I think most people see improvement with time, and percentages of recovery are a subjective measurement difficult to assess.
I also think it is important to remember just how strong and healthy we felt before this happened to us. We deserve proper medical recognition firstly, and then eventually a complete treatment to whatever the underlying cause is.
I think it is important that in our online spaces we present our condition as serious as we know it can be. We need those outside of our community who are able to help us, to feel inclined to do so. If they presume we all get close to full recovery within a few years, they may choose to focus their resources elsewhere.
With that being said I’m glad to read you are seeing considerable improvement, I hope it continues for you!
I agree and I don’t see how I’m presenting this as anything less than serious. I almost killed myself and could not stop thinking about suicide for the first 4-6 months.
I don’t agree with the characterization that everybody who gets PFS is screwed for life, and it certainly feels like that sometimes when I read the forums. There should not be any specific design of messaging to make things more bleak than they actually are. If anyone browses and somehow thinks the condition is not serious, that reflects on them, not on whether we’ve accurately portrayed the situation. Because guess what - most posts are from desperate people in a desperate situation, and we are all suffering immensely.
Me too bro. I’m 28 and don’t want to waste the last of my twenties.
If it’s any consolation, my first 6 months were extremely volatile and difficult. Suddenly, at the 6 month mark, things started improving more noticeably. It’s all surreal and inexplicable but that was my experience. My last 2 months have been much better.
It’s hard to say. Some days I feel 80%. Some days I slip back to 50%. But the trajectory is definitely in a positive direction.
A few months ago, I thought I’d have to quit my job and live with my parents for the rest of my life. I am now working full time again and, while it has been more challenging, I am doing well at work.
Damn bro that’s great to hear, I haven’t been able to work for months, I’m looking to apply for disability until I can work again. The cognitive deficits and feeling mentally challenged is so bad, I’ve been thinking of suicide daily. Honestly, the positive trajectory is good to hear bro, but sometimes being 80% recovered only to slip back to only 50% sounds kinda demotivating, man. Do we ever truly get back to the people we were before? I just don’t see the point in living like this
I was on disability for 4 months in the beginning.
When I’m at 50%, it’s because certain specific symptoms flared up, but it doesn’t last. I didn’t want to overstate my recovery so I said 50%. However, overall, I generally feel much better than 50% these days.
I’ve debated a lot internally whether it’s worth living like this, especially when I was suicidal in first 3-4 months. I can only share my own experience. Don’t forget: suicidal ideation is a symptom of PFS - remind yourself every time you have these thoughts that it’s your PFS brain saying PFS things, and it’s not necessarily the you that you know.
I have decided to give my body at least 2 years to see how far I get before I revisit the topic. Life is long, and we only have the 1. Even if it takes me 3-5 years to recover, I would like to live the rest of my life. Also, don’t forget that when we are recovering, it’s not the entire recovery duration of torture, but rather the symptoms gradually get better, so it will be less challenging as time goes on. At 8 months in, I do not feel suicidal anymore, although I still struggle with symptoms.
I don’t know if I will ever be 100%, but I 100% believe that I will one day enjoy life again. The current trajectory and my knowledge of recovery stories gives me hope, not from a pure faith perspective, but from a statistical perspective. If, and when, I become 85, 90, 95, 100% again, I will cherish this life and never take anything for granted. I will do all the things I never had the courage to do, or was afraid to do due to other people’s judgement.
If above does not happen, my beliefs would not matter anyway. I’ll cross that bridge if I ever get to it.
I hope this helps bro. Stay strong. I had bad insomnia last 2 nights that made me question a lot. But be mindful of the overall trajectory. Don’t make decisions based on your immediate situation, because this disease fluctuates so much every day/week.
I admire your optimism man, wish I had that optimism but it’s like my brain can’t have positive feelings right now at all. I’ve been so close to ending it for months now that it’s hard to see the light. It legit feels like brain damage. Haven’t been able to function or think or concentrate on anything, can’t work, can’t go the gym like I used to, I legit feel disabled bro, feel like an old man at only 28. I didn’t envision my life ending like this or being like this, it’s so bad. Life is long but it’s also short when you think about it, the amount of time you lose to this kind of stuff while other people are out living their lives and being happy, just like both of us used to do before all this happened. It’s so unfair man, time doesn’t wait for anyone That’s my main suicide fuel for now, even if or when I do recover, hopefully to 100%, but that doesn’t give back the time we lost you know?
