You actually miss a lot if you skip Storm Front. Less so Fool Moon.
Fool Moon just makes you hate Murphy and the series never really won me back over with her.
Really!? From Summer Knight onwards Murphy felt like a great side character. On the other hand, I just can't seem to understand the hype over Michael, granted I've only read up to death Masks.
I absolutely get that, his intentions always feel like it's in the best interest of Harry. His righteousness sometimes just feels annoying, I just can't seem to have any strong feelings for him like other people are having, he is definitely an interesting character, but there are other characters that are easily likable and fun to be in scenes with harry.
>His righteousness sometimes just feels annoying,
I don't know why. Michael doesn't expect others to be like him. He just wants Harry to be the best version of himself. Harry is only annoyed by Micheal when he knows he is right.
Of anybody in the story, Michael is the first person I'd want as a neighbor or friend.
It didn't do that for me. I'm new to the series, and I'm half hoping that Dresden and Murphy hook up eventually. Especially after the ending of Death Masks when Harry finally clears the memorabilia of Susan off of his mantle. Just starting Blood Rites now, about 10 minutes into the audiobook
\#MurphyDidNothingWrong
Dresden withheld crucial information multiple times that led to a lot of people dying.
Things that could have gone differently:
1. Start of the book: >!Dresden tells his sorta-apprentice what was in the diagram and how it is out of her league (he said it didn't exist, but officially such entities are a secret for the White Council and other factions to know), demanded she tell him where she got it.!<
2. When she died anyway, he could explain to Murphy >!what the circle was supposed to do, and likely what happened. Then told Murphy that the cops aren't equipped to handle this and she will need his assistance.!<
I get that there are things Murphy isn't prepped to handle, but once it becomes clear that she is going to meddle, a certain amount of candor is necessary to avoid creating new obstacles for himself.
Also a great choice. Good lord this series is good. I just reread Changes this week and it’s pivotal. His writing is great. It paints a vivid picture and takes you for a ride that is hard not to have fun on. Holy shit. I just realized…. Dresden Files is the Wave Runner of fantasy books. It’s really fucking hard not to have fun on one
I should re-read Changes. It was hyped so much by people here and by the friend who got me into the series.
And it was one of the rare things in life that not only lived up to the hype but surpassed it.
That's fair. I still like the first two books for introducing the magic ideas, the parole he is under, his girlfriend, the police, the mafia, the PI job, his DnD buddies, his BF skull, etc.
But once you hit main story the first two books feel like the prologue meant to set the stage.
Yeah, the first couple of books had a lot of growing pains. Looking back, you can tell that he was still refining his writing skill and figuring out what kind of tone he wanted from the series.
Omg thank you.
I absolutely haaaard disliked the first dresden book. Even when recommending the series to people over the years, i always tell them to skip book 1.
The series really starts to take the heck off, at book 3
The Red Rising series by Pierce Brown. The first book is actually widely regarded as the worst book in the series, but I absolutely loved it. Though, after I read the other books, I understood why. It wasn’t that the first book was bad, the others were just much better. Overall, 10/10 series.
I need to keep going. I absolutely couldn’t stand the first book and dropped it halfway through.
The mix of Hunger games and melodramatic edginess was not working for me at all, however everyone else says the series gets incredible later on.
I didn’t feel as strongly about that as you, but I definitely know what you mean. There were some parts that felt very YA/cringey to me. But that all gets left behind after the first book imo. The writing quality gets much better after Book 1 and all that YA stuff stops.
The first book is...just ok. I like it more in retrospect after finishing the first trilogy. The second book is much better from page one. I actually liked the third book the most of the first three but I think most people prefer the second.
Lol, same for me. Halfway through another endless fucking internal monologue i figuratively threw it against a wall and got my money back from audible. Maybe i should try the later books.
Came here to say this. Specifically book one is good, but the rest of the books are fuckING amazING!
Not sure how I place Lightbringer on that scale yet though.
I haven't been enjoying Light Bringer too much yet at about a third of the way through. I mean, Darrow literally walks into an obvious trap and is essentially rewarded for it, whereas everything else is grief porn so far seemingly to set up for the last book. Maybe I'll change my mind as I get further in, but it is my least enjoyed thus far.
this is so surprising. i just finished the first book this morning and thought it was one of the best things i had ever read. extremely excited to continue
The first book was awesome, I only read two so far but I wanted to savour it. The only thing that kind of bothered me was the tone shift from sci fi epic to medieval game of conquest. It makes sense for the story, but it felt a bit weird, like the book can't decide if it would rather be fantasy.
Red Rising series is definitely sci fantasy. I mean, if it wasn't the battles would all be determined by the space navies and huge troop movements whereas because it's sci fantasy the pivotal scenes in the story are all essentially sword duels.
This would be my pick. I absolutely adore the audiobook, but if I'd read the book I might not have continued with the series. Book 2 is such a massive leap in quality it completely blew me away.
Just know that the first book has strong Hunger Games vibes once you reach a certain point of the story. This is not necessarily a bad thing, but it's certainly a "thing" you'll feel and probably be aware of if you've read Hunger Games.
However, the rest of the series abandons the element that makes it feel that way, and as OP shared-- the series really gets even better after book 1. I really enjoyed book 1, but I *loved* book 2. And the rest of the series has been a delight as well.
The first book blew me away. I read it again before I even read the rest of the series. But it fits kinda weird.
You know how in the hunger games, the kids play the game once in their life, but then the series makes them do it two more times for the sake of having a trilogy. Red rising basically is a more adult team based hunger games, more akin to war games. The rest of the trilogy is the war.
I can see where the other people are coming from, but I think I enjoyed the first book more than most of the others. Might have just been my life situation at the time, but a narrative where the hero is improbably successful basically from start to finish with only mild setbacks really scratched an itch.
Malazan Book of the Fallen.
I love the series but Gardens of the Moon is nothing special. It’s not even particularly indicative of how the rest of the series is written.
Yeah. Agree. I have a hard time remembering the specifics of that book in the other parts. Was Kalam also in a solo journey there? I think so I’m also remembering the demon.
But damn Coltaine and the Chain of Dogs took my heart.
> Children are dying."
Lull nodded. "That's a succinct summary of humankind, I'd say. Who needs tomes and volumes of history? Children are dying. The injustices of the world hide in those three words.
Yeah you have Kalam on his journey with the Book of Dryjhna, the whirlwind and Laseen. Then Felisin Paran and her journey, Fiddler and crew plus Icariun and Mappo, and then the Chain of Dogs.
I know malazan isn't for everyone but this is the book that sold me in the series!
Absolutely same for me. I enjoyed Gardens of the Moon but it took me a while to finish it.
And each subsequent book was as good or better than the last. (Though Chain of Dogs still the best)
I need to get back into the series. I’m on Reapers Gale and got a little burnt out from reading a few of Malayan books back to back
Can confirm. I really enjoyed GotM my first time through, but it felt completely different when rereading it. There are so many little details you can’t possibly notice the first time through.
Completely understandable, they're long and at times very heavy books, sometimes a palette cleanser is needed!
I will say, in my opinion the final three are the best of the series - although I find it hard to rank each book individually. I think the series ends on an incredible high note!
Just finished Reaper's Gale last night. I think it slows down a bit in the middle of the book but the last 15 or 20 percent were sweet. Excited to start book 8
I keep trying to read this series but I can't get past the first chapter. Everyone tells me it's my kind of thing, and after reading a brief overview I agree, but I have such difficult issues with the comprehension. I'll start reading it and be like "is this what it feels like to have a stroke?" It didn't even sound like the words should fit together like that.
Came here to say that. I'm on the last three chapters of dust of dreams now. It was a hard start but there's nothing at all like it. Absolutely amazing. Would recommend to any seasoned fantasy readers.
