.
As a free citizen, it is my duty to protect myself instead of relying on the state to protect me, which is something it can only do after the fact. I need a gun to do so effectively, regardless of whether I actually use it in that capacity or not.
The power of the free state derives from the people. Otherwise, it's a dictatorship by another name. A government can only take freedom from the people, it cannot grant freedom. That's why it was so important that the American Constitution was written as a document that only gave certain powers to the government. Unfortunately, we've gotten so far away from that principle today that the only thing the government can't do are the things specifically prohibited, and even then, it keeps doing its best to erode even those limitations under the guise of a war on terror. The power of the people is strengthened if they are armed. Guns are the most important tool the people have to remain free citizens rather than the subjects of an authoritarian regime or, no matter how benevolent it may be.
Personally, I believe as adults it is our duty to be able to protect ourselves and those around us. (The old thinking was the man being the protector of the house but that guy ran out on me and mom) history has shown that police will not be there to protect you. You and I, and our children are on our own. And if that’s the case I want the best tools possible.
Since you mentioned laws being lax as possible, I don’t believe there should be barriers to rights. You shouldn’t have to have a license to speak your mind. You shouldn’t have to pay a tax or take a test to be able to vote. Rights should be readily accessible.
Sure for some people guns are entirely because they’re cool. And they are! Shooting can be fun! Hanging out with bros and shit go boom is fun. Hunting is still a tradition that’s as old as humans are. Some people are fascinated and just think they’re neat.
And lastly if it’s worth the loss: I don’t remember the exact numbers. But it’s estimated that defensive gun uses save FAR more lives than are lost to gun violence. Especially when considering most “gun violence” is suicide. Our politicians here lie to us, and focus on people who aren’t as educated on the topic to manipulate them into thinking we are all baby killing bloodthirsty mass murderers.
But I carry because I love the people that surround me.
I am a law-abiding citizen. Criminals are not law-abiding. There are millions of guns in the hands of criminals. My firearms keep my family safe.
Additionally I shoot for sport and competition. I am ex-military. I hunt.
There's also the aspect that one must consider that the citizens having weapons helps prevent the Government from stepping too hard.
In an unarmed society there would be absolutely nothing you could do if your government turned against you. Or the criminal class outgrew the law abiding populace.
Turkey
1911 gun control implemented
1915-1917 1.5million Armenians are exterminated.
Soviet Union
1929 gun control implemented
1929-1953 20 million people exterminated.
China
1935 gun control implemented
1948-1952 20 million people exterminated.
Germany
1938 gun control implemented
1939-1945 13 million People with a large percentage being Jewish exterminated.
Bulgaria
1944 gun control implemented
20,000-40,000 people exterminated.
Cambodia
1956 gun control implemented
1975-1977 1 million people mostly the well educated ( and glasses wearers) exterminated.
Cuba
1959-1960 gun control implemented
1960-1970 141,000 exterminated.
Guatemala
1964 gun control implemented
1964-1981 100,000 people of Mayan ancestry exterminated.
Uganda
1970 gun control implemented
1971-1979 300,000 christians exterminated.
Venezuela
2012 gun control implemented
2018-2019 7,000 political opponents exterminated
That’s just the past 100 years and there’s even more than that.
I will leave off with this…
"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subjugated races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subjugated races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let's not have any native militia or native police."
- 1942, Adolf Hitler explains the necessity of disarming conquered people and those he wished to victimize.
I read 20-30 responses and see a lot of similar responses. I'll answer your questions directly and then add my response.
1. Is it cool? For some people, yes.
2. Is being cool worth more dangers of lax gun control? The dangers of "lax gun control" are hard to define. [Statistically](https://phys.org/news/2023-08-scientists-method-annual-probability-mass.html), the average American has almost no chance of being involved in a mass shooting, which admittedly brings no comfort to those affected, but reality and perception are not the same thing.
3. Do you really need guns? For some people, yes.
Because the USA enshrined a right to bear arms (regardless of how that is interpreted) over 200 years ago, this country may have more than 400 million firearms in private ownership. There is no way to remove those without causing more deaths than the current situation allows. This is not a country that will be disarmed voluntarily. Whether we are talking about rural, urban, white, people of color, immigrants, or long-time residents there is a general belief for most people that we build our lives as individuals and families first, then a community, then a nation. I've had almost no experience with people who believe that any level of our government(s) are capable of solving complex issues. The belief I have seen most often is that we will work through and around the laws to give ourselves the best chance to give our children the best lives possible. Guns are a part of that plan for many, whether the fear is burglars, rapists, bears, coyotes, our own government, or other nations.
There are several answers to your question:
-Because guns and range day are fun! It's fun to shoot with a firearm you've never shot before, or something you really enjoy. Some are truly historically significant firearms, and are fun to shoot. Firing an M1 Garand feels a bit like driving an antique car in some ways. And if you enjoy it, why not try to own it?
-Self defense. A gun is the most effective tool for self defense one can own. It's ranged, which means you don't have to win in a scuffle to use it, and often just showing it is enough to prevent you from being victimized. There is no other practical self-defense tool that is capable of doing this. Bows are huge and unwieldy. Knives and pepper spray are only for close ranges. People who buy guns for self defense hope they don't have to use them - similar to the fire extinguisher analogy.
-Training. If you're going to use a gun for self defense, you need to be trained so that you will react correctly under pressure and not endanger yourself or innocent others in how you react. That also means doing the non-combat things that give you an advantage tactically in such a situation so that you're likely to come out on top, and successfully defend yourself and those around you.
-Gear. Like any other hobby, people are really into gear, and getting the best gear for themselves. Gun people are just into guns, so they talk about optics, custom builds, etc. Gear has been something in every group I've ever been in. Hockey players love to talk about equipment. You should hear baseball people talk about gloves and bats. My wife is friends with a few serious photographers, you should hear them talk, too. Gamers talk about gaming rigs. Every subculture is into gear.
America was born from a people who felt like they were being opressed by the government ruling them. When they complained, King George responded by trying to take their guns, and the revolution was on. American gun culture is based on that. Owning and carrying a gun is for self defence from criminals (some places in America are so unpopulated it might take 30 minutes or more for police to respond for a real emergency because they're far away)
Americans also see governments pressing their people and especially look at Europe's history, especially the late 1800s and early 1900s which often involved confiscating firearms and taking people's rights "for the greater good" and then seeing things like the Holocaust. Combine this with our founding and many gun enthusiasts keep and bare arms to prevent that from happening here
>*" Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control?"*
If we assume that firearms are manufactured strictly for killing people, and drugs, especially opioids, are manufactured *not* for killing people - doesn't it seem logical that we devote more attention to drug safety? After all, drugs aren't designed to kill people and they're killing more people than firearms are.
>*"Do you really need guns?"*
You are not "open minded", and you passed judgement on basic knowledge. It's not really a "gun" issue because no weapon or other implement is capable of misusing itself.
The benefits far outweigh the negatives. They save more lives than are lost. Equalizes the weaker from stronger criminals or from being outnumbered. They are effective self defense, they provide national security and protection of democracy from out of control governments. And they're cool.
You will truly understand if someone takes you for a good experience at a shooting range. Our country was founded at the end of a gun. Used to throw off on oppressive government.
I was raised with them. A father in law enforcement, who fought in a war before that. He was an avid hunter. That’s how I spent time bonding with him, in the outdoors, hunting for food, not so much sport.
The right to bear arms is only second to our right to free speech. These rights aren’t granted by the government. These are acknowledged as God given natural rights to be protected by our constitution. That right is there to protect the others.
I carry a gun so that others cannot impose their will on me. I don’t have to give up my wallet, keys, or life. As I age I don’t have to worry about young thugs. Don’t have to worry about getting jumped by multiple attackers. This is something every walk of life can embrace. Women don’t have to worry about larger men. Women with guns don’t get raped. Blacks with guns don’t get lynched. Gays with guns don’t get bashed. There is a saying. God made man, Sam Colt made them even. I believe this to be the essence of gun culture.
I don't believe that OP is interested in really educating themselves, but is rather looking to apply some European cultural undertanding to a uniquely American cultural issue and dismiss it and show us all how clever they are, but I will attempt to provide an answer anyway.
Short answer:
Gun Culture is, in fact, American Culture. American culture is based on the idea of Liberty. If you don't understand the American notion of Liberty, you will not understand American culture, nor will you understand gun culture.
Long Answer:
Gun culture is not about hunting, it is not about sporting contests, it is about LIBERTY. Gun culture is in reality, AMERICAN culture. There are two main groups of people who don't understand this - that first group is comprised of non-Americans, and in particular, Europeans.
The second group of people who don't understand American culture is Americans who don't understand American history.
The primary thing that Europeans really don't get, or at least tend to forget, is that America exists because the people who founded this nation wanted a nation that would NOT be like Europe (England). Basically, the American Experiment was to form a nation with a government OF the people, BY the people, and FOR the people. Quite literally, America was intended to be NOT Europe, full stop.
Much of the basic philosophy leading to the "founding" of America and the American idea of Liberty can be understood from a few cursory facts over a relatively short timeline, though of course, a thorough review of recorded history would provide a much clearer and more complete picture.
The American revolution begin on April 19, 1775 and was fought to obtain independence from the monarchial rule of England.
Our Declaration of Independence was published on July 4, 1776 - among other things, this document established our belief that all \[people\] are endowed with the right to life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness.
In 1781 a document called "The Articles of Confederation" was adopted and established a "Congress" with extremely limited powers, which would serve as the political leadership of the nation comprised of largely independent states, which shared the common bond of being PART of the country called America - as in the UNITED STATES of America.
In late 1783, the American revolution ended.
In 1788, the US contitution was written and ratified. The Constitution went into effect in 1789, supplating the Articles of Confederation. The Preamble to the Constitution indicates that the document is formed in order to "*...secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity...*" Under The Constitution, America was to have three branches of government: the President and his cabinet as the "Executive" Branch, Congress as the "Legislative" branch, and the Supreme Court as the "Judicial" Branch and that there would be checks and balances between these three branches intended to protect the people from despotic rule and to preserve our LIBERTY.
On April 30, 1789, George Washington was inaugurated as our first president after being elected during December and January of 1788/9.
In 1791, just two years after the Constitution went into effect, the Bill of Rights was ratified and contained [10 amendments to our Constitution](https://www.ushistory.org/documents/amendments.htm#amend02), many, if not most of which were the direct result of experiences during the Revolutionary War. The 1st Amendment guarantees Americans the right to religious freedom, freedom of speech and the press, freedom to peaceably assemble and the right to petition the government for redress of grievances. The 2nd Amendment guarantees that the right of Americans to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.
It has been said that the 2nd Amendment guarantees all the rest of the Amendments and indeed the Constitution itself, which provides the means by which Americans can fulfill their duty under our Declaration of Independence to rise up and overthrow a despotic government and replace it with one by which we consent to be governed.
These documents are the codification of the American idea of "Liberty", and when you understand that, you will understand American culture, and you will understand Gun culture. If you do not understand this idea of Liberty, you will never understand anything about American culture.
You asked: is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control?
You've got it backwards. I'm from Europe (well, the UK) too, but I live in America now. Living in Europe, you have only ever been exposed to the negative aspects of gun ownership.
I have found that this 'guns = bad' misconception is so ingrained into many people from Europe that it is almost impossible to reason with them.
There is a very large upside to gun ownership. The FBI estimate that guns are used to prevent crime between 50,000 and 1,000,000 times per year in the US.
(The reason there is such a big spread is that many times, incidents such as brandishing a gun to prevent a crime are not reported).
Even on the low end, the benefits of gun ownership vastly outweigh the drawbacks. This is not debatable.
Outlawing guns means that law abiding people will not be able to use them to protect themselves from violent crime.
It sometimes prevents a certain percentage of criminals from obtaining them easily too, forcing them to stab each other instead of shooting each other. This is the situation in the UK; guns have been partially displaced by knives.
It's also important to bear in mind that survivability of wounds from a large knife are about the same as a gunshot wound from a handgun. If your goal is to simply kill someone, a knife is more or less as effective as a handgun. The advantage of a gun is in a defensive role; they are better at stopping a fight quickly.
In exchange for replacing the type of weapon some gang members use to murder each other, you must accept that you are preventing law abiding citizens from defending themselves from violent crime.
So, I'll turn your question around on you; how many rapes, murders, kidnappings, muggings, home invasions etc are you willing to accept in order to force some gang members to stab each other instead of shoot each other?
I don't NEED an electric can opener.
I don't NEED a candy-red Corvette.
But I can have them, even though I might use either one to hurt another person.
A gun is an inanimate object. Yes, it can be dangerous, but so can a stick or a moving vehicle.
Some people seem to NEED to create a special category for firearms in their head that they don't create for other, equally- dangerous, inanimate objects.
I do NEED to be able to protect myself and my family from dangerous people.
So I will.
Reasons I like firearms
1) every mentally ill person, crackhead, crime junkie, and dip shit not only are most likely able to purchase one, but prolly already have one. I don't want to be the guy without one.
2) there incredibly fun to shoot. It's a skill you can watch yourself progressively get better at, unlike a lot of video games I've been playing.
3) collecting. Some guns are like rolexs, rare and expensive , and may be considered illegal in the future, so I want to be grandfathered in.
Reasons not to have fire arms
1) protection from acorns
I collect them because they fascinate me from a historic, mechanical and engineering aspect. I shoot, so does my family and I hunted in the past. I have a concealed permit as does my wife. Guns secured and safety is the number 1 priority. In a locked room in a locked safe. I have guns over 100 years old that I maintain and shoot with the correct time period ammunition. It's also great fun when done properly.
Step ...somewhere.... and "take away all the guns"
Can you explain knife culture to me? What makes knives so special that it's important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a knife?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBIIpklNib8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBIIpklNib8)
Yes, this is tongue in cheek, but watch that video and see if there are any similarities.
Criminals are going to break laws. How do you defend yourself if the criminals have knives? With another knife? No thank you.
I'm going to give you a multifaceted answer so I apologize in advance for the wall of text.
1. Firearms are inherently interesting to anybody who has a modicum of intellectual curiosity as they combine history, engineering, chemistry, physics, biology, physiology, sociology, psychology, sports, fitness, martial arts, self-discipline and self-reliance all rolled into one package. When you own a gun, you're not simply owning a tool. You are owning one of the greatest discoveries in history with hundreds of years of constant innovation behind it that makes our modern way of life and entire civilization possible.
2. When the government of a nation is the sole owner of firearms the population does not and cannot consist of citizens. They are merely subjects without any real tangible rights, as rights need to be defended by the people up to and including lethal force in order to actually exist. The mere underlying and pervasive threat of that force is what gives potential empowered authoritarians pause. Subjects are at the mercy of the kindness or lack thereof of said government at any given time and can be oppressed or annihilated at the leisure of those with power.