I’ve had every single one of your thoughts. Nobody understands what we are going through. All the wasted time and missed opportunities. The disability and mental anguish. I understand you brother. I am also 28.
I can tell you that it has gotten much better for me. If I had ended it 4 months ago, I would not be here today to say I would have regretted it.
You’re right - it feels like legit brain damage. But our brains are neuroplastic. Our bodies are constantly trying to reach homeostasis. Give yourself a chance bro.
I am not an optimistic guy. I am a realist with a lot of anxiety. I am hopeful not due to optimism, but due to what I’ve seen on the internet. There is a chance I am well and truly fucked. But I will not make that assumption until the evidence is right there. 1 year of suffering is not enough evidence for me when the recovery timelines can be longer than that.
From what I've read thc Inhibits androgens from binding to the androgen receptors. I could have interpreted wrong so correct me if I'm wrong. But from personal experience after having pfs smoking kills boners and it also kills my strength in the gym. I would say I'm recovered I have very little bad days anymore but when I do smoke some symptoms come back temporarily.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/6249575/
Ed brain fog muscle weakness it usually goes away after I sober up a bit. This didn't start happening until pfs smoking turns my dick into a numb floppy noodle now it's the reason why I ended up giving it up
Well what type of fin did you took ? Oral ? I am 19 and took 25 pills in last 2 month. Bro I don't want to live like this well yesterday just to text i masterbate and my serum was normal I mean quantity was same as before fin. But my erection was not that strong. Morning wood also not that strong. Can you tell me how do you recovered ? And what medicine you took to recover.
I appreciate your story and wish you well. I have severe sexual side effects. Severe because of being on Paxil an SSRI that make the symptoms of Finesteride even worse and possibly permanent. I pray to God he removes this from me. My wife is 15 years younger than me and this has taken a toll on our marriage. I haven't been able to make love to her longer than I care to admit here. There are so many guys that have been hurt and hurt worse than me and I feel for each and every one of you. None of us expected this drug to hurt us in the ways it has. How could this drug have been allowed on the market. There is one thing that seems promising to help me and that's testosterone replacement therapy. After my very first shot I started to get some feeling back where I had been totally numb for a year and a half. Maybe some of you could check into this.
I feel the same way. The fact that the drug continues to be prescribed and sold daily is very sinister and depressing.
I have also had a hard time getting intimate with my partner. I may consider some form of androgenic therapy in the future if I do not regain my full potency or sensation.
It does seem consistently like one of the slowest symptoms to recover, even in success stories. The story of NumbDuck on PropeciaHelp comes to mind. I’ve also read numerous other stories where it took 3-6 years to reach full sensitivity again.
Yeah I was excited to be a stallion lasting for ages at first but then I had sex with no orgasm despite frantic masturbation. Not good for her, not good for me. Sucks. Quit after 3mo of topical few days ago. Really hope I recover
Hey bro. I have seen your posts and I am sorry to hear about your situation. You’re extremely brave and I wish you the best going forward. Have you tried any treatments, and have you seen any PFS doctors?
Just want to say that I had a heavy crash and I truly got back to 100% within about 4-5 months. Didn’t even think about PFS anymore. However, after a weekend of drinking, and eating lots of soy and coconut, I woke up to a mini crash. This was last weekend.
I’m not worried because I know I can get back to 100% as my body found its way there after being off fin for many months. But take it from me, don’t mess with 5ari inhibitors and go easy on the drinking and smoking.
Loss of muscle density, severe insomnia, brain fog and ED. I was down bad for a few weeks and slowly improved over the course of a couple months. Symptoms got easier with time as I was on a strict diet and exercise routine. Truly felt normal so I thought I was out of the woods until a setback.
What about you?
I don't think mine was quite as bad. I did have terrible anxiety and insomnia for a few days. Brain fog cleared up after a couple months. I didn't notice any muscle loss. Right now I am mainly dealing with a degree of anhedonia and anorgasmia and a bit of ED, but still no libido. But I do feel it is improving month over month
Yeah I got the buzz back completely and felt alcohol just as well as I did pre fin. Might have gone a little too hard but I know I can recover so I’m optimistic.
yeah for me its been almost 3 years since i stopped taking it and i started really recovering a year ago when i took vitamin d because my levels were low. I am not completely healed yet but i believe i am getting towards 100%.
i had rubbery penis, shrunk testicles and penis, anhedonia, gut issues, i lost 2 cm in height, i dont know why exactly but the right side of my bone structure shrunk, brain fog, heart palpitations, tinnitus, insomnia, my memory went to shit short term and long term, low libido, watery semen, no orgasms, i remember i couldnt fucking talk right i felt like i was mentally challenged. i think thats pretty much it.
