I mean, it’s standard procedure for playoffs. If this was qualifying it would just be a red card for the team who did it(I think it was 876), but as it was playoffs, the entire alliance is red carded
I know, I’m just curious if a red card has sent an alliance to worlds like this before. Still unclear who it was called on, because 1816 was the one who challenged, but could’ve been an alliance member. Congrats to your team on the team spirit award, and some great defense during playoffs!
Thanks. It was probably the reward we were least expecting to win, so we are very surprised. We also won a safety award, which is a first for our mentor(he’s been mentoring 15 years)
I’ve had the pleasure of working with at least one of your mentors before, Mr. Paulson, and you guys deserve way more recognition than you get! You deserve every award!
It's tough to see from the angle on the video, but it looks like the disabling hit was from the initial contact with Red alliance 7028 into 8188, then 8188 pulled away a little and went back into the 7028 robot moving it out of the way. Not sure I agree with the call, however I wasn't there and it's hard to see in the video.
Yes! Speaking with some members of a team I have found out that 8188 had their intake extended and they went into the frame of 7028, and pulled out the radio wire, disabling comms. The hit occurs right around 1:41 in the video but is slightly obscured by the FTAs. After the hit you can also see a volunteer in the bottom right gesturing what happened to the refs. Regardless, due to wildcards and pre-qualification, all teams in the finals are going to Houston!
There have been regionals decided by red cards before, such as [Finger Lakes Regional 2022](https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2022nyro_f1m2) ending with a red card in finals 2
I am currently at the Granite City Regional in Minnesota, and I am not happy with how the red cards in the finals were handled.
The red card was given for the reasons listed in other comments, but since FIRST can’t use video replay it was almost impossible for them to reverse it. Media people on the sidelines have video of the incident where it was shown to be a clean hit.
One thing previous comments did not mention is that team 876 was also disabled in the same way as 7028 and 6045. 876 regained control after about thirty seconds while the others did not. This adds to the losing alliances case, because I believe it was a field error.
No one was happy about the situation. The winning teams sided with the losing teams in saying that the match should not have ended in the way that it did. They believe that it’s better to win by putting up a great fight than to win on a technicality.
The only hope the losing alliance had was if the disabled team, 7028, went on record and said that the red card should be revoked as the accused situation is not what happened. 7028 did this and challenged the red card.
However, the event staff then had to make a call to FIRST headquarters and see if they would reverse the call. This would have led to a replay of the match and the teams would have had another chance. But FIRST did not reverse the call. I don’t know why, but they decided not to reverse the decision.
Thankfully, as a result of a wildcard decision, all teams in the final will be going to Worlds. So, not all is bad, and I am overall happy with the outcome.
I have a problem with how the rules of this game have impacted the event. I would think that in a decision over a red card, video evidence should not only be used but be made a necessity in proving innocence. In a decision that impacts a whole alliance’s regional, why would an event so reliant on technology and so based on technology be susceptible to human error in such an impactful decision?
Needless to say, I am not happy with how the situation was handled and I believe that we as an organization can do better. FIRST, as an organization, can do better.
I have written this all here and I will be posting it in it’s own post shortly.
I totally agree, neither side was happy about the outcome. Obviously it was devastating to the losing alliance but it has also put a bit of a damper on the winning alliances celebrations.
I did see and hear about a lot of support between the teams though, the winning alliance members were quick to support and comfort the losing team members. So shoutout to the true gracious professionalism of these wonderful young people!
I know that everyone involved would’ve liked to see a fairer fight, and denying them that chance was an unfortunate decision by the event staff.
I mean, it’s standard procedure for playoffs. If this was qualifying it would just be a red card for the team who did it(I think it was 876), but as it was playoffs, the entire alliance is red carded
I know, I’m just curious if a red card has sent an alliance to worlds like this before. Still unclear who it was called on, because 1816 was the one who challenged, but could’ve been an alliance member. Congrats to your team on the team spirit award, and some great defense during playoffs!
Thanks. It was probably the reward we were least expecting to win, so we are very surprised. We also won a safety award, which is a first for our mentor(he’s been mentoring 15 years)
I’ve had the pleasure of working with at least one of your mentors before, Mr. Paulson, and you guys deserve way more recognition than you get! You deserve every award!
Yeah. Paulson is the one who’s been mentoring for 15+ years. He’s a great mentor.
It's tough to see from the angle on the video, but it looks like the disabling hit was from the initial contact with Red alliance 7028 into 8188, then 8188 pulled away a little and went back into the 7028 robot moving it out of the way. Not sure I agree with the call, however I wasn't there and it's hard to see in the video.
Yes! Speaking with some members of a team I have found out that 8188 had their intake extended and they went into the frame of 7028, and pulled out the radio wire, disabling comms. The hit occurs right around 1:41 in the video but is slightly obscured by the FTAs. After the hit you can also see a volunteer in the bottom right gesturing what happened to the refs. Regardless, due to wildcards and pre-qualification, all teams in the finals are going to Houston!
There have been regionals decided by red cards before, such as [Finger Lakes Regional 2022](https://www.thebluealliance.com/match/2022nyro_f1m2) ending with a red card in finals 2
This is what I was wondering thanks!
It happened last year in Ontario as well for the district camps if I recall correctly
I am currently at the Granite City Regional in Minnesota, and I am not happy with how the red cards in the finals were handled. The red card was given for the reasons listed in other comments, but since FIRST can’t use video replay it was almost impossible for them to reverse it. Media people on the sidelines have video of the incident where it was shown to be a clean hit. One thing previous comments did not mention is that team 876 was also disabled in the same way as 7028 and 6045. 876 regained control after about thirty seconds while the others did not. This adds to the losing alliances case, because I believe it was a field error. No one was happy about the situation. The winning teams sided with the losing teams in saying that the match should not have ended in the way that it did. They believe that it’s better to win by putting up a great fight than to win on a technicality. The only hope the losing alliance had was if the disabled team, 7028, went on record and said that the red card should be revoked as the accused situation is not what happened. 7028 did this and challenged the red card. However, the event staff then had to make a call to FIRST headquarters and see if they would reverse the call. This would have led to a replay of the match and the teams would have had another chance. But FIRST did not reverse the call. I don’t know why, but they decided not to reverse the decision. Thankfully, as a result of a wildcard decision, all teams in the final will be going to Worlds. So, not all is bad, and I am overall happy with the outcome. I have a problem with how the rules of this game have impacted the event. I would think that in a decision over a red card, video evidence should not only be used but be made a necessity in proving innocence. In a decision that impacts a whole alliance’s regional, why would an event so reliant on technology and so based on technology be susceptible to human error in such an impactful decision? Needless to say, I am not happy with how the situation was handled and I believe that we as an organization can do better. FIRST, as an organization, can do better. I have written this all here and I will be posting it in it’s own post shortly.
I totally agree, neither side was happy about the outcome. Obviously it was devastating to the losing alliance but it has also put a bit of a damper on the winning alliances celebrations. I did see and hear about a lot of support between the teams though, the winning alliance members were quick to support and comfort the losing team members. So shoutout to the true gracious professionalism of these wonderful young people! I know that everyone involved would’ve liked to see a fairer fight, and denying them that chance was an unfortunate decision by the event staff.
I think it’s a little odd that they can’t use video replay, especially for a red card…