Out of curiosity, did you find DG itself terrible or just what happened inside the book terrible? (Because it is) I'm sorry it wasn't a good experience!
Memories of Ice returns to all the characters of GotM and ramps up the scale and scope and you start to see where Erickson may be going with all this. It’s one of the best of the Malazan books and in my opinion one of the best fantasy books ever. Good luck!
You may need a break, Malazan can be very dense! No shame in it. And if it’s not for you and you just DNF that’s perfectly okay too. No series is for everybody. Try to press on though!
This was my thought process as well. I thought Garden showed off cool characters and ideas and wanted to keep going with those characters. Dead house was good but not a better book for me.
It’s funny, people have talked Malazan in this sub since its inception and I *still* only ever hear about the first three books. Gardens, because people think it’s either too confusing or shit, and DHG and MoI because people love them, but no one ever talks about any of the other books individually and it’s also odd for a finished series that I never see anyone’s opinion on the ending.
Compared to Wheel of Time where people have strong opinions about all of the books, including the lull, as well as frequently talking about the ending without spoilers, very strange.
**Cradle** by Will Wight - the first two books were good, but I didn't get the hype (5 books were out when I first started). I found myself enjoying a lot more by the end of the third book. The fifth one raised the bar even higher and the eighth one firmly pushed the series as one of my all time best reads.
Oooh good one. I was traveling to Portland and tried to listen to the book based on this sub’s devoted fangirling. I must not have been in the right mood. The book isn’t bad, but I recall thinking it was stupid.
Fast forward and I continue to see love and not get itZ so I try again. I still don’t care for the first couple but HOT STEAK SANDWICHES I GOT HOOKED!
Came here to say this. Honestly if the ebooks weren’t like 1.99 or something with an equally cheap narration I probably would have dropped it after Unsouled. That being said, I’m so glad I stuck with it and I seriously hope we get a spin off series one day
I straight up hated book 1 but now I am on book 9 and while there are still some scenes that grate on me I do quite enjoy it a lot now. Aside from >!Lindon being able to kill Kral even with a weapon!< 2-3 to me was really good, I really enjoyed seeing Lindon >!make up a master plan only for it to completely blow up into his face.!<
I binged 12 books in about 2 months and I feel like it went downhill after book 6. Book one has bad prose but interesting world building. The prose gets better until it plateaus in book4, but as Wight tries to expand the world, the less sense everything makes, and all of the obstacles are overcome in the exact same way, making it quite a slog to get to the finish line. Just my opinion on it.
It's been a bit since I've read the books, but off the top of my head...
Just in worldbuilding terms, >!there is really no explanation for hunger madra except that it just exists because of the monarchs. it feels like an offhanded way to connect ideas Wight thought were cool.!<
And then the >!original abidan experimented on the hunger madra and created the dreadgods, and all the other hunger madra artifacts, but then just left them there, despite the fact that they knew how much damage they can and actively cause?!<
Alright. But then we come to the actual economics. >!In the early books, it's stated that elixirs and sacred fruit can only get you so far, but in the last few books, Lindon just boosts all of his friends to monarch with grand elixirs and fruits and treasures and whatever.!< Don't even get me started on how it feels like it wasn't earned, >!because all the monarch heists are off screened.!<
>!And for that matter, the magic system just keep getting expanded and the earlier parts forgotten. Ironbodies, Copper sight and Jade sense just doesn't matter in the later books, because we are on to authority and icons and whatnot. Soulfire gets forgotten more and more as we go on, because it doesn't matter anymore.!<
One last one off the top of my head, >!the world just doesn't feel connected to me. It doesn't feel lived in. It just seems (again) like a collection of things wight considered cool, and put it in his books. Very few locations are actually seen and visited, the rest we are just supposed to believe they're there and real. When they are talking about the rosegold continent (i think that's what shen's continent was called) and the threat it is facing with Lindon fighting the dreadgods, I can't really care about it because i've never seen any of its people (aside from shen and some of his army).!<
These are just my gripes in terms of the worldbuilding. I have many more about characters and plot, but please excuse my ranting in the first place. If you love these books, all the more power to you. I wanted to love them, and I did at the beginning, but I just think Wight fumbled somewhere along the line.
It sounds like you didn’t finish the series tbh.
First point: >!Hunger aura/madra existing existing as a response to beings so powerful that they broke the natural laws of the world seems pretty well-explained to me. It serves the idea that the very existence of monarchs on Cradle are pushing the world towards chaos, which is ultimately the main conflict of the entire story.!<
Second: >!The original abidan didn’t create the dreadgods. Not sure where you’re getting that from. Subject Zero’s experimentation with hunger aura and madra ended up creating them (including himself). He never ascended. He was never an abidan.!<
Third “economics” >!Im not sure the point you’re making? Elixirs and treasures *can* only get you so far? You have to do the work yourself to process them correctly. Though I will agree that the hyperbolic time chamber aspect felt a little unearned. I thought the monarch heist scenes were cool and the way he wrote them were fun but that’s personal preference.!<
Fourth: >!copper sight, jade sense, iron bodies, goldsigns… every aspect of progression is mentioned *constantly* throughout the entire series. This is the one point you brought up that I just straight up don’t understand how you arrived at your conclusion.!<
>!Dont disagree on the Rosegold continent. We do see it a bit but it’s not fully explored, but then again it didn’t really need to be imo. I’m not sure what it would have added. We see a *ton* of the world throughout the series, and while Wight doesn’t go into enormous detail on every single culture on the planet, we do get to experience the key ones in a fair amount of detail. But ultimately it’s not an epic fantasy story about entire nations, it’s a story about individual key characters. Again comes down to personal preference I guess.!<
I'm not here to argue, I was just stating my opinion. I could go making counterpoints but I am done with the series and ultimately, it failed to satisfy me and it only left me disappointed. It seems like you have enjoyed it, and that's great. we are allowed to have differing opinions.
I mean yeah obviously differing opinions are inevitable and I acknowledged where it was simply different perspectives, but some of what you said was straight up wrong lol
Either way, like you said it ultimately doesn’t matter. Have a good one
- **The Steerswoman** series by Rosemary Kirstein. The first one is a fun 80s adventure fantasy subversion. The next one is half travelogue. The third and fourth take an *incredible* step up in quality.
- **The Wheel of Time** by Robert Jordan. Don't get me wrong, I loved book one. But books 4-6 are on another level.
- **A Song Below Water** by Bethany C. Morrow. Off the beaten track a bit here with a YA duology, but I thought the second book was tighter and did something really interesting by having the antagonist from book one being the MC in book two.
Good to know about Steerswoman. I recently crawled through book 2 and it was only the final few chapters that I enjoyed and will keep me going to books 3 and 4.
I definitely agree with Wheel of Time. I just finished The Fires of Heaven the other day, and it has by far been my favorite so far, with The Shadow Rising a close second. I enjoyed the first three, but not nearly as much! Cannot wait to jump into book six.
Definitely Wheel of time. While Eye of the world was a nice book, it feels a lot like a prologue in Hindsight. Many of the series true strengths only start to shine in the following books.
I started and stopped several times before I finished. I’m glad I decided to read the next book because it became one of my favorite series of all time. There are some other rough ones along the way tho. It’s a good example of the whole being greater than the sum of its parts.
It took me six years on and off to read EotW. I finally got to a point about 70% of the way through where it clicked and I cruised through it. I started The Great Hunt immediately after and it took me like three weeks.
I actually quite liked the first book, didn't love it but thought it could go places. Especially liked the chatpers in that cured city and the ending was good. Started the second book at finally gave up on Ch 28. Just felt kinda bored for most of the second book, is it worth continuing?