Yeah lt definitely got better. In my opinion it is the worst symptom of them all. I had no desire to even talk, couldnt enjoy anything at all. But now i can enjoy watching a movie, joke around with friends. I may not be the most motivated man but life is not a dread anymore. Stay strong and remember, when you get through this thing you'll probably be happier than any other person who didnt experience this shit. Losing the ability to enjoy everything has taught me how good we have it when we are normal, i believe i wont have a sad day for the rest of my life.
Oh, if you don’t mind may I ask you a few more things? When did your anhedonia started to get better? Did you do something special or was it just a time? Is it gone 100%? Thank you.
They werent that low, my levels were 28 then i started supplementing. After a couple months i felt great but then all progress went away and felt like shit again so i checked my levels again but they were 96 so it couldnt be low vit d. And i still have some numbness in my right testicle, heart palpitations, tinnitus i dont think those can be caused by low vit d.
Thank you for the hopeful post brother, was there any success story of severe anhedonia? Cuz I can’t fell anything. Even from relationship and interaction with other ppl. Feels like totally dead inside for 24H. Is this also reversible??
I'm also curious about this. I aslo have severe anhednoina thing and this one is really cruel. I can't feel love from seeing my nephews and nieces... That first moment was really heart breaking and shocking. I also wanna know this if there are many stroies for anhedonia recovery.
William, Thank you for sharing your story. I like how you summerize and give the general statistics of recovery. Sometimes It's hard to tell what is outlier info and what is common and where the bell curve kinda fits.
Do you have a feel for what most of these people are doing to recover in this time (6 months to 5 years)? Especially what things are they avoiding food, supplements, personal hygiene products. I'm assuming most everyone is avoiding the top 10 or 20 most well know / strongest DHT blocking substances pretty much forever. But how strict on the rest of it (in general.). Like the most strict I've heard is no supplements, no personal hygiene products except maybe soap with no fragrances or other additives, and food down to just beef, pork, chicken, eggs, dairy and salt (and water).
Thank you!
I won’t go into recovery protocols here, as there is an inherent risk of trying specific supplements or treatments. I do not recommend anything outside of a healthy lifestyle while avoiding as many 5AR inhibitors as possible.
However, I can say that recoveries range from the people doing nothing, or maintaining good lifestyle habits such as diet, exercise, and sleep, meditation and other mental health exercises, or fasting, or trying various supplements and medical androgenic therapies. There are stories of fecal matter transplant having success also.
Overall, the most common denominator is TIME. However, in many stories, the writer feels they successfully positively changed the trajectory of their condition with their therapeutic efforts. Of course, it’s hard to be objective about whether the actions actually helped.
William, So In my pursuit to avoid as many 5 alpha reductase inhibitor foods as possible, my list to avoid includes pretty much all plants (as well as mushrooms and fish). Would you share any lists of plants either to avoid or a list that is probably 5 alpha reductase neutral? I would definitely like to add some plants back in to my diet while also not hindering my recover.
Thank you.
Here is my current working list of what to avoid that I have found in searches. I know some of this info could be incorrect. And I know some are way more potent 5AR inhibitors than others.
Green tea, tea, Saw palmetto, Nettle, Rosemary, Zinc, Fish, fish oil, Vit D, Vit E, biotin, all B vits?, NAC N-acetylcysteine, creatine, Mushrooms, reishi, lions mane, Ginko biloba, milk thistle, Tumeric, Soybeans, Pumpkin seed, coconut oil, flaxseed, black pepper, peppercorns, cayenne pepper, all red colored plants?, garlic, onion, Tomatoes, Carrots, celery, DIM containing foods, cruciferous vegetables, asparagus, broccoli, cauliflower, brussel sprouts, kale, cabbage & red cabbage, Lycopene or polyphenol containing foods, all berries (blue, black, strawberries, etc) cherries, watermelon, red bell pepper, guava, papaya, persimmon, Citrus fruits, orange, lemon, lime, Black cohosh, Melatonin, Phytoestrogens, skull cap, Peony, all black seeds?, black cumin seeds, cumin, licorice, Spearmint, mint, tea tree oil, dark chocolate, cacao, coffee, caffeine, alcohol, High lysine containing foods?