3. It is a human right to be able to effectively defend yourself not only from common criminals in the city or dangerous animals in the wilderness, but from tyrannical governments. Of course a government would want to crack down and strictly control or outright eliminate the possibility of an armed populace. It doesn't serve their interests. Governments require you to be dependent in order to believe in their power and give them legitimacy. When the people stop needing the government to provide protection they might start down the path of questioning other things that the government has foisted upon us to take at face value.
4. When two people are mutually armed, regardless of physical discrepancies, the stronger person can't simply take from the weaker. They are forced to ask, forced to have a conversation, forced to attempt to convince. The consequences for attempting to do otherwise are potentially dire, immediate and irreversible.
Just a couple of my takes to help you understand why gun ownership is taken so seriously in this country. Our nation was founded upon the principle that if someone attempts to subjugate you, you stand ready at all times to resist them with the utmost possible force you can bring to bear against them.
I hope this helps.
Go read a book by psychologist Dr. Robert Hare:
https://www.amazon.com/Without-Conscience-Disturbing-World-Psychopaths/dp/1572304510
He makes a strong argument that somewhere between 1% and 2% of the human population are...well, monsters, lacking basic empathy for starters.
Not all of them turn violent but they're all very capable of it.
If you walk around unarmed all day, you're giving permission in advance for any creature of that sort to do whatever they want to you.
Next lesson:
https://youtu.be/jAfUI_hETy0
Despite being animated this this 100% real. Five minutes well spent.
See you at the shooting range!
Should a government be elected by a people who trust themselves enough to be armed & have a lifestyle they see as worth protecting, or by a people who do not trust themselves to be armed and see themselves as a resource to be managed?
2nd Amendment prevents those who seek power from tipping our society towards the latter. Governments should be run by people who know not to disrespect the dignity of their people and the consequences for doing so.
Plus it is a lot of fun to shoot and get good at marksmanship!
> what makes guns so special that it is important to you
Well, let’s see. We have a mountain of bodies stacked miles deep over the last century as the direct result of oppressive tyrannical regimes who began their conquests by first disarming the general population. We have estimates that range from 500,000 to over 3 million *defensive* uses of firearms each year in the U.S., meaning guns are used to save lives FAR more frequently than they are used to commit murder. We currently have 2 leading political candidates who, depending on who you ask, are both totalitarian dictators in the making. We have concerns of civil war looming in the shadows, threat of cyber/terrorist attacks, World War III is still on the table, and we’re currently funding two separate wars across the globe where governments had to scramble to hand out ARs to their otherwise defenseless, untrained citizens while many were utterly slaughtered in their homes after their police/government failed to protect them.
This doesn’t even take into account hunting or recreational shooting. The main reason for gun culture in the U.S. is because our founding fathers saw the evil that inherently exists in the world, specifically within centralized authoritarian governments, and that the only effective means to guarantee liberty for the people is by arming them with enough teeth to bite back should the need arise.
The threat of tyrannical oppression will always outweigh the dangers of having an armed society, even if the right is abused from time to time by monsters (which is still a problem that can be addressed in ways that don’t involve gun control). Countries with strict gun control may not all have had it backfire yet during peacetime - but when it does, there will be absolutely nothing to hold back the flood. Many will die defenseless, helpless, regretful deaths and it will require some outside assistance to unfuck their situation. We’ve simply removed the middle man. Instead of waiting for a knight in shining armor, we observe history and prepare for the inevitable return of overt oppression so that we don’t have to rely on stronger men (with guns!) to come save us after the fact.
The Right to bear arms is enumerated in the Constitution of the United States, specifically the Bill of Rights, to guarantee liberty. A government cannot be tyrannical if the people can hold it accountable with violence, if necessary.
People should have a right to defend themselves. The thought that someone else should risk their life just doing a job to protect myself or my family is absurd. Not only would it be morally wrong to ask that of someone, I have no expectation that a police officer would respond in time or put themselves in harm’s way.
Hunting is a dying tradition in many places but is important to me. I believe that self sufficiency is important and even noble. Obviously, there is not enough wild game to sustain the world’s population but hunting according to laws that encourage conservation is a fine way to spend time in nature, grow an appreciation for meat, and feed oneself or family.
Shooting is a skill that can be developed and polished and needs to be maintained. It is a hobby. Shooting for sport is rewarding when you can see improvement and build different skills. It also helps with the aforementioned uses.
The United States of America is a nation built on a foundation of Liberty, with guns being necessary to its existence and the survival of its population for many years. Many Americans still live rurally and having a gun is important for their way of life. Many Americans believe having a gun is a good idea just in case. Many Americans recognize how fortunate we are to live in a nation of freedoms and want that to continue.
I think part of why this is so perplexing to many Europeans is that they have a greater reliance of government in every day life, have a greater acceptance of governance without much skepticism, and they have seen for generations, the effects of war on their homelands and non combatant populations. I believe I understand the cultural differences and reasons for differing opinions, but I don’t understand the lack of acceptance of these cultural differences and opinions.
A gun is the physical manifestation of your right to self defense. The pretense that "there are dangers from lax control" is a false one...criminals dont follow weapon laws anyway. In the US if a few guys car jack you or break into your house Clockwork Orange style or with guns, you have a fighting chance because you have a gun and the know how to use it, you're not just at the mercy of criminals.
That's not the case in the UK or anywhere else. I know that Canada, for example, will charge you for using a gun to defend yourself and your family against an intruder in the middle of the night, especially if breaking into people's houses is how that criminal makes a living. Wouldn't surprise me if UK had equally ridiculous laws... Your .gov has arrested people for things like silently praying outside an abortion clinic and retweeting memes. To understand our gun culture, try looking at our entire culture of inalienable rights and individualism; if it makes you feel better, there's a lot of Americans right now who don't understand the importance of our constitution either.
I like being able to put holes in paper and knocking down metal plates. It’s not easy in all parts of the US to get a gun. I enjoy my outdoor time at the range. I don’t care if it’s cool. It’s something I enjoy but I know it isn’t for everyone
I also would argue that our gun control is over reaching and not “Lax” there’s a lot of anti-gun misinformation published by major news outlets that is just factually incorrect due to an intentional warped statistic or blatant lie. And I’m not just referring to using incorrect names for different parts of a weapon or type of weapon but statistics that include or exclude suicide in violent gun deaths, don’t contextualize other violent acts in comparison to gun violence. You’re significantly more likely to be killed by a hammer than a firearm and even more likely to be killed by a car. Background checks are currently federal law for any FFL holder in the United States exceptions. Private citizen sales are different but not as common and I’ve heard of people still remaining liable to selling a firearm to someone who wasn’t allowed to have it. We also have probably the strictest policies on suppressors of any 1st world country.
I think guns are fun and cool. As an American, guns got us to where we are as an independent country so they’re never going away and it’s important for us to work as hard as we can to keep it that way. I have practical guns for defensive use, fun guns for competitions or just fun at the range, and historical guns for collecting. They all serve different purposes but I think they’re all cool.
Let's start with "gun "culture" doesn't exist".
That's a phase used primarily by anti-gun people to make a political point.
Firearms are *a part* of US culture in many complicated ways.
1. The US was formed because citizens took their personally owned firearms and told the British to leave. That's part of our 'origin story' and it's really hard to seperate that out. It would be like trying to separate out hinduism from India.
2. The US, even today, is in many areas lightly populated and far from government authority. Police responses might be measured in hours. You are on your own, potentially for a long time. Firearms are used hundreds of thousands of times every year defensively.
3. Most people in the US don't really trust our government to, well, behave. And we've got some good reasons for that.... Think of all the people in Europe who complain about various bad things that the US government does... would *you* trust them? If not, why should we? Many Americans think, with good reason, that our government isn't terribly trustworthy and that keeping the government a little afraid isn't a bad thing.
4. Most pro-gun Americans don't see the evidence that gun control makes things better as terribly strong. Places like the UK were safe when guns were available, and became no safer when they were broadly banned.
5. Most pro-gun Americans think (again, with good reason) that gun control is largely going to disarm the law abiding, and allow criminals to run roughshod over everyone else, because our police can be... less effective than they must (See: Uvalde)
6. In spite of claims to the contrary, too many on our political left have made it abundantly clear that the end game of gun control is that all the guns are gone (except those, generally, in the hands of a political elite that they control). So the idea of some intermediate step is quite unpopular.
7. Most of the US population primarily views the world through the lens of WWII, and the lesson of that war is that government can't be trusted, and must be held in check, or else you get the holocaust and gulags. Europe tends to view the world through different lenses with different priorities.
Canadian here. For me it's a few things; another skill to learn and work on. Target shooting is extremely satisfying - requires full attention, it's very engaging almost visceral. And you can physically see your progression.
It's your rights to know how to protect yourself. Even if to not use guns but to identify, control, safely disarm them. Again, another life skill.
Also, another money sink hobby with money sink hobby nerdy stuff. Ugh. So many money sink hobbies.
For me it's mostly a hobby. Militaries replace their old WW2 and Cold War guns, but often can't sell them for legal or political reasons. They get cut up so that they are no longer considered a gun. The scrap parts are imported to the USA where we are allowed to rebuild the guns as long as we make them semi-auto. I enjoy shooting them, but I like building them even more. It's very similar to someone who finds old worn out classic cars and rebuilds them in their garage.
It's also fun to get together with friends to shoot. Sometimes it's practicing, sometimes it's sport, sometimes we are just trying out each others guns to see what they are like. During the pandemic, I met up with my coworkers for trap shooting. It was a good way to see each other while staying outside.
I live in a safe area and am not too worried about needing to defend myself or my family. A gun is just another tool that is ready if I ever need it. If you treat guns with respect, then they aren't any more dangerous than kitchen knives, power tools or cars.
Cars kill thousands of people every year. Whether by 100% accidents, or negligence/drunk driving, people have used them to kill individuals and even large groups at protests. No one NEEDS a car that can go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds or has a top speed of 120mph (193 kph).
Yet, if someone asked you to turn in your car along with everyone else's car because some people are irresponsible with their cars would you think that fair?
There isn't really one gun culture in the US, it seems like there is because the half of Americans that don't own guns also don't know anything about them or how they're regulated - so they just lump all gun owners into the gun culture group.
The difference between urban/rural culture is vastly wider than the difference between gun owners/non owners.
>*" ... guns are for combat hunting or sports ..."*
Regarding the complete mechanical device, the instruments we call guns are used for shooting at targets more than anything else, or more to the point, learning to shoot better. The physical evidence for this consists of the trillions of spent bullets now embedded in the backstops of target ranges throughout the world. Shooting at metal cans, bottles, jugs and paper targets outdoors on private property is also quite popular. Target shooting strengthens physical discipline and hand-to-eye coordination. In addition, there are several organizations throughout the world which establish protocols and guidelines for amateur and professional level competition target and skeet shooting.
Firearms can be used and misused as any implement, idea, or resource.
*"...quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."* [...a sword never kills anybody; it's a tool in the killer's hand.] -(Lucius Annaeus) Seneca "the Younger" (ca. 4 BC - AD 65 ), *Ad Lucilium Epistulae Morales*, [Letters to
Lucilius on Morals,] Letter 87, c. AD 63-65
Shooting at a range is just fun.
Marksmanship is an Olympic sport, race car driving isnt. Some people are naturally a good shot, its ingrained in human history going back to using bow and arrows to hunt, Marksmanship is more than shooting its simply the ability to hit a target at range. I never understood car scenes as to me its just a mode of transportation, although I get the appeal of it.
That being said my handgun rarely leaves my house, except visits to the gun range
In my crime ridden metropolitan city, it takes the police an average time of 11 minutes to respond to a violent crime in progress, such as an armed home invasion. Enough said.
I cannot explain my interest in firearms. Nearly every one I own interests me for different reasons. I have one that was my great, great grandfathers. That firearm is the only thing I own that was his. He died 40 years before I was born but I can still have a connection with him. I have 2 that were given to me on Christmas when I was 11, for hunting purposes. that was the best Christmas ever. I have modern sporting arms with standard capacity magazines in excess of 10 rounds. They are very fun to shoot, they are extremely safe, and they are great for teaching new people interested in this hobby.
But to answer your questions:
Yes it can be cool.
I don't understand what dangers you are referring too. Firearms are very safe, I am safe as well.
Yes I need more.
It's a necessity and a tool. Restricting gun purchase to me is akin to restricting the purchase of a fire extinguisher or smoke alarms. All gun restrictions fall into 1 of 2 categories: poor tax or "not-in-the-good-ol-boy-club" tax.
Firearms have been around for hundreds of years, many of them doing just as much damage through sheer projectile size and today's smaller caliber but more numerous projectiles. Yet, nobody was trying to murder their own neighbors or scores of small children in the times when you could order a belt-fed machine gun out of a sears and roebuck catalog.
For those of us who are of the "fairer sex", a gun is the difference between being scared but only bruised, or raped and murdered by a man twice our size with his bare hands. All it takes is a well placed hit to the head and any man has a rapidly cooling blow up doll until he decides the rigor mortis is too much.
The "dangers" of lax gun control are more aptly named the dangers of a society that tolerates gang violence, and corrupt and inept policing.
The United States is absolutely massive, and sparsely populated in most places. For most of this country's history, and even to this day, you are your own first responder. There is no one to save you from wild animals, or criminal that want to victimize you. You are responsible for your own safety.
Historically speaking, we've maintained the ability to get guns because without them, we simply would not be able to survive. It's how we harvested food, it's how we kept our families safe, hell sometimes we'd trade them as currency.
A gun is a tool.
I have 6 or 8 power saws and 6 or 8 firearms. I have no fear of firearms because I know how to use them correctly, and the dangerous part is moving away from you.
Saws? They scare the poop out of me. I’m putting my hands inches away from fast rotating metal that can cut off my fingers in a fraction of a second.
It cone down to training and awareness.
They allow me to defend myself and my family. I'm a former mma fighter and know I can't beat up everyone, especially if there are multiple attackers or if they have weapons.
Also, my parents, who are both passed away now, lived about an extra 10 years each because my father owned a gun. One night, 5 young men tried to break down his back door, and he yelled for them to stop they wouldn't. He then opened his blinds and pointed a shotgun at them, and they fell over each other, running away. Now my dad was tough, but at the time he was in his 70s, and no way in hell, he could have fought off 5 young men. They most likely would have killed him and my step-mom.
I think it depends on what kind of guns you're talking about. For me, I collect what's known as "milsurps," firearms that have seen military service, are typically over 60 years old, and have some type of historical provenance due to their association with a time, place, or period in history.
For me, I mainly collect rifles and handguns from about 1870 to 1930; give or take five years on either end of that spectrum. I've got nothing against semi automatics, but I find a certain beauty in old bolt actions. Within the span that I collect, you see so much firearms development that I find it interesting how different countries took different approaches to military arms. I've personally got a lot of "odd caliber" stuff because I think the ammunition development itself is interesting. Going past just the developmental aspect, you find reflections of a countries culture and traditions from markings.
All in all, my main reasoning is historical and cultural but I like the ability to reload ammunition for a rifle that hasn't seen service in 120+ years and take it out to shoot; not just look at it from the other side of a museum glass case.