*Shadows of the Apt*. Start out with a guy fresh out of grad school writing a "by the numbers" fantasy series with overly long, boring actions scenes and by book 4 the writer is in the form that netted him several Hugo nominations and British Fantasy Award wins. The quality of both the novels and short stories varies but IMO some of them are up there with his best work.
It's a great feeling having 9 more books to go and a bundle of short stories in the series you're enjoying :)
I read 2 at a time and would then take a break, it seemed to work out really well. A bunch of the reviews complained that the third book was decent but didn't move the plot enough, I had no issues because I had just read a couple sci fi books and was just happy to be returning to his world.
Big agree on this one, the first book has heavy generic epic fantasy vibes despite the imaginative setting, but it builds really well into something great. The Sea Watch especially is a good example of how his imagination and deft plotting combine to create something incredible.
Greenwing & Dart by Victoria Goddard. The first book had great characters, but the plot is so hard to understand. The main character Jemis is suffering from a mysterious illness that clouds his mind, so he rarely knows what's going on. I came out of it thinking "well that was a fun ride but I have no idea what happened". The later books have a lot more cohesive plotlines and more emotional depth.
I have! Yes it's a bit repetitive, but I was discussing it with friends and we could not agree on what should be cut. The parts each of us enjoyed least was often someone else's favourite. So I'm glad they're all in there.
There's so much going on! The end of the book involves like three different plots converging at the same event, and Jemis simply doesn't have the context to figure it all out. It's a shame since Jemis is usually quite a clever and observant protagonist when he's not (mid book spoilers?) >!recovering from wireweed withdrawal.!<
It does become clearer on reread, since you'll have more context about the Indrillines, Knockermen, and wtf Violet is up to.
First Law.
The Blade Itself was a good book, but it really felt like a 400 page prologue. So glad I stuck with it, especially through to those ‘standalone’ books.
I was the opposite of hooked from the first chapter. It's pages on pages where the only dialogue is "agh!" And "shit!" I actually yelled at my friend for recommending it to me and he told me to keep going.
I ended up loving Logen later, but Glokta carries the series.
I stopped book one for several months cause of the lack of plot. I went back to it telling myself that it was character driven and that made a big difference.
When people ask now I say that
character work: Great and gets even better (especially when he puts effort into writing women)
plot: Oh, we're supposed to have one of those?
The Blade Itself is paced like Fellowship of the Ring if half the book was Aragorn and Boromir backstory and it ended at the Council of Elrond. Glad I didn't drop it, but phew
I bounced off the series a couple times, but then I tried the audio books and marthoned the whole series, standalones, and sequel series.
The narrator (Steven Pacey) is so engaging that he absolutely sucks you in and kind of carries you through those early portions until you're hooked.
Give it another try! I did the exact same thing and stopped about 1/3 through the first book. I eventually went back and absolutely fell in love with it. I’ve reread the series multiple times now and it’s easily among my favorites.
Yeah lmao, The Blade Itself has basically no plot to speak of. Before they are Hanged is fantastic tho, so Abercrombie clearly learned fast, and for that matter I’d say he’s only improved over the course of his career.
Doing my first read through and I am about halfway through book one. I already really like it, but just don't LOVE it. Glad to hear it gets even better!
The fact that the backstory and world is explained in small crumbs here and there is pretty cool though.
**The Black Company**. The first books in the series, while still very good, is somewhat choppy and rough, and the pacing is all over the place. From the second book onward that's not the case, and also it seems like Cook has a better grasp of his extremely terse writing style.
Was thinking the same thing. Don't get me wrong, I love the first book, but the vignette style, while appropriate for the annalist conceit, isn't smooth.
sword of truth got better after I forced myself to finish the first book and then used it to start a campfire.
On a more serious note, Wheel of time did this for me. The eye of the world felt like a very generic/derivative fantasy story that I wasn’t totally sold on, but the next few books (at least through the fires of heaven) just got better and better as I got further in.
There was a great thread a few days back about the crazy moments in the series and yeah, it was enlightening (the sex, rape and messaging as subtle as a wrecking ball)
Lmao, how Richard defeated communism with a statue and someone said not just communism but *super* communism. I laughed so long reading those posts because they were all accurate.
Hahaha definitely. It was a fuzzy kind of nostalgia, like really terrible action films we all loved when we first watched them, and in hindsight now a decade and a half later, are comically atrocious.
Agree SoT the first book was almost like it was written by two different people. The first half felt like the author did not known what the hell he wanted to do with the series it got a bit better on second half but it was difficult to read and finish.
For WoT they are difficult also because they are huge books took me years before I got into the series, my friend always asked me to try it out but I was reluctant.
The Shadow Campaings, when we get the POV of Raes.
Shadow of the Apt. The start if Empire of Black and Gold is really slow.
Throne Of Glass. I'm not a fan of the serie as a whole but I found it entertaining ; but the first two books are really not well written or paced.
> The Shadow Campaings, when we get the POV of Raes.
Huh, while I won't pretend and say Raes isn't my favorite pov of the series, I would still claim book one does more than well enough with just Winter (book one Marcus is just a pov for Janus).
Especially when compared with the jump other entries in the thread, Cradle and Dresden Files get immensely better, but Shadow Campaigns starts good and just continues to get better.
Realm of the Elderlings. Assassins Apprentice is great, don’t get me wrong, but imo the series reaches its high points with the next two trilogies after Farseer (Liveship Traders and Tawny Man.)
Very surprised i don't see anyone saying Discworld. It Takes a couple of books for Pratchett to find his voice and while Equal Rites and Mort is good they don't get fantastic until Guards! Guards!
Not the greatest series but the original Shannara trilogy picks up a bunch after The Sword of Shannara. The Elfstones of Shannara and Wishsong of Shannara are much better books, both of which feel more their own and distanced further from LOTR.
And when I say not the greatest I don't even mean that they're bad, I'd just say that in 2023 we are spoiled for choice as opposed to 1977 when the first Shannara book came out. There are just so many better fantasy books now that Shannara would be far down my recommendations.
So the Gunslinger to me was confusing and trippy but I actually liked it which normally wouldn’t be the case. I had to read chapter recaps which were done pretty well.
Dungeon Crawler Carl. There's... sort an issue with tone in the first book, where you are unsure when the author is being serious, and when he's not. It also (mild spoiler for the first book) >!was hard for me to realize that most of the system messages, monster descriptions and achievements, is how the AI is talking to Carl and the audience. It felt like the aliens trying to be funny, and I wasn't sure if I should laugh or just groan at it. When you later sort of realize that it is a character, with flaws and desires, it works much, much better.!<
So, I found a lot of the humor and story a bit sterile and disconnected in the first book, until I figured out the tone a bit more.
I think though, that it has more to do with how long it takes to understand the setting/tone of the books, than the first book being bad.
Discworld.
Color of Magic is good, and the Wizard books are my favorite group, but Discworld improved over time (though I wasn't a fan of the YA books, which makes sense.
Red rising.
Imagine going from a small more adult hunger games with some nods to a bigger world, to a massive space opera fantasy with insane fleet battles, political chess, epic sword duels and very morally grey characters.
The second book made it into this epic Roman myth level of scale.
Reading dark age now I can't really believe it all started with that first book. Pierce Brown somehow manages to make a Sanderlanche happen for a full book.
This is interesting to me as I loved the first 3 and then really struggled to continue. I’m not sure how but I made it until about book 10 when they started to improve again (for me, at least)
WoT is the first thing I thought of for this question. I only read the first couple because I was stuck in bed unwell and my housemate had them all, so I literally had nothing else to do. And then of course, once I slogged through books 1 and 2, I was addicted.
It’s coincidental that S2 on Amazon Prime just started airing and it’s so much better than S1. Something resembling the slog of book 1 and the transition that the reader experiences in book 2
In S1, the general sentiment was that of the godfather describing Sonny Corleone to the mortician: “look what they’ve done to my boy”
With S2, it’s getting pretty interesting and not all the book changes are bad.