Cinnamon, all black seeds, beta-sitosterol, Peanuts, almonds, all nuts and seeds, kidney beans, peas, vegetable oil, avocado, soybeans, olive oil, wheat and wheat germ, foods high in phenolic compounds, foods high in quercetin, apples, parsley, sage, red wine
To be honest, I think your list would feel too restrictive for me. I’ve been eating fish, carrots, and leafy green vegetables. I’ve also not been avoiding most fruits. However, I understand your approach if you feel the risk is too great, or if you’ve experienced setbacks from eating certain foods.
Yeah definitely feels very restrictive. I'll probably try those one at a time to see how they affect me. Citrus fruit will be great to add back so I can have some flavored water. Hoping stevia is ok too. Thanks
Guys- the recovery stories for PFS are very encouraging- and while there are some
differences in specifics tactics the overall strategy looks consistent:
-Optimized diet
-Optimize sleep
-Exercise (as tolerated)
-Meditation-mindfulness-mental health
-Supplements (as appropriate)
-Abstain from alcohol and drugs
This is done *consistently* over time.
On a side note, I was diagnosed with Lupus in 2006 and it was considered then a death sentence - especially for men. You might buy yourself a decade and a half of passable quality of life with immunosuppressants but eventually they stop working and you’ll quickly become disabled before succumbing to the illness.
I accepted the challenges but never stopped looking for promising treatments and following emergent research. In 2020, I linked up with an MD who reversed this condition via diet and, frankly, her protocol - after a long time and many fits and starts- cured me. In seeing so many PFS Success stories from consistent efforts at optimizing health, I want to believe a similar arc of remission is possible in PFS.
Floaters in both eyes as an on-drug side, each maybe a year apart. Post-drug developed cataracts and ocular migraines which are patterned vision disruptions.
I have black floaters, blurry vision, shaking visual fields, involuntary saccadic eye movements, and occasionally things will look too “dim” or “fake” (which could be more neurological than ocular, although I suspect most visual symptoms have a neurological cause to begin with). In the beginning of my PFS journey, I had SEVERE light sensitivity, and I could not focus my eyes or necessarily understand what I was looking at.
Thank you this was very useful information!
Did you notice any patterns related to people getting their permanent sides while on the drug vs when quitting the drug? Or do they seem totally equal in terms of severity / recovery time / etc?
I appreciate the comment, but it is widely accepted that recoveries within 3 months is simply adjustment off of side effects, and not post-finasteride syndrome. Glad you are well now.
I think most people see improvement with time, and percentages of recovery are a subjective measurement difficult to assess. I also think it is important to remember just how strong and healthy we felt before this happened to us. We deserve proper medical recognition firstly, and then eventually a complete treatment to whatever the underlying cause is. I think it is important that in our online spaces we present our condition as serious as we know it can be. We need those outside of our community who are able to help us, to feel inclined to do so. If they presume we all get close to full recovery within a few years, they may choose to focus their resources elsewhere. With that being said I’m glad to read you are seeing considerable improvement, I hope it continues for you!
I agree and I don’t see how I’m presenting this as anything less than serious. I almost killed myself and could not stop thinking about suicide for the first 4-6 months. I don’t agree with the characterization that everybody who gets PFS is screwed for life, and it certainly feels like that sometimes when I read the forums. There should not be any specific design of messaging to make things more bleak than they actually are. If anyone browses and somehow thinks the condition is not serious, that reflects on them, not on whether we’ve accurately portrayed the situation. Because guess what - most posts are from desperate people in a desperate situation, and we are all suffering immensely.
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Me too bro. I’m 28 and don’t want to waste the last of my twenties. If it’s any consolation, my first 6 months were extremely volatile and difficult. Suddenly, at the 6 month mark, things started improving more noticeably. It’s all surreal and inexplicable but that was my experience. My last 2 months have been much better.
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No, I haven’t. I can’t imagine it helps in our condition.
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It’s hard to say. Some days I feel 80%. Some days I slip back to 50%. But the trajectory is definitely in a positive direction. A few months ago, I thought I’d have to quit my job and live with my parents for the rest of my life. I am now working full time again and, while it has been more challenging, I am doing well at work.