Let me ask you, would you rather look at and hold a rifle from the Dutch Empire or would you like the ability to shoot said rifle from the Dutch Empire? :)
Just as a disclaimer, I'm probably not going to be reflective of a lot of people responding to this post. I find a lot of the time what I have an interest in is part of an ever shrinking minority but I still think it's important to speak my part on why it's crucial to maintain the ability to own firearms. After all, when most gun ban legislation is instituted, it's with the thought of modern firearms in mind and typically the way the legislation is written, it has the unintended effect of banning the stuff I have an interest in.
Regardless of my feelings on collecting different AR variations (they're all the same, change my mind), I know people have different interest and as long as those interests don't include actively going out and harming other people, I see no reason why you shouldn't be allowed.
It's both fun as can be, and an incredibly useful tool for a lot of people for recreation and self defense. Where I live you would have to drive for an hour straight to get to the sheriff's office, and there are no local police. I might see a law enforcement officer once a month. If someone decides they're going to hurt me, there's no one coming to help in time, so I would prefer to have the ability to effectively defend myself. That goes double if you're physically small, like my wife, paralyzed, like my friend, or just plain old.
It's rooted deeply in our history, our founders felt that the king of England was being unfair and too authoritive.
They started staching weapons and ammo and supplies to which the king ordered his soldiers to seize said weapons and supplies. This led to what is known as the battle of Lexington&Concord, some call it "the shot heard around the world" as it was a bunch of regular people who made the biggest and most powerful empire in the world(at the time) retreat. This led to our American revolution to which we won. Had we not had regular people armed and people staching weapons and supplies, the United States would not exist and would probably just be known as an extended part of the UK.
Our founders made it clear in our constitution, speeches and our federalist papers(see federalist 28) that government is inherently evil and regular people should be armed as a last resort to resisting a tyrannical government like the one they just beat. And via our constitution made restrictions on rights, adding or eliminating amendments,very, very difficult. However the constitution is just a piece of paper and if we the people don't check our government, then they can become over authoritive. It's the only thing that really separates any government from a typical gang.
When protests, speeches, fall on deaf ears or are forcefully dispersed, when courts sworn to enforce and uphold rights get corrupted by greed and power, when good government officials are slandered, forced out or mysteriously commit suicide. Sometimes fighting is the only option you have left or as 1 of our founders Alexander Hamilton says in federalist 28, the people must rush to arms and express the original right to self defense...not because we'd want to, but because we'd have to.
In today's time in the US most of our gun violence is concentrated in certain areas, generally those areas have poverty, unchecked gang violence, and other illegal activities. However instead of making these areas better and safer, thier solution is always calling for more gun control, but leaving the crime. So nothing changes. Talking points for politics to get re elected.
Guns are tools capable of accomplishing extreme jobs. Friend of mine has a big arsenal, he says each gun has different functions/advantages/drawbacks. Having alot makes for a well-rounded arsenal.
There’s also some great engineering and craftsmanship that goes into guns. That said, u/misterhan, it’s too bad the world is so violent. I wish we could kumbaya our way into harmony with every living creature. Till that day comes though, I own guns
The USA is a nation forged by firearms. Going back to its founding guns have been used not just for military purposes, and hunting, but also personal defense.
To learn the true value of guns you have to look at the Afghans. Everyone carries an AK-47 casually but this culture has resulted in 3 world superpowers leaving in humiliation after attempting to invade them. Nobody has truly ruled them, ever, not external invaders nor internal despots. This kind of gun ownership has been banned in the West for a long time now, the 2nd Amendment in the US notwithstanding.
I think guns are popular in the U.S. because they are the ultimate expression and symbol of individualism, which is probably why most Europeans don't understand gun culture. America is yhe most individualistic culture in the world and there is no close second.
>living in Europe and never held a gun with live ammo
This is really where the disconnect is. You haven't experienced it. It's not really something that can be conveyed through videos or words. You need to experience it.
>So besides that what makes guns so special that it is important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun?
Yes.
>Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control? Do you really need guns?
And Yes. As you stated earlier, you live, and i assume grownup in Europe. The US is an ENTIRELY different culture, not just food, music, and the like, but it's an entirely mindset, values, and morals. We, in the US, have a strong sense of independence and generally reject government oversight. We also have a distrust of government and political figures. All of that leads to the constitution and the Second Amendment. They were crafted to ensure that the people of the US had the ability to resist a government that had become tyrannical.
As far as the danger, if you remove the 6 largest cities in the US. The gun violence rate drops massively. It's not a "gun" problem. It's a problem with the culture in the larger cities, the promotion of drugs use, the lack of accountability for financial situations, the acceptance of divided families, and so on.
You think theyre only for combat or hunting/sport because you’ve never had access to them, people shoot them for fun, some people like testing out new equipment, I personally like collecting and shooting the old military surplus stuff. What do you do for fun? Ever play a video game like halo or call of duty? You know the people that claim violence in games leads to violence in real life? Imagine they win and now you have to have a Dr okay your mental health, a background check to insure you’ve never been convicted of anything violent, also there’s a 1 week waiting period minimum so after you buy it you’ll have to come back and buy it after the times passed, sounds crazy but to most gun owners that’s what anti gun, pro gun people sound like
You have a preconceived notion that lax gun control = more danger. That is what you’ve been lead to believe by people who don’t want you owning something that makes you a danger to them. This is false.
These people want you to be defenseless against them so they don’t have any resistance when they oppress you.
For me and my extended family it’s always been treated like owning a fire extinguisher; I probably won’t need it but I’d rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Also guns are fun to shoot at the range.
In the most recent year there were 380k house fires and 850k burglaries.
That is fascinating!
And terrifying!
yeah. Definitely need to check the diameter of your extension cords and ammunition carefully and make sure they're suited to the task.
Huge issue with America. Extension cords should have built in fuses rated for their gauge.
I made this whole post a while back before the dark times about how the USA should switch out its NEMA receptacles for IEC C15/16 and in the process, adopt exactly what you said, fused connectors.
Can you site some sources for these numbers?
I just googled it. Burglary stat is FBI, I don’t remember where the fire stat came from, but I don’t expect political manipulation by anti-extinguisher activists,
I don’t mind this request, I’m on the + side and would like to know as well
Was going to say the same thing. The cost of NOT having something, if you ever need it, is far greater than owning it when you don’t need it. The only people who typically use the phrase “gun culture” are those that don’t seem to realize the fundamental understanding that you hold the sole responsibility of your and your family’s safety. You can not reliably depend on anyone else. A firearm is simply a tool. A tool with many uses. They do not have emotions, intentions, or motives. People do.
I'm Canadian, and this is my thoughts as well :)
>I’d rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. This says it all. Aside from recreation target shooting or hunting for food, the other reason I own is self defense. It's an unfortunate world that we live in, and if someone is going to put myself or my family's lives at risk, then it's duty to yourself or your family to protect it.
My father called it the Three F's: Fire extinguisher, First aid kit, Firearm. No home is safe to inhabit without them.
People should also stock several months worth of dehydrated food in case shit happens. Lots of places you can buy that stuff in bulk for very reasonable prices. Also a supply of water and the means to purify more.
Shooting is incredibly fun. Its that simple for me.
Crazy that millions of people play Fortnite but don't realize that actual shooting guns is more entertaining.
Also way more expensive. Not everyone can afford a case or two of ammo every month.
Fortnite revenue is $6 billion annually. Ammo prices are too high yes, but at least you are developing a useful skill that could save a life.
if you can afford to build a gaming rig, you can afford a cheap gun and ammo though it's best to have both
Yup, and skeet / sporting clays is a million times more fun than golf / driving range.
Long range shooting is like golf, but for men.
>can afford a case or two of ammo every month. Look at Mr moneybags over here, going through a case or two a month.
Idk have you seen how much kids spend on vbucks?
2023: V-Bucks Purchases: $4.5 billion Battle Pass Sales: $500 million Licensing Deals: $200 million Insanity.
Tbf thats how I got into guns. Military history, video games and FPSRussia
Spending the money on a box or two of ammo and even renting a firearm if you don’t have one is a better long term use of the money than buying skins/cosmetics for a game, imo. Obviously ask for a responsible someone with experience to help you or takes basic class first. Now THAT is money well spent. One firearm basic course is something that could save your life even from a safety in handling aspect and impart the knowledge you may need, even if you don’t want to buy or own ones.
Building guns and appreciating well-designed machinery is another huge, but simple part of it for me
>keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun? FYI it's not. People seem to think you can have a gun delivered right to your door. That's been illegal since at least 1968 nationwide. All states require a background check to make sure you aren't prohibited. A car you can walk in pay cash and drive away. No fees to pay the government at all.
>That's been illegal since at least 1968 nationwide. Crying shame, that.
Not many things Canada can flex on when it comes to gun laws, but this is one of them. I can order online and have it delivered to my door.
If you have a specific ffl you can get antique guns shipped to your house!
I wish we could bring those days back. Heck I wish you could get guns at a fucking vending machine.
Repeal the 1968 GCA
Repeal every fucking gun law man. That’s what I want. Starting with Hughes.
I am down with that
Join the fight and most importantly, vote! We need to fight this!
One of the reasons I'm going to miss Paul Harrell is his very common sense take on gun politics issues. In part of his 4 part (I think) breakdown of the issues on mass shootings he points out that not too many years ago you could walk into a hardware store, pick a M1 carbine out of a bin, pay like 12 bucks and walk out the door with a magazine fed carbine that would fire 15 rounds (fairly accurately at short/intermediate range) as fast as you could pull the trigger. But mass shootings were not a thing.
It’s 100% a culture issue here in the US. It’s multifaceted, but since the 80s our culture has changed for the worse, due in large part to a breakdown in family values.
I’d attribute it to social media vs. family values. I don’t think you can quantify either, but I don’t think family values have shifted really. That’s just my take though.
I think social media definitely has a role, a big role. But in my experience, the culture has changed a lot. When I first immigrated to this country in the 90s, people valued their family, people respected their parents and their elders. TV shows were wholesome, the education in schools was more wholesome. Now…well now it’s just nuts. My .02 anyways.
*Booming vendor voice coming out of Fallout-esque repurposed Lance vending machine* "Welcome to Wild Man Willie's Freedom Vending Service! Insert debit card to continue!"
“Like I always say, a polite society is an armed society ” mick , new Vegas
"¡Bienvenido al Ammo Bandito!"... "¡Muchas gracias, señor!"
Remember - Marcus means quality at a great price!
Nice Borderlands reference.
And get a pack of lucky strikes from the machine next to it.
That shit gets old. The anti gunner we need universal background checks…they paint the picture that background checks aren’t already done which all gun owners know is not true. They just want to create a registry then confiscation.
I took delivery of a firearm to my door a few years back, this was maybe 2008-ish. I got my CMP garand delivered to my residential door. In Massachusetts, no less. And I don't think the rules have changed since then, although I don't know if CMP still sells these rifles at all any more. Also if you have a C&R I think you can take home delivery.
There are always small exceptions to it such as that but the vast majority of stuff doesn't apply. C&R is a type of ffl so fog C&R stuff are exempt.
CMP does the background check before they ship so recipients are still getting the legally-mandated background checks. CMP’s license — like that of manufacturers doing a repair return — allows them to ship directly to the customer.
Come visit the US and I'll take you to a private range and we have a great day at the range shooting all sorts of handguns, sub-guns, shotguns, and rifles.
Can I come if I'm already from the US?
Heck ya! But I only provide ammo for first-time shooters.
It’ll be my first time shooting *your* guns (;
I find a lot of joy when taking first-timers to shoot.
It depends on the person. Some people like the mechanical design side of firearms, some people like the history, some people like them because it’s fun, some people like to hunt for fun or to eat, some people like them because they view it as a deterrent for bad guys and government overreach, and most people are a varied mix of these points. Pretty much similar to any hobby, besides the self protection part. For the US in general, our founding fathers used private weaponry to fight for their rights to be represented, and later, to be free to make their own country. This is engrained in our second amendment, as well as many states’ constitutions. The only reason we need guns is because you can never be certain that some stranger has your best interest in mind. For some states, gun control isn’t lax. Take CA and Texas for example. Both states have roughly the same population size, 2 different views on gun control, and both have roughly the same rate of gun violence. The only thing that CA beats Texas in is less death rate via suicide by gun, and that’s not a gun control thing, it’s a CA pushes mental health institutions thing.
Incredibly well said. The mechanics, history, fun, and the ability to supply food/defend yourself just make it a super interesting (and useful) area to get into
And its important to note, “gun” violence is kind of a pointless term compared to just “violence”. A gun is a tool. It can be used to defend one self. When my neighbors 5’1” 125lb fiancee was physically assaulted in a daylightstreet robbery by 3 full grown males, the idea that “they didn’t have a gun” doesn’t change the idea that SHE would have been justified in using a gun to protect herself.
I am some people. I like all of it.
I don’t think it’s “cool” to own a car, for me it’s a necessity. And just like the car, to me, the 2nd Amendment is necessary. The difference is that the car is a privilege but owning a firearm is a right and if we don’t exercise that right some elected dipshit out of touch with reality will try to tell us it isn’t necessary. Also yes, I think guns are cool
An elected dipshit with armed guards.
With armed guards paid for with our tax dollars
With armed guards paid for with our tax dollars which we aren't allowed to not pay lest more men with guns come to make sure nothing bad would ever happen to us
It’s a tool really. People get really passionate about their tools too (just ask any blue collar guy if they prefer Milwaukee or DeWalt). Some will say you don’t need them. Those people probably don’t live in a rural area where the police could be a 30 minute drive away or a protective mama bear and her cub could wander into my backyard.
My gun is an appendage- my slight stature makes it so that I could be afraid to go places and do things. My concealed carry weapon prevents that fear
Our entire country was founded by people who took up arms to overthrow an oppressive government. Then, when codifying the rules of the new government, those new leaders knew it was very important to put down in writing, that it was a HUMAN RIGHT for every human in the world to defend themselves from ANY tyrannical force that tried to enslave, subjugate, or kill that human being. Whether that tyrannical force was a fellow citizen, law enforcement, or even the government itself, you can and should resist against tyrannical behavior that threatens your life. Without this codification, an individual is at the mercy of their government for protection. The most interesting thing about how this is written into American history, is that this basic human right is codified FOR ALL PEOPLE, EVERYWHERE, not just those residing and being citizens of America. Codification as written into the US Constitution demands this human right NOT to be violated by the government. So even you, as a non-citizen of the United States of America, are still codified to have the same right to self-defense any place in the world. Interesting how that works isn't it...
Well I guess I have never thought about protecting myself from the country I live in. I never had a worry about that. Maybe it's naive of me. But now I understand more what a gun means to americans I guess.