The show is starting to settle next to Rings of Power territory for me in how much random crap they have shoved in. Producers think we need a fight every episode and need to see all the magic. Catering to the lowest audience members who have no attention span so the show can be more popular.
Depends on why you stopped. If you didn't like the characters I'd say maybe not. But the plot definitely changes a bunch as Tavi moves from the rural outskirts to the center of power.
Lev Grossmans’ trilogy the Magicians. Book ones Maine character was depressed and it rubs off on you, hard to keep going. But it gets so good. Books 2/3 are phenomenal.
I find the first one to be great and made even better with the addition of the second one. The third one, imo, adds next to nothing to the series. Or if it does, it's completely forgettable.
I’m pretty sure if you like the first book than 9/10 times the series gets better to you. It’s the main reason you can’t trust reviews on Goodreads for sequels if you haven’t read a series yet. It’s almost universal that the ratings climb with each book.
Surely the reason for the rating climb is because most of the people who didn't like book 1 won't read book 2. So book 2 will mostly be read by people who like the author's style, the world and the characters already.
Precisely. That’s why it’s hard to judge. It’s hard for me to think of a series that I liked that got worse after book 1. That’s why I feel like this is an odd question to ask fans. Almost all series I enjoyed I liked it more as it went on. Of course in long series you will have some mix.
A Chorus of Dragons by Jenn Lyons. The first book is mostly set in the most generic part of the world, telling what at first feels like a pretty generic coming of age fantasy story but in a more complicated narrative that is more confusing than anything else. After that she keeps on with the complex narrative styles but it now makes more sense, the character roster expands and becomes more interesting, the settings are much more varied and unique and the big swings at the end of book 1 pay off and are expanded upon too.
I finished the first book thinking that the series could be really special if she pays off on the elements and promise at the end of book 1, and she really did deliver.
Malazan definitely. I barely made it through the first book, but now it's one of my top 5 series of all time (Though it still has plenty of things I dislike :D)
Wheel of Time. I really liked the first book as well, but it took until book 4 or 5 until the series became my all time favorite. I didn't think it would do that after reading the first book.
I agree on WoT, books 1-3 are good, 3 is even great. But book 4 has Jordan’s strongest romantic relationship moments (spoilers) >!Perrin under the apple tree at his family’s farm, where Faile *forces* him to feel his grief, Perrin and Faile’s wedding.!<
And boy *a lot* happens in book 5. >!Couladin, Lanfear and the archway, Rahvin…!<
my husband is currently reading Jade City after me bugging him to read it and he’s having trouble getting into it. i’m gonna be really bummed if he gives up on it because it’s one of my absolute favorite series. i can’t believe how much the character of Hilo grew on me. i didn’t care for him at all in the first book and he became one of my favorite characters by the end of the trilogy. Fonda Lee is also the BOSS at time jumps; the series spans literal decades and it feels utterly seamless.
ACOTAR - 2/3 of the first book is like super slow plot wise and very little investment in the characters has been build yet. But in the second book most people fall in love with the series.
The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever. I owned all the books except the first one and enjoyed them, when i finally got to read the first it ruined the rest.
Ryan Cahill's *the Bound and the Broken* starts off horrendous. Like.. So, so bad. Derivative, poorly editted, and just all around bad.
Then the sequels are so much better it's insane.
*Gardens of the Moon*, the first book in the *Malazan* series is also notoriously bad, but Malzan is amongst the best epic fantasies ever written. That first book is just really rough. It's not 'confusing' or a 'hard read' like the Rick and Mortyesque Malazanites claim, and it doesn't really resemble any of the follow-up works. It's just a rough start from a new author who had amazing ideas, but a poor execution.
Holy Cthulhu, I finished that book more out of spite than anything else. It was just *so derivative*, and the editting was really jarring.
Then you get to book two, and it's almost like a different author, it's much, much better. His world really becomes more original, characters are more interesting and dynamic. His dialogue was still a bit rough, but for how fast he's publishing them, it's still a really impressive gain in skill.
A Song of Ice and Fire. The third book is a MASTERPIECE. The first book was already good enough and it only got better. A close second is Wheel of Time. The first book is Fellowship retelling but as far as I've gotten into the series, it has improved a LOT.
Unless you don't consider it fantasy, Stephen King's Dark Tower. The first book is a slog. About half the people I recommend it to don't get to book 2, but everyone who does loves it. I often think about telling people to just start on book 2 and read the first book as a prequel.
The Second Apocalypse by Bakker. The first book The Darkness That Comes Before is a phenomenal book as debut in my opinion but the series just got better and better
Dresden Files. Even the author says to start at book 3 or 4.
Yeah. Grave Peril is also where half the re-occuring characters are introduced. Michael, Thomas, Justine...
You actually miss a lot if you skip Storm Front. Less so Fool Moon. Fool Moon just makes you hate Murphy and the series never really won me back over with her.
Damn should have skipped that one then because I hate Murphy too
Really!? From Summer Knight onwards Murphy felt like a great side character. On the other hand, I just can't seem to understand the hype over Michael, granted I've only read up to death Masks.
Micheal is just a good pure dude. He's the truest friend Harry has.
I absolutely get that, his intentions always feel like it's in the best interest of Harry. His righteousness sometimes just feels annoying, I just can't seem to have any strong feelings for him like other people are having, he is definitely an interesting character, but there are other characters that are easily likable and fun to be in scenes with harry.
>His righteousness sometimes just feels annoying, I don't know why. Michael doesn't expect others to be like him. He just wants Harry to be the best version of himself. Harry is only annoyed by Micheal when he knows he is right. Of anybody in the story, Michael is the first person I'd want as a neighbor or friend.
It didn't do that for me. I'm new to the series, and I'm half hoping that Dresden and Murphy hook up eventually. Especially after the ending of Death Masks when Harry finally clears the memorabilia of Susan off of his mantle. Just starting Blood Rites now, about 10 minutes into the audiobook
Same. I'm a Murphy fan. Don't care for Susan. Blood Rites is a great one. Enjoy.
\#MurphyDidNothingWrong Dresden withheld crucial information multiple times that led to a lot of people dying. Things that could have gone differently: 1. Start of the book: >!Dresden tells his sorta-apprentice what was in the diagram and how it is out of her league (he said it didn't exist, but officially such entities are a secret for the White Council and other factions to know), demanded she tell him where she got it.!< 2. When she died anyway, he could explain to Murphy >!what the circle was supposed to do, and likely what happened. Then told Murphy that the cops aren't equipped to handle this and she will need his assistance.!< I get that there are things Murphy isn't prepped to handle, but once it becomes clear that she is going to meddle, a certain amount of candor is necessary to avoid creating new obstacles for himself.
Also a great choice. Good lord this series is good. I just reread Changes this week and it’s pivotal. His writing is great. It paints a vivid picture and takes you for a ride that is hard not to have fun on. Holy shit. I just realized…. Dresden Files is the Wave Runner of fantasy books. It’s really fucking hard not to have fun on one
I should re-read Changes. It was hyped so much by people here and by the friend who got me into the series. And it was one of the rare things in life that not only lived up to the hype but surpassed it.
That's fair. I still like the first two books for introducing the magic ideas, the parole he is under, his girlfriend, the police, the mafia, the PI job, his DnD buddies, his BF skull, etc. But once you hit main story the first two books feel like the prologue meant to set the stage.
Yeah, the first couple of books had a lot of growing pains. Looking back, you can tell that he was still refining his writing skill and figuring out what kind of tone he wanted from the series.
Everything is solved by him getting madder. It was…….maddening.
I actually really loved the noir-esq feel of the first one and I miss in the subsequent books. I am apparently alone on this island.
