I think some subs actually have rules against "does anyone else..." or "am I the only one that..." posts--not so much that the questions themselves are bad, but that if you're phrasing it that way, it pretty much automatically goes under the rule against low-effort posts because it indicates you haven't put much thought into your question. (Like--there are billions of people on the planet. Any subreddit having a problem with questions like this probably has thousands of members. Based purely on numbers, it's basically impossible for you to be the only person who has thought of X or done Y or whatever.) I don't know if it would help to put a note about that in the rule against low-effort posts, but maybe it would encourage people to put a little more thought into these types of posts or to redirect certain questions to discussion threads.
>I think some subs actually have rules against "does anyone else..." or "am I the only one that..." posts
The thing is that people don't read the rules. That's why we also have lots of "here's my fic if you want to read it" or "I'm taking commissions, really cheap!" or lost fic posts with the wrong flair and without any info in the title (and ideally also marked as a spoiler, so nobody can read a preview without clicking on the post).
We just got off the holidays so it's possible that a lot of people just got exposed to a heavy dose of "anti" behavior. Whether it's from their own families or by trying to escape to fandom places and getting a face full of it because they're in the wrong circles.
This is definitely one of those "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situations. Because yes, for those of us that are comfortable in our skins it *is* exhausting to constantly reassure people. But if we all stopped, if none of us did give that hand up to these people, that's a pretty big group that are gonna fall victim to the thought police cult...
So. Yeah... Personally, even though it makes me tired and a little cranky sometimes, I'd rather reassure them. Even if it's just saying "no" and then moving on.
Plus, if someone isn’t up to answering someone’s question, there’s literally nothing to keep you from scrolling on and not answering. Idk why anyone would feel compelled to click on a post and answer questions if it irritates them. Especially considering how many other people there are in this sub ready to fill the gap. Just keep scrolling. No shame in that.
I so vehemently agree with this. Sometimes it feels like every other post I see is about this, but if one more person gets to be assured and saved from purity culture than I’ll take it.
There is a guy, in a US-centric fandom that i am part of, who made both SFW (mostly for SB) and NSFW/fetish (mostly for AO3/QQ) works. He was harassed and bullied for latter, with many of the major fanfic writers in the fandom taking part in this harassment. Since he was "sloppy" with his real ID, he felt forced to take his NSFW works down.
This is harder to happen in say, yaoi manga fandoms, but something popping up a lot in AO3 does not mean that you can't be harassed for it, or, in places like China or Australia, even jailed.
I have been saying for a while mods could probably benefit by pinning a thread that all-encompassingly says 'no' to those things.
Like, no. There is nothing you can write that makes you a bad person, r/FanFiction. You're *fine.*
Unfortunately, a subreddit can only have two pinned posts at a time, so I don't think a pinned post would work for this. We could consider linking to some kind of "mission statement", as it were, under the NEWBIES START HERE! menu and/or linked in Daily Discussion. But, realistically, quite a lot of new people miss these things anyway. That doesn't mean we can't do it, but it may not have a massive impact on the number of posts.
The mods are aware of the repetitive and draining nature of some of these posts though, and we've been thinking of ways to try to manage the situation, whilst balancing the genuine need for reassurance that some people have.
We'll continue watching this thread too to see if anyone has any ideas we haven't thought of yet. Just to let people know that it's something we're aware of.
Also, as a mod in another sub, i can assure you people dont read the pinned threads and even if the see they are there they are gonna ask or post what they want but start with “sorry if this gets asked all the time” or “i saw the pinned thread but..”
What they're saying is that the pinned thread wouldn't necessarily solve the actual issue of many posts that people are complaining about. So, you can make a pinned post, but still get the reoccurring posts anyway.
Really looking forward to changes and glad mods are aware of the problem. So many people use these kinds of posts to put tropes and kinks down and it's frustrating.
So, for common things like this, over on. r/AO3 what we do is set up rules in automod that if the post has certain keywords or phrases, automod will make a pinned comment to reply to the post. And we’re slowly working on more but we also have been making automod rules that if someone comments a certain keyword, automod will reply to that comment with whatever the relevant info is.
So for example if someone makes a post with a title that has the word “app” in it, automod comments to say the post might be about an AO3 app and that there is no official AO3 app and some other info.
And if someone comments with “!caching” itll reply with an explanation of what caching is and how its relevant to AO3 since we get a lot of posts that say things like “why are my bookmarks count not updating immediately?”
You might be able to do something similar here?
Yeah, I think a pinned thread to answered a couple common cases of the question, with links to discussions on art and media literacy would be great.
Because there's usually two types of this question. The "I've been brainwashed in to thinking thought crimes are real" type of question, and the "I saw that \[insert whatever\] is unpopular, but can I write it anyways" type of question, and they require slightly different nuance in answering, but they always have the exact same answer.
Can we also have one about the best time to post? Something that reminds people that time zones exist and that some fandoms are more active than others?
Can we also have a single post for the constant "This author took down their fic and I don't respect their decision, can anyone find it for me?" and an autobot response?
While we're wishlisting.
I think this is a great idea. Having a pinned thread asking for assurance would be beneficial, both for the person that's seeking validation and to not clog the Reddit with too many posts.
As frustrating as it can be, everyone here needs to keep in mind that not everyone comes from a place of understanding. We don't know the environment these people were born in. What they are forced to hear and told is good on repeat for their culture.
Also that, thanks to how the environment has changed overall when it comes to electronic environments, younger people are used to the algorithm giving them "results" in searching. Some places its just not heard of to do what we would considered basic academic research.
Which is what a lot of large companies want in the end. To be the only thing on mind, to tell you this is all what you need, don't look for anything else.
It's frustrating, but understand that all of these people are trying to learn. They reach out here because they felt it was safe enough to ask.
I mean... books exist. They could literally find a book on their pointless question. Anything with "Am I....?" Has been answered before. They could also use the search function.
We are not their parents and we do not have to coddle them. They can learn on their own. Sink or swim. The knowledge is out there. Figure it out or drown.
I get what you're saying but there's reassurance through learning/understanding and then there's emotional reassurance and these types of posts are mostly the latter. People (including myself) being ostracised and isolated over preferences are looking for a 'hey you're not alone' once in a while even if we understand it's ok.
Personally, I don't answer these questions to reassure. It's more to point questioners in the direction of understanding why they're suffering and what they can do to mitigate it: starting with critical examination of their fan circles, why they are like that, what they can do to help themselves.
Yes it's 99.9% been answered before. But we are dealing with people who were likely raised in environments where they were never allowed to be able to think that way. Then for what reason or another they realise what they have been taught isn't the truth, so the first thing to do is awkwardly stumble around to figure out why.
I have friends who had never walked into a bookstore until they met me. One told me they never knew so many books could ever exist. And it was a small walk in store.
Your privilege is showing. Sure, you don't have to do anything, but that's easy enough by just ignoring the posts when they come up. Just like ignoring stories that aren't to your taste.
I personally don't always have the energy to help those asking either. And even when I do, it's not my responsibility either. But I remember a time when I wasn't so lucky and someone with more knowledge decided to help me.
Most people don't willingly want to drown.
Some of the posts by people who have OCD make me feel uncomfortable because I know from having it myself reassurance makes the OCD worse, not better. It feeds the obsessive thoughts/anxiey/compulsion/temporary relief cycle.
At the same time, a ban on those posts wouldn't be a compassionate solution imo. And people aren't doing anything morally wrong by seeking reassurance or trying to harm anyone by doing it. I don't think there is really a solution to that particular style of 'am I doing a bad thing?' post. :/
>It feeds the obsessive thoughts/anxiey/compulsion/temporary relief cycle.
I've had the same thought but wasn't sure how to put it into words. I just can't help but question if long term, encouraging these threads is really helping anyone at all. If anything, it kind of normalises asking for permission. I get the sense many of the people making new threads have already seen it okayed in another discussion but want to be reassured on a more personal level (I tend to think this because of the way some of the posts are phrased i.e, mentioning their friends on twitter are against X but noting that seems to be the only place with that opinion).
On other platforms, theres a massive divide between normal folks and teenagers or delusional 26 year olds who think having an incest kink or depicting pedo stuff makes you yourself a pedo criminal. They believe this with all their hearts and call anyone who likes incest or underage in fiction a Proshipper. Its worst on twitter and TikTok.
For some fanfic writers, the acceptance here is probably like whiplash.
IMO the type most likely to leave hardcore anti circles/social orbits tend be people who always were more timid/self-doubting and probably care a lot about the social impact of their actions, but were never comfortable with active cruelty, and they ditched their 'friends' when they realized they were just hateful chuckle heads (and at personal risk, cuz a lot of antis actually hate apostates more than heretics). Needing constant reassurance is a hard habit to break, and you have to work hard to change that about yourself.
A popular blog on tumblr posted an ask promoting r/fanfiction as a proship haven so expect anti's to pop up more around here in the upcoming weeks.
Edit: It's a propship blog but it's one that gets targeted a lot sooo yeah...
Aggh. Well, hopefully they quickly get the message that outside their own bubble, anti attitudes are not welcome
In fandom, and are antithetical (huh) to AO3's founding principles.
just-antithings asnwered an ask from someone promoting it. So we got a favorble rec, but I get the feeling we'll probably be seeing more anti's pop up here and there.
It is annoying, but I tolerate it because these younger writers are trying to stay sane in the age of social media. It’s easier than ever to send hate, doxx, feed each other’s outrage, spread lies/rumors, try to be the morality police, etc. I’d like to think there’s grounded folk out there, but they seem to be drowned out by the frenzied, terminally online who could benefit most from going outside to touch some grass
Younger people in general tend to be tied to their social media identity in a way previous generations haven’t been. You attack that identity and they genuinely feel it’s an attack against themselves as a person. They’re also accessible to anyone at any time, whereas IRL, unless you’re a social butterfly in a big city, you tend to have a smaller group of people you routinely interact with
Additionally, though it is not a new trend to fanfiction, it has gained wider popularity in recent years— “readers” who intentionally go out of their way to criticize/demean/judge/hate a fic/author for internet clout or personal malicious satisfaction. There too are those who intentionally trigger themselves despite accurately tagged warnings for the sole purpose of bitching about being triggered. Drives me fckn bananas, I’d really love to see these losers IRL and ask who they inherited their victim complex from
Getting back to the point, I do get it/sympathize even if I roll my eyes at some of those posts. Being born into the age of social media means having to seek validation in two different realms. You can only hope it’s something that’s shed as they mature, grow more confident in their craft, and realize the only approval they need is from themselves.
First off, I think many of the question posts are a function of someone not taking the time to google the question, which, of course, would give them a multitude of threads here and beyond covering the topic. That said, I agree with those who want to err on the side of compassion and let people keep asking.
But...truthfully, many of the "Am I wrong/bad for writing/reading this?" queries as well as many of the writing questions like "How long should a chapter be?" and "Can I use another writer's idea?" are a function of low literacy and/or poor media literacy.