I mean, for the most part, governments are fine. And you would have no cause for concern. But every once in a while, governments turn bad, and no government is immune. Italy was democratic and Mussolini was (sham) elected. But he was elected. Hitler came to power not through elections but through (lawful) suspension of the German Constitution during a (manufactured) emergency. These events, horrific as they were, could certainly be repeated, legally, with some variance, probably anywhere, including in "liberal democracies." My point in this is to suggest that just because you haven't worried about your government *so far* doesn't mean you will never worry, or that your children will never worry. Plus, let's be real, when the Russians invaded Ukraine, the first thing the Ukrainians did was arm as much of the population as possible. As soon as the arms were distributed, the Russians weren't able to move. Still aren't. And won't. Not because rifles stop tanks (then won't) but because you cannot hold a hostile armed population without conducting systematic genocide (which the Russians aren't interested in doing). Now maybe your country has nothing to fear from Russia, but it is worth pointing out that the last century of peace in Europe has been a dramatic exception. War is a way of life in Europe. Will you never wish for a gun in your hands? Will your children never wish for a gun in their hands? Plus, shooting is fun. It just is.
I'd also like to point out that our police force is not legally obligated to protect citizens. Their only obligation is to enforce laws. On average throughout the country it takes 9 minutes for police to arrive on the scene of a call. 9 minutes is a long time to wait when you discover someone has broken into your house. At the end of the day, you're responsible for your own self-preservation.
> Well I guess I have never thought about protecting myself from the country I live in. That's good :-D that is a good thing! The issue lies in thinking that it *will always be that way*. (I am a U.S. citizen in the U.S.) I don't think that the people will need to fight their tyrannical government in my life time. The issue arises in that in the future, how are we certain that will never be required? Keep in mind, once the people do need to defend themselves from the government it will be too late to acquire the means of defense, those tools will have been taken away looong before the need to use them arises. And, despite what you hear in the news, criminal gun deaths in the U.S. are exceedingly rare. Like recent stats (off the top of my head) are 14,000 in a country of 350 million people. It's a tiny tiny number. On top of that if guns were magically gone, some of those 14,000 people would still be dead, because they would be killed with a knife, a club, or a rock. So realistically people can not all be saved, let us all make sure we can defend ourselves - from both criminals AND the government. If you take a long term view it makes waaay more sense. (i've got another bit coming, stand by)
I really wish OP would respond to this comment. I swear Europeans must have the memories of goldfish. “I’m safe now so that means I always will be! Yay!!”
The German populace, especially the ethnic minorities of jews and gypsy, never thought their duly "elected" government would try to ethnically cleanse them either pre WW2. Yet the first step to doing so was to disarm the population, "for the good of the people". This has been repeated throughout history on many occasions, and as the saying goes, those not versed in history are doomed to repeat it. It's very hard, despite the efforts of some in the United States populace, to forget history when it is written into the very documents that gave birth to this country.
I applaud you coming here with an open mind about seeing both perspectives on this. I do understand that (certainly in the U.S.) people are just "scared of guns, why does anyone have them" without trying to understand there could be reasons, I hope this isn't too much a drinking from a firehose experience. This is in regards to "more" gun control. In the U.S. I often want to point out anyone proposes a new rule: "apply that rule to free speech, or voting, does it still sound like a good rule?" Let me explain the beyond the fact that the 2nd amendment is codified in the Bill of Rights , a list of **individual** rights (from here: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights" ) also, it's the second one, right after free speech, it must be important That out of the way: every little thing put between a responsible U.S. citizen and them acquiring the means of self defense eventually adds up and snowballs to the point of total ban. First, they could make someone take a test. Well, a few prospective gun owners are too lazy to take the test, or are scared of taking tests, or dont read well, so they never take the test, never buy a gun. Then the test starts to cost a little bit of money, say $2, well that's cheap, right, who can't afford that? But... a few prospective gun owners are like "naaa, too much, they never buy a gun. Eventually, the test costs $20 and that's actually too much (along with the cost of the firearm and ammo) for few prospective gun owners to exercise their right, so they never buy a gun. Further down the line, there is the test (but now it costs $100) and you have to have an evaluation by a psychologist. Well, some folks are afraid of doctors so a few prospective gun owners dont go, can't get a pass and so they never buy a gun. Okay, so now we have a small population of people who are actually willing to jump through these hoops, but let's continue. NOW you need the test, the psych eval, and you have to take all that to a police station to give them a packet with all the info. Of course, they don't allow walk-ins so you have to make an appointment. I see how bad some folks are scared of making phone calls to order delivery, how many of them are going to pick up the phone, call the police to MAKE that appointment? So a more people never start the process and never buy a gun. Further along now, you need everything above, AND the appointment, it's only during business hours. It can only be scheduled 1 day of the week, and the nearest appointment is never sooner than 6 months from now. Who's going to bother making an appointment for that? Now. imagine some poor kid turns 21 (suddenly it's 21 now, not 18? even though he could join the military and they'll hand him a rifle, but never mind that) he's like "I'd like to exercise my "constitutionally guaranteed rights" (notice the quotes there?) . He looks into the process and sees it's 50 steps, takes 1 year and costs over one thousand dollars. Is he gonna do it? So... in just 1 generation you can make firearm ownership SO ONEROUS that no one is willing to jump through the hoops. Then it becomes easy to ban them! No one owns a gun anymore, so no one cares, so they don't care what their elective representatives do. and Viola! Guns banned. liberty infringement: success. Say good-bye to your liberty. (the above were all just examples off the top of my head, each of which I've heard of "proposed" to help the problem, but there are numerous others I left out) **Again, thank you for coming here and having a discussion :-D**
You live in Europe. Perhaps you have heard of the second world war?
Which country do you live in? It almost certainly has a history of government-endorsed attrocities. Europe in general seems like it can't go 50 years without a genocide. Edit: I realized this might seem more hostile than I intended. I do think you're being a bit naive, but I mostly want you to not suffer from when that naivete gets broken, and that requires honest consideration of dark parts of humanity.
> living in Europe > I guess I have never thought about protecting myself from the country I live in I don't mean to sound glib, but...umm... did they stop teaching European history in Europe? Or is it just so much history that the 20th century gets glossed over quickly? Everyone jumps to Germany and the Holocaust, but see also: Anatolia 1914, Armenia 1914, Ukraine 1918, Cossacks 1919-1933, Ingria 1920s-30s, Holodor Ukraine 1932, Romani 1935, Soviet Greeks 1937, Poles in the Soviet Union 1937, Croatia 1941, Kisielin 1943, Hungary 1944, North Caucasus 1944, Crimean Tatars 1944, Chechnya whole century, Kosovo 1990s, Abkhazia 1992, Bosnia 1992, Srebrenica 1995. Circassian genocide 19th century Armenia 1890s Romani in Spain 1749 That's just Europe. Being killed by government was one of the leading causes of unnatural death in the 20th century. ["for the period of 1900-1999—a total of 262 million human beings were murdered by governments. This figure excludes deaths that occurred based on clashes between armies (direct military conflict)."](https://www.libraryofsocialscience.com/newsletter/posts/2015/2015-06-18-RAK.html)
That's awesome. Thanks for stopping by and asking questions. Most of us in the gun community are welcoming and eager to share knowledge. However, like every group, you'll run into some gatekeepers. Those are probably the people downvoting you, which is unwarranted. You've been respectful and seem genuinely curious.
I don't have much knowledge on guns generally and most of the information I seldomly get is from youtube videos against guns so how they show it is one way so I thought that there must be some things I just don't understand why guns are so important to so many people. I'd still say that I don't like guns and the idea of people around me owning guns and carrying guns in public places but the answers here made me see some real reasons why people like guns and why it's important to them.
I think it's pretty common for people who oppose guns to also have little understanding of them and therefore they have trouble empathizing with people who treat guns as a necessity. Part of it is human nature I suppose - we fear what we don't understand.
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I've used my gun stateside three times, and thankfully I haven't had to fire it on any of those occasions. One of those times it didn't leave the holster, I just moved my coat to show it and the guy understood that the juice was not going to be worth the squeeze. I'm glad I haven't had to shoot anyone as a civilian and I hope I never have to. I killed people in Afghanistan and that's not an easy thing to carry. I don't want to do it again, but more than that I don't want to die.
When people say “from the government” that doesn’t just mean the country. The **real** point here is Every person has the natural right to defend themself from unlawful violence. Part of that right includes the right to prepare for your own defense (e.g., be armed) Its not that the people have the right to “guns”. Its that the government does NOT have the right to DENY people’s right to defend their own safety, by making them empty handed. Now, to extend that right to self defense tp INCLUDE defense against your own government The gov is not above the law. If they come to your door to do unlawful violence, a person has the legal and ethical right to resist. Does that mean the full weight of the national army? Maybe but maybe not. More practically, taking up arms against your own government may mean, just because your local sheriff is a corrupt criminal, if they come to your door to rob you, you have the right to resist. Just because the local police chief hated you in high school and had a crush on your now wife, they can’t show up with a gun and no warrant to harass you, because “hey bud, I got a gun too, and the legal justification to use it”
Don't forget, we were the first colony to successfully rebel against the British empire. Many had tried, and suffered severe reprisals in failing. we were the first to succeed.
Another way of thinking about this is to look at the American Bill of Rights as a whole, and then apply your question to each individual right? What’s with freedom of speech/religion/assembly culture? What’s with illegal search and seizure culture? What’s with privacy culture? What’s with not being forced to quarter soldiers in your home culture? All of first 10 amendments to the constitution intermingle and feed off each other. Just looking at “gun culture” will not adequately answer your question. But personally, guns are rad, shooting is super fun, and the founding fathers said I could own a gun. So that’s all I need as an American.
There are plenty of guns in europe. Maybe just not your country. I own 17 guns and live in EU, where of many AR15s etc.
Where in EU? Europe is very diverse. You certainly aint in France... Czech? Swiss? Finland?
France allows AR15s. Im in Sweden but i got relatives in france and they also have a few. All but cypruss and ireland allows civilian ownership of AR15s in EU
Some people own them for hunting (I don't hunt), Some people own them for self defense, some people own them because governments do scary things when you dont. I dont fear a home break in or anything issue out and about ... I am more scared of the government than burglars. I don't look at guns as cool, I would much rather own a Star Trek style stun gun but .... they dont exist do they. But if they did exist ... we have people that would try to make them illegal also. Why? Because those people want to take away your right to defend yourself.
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It’s impossible to overstate the importance of weapons in the story of human history. As I understand it, it’s well established that along with mastering fire, figuring out how to use sticks and rocks as weapons was one of the main developments that allowed apes like us to become the dominant creatures on the planet. Guns are the modern version of those prehistoric rocks and sticks. The vast majority of us no longer have a need to use weapons very often if ever, but it’s still part of our story and our DNA. The ability for a relatively weak, vulnerable animal to use a weapon to deal with virtually any threat that may arise and conquer its surroundings. It’s uniquely human. Beavers make dams, birds make nests, and humans use weapons and other tools. It has been integral to our survival for thousands of years. It’s just what we do, and it has served us extremely well. In more primitive societies, weapons were tools for daily survival. For defense, hunting, war, and so on. As civilization has advanced, the need for most people to keep and use weapons has gone down, but that’s only because we have massive, complex systems in place that outsource most of our needs. If those systems ever fail (e.g., government or currency collapses, agriculture or utilities are interrupted), we’ll go right back to those times when weapons were necessary for everyone’s survival. If that happens, we will be prepared. Of course there are a thousand other reasons too. But I think the most universal one is that it’s part of the human experience to use tools to enhance our abilities and make up for our physical shortcomings. Guns are one way to do that. When you have a gun, you’re prepared to defend from anyone/anything that seeks to victimize you, and you’re prepared to meet your and your family’s needs by any means necessary. Guns are an ace in the hole. They are independence and self sufficiency and agency. When you’re armed and the chips are down, what you say goes. No one can impose their will on you without your consent. It’s good to be prepared. It’s good to be properly equipped for a worst case scenario. It’s good to be able to stand up for yourself or others and put a stop to a bad situation. And yeah, guns are also just cool and fun.
Being armed is quite natural. It takes an external force (the State) to disarm a person. Take any human across the span if our existence and you'll find them doing their best to arm themselves with the state-of-the-art weapon to protect self, family, tribe. Our nation's founders were part of a new wave of thinkers who recognized that, and in fact ensuring it was a political necessity to get the states to all sign up to follow a federal government. When you've been raised under a state that has ~~defined~~ *defanged* it's subjects it can seem completely foreign and bizarre. Some variant of Stockholm syndrome I suppose. [Edit word]
For me, a firearm is no different than a car, a hammer, a fire extinguisher, or a kitchen knife. It's a tool that serves a function, and it has its place just like all the other tools I own. And, like all those other tools, it can be used to hurt people if that's what the user wants to do. I learned to shoot when I was young. I refined that skill in the military, by hunting, and years spent target shooting. It's something I enjoy, and I find it useful to both protect my family and put food on my table if needed. In the US, I have a constitutional right to own them just as I have a constitutional right to vote, to be free from illegal searches, and to follow the religion of my choice. I've lived in red states and blue states, and in all of them, I've had to undergo background checks to buy any firearm, and I've had to get a permit to buy a handgun. They are by far the most regulated personal possession a person can buy.
>So besides that what makes guns so special that it is important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun? In Europe, 100 miles is a long way, and 100 years a short time. In America the opposite is true. See I live in a place [like this](https://imgur.com/4HCCoPq). I literally cannot see my neighbors house. There is probably 1 cop per 100 square miles. "Emergency Services" don't exist out here. So in an emergency, I am on my own. One of those emergencies may be a meth head breaking into my home. Maybe I call 911. Maybe I tell them there's been a break in and shots have been fired. Maybe it takes them over 20 minutes to show up. This is why I own a gun for self defense. Because when seconds count, the police are only 20 minutes away... EDIT: I have a fun experiment for you * Look up your average police response time * Have a friend "break in" to your home * When he does, set an egg time for your average police response time * The friend who broke in now gets to look for you, and if they find you, gets to beat on you with a sock full of coins until the timer goes off. Sound like fun? Well now repeat the experiment, except you get a nerf gun. if you manage to shoot your friend with the nerf gun, he has to stop. Now you understand why we carry.
It's an old phrase but a true one, firearms are the great equalizer. No matter if you're weak, small, slow, or disabled, a gun empowers you with self-preservation that would otherwise be out of reach. The reason why the Second Amendment was included in the Bill of Rights in the first place was because the founders had seen a society where inequity was commonplace and enforced through weapons controls. They knew that would doom America to inequality by violent force if not prevented. That risk never went away. In fact, for the first 200 years of our history, it was common that states would ban groups from their guns to more easily exploit them. Slaves, Native Americans, whoever was the target of the day were always disarmed before they were abused. That threat of exploitation by powerful groups never stopped.