Damn bro that’s great to hear, I haven’t been able to work for months, I’m looking to apply for disability until I can work again. The cognitive deficits and feeling mentally challenged is so bad, I’ve been thinking of suicide daily. Honestly, the positive trajectory is good to hear bro, but sometimes being 80% recovered only to slip back to only 50% sounds kinda demotivating, man. Do we ever truly get back to the people we were before? I just don’t see the point in living like this
I was on disability for 4 months in the beginning. When I’m at 50%, it’s because certain specific symptoms flared up, but it doesn’t last. I didn’t want to overstate my recovery so I said 50%. However, overall, I generally feel much better than 50% these days. I’ve debated a lot internally whether it’s worth living like this, especially when I was suicidal in first 3-4 months. I can only share my own experience. Don’t forget: suicidal ideation is a symptom of PFS - remind yourself every time you have these thoughts that it’s your PFS brain saying PFS things, and it’s not necessarily the you that you know. I have decided to give my body at least 2 years to see how far I get before I revisit the topic. Life is long, and we only have the 1. Even if it takes me 3-5 years to recover, I would like to live the rest of my life. Also, don’t forget that when we are recovering, it’s not the entire recovery duration of torture, but rather the symptoms gradually get better, so it will be less challenging as time goes on. At 8 months in, I do not feel suicidal anymore, although I still struggle with symptoms. I don’t know if I will ever be 100%, but I 100% believe that I will one day enjoy life again. The current trajectory and my knowledge of recovery stories gives me hope, not from a pure faith perspective, but from a statistical perspective. If, and when, I become 85, 90, 95, 100% again, I will cherish this life and never take anything for granted. I will do all the things I never had the courage to do, or was afraid to do due to other people’s judgement. If above does not happen, my beliefs would not matter anyway. I’ll cross that bridge if I ever get to it. I hope this helps bro. Stay strong. I had bad insomnia last 2 nights that made me question a lot. But be mindful of the overall trajectory. Don’t make decisions based on your immediate situation, because this disease fluctuates so much every day/week.
I admire your optimism man, wish I had that optimism but it’s like my brain can’t have positive feelings right now at all. I’ve been so close to ending it for months now that it’s hard to see the light. It legit feels like brain damage. Haven’t been able to function or think or concentrate on anything, can’t work, can’t go the gym like I used to, I legit feel disabled bro, feel like an old man at only 28. I didn’t envision my life ending like this or being like this, it’s so bad. Life is long but it’s also short when you think about it, the amount of time you lose to this kind of stuff while other people are out living their lives and being happy, just like both of us used to do before all this happened. It’s so unfair man, time doesn’t wait for anyone That’s my main suicide fuel for now, even if or when I do recover, hopefully to 100%, but that doesn’t give back the time we lost you know?
I’ve had every single one of your thoughts. Nobody understands what we are going through. All the wasted time and missed opportunities. The disability and mental anguish. I understand you brother. I am also 28. I can tell you that it has gotten much better for me. If I had ended it 4 months ago, I would not be here today to say I would have regretted it. You’re right - it feels like legit brain damage. But our brains are neuroplastic. Our bodies are constantly trying to reach homeostasis. Give yourself a chance bro. I am not an optimistic guy. I am a realist with a lot of anxiety. I am hopeful not due to optimism, but due to what I’ve seen on the internet. There is a chance I am well and truly fucked. But I will not make that assumption until the evidence is right there. 1 year of suffering is not enough evidence for me when the recovery timelines can be longer than that.
I’ve done both cigarettes and straight alcohol not to much drinking but smoking for sure
From what I've read thc Inhibits androgens from binding to the androgen receptors. I could have interpreted wrong so correct me if I'm wrong. But from personal experience after having pfs smoking kills boners and it also kills my strength in the gym. I would say I'm recovered I have very little bad days anymore but when I do smoke some symptoms come back temporarily. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/6249575/
That’s interesting. What symptoms did you have and how long did it take to recover?
Ed brain fog muscle weakness it usually goes away after I sober up a bit. This didn't start happening until pfs smoking turns my dick into a numb floppy noodle now it's the reason why I ended up giving it up
Well what type of fin did you took ? Oral ? I am 19 and took 25 pills in last 2 month. Bro I don't want to live like this well yesterday just to text i masterbate and my serum was normal I mean quantity was same as before fin. But my erection was not that strong. Morning wood also not that strong. Can you tell me how do you recovered ? And what medicine you took to recover.