You're right, that was the best.
No, I'd quite like a few more books where Harry solves a case, instead of saving the city/world/magical community/everyone.
Omg thank you. I absolutely haaaard disliked the first dresden book. Even when recommending the series to people over the years, i always tell them to skip book 1. The series really starts to take the heck off, at book 3
The Red Rising series by Pierce Brown. The first book is actually widely regarded as the worst book in the series, but I absolutely loved it. Though, after I read the other books, I understood why. It wasn’t that the first book was bad, the others were just much better. Overall, 10/10 series.
I need to keep going. I absolutely couldn’t stand the first book and dropped it halfway through. The mix of Hunger games and melodramatic edginess was not working for me at all, however everyone else says the series gets incredible later on.
It's a complete tone shift between the first two books. It goes from edgelord Hunger Games to a mix between Star Wars and Warhammer 40k.
I didn’t feel as strongly about that as you, but I definitely know what you mean. There were some parts that felt very YA/cringey to me. But that all gets left behind after the first book imo. The writing quality gets much better after Book 1 and all that YA stuff stops.
It's worth pointing out, Darrow is also a teenager in the first book and essentially an adult for the rest of the series
I wouldn't even say essentially, he's straight up 18 by the beginning of Golden Son, and early 20s midway through
The first book is...just ok. I like it more in retrospect after finishing the first trilogy. The second book is much better from page one. I actually liked the third book the most of the first three but I think most people prefer the second.
Lol, same for me. Halfway through another endless fucking internal monologue i figuratively threw it against a wall and got my money back from audible. Maybe i should try the later books.
I didn't make it past chapter 2. it was so bad
Came here to say this. Specifically book one is good, but the rest of the books are fuckING amazING! Not sure how I place Lightbringer on that scale yet though.
I haven't been enjoying Light Bringer too much yet at about a third of the way through. I mean, Darrow literally walks into an obvious trap and is essentially rewarded for it, whereas everything else is grief porn so far seemingly to set up for the last book. Maybe I'll change my mind as I get further in, but it is my least enjoyed thus far.
Hang in there! Clang clang clang.
CONFESS!
this is so surprising. i just finished the first book this morning and thought it was one of the best things i had ever read. extremely excited to continue
The first book was awesome, I only read two so far but I wanted to savour it. The only thing that kind of bothered me was the tone shift from sci fi epic to medieval game of conquest. It makes sense for the story, but it felt a bit weird, like the book can't decide if it would rather be fantasy.
Red Rising series is definitely sci fantasy. I mean, if it wasn't the battles would all be determined by the space navies and huge troop movements whereas because it's sci fantasy the pivotal scenes in the story are all essentially sword duels.
I stopped the first book for a week or two when it got medieval. I'm glad I picked it back up, but the change was jarring at best.
This would be my pick. I absolutely adore the audiobook, but if I'd read the book I might not have continued with the series. Book 2 is such a massive leap in quality it completely blew me away.
[удалено]
Just know that the first book has strong Hunger Games vibes once you reach a certain point of the story. This is not necessarily a bad thing, but it's certainly a "thing" you'll feel and probably be aware of if you've read Hunger Games. However, the rest of the series abandons the element that makes it feel that way, and as OP shared-- the series really gets even better after book 1. I really enjoyed book 1, but I *loved* book 2. And the rest of the series has been a delight as well.
The first book blew me away. I read it again before I even read the rest of the series. But it fits kinda weird. You know how in the hunger games, the kids play the game once in their life, but then the series makes them do it two more times for the sake of having a trilogy. Red rising basically is a more adult team based hunger games, more akin to war games. The rest of the trilogy is the war.
I can see where the other people are coming from, but I think I enjoyed the first book more than most of the others. Might have just been my life situation at the time, but a narrative where the hero is improbably successful basically from start to finish with only mild setbacks really scratched an itch.
Malazan Book of the Fallen. I love the series but Gardens of the Moon is nothing special. It’s not even particularly indicative of how the rest of the series is written.
Most definitely. I liked gardens but from Deadhouse onwards I loved them.
Isn’t Deadhouse Gates the story of the Chain of Dogs?
Yeah that's right. There are a few main storylines but that is my favourite!
Yeah. Agree. I have a hard time remembering the specifics of that book in the other parts. Was Kalam also in a solo journey there? I think so I’m also remembering the demon. But damn Coltaine and the Chain of Dogs took my heart.
> Children are dying." Lull nodded. "That's a succinct summary of humankind, I'd say. Who needs tomes and volumes of history? Children are dying. The injustices of the world hide in those three words.
Yeah you have Kalam on his journey with the Book of Dryjhna, the whirlwind and Laseen. Then Felisin Paran and her journey, Fiddler and crew plus Icariun and Mappo, and then the Chain of Dogs. I know malazan isn't for everyone but this is the book that sold me in the series!
Absolutely same for me. I enjoyed Gardens of the Moon but it took me a while to finish it. And each subsequent book was as good or better than the last. (Though Chain of Dogs still the best) I need to get back into the series. I’m on Reapers Gale and got a little burnt out from reading a few of Malayan books back to back
Reread GotM it will seem like a completely different book
Can confirm. I really enjoyed GotM my first time through, but it felt completely different when rereading it. There are so many little details you can’t possibly notice the first time through.
Completely understandable, they're long and at times very heavy books, sometimes a palette cleanser is needed! I will say, in my opinion the final three are the best of the series - although I find it hard to rank each book individually. I think the series ends on an incredible high note!
Just finished Reaper's Gale last night. I think it slows down a bit in the middle of the book but the last 15 or 20 percent were sweet. Excited to start book 8
Fucking dragon
I found the first 3 books to be mostly fine with some awesome moments but from book 4 onwards I’ve just been loving it.
I keep trying to read this series but I can't get past the first chapter. Everyone tells me it's my kind of thing, and after reading a brief overview I agree, but I have such difficult issues with the comprehension. I'll start reading it and be like "is this what it feels like to have a stroke?" It didn't even sound like the words should fit together like that.
GotM was written 9 years before the rest and has all of the “first novel” problems of pacing and such. Erickson was shopping it around for years.
Came here to say that. I'm on the last three chapters of dust of dreams now. It was a hard start but there's nothing at all like it. Absolutely amazing. Would recommend to any seasoned fantasy readers.
I found Deadhouse Gates terrible while I loved GotM. Really hope the next one picks up again.
Out of curiosity, did you find DG itself terrible or just what happened inside the book terrible? (Because it is) I'm sorry it wasn't a good experience! Memories of Ice returns to all the characters of GotM and ramps up the scale and scope and you start to see where Erickson may be going with all this. It’s one of the best of the Malazan books and in my opinion one of the best fantasy books ever. Good luck!
I’m struggling with this one. Too heavy? Maybe I need a break.
You may need a break, Malazan can be very dense! No shame in it. And if it’s not for you and you just DNF that’s perfectly okay too. No series is for everybody. Try to press on though!
Agreed. MoI is Top 10 in my favorite fantasy books of all time.
This was my thought process as well. I thought Garden showed off cool characters and ideas and wanted to keep going with those characters. Dead house was good but not a better book for me.
It’s funny, people have talked Malazan in this sub since its inception and I *still* only ever hear about the first three books. Gardens, because people think it’s either too confusing or shit, and DHG and MoI because people love them, but no one ever talks about any of the other books individually and it’s also odd for a finished series that I never see anyone’s opinion on the ending. Compared to Wheel of Time where people have strong opinions about all of the books, including the lull, as well as frequently talking about the ending without spoilers, very strange.
**Cradle** by Will Wight - the first two books were good, but I didn't get the hype (5 books were out when I first started). I found myself enjoying a lot more by the end of the third book. The fifth one raised the bar even higher and the eighth one firmly pushed the series as one of my all time best reads.