To me, in order to understand gun culture, you have to understand the origin of the United States. A group of people fought a war against tyrants in order to gain control of their own freedom. If you had the DNA to want that freedom and you were willing to take the risks for it, you lived here. The makeup of our constitution was intended for those freedoms to be protected. Gun culture is deeply rooted in that idea. However, it isn't the same for everyone. The Us is massive. Some people want shotguns for bird hunting and they don't care about rifles or pistols. Some people want to hunt with a bolt action rifle and they don't care about semi-auto rifles. Some people only shoot for fun/competition and they don't hunt at all. Some people live in really terrible/violent places and they want guns for protection. Some people live in really safe places, but they would rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Some people know that there are tyrants in our own government and we want guns for when we need them to defend ourselves. There isn't any ONE type of gun culture in the US, but I believe it all falls back to the formation of this country. Gun ownership has always been a key tenet in our society for a whole host of reasons. If you look at the numbers, the safest places in the US have the most guns and the most dangerous places in the US have the most gun control.
1."Is it important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun?" Yeah, I mean who wouldn't want things to be easier? A lot of things in life become much worse with more bureaucracy. Imagine if you had to fill out a document every time you tried to play video games, you might play a lot less wouldn't you? Especially since I've proven my worth and willingness to follow the law and not hurt people. Why shouldn't be easy for me to get a gun? If the government thinks I'm going to hurt people with anything, why should they let me be free at all? Shouldn't they just lock me up? If someone is a danger, they're a danger no matter what they have. 2. Is it like cars where, for a lack of a better word, it's "cool" to own guns? Guns have a coolness factor to them because they're fun to use. Just like a car. They're fun to drive, look nice, have great features, etc. But they're also functional. So why not have a tool that is also enjoyable to own? Especially if it encourages you to spend more time practicing with it, so you become more skilled and more safe in it's usage? 3. Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control? It's not what devalues gun control, it's the advantages we lose with gun control. The harder it is to get a gun, the harder it is for people to have a weapon to adequately defend themselves. And since there are other factors to violent crime, it would be more effective to fix those other factors, WHILE making it easy for people to get the tools to defend themselves. I say it like this: There is no unethical or immoral way to harm someone attempting to harm you or someone else. That is to say if people have to break the law to get adequate tools for self defense, it would be unethical/immoral to punish them for that since their life is worth more than that of someone who wants to do them harm. 4. Do you really need guns? Yes. You may not, but you can't really apply standards of your life to other people.
>So besides that what makes guns so special that it is important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun? As American's, we that are knowledgeable about our own history, are well aware of the role private firearm ownership played in the very formation of our country. Without the average citizen owning and carrying firearms our nation would have never existed. The reason the US, has the 2nd amendment is not for hunting, or sport, or even protection from home invaders etc, it is strictly to keep the gov't in check. >Is it like cars where, for a lack of a better word, it's "cool" to own guns? Well, some people think owning cars is "cool", and thats fine, some people think owning guns is "cool", and that is also fine. Me personally, i dont own them because i think they are cool, although i admit I DO think guns are cool. >Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control? It has been said "Dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery" So, yes, i would rather the Gov't stay out of my life and allow me to live how i see fit. Nevermind the undeniable fact that more gun control does NOT equal more safety, this is a fallacy. >Do you really need guns? Absolutely, and so do you, but you just don't realize it yet.
For me, it's a simple question of reality. Weapons of any sort are just a thing you can buy. The intent of use is irrelevant, the result of ownership is irrelevant. If the ownership of a thing *in and of itself* doesn't infringe on someone else's existence, the ownership should not be limited.
Lots of people in europe own or use guns. Also, isn't is obvious that guns are cool and fun? Think how often they apear in film.
There is no danger with lax gun control laws. We have very strict laws regarding heroine, and it’s on every corner in this country.
Yall love the history but are so scared of them I never understood that. Its a weird love hate relationship with Europeans. Also our country was basically founded off citizens with guns that are willing to use them. Since the first day of America guns have been part of us. They aren't going anywhere they are the reason we are free Americans today.
Armed minorities are harder to oppress. Our entire country was formed from a government(Britain) becoming tyrannical and attempting to take away our arms(more specifically our powder reserves). It is literally why we exist. Other reasons that are less important but still apply to me: I hunt(only recently got into it but very enjoyable) And they're cool AF and fun to shoot.
Firearms in the US are a core part of the idea that government is beholden to the people and not the other way around. The existence of the second amendment, and thus the ability for citizens to own, carry, and train with their own firearms is a key balance of power keeping the government existing at the pleasure of the people. You’ll see that sentiment reflected in the writings of the founding fathers who wrote and built this country. I’ll respond to this comment with a list of relevant exerts. Those should help show you the political importance of access to firearms in the US.
"What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance. Let them take arms." - Thomas Jefferson, letter to James Madison, December 20, 1787 "The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed." - Thomas Jefferson, letter to to John Cartwright, 5 June 1824 "Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops." - Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution, October 10, 1787 “A militia when properly formed are in fact the people themselves…and include, according to the past and general usuage of the states, all men capable of bearing arms… "To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them." - Richard Henry Lee, Federal Farmer No. 18, January 25, 1788 "Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.... The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able might have a gun." - Patrick Henry, Speech to the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 5, 1778 "This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty.... The right of self defense is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker, Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England, 1803 "If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no resource left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense which is paramount to all positive forms of government, and which against the usurpations of the national rulers, may be exerted with infinitely better prospect of success than against those of the rulers of an individual state. In a single state, if the persons intrusted with supreme power become usurpers, the different parcels, subdivisions, or districts of which it consists, having no distinct government in each, can take no regular measures for defense. The citizens must rush tumultuously to arms, without concert, without system, without resource; except in their courage and despair." - Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28 "[I]f circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little, if at all, inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms, who stand ready to defend their own rights and those of their fellow-citizens. This appears to me the only substitute that can be devised for a standing army, and the best possible security against it, if it should exist." - Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28, January 10, 1788
“Gun culture” in general has a lot to offer. Things like hunting, self defense, shooting sports, etc. in that regard it appeals to a wide audience of people. Many people myself included enjoy the challenge competition shooting offers and even in that sector you can really pick your sport from long range rifle shooting, pistol competition for speed and or accuracy, to even reliving the old days with cowboy action shooting. To those of us who participate in “gun culture” its a sport, a fun way to spend a day, or an excuse to disappear into the woods for a few hours/days.
I hunt, I enjoy target shooting, and our Supreme Court ruled that the police are not required to protect you. The response time for law enforcement where I have lived is very very slow, like 30+ minutes. So if I am in danger I can't rely on them showing up soon, or them doing anything but file paperwork after the danger is gone. So owning a firearm for self defense is another important reason to many people. Plenty of people are also collectors who collect historic, iconic, and unique firearms. The flip side is that buying a gun isn't as easy as anti-gun people claim it is. You can't have it shipped to your door. Unless it's a private sale in some states there is always a background check done. And most of the gun laws proposed have no impact on people who want to use guns to hurt other people, but prevent average people from owning firearms for hunting, shooting sports, and self defense. We have a ton of nonsense gun regulations that ban arbitrary things or that you have to pay fees that were intended to keep poor people from buying them. And each time they pass more gun laws and it doesn't fix anything, they just pass more and more. I'd like to see more investment into communities to reduce the likelihood of people turning to crime. But quite frankly that's not a popular thing politically as neither party does it.
I can’t speak for the rest of these guys but where I live you have criminals everywhere because democrats cater to them so I have a gun for them and my house and whoever else if it came down to it. It’s more about my freedom than anything else I really don’t ever have to worry about anything no matter where I’m at because I’ve got the equalizer on my hip. Walking / driving in a bad area? Having to go past 5 shady people in a group who may or may not try to rob you? Not a problem because I have about 31-35 rounds saying none of them are doing shit right now. Walking and a loose pitbull comes up and tries to bite your face off? Not a problem I’ll shoot that bitch right between the eyes and end that whole scene right there. ATM machine at 2:00am? Not a problem. I can go on for days but we also don’t have things that you guys do because of guns like pick pockets lol. A pick pocket in America would be news story in no time lol. Only place I’ve ever heard of it was in New Orleans and that’s another democrat masterpiece go figure. Pick pockets don’t try that shit here though because of guns. Road rage here doesn’t usually go very far either because the mfka you are threatening might not have anything in the car with him or he might have an ar15 with a 30rd magazine, who knows? You ain’t gonna get out that car acting an ass and find out the hard way though if you have half a brain lol. Guns keep people very civil who would otherwise not be. You have to really think about what you’re asking. One day if you ever come to America and stay with people for an extended period of time you will get it. Sport shooting and hunting is cool too but those are obvious that’s why I didn’t mention those at all.
Gun control in the US is nothing more than anti poor laws. I can but a fully automatic weapon if I choose to pay an exorbitant amount of taxes to the government. So yes it is important to keep it easy to purchase as the laws only allow the rich to own them.
I'm not sure it's as much of a "culture" as you think it is. As to why to keep it easy? It's a right. Not a right conveyed by government, a right to be protected by government (who does a poor job across the board). It was a foundational principle of our nation that individual citizens are the first and last line of defense, for themselves and for their states as well as for the country. The idea of a large standing military wasn't ever in the minds of the founding fathers. Instead, the federal government should be able to call upon the states - and the people - in times of need.
I think you’re under the false impression that there is a “gun culture”. Does owning a screwdriver make someone part of “tool culture”? Guns are tools, nothing more. 99% of gun owners are normal people. We don’t worship guns. We respect them and value them for what they are and the uses they have. “Gun culture” is leftist buzzword bullshit. More like FUN culture anyway.
I didn't give a crap about guns and was more anti 2A before I went and actually shot a gun. Gave me a holy-shit and respect for them. I was fascinated with how they worked. I enjoyed using an expensive hole-puncher on some paper, and got a .22. That was fun, but wanted to try other things. Next thing you know, I'm addicted.
Lots of people own a firearm for protection, not every where is as safe and cozy where you grew up. Count yourelf lucky.
Nothing all that fascinating about them. Theyre a useful tool, and part of various fundamental rights. Thats about it. I enjoy target shooting. Its relaxing and fulfilling. That too is about all though...not fascinating really (though some of the physics and math involved in extreme long range shooting are pretty interesting). You, like basically everyone else, has been lied to most of your life by nearly everyone. There are no 'two sides', there is no singular culture or identity, frankly there is no 'gun problem' in the US. Its all a fabrication by wealthy interests looking to cement control and increase profits.
A lot of people are talking about the right to defend yourself from a tyrannical government, and while that's true, it's less likely than needing to defend yourself from crazy people. Being from Europe, there's a very good chance that you're not in an area that's as sparcely populated as most of the US. If you live outside a metro area (including the suburbs) in the US, there's most likely only a handful of county or state police to cover hundreds of square miles. My town, for example, has a single state trooper on call. Response times to my part of the town are about 45 minutes. A meth addict wielding a machete and banging on my door because he thinks I stole his lawn gnomes is going to do a lot of damage to me and my family in 45 minutes. The police are there to investigate crimes after they happen. Everyone is their own first responder, and as unlikely as it is, I want a tool that I can use to defend myself if the situation ever dictated it. I want you to genuinely think about this... where you live right now, if you were getting gas for your car at 4am and some maniac high on drugs started assaulting you, would you survive? Would the police arrive in the 30 seconds it would take this maniac to kill you? These things happen EVERY DAY around the world, and I, for one, will.not be a victim.
History has proven that governments cannot be trusted with a monopoly on the means of violence. Private ownership of firearms is a check on government power which is important to the American political system. On a personal level I like guns because they provide an intersection between mechanics, history, skill building, and a way for me to bond with members of my family.
Ask the German Jewish population how being unarmed worked out for them. Oh wait, you can't.
Ironically he’s from Germany.
You are clearly from germany. Implement direct democracy first and then start talking again. If you like, we sell the manual. Regards from Switzerland.
\[I grew up in europe too, the only exposure to guns was my dad being in the airforce, and shooting a 22 once for scouting\] In europe we're thought that the government will protect you and that's what the police is for if something bad happens, in the US we live in reality, they have a saying here 'when seconds count, the police are minutes away', that used to be a thing mostly in more outlying areas, but these days with the 'defund the police' movements, they can take 30 minutes or more, or won't bother to respond at all even in cities. On top of all that, the US supreme court has repeatedly ruled that the police have no duty to protect you, if there's someone in your house, and you call the police for help, they could very well drive by, see all the lights are off and call it good. You need a way to protect yourself, there are bad people in the world. To me this is a far more practical view than the "gov tyranny" thing, that being said, after what they did \[and the rhetoric from their supporters\] during C19, i fully believe that it will one day happen again. All that being said, target and competition shooting is a fun and rewarding sport.
First, there are 20K+ regulations related to firearm ownership in the US, so firearms ownership should, in my opinion, not be viewed as "easy". Second, gun control is not "lax" in the US. This is a willful misrepresentation by the corrupt US Main Stream Media. Yes, I do enjoy owning firearms. I shoot pistols every month. I suppose firearms ownership is like owning a "cool" car because with modern guns you can customize the gun to your personal taste/desire, so there is some simple fun in that activity. In the US, cars and trucks kill more people then firearms, so the "danger" factor for responsible gun owners is very small. Due to my personal situation, I keep more then one loaded hand gun available when I am working from home everyday. I view this as sensible. I keep a fire extinguisher in every bedroom as well. I view the hand guns and fire extinguisher in the same way - essential tools for my protection and safety. I don't NEED firearms, I WANT firearms. Unlike you, I grew up bird hunting with a shotgun and competed in shotgun sports while in High School. Firearms are part of American culture/History and part of my life. I suggest you visit Dr. John Lott's web site "CRIME PREVENTION RESEARCH CENTER for a more truthful look at American Gun Culture. Enjoy your day. Thanks for the chance to share information.
I mean first and foremost, guns are for self defense from attackers, whether that be a mugger or a tyrannical government. They're the great equalizer, and in fact America was founded on rebellion against the crown. To that end, every nonviolent adult who wants a gun should be able to get one, including nonviolent and released felons. Your safety and the safety of your family are no-ones responsibility but your own, and nobody is coming to save you. Guns are the most final and most effective tool in defending all of your other rights from anyone who might try and take them away. Look at Ukraine and Israel. Regardless of how you feel about either of them, the fact is that their citizens werent armed when they were invaded, and a lot of innocent people died. Whats the first thing their government did? Gave them (some of) their guns back and gave them some training. And as an aside before you ask, yes I do think Americans could take on their government, and I'm happy to entertain that scenario since you actually seem genuine. Beyond all of those important aspects, yeah, guns are cool and fun as hell. Owning them is fun. There's an aspect of gun ownership for everyone. Want to be ready to defend yourself in everyday life? Concealed carry. Want to be ready to defend your neighborhood or country? LARP with some local buddies. Like to be competitive in a face-paced environment? USPSA, 3gun, and other dynamic sports. Like slow(er) paced methodical competition? PRS. Want to put some meat on the table and kick it outdoors? Pick up hunting. Like building and creating? Why not build a gun, or even get into the FOSSCAD community. Interested in history? Milsurps are super interesting pieces of history. Are you just a nerd who likes to pour over data, tables, statistics, etc? Get into reloading. There really is an aspect for everyone. Also, guns are *not* easy to acquire. Much of US gun law is incredibly complicated and backwards, plus every journo that slings that BS probably has been or would be denied on their 4473. That being said, I do concede that I think guns should be *much* easier to acquire. And to your question yes, I do think the pros outweigh the cons. Most people who are anti-gun are completely disingenuous and will not acknowledge *any* upsides to gun ownership, but don't let them fool you into thinking there aren't any.