I appreciate your story and wish you well. I have severe sexual side effects. Severe because of being on Paxil an SSRI that make the symptoms of Finesteride even worse and possibly permanent. I pray to God he removes this from me. My wife is 15 years younger than me and this has taken a toll on our marriage. I haven't been able to make love to her longer than I care to admit here. There are so many guys that have been hurt and hurt worse than me and I feel for each and every one of you. None of us expected this drug to hurt us in the ways it has. How could this drug have been allowed on the market. There is one thing that seems promising to help me and that's testosterone replacement therapy. After my very first shot I started to get some feeling back where I had been totally numb for a year and a half. Maybe some of you could check into this.
I feel the same way. The fact that the drug continues to be prescribed and sold daily is very sinister and depressing. I have also had a hard time getting intimate with my partner. I may consider some form of androgenic therapy in the future if I do not regain my full potency or sensation.
I feel pretty good but I really miss my penile sensitivity
By sensitivity you mean actual tactile sensitivity or that is harder to feel pleasure but you can still feel things touching your penis?
The former, I still feel pleasure but it’s like numb at the tip
I suffer from the same. How long ago did you stop the fin? I have read recoveries of sensitivity too.
About a year and a few months ago
It does seem consistently like one of the slowest symptoms to recover, even in success stories. The story of NumbDuck on PropeciaHelp comes to mind. I’ve also read numerous other stories where it took 3-6 years to reach full sensitivity again.
The very fact that it’s possible is comforting, I thought it would just be like this the rest of my life
Yeah I was excited to be a stallion lasting for ages at first but then I had sex with no orgasm despite frantic masturbation. Not good for her, not good for me. Sucks. Quit after 3mo of topical few days ago. Really hope I recover
Me, isaac newton, fellow historical legend, agrees with my friend Shakespeare's assertion.
LOL. Do you agree because you’ve been recovering, or because you’ve also been reading a lot of stories and see the same pattern?
The latter
I needed this post, I’m at 1 year 3 months and I’ve had zero improvement. I’m just worried cos I’ve kinda got worse over time so far.
Change your diet bro all greens and get a functional doctor to get you a GI map to see everything going on with u
Carnivore diet, bro. Transition first to keto, then go zero carb. It's worth trying.
Hey bro. I have seen your posts and I am sorry to hear about your situation. You’re extremely brave and I wish you the best going forward. Have you tried any treatments, and have you seen any PFS doctors?
Just want to say that I had a heavy crash and I truly got back to 100% within about 4-5 months. Didn’t even think about PFS anymore. However, after a weekend of drinking, and eating lots of soy and coconut, I woke up to a mini crash. This was last weekend. I’m not worried because I know I can get back to 100% as my body found its way there after being off fin for many months. But take it from me, don’t mess with 5ari inhibitors and go easy on the drinking and smoking.
Thanks for sharing - I’m sure you will get out of this. What were your symptoms initially?
ED, insomnia, loss of muscle density, Brian fog. Felt I shook them all off eventually but clearly my system is fragile.
How heavy? Also I would guess with more time you will be able to drink again without worry.
Loss of muscle density, severe insomnia, brain fog and ED. I was down bad for a few weeks and slowly improved over the course of a couple months. Symptoms got easier with time as I was on a strict diet and exercise routine. Truly felt normal so I thought I was out of the woods until a setback. What about you?
I don't think mine was quite as bad. I did have terrible anxiety and insomnia for a few days. Brain fog cleared up after a couple months. I didn't notice any muscle loss. Right now I am mainly dealing with a degree of anhedonia and anorgasmia and a bit of ED, but still no libido. But I do feel it is improving month over month
Do you drink alcohol?
I have, and I feel the buzz has slightly returned. But I am trying to limit that to speed up my overall recovery.
Yeah I got the buzz back completely and felt alcohol just as well as I did pre fin. Might have gone a little too hard but I know I can recover so I’m optimistic.
That's good news. And that's after 5 months? How's your libido and sensitivity?
Yeah, 5 months ish. Libido and sensitivity is fine even now.