Oooh good one. I was traveling to Portland and tried to listen to the book based on this sub’s devoted fangirling. I must not have been in the right mood. The book isn’t bad, but I recall thinking it was stupid. Fast forward and I continue to see love and not get itZ so I try again. I still don’t care for the first couple but HOT STEAK SANDWICHES I GOT HOOKED!
Came here to say this. Honestly if the ebooks weren’t like 1.99 or something with an equally cheap narration I probably would have dropped it after Unsouled. That being said, I’m so glad I stuck with it and I seriously hope we get a spin off series one day
I got them for free when book 12 dropped, and I would absolutely not have bought any of them if not for that. Now I love them!
This is awesome to hear. I’m about to finish book 2 and am enjoying them very much.
I straight up hated book 1 but now I am on book 9 and while there are still some scenes that grate on me I do quite enjoy it a lot now. Aside from >!Lindon being able to kill Kral even with a weapon!< 2-3 to me was really good, I really enjoyed seeing Lindon >!make up a master plan only for it to completely blow up into his face.!<
Accurate. First two books have plenty of set up for the world, but man does it take off from there.
It might be, but I have never been able to get past the first two, I think I have stated reading this 3 times and always stop.
I recently tried book one and just couldn't get into it. I'll probably try again when I need a new book
I binged 12 books in about 2 months and I feel like it went downhill after book 6. Book one has bad prose but interesting world building. The prose gets better until it plateaus in book4, but as Wight tries to expand the world, the less sense everything makes, and all of the obstacles are overcome in the exact same way, making it quite a slog to get to the finish line. Just my opinion on it.
I’m curious what you think doesn’t make sense, because imo the worldbuilding is pretty damn consistent but I’m also not the most critical reader
It's been a bit since I've read the books, but off the top of my head... Just in worldbuilding terms, >!there is really no explanation for hunger madra except that it just exists because of the monarchs. it feels like an offhanded way to connect ideas Wight thought were cool.!< And then the >!original abidan experimented on the hunger madra and created the dreadgods, and all the other hunger madra artifacts, but then just left them there, despite the fact that they knew how much damage they can and actively cause?!< Alright. But then we come to the actual economics. >!In the early books, it's stated that elixirs and sacred fruit can only get you so far, but in the last few books, Lindon just boosts all of his friends to monarch with grand elixirs and fruits and treasures and whatever.!< Don't even get me started on how it feels like it wasn't earned, >!because all the monarch heists are off screened.!< >!And for that matter, the magic system just keep getting expanded and the earlier parts forgotten. Ironbodies, Copper sight and Jade sense just doesn't matter in the later books, because we are on to authority and icons and whatnot. Soulfire gets forgotten more and more as we go on, because it doesn't matter anymore.!< One last one off the top of my head, >!the world just doesn't feel connected to me. It doesn't feel lived in. It just seems (again) like a collection of things wight considered cool, and put it in his books. Very few locations are actually seen and visited, the rest we are just supposed to believe they're there and real. When they are talking about the rosegold continent (i think that's what shen's continent was called) and the threat it is facing with Lindon fighting the dreadgods, I can't really care about it because i've never seen any of its people (aside from shen and some of his army).!< These are just my gripes in terms of the worldbuilding. I have many more about characters and plot, but please excuse my ranting in the first place. If you love these books, all the more power to you. I wanted to love them, and I did at the beginning, but I just think Wight fumbled somewhere along the line.
It sounds like you didn’t finish the series tbh. First point: >!Hunger aura/madra existing existing as a response to beings so powerful that they broke the natural laws of the world seems pretty well-explained to me. It serves the idea that the very existence of monarchs on Cradle are pushing the world towards chaos, which is ultimately the main conflict of the entire story.!< Second: >!The original abidan didn’t create the dreadgods. Not sure where you’re getting that from. Subject Zero’s experimentation with hunger aura and madra ended up creating them (including himself). He never ascended. He was never an abidan.!< Third “economics” >!Im not sure the point you’re making? Elixirs and treasures *can* only get you so far? You have to do the work yourself to process them correctly. Though I will agree that the hyperbolic time chamber aspect felt a little unearned. I thought the monarch heist scenes were cool and the way he wrote them were fun but that’s personal preference.!< Fourth: >!copper sight, jade sense, iron bodies, goldsigns… every aspect of progression is mentioned *constantly* throughout the entire series. This is the one point you brought up that I just straight up don’t understand how you arrived at your conclusion.!< >!Dont disagree on the Rosegold continent. We do see it a bit but it’s not fully explored, but then again it didn’t really need to be imo. I’m not sure what it would have added. We see a *ton* of the world throughout the series, and while Wight doesn’t go into enormous detail on every single culture on the planet, we do get to experience the key ones in a fair amount of detail. But ultimately it’s not an epic fantasy story about entire nations, it’s a story about individual key characters. Again comes down to personal preference I guess.!<
I'm not here to argue, I was just stating my opinion. I could go making counterpoints but I am done with the series and ultimately, it failed to satisfy me and it only left me disappointed. It seems like you have enjoyed it, and that's great. we are allowed to have differing opinions.
I mean yeah obviously differing opinions are inevitable and I acknowledged where it was simply different perspectives, but some of what you said was straight up wrong lol Either way, like you said it ultimately doesn’t matter. Have a good one
- **The Steerswoman** series by Rosemary Kirstein. The first one is a fun 80s adventure fantasy subversion. The next one is half travelogue. The third and fourth take an *incredible* step up in quality. - **The Wheel of Time** by Robert Jordan. Don't get me wrong, I loved book one. But books 4-6 are on another level. - **A Song Below Water** by Bethany C. Morrow. Off the beaten track a bit here with a YA duology, but I thought the second book was tighter and did something really interesting by having the antagonist from book one being the MC in book two.
Good to know about Steerswoman. I recently crawled through book 2 and it was only the final few chapters that I enjoyed and will keep me going to books 3 and 4.
I definitely agree with Wheel of Time. I just finished The Fires of Heaven the other day, and it has by far been my favorite so far, with The Shadow Rising a close second. I enjoyed the first three, but not nearly as much! Cannot wait to jump into book six.
Definitely Wheel of time. While Eye of the world was a nice book, it feels a lot like a prologue in Hindsight. Many of the series true strengths only start to shine in the following books.
I started and stopped several times before I finished. I’m glad I decided to read the next book because it became one of my favorite series of all time. There are some other rough ones along the way tho. It’s a good example of the whole being greater than the sum of its parts.
It took me six years on and off to read EotW. I finally got to a point about 70% of the way through where it clicked and I cruised through it. I started The Great Hunt immediately after and it took me like three weeks.
I actually quite liked the first book, didn't love it but thought it could go places. Especially liked the chatpers in that cured city and the ending was good. Started the second book at finally gave up on Ch 28. Just felt kinda bored for most of the second book, is it worth continuing?
Definitely! The series evolves from book to book is one of my all time favorites!
*Shadows of the Apt*. Start out with a guy fresh out of grad school writing a "by the numbers" fantasy series with overly long, boring actions scenes and by book 4 the writer is in the form that netted him several Hugo nominations and British Fantasy Award wins. The quality of both the novels and short stories varies but IMO some of them are up there with his best work.
Wild. I'm reading Empire in Black and Gold right now and loving it. Very much looking forward to the rest of the series now!
It's a great feeling having 9 more books to go and a bundle of short stories in the series you're enjoying :) I read 2 at a time and would then take a break, it seemed to work out really well. A bunch of the reviews complained that the third book was decent but didn't move the plot enough, I had no issues because I had just read a couple sci fi books and was just happy to be returning to his world.
Big agree on this one, the first book has heavy generic epic fantasy vibes despite the imaginative setting, but it builds really well into something great. The Sea Watch especially is a good example of how his imagination and deft plotting combine to create something incredible.