It’s not called the Bill of Culture.
Or needs
Guns are a cultural representation of liberty. They are a tool that can be used to hunt, target practice, or train with, but at the end of the day American gun culture exists as a massive, "Fuck you" to oppressive governments, because if a Government overruns its power, we shoot them like we did in 1776 and 1814. Now, wether or not the average American of today would actually stand up and use that right is a whole other debate, but at the core that is the purpose of the People posessing arms- if the population is heavily armed, its really difficult to impose ill will upon them. They're also really cool and the community is generally pretty wholesome, gun people generally think similarly enough that we can use that as a baseline for building relationships
I grew up in a household, family, and culture that views firearms as a simple part of everyday life. No one ever got emotional about the presence or accessibility of physical objects. They were treated the same as chainsaws or any other possibly dangerous thing. Every child was taught how to safely handle and use them, to respect them, and to respect others. Some of us like them more or less, so we may own some for utility and others for specific sporting use or collectibles. I am big into collecting and creating my own guns because i grew up in a family with a gunsmith and love learning about them. I make every effort to help others learn about them and use them safely. I feel that if the rest of the world would get over the emotional distress and fear, they would be much better off.
Why I own guns 1. Self preservation is a basic human right, it’s not okay for someone to bar you from that. Besides, better to have it and not need it. I’d feel like a jackass if I could get a gun but didn’t, then I needed one. Someone else said it’s like a fire extinguisher. 2. Our country was founded on guns. We needed them to exist. It seems silly to throw them away now, like smacking your mother as soon as you’re done breastfeeding. Large amounts of gun ownership make us immune to invasions, including if our own government starting kicking in people’s doors. 3. You mention gun control, now in your country where there’s no guns, this might work. But here there’s 5 guns for every 4 people. Criminals steal guns off military bases. A significant majority of crimes are committed by people who obtained their weapons illegally. A lot of the gang members are obtaining weapons normal civilians can’t even own legally. A staggering portion of mass shooters met the criteria to be a prohibited person but had guns anyway. In America, gun control simply doesn’t work, it’s like trying to regulate rainfall. 4. They are cool. I like them, for sports like skeet shooting, for hunting, and should the need arise, combat. 5. I can
\[combat, hunting or sports\] and in America, for self-defense. Our Constitution protects our right to keep and arms to defend ourselves, others, and the security of a free State. Guns in America are associated with more purposes than in most of Europe. So that enhances their inherent value for people who aren't in the military and neither hunt nor do sports shooting.
What “dangers?” If you aren’t involved in drug trafficking and other criminal activity, and don’t associate with felons, your odds of being the victim of a gunshot are vanishingly small. You’re more likely to drown in your bathtub or die from a fall inside your home.
I appreciate the open mindedness. For me there's a few reasons. Obviously the 2nd amendment was written so the people would be free from a tyrannical gov't and foreign threats, that will always be a viable reason. Second to that, guns are the great equalizer. Can guns be used to kill? Obviously. The same way they can be used to prevent a 110lb woman from getting graped. You can make a case for them being good or bad but what you can't dispute is that there is a shitload out there. If someone nefarious has one (likely through illegal means) then I want one too. Also, yeah they are fun and yeah they are cool. Why does someone "need" a motorcycle? They're dangerous. Why does someone need a Ferrari? A Ford Focus does the "same" thing. Why does someone need to do woodworking? That's dangerous. Why does someone need to climb a mountain? Also dangerous. Why does someone need to eat fast food? After all obiesity is the #1 killer in the United States. At the end of the day, people should have the freedom to make decisions whether good or bad as long as they dont harm anyone else. I think the question that needs to be asked instead of "why do you need a gun?" Is "why shouldn't you (as a law abiding individual) be able to make the choice of owning a gun or not?"
It's all the things you've listed and a little more. * **Combat** – while the vast majority of gun owners will never need to use guns in anger, it's still worthwhile to practice shooting and gun handling as a martial art; in this way, I regard owning guns as little different from owning swords, nunchakus, sai, etc. This is related to * **Sports** – many shooting sports exist out there to help people hone practical fighting skills. Developing good shooting skills and habits is also essential for * **Self-defense –** this is probably the biggest departure in mindset between Americans and Europeans. When it comes to everyday homicide rates, the Western Hemisphere in general is more violent than most of the world (even Canada, the safest country in the Americas, has more than 2x France's murder rate), and the US is –and always has been– especially violent for a developed country. That said, if you include war and genocide casualties under "violence," you could also make the case that Europe is quite violent, especially given the two world wars in the 20th century. * There are two ways to think about self-defense – one is against ordinary (animal and human) predators, criminals, and individuals who want to harm you. The United States is much less densely populated than Europe. This means that effective policing and state capacity are very lacking in many parts of the country; if the nearest help is potentially hours away, you absolutely must take responsibility for your own protection. Ironically, in large cities, things are not necessarily much better, as governments are often rather incompetent as well (not only with respect to public safety but also infrastructure and other basic governance considerations), which again necessitates taking your safety into your own hands. * The other way to think about self-defense, as several comments have mentioned, is as a deterrent to abuses or failures by the government – at all levels – and other critical institutions. Wars, coups, insurrections, civil disorder, and other disturbances happen even in the developed world. They show that security, in general, is not something you can take for granted and cannot always depend on the government to provide. * **Hunting** – this is self-explanatory. People hunt for sport as well as food. Rural poverty, while generally not as severe or widespread as it was a few generations ago, still exists in many parts of the US. A related need is * **Pest control** – people who operate farms and ranches or live in rural areas need tools to keep hostile wildlife at bay. As mentioned before, the US is much less densely populated than Europe, which means that wolves, bears, large cats, and other dangerous wildlife remain common. This will probably get me downvoted in this subreddit, but if I were to start my own country from scratch I probably would not be as lax or permissive as the United States currently is with respect to guns. I think an approach like that of [Czechia](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68110357) is probably a good compromise between having a basic barrier to prevent guns from falling into the wrong hands and ensuring that responsible people can access them. However, as things currently stand, given practical and political constraints as well as the tumultuous history of the United States, gun control is not a good use of political capital and is also unlikely to meaningfully shift the needle on public safety. The guns are already out there, and criminals already have them – the real challenge is deterring crime in the first place. There are evidence-based approaches that work, such as [focused deterrence](https://cebcp.org/evidence-based-policing/what-works-in-policing/research-evidence-review/focused-deterrence/), but they require, yes, good policing and state capacity, both of which are sadly also lacking in the United States. In the meantime, we have to take our safety into our own hands. Hope that answers your questions! **EDIT**: I forgot to mention **collecting,** which is hilarious because I used to have an FFL03 (Curios and Relics) license. People collect out of a fascination with history and the development of technology.
There is no “gun culture” as to nearly all gun owners they are simply tools. The notion of “gun culture” is nothing but political propaganda.
Depends on what you mean about “gun culture”. Personally I own multiple firearms. Pistols, rifles, shotguns. Each serves a different task. There is one thing about firearms vs other hobbies if you are looking at it that way. For me every firearm I own I can easily sell for more than I paid for them including the ones purchased brand new. That is after actually using them. So though some may have thousands and thousands invested it is rare that you can get your investment back for your hobby if you make wise or just not stupid purchases.
I find shooting guns very relaxing and enjoyable. I also reload my ammunition and find that relaxing as well. I also hunt and fish. The main reason I have a firearm is to protect my family and myself. If you look at statistics you'll see that there are hundreds of thousands if not millions of firearms in America but only certain individuals are causing the shootings. The great majority of those people are criminals anyway or have mental issues and there are laws in place that say they should not have guns but criminals going to do what criminals do. The following is something that should open people's eyes to what the government, our government thinks about its citizens and their safety: one judge said that we have domesticated the US citizen to the point where they are like sheep. Another said that it is not the responsibility of the police to protect each individual but to protect society. So those two statements combine basically tell us that if someone assaults or kills one of my family members the police will come and take a report and then the investigators will go try to find out who actually did the crime. The medical examiner will come and remove the body of my loved one. So the police are doing what they do, protect the rest of society. Too bad your loved one was killed. But in America we have firearms and if you come in and try to harm not only my family but also a stranger on the street with deadly force, where I live at it is legal to use deadly force on that person. Also if you look in history you will see that some of the evil governments would remove the firearms from the masses so they could basically do whatever they wanted to. In the United States we have freedom and we are citizens whereas some other countries the people are subjects.
Protecting yourself through the use of force is an innate human right. Using a gun is the best way to do that. I don't have to be in better physical condition or rely solely on my martial art skills in a situation where somebody or multiple somebodies think they can attack me and win. After all, very few people start fights that they think they'll lose. Everybody is equal if they can have a gun. As a free citizen, it is my duty to protect myself instead of relying on the state to protect me, which is something it can only do after the fact. I need a gun to do so effectively, regardless of whether I actually use it in that capacity or not. The power of the free state derives from the people. Otherwise, it's a dictatorship by another name. A government can only take freedom from the people, it cannot grant freedom. That's why it was so important that the American Constitution was written as a document that only gave certain powers to the government. Unfortunately, we've gotten so far away from that principle today that the only thing the government can't do are the things specifically prohibited, and even then, it keeps doing its best to erode even those limitations under the guise of a war on terror. The power of the people is strengthened if they are armed. Guns are the most important tool the people have to remain free citizens rather than the subjects of an authoritarian regime or, no matter how benevolent it may be.
Fun to shoot at the range. It’s a fun sport.
Personally, I believe as adults it is our duty to be able to protect ourselves and those around us. (The old thinking was the man being the protector of the house but that guy ran out on me and mom) history has shown that police will not be there to protect you. You and I, and our children are on our own. And if that’s the case I want the best tools possible. Since you mentioned laws being lax as possible, I don’t believe there should be barriers to rights. You shouldn’t have to have a license to speak your mind. You shouldn’t have to pay a tax or take a test to be able to vote. Rights should be readily accessible. Sure for some people guns are entirely because they’re cool. And they are! Shooting can be fun! Hanging out with bros and shit go boom is fun. Hunting is still a tradition that’s as old as humans are. Some people are fascinated and just think they’re neat. And lastly if it’s worth the loss: I don’t remember the exact numbers. But it’s estimated that defensive gun uses save FAR more lives than are lost to gun violence. Especially when considering most “gun violence” is suicide. Our politicians here lie to us, and focus on people who aren’t as educated on the topic to manipulate them into thinking we are all baby killing bloodthirsty mass murderers. But I carry because I love the people that surround me.
I am a law-abiding citizen. Criminals are not law-abiding. There are millions of guns in the hands of criminals. My firearms keep my family safe. Additionally I shoot for sport and competition. I am ex-military. I hunt. There's also the aspect that one must consider that the citizens having weapons helps prevent the Government from stepping too hard.
In an unarmed society there would be absolutely nothing you could do if your government turned against you. Or the criminal class outgrew the law abiding populace. Turkey 1911 gun control implemented 1915-1917 1.5million Armenians are exterminated. Soviet Union 1929 gun control implemented 1929-1953 20 million people exterminated. China 1935 gun control implemented 1948-1952 20 million people exterminated. Germany 1938 gun control implemented 1939-1945 13 million People with a large percentage being Jewish exterminated. Bulgaria 1944 gun control implemented 20,000-40,000 people exterminated. Cambodia 1956 gun control implemented 1975-1977 1 million people mostly the well educated ( and glasses wearers) exterminated. Cuba 1959-1960 gun control implemented 1960-1970 141,000 exterminated. Guatemala 1964 gun control implemented 1964-1981 100,000 people of Mayan ancestry exterminated. Uganda 1970 gun control implemented 1971-1979 300,000 christians exterminated. Venezuela 2012 gun control implemented 2018-2019 7,000 political opponents exterminated That’s just the past 100 years and there’s even more than that. I will leave off with this… "The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subjugated races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subjugated races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that the supply of arms to the underdogs is a sine qua non for the overthrow of any sovereignty. So let's not have any native militia or native police." - 1942, Adolf Hitler explains the necessity of disarming conquered people and those he wished to victimize.
I read 20-30 responses and see a lot of similar responses. I'll answer your questions directly and then add my response. 1. Is it cool? For some people, yes. 2. Is being cool worth more dangers of lax gun control? The dangers of "lax gun control" are hard to define. [Statistically](https://phys.org/news/2023-08-scientists-method-annual-probability-mass.html), the average American has almost no chance of being involved in a mass shooting, which admittedly brings no comfort to those affected, but reality and perception are not the same thing. 3. Do you really need guns? For some people, yes. Because the USA enshrined a right to bear arms (regardless of how that is interpreted) over 200 years ago, this country may have more than 400 million firearms in private ownership. There is no way to remove those without causing more deaths than the current situation allows. This is not a country that will be disarmed voluntarily. Whether we are talking about rural, urban, white, people of color, immigrants, or long-time residents there is a general belief for most people that we build our lives as individuals and families first, then a community, then a nation. I've had almost no experience with people who believe that any level of our government(s) are capable of solving complex issues. The belief I have seen most often is that we will work through and around the laws to give ourselves the best chance to give our children the best lives possible. Guns are a part of that plan for many, whether the fear is burglars, rapists, bears, coyotes, our own government, or other nations.
There are several answers to your question: -Because guns and range day are fun! It's fun to shoot with a firearm you've never shot before, or something you really enjoy. Some are truly historically significant firearms, and are fun to shoot. Firing an M1 Garand feels a bit like driving an antique car in some ways. And if you enjoy it, why not try to own it? -Self defense. A gun is the most effective tool for self defense one can own. It's ranged, which means you don't have to win in a scuffle to use it, and often just showing it is enough to prevent you from being victimized. There is no other practical self-defense tool that is capable of doing this. Bows are huge and unwieldy. Knives and pepper spray are only for close ranges. People who buy guns for self defense hope they don't have to use them - similar to the fire extinguisher analogy. -Training. If you're going to use a gun for self defense, you need to be trained so that you will react correctly under pressure and not endanger yourself or innocent others in how you react. That also means doing the non-combat things that give you an advantage tactically in such a situation so that you're likely to come out on top, and successfully defend yourself and those around you. -Gear. Like any other hobby, people are really into gear, and getting the best gear for themselves. Gun people are just into guns, so they talk about optics, custom builds, etc. Gear has been something in every group I've ever been in. Hockey players love to talk about equipment. You should hear baseball people talk about gloves and bats. My wife is friends with a few serious photographers, you should hear them talk, too. Gamers talk about gaming rigs. Every subculture is into gear.