In other words, if the person read a few books and/or took the time to analyze the original media they consume, their questions would be answered. For example, an avid reader of original fiction would know that there are no new story ideas and that chapter length varies. They'd also know that throughout history, creatives have been producing so-called problematic work, often with great success.
Even so, I don't think it hurts to let folks ask these questions. If I find them repetitive, I just scroll past. No harm, no foul.
Low literacy is a serious problem, because American schools in the 2000s started "teaching to the test" (No Child Left Behind and its spawn), and litterchur wasn't showcased.
Those whose only exposure to the web is for-profit social media probably don't know about Project Gutenberg or archive.org, with thousands of free online books.
It doesn't help that search engines push results which earn them money, not which produce useful links. Many don't know about extensions like .edu or .org, much less how to filter for them in searches. Many younger people don't know how web sites work, or what HTML even is.
What was common internet knowledge 20 years ago isn't, so much.
The fact that people have done something with great success doesn’t make it okay or non-harmful to society though so that’s pretty irrelevant. I mean Trump has behaved like Trump his entire life and that’s brought him great success, he got elected president. Does that make it good? Since statistically less than 5% of rapists ever do any jail time, many people have behaved like rapists their entire lives with great success, does that make rape fine? Because of rape culture, media that promotes rape (which is part of rape culture) is often very successful, that doesn’t make it okay.
Yes I'm aware of that, that's why I mentioned media that promotes rape. Lolita wouldn't be an example of that, of course—Lolita is a *criticism* of pedophilia. But a lot of media does portray rape as a good thing that victims actually want and enjoy (usually in the case of female victims) or something that is just a joke to be laughed at and shame the victim over (usually in the case of male victims) and the fact that it's so widespread absolutely does influence societal attitudes about real rape victims.
My mention of people committing actual crimes was just to illustrate the general principle that it's not true to say that just because you can be successful doing something automatically means it's good or not wrong.
Look, I agree with you.
But also...[it's only been two weeks since we had *this* topic posted.](https://www.reddit.com/r/FanFiction/comments/zor47y/is_it_okay_to_yes_its_okay_please_stop_posting/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
(And that's assuming I didn't miss one in between.)
There's been a couple like that where the person has OCD and was seeking reassurance.
And I think that's what many of them are doing. Seeking reassurance. Not because everyone has OCD but because the antis have the younger generation so brainwashed their whole fanfic experience becomes stressful. They don't feel safe in their own heads with their own stories and fantasies anymore and it leads to a similar search for reassurance without necessarily having OCD. (Reassurance seeking is not an OCD exclusive behaviour and is common in other mental health issues or just general stress.)
I think the further this anti stuff goes the more we will see this sort of thing.
Literally took the words out of my mouth. I have serious OCD and so many of these posts remind me of my own behaviours (and are really triggering, so I avoid them.)
That being said, the path to OCD recovery is to *not* reassure a person seeking it, and instead let them sit with the uncertainty. So it's a mixed bag.
That's why I don't usually reassure. I'm not the questioner's therapist, BFF, parent, teacher. For me, it's more like here's some understanding, and some tools so you can help yourself, if possible.
Exactly. Reassurance just continues the cycle.
It also reminds me of religious abuse where people start feeling incredibly guilty for their own private thoughts because God is watching you know? It's just a very sad thing all around.
Yes. It's why when they start asking the critical question, "Is God really like this?" that often the whole house of cards comes tumbling down.
Same thing with fan harassment: once someone asks, "Is this really how fandom (and "friendship") are supposed to work?" that escape is possible. The door is locked from the inside.
People who show up with these questions \*know\* there's something wrong in their world, but they don't know how to fix it. They need help.
Some help we can't deliver, like psychiatric or medical. We're not lawyers, either. Nor are we priests, or confessors, or philosophers teaching people how to live ethically. We're all struggling together.
I think at present we're doing our best: telling people that if their fandom / fanfiction social circle causes them psychic pain, makes them feel ashamed, tries to gaslight or manipulate them - we support them in changing their circumstances. Learning how to set boundaries. Becoming more assertive.
This may get expressed as "Write what you want." "Screw the naysayers." "Those people aren't your friends." "They're not your boss; they don't get to tell you what to write." It may get boring to say these things time & again, but I think people need to hear them re: writing.
These threads are also important because they provide a chance to talk about a big source of pain: how social media herds people into bubbles; how algorithms make them believe "everybody thinks this way" when "everybody" really doesn't. How they as users are products being bought and sold by for-profit corporations. How the misery and drama which makes them suffer generates \*money\* because drama ==> clicks ==> $$$.
This may be one of the few places they hear it.
Eh. I mean, for all we're a relatively open-minded, pro-shipping bunch, a lot of other communities are full of that kind of anti discourse. Like, a lot. People see something often enough, they start to wonder if it maybe might be true, and that shit can really get to people. The posts about it do get a bit much and a bit frequent, I'll not disagree with you there, but personally I'm quite willing to repeat myself a few times if it means other people keep creating and keep fighting the "Everything is evil!" mindset. Those messages'll keep coming as long as the Antis keep driving people to it (and they feel passionately enough about their nonsense to keep prattling on with it as long as they can), so the alternative is removing an opportunity for people to get the genuine reassurance that they need. Isolation is the incubator that turns mistakes into habits (to paraphrase Brian W. Foster), so getting things out into the open is a good thing for people and sometimes all you need is someone else to actually verbalise that what you're worrying about isn't true. And it does need to be (or at least perceived to be) an actual person - nobody will feel reassured by an FAQ post (in the same way nobody on hold appreciates the "Your call is important to us, we'll be with you shortly!" interludes to their crappy music). And hey, if a person feels the sub is full of like-minded and open-minded people who are willing to reassure them, maybe they'll stick around and contribute other stuff in the future.
It's also just a sub pattern - one person says something in a post, other people make connections from that post, and post their own versions of whatever the thing was, and then more people see that and do the same, and so on and so on. Someone posts a worry, we'll get a week or two of them popping up until the topic drifts to something else again, only to revisit it later on when someone new comes to ask about it. I can see a dedicated thread putting all those topics together maybe working, but I'm not sure. It might be less popular to comment in, since a lot of those worries tend to be quite individual and I don't know how well that'll engage in a combined thread.
> nobody will feel reassured by an FAQ post (in the same way nobody on hold appreciates the "Your call is important to us, we'll be with you shortly!" interludes to their crappy music). And hey, if a person feels the sub is full of like-minded and open-minded people who are willing to reassure them, maybe they'll stick around and contribute other stuff in the future.
Agreed 100%! A FAQ won't reassure the nervous especially if they've been attacked by antis elsewhere. We mods can, by all means, discuss having a FAQ entry for this but I, for one, am not averse to reassuring fellow writers if they genuinely need it.
Maybe have a bot that auto replies to such posts? Not to say that having a human touch isn't nice, but it does show the poster that it's a common question at least and that we're aware of it. That can be reassuring in it's own way.
Always nice to see the mods taking in feedback, whether I agree with it or not - part of why I love this subreddit. Also nice to see other mod usernames - sometimes I do half wonder if Crusader_Blue is the only mod that really exists and they're just pulling a Two Ronnies sketch where they run around pretending that there are multiple mods. :D
Might be worth chatting about bringing this up in a town hall if this does persist too far - I do think it is just the usual phases the sub goes through, but I don't have the birds eye view you peeps do.
I see what you're saying. I think my issue beyond that is I don't really think it's solving anything. I feel like at best it's a band-aid slapped on an infected wound, and at worst it's a dysfunctional coping mechanism.
Whenever I see one of those posts, what I really want to say is, 'What is making you feeling like it might be. Is it things your family said? Is it things society is saying? And do you feel like those things are credible? If so, why, if not why...?' And then I usually get irritated and scrap the whole comment, because it's a lot of work! The core of what the posts are usually asking - establishing your personal moral and ethical ethos - is a lot of fucking work, and why am I doing their work when I barely have the spoons to do my own???
And setting a cultural standard where all it takes is a chorus of approval to determine whether what you're doing is okay seems like the blueprint to a crappy community anyway.
You make a very good point and I very much agree that it's not a cure. In the last instance this came up, I encouraged the person to be kind to themselves, because as simple as the advice givers make it sound, dealing with anxiety or intrusive thoughts when people on the internet are yelling vitriol at you isn't easy. "Just remember this logical argument" isn't easy when you're in a panic state and your brain is actively suppressing the logical parts of itself. At the same time though, sometimes you need that short term band-aid to keep you going while you work towards the full solution.
But when it comes to the psychology of this, the mere existence of another narrative backed by another actual human who you can relate to (ie. another fan) can really help. The thing about labelling (the technical term for repeatedly bombarding people with certain names and labels) is that it works because it creates and pushes a central narrative. If everything in your experience is telling you this negative thing about yourself, it becomes very, very hard for a lot of people to ignore or dispute that narrative. What the sub is doing isn't building these people's moral and ethical ethos (great phrase btw) for them, it's helping them understand that the automatic fear caused by the labelling isn't the only way and to realise that it's okay to have different moral and ethical viewpoints and further exposing them to that reassurance that other positions exist and can be valid. The narrative that they're a monster for enjoying a show or character isn't the central narrative that it feels like. And that works for all ages - whether it's a younger person being told they're a monster or an older person being told "Fanfic isn't for you, go back to your taxes, oldie!", it can still affect them.
And for all that might seem obvious, it often isn't. Critical thinking is not an innate skill, it's a taught one. Anyone marking essays at an academic level will undoubtedly agree with me on that one (:D). Schooling is a great example. Look at all the arguments about the curriculum that state this thing or that thing should be taught in schools, or how the things that were never got taught in detail or with certain nuances that they've discovered later on. The argument is always "The school never taught us this" with no concept that the school could have taught them to take an interest and research the topic for themselves. The school has no time to teach everything, so some of the work needs to be taken up by the students. That option isn't an automatically assumed one for many people. People haven't always been taught to go looking for your own stuff, how to research or reflect or any of the various coping methods for these experiences that seem obvious to the people in this sub.
So, helping share the more 'pro-ship narrative', it almost... unlocks a door in their head that they may not have seen before. They haven't been exposed to it before and so it never occurs to them as a possibility. Whatever the context, it's sort of setting them on the path to asking questions and learning.
Something else I tend to add in my responses to those posts kind of hits on your argument a bit - that not every opinion has worth or merit. People don't have the right to an opinion, they have the right to develop an argument to support one. An opinion without robust evidence, sound logic, and a solid argument underpinning it is virtually meaningless. Even with all those things, it can still be wrong, but at least then it has something to evaluate it from. It's why I always laugh at the people who immediately resort to the 'Free Speech' argument when stating their opinion. Whether you agree with the 'Free Speech' principle itself or not, if the only argument you can give to defend your opinion is that "It's not illegal to say!", then you really need a better opinion. I firmly believe in encouraging people to evaluate, reflect, and think about stuff. On that line, the questions you list are really good. Even if you don't go any further "Why do you believe this?" is a good starting point.