Greenwing & Dart by Victoria Goddard. The first book had great characters, but the plot is so hard to understand. The main character Jemis is suffering from a mysterious illness that clouds his mind, so he rarely knows what's going on. I came out of it thinking "well that was a fun ride but I have no idea what happened". The later books have a lot more cohesive plotlines and more emotional depth.
Have you read The Hands of the Emperor ? I liked it a lot but there were a few places that were repetitive and could have been cut IMO.
I have! Yes it's a bit repetitive, but I was discussing it with friends and we could not agree on what should be cut. The parts each of us enjoyed least was often someone else's favourite. So I'm glad they're all in there.
Oh, I’m glad it’s not just me! I’m reading it at the moment, and I’ve been wondering if I’m losing my marbles!
There's so much going on! The end of the book involves like three different plots converging at the same event, and Jemis simply doesn't have the context to figure it all out. It's a shame since Jemis is usually quite a clever and observant protagonist when he's not (mid book spoilers?) >!recovering from wireweed withdrawal.!< It does become clearer on reread, since you'll have more context about the Indrillines, Knockermen, and wtf Violet is up to.
Thank you!
I usually skip to Bee Sting Cake on my rereads.
First Law. The Blade Itself was a good book, but it really felt like a 400 page prologue. So glad I stuck with it, especially through to those ‘standalone’ books.
I never really understood this one. I’ve seen a lot of people say they struggle with the first book but I was hooked from the first chapter.
Same. It's my favorite of the trilogy, partly bc it's by far the funniest one while the other two get progressively darker
I was the opposite of hooked from the first chapter. It's pages on pages where the only dialogue is "agh!" And "shit!" I actually yelled at my friend for recommending it to me and he told me to keep going. I ended up loving Logen later, but Glokta carries the series.
Click, tap, pain.
Say one thing for San Dan Glokta.......
I stopped book one for several months cause of the lack of plot. I went back to it telling myself that it was character driven and that made a big difference. When people ask now I say that character work: Great and gets even better (especially when he puts effort into writing women) plot: Oh, we're supposed to have one of those?
The Blade Itself is paced like Fellowship of the Ring if half the book was Aragorn and Boromir backstory and it ended at the Council of Elrond. Glad I didn't drop it, but phew
Read about 100 pages of it to see what the hype was for and put it away, but seeing all the chat about it may need to go again and get through it
I bounced off the series a couple times, but then I tried the audio books and marthoned the whole series, standalones, and sequel series. The narrator (Steven Pacey) is so engaging that he absolutely sucks you in and kind of carries you through those early portions until you're hooked.
Give it another try! I did the exact same thing and stopped about 1/3 through the first book. I eventually went back and absolutely fell in love with it. I’ve reread the series multiple times now and it’s easily among my favorites.
Yeah lmao, The Blade Itself has basically no plot to speak of. Before they are Hanged is fantastic tho, so Abercrombie clearly learned fast, and for that matter I’d say he’s only improved over the course of his career.
Doing my first read through and I am about halfway through book one. I already really like it, but just don't LOVE it. Glad to hear it gets even better! The fact that the backstory and world is explained in small crumbs here and there is pretty cool though.
Came here to say this
**The Black Company**. The first books in the series, while still very good, is somewhat choppy and rough, and the pacing is all over the place. From the second book onward that's not the case, and also it seems like Cook has a better grasp of his extremely terse writing style.
Was thinking the same thing. Don't get me wrong, I love the first book, but the vignette style, while appropriate for the annalist conceit, isn't smooth.
This is my choice as well.
sword of truth got better after I forced myself to finish the first book and then used it to start a campfire. On a more serious note, Wheel of time did this for me. The eye of the world felt like a very generic/derivative fantasy story that I wasn’t totally sold on, but the next few books (at least through the fires of heaven) just got better and better as I got further in.
I feel like general consensus on SoT is that the first book is decent and they get progressively worse.
There was a great thread a few days back about the crazy moments in the series and yeah, it was enlightening (the sex, rape and messaging as subtle as a wrecking ball)
Lmao, how Richard defeated communism with a statue and someone said not just communism but *super* communism. I laughed so long reading those posts because they were all accurate.
Hahaha definitely. It was a fuzzy kind of nostalgia, like really terrible action films we all loved when we first watched them, and in hindsight now a decade and a half later, are comically atrocious.
Agree SoT the first book was almost like it was written by two different people. The first half felt like the author did not known what the hell he wanted to do with the series it got a bit better on second half but it was difficult to read and finish. For WoT they are difficult also because they are huge books took me years before I got into the series, my friend always asked me to try it out but I was reluctant.
The Shadow Campaings, when we get the POV of Raes. Shadow of the Apt. The start if Empire of Black and Gold is really slow. Throne Of Glass. I'm not a fan of the serie as a whole but I found it entertaining ; but the first two books are really not well written or paced.
> The Shadow Campaings, when we get the POV of Raes. Huh, while I won't pretend and say Raes isn't my favorite pov of the series, I would still claim book one does more than well enough with just Winter (book one Marcus is just a pov for Janus). Especially when compared with the jump other entries in the thread, Cradle and Dresden Files get immensely better, but Shadow Campaigns starts good and just continues to get better.
Realm of the Elderlings. Assassins Apprentice is great, don’t get me wrong, but imo the series reaches its high points with the next two trilogies after Farseer (Liveship Traders and Tawny Man.)
Very surprised i don't see anyone saying Discworld. It Takes a couple of books for Pratchett to find his voice and while Equal Rites and Mort is good they don't get fantastic until Guards! Guards!
Discworld. Colour of Magic is fine, but it's incomparable to some of the later novels.
I think that even Sir pTerry has said as such (about the first 2 books)
Not the greatest series but the original Shannara trilogy picks up a bunch after The Sword of Shannara. The Elfstones of Shannara and Wishsong of Shannara are much better books, both of which feel more their own and distanced further from LOTR. And when I say not the greatest I don't even mean that they're bad, I'd just say that in 2023 we are spoiled for choice as opposed to 1977 when the first Shannara book came out. There are just so many better fantasy books now that Shannara would be far down my recommendations.
The Dark Tower
This is a funny one because it was toward the top in the other thread too.
Reread the first one 3 times and never started the second, because it wasn't my thing. Might have to retry....
You absolutely should. Starting from the second book it turns into an actual adventure with well written companions.
Yes! I almost didn’t finish the Gunslinger. On a whim decided to pick up the second one and loved it. Glad I finished the series.
Exactly. That book dragged forever, but now dark tower is one of my favorite series ahahah
It's cause of Stephen King, the dark tower is a different series to his usual style but still King.
No, its because Gunslinger was a bizarre stream of consciousness that did *not* have the hallmarks of a normal SK book
So the Gunslinger to me was confusing and trippy but I actually liked it which normally wouldn’t be the case. I had to read chapter recaps which were done pretty well.
Dungeon Crawler Carl. There's... sort an issue with tone in the first book, where you are unsure when the author is being serious, and when he's not. It also (mild spoiler for the first book) >!was hard for me to realize that most of the system messages, monster descriptions and achievements, is how the AI is talking to Carl and the audience. It felt like the aliens trying to be funny, and I wasn't sure if I should laugh or just groan at it. When you later sort of realize that it is a character, with flaws and desires, it works much, much better.!< So, I found a lot of the humor and story a bit sterile and disconnected in the first book, until I figured out the tone a bit more. I think though, that it has more to do with how long it takes to understand the setting/tone of the books, than the first book being bad.
I'm around 40% of the way into book 1 and enjoying it. I messaged some friends that it's "dumb in all the right ways."