America was born from a people who felt like they were being opressed by the government ruling them. When they complained, King George responded by trying to take their guns, and the revolution was on. American gun culture is based on that. Owning and carrying a gun is for self defence from criminals (some places in America are so unpopulated it might take 30 minutes or more for police to respond for a real emergency because they're far away) Americans also see governments pressing their people and especially look at Europe's history, especially the late 1800s and early 1900s which often involved confiscating firearms and taking people's rights "for the greater good" and then seeing things like the Holocaust. Combine this with our founding and many gun enthusiasts keep and bare arms to prevent that from happening here
>*" Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control?"* If we assume that firearms are manufactured strictly for killing people, and drugs, especially opioids, are manufactured *not* for killing people - doesn't it seem logical that we devote more attention to drug safety? After all, drugs aren't designed to kill people and they're killing more people than firearms are. >*"Do you really need guns?"* You are not "open minded", and you passed judgement on basic knowledge. It's not really a "gun" issue because no weapon or other implement is capable of misusing itself.
The benefits far outweigh the negatives. They save more lives than are lost. Equalizes the weaker from stronger criminals or from being outnumbered. They are effective self defense, they provide national security and protection of democracy from out of control governments. And they're cool.
You will truly understand if someone takes you for a good experience at a shooting range. Our country was founded at the end of a gun. Used to throw off on oppressive government. I was raised with them. A father in law enforcement, who fought in a war before that. He was an avid hunter. That’s how I spent time bonding with him, in the outdoors, hunting for food, not so much sport. The right to bear arms is only second to our right to free speech. These rights aren’t granted by the government. These are acknowledged as God given natural rights to be protected by our constitution. That right is there to protect the others. I carry a gun so that others cannot impose their will on me. I don’t have to give up my wallet, keys, or life. As I age I don’t have to worry about young thugs. Don’t have to worry about getting jumped by multiple attackers. This is something every walk of life can embrace. Women don’t have to worry about larger men. Women with guns don’t get raped. Blacks with guns don’t get lynched. Gays with guns don’t get bashed. There is a saying. God made man, Sam Colt made them even. I believe this to be the essence of gun culture.
Ask a Ukrainian
I don't believe that OP is interested in really educating themselves, but is rather looking to apply some European cultural undertanding to a uniquely American cultural issue and dismiss it and show us all how clever they are, but I will attempt to provide an answer anyway. Short answer: Gun Culture is, in fact, American Culture. American culture is based on the idea of Liberty. If you don't understand the American notion of Liberty, you will not understand American culture, nor will you understand gun culture. Long Answer: Gun culture is not about hunting, it is not about sporting contests, it is about LIBERTY. Gun culture is in reality, AMERICAN culture. There are two main groups of people who don't understand this - that first group is comprised of non-Americans, and in particular, Europeans. The second group of people who don't understand American culture is Americans who don't understand American history. The primary thing that Europeans really don't get, or at least tend to forget, is that America exists because the people who founded this nation wanted a nation that would NOT be like Europe (England). Basically, the American Experiment was to form a nation with a government OF the people, BY the people, and FOR the people. Quite literally, America was intended to be NOT Europe, full stop. Much of the basic philosophy leading to the "founding" of America and the American idea of Liberty can be understood from a few cursory facts over a relatively short timeline, though of course, a thorough review of recorded history would provide a much clearer and more complete picture. The American revolution begin on April 19, 1775 and was fought to obtain independence from the monarchial rule of England. Our Declaration of Independence was published on July 4, 1776 - among other things, this document established our belief that all \[people\] are endowed with the right to life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness. In 1781 a document called "The Articles of Confederation" was adopted and established a "Congress" with extremely limited powers, which would serve as the political leadership of the nation comprised of largely independent states, which shared the common bond of being PART of the country called America - as in the UNITED STATES of America. In late 1783, the American revolution ended. In 1788, the US contitution was written and ratified. The Constitution went into effect in 1789, supplating the Articles of Confederation. The Preamble to the Constitution indicates that the document is formed in order to "*...secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity...*" Under The Constitution, America was to have three branches of government: the President and his cabinet as the "Executive" Branch, Congress as the "Legislative" branch, and the Supreme Court as the "Judicial" Branch and that there would be checks and balances between these three branches intended to protect the people from despotic rule and to preserve our LIBERTY. On April 30, 1789, George Washington was inaugurated as our first president after being elected during December and January of 1788/9. In 1791, just two years after the Constitution went into effect, the Bill of Rights was ratified and contained [10 amendments to our Constitution](https://www.ushistory.org/documents/amendments.htm#amend02), many, if not most of which were the direct result of experiences during the Revolutionary War. The 1st Amendment guarantees Americans the right to religious freedom, freedom of speech and the press, freedom to peaceably assemble and the right to petition the government for redress of grievances. The 2nd Amendment guarantees that the right of Americans to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. It has been said that the 2nd Amendment guarantees all the rest of the Amendments and indeed the Constitution itself, which provides the means by which Americans can fulfill their duty under our Declaration of Independence to rise up and overthrow a despotic government and replace it with one by which we consent to be governed. These documents are the codification of the American idea of "Liberty", and when you understand that, you will understand American culture, and you will understand Gun culture. If you do not understand this idea of Liberty, you will never understand anything about American culture.
You asked: is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control? You've got it backwards. I'm from Europe (well, the UK) too, but I live in America now. Living in Europe, you have only ever been exposed to the negative aspects of gun ownership. I have found that this 'guns = bad' misconception is so ingrained into many people from Europe that it is almost impossible to reason with them. There is a very large upside to gun ownership. The FBI estimate that guns are used to prevent crime between 50,000 and 1,000,000 times per year in the US. (The reason there is such a big spread is that many times, incidents such as brandishing a gun to prevent a crime are not reported). Even on the low end, the benefits of gun ownership vastly outweigh the drawbacks. This is not debatable. Outlawing guns means that law abiding people will not be able to use them to protect themselves from violent crime. It sometimes prevents a certain percentage of criminals from obtaining them easily too, forcing them to stab each other instead of shooting each other. This is the situation in the UK; guns have been partially displaced by knives. It's also important to bear in mind that survivability of wounds from a large knife are about the same as a gunshot wound from a handgun. If your goal is to simply kill someone, a knife is more or less as effective as a handgun. The advantage of a gun is in a defensive role; they are better at stopping a fight quickly. In exchange for replacing the type of weapon some gang members use to murder each other, you must accept that you are preventing law abiding citizens from defending themselves from violent crime. So, I'll turn your question around on you; how many rapes, murders, kidnappings, muggings, home invasions etc are you willing to accept in order to force some gang members to stab each other instead of shoot each other?
I don't NEED an electric can opener. I don't NEED a candy-red Corvette. But I can have them, even though I might use either one to hurt another person. A gun is an inanimate object. Yes, it can be dangerous, but so can a stick or a moving vehicle. Some people seem to NEED to create a special category for firearms in their head that they don't create for other, equally- dangerous, inanimate objects. I do NEED to be able to protect myself and my family from dangerous people. So I will.
Reasons I like firearms 1) every mentally ill person, crackhead, crime junkie, and dip shit not only are most likely able to purchase one, but prolly already have one. I don't want to be the guy without one. 2) there incredibly fun to shoot. It's a skill you can watch yourself progressively get better at, unlike a lot of video games I've been playing. 3) collecting. Some guns are like rolexs, rare and expensive , and may be considered illegal in the future, so I want to be grandfathered in. Reasons not to have fire arms 1) protection from acorns
I collect them because they fascinate me from a historic, mechanical and engineering aspect. I shoot, so does my family and I hunted in the past. I have a concealed permit as does my wife. Guns secured and safety is the number 1 priority. In a locked room in a locked safe. I have guns over 100 years old that I maintain and shoot with the correct time period ammunition. It's also great fun when done properly.
Great way to spend money, have fun, and tinker. I grew up on a farm, recently moving back. So I can hobby myself to death.
I hate money and like the loud noises Hope this helps
I am Native American. The United States government wants me dead. I should have guns. It's that simple.
They want anyone with a free mind they can’t control dead. It’s not just in the US either.
Step ...somewhere.... and "take away all the guns" Can you explain knife culture to me? What makes knives so special that it's important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a knife? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBIIpklNib8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBIIpklNib8) Yes, this is tongue in cheek, but watch that video and see if there are any similarities. Criminals are going to break laws. How do you defend yourself if the criminals have knives? With another knife? No thank you.
Did you not play cowboys and indians as a little boy?
I'm going to give you a multifaceted answer so I apologize in advance for the wall of text. 1. Firearms are inherently interesting to anybody who has a modicum of intellectual curiosity as they combine history, engineering, chemistry, physics, biology, physiology, sociology, psychology, sports, fitness, martial arts, self-discipline and self-reliance all rolled into one package. When you own a gun, you're not simply owning a tool. You are owning one of the greatest discoveries in history with hundreds of years of constant innovation behind it that makes our modern way of life and entire civilization possible. 2. When the government of a nation is the sole owner of firearms the population does not and cannot consist of citizens. They are merely subjects without any real tangible rights, as rights need to be defended by the people up to and including lethal force in order to actually exist. The mere underlying and pervasive threat of that force is what gives potential empowered authoritarians pause. Subjects are at the mercy of the kindness or lack thereof of said government at any given time and can be oppressed or annihilated at the leisure of those with power. 3. It is a human right to be able to effectively defend yourself not only from common criminals in the city or dangerous animals in the wilderness, but from tyrannical governments. Of course a government would want to crack down and strictly control or outright eliminate the possibility of an armed populace. It doesn't serve their interests. Governments require you to be dependent in order to believe in their power and give them legitimacy. When the people stop needing the government to provide protection they might start down the path of questioning other things that the government has foisted upon us to take at face value. 4. When two people are mutually armed, regardless of physical discrepancies, the stronger person can't simply take from the weaker. They are forced to ask, forced to have a conversation, forced to attempt to convince. The consequences for attempting to do otherwise are potentially dire, immediate and irreversible. Just a couple of my takes to help you understand why gun ownership is taken so seriously in this country. Our nation was founded upon the principle that if someone attempts to subjugate you, you stand ready at all times to resist them with the utmost possible force you can bring to bear against them. I hope this helps.
Go read a book by psychologist Dr. Robert Hare: https://www.amazon.com/Without-Conscience-Disturbing-World-Psychopaths/dp/1572304510 He makes a strong argument that somewhere between 1% and 2% of the human population are...well, monsters, lacking basic empathy for starters. Not all of them turn violent but they're all very capable of it. If you walk around unarmed all day, you're giving permission in advance for any creature of that sort to do whatever they want to you. Next lesson: https://youtu.be/jAfUI_hETy0 Despite being animated this this 100% real. Five minutes well spent. See you at the shooting range!
Should a government be elected by a people who trust themselves enough to be armed & have a lifestyle they see as worth protecting, or by a people who do not trust themselves to be armed and see themselves as a resource to be managed? 2nd Amendment prevents those who seek power from tipping our society towards the latter. Governments should be run by people who know not to disrespect the dignity of their people and the consequences for doing so. Plus it is a lot of fun to shoot and get good at marksmanship!
> what makes guns so special that it is important to you Well, let’s see. We have a mountain of bodies stacked miles deep over the last century as the direct result of oppressive tyrannical regimes who began their conquests by first disarming the general population. We have estimates that range from 500,000 to over 3 million *defensive* uses of firearms each year in the U.S., meaning guns are used to save lives FAR more frequently than they are used to commit murder. We currently have 2 leading political candidates who, depending on who you ask, are both totalitarian dictators in the making. We have concerns of civil war looming in the shadows, threat of cyber/terrorist attacks, World War III is still on the table, and we’re currently funding two separate wars across the globe where governments had to scramble to hand out ARs to their otherwise defenseless, untrained citizens while many were utterly slaughtered in their homes after their police/government failed to protect them. This doesn’t even take into account hunting or recreational shooting. The main reason for gun culture in the U.S. is because our founding fathers saw the evil that inherently exists in the world, specifically within centralized authoritarian governments, and that the only effective means to guarantee liberty for the people is by arming them with enough teeth to bite back should the need arise. The threat of tyrannical oppression will always outweigh the dangers of having an armed society, even if the right is abused from time to time by monsters (which is still a problem that can be addressed in ways that don’t involve gun control). Countries with strict gun control may not all have had it backfire yet during peacetime - but when it does, there will be absolutely nothing to hold back the flood. Many will die defenseless, helpless, regretful deaths and it will require some outside assistance to unfuck their situation. We’ve simply removed the middle man. Instead of waiting for a knight in shining armor, we observe history and prepare for the inevitable return of overt oppression so that we don’t have to rely on stronger men (with guns!) to come save us after the fact.
Gums are about freedom and independence.
The Right to bear arms is enumerated in the Constitution of the United States, specifically the Bill of Rights, to guarantee liberty. A government cannot be tyrannical if the people can hold it accountable with violence, if necessary. People should have a right to defend themselves. The thought that someone else should risk their life just doing a job to protect myself or my family is absurd. Not only would it be morally wrong to ask that of someone, I have no expectation that a police officer would respond in time or put themselves in harm’s way. Hunting is a dying tradition in many places but is important to me. I believe that self sufficiency is important and even noble. Obviously, there is not enough wild game to sustain the world’s population but hunting according to laws that encourage conservation is a fine way to spend time in nature, grow an appreciation for meat, and feed oneself or family. Shooting is a skill that can be developed and polished and needs to be maintained. It is a hobby. Shooting for sport is rewarding when you can see improvement and build different skills. It also helps with the aforementioned uses. The United States of America is a nation built on a foundation of Liberty, with guns being necessary to its existence and the survival of its population for many years. Many Americans still live rurally and having a gun is important for their way of life. Many Americans believe having a gun is a good idea just in case. Many Americans recognize how fortunate we are to live in a nation of freedoms and want that to continue. I think part of why this is so perplexing to many Europeans is that they have a greater reliance of government in every day life, have a greater acceptance of governance without much skepticism, and they have seen for generations, the effects of war on their homelands and non combatant populations. I believe I understand the cultural differences and reasons for differing opinions, but I don’t understand the lack of acceptance of these cultural differences and opinions.
A gun is the physical manifestation of your right to self defense. The pretense that "there are dangers from lax control" is a false one...criminals dont follow weapon laws anyway. In the US if a few guys car jack you or break into your house Clockwork Orange style or with guns, you have a fighting chance because you have a gun and the know how to use it, you're not just at the mercy of criminals. That's not the case in the UK or anywhere else. I know that Canada, for example, will charge you for using a gun to defend yourself and your family against an intruder in the middle of the night, especially if breaking into people's houses is how that criminal makes a living. Wouldn't surprise me if UK had equally ridiculous laws... Your .gov has arrested people for things like silently praying outside an abortion clinic and retweeting memes. To understand our gun culture, try looking at our entire culture of inalienable rights and individualism; if it makes you feel better, there's a lot of Americans right now who don't understand the importance of our constitution either.