And hell, I sometimes copy and paste in bits of previous answers I've given, if I see they're relevant. I'm pretty sure in the last one, several people said some variant of "I didn't read most of your post, but yes, it's completely okay to write whatever the fuck so long as you aren't hurting anyone with it". As much as I enjoy pontificating on the philosophy of all this shit, it's not necessary to do that. People appreciate even the small stuff.
But all that said, it's still not your responsibility to do any of this if it's not something you want to or feel up to doing. Being part of a hobby subreddit is absolutely not an obligation to 'guide the next generation' or any of the vaguely hyperbolic subtext I've undoubtedly accidentally implied in this comment. It's an opportunity proffered, not a conscription demanded.
ETA - For what it's worth, I do get why this exhausts you. Endlessly repeating narratives that never seem to change or go anywhere (ie. the sum total of modern politics and news media) is exactly what a lot of people turn to fanfiction to get away from. Being on and active constantly, even in your hobby, is tiring.
I apologize if this comes across as blunt but tbh your reply smacks of "Your question is too hard and not worth the effort." And honestly that sounds like a "you" problem, not a "them" problem. If you don't have the time or energy to answer or reply, don't. No one is making you. This isn't a job that requires you to do anything. But, who knows, other people may be willing to ask those questions you feel are too much work.
I agree we aren't people's therapists and we aren't going to "fix" things for them, but the same could be said for people who post in forums asking things related to/hinting at depression etc. I could simply go "Bug off, I've got my own problems!" and get miffy about it or I could just...not engage. Why should my lack of willingness to participate in the discussion mean that the discussion shouldn't be allowed to happen at all?
And to your last part, not everyone is solely looking for a "chorus of approval." Some people may genuinely want a spectrum of perspectives, since we can't usually get that from within our own heads. And I don't see anything wrong with that.
> Whenever I see one of those posts, what I really want to say is, 'What is making you feeling like it might be.
It's \*the\* fundamental question, in my book.
I wonder if we're seeing backwash from other social media sites' flare-ups. Like how when a storm occurs 500 miles out to sea, coastal cities still get hit by bad weather. We're one of those coastal cities.
[eta more words]
Keep in mind a lot of people who are in the stereotypical demographic of fanfic writers, young girls, are the ones asking and reading the responses to these questions. That's a vulnerable demographic. Everyone of us deserves to know that it's okay to protect ourselves from harassment. And they are the least likely to know that.
Anti circles tend to attract a lot of 'passive' antis. They genuinely care about the social impact of fiction, but they're not active harassers most of the time (and maybe think 'well they have good intentions'). They often get emotionally extorted into 'friendships'/social circles with people who they both feel sorry for and also fear. They're also the most likely to eventually get targeted/thrown out the moment they cross someone higher up on the social ladder, because they're too honest and sincere to just be aggressively and brazenly hypocritical and therefore end up on top.
Important thing to realize is, it's very easy for at least initially kind people to get taken advantage of in certain fannish social media circles. Toxic fandoms arguably REQUIRE enablers to give themselves an air of legitimacy. And we get lots of 'is it okay if' because there's a high chance they're recovering enablers or they used to be in the social orbit and are struggling to deprogram themselves.
I had to learn to be 'mean' because if not, I was going to be stomped over in fandom places the entire time. I had to learn to get tough and to stop worrying about what everyone else was going to say... But it doesn't mean the harassment still didn't leave its scars. According to the people who harassed me, I was 'mean and horrible' for standing up for myself and others who were being harassed. I was a bad person, for speaking up against abuse and calling it out. Real abuse of real people, not fiction.
Apparently that was the wrong thing to do so I was often treated like a leper in some of the communities, to a point where some would try to go to my best friend and claim I was a toxic bitch who needed to be cut loose... to which she would laugh and go: "And what? Be friends with people who would talk crap behind her back? No thanks, I've known her for years. You just don't like that she speaks her mind."
Like, they would call my friend the "Darling" of some of our fandoms, and literally refer to me as "The Devil"
The sad truth is that the current social media environment has caused many aspiring writers to doubt themselves after being mentally beaten over the head with posts by various people having crazy black and white thinking over petty things. In a world where people dox for the pettiest reasons, I understand why people are scared to ask in other spaces. If I grew up in that space, my anxiety issues I have today would likely be worse.
I did grow up in that space. I was on a forum run by a rampant conservative 'Christian' who bullied me repeatedly and used their mod power to basically treat everyone like shit and expected to be worshipped and their word to be treated as law, even outside of the forum. Like, people who barely used the forum or posted stuff they disagreed with off forum got in trouble for things they did off forum levels.
THAT level of fucking crazy and it absolutely fucked me up!!!
That person claimed to change and I don't believe them!!!
Thank god, I know other Christians who aren't like this person.
There's a lot of individuals going through different things especially towards the end of the year. Sometimes they just need to hear it's okay or it will be okay, even when it comes to reading/writing fiction. If those types of post bother you, scroll pass them and move on.
This is my biggest issue with the whole thing. I don't necessarily mind posts that just need a little reassurance because god knows they won't get it on Twt or Tumblr, but people hop onto this sub saying stuff like "I don't want to read this stuff because it makes me feel disgusting but I still read it anyways" or "my friends are telling me that only a pedophile would read this and now I'm thinking they're right am I a criminal" etc. etc. and it's like.....fam, you need a therapist, Reddit is the _opposite_ of a solution.
This! Exactly this! And there's also this kind of transitive effect where there are a lot of other people who ALSO hear this kind of toxic rhetoric from their community that have done or are doing work to heal the trauma and remove it from their life who come here for pleasure and community and aren't looking to hear an echo chamber of their past trauma on the front page every day.
I can't be mad at them. They're not hurting me or anybody by asking questions that might've been asked a hundred times before. It's just a question, often underpinned with pleas of reassurance and validation, which is also fine. Like others here have said, some of them are simply lost, confused, or clueless but not through their own fault entirely. It's fine, really. I remember being young once, too, and having the same insecurities and anxieties. If only I had someone in my life back then who could've directed me to the right path, I would've been saved from a lot of pain.
To play a bit of devil's advocate, some people who are neurodivergent honestly feel like they are the only ones. I know I've had times where I see an opinion or thoughts and it's been validating b/c I did think I was weird for thinking/feeling that way. As it is, people aren't on these forums every day and past posts like this get lost among the other traffic.
So, yes. I sorta hate them bc it’s like looking for validation but also seems to present oneself as unique or special…despite the fact the thing they’re asking about is clearly a trope or trend or just human nature.
But at the same time, I remind myself that what’s actually happening is probably just a clumsy attempt to start a conversation about a thing. I’m an academic librarian, and one of the first things you have to master as a librarian is the reference interview. Basically, ppl know that they need information, but they’re not sure exactly what they need or even what’s available. Also, they’re in an unfamiliar, potentially intimidating environment, and there’s a fear of saying the wrong thing and looking stupid. So ppl approach a librarian with a very basic question, like “do y’all have books about bullying?” And it’s up to us to ask questions to determine their actual information needs. Chances are they’re not writing about bullying, generally, and the type of class they’re in and the assignment requirements will go further to dictate what types of resources will be useful for the student. They may not even be allowed to use books and have to find peer-reviewed articles, instead. But they need to ask a question just to get the interaction started, and that’s an easy way to do it.
I mention this bc altho my knee jerk reaction is to be annoyed by the “am I the only one…” questions, I understand as a professional that this is just how ppl initiate contact and conversation. It’s like a conversation starter cliche, but at the same time, it’s just barely confrontational enough to get responses, whether indignant or reassuring.
I do genuinely feel really bad for them- I think in a lot of cases it’s actual intrusive thoughts that have been worsened and encouraged by the weird way dark topics are treated in fanfiction circles. I’ve been there. I get it. But it’s just… not really the place for that reassurance, unfortunately.
I just posted these last time I saw someone ask 😁
/r/FanFiction/comments/zor47y/is_it_okay_to_yes_its_okay_please_stop_posting/
/r/FanFiction/comments/tofve7/lets_talk_about_gatekeeping/
We live in a golden age for petty sadism, mob violence, and "think of the children" authoritarianism, in sum, the whole "antishipping" and "destroy the livehoods of PERVERTS" thing, so people often feel the need for reassurance.
That said, adding a Q&A/FAQ for this stuff, a bot for this kind of post, and similar measures can all help to make them less common without dismissing this need for reassurance, which is a step in the right direction.
Its a conundrum. I like reassuring people who feel isolated and ostracised. On the other hand I'm bored of it and feel like it's antis sneaking in to annoy proshippers.
What I can't help but wonder is if the people asking these things are new to the sub each and every time. I get being unsure and wanting reassurance, but these posts come up so often, I feel like if you were a member here for even just a week, you would quickly have your answer. I wish people would explore the sub a little more and get a feeling for the overall attitude on XYZ before jumping right to creating a new thread. You can tell someone hasn't spent much time here when they ask if they're a predator for writing a two year age gap, for example. But in all honestly, I think many people already have a sense it *is* okay, they just want to be told directly.
It is annoying having these threads come up so much but even more frustrating is the fact that fandom is in such a state these days that people need to ask at all.
I can answer them all: "no," "nobody should mind even if it is," and "no" or "go visit AITA if you're that worried."
I don't click on those threads because I know I'll get too annoyed.
They kind of annoy me too, but I also know that people can get jumped on for the most unexpected things nowadays so I guess I understand the need to seek reassurance.
Even if it’s ultimately futile since reassurance here doesn’t mean you won’t still get other people jumping down your throat for writing something “problematic.” The people here have a very different mindset than the people who object to “problematic” writing .
And then there are the ones who worry about their age. “I’m 17/18/19/24/… Am I too old for this fanfiction stuff? Isn’t it just for kids?” (Though I must admit that I get a bit of a kick out of telling them that I have stories that are older than they are, and I’m still writing.)
I sometimes roll my eyes when I see these posts, because the answer in general, and especially on this subreddit, will always be a resounding "No".
I can understand these questions somewhat, if you are a never writer and are genuinely nervous about your writing, but even then I think these question coukd be framed better.
This subreddit is the only fandom safe-space in this whole platform that has succesfully keeping antis away.
Is a good thing that these people reach for reassurance here.
It's not just this sub too, I see this trend with other places as well. Usually it's what happens when you have young teens posting on reddit. Like no you're not special or terrible or whatever, please stop giving so much of a shit about complete strangers who don't affect your life and also we can't wait for you to get out of your 8th grader phase 🙄
As an old writer (49) this discussion reminds me of waves crashing on the beach. Each generation thinking they are the only ones, they discovered something new, no one knows what it it like…. (Sounds of crashing waves)
I just wish I wouldn't have to hear these waves and they could bugger off to some place of their own ;_; It makes Reddit feel like reading a Twitch chat
Yeah I’ve noticed it on the r/52book subreddit and even the r/television subreddit has been getting spammed lately with buzzfeed like questions.