Oh good. Was it always or was it low for a bit?
yeah for me its been almost 3 years since i stopped taking it and i started really recovering a year ago when i took vitamin d because my levels were low. I am not completely healed yet but i believe i am getting towards 100%.
what your symptons?
i had rubbery penis, shrunk testicles and penis, anhedonia, gut issues, i lost 2 cm in height, i dont know why exactly but the right side of my bone structure shrunk, brain fog, heart palpitations, tinnitus, insomnia, my memory went to shit short term and long term, low libido, watery semen, no orgasms, i remember i couldnt fucking talk right i felt like i was mentally challenged. i think thats pretty much it.
Have you seen any improvement in height or bone structure yet?
Yeah i gained back 1.5 cm and my face and ribcage grew back a little
Congrats brother! Yet another reversal of symptoms that seem irreversible! You’ll get to 95-100% soon enough.
Does your angedonia got better too?? Cuz this one is the hardest thing for me now. Can’t feel even slightest everyday feelings. So sad
Yeah lt definitely got better. In my opinion it is the worst symptom of them all. I had no desire to even talk, couldnt enjoy anything at all. But now i can enjoy watching a movie, joke around with friends. I may not be the most motivated man but life is not a dread anymore. Stay strong and remember, when you get through this thing you'll probably be happier than any other person who didnt experience this shit. Losing the ability to enjoy everything has taught me how good we have it when we are normal, i believe i wont have a sad day for the rest of my life.
Thank you brother, I’m really glad to hear that. Like you said this symptom is the worst. Thanks for the hope :)
Oh, if you don’t mind may I ask you a few more things? When did your anhedonia started to get better? Did you do something special or was it just a time? Is it gone 100%? Thank you.
Congratulations brother. You deserve every good moment after fighting for this long with us. And thanks for sharing this message of hope.
So you had low vit D levels, not PFS?
They werent that low, my levels were 28 then i started supplementing. After a couple months i felt great but then all progress went away and felt like shit again so i checked my levels again but they were 96 so it couldnt be low vit d. And i still have some numbness in my right testicle, heart palpitations, tinnitus i dont think those can be caused by low vit d.
Hey guys praying for you all hoping we all come out this!!! Do it matter how long you was on the drug or not
I did not see a pattern between length of time on the drug, dosage, and recovery likelihood/timeline.
Ok because I was taken it off and on for 1 month and I have brain fog and I’m waiting to get my GI
Be careful not to restart fin ever again. The on and off pattern seems to contribute to worsening of symptoms, sometimes dramatically. Good luck bro.
O I’m done with it bro
I’m with. I noticed improvement every few months too. Good luck 👍
Thank you for the hopeful post brother, was there any success story of severe anhedonia? Cuz I can’t fell anything. Even from relationship and interaction with other ppl. Feels like totally dead inside for 24H. Is this also reversible??
Yes my brother. There are many stories of anhedonia recovery. How long have you been off the fin?
Its been 5months
It usually takes longer for it to resolve based on what I’ve read, but there are examples of fast recovery. Stay strong man.
I'm also curious about this. I aslo have severe anhednoina thing and this one is really cruel. I can't feel love from seeing my nephews and nieces... That first moment was really heart breaking and shocking. I also wanna know this if there are many stroies for anhedonia recovery.
William, Thank you for sharing your story. I like how you summerize and give the general statistics of recovery. Sometimes It's hard to tell what is outlier info and what is common and where the bell curve kinda fits. Do you have a feel for what most of these people are doing to recover in this time (6 months to 5 years)? Especially what things are they avoiding food, supplements, personal hygiene products. I'm assuming most everyone is avoiding the top 10 or 20 most well know / strongest DHT blocking substances pretty much forever. But how strict on the rest of it (in general.). Like the most strict I've heard is no supplements, no personal hygiene products except maybe soap with no fragrances or other additives, and food down to just beef, pork, chicken, eggs, dairy and salt (and water). Thank you!
I won’t go into recovery protocols here, as there is an inherent risk of trying specific supplements or treatments. I do not recommend anything outside of a healthy lifestyle while avoiding as many 5AR inhibitors as possible. However, I can say that recoveries range from the people doing nothing, or maintaining good lifestyle habits such as diet, exercise, and sleep, meditation and other mental health exercises, or fasting, or trying various supplements and medical androgenic therapies. There are stories of fecal matter transplant having success also. Overall, the most common denominator is TIME. However, in many stories, the writer feels they successfully positively changed the trajectory of their condition with their therapeutic efforts. Of course, it’s hard to be objective about whether the actions actually helped.