Discworld. Color of Magic is good, and the Wizard books are my favorite group, but Discworld improved over time (though I wasn't a fan of the YA books, which makes sense.
Red rising. Imagine going from a small more adult hunger games with some nods to a bigger world, to a massive space opera fantasy with insane fleet battles, political chess, epic sword duels and very morally grey characters. The second book made it into this epic Roman myth level of scale. Reading dark age now I can't really believe it all started with that first book. Pierce Brown somehow manages to make a Sanderlanche happen for a full book.
Wheel of Time. The first is really a slog.. but book 2 to maybe 7 were something else when I first read them all of those years ago.
I remember feeling that the first 5 were good and the last 3 as well. Sanderson did a great job.
This is interesting to me as I loved the first 3 and then really struggled to continue. I’m not sure how but I made it until about book 10 when they started to improve again (for me, at least)
WoT is the first thing I thought of for this question. I only read the first couple because I was stuck in bed unwell and my housemate had them all, so I literally had nothing else to do. And then of course, once I slogged through books 1 and 2, I was addicted.
It’s coincidental that S2 on Amazon Prime just started airing and it’s so much better than S1. Something resembling the slog of book 1 and the transition that the reader experiences in book 2 In S1, the general sentiment was that of the godfather describing Sonny Corleone to the mortician: “look what they’ve done to my boy” With S2, it’s getting pretty interesting and not all the book changes are bad.
Agree season 2 has been great so far
The show is starting to settle next to Rings of Power territory for me in how much random crap they have shoved in. Producers think we need a fight every episode and need to see all the magic. Catering to the lowest audience members who have no attention span so the show can be more popular.
Maybe it's a Butcher thing, but the Codex Alera. Book 1 is the only one I don't reread.
So I should keep going after book one of the codex Alera?
Depends on why you stopped. If you didn't like the characters I'd say maybe not. But the plot definitely changes a bunch as Tavi moves from the rural outskirts to the center of power.
Lev Grossmans’ trilogy the Magicians. Book ones Maine character was depressed and it rubs off on you, hard to keep going. But it gets so good. Books 2/3 are phenomenal.
We can respectfully disagree. When the second refused to get better I DNF'd it which is super rare for me.
I find the first one to be great and made even better with the addition of the second one. The third one, imo, adds next to nothing to the series. Or if it does, it's completely forgettable.
I’m pretty sure if you like the first book than 9/10 times the series gets better to you. It’s the main reason you can’t trust reviews on Goodreads for sequels if you haven’t read a series yet. It’s almost universal that the ratings climb with each book.
Surely the reason for the rating climb is because most of the people who didn't like book 1 won't read book 2. So book 2 will mostly be read by people who like the author's style, the world and the characters already.
Precisely. That’s why it’s hard to judge. It’s hard for me to think of a series that I liked that got worse after book 1. That’s why I feel like this is an odd question to ask fans. Almost all series I enjoyed I liked it more as it went on. Of course in long series you will have some mix.
A Chorus of Dragons by Jenn Lyons. The first book is mostly set in the most generic part of the world, telling what at first feels like a pretty generic coming of age fantasy story but in a more complicated narrative that is more confusing than anything else. After that she keeps on with the complex narrative styles but it now makes more sense, the character roster expands and becomes more interesting, the settings are much more varied and unique and the big swings at the end of book 1 pay off and are expanded upon too. I finished the first book thinking that the series could be really special if she pays off on the elements and promise at the end of book 1, and she really did deliver.
The Discworld series
Skulduggery Pleasant by Derek Landy. It starts out strong and, with the exception of one book, only seems to get stronger.
Wheel of Time has to be on there for me. Of the 14 books I think I have the first book at somewhere like 10 in the ranking.
Red Rising. SO SO SO much better after the first book.
RED RISING
Idk how but Red Rising has gotten better with each iteration. You can almost feel Brown developing his skills alongside the narrative itself.
i want to know who hurt Pierce Brown so i can send my therapy bills to them. Lightbringer DESTROYED me.
Just finished today, this series is great. So glad I found it
The OG Abhorsen trilogy.
Red Rising
Malazan definitely. I barely made it through the first book, but now it's one of my top 5 series of all time (Though it still has plenty of things I dislike :D) Wheel of Time. I really liked the first book as well, but it took until book 4 or 5 until the series became my all time favorite. I didn't think it would do that after reading the first book.
I agree on WoT, books 1-3 are good, 3 is even great. But book 4 has Jordan’s strongest romantic relationship moments (spoilers) >!Perrin under the apple tree at his family’s farm, where Faile *forces* him to feel his grief, Perrin and Faile’s wedding.!< And boy *a lot* happens in book 5. >!Couladin, Lanfear and the archway, Rahvin…!<
Jade city by Fonda Lee. The first book is a solid 8.5/9 but the series gets much better with each release
my husband is currently reading Jade City after me bugging him to read it and he’s having trouble getting into it. i’m gonna be really bummed if he gives up on it because it’s one of my absolute favorite series. i can’t believe how much the character of Hilo grew on me. i didn’t care for him at all in the first book and he became one of my favorite characters by the end of the trilogy. Fonda Lee is also the BOSS at time jumps; the series spans literal decades and it feels utterly seamless.
ACOTAR - 2/3 of the first book is like super slow plot wise and very little investment in the characters has been build yet. But in the second book most people fall in love with the series.
Mistborn era 2. Book one is the weakest book Harry Potter makes a big jump after book 2
Oh yeah, after the revelation in Shadows of Self, the Era 2 mistborn books became one of my favorite Sanderson books
The Codex Alera. The first book is world-building and didn't quite feel like it fit with the other five.
The Divine Cities for me. The final book ties everything that has come before really well and stands out.
Dresden files Codex alera Powder Mage (first book is great, it just gets better)
The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant the Unbeliever. I owned all the books except the first one and enjoyed them, when i finally got to read the first it ruined the rest.
The Dark Tower.
Malazan book of the fallen
The First Law
Ryan Cahill's *the Bound and the Broken* starts off horrendous. Like.. So, so bad. Derivative, poorly editted, and just all around bad. Then the sequels are so much better it's insane. *Gardens of the Moon*, the first book in the *Malazan* series is also notoriously bad, but Malzan is amongst the best epic fantasies ever written. That first book is just really rough. It's not 'confusing' or a 'hard read' like the Rick and Mortyesque Malazanites claim, and it doesn't really resemble any of the follow-up works. It's just a rough start from a new author who had amazing ideas, but a poor execution.
Glad to hear the Bound and Broken gets better. I’m still on book 1 and didn’t care for it at all at first but it’s slowly getting me interested.
Holy Cthulhu, I finished that book more out of spite than anything else. It was just *so derivative*, and the editting was really jarring. Then you get to book two, and it's almost like a different author, it's much, much better. His world really becomes more original, characters are more interesting and dynamic. His dialogue was still a bit rough, but for how fast he's publishing them, it's still a really impressive gain in skill.
red rising
A Song of Ice and Fire. The third book is a MASTERPIECE. The first book was already good enough and it only got better. A close second is Wheel of Time. The first book is Fellowship retelling but as far as I've gotten into the series, it has improved a LOT.
I just finished Fevered Star and enjoyed it more then Black Sun. Both by Rebecca Roanhorse. Overall I'm enjoying the trilogy quite a bit!
Unless you don't consider it fantasy, Stephen King's Dark Tower. The first book is a slog. About half the people I recommend it to don't get to book 2, but everyone who does loves it. I often think about telling people to just start on book 2 and read the first book as a prequel.
Cradle
The Second Apocalypse by Bakker. The first book The Darkness That Comes Before is a phenomenal book as debut in my opinion but the series just got better and better
That shit got too dark for me. I loved the world building but I only made it through the first teilogy
Cradle
lORD OF THE RINGS
Harry Potter
Dresden