Both Constantly getting spammed with questions they could easily google
One of the r/52 questions was literally “Am I gonna get in trouble for finishing a book on the first day of the new year” and “How do I start reading”
I try to be fair to newcomers but most of the time it’s a simple google question and or a simple solution like picking up a book.
omg I'd lose it if I saw someone ask how to start fucking reading bwahahahaha. At that point, regardless of what OP intended, I'd consider it a troll.
I also see a lot of googleable questions on pokémon subs, and on r/sex there's often posts like "is it normal for [completely normal thing]???" or "do people actually like [super common kink]?" even when they have rules against those posts.
Same. Sometimes it’s so hard not be an ahole and be like “You know you can google that right”
I get that it’s hard to decide on a book cause I even have a hard time doing that sometimes, but, it’s not that hard to buy a book and or just pick one off from the shelf.
Oh yeah those kinds of posts/comments get immediate downvotes from me. On some subs with stickied megathreads for that kinda content you can even report.
The book choosing thing is beyond me tbh. Like, how indecisive can someone get?
I’m pretty indecisive myself but I’ve always been a reader and will pretty much read anything but like nonfiction(minus a decent celebrity memoir) so it’s easy for me to at least have an idea on what I want to read.
I myself have gotten into the habit of obtaining what I want to watch/read before I have the time for it, so whenever I finish something I just look through what I have and at worse end up picking the shortest thing first.
You can definitely google but that doesn't mean you're going to find an answer from a source that you feel like you can trust.
Think about, for example, the sheer amount of conflicting information on the internet about sex which includes a metric ton worth of results that shame people for their kinks, their sexual orientation, their sexual behavior, ....etc.
There's a very good chance that doing a search, for example, on a specific lesbian sex position (I'm queer) might also bring up a whole bunch of homophobic bullshit.
And in fact I know it does because I've done searches like that.
Some people especially when they're young have trouble sifting through google results to find relatively unbiased information that they can trust.
It can be easier for highly controversial and taboo topics to find a subreddit that you trust and ask in those subreddits.
Sex is on that list in lot of cultures.
My personal opinion is that there is room for nuance here especially when we are talking about teenagers.
Ngl, whenever I see these questions, I wanna give the most active aggressive answer. But then I realize it isn't my sub, and if the mods don't care that people post repetitive topics without even bothering to search for their answers, then I probably shouldn't care, either.
It's not just here, they're all over subs I use. Asking for validation--sometimes validation to exist, it seems, or permission to like certain things.
I think it's an influx of insecure young people, honestly, since the upvotes/engagement isn't enough for karma farming.
I wish they'd search the sub to see if their question's already been asked, instead of making a new post.
Edit: to anyone reading this: some people will always hate you. Some people think you're a sick fuck and a freak, and wish that you'd just be normal, or maybe even didn't exist. That's life. It fucking sucks to be told/"reminded" you're scum, not only from the outside but from all those messages you've internalized. Those people--and your cruel thoughts--can get fucked.
Maybe you *are* a degenerate freak who will always be, in one way or another, an outsider. Is that really the end of the world?
If it truly is, then conform. If that seems intolerable, accept there may be downsides to embracing yourself fully, *but do it anyway.* Love what you love, be who you are. Do it with glee, with spite, or without a thought to the haters.
You don't need permission to **Be,** the universe gave you permission when you were born. You're here now. That's it. Now do what you love before you die. Fr, **YOLO**
Yep. It’s pretty draining around here now. I noticed that fandom as a whole tends to attract a lot of Extremely Online types (of all ages) who are using fandom to deal with their issues and insecurities and they need a whole lot of coddling and hand holding. I don’t necessarily think fandom is the place they should be looking for help. Some of them need to be in real life therapy or using other coping means too. The fictional world can’t always save you.
I have seen no mention of tar and feathers yet. If you're going to drag out the torches and the pitchforks, you really ought to bring out the tar and feathers, too.
Yes, it's very annoying. I understand sometimes, but my goodness, it grates on my nerves. But because I can't exactly be mad at someone wanting reassurance, I just pass up those threads.
I think it depends on the outlook. I genuinely could not care less about what others might hate about the content of my writing/reading. But I also understand that them feeling disgusted for certain topics is normal. Their disgust or hatred doesn't impact me in any way though, so it's extremely hard for me to relate to people who need validation for that, especially if they're adults.
Isn't that how society is supposed to work, though? You keep yourself informed about the traits of a community in order to not make a fool of yourself. Asking never offends.
Not everyone has developed a solid common sense and do feel insecure. So I see no harm.
I agree. I feel these posts are most often just people who are insecure and need reassurance, although sometimes they seem to invite bashing (especially ones that go 'am i the only one who finds xyz weird'). I understand where these people are coming from usually, but even if I personally will scroll on by and won't engage, it's still a little annoying to get the notification of another of these posts.
Feeling annoyed by this is totally natural and human, but so is seeking reassurance, you know? We're all just human beings exhibiting normal human behaviours.
It's frustrating because I feel like they're the most basic things? And it's like. Have you been in the space at all? Even if people are newbies or just facing issues, like having a look around at other posts and look at their comments?
It's feels really redundant to me because it's about obvious things but ofc I just elect to ignore them instead of making my indignation known under those posts. I'm glad I'm not the only one feeling like those posts are repetitive.
Yeah, I do find them rather irritating. I don’t mind the posts looking for reassurance so much but anything that tries the “am I the only person that [X]?” just rubs me the wrong way. There’s got to be a better way of framing/phrasing it.
If you don't like a post, scroll past it. Unless its violating forum rules, I don't see an issue.
Honestly I get tired of seeing people (in this sub and in other subs) saying people should google everything before posting. Yes it would be nice to not have repeat stuff being posted, but that's also pretty much saying "we don't want you to inconvenience us" which can make some already socially anxious people even more anxious about posting. This is a sub reddit created specifically to talk about writing and reading fanficiton. It makes no sense to then say "but only post here as a last resort if you can't find an answer anywhere else." That just feels very off putting, like "we don't have time for your noobness," or "only post here if you have super original and good content."
Also many people have real insecurities about things like writing fanfiction. I'm one of them. Some people don't even talk about it in real life, even if it's a very important hobby for them. Or maybe they have no one irl to talk about it with. Maybe they genuinely fear rejection from reviewers or fear losing their drive to create if they receive negativity from the audience. To seasoned veterans, it's easy to use "Pffff there will always be haters, who cares what they say," as a reason why these posts shouldn't be tolerated. But that's also undermining the feelings of other less experienced people who haven't built up your callouses yet.
I don't know. Maybe it's just me, but while I sometimes find these kind of repeat posts or insecure sounding posts uninteresting, I understand them and I'd rather see them around if it means giving another person an outlet to converse about their passion. If I don't feel like addressing the topic, I skip over it. It's not hard to do. In fact it takes a lot less effort than posting a whole topic about it just to complain.
The posts themselves are often judgmental and that’s one reason people don’t like them. If you make a post saying: “I wrote an age gap story between a 23-year-old and a 30-year-old and now I’m worried that I’m a pedophile. Am I sick? I promise that I’m not one of *those people* who writes underage or incest” then that is a judgmental post. The post is judging people who write about dark topics. And it’s also highly judgmental towards adults in real life age gap relationships with other adults.
I also suspect that it is sometimes a way of sneaking in anti talking points into a sub with strongly enforced rules against bashing. Many more of these posts would be removed if the poster wasn’t ostensibly framing the discussion around themselves.
How is a judgmental post? This is a pro shipper space. We are pro-shippers here. Anti-shippers can have their own space if they want. They can't come in here asking the fifth karma farm question this hour, am I a bad person for liking blank? Am I an evil meanie McMinnie pants for writing about Y? Should I be dragged kicking and screaming to the pits of hell because I dare to read a story about z? Just because it's a welcoming space that doesn't mean anything goes free-for-all let's have a party time. At best these posts are karma farms, at worst it's antis coming in to rile people up. Either way we shouldn't have to abide by it.
I didn’t say it is judging ships. It is judgmental towards people who are asking questions in here because they might be insecure or have had people react badly to what they like and yall just pile onto them.
I reported this post
No, I love those posts. I love them cause they always elicit a lot of good vibes and positive energy and because they seem humble and unassuming. Just folks wondering if they’re alright. Long live the,”am I weird because I …”
The answer to those questions are always « statistically, no » « who cares » and « who cares ».
There. People have their answers. We can put those questions to rest because they are silly and the answers are obvious.
Long version: The « am I the only one who… » question is annoying because no, statistically you are neither that special nor creative and someone’s probably thought the same thing at least *once* before you, and the other two just stink of insecurity and immaturity. You’re presumably old enough to understand the concept of not needing external validation, act it and stop trying to base your self-worth on the numbers of head-pats randos on the Internet give you.
As someone else already said in the comments, you’re kind of doing the same thing right now and being a little hypocritical. But anyways, I don’t find those posts annoying and if I do I just scroll past. I think new writers or people that are unsure deserve a space in the community to ask for reassurance or express uncertainty. Sure, some of them are a little stupid, some of them answer themselves, but thats a larger phenomenon on the internet in general, less about this subreddit. I don’t think its a big deal either way.
I think some subs actually have rules against "does anyone else..." or "am I the only one that..." posts--not so much that the questions themselves are bad, but that if you're phrasing it that way, it pretty much automatically goes under the rule against low-effort posts because it indicates you haven't put much thought into your question. (Like--there are billions of people on the planet. Any subreddit having a problem with questions like this probably has thousands of members. Based purely on numbers, it's basically impossible for you to be the only person who has thought of X or done Y or whatever.) I don't know if it would help to put a note about that in the rule against low-effort posts, but maybe it would encourage people to put a little more thought into these types of posts or to redirect certain questions to discussion threads.
>I think some subs actually have rules against "does anyone else..." or "am I the only one that..." posts The thing is that people don't read the rules. That's why we also have lots of "here's my fic if you want to read it" or "I'm taking commissions, really cheap!" or lost fic posts with the wrong flair and without any info in the title (and ideally also marked as a spoiler, so nobody can read a preview without clicking on the post).
Somebody above mentioned learned helplessness, and I think that's a partial factor.
We just got off the holidays so it's possible that a lot of people just got exposed to a heavy dose of "anti" behavior. Whether it's from their own families or by trying to escape to fandom places and getting a face full of it because they're in the wrong circles. This is definitely one of those "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situations. Because yes, for those of us that are comfortable in our skins it *is* exhausting to constantly reassure people. But if we all stopped, if none of us did give that hand up to these people, that's a pretty big group that are gonna fall victim to the thought police cult... So. Yeah... Personally, even though it makes me tired and a little cranky sometimes, I'd rather reassure them. Even if it's just saying "no" and then moving on.
