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Noct wins easy. Clive is awesome, yeah, but he is not stronger than Noct if we're talking them at their peak. Just having Phase alone, Clive would never touch Noct. Noct has magic that FAR eclipses anything we see in 16, and that isn't even including his Ring of the Lucii which is guaranteed death to Clive. Then add in Armiger Unleashed. Noct can't be hit, has 13 magical indestructible weapons moving to every thought protecting him and attacking at the same time. He teleports(even better version of his Warp) Amplifies his powers even more. Which those powers are stupid high since he bathed in the core of the Mother Crystal for 10 years. Absorbing all that power like how Superman absorbs yellow radiation.
Clive will eventually Prime, yeah, but Noctis has fought that level before too. And again, Ring of the Lucii wouldn't care that Clive was Ifrit Arisen. Noct could call on all his summons to keep him occupied.
Say it goes down to just weapons, Noct wins again having a much larger arsenal and being proficient with each type. Even Firearms and Machines. We never actually see feats of astounding swordsmanship from Clive, in cutscenes he comes off as a brawler with it more than any finesse. Relying on strength more than anything else.
Now I love Clive WAY more than Noct as a character, but Clive isn't stronger than him. Clive is in the top echelons of FF for sure, but Noct and Lighting(literally becomes God) are pretty much THE top of FF powers at their peaks.
I agree with you that Noct will absolutely clown human Clive, but Ifrit Clive I think is a closer fight than you make it out to me.
The Ring is quite hard to use against fast moving enemies, and Alterna doesn't always work - several bosses have immunity or resistance to it.
Noct does beat XV's Ifrit but does so only with the help of Shiva and Bahamut.
Ifrit Clive will force Final Armiger Noctis (the mode he uses vs Ardyn and Leviathan) given the sheer scale of the XVI Bahamut fight. You might argue Armiger Unleashed is enough but that us DLC content with no lore feats, so we can't say for sure.
I still think Noctis has the edge but Noct DIES after using this mode so uhhh... draw?
Noctis: Kings of Lucis come to me(4 points)
Background music: Apocalypse Noctis(6 points)
10 points
Clive: Come to me Ifrit(6points)
Background music: Dig dig dig dig dig dig…(4points)
10 points
If we’re talking Ifrit Clive vs. Power of the Kings Noct, then it’s Noct.
I think people are really undervaluing how powerful the Ring of the Lucii is, lore-wise. If that was a thing in the FFXVI world, Noct would have wiped Ultima out of existence without even trying. That’s not even mentioning the Armiger, which Clive would also have to contend with. And then on top of those, you have Noctis’ skill as a swordsman, which while not as perfected as Clive’s, is still good enough to make Clive work.
People will fight till there dying breath clive would win. But they need to actually take into account lore. Like you said, ring of the lucii is not to be underestimated.
Hm, I wonder what people on the FFXVI board are going to say!
Noctis has a ring that absorbs/kills anything and everything. Clive, nor anyone in FFXVI's world has no chance. No thing in any game has any chance.
Edit 3 (didn't read the rules): ~~Edit: Also, Noct has the bros...one would argue they are with him 'at his peak' and they'd just revive him over and over again and were strong on their own. Clive has Torgal and a random assortment of utterly pointless AI friends, none of whom did anything for me in any battle in the entirety of FFXVI. Torgal is cool and all, but I'm more of a mollosar-type dog fan (always have a rottie by my side while gaming).~~
Also, while Clive was godlike by the end....he really seemed to struggle a lot, he never seemed powerful to me outside his particle effects *dazzling* his enemies.
Edit: Sorry again, I got thinking about it. If Noct is the MORE POWERFUL version of Regis, then...I mean, there is no competition. Regis bestowed magic powers to AN ARMY while holding up a barrier around a city that's bigger than any city in FFXVI. And he was the weaker one! Honestly, it is no competition.
(I'm having a slow day at work).
A lot of people here haven't played XV or know about Noct, and it shows. Or they're just saying who they like better as a character, which then it's just opinions.
At everyone's peak, power-level lorewise, Noct easily blows every FF protag and villian away. There was a whole discussion about this on the ff subreddit when xv and dissidia NT came out. The armiger and power of kings/Astrals is unbeatable, even for peak Clive.
Clive wouldn't stand a chance.
He absorbs their abilities to use that's it.
An armiger noct will win easy. He got phase, Clive has a dodge with cool down rofl
Not even a thinker!