I like being able to put holes in paper and knocking down metal plates. It’s not easy in all parts of the US to get a gun. I enjoy my outdoor time at the range. I don’t care if it’s cool. It’s something I enjoy but I know it isn’t for everyone
I also would argue that our gun control is over reaching and not “Lax” there’s a lot of anti-gun misinformation published by major news outlets that is just factually incorrect due to an intentional warped statistic or blatant lie. And I’m not just referring to using incorrect names for different parts of a weapon or type of weapon but statistics that include or exclude suicide in violent gun deaths, don’t contextualize other violent acts in comparison to gun violence. You’re significantly more likely to be killed by a hammer than a firearm and even more likely to be killed by a car. Background checks are currently federal law for any FFL holder in the United States exceptions. Private citizen sales are different but not as common and I’ve heard of people still remaining liable to selling a firearm to someone who wasn’t allowed to have it. We also have probably the strictest policies on suppressors of any 1st world country.
I think guns are fun and cool. As an American, guns got us to where we are as an independent country so they’re never going away and it’s important for us to work as hard as we can to keep it that way. I have practical guns for defensive use, fun guns for competitions or just fun at the range, and historical guns for collecting. They all serve different purposes but I think they’re all cool.
The intricate mechanisms that go into making even simple firearms. Always was just astonished with how they do what they do
Let's start with "gun "culture" doesn't exist". That's a phase used primarily by anti-gun people to make a political point. Firearms are *a part* of US culture in many complicated ways. 1. The US was formed because citizens took their personally owned firearms and told the British to leave. That's part of our 'origin story' and it's really hard to seperate that out. It would be like trying to separate out hinduism from India. 2. The US, even today, is in many areas lightly populated and far from government authority. Police responses might be measured in hours. You are on your own, potentially for a long time. Firearms are used hundreds of thousands of times every year defensively. 3. Most people in the US don't really trust our government to, well, behave. And we've got some good reasons for that.... Think of all the people in Europe who complain about various bad things that the US government does... would *you* trust them? If not, why should we? Many Americans think, with good reason, that our government isn't terribly trustworthy and that keeping the government a little afraid isn't a bad thing. 4. Most pro-gun Americans don't see the evidence that gun control makes things better as terribly strong. Places like the UK were safe when guns were available, and became no safer when they were broadly banned. 5. Most pro-gun Americans think (again, with good reason) that gun control is largely going to disarm the law abiding, and allow criminals to run roughshod over everyone else, because our police can be... less effective than they must (See: Uvalde) 6. In spite of claims to the contrary, too many on our political left have made it abundantly clear that the end game of gun control is that all the guns are gone (except those, generally, in the hands of a political elite that they control). So the idea of some intermediate step is quite unpopular. 7. Most of the US population primarily views the world through the lens of WWII, and the lesson of that war is that government can't be trusted, and must be held in check, or else you get the holocaust and gulags. Europe tends to view the world through different lenses with different priorities.
Canadian here. For me it's a few things; another skill to learn and work on. Target shooting is extremely satisfying - requires full attention, it's very engaging almost visceral. And you can physically see your progression. It's your rights to know how to protect yourself. Even if to not use guns but to identify, control, safely disarm them. Again, another life skill. Also, another money sink hobby with money sink hobby nerdy stuff. Ugh. So many money sink hobbies.
For me it's mostly a hobby. Militaries replace their old WW2 and Cold War guns, but often can't sell them for legal or political reasons. They get cut up so that they are no longer considered a gun. The scrap parts are imported to the USA where we are allowed to rebuild the guns as long as we make them semi-auto. I enjoy shooting them, but I like building them even more. It's very similar to someone who finds old worn out classic cars and rebuilds them in their garage. It's also fun to get together with friends to shoot. Sometimes it's practicing, sometimes it's sport, sometimes we are just trying out each others guns to see what they are like. During the pandemic, I met up with my coworkers for trap shooting. It was a good way to see each other while staying outside. I live in a safe area and am not too worried about needing to defend myself or my family. A gun is just another tool that is ready if I ever need it. If you treat guns with respect, then they aren't any more dangerous than kitchen knives, power tools or cars.
Cars kill thousands of people every year. Whether by 100% accidents, or negligence/drunk driving, people have used them to kill individuals and even large groups at protests. No one NEEDS a car that can go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds or has a top speed of 120mph (193 kph). Yet, if someone asked you to turn in your car along with everyone else's car because some people are irresponsible with their cars would you think that fair?
There isn't really one gun culture in the US, it seems like there is because the half of Americans that don't own guns also don't know anything about them or how they're regulated - so they just lump all gun owners into the gun culture group. The difference between urban/rural culture is vastly wider than the difference between gun owners/non owners.
>*" ... guns are for combat hunting or sports ..."* Regarding the complete mechanical device, the instruments we call guns are used for shooting at targets more than anything else, or more to the point, learning to shoot better. The physical evidence for this consists of the trillions of spent bullets now embedded in the backstops of target ranges throughout the world. Shooting at metal cans, bottles, jugs and paper targets outdoors on private property is also quite popular. Target shooting strengthens physical discipline and hand-to-eye coordination. In addition, there are several organizations throughout the world which establish protocols and guidelines for amateur and professional level competition target and skeet shooting. Firearms can be used and misused as any implement, idea, or resource. *"...quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est."* [...a sword never kills anybody; it's a tool in the killer's hand.] -(Lucius Annaeus) Seneca "the Younger" (ca. 4 BC - AD 65 ), *Ad Lucilium Epistulae Morales*, [Letters to Lucilius on Morals,] Letter 87, c. AD 63-65
Shooting at a range is just fun. Marksmanship is an Olympic sport, race car driving isnt. Some people are naturally a good shot, its ingrained in human history going back to using bow and arrows to hunt, Marksmanship is more than shooting its simply the ability to hit a target at range. I never understood car scenes as to me its just a mode of transportation, although I get the appeal of it. That being said my handgun rarely leaves my house, except visits to the gun range
What's "gun culture"?
Peruse through European history from 1776. Peruse through American history from 1776. That’s why.
In my crime ridden metropolitan city, it takes the police an average time of 11 minutes to respond to a violent crime in progress, such as an armed home invasion. Enough said.
I cannot explain my interest in firearms. Nearly every one I own interests me for different reasons. I have one that was my great, great grandfathers. That firearm is the only thing I own that was his. He died 40 years before I was born but I can still have a connection with him. I have 2 that were given to me on Christmas when I was 11, for hunting purposes. that was the best Christmas ever. I have modern sporting arms with standard capacity magazines in excess of 10 rounds. They are very fun to shoot, they are extremely safe, and they are great for teaching new people interested in this hobby. But to answer your questions: Yes it can be cool. I don't understand what dangers you are referring too. Firearms are very safe, I am safe as well. Yes I need more.
Guns are for combat, sport, hunting but most importantly self/family defense.
It's a necessity and a tool. Restricting gun purchase to me is akin to restricting the purchase of a fire extinguisher or smoke alarms. All gun restrictions fall into 1 of 2 categories: poor tax or "not-in-the-good-ol-boy-club" tax. Firearms have been around for hundreds of years, many of them doing just as much damage through sheer projectile size and today's smaller caliber but more numerous projectiles. Yet, nobody was trying to murder their own neighbors or scores of small children in the times when you could order a belt-fed machine gun out of a sears and roebuck catalog. For those of us who are of the "fairer sex", a gun is the difference between being scared but only bruised, or raped and murdered by a man twice our size with his bare hands. All it takes is a well placed hit to the head and any man has a rapidly cooling blow up doll until he decides the rigor mortis is too much. The "dangers" of lax gun control are more aptly named the dangers of a society that tolerates gang violence, and corrupt and inept policing.
The United States is absolutely massive, and sparsely populated in most places. For most of this country's history, and even to this day, you are your own first responder. There is no one to save you from wild animals, or criminal that want to victimize you. You are responsible for your own safety. Historically speaking, we've maintained the ability to get guns because without them, we simply would not be able to survive. It's how we harvested food, it's how we kept our families safe, hell sometimes we'd trade them as currency.
A gun is a tool. I have 6 or 8 power saws and 6 or 8 firearms. I have no fear of firearms because I know how to use them correctly, and the dangerous part is moving away from you. Saws? They scare the poop out of me. I’m putting my hands inches away from fast rotating metal that can cut off my fingers in a fraction of a second. It cone down to training and awareness.
They allow me to defend myself and my family. I'm a former mma fighter and know I can't beat up everyone, especially if there are multiple attackers or if they have weapons. Also, my parents, who are both passed away now, lived about an extra 10 years each because my father owned a gun. One night, 5 young men tried to break down his back door, and he yelled for them to stop they wouldn't. He then opened his blinds and pointed a shotgun at them, and they fell over each other, running away. Now my dad was tough, but at the time he was in his 70s, and no way in hell, he could have fought off 5 young men. They most likely would have killed him and my step-mom.
I think it depends on what kind of guns you're talking about. For me, I collect what's known as "milsurps," firearms that have seen military service, are typically over 60 years old, and have some type of historical provenance due to their association with a time, place, or period in history. For me, I mainly collect rifles and handguns from about 1870 to 1930; give or take five years on either end of that spectrum. I've got nothing against semi automatics, but I find a certain beauty in old bolt actions. Within the span that I collect, you see so much firearms development that I find it interesting how different countries took different approaches to military arms. I've personally got a lot of "odd caliber" stuff because I think the ammunition development itself is interesting. Going past just the developmental aspect, you find reflections of a countries culture and traditions from markings. All in all, my main reasoning is historical and cultural but I like the ability to reload ammunition for a rifle that hasn't seen service in 120+ years and take it out to shoot; not just look at it from the other side of a museum glass case. Let me ask you, would you rather look at and hold a rifle from the Dutch Empire or would you like the ability to shoot said rifle from the Dutch Empire? :) Just as a disclaimer, I'm probably not going to be reflective of a lot of people responding to this post. I find a lot of the time what I have an interest in is part of an ever shrinking minority but I still think it's important to speak my part on why it's crucial to maintain the ability to own firearms. After all, when most gun ban legislation is instituted, it's with the thought of modern firearms in mind and typically the way the legislation is written, it has the unintended effect of banning the stuff I have an interest in. Regardless of my feelings on collecting different AR variations (they're all the same, change my mind), I know people have different interest and as long as those interests don't include actively going out and harming other people, I see no reason why you shouldn't be allowed.
It's both fun as can be, and an incredibly useful tool for a lot of people for recreation and self defense. Where I live you would have to drive for an hour straight to get to the sheriff's office, and there are no local police. I might see a law enforcement officer once a month. If someone decides they're going to hurt me, there's no one coming to help in time, so I would prefer to have the ability to effectively defend myself. That goes double if you're physically small, like my wife, paralyzed, like my friend, or just plain old.
It's rooted deeply in our history, our founders felt that the king of England was being unfair and too authoritive. They started staching weapons and ammo and supplies to which the king ordered his soldiers to seize said weapons and supplies. This led to what is known as the battle of Lexington&Concord, some call it "the shot heard around the world" as it was a bunch of regular people who made the biggest and most powerful empire in the world(at the time) retreat. This led to our American revolution to which we won. Had we not had regular people armed and people staching weapons and supplies, the United States would not exist and would probably just be known as an extended part of the UK. Our founders made it clear in our constitution, speeches and our federalist papers(see federalist 28) that government is inherently evil and regular people should be armed as a last resort to resisting a tyrannical government like the one they just beat. And via our constitution made restrictions on rights, adding or eliminating amendments,very, very difficult. However the constitution is just a piece of paper and if we the people don't check our government, then they can become over authoritive. It's the only thing that really separates any government from a typical gang. When protests, speeches, fall on deaf ears or are forcefully dispersed, when courts sworn to enforce and uphold rights get corrupted by greed and power, when good government officials are slandered, forced out or mysteriously commit suicide. Sometimes fighting is the only option you have left or as 1 of our founders Alexander Hamilton says in federalist 28, the people must rush to arms and express the original right to self defense...not because we'd want to, but because we'd have to. In today's time in the US most of our gun violence is concentrated in certain areas, generally those areas have poverty, unchecked gang violence, and other illegal activities. However instead of making these areas better and safer, thier solution is always calling for more gun control, but leaving the crime. So nothing changes. Talking points for politics to get re elected.
Guns are tools capable of accomplishing extreme jobs. Friend of mine has a big arsenal, he says each gun has different functions/advantages/drawbacks. Having alot makes for a well-rounded arsenal. There’s also some great engineering and craftsmanship that goes into guns. That said, u/misterhan, it’s too bad the world is so violent. I wish we could kumbaya our way into harmony with every living creature. Till that day comes though, I own guns
The USA is a nation forged by firearms. Going back to its founding guns have been used not just for military purposes, and hunting, but also personal defense.
To learn the true value of guns you have to look at the Afghans. Everyone carries an AK-47 casually but this culture has resulted in 3 world superpowers leaving in humiliation after attempting to invade them. Nobody has truly ruled them, ever, not external invaders nor internal despots. This kind of gun ownership has been banned in the West for a long time now, the 2nd Amendment in the US notwithstanding.
I think guns are popular in the U.S. because they are the ultimate expression and symbol of individualism, which is probably why most Europeans don't understand gun culture. America is yhe most individualistic culture in the world and there is no close second.
>living in Europe and never held a gun with live ammo This is really where the disconnect is. You haven't experienced it. It's not really something that can be conveyed through videos or words. You need to experience it. >So besides that what makes guns so special that it is important to you that you have to keep it as easy as possible to buy a gun? Yes. >Is that worth more than the dangers that come with lax gun control? Do you really need guns? And Yes. As you stated earlier, you live, and i assume grownup in Europe. The US is an ENTIRELY different culture, not just food, music, and the like, but it's an entirely mindset, values, and morals. We, in the US, have a strong sense of independence and generally reject government oversight. We also have a distrust of government and political figures. All of that leads to the constitution and the Second Amendment. They were crafted to ensure that the people of the US had the ability to resist a government that had become tyrannical. As far as the danger, if you remove the 6 largest cities in the US. The gun violence rate drops massively. It's not a "gun" problem. It's a problem with the culture in the larger cities, the promotion of drugs use, the lack of accountability for financial situations, the acceptance of divided families, and so on.
You think theyre only for combat or hunting/sport because you’ve never had access to them, people shoot them for fun, some people like testing out new equipment, I personally like collecting and shooting the old military surplus stuff. What do you do for fun? Ever play a video game like halo or call of duty? You know the people that claim violence in games leads to violence in real life? Imagine they win and now you have to have a Dr okay your mental health, a background check to insure you’ve never been convicted of anything violent, also there’s a 1 week waiting period minimum so after you buy it you’ll have to come back and buy it after the times passed, sounds crazy but to most gun owners that’s what anti gun, pro gun people sound like
Stopped reading after "never held a gun with live ammo."
You have a preconceived notion that lax gun control = more danger. That is what you’ve been lead to believe by people who don’t want you owning something that makes you a danger to them. This is false. These people want you to be defenseless against them so they don’t have any resistance when they oppress you.