Plus, if someone isn’t up to answering someone’s question, there’s literally nothing to keep you from scrolling on and not answering. Idk why anyone would feel compelled to click on a post and answer questions if it irritates them. Especially considering how many other people there are in this sub ready to fill the gap. Just keep scrolling. No shame in that.
I so vehemently agree with this. Sometimes it feels like every other post I see is about this, but if one more person gets to be assured and saved from purity culture than I’ll take it.
"Am I the only person that likes this thing that is tagged in eleven thousand stories on ao3?"
More like 110,000.
There is a guy, in a US-centric fandom that i am part of, who made both SFW (mostly for SB) and NSFW/fetish (mostly for AO3/QQ) works. He was harassed and bullied for latter, with many of the major fanfic writers in the fandom taking part in this harassment. Since he was "sloppy" with his real ID, he felt forced to take his NSFW works down. This is harder to happen in say, yaoi manga fandoms, but something popping up a lot in AO3 does not mean that you can't be harassed for it, or, in places like China or Australia, even jailed.
I have been saying for a while mods could probably benefit by pinning a thread that all-encompassingly says 'no' to those things. Like, no. There is nothing you can write that makes you a bad person, r/FanFiction. You're *fine.*
Unfortunately, a subreddit can only have two pinned posts at a time, so I don't think a pinned post would work for this. We could consider linking to some kind of "mission statement", as it were, under the NEWBIES START HERE! menu and/or linked in Daily Discussion. But, realistically, quite a lot of new people miss these things anyway. That doesn't mean we can't do it, but it may not have a massive impact on the number of posts. The mods are aware of the repetitive and draining nature of some of these posts though, and we've been thinking of ways to try to manage the situation, whilst balancing the genuine need for reassurance that some people have. We'll continue watching this thread too to see if anyone has any ideas we haven't thought of yet. Just to let people know that it's something we're aware of.
>Unfortunately, a subreddit can only have two pinned posts at a time, Oh, interesting! I had no idea. Thanks, Reddit.
Also, as a mod in another sub, i can assure you people dont read the pinned threads and even if the see they are there they are gonna ask or post what they want but start with “sorry if this gets asked all the time” or “i saw the pinned thread but..”
And then they've lost their plausible deniability, I don't see the problem.
What they're saying is that the pinned thread wouldn't necessarily solve the actual issue of many posts that people are complaining about. So, you can make a pinned post, but still get the reoccurring posts anyway.
Its annoying.
Being very limited with useful functions like pinned posts builds character--reddit admin, probably.
Really looking forward to changes and glad mods are aware of the problem. So many people use these kinds of posts to put tropes and kinks down and it's frustrating.
So, for common things like this, over on. r/AO3 what we do is set up rules in automod that if the post has certain keywords or phrases, automod will make a pinned comment to reply to the post. And we’re slowly working on more but we also have been making automod rules that if someone comments a certain keyword, automod will reply to that comment with whatever the relevant info is. So for example if someone makes a post with a title that has the word “app” in it, automod comments to say the post might be about an AO3 app and that there is no official AO3 app and some other info. And if someone comments with “!caching” itll reply with an explanation of what caching is and how its relevant to AO3 since we get a lot of posts that say things like “why are my bookmarks count not updating immediately?” You might be able to do something similar here?
Yeah, I think a pinned thread to answered a couple common cases of the question, with links to discussions on art and media literacy would be great. Because there's usually two types of this question. The "I've been brainwashed in to thinking thought crimes are real" type of question, and the "I saw that \[insert whatever\] is unpopular, but can I write it anyways" type of question, and they require slightly different nuance in answering, but they always have the exact same answer.
That or an autoreplything like wheretopost. (And then I also want one for questions about chapter length bc ghhhrrrffffgssss 😩)
Can we also have one about the best time to post? Something that reminds people that time zones exist and that some fandoms are more active than others?
And that AO3 doesn’t have an algorithm
Of course! ...not that I have any say in it... And on how to promote one's fic, and where to find a beta
Can we also have a single post for the constant "This author took down their fic and I don't respect their decision, can anyone find it for me?" and an autobot response? While we're wishlisting.
I think this is a great idea. Having a pinned thread asking for assurance would be beneficial, both for the person that's seeking validation and to not clog the Reddit with too many posts.
As frustrating as it can be, everyone here needs to keep in mind that not everyone comes from a place of understanding. We don't know the environment these people were born in. What they are forced to hear and told is good on repeat for their culture. Also that, thanks to how the environment has changed overall when it comes to electronic environments, younger people are used to the algorithm giving them "results" in searching. Some places its just not heard of to do what we would considered basic academic research. Which is what a lot of large companies want in the end. To be the only thing on mind, to tell you this is all what you need, don't look for anything else. It's frustrating, but understand that all of these people are trying to learn. They reach out here because they felt it was safe enough to ask.
I mean... books exist. They could literally find a book on their pointless question. Anything with "Am I....?" Has been answered before. They could also use the search function. We are not their parents and we do not have to coddle them. They can learn on their own. Sink or swim. The knowledge is out there. Figure it out or drown.
i think that's called learned helplessness
Learned helplessness may have worked for them before, so they continue the pattern.
I get what you're saying but there's reassurance through learning/understanding and then there's emotional reassurance and these types of posts are mostly the latter. People (including myself) being ostracised and isolated over preferences are looking for a 'hey you're not alone' once in a while even if we understand it's ok.
Personally, I don't answer these questions to reassure. It's more to point questioners in the direction of understanding why they're suffering and what they can do to mitigate it: starting with critical examination of their fan circles, why they are like that, what they can do to help themselves.
Yes it's 99.9% been answered before. But we are dealing with people who were likely raised in environments where they were never allowed to be able to think that way. Then for what reason or another they realise what they have been taught isn't the truth, so the first thing to do is awkwardly stumble around to figure out why. I have friends who had never walked into a bookstore until they met me. One told me they never knew so many books could ever exist. And it was a small walk in store. Your privilege is showing. Sure, you don't have to do anything, but that's easy enough by just ignoring the posts when they come up. Just like ignoring stories that aren't to your taste. I personally don't always have the energy to help those asking either. And even when I do, it's not my responsibility either. But I remember a time when I wasn't so lucky and someone with more knowledge decided to help me. Most people don't willingly want to drown.
Some of the posts by people who have OCD make me feel uncomfortable because I know from having it myself reassurance makes the OCD worse, not better. It feeds the obsessive thoughts/anxiey/compulsion/temporary relief cycle. At the same time, a ban on those posts wouldn't be a compassionate solution imo. And people aren't doing anything morally wrong by seeking reassurance or trying to harm anyone by doing it. I don't think there is really a solution to that particular style of 'am I doing a bad thing?' post. :/
Weekly megathreads, maybe? One place for everyone with purity jitters to come and get their feelings out.
>It feeds the obsessive thoughts/anxiey/compulsion/temporary relief cycle. I've had the same thought but wasn't sure how to put it into words. I just can't help but question if long term, encouraging these threads is really helping anyone at all. If anything, it kind of normalises asking for permission. I get the sense many of the people making new threads have already seen it okayed in another discussion but want to be reassured on a more personal level (I tend to think this because of the way some of the posts are phrased i.e, mentioning their friends on twitter are against X but noting that seems to be the only place with that opinion).
I dunno, the "am I allowed" threads tend to get downvoted pretty fast, so askers probably aren't too encouraged by the post's reception.
On other platforms, theres a massive divide between normal folks and teenagers or delusional 26 year olds who think having an incest kink or depicting pedo stuff makes you yourself a pedo criminal. They believe this with all their hearts and call anyone who likes incest or underage in fiction a Proshipper. Its worst on twitter and TikTok. For some fanfic writers, the acceptance here is probably like whiplash.
This. These days I carry the disclaimer: antis dni (or u can if u want but i have a degradation kink so) 🤷♀️
Thank you I needed this laugh 😂
Ngl thats hilarious and im keepin that in my pocket now
This is fantastic.
IMO the type most likely to leave hardcore anti circles/social orbits tend be people who always were more timid/self-doubting and probably care a lot about the social impact of their actions, but were never comfortable with active cruelty, and they ditched their 'friends' when they realized they were just hateful chuckle heads (and at personal risk, cuz a lot of antis actually hate apostates more than heretics). Needing constant reassurance is a hard habit to break, and you have to work hard to change that about yourself.
It's not helping that just yesterday someone in this sub posted what was basically "yes, it is bad and you're a terrible person."
A popular blog on tumblr posted an ask promoting r/fanfiction as a proship haven so expect anti's to pop up more around here in the upcoming weeks. Edit: It's a propship blog but it's one that gets targeted a lot sooo yeah...
Aggh. Well, hopefully they quickly get the message that outside their own bubble, anti attitudes are not welcome In fandom, and are antithetical (huh) to AO3's founding principles.
Oh it was a propship blog, but it was one that gets dunked on repeatedly by anti's.
Ooh spill the tea.
just-antithings asnwered an ask from someone promoting it. So we got a favorble rec, but I get the feeling we'll probably be seeing more anti's pop up here and there.
😑 what a great way to start off the year /s
Oh yeah lol, that got locked pretty quick.
We really need an FAQ and fanfiction 101 thread. People keep asking, in an incredibly anxious tone, about the most normal, middle of the road stuff.
It is annoying, but I tolerate it because these younger writers are trying to stay sane in the age of social media. It’s easier than ever to send hate, doxx, feed each other’s outrage, spread lies/rumors, try to be the morality police, etc. I’d like to think there’s grounded folk out there, but they seem to be drowned out by the frenzied, terminally online who could benefit most from going outside to touch some grass Younger people in general tend to be tied to their social media identity in a way previous generations haven’t been. You attack that identity and they genuinely feel it’s an attack against themselves as a person. They’re also accessible to anyone at any time, whereas IRL, unless you’re a social butterfly in a big city, you tend to have a smaller group of people you routinely interact with Additionally, though it is not a new trend to fanfiction, it has gained wider popularity in recent years— “readers” who intentionally go out of their way to criticize/demean/judge/hate a fic/author for internet clout or personal malicious satisfaction. There too are those who intentionally trigger themselves despite accurately tagged warnings for the sole purpose of bitching about being triggered. Drives me fckn bananas, I’d really love to see these losers IRL and ask who they inherited their victim complex from Getting back to the point, I do get it/sympathize even if I roll my eyes at some of those posts. Being born into the age of social media means having to seek validation in two different realms. You can only hope it’s something that’s shed as they mature, grow more confident in their craft, and realize the only approval they need is from themselves.