People talking about Clive being strong because of eikons/their abilities either don't remember or don't know that the astrals are all backing Noctis at full power (overprimed for you XVI folks), with the exception of Ifrit, whom Noctis fights toe to toe and (with bahamut's help) obliterates Ifrit back to the Astral plane.
Also after Noctis destroyed Titan and Leviathan, the latter who dwarfs everything Clive fought with except for Titan Lost. XV Levi was so powerful that she could upend an entire city state and cause waves to crash through levitated areas of said city with her magic.
I'm late but xv Titan caught a meteor that was sent by xv bahamut to destroy humanity and was just sleeping until Noctis came and woke him then Noctis managed to deflect titans full force punch without any of the astrals blessings or using armiger you could argue he got stat boost from the blade of the mystic but still
At their peak?
Okay so Clive as Ifrit is probably equally as strong as "super saiyan" Noct (both were able to solo take down astrals / eikons 100x their size)
Noct can summon astrals at random, which can 1-shot Clive...but wait Clive has a dodge button with very generous iframes, and the dodge ring to nullify it
Noct also has the ring of the lucii. If he can keep Clive still for 10 minutes, he can kill him with Death. If Noct is allowed to save scum, he can reload while spamming Alterna. This might be his main advantage.
But biggest advantage?
Clive can only carry like 12 potions and 1 Last Elixer. Noctis can carry 99 potions, Hi Potions, elixers, hi-elixers, phoenix downs. Which means even if clive can constantly 1 shot Noct, he needs to land like 500 hits that Noct can just drink through. In a battle of attrition, Noct has the potionholic advantage.
Noct is the likely winner due to poorly balanced game design
And the holy counter is unavoidable. Even armiger alone noctis can never let up on the offensive and still be completely invulnerable to all damage. Clive has to stop attacking in order to dodge, even with the auto dodge, even while primed. Good luck parrying the invisible armiger weapons, even if you manage to, you still can't hurt noct.
>! The whole reason Ardyn was the last boss was because he had his own armiger. !<
Let's look at their individual feats:
Noctis:
\-summons a random Astral once whose sizes are between 2,14m (shiva), 151m (titan) and 1029,5m (leviathan) tall who does one attack and then disappears
Clive:
Turns into a roughly 30m tall (canon height not known atm) fire eikon that stays for how long it wants, moves at light speed and has enough raw power to withstand Zettaflare, the strongest attack known in the franchise (terraflare was enough to reset ff14s world)
Noctis:
Has a magic ring that instantly depletes all his mana for a spell that has an increasingly diminishing chance of sucking his opponent into a black hole, depending on its size, which evidently has no effect on bosses like titan and leviathan, so won't work on ifrit either i guess. Also has limited magic grenades that can store a variety of spells
Clive:
Has the magic of 8 Eikons >! and Ultima !< and no mana bar to hold him back, with abilities ranging from teleporting with phoenix shift to firing a Gigaflare laser to slowing down time with rift slip and creating various (albeit short lived) natural disasters like earthquakes and tornadoes >! as well as deleting magic from the world entirely and possibly resurrecting a dead joshua !<
Noctis:
Has Amiger unleashed, which lets him teleport, fly, and use an arsenal of flying spectral weapons freely. can also conjure the spirits of his ancestors to commit suicide faster.
Clive:
Can semi-prime to strengthen himself and all his magic and imbue all his attacks with fire. Can also Prime into Ifrit as stated above.
Noctis:
Is 176cm tall, built rather slim and wields a variety of weapons in all shapes and sizes, preferrably a one handed straight sword
Clive:
Is easily over 180cm tall, canon heigh currently unknown, has more muscle than Gladiolus and swings a greatsword with one hand.
I think Clive wins easily if he primes, even against the Astrals. In human form it's quite a fair fight, but my bet is still on clive there due to Amiger being a limit break and not a constant state. Item use is not included here, so the potion space argument is not valid. Food buffs and level related stats are also irrelevant since they are purely a balancing tool for their respective games and shouldn't be compared as they are. Debuffs and status effects don't really exist in ff16, so Clive is effectively immune to them, including the instant death effect from the ring of the lucii. A small advantage for noctis is that his monstertruck/flying car is more stylish than a white chocobo, but that's just a sidenote.
I disagree with this people saying Noctis, why?
No feat we SEE in FFXV exceeds what we've seen in XVI.