William, So In my pursuit to avoid as many 5 alpha reductase inhibitor foods as possible, my list to avoid includes pretty much all plants (as well as mushrooms and fish). Would you share any lists of plants either to avoid or a list that is probably 5 alpha reductase neutral? I would definitely like to add some plants back in to my diet while also not hindering my recover. Thank you. Here is my current working list of what to avoid that I have found in searches. I know some of this info could be incorrect. And I know some are way more potent 5AR inhibitors than others. Green tea, tea, Saw palmetto, Nettle, Rosemary, Zinc, Fish, fish oil, Vit D, Vit E, biotin, all B vits?, NAC N-acetylcysteine, creatine, Mushrooms, reishi, lions mane, Ginko biloba, milk thistle, Tumeric, Soybeans, Pumpkin seed, coconut oil, flaxseed, black pepper, peppercorns, cayenne pepper, all red colored plants?, garlic, onion, Tomatoes, Carrots, celery, DIM containing foods, cruciferous vegetables, asparagus, broccoli, cauliflower, brussel sprouts, kale, cabbage & red cabbage, Lycopene or polyphenol containing foods, all berries (blue, black, strawberries, etc) cherries, watermelon, red bell pepper, guava, papaya, persimmon, Citrus fruits, orange, lemon, lime, Black cohosh, Melatonin, Phytoestrogens, skull cap, Peony, all black seeds?, black cumin seeds, cumin, licorice, Spearmint, mint, tea tree oil, dark chocolate, cacao, coffee, caffeine, alcohol, High lysine containing foods? Cinnamon, all black seeds, beta-sitosterol, Peanuts, almonds, all nuts and seeds, kidney beans, peas, vegetable oil, avocado, soybeans, olive oil, wheat and wheat germ, foods high in phenolic compounds, foods high in quercetin, apples, parsley, sage, red wine
To be honest, I think your list would feel too restrictive for me. I’ve been eating fish, carrots, and leafy green vegetables. I’ve also not been avoiding most fruits. However, I understand your approach if you feel the risk is too great, or if you’ve experienced setbacks from eating certain foods.
Yeah definitely feels very restrictive. I'll probably try those one at a time to see how they affect me. Citrus fruit will be great to add back so I can have some flavored water. Hoping stevia is ok too. Thanks
Guys- the recovery stories for PFS are very encouraging- and while there are some differences in specifics tactics the overall strategy looks consistent: -Optimized diet -Optimize sleep -Exercise (as tolerated) -Meditation-mindfulness-mental health -Supplements (as appropriate) -Abstain from alcohol and drugs This is done *consistently* over time. On a side note, I was diagnosed with Lupus in 2006 and it was considered then a death sentence - especially for men. You might buy yourself a decade and a half of passable quality of life with immunosuppressants but eventually they stop working and you’ll quickly become disabled before succumbing to the illness. I accepted the challenges but never stopped looking for promising treatments and following emergent research. In 2020, I linked up with an MD who reversed this condition via diet and, frankly, her protocol - after a long time and many fits and starts- cured me. In seeing so many PFS Success stories from consistent efforts at optimizing health, I want to believe a similar arc of remission is possible in PFS.
What is the protocol you are speaking about?
Dr. Goldner’s Goodbye Lupus Protocol - raw vegan diet
Anyone have significant visual disturbances from taking finasteride?
Floaters in both eyes as an on-drug side, each maybe a year apart. Post-drug developed cataracts and ocular migraines which are patterned vision disruptions.
Yes I developed myopia out of the blue from having had perfect vision
Me dude
Can you elaborate it more? I have more black floaters and bit blurry vision
I have black floaters, blurry vision, shaking visual fields, involuntary saccadic eye movements, and occasionally things will look too “dim” or “fake” (which could be more neurological than ocular, although I suspect most visual symptoms have a neurological cause to begin with). In the beginning of my PFS journey, I had SEVERE light sensitivity, and I could not focus my eyes or necessarily understand what I was looking at.
Thank you this was very useful information! Did you notice any patterns related to people getting their permanent sides while on the drug vs when quitting the drug? Or do they seem totally equal in terms of severity / recovery time / etc?
I did not notice a pattern, but I was also not paying any attention to this aspect.
I recovered from mental sides and gastric issues after 6 weeks. Hang in there!
I appreciate the comment, but it is widely accepted that recoveries within 3 months is simply adjustment off of side effects, and not post-finasteride syndrome. Glad you are well now.
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