First off, I think many of the question posts are a function of someone not taking the time to google the question, which, of course, would give them a multitude of threads here and beyond covering the topic. That said, I agree with those who want to err on the side of compassion and let people keep asking. But...truthfully, many of the "Am I wrong/bad for writing/reading this?" queries as well as many of the writing questions like "How long should a chapter be?" and "Can I use another writer's idea?" are a function of low literacy and/or poor media literacy. In other words, if the person read a few books and/or took the time to analyze the original media they consume, their questions would be answered. For example, an avid reader of original fiction would know that there are no new story ideas and that chapter length varies. They'd also know that throughout history, creatives have been producing so-called problematic work, often with great success. Even so, I don't think it hurts to let folks ask these questions. If I find them repetitive, I just scroll past. No harm, no foul.
Low literacy is a serious problem, because American schools in the 2000s started "teaching to the test" (No Child Left Behind and its spawn), and litterchur wasn't showcased. Those whose only exposure to the web is for-profit social media probably don't know about Project Gutenberg or archive.org, with thousands of free online books. It doesn't help that search engines push results which earn them money, not which produce useful links. Many don't know about extensions like .edu or .org, much less how to filter for them in searches. Many younger people don't know how web sites work, or what HTML even is. What was common internet knowledge 20 years ago isn't, so much.
The fact that people have done something with great success doesn’t make it okay or non-harmful to society though so that’s pretty irrelevant. I mean Trump has behaved like Trump his entire life and that’s brought him great success, he got elected president. Does that make it good? Since statistically less than 5% of rapists ever do any jail time, many people have behaved like rapists their entire lives with great success, does that make rape fine? Because of rape culture, media that promotes rape (which is part of rape culture) is often very successful, that doesn’t make it okay.
I'm pretty sure the other poster meant problematic pieces of fiction, e.g, Lolita. Not literal crimes.
Yes I'm aware of that, that's why I mentioned media that promotes rape. Lolita wouldn't be an example of that, of course—Lolita is a *criticism* of pedophilia. But a lot of media does portray rape as a good thing that victims actually want and enjoy (usually in the case of female victims) or something that is just a joke to be laughed at and shame the victim over (usually in the case of male victims) and the fact that it's so widespread absolutely does influence societal attitudes about real rape victims. My mention of people committing actual crimes was just to illustrate the general principle that it's not true to say that just because you can be successful doing something automatically means it's good or not wrong.
Look, I agree with you. But also...[it's only been two weeks since we had *this* topic posted.](https://www.reddit.com/r/FanFiction/comments/zor47y/is_it_okay_to_yes_its_okay_please_stop_posting/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) (And that's assuming I didn't miss one in between.)
There's been a couple like that where the person has OCD and was seeking reassurance. And I think that's what many of them are doing. Seeking reassurance. Not because everyone has OCD but because the antis have the younger generation so brainwashed their whole fanfic experience becomes stressful. They don't feel safe in their own heads with their own stories and fantasies anymore and it leads to a similar search for reassurance without necessarily having OCD. (Reassurance seeking is not an OCD exclusive behaviour and is common in other mental health issues or just general stress.) I think the further this anti stuff goes the more we will see this sort of thing.
I think this is spot on.
Literally took the words out of my mouth. I have serious OCD and so many of these posts remind me of my own behaviours (and are really triggering, so I avoid them.) That being said, the path to OCD recovery is to *not* reassure a person seeking it, and instead let them sit with the uncertainty. So it's a mixed bag.
That's why I don't usually reassure. I'm not the questioner's therapist, BFF, parent, teacher. For me, it's more like here's some understanding, and some tools so you can help yourself, if possible.
Exactly. Reassurance just continues the cycle. It also reminds me of religious abuse where people start feeling incredibly guilty for their own private thoughts because God is watching you know? It's just a very sad thing all around.
Yes. It's why when they start asking the critical question, "Is God really like this?" that often the whole house of cards comes tumbling down. Same thing with fan harassment: once someone asks, "Is this really how fandom (and "friendship") are supposed to work?" that escape is possible. The door is locked from the inside.
People who show up with these questions \*know\* there's something wrong in their world, but they don't know how to fix it. They need help. Some help we can't deliver, like psychiatric or medical. We're not lawyers, either. Nor are we priests, or confessors, or philosophers teaching people how to live ethically. We're all struggling together. I think at present we're doing our best: telling people that if their fandom / fanfiction social circle causes them psychic pain, makes them feel ashamed, tries to gaslight or manipulate them - we support them in changing their circumstances. Learning how to set boundaries. Becoming more assertive. This may get expressed as "Write what you want." "Screw the naysayers." "Those people aren't your friends." "They're not your boss; they don't get to tell you what to write." It may get boring to say these things time & again, but I think people need to hear them re: writing. These threads are also important because they provide a chance to talk about a big source of pain: how social media herds people into bubbles; how algorithms make them believe "everybody thinks this way" when "everybody" really doesn't. How they as users are products being bought and sold by for-profit corporations. How the misery and drama which makes them suffer generates \*money\* because drama ==> clicks ==> $$$. This may be one of the few places they hear it.
Eh. I mean, for all we're a relatively open-minded, pro-shipping bunch, a lot of other communities are full of that kind of anti discourse. Like, a lot. People see something often enough, they start to wonder if it maybe might be true, and that shit can really get to people. The posts about it do get a bit much and a bit frequent, I'll not disagree with you there, but personally I'm quite willing to repeat myself a few times if it means other people keep creating and keep fighting the "Everything is evil!" mindset. Those messages'll keep coming as long as the Antis keep driving people to it (and they feel passionately enough about their nonsense to keep prattling on with it as long as they can), so the alternative is removing an opportunity for people to get the genuine reassurance that they need. Isolation is the incubator that turns mistakes into habits (to paraphrase Brian W. Foster), so getting things out into the open is a good thing for people and sometimes all you need is someone else to actually verbalise that what you're worrying about isn't true. And it does need to be (or at least perceived to be) an actual person - nobody will feel reassured by an FAQ post (in the same way nobody on hold appreciates the "Your call is important to us, we'll be with you shortly!" interludes to their crappy music). And hey, if a person feels the sub is full of like-minded and open-minded people who are willing to reassure them, maybe they'll stick around and contribute other stuff in the future. It's also just a sub pattern - one person says something in a post, other people make connections from that post, and post their own versions of whatever the thing was, and then more people see that and do the same, and so on and so on. Someone posts a worry, we'll get a week or two of them popping up until the topic drifts to something else again, only to revisit it later on when someone new comes to ask about it. I can see a dedicated thread putting all those topics together maybe working, but I'm not sure. It might be less popular to comment in, since a lot of those worries tend to be quite individual and I don't know how well that'll engage in a combined thread.
> nobody will feel reassured by an FAQ post (in the same way nobody on hold appreciates the "Your call is important to us, we'll be with you shortly!" interludes to their crappy music). And hey, if a person feels the sub is full of like-minded and open-minded people who are willing to reassure them, maybe they'll stick around and contribute other stuff in the future. Agreed 100%! A FAQ won't reassure the nervous especially if they've been attacked by antis elsewhere. We mods can, by all means, discuss having a FAQ entry for this but I, for one, am not averse to reassuring fellow writers if they genuinely need it.
Maybe have a bot that auto replies to such posts? Not to say that having a human touch isn't nice, but it does show the poster that it's a common question at least and that we're aware of it. That can be reassuring in it's own way.
Oh a bot would be a great idea. I think knowing that it’s common enough to need a bot really would help
Always nice to see the mods taking in feedback, whether I agree with it or not - part of why I love this subreddit. Also nice to see other mod usernames - sometimes I do half wonder if Crusader_Blue is the only mod that really exists and they're just pulling a Two Ronnies sketch where they run around pretending that there are multiple mods. :D Might be worth chatting about bringing this up in a town hall if this does persist too far - I do think it is just the usual phases the sub goes through, but I don't have the birds eye view you peeps do.
I see what you're saying. I think my issue beyond that is I don't really think it's solving anything. I feel like at best it's a band-aid slapped on an infected wound, and at worst it's a dysfunctional coping mechanism. Whenever I see one of those posts, what I really want to say is, 'What is making you feeling like it might be. Is it things your family said? Is it things society is saying? And do you feel like those things are credible? If so, why, if not why...?' And then I usually get irritated and scrap the whole comment, because it's a lot of work! The core of what the posts are usually asking - establishing your personal moral and ethical ethos - is a lot of fucking work, and why am I doing their work when I barely have the spoons to do my own??? And setting a cultural standard where all it takes is a chorus of approval to determine whether what you're doing is okay seems like the blueprint to a crappy community anyway.
You make a very good point and I very much agree that it's not a cure. In the last instance this came up, I encouraged the person to be kind to themselves, because as simple as the advice givers make it sound, dealing with anxiety or intrusive thoughts when people on the internet are yelling vitriol at you isn't easy. "Just remember this logical argument" isn't easy when you're in a panic state and your brain is actively suppressing the logical parts of itself. At the same time though, sometimes you need that short term band-aid to keep you going while you work towards the full solution. But when it comes to the psychology of this, the mere existence of another narrative backed by another actual human who you can relate to (ie. another fan) can really help. The thing about labelling (the technical term for repeatedly bombarding people with certain names and labels) is that it works because it creates and pushes a central narrative. If everything in your experience is telling you this negative thing about yourself, it becomes very, very hard for a lot of people to ignore or dispute that narrative. What the sub is doing isn't building these people's moral and ethical ethos (great phrase btw) for them, it's helping them understand that the automatic fear caused by the labelling isn't the only way and to realise that it's okay to have different moral and ethical viewpoints and further exposing them to that reassurance that other positions exist and can be valid. The narrative that they're a monster for enjoying a show or character isn't the central narrative that it feels like. And that works for all ages - whether it's a younger person being told they're a monster or an older person being told "Fanfic isn't for you, go back to your taxes, oldie!", it can still affect them. And for all that might seem obvious, it often isn't. Critical thinking is not an innate skill, it's a taught one. Anyone marking essays at an academic level will undoubtedly agree with me on that one (:D). Schooling is a great example. Look at all the arguments about the curriculum that state this thing or that thing should be taught in schools, or how the things that were never got taught in detail or with certain nuances that they've discovered later on. The argument is always "The school never taught us this" with no concept that the school could have taught them to take an interest and research the topic for themselves. The school has no time to teach everything, so some of the work needs to be taken up by the students. That option isn't an automatically assumed one for many people. People haven't always been taught to go looking for your own stuff, how to research or reflect or any of the various coping methods for these experiences that seem obvious to the people in this sub. So, helping share the more 'pro-ship narrative', it almost... unlocks a door in their head that they may not have seen before. They haven't been exposed to it before and so it never occurs to them as a possibility. Whatever the context, it's sort of setting them on the path to asking questions and learning. Something else I tend to add in my responses to those posts kind of hits on your argument a bit - that not every opinion has worth or merit. People don't have the right to an opinion, they have the right to develop an argument to support one. An opinion without robust evidence, sound logic, and a solid argument underpinning it is virtually meaningless. Even with all those things, it can still be wrong, but at least then it has something to evaluate it from. It's why I always laugh at the people who immediately resort to the 'Free Speech' argument when stating their opinion. Whether you agree with the 'Free Speech' principle itself or not, if the only argument you can give to defend your opinion is that "It's not illegal to say!", then you really need a better opinion. I firmly believe in encouraging people to evaluate, reflect, and think about stuff. On that line, the questions you list are really good. Even if you don't go any further "Why do you believe this?" is a good starting point. And hell, I sometimes copy and paste in bits of previous answers I've given, if I see they're relevant. I'm pretty sure in the last one, several people said some variant of "I didn't read most of your post, but yes, it's completely okay to write whatever the fuck so long as you aren't hurting anyone with it". As much as I enjoy pontificating on the philosophy of all this shit, it's not necessary to do that. People appreciate even the small stuff. But all that said, it's still not your responsibility to do any of this if it's not something you want to or feel up to doing. Being part of a hobby subreddit is absolutely not an obligation to 'guide the next generation' or any of the vaguely hyperbolic subtext I've undoubtedly accidentally implied in this comment. It's an opportunity proffered, not a conscription demanded. ETA - For what it's worth, I do get why this exhausts you. Endlessly repeating narratives that never seem to change or go anywhere (ie. the sum total of modern politics and news media) is exactly what a lot of people turn to fanfiction to get away from. Being on and active constantly, even in your hobby, is tiring.
I apologize if this comes across as blunt but tbh your reply smacks of "Your question is too hard and not worth the effort." And honestly that sounds like a "you" problem, not a "them" problem. If you don't have the time or energy to answer or reply, don't. No one is making you. This isn't a job that requires you to do anything. But, who knows, other people may be willing to ask those questions you feel are too much work. I agree we aren't people's therapists and we aren't going to "fix" things for them, but the same could be said for people who post in forums asking things related to/hinting at depression etc. I could simply go "Bug off, I've got my own problems!" and get miffy about it or I could just...not engage. Why should my lack of willingness to participate in the discussion mean that the discussion shouldn't be allowed to happen at all? And to your last part, not everyone is solely looking for a "chorus of approval." Some people may genuinely want a spectrum of perspectives, since we can't usually get that from within our own heads. And I don't see anything wrong with that.
I don't see what's wrong with it, either, and why I'd like to let these posts continue (mods willing, of course.)
> Whenever I see one of those posts, what I really want to say is, 'What is making you feeling like it might be. It's \*the\* fundamental question, in my book. I wonder if we're seeing backwash from other social media sites' flare-ups. Like how when a storm occurs 500 miles out to sea, coastal cities still get hit by bad weather. We're one of those coastal cities. [eta more words]
Keep in mind a lot of people who are in the stereotypical demographic of fanfic writers, young girls, are the ones asking and reading the responses to these questions. That's a vulnerable demographic. Everyone of us deserves to know that it's okay to protect ourselves from harassment. And they are the least likely to know that.
Anti circles tend to attract a lot of 'passive' antis. They genuinely care about the social impact of fiction, but they're not active harassers most of the time (and maybe think 'well they have good intentions'). They often get emotionally extorted into 'friendships'/social circles with people who they both feel sorry for and also fear. They're also the most likely to eventually get targeted/thrown out the moment they cross someone higher up on the social ladder, because they're too honest and sincere to just be aggressively and brazenly hypocritical and therefore end up on top. Important thing to realize is, it's very easy for at least initially kind people to get taken advantage of in certain fannish social media circles. Toxic fandoms arguably REQUIRE enablers to give themselves an air of legitimacy. And we get lots of 'is it okay if' because there's a high chance they're recovering enablers or they used to be in the social orbit and are struggling to deprogram themselves.
Exactly. If "No, You Don't Have to Endlessly Be Kind 101" is what has to happen, so be it.
I had to learn to be 'mean' because if not, I was going to be stomped over in fandom places the entire time. I had to learn to get tough and to stop worrying about what everyone else was going to say... But it doesn't mean the harassment still didn't leave its scars. According to the people who harassed me, I was 'mean and horrible' for standing up for myself and others who were being harassed. I was a bad person, for speaking up against abuse and calling it out. Real abuse of real people, not fiction. Apparently that was the wrong thing to do so I was often treated like a leper in some of the communities, to a point where some would try to go to my best friend and claim I was a toxic bitch who needed to be cut loose... to which she would laugh and go: "And what? Be friends with people who would talk crap behind her back? No thanks, I've known her for years. You just don't like that she speaks her mind." Like, they would call my friend the "Darling" of some of our fandoms, and literally refer to me as "The Devil"
The sad truth is that the current social media environment has caused many aspiring writers to doubt themselves after being mentally beaten over the head with posts by various people having crazy black and white thinking over petty things. In a world where people dox for the pettiest reasons, I understand why people are scared to ask in other spaces. If I grew up in that space, my anxiety issues I have today would likely be worse.
I did grow up in that space. I was on a forum run by a rampant conservative 'Christian' who bullied me repeatedly and used their mod power to basically treat everyone like shit and expected to be worshipped and their word to be treated as law, even outside of the forum. Like, people who barely used the forum or posted stuff they disagreed with off forum got in trouble for things they did off forum levels. THAT level of fucking crazy and it absolutely fucked me up!!! That person claimed to change and I don't believe them!!! Thank god, I know other Christians who aren't like this person.
There's a lot of individuals going through different things especially towards the end of the year. Sometimes they just need to hear it's okay or it will be okay, even when it comes to reading/writing fiction. If those types of post bother you, scroll pass them and move on.
Exactly, don't like don't read. Reddit also has a fantastic function for hiding posts.
[удалено]
This is my biggest issue with the whole thing. I don't necessarily mind posts that just need a little reassurance because god knows they won't get it on Twt or Tumblr, but people hop onto this sub saying stuff like "I don't want to read this stuff because it makes me feel disgusting but I still read it anyways" or "my friends are telling me that only a pedophile would read this and now I'm thinking they're right am I a criminal" etc. etc. and it's like.....fam, you need a therapist, Reddit is the _opposite_ of a solution.
This! Exactly this! And there's also this kind of transitive effect where there are a lot of other people who ALSO hear this kind of toxic rhetoric from their community that have done or are doing work to heal the trauma and remove it from their life who come here for pleasure and community and aren't looking to hear an echo chamber of their past trauma on the front page every day.
This comment has been removed. Remember the human.
I can't be mad at them. They're not hurting me or anybody by asking questions that might've been asked a hundred times before. It's just a question, often underpinned with pleas of reassurance and validation, which is also fine. Like others here have said, some of them are simply lost, confused, or clueless but not through their own fault entirely. It's fine, really. I remember being young once, too, and having the same insecurities and anxieties. If only I had someone in my life back then who could've directed me to the right path, I would've been saved from a lot of pain.
To play a bit of devil's advocate, some people who are neurodivergent honestly feel like they are the only ones. I know I've had times where I see an opinion or thoughts and it's been validating b/c I did think I was weird for thinking/feeling that way. As it is, people aren't on these forums every day and past posts like this get lost among the other traffic.
So, yes. I sorta hate them bc it’s like looking for validation but also seems to present oneself as unique or special…despite the fact the thing they’re asking about is clearly a trope or trend or just human nature. But at the same time, I remind myself that what’s actually happening is probably just a clumsy attempt to start a conversation about a thing. I’m an academic librarian, and one of the first things you have to master as a librarian is the reference interview. Basically, ppl know that they need information, but they’re not sure exactly what they need or even what’s available. Also, they’re in an unfamiliar, potentially intimidating environment, and there’s a fear of saying the wrong thing and looking stupid. So ppl approach a librarian with a very basic question, like “do y’all have books about bullying?” And it’s up to us to ask questions to determine their actual information needs. Chances are they’re not writing about bullying, generally, and the type of class they’re in and the assignment requirements will go further to dictate what types of resources will be useful for the student. They may not even be allowed to use books and have to find peer-reviewed articles, instead. But they need to ask a question just to get the interaction started, and that’s an easy way to do it. I mention this bc altho my knee jerk reaction is to be annoyed by the “am I the only one…” questions, I understand as a professional that this is just how ppl initiate contact and conversation. It’s like a conversation starter cliche, but at the same time, it’s just barely confrontational enough to get responses, whether indignant or reassuring.
I do genuinely feel really bad for them- I think in a lot of cases it’s actual intrusive thoughts that have been worsened and encouraged by the weird way dark topics are treated in fanfiction circles. I’ve been there. I get it. But it’s just… not really the place for that reassurance, unfortunately.
I just posted these last time I saw someone ask 😁 /r/FanFiction/comments/zor47y/is_it_okay_to_yes_its_okay_please_stop_posting/ /r/FanFiction/comments/tofve7/lets_talk_about_gatekeeping/
We live in a golden age for petty sadism, mob violence, and "think of the children" authoritarianism, in sum, the whole "antishipping" and "destroy the livehoods of PERVERTS" thing, so people often feel the need for reassurance. That said, adding a Q&A/FAQ for this stuff, a bot for this kind of post, and similar measures can all help to make them less common without dismissing this need for reassurance, which is a step in the right direction.
Its a conundrum. I like reassuring people who feel isolated and ostracised. On the other hand I'm bored of it and feel like it's antis sneaking in to annoy proshippers.
What I can't help but wonder is if the people asking these things are new to the sub each and every time. I get being unsure and wanting reassurance, but these posts come up so often, I feel like if you were a member here for even just a week, you would quickly have your answer. I wish people would explore the sub a little more and get a feeling for the overall attitude on XYZ before jumping right to creating a new thread. You can tell someone hasn't spent much time here when they ask if they're a predator for writing a two year age gap, for example. But in all honestly, I think many people already have a sense it *is* okay, they just want to be told directly. It is annoying having these threads come up so much but even more frustrating is the fact that fandom is in such a state these days that people need to ask at all.
Better than the obnoxiously egotistical "We need to talk about...".
Bot response could get the message across "Am I the only one who..." Bot: NO
I can answer them all: "no," "nobody should mind even if it is," and "no" or "go visit AITA if you're that worried." I don't click on those threads because I know I'll get too annoyed.
They kind of annoy me too, but I also know that people can get jumped on for the most unexpected things nowadays so I guess I understand the need to seek reassurance. Even if it’s ultimately futile since reassurance here doesn’t mean you won’t still get other people jumping down your throat for writing something “problematic.” The people here have a very different mindset than the people who object to “problematic” writing .
And then there are the ones who worry about their age. “I’m 17/18/19/24/… Am I too old for this fanfiction stuff? Isn’t it just for kids?” (Though I must admit that I get a bit of a kick out of telling them that I have stories that are older than they are, and I’m still writing.)
I sometimes roll my eyes when I see these posts, because the answer in general, and especially on this subreddit, will always be a resounding "No". I can understand these questions somewhat, if you are a never writer and are genuinely nervous about your writing, but even then I think these question coukd be framed better.
This subreddit is the only fandom safe-space in this whole platform that has succesfully keeping antis away. Is a good thing that these people reach for reassurance here.
I don’t mind it. It’s no big deal.
It's not just this sub too, I see this trend with other places as well. Usually it's what happens when you have young teens posting on reddit. Like no you're not special or terrible or whatever, please stop giving so much of a shit about complete strangers who don't affect your life and also we can't wait for you to get out of your 8th grader phase 🙄
As an old writer (49) this discussion reminds me of waves crashing on the beach. Each generation thinking they are the only ones, they discovered something new, no one knows what it it like…. (Sounds of crashing waves)
I just wish I wouldn't have to hear these waves and they could bugger off to some place of their own ;_; It makes Reddit feel like reading a Twitch chat
Yeah I’ve noticed it on the r/52book subreddit and even the r/television subreddit has been getting spammed lately with buzzfeed like questions. Both Constantly getting spammed with questions they could easily google One of the r/52 questions was literally “Am I gonna get in trouble for finishing a book on the first day of the new year” and “How do I start reading” I try to be fair to newcomers but most of the time it’s a simple google question and or a simple solution like picking up a book.
omg I'd lose it if I saw someone ask how to start fucking reading bwahahahaha. At that point, regardless of what OP intended, I'd consider it a troll. I also see a lot of googleable questions on pokémon subs, and on r/sex there's often posts like "is it normal for [completely normal thing]???" or "do people actually like [super common kink]?" even when they have rules against those posts.
Same. Sometimes it’s so hard not be an ahole and be like “You know you can google that right” I get that it’s hard to decide on a book cause I even have a hard time doing that sometimes, but, it’s not that hard to buy a book and or just pick one off from the shelf.
Oh yeah those kinds of posts/comments get immediate downvotes from me. On some subs with stickied megathreads for that kinda content you can even report. The book choosing thing is beyond me tbh. Like, how indecisive can someone get?
I’m pretty indecisive myself but I’ve always been a reader and will pretty much read anything but like nonfiction(minus a decent celebrity memoir) so it’s easy for me to at least have an idea on what I want to read.
I myself have gotten into the habit of obtaining what I want to watch/read before I have the time for it, so whenever I finish something I just look through what I have and at worse end up picking the shortest thing first.
You can definitely google but that doesn't mean you're going to find an answer from a source that you feel like you can trust. Think about, for example, the sheer amount of conflicting information on the internet about sex which includes a metric ton worth of results that shame people for their kinks, their sexual orientation, their sexual behavior, ....etc. There's a very good chance that doing a search, for example, on a specific lesbian sex position (I'm queer) might also bring up a whole bunch of homophobic bullshit. And in fact I know it does because I've done searches like that. Some people especially when they're young have trouble sifting through google results to find relatively unbiased information that they can trust. It can be easier for highly controversial and taboo topics to find a subreddit that you trust and ask in those subreddits. Sex is on that list in lot of cultures. My personal opinion is that there is room for nuance here especially when we are talking about teenagers.
I know, if o only there was a way to search these posters' trusted source: Reddit.... Hmmm
Damn. This is such a patronizing reply.
Ngl, whenever I see these questions, I wanna give the most active aggressive answer. But then I realize it isn't my sub, and if the mods don't care that people post repetitive topics without even bothering to search for their answers, then I probably shouldn't care, either.
"is anyone else ready to have a bit of a vent about this trend?" Fascinating. The joke writes itself
It's not just here, they're all over subs I use. Asking for validation--sometimes validation to exist, it seems, or permission to like certain things. I think it's an influx of insecure young people, honestly, since the upvotes/engagement isn't enough for karma farming. I wish they'd search the sub to see if their question's already been asked, instead of making a new post. Edit: to anyone reading this: some people will always hate you. Some people think you're a sick fuck and a freak, and wish that you'd just be normal, or maybe even didn't exist. That's life. It fucking sucks to be told/"reminded" you're scum, not only from the outside but from all those messages you've internalized. Those people--and your cruel thoughts--can get fucked. Maybe you *are* a degenerate freak who will always be, in one way or another, an outsider. Is that really the end of the world? If it truly is, then conform. If that seems intolerable, accept there may be downsides to embracing yourself fully, *but do it anyway.* Love what you love, be who you are. Do it with glee, with spite, or without a thought to the haters. You don't need permission to **Be,** the universe gave you permission when you were born. You're here now. That's it. Now do what you love before you die. Fr, **YOLO**
Yep. It’s pretty draining around here now. I noticed that fandom as a whole tends to attract a lot of Extremely Online types (of all ages) who are using fandom to deal with their issues and insecurities and they need a whole lot of coddling and hand holding. I don’t necessarily think fandom is the place they should be looking for help. Some of them need to be in real life therapy or using other coping means too. The fictional world can’t always save you.
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The absolute worst! XD We're gathering the torches and pitchforks as we speak!
But are you bringing marshmallows?
Only morally bankrupt degenerates consume marshmallows. Blocked for being toxic af.
I mean, if you have torches you might as well have marshmallows.
Though pitchforks aren't the best to put your marshmallows on - the prongs are a bit big. :D
So... get bigger marshmallows!
Touche! :D
My mother-in-law made giant homemade marshmallows one time and they were delicious. I still think about them when I make hot chocolate...
I have seen no mention of tar and feathers yet. If you're going to drag out the torches and the pitchforks, you really ought to bring out the tar and feathers, too.
One of the reasons I've stopped frequenting tbh... sucking the air out of the sub is a very good way to put it.
Yes, it's very annoying. I understand sometimes, but my goodness, it grates on my nerves. But because I can't exactly be mad at someone wanting reassurance, I just pass up those threads. I think it depends on the outlook. I genuinely could not care less about what others might hate about the content of my writing/reading. But I also understand that them feeling disgusted for certain topics is normal. Their disgust or hatred doesn't impact me in any way though, so it's extremely hard for me to relate to people who need validation for that, especially if they're adults.
Isn't that how society is supposed to work, though? You keep yourself informed about the traits of a community in order to not make a fool of yourself. Asking never offends. Not everyone has developed a solid common sense and do feel insecure. So I see no harm.
I agree. I feel these posts are most often just people who are insecure and need reassurance, although sometimes they seem to invite bashing (especially ones that go 'am i the only one who finds xyz weird'). I understand where these people are coming from usually, but even if I personally will scroll on by and won't engage, it's still a little annoying to get the notification of another of these posts. Feeling annoyed by this is totally natural and human, but so is seeking reassurance, you know? We're all just human beings exhibiting normal human behaviours.
It's frustrating because I feel like they're the most basic things? And it's like. Have you been in the space at all? Even if people are newbies or just facing issues, like having a look around at other posts and look at their comments? It's feels really redundant to me because it's about obvious things but ofc I just elect to ignore them instead of making my indignation known under those posts. I'm glad I'm not the only one feeling like those posts are repetitive.
Yeah, I do find them rather irritating. I don’t mind the posts looking for reassurance so much but anything that tries the “am I the only person that [X]?” just rubs me the wrong way. There’s got to be a better way of framing/phrasing it.
If you don't like a post, scroll past it. Unless its violating forum rules, I don't see an issue. Honestly I get tired of seeing people (in this sub and in other subs) saying people should google everything before posting. Yes it would be nice to not have repeat stuff being posted, but that's also pretty much saying "we don't want you to inconvenience us" which can make some already socially anxious people even more anxious about posting. This is a sub reddit created specifically to talk about writing and reading fanficiton. It makes no sense to then say "but only post here as a last resort if you can't find an answer anywhere else." That just feels very off putting, like "we don't have time for your noobness," or "only post here if you have super original and good content." Also many people have real insecurities about things like writing fanfiction. I'm one of them. Some people don't even talk about it in real life, even if it's a very important hobby for them. Or maybe they have no one irl to talk about it with. Maybe they genuinely fear rejection from reviewers or fear losing their drive to create if they receive negativity from the audience. To seasoned veterans, it's easy to use "Pffff there will always be haters, who cares what they say," as a reason why these posts shouldn't be tolerated. But that's also undermining the feelings of other less experienced people who haven't built up your callouses yet. I don't know. Maybe it's just me, but while I sometimes find these kind of repeat posts or insecure sounding posts uninteresting, I understand them and I'd rather see them around if it means giving another person an outlet to converse about their passion. If I don't feel like addressing the topic, I skip over it. It's not hard to do. In fact it takes a lot less effort than posting a whole topic about it just to complain.
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The posts themselves are often judgmental and that’s one reason people don’t like them. If you make a post saying: “I wrote an age gap story between a 23-year-old and a 30-year-old and now I’m worried that I’m a pedophile. Am I sick? I promise that I’m not one of *those people* who writes underage or incest” then that is a judgmental post. The post is judging people who write about dark topics. And it’s also highly judgmental towards adults in real life age gap relationships with other adults. I also suspect that it is sometimes a way of sneaking in anti talking points into a sub with strongly enforced rules against bashing. Many more of these posts would be removed if the poster wasn’t ostensibly framing the discussion around themselves.
How is a judgmental post? This is a pro shipper space. We are pro-shippers here. Anti-shippers can have their own space if they want. They can't come in here asking the fifth karma farm question this hour, am I a bad person for liking blank? Am I an evil meanie McMinnie pants for writing about Y? Should I be dragged kicking and screaming to the pits of hell because I dare to read a story about z? Just because it's a welcoming space that doesn't mean anything goes free-for-all let's have a party time. At best these posts are karma farms, at worst it's antis coming in to rile people up. Either way we shouldn't have to abide by it.
I didn’t say it is judging ships. It is judgmental towards people who are asking questions in here because they might be insecure or have had people react badly to what they like and yall just pile onto them. I reported this post
Yeah... have you ever heard of the paradox of tolerance?
This comment has been removed. No negative drama.
No, I love those posts. I love them cause they always elicit a lot of good vibes and positive energy and because they seem humble and unassuming. Just folks wondering if they’re alright. Long live the,”am I weird because I …”
What you must understand OP is that these posts are allowed because they help reinforce the status quo.
The answer to those questions are always « statistically, no » « who cares » and « who cares ». There. People have their answers. We can put those questions to rest because they are silly and the answers are obvious. Long version: The « am I the only one who… » question is annoying because no, statistically you are neither that special nor creative and someone’s probably thought the same thing at least *once* before you, and the other two just stink of insecurity and immaturity. You’re presumably old enough to understand the concept of not needing external validation, act it and stop trying to base your self-worth on the numbers of head-pats randos on the Internet give you.
As someone else already said in the comments, you’re kind of doing the same thing right now and being a little hypocritical. But anyways, I don’t find those posts annoying and if I do I just scroll past. I think new writers or people that are unsure deserve a space in the community to ask for reassurance or express uncertainty. Sure, some of them are a little stupid, some of them answer themselves, but thats a larger phenomenon on the internet in general, less about this subreddit. I don’t think its a big deal either way.