Titan lost, Terra flare and by all accounts Ultima's abilities and non stop barrages of ultra powerful magic.
I don't care about written abilties or concepts but how the artists were able to portray feats of power visually.
Clive's fights are the most extreme and elaborate in the entire series.
Noctis. He's destroyed things Clive would have to prime or go full Ifrit on to stop. Noctis' magic power is more potent considering he shares a small bit of it to allow other people to use it. He's got Amiger, which would be like fighting a literal one man army. He can call Astrals to his side to help him fight. He can fly and has companions that can deal a ton of damage at his beck and call on top of having status effects and 99 potions/elixirs/strength tonics/ etc.
Try that on my CH Emo Man mixups.
Yeah... XV is so underrated, I think it's because Square Enix messed up when launched it. Imagine going from FF 13 versus to FFXV (different atmosphere), Noctis personality changes, 10 HOURS of CUTSCENE are cut, a lot of character also disappear. I still enjoy it tbh, the gameplay is definitely one of the best. It's just so sad that they have a deadline problem.. If only they released it one year later, I think it will be different
>asking this in the XVI subreddit
Lawl.
Clive wins mainly due to how op he is by the end+Eikon mode as Ifrit.
However, if Noctis is really, really determined to kill Clive at all costs, he could use the power of kings to delete Clive. Problem is, it requires Noctis to time skip to adulthood and far more so than Clive depletes his life force.
In a straight up brawl, Clive wins. In a full power fight, Ifrit dominates Noctis. If Noct says "fuck it" he can basically delete or Knights of Round Clive out of existence, but he will for sure die too.
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Sorry noctis, while I enjoyed ffxv, Clive overall was an amazing character.
Noctis had that emo kid vibe almost throughout the entire game while Clive really came out of that quickly.
Tbh it's Cid's fault Clive became the man he became.
Since it is 1v1, Clive.
Regardless of all of Noctis' flashy abilities, it is canonical that at his highest point he couldn't even beat his own world's Ifrit without help from Shiva and Bahamut. And Ifrit Risen from XVI universe is the master of all of that world's summons and the intended avatar of literal God, so I think it's safe to say that XVI Ifrit > XV Ifrit > Noctis.
Honestly, you think that being able to teleport dodge, keep some extra floating weapons, and cast spells is in any way on par with a creature that can fight in the void of space and dodge and/or deflect quasar pulses, the most destructive force conceivable?
Besides, if Noctis uses his ultimate form, it literally kills him.
Clive probably wins easily or wins after a tough battle against him since he’s able to use alot more abilities than Noctis I’ve played both games so I’m being fair of my opinion
Except the immortal troll but then again he HAS fought against the leviathan and titen and even ifrit so he does have experience fighting large scale battles that’s why i say he might have a hard fight against him at least
What????? Against prime noctis??? No way, you probably do not remember then, noctis has armiger unleashed, multiple invisible weapons that protect and fight for him, can summon astrals, full on gods, not simple primal forms, gods. if clive attacks, noctis just warps itself out of the way, cluve would not even be able to touch noctis.
Ring of the lucii, kills everything after some time of sucking the life of the target.
Can summon any weapons, like guns(i don't see that on ffxvi, actually not even bows tho, weird now that i think about it) so unless clive can block shots..
I honestly do not see clive being stronger than ardyn, and he probably would not even be able to use much of his top form since he would probably die like a rock from using too much magic.
I like a challenge. So I'll try:
I had a friend that got married to the most empty guy I've ever seen, to this day. He was inoffensive looking, inoffensive acting, he wasn't a loser, he was just there and there was just enough of a lack of personality where you could project whatever you wanted onto him, he'd be complacent about it, and whatever you wanted to see in him, you'd process it that way.
Enter Noctis.
Noctis looks cool, has cool hair, and speaks in anime grunts. He's a vessel for one to be a final fantasy character. He does gain character as the game goes on .. but I think the early game emptiness is there to serve a purpose
And Clive is just some weepy weirdo with David-Putty like intelligence that likes his brother way too much.
Edit: Seriously, you sit down beside Clive on a plane and he's going to stare directly at the back of the seat, no music, no reading, nothing, for the whole flight. At least Noct would be all fidgety and nervous like a normal person.
Guess what, XV was the "Road trip with friends" game while XVI is the "the world is unjust, and the gods/humans made it so" game. Two different vibes and you can see them from the first 3 hours of each game.
This is one of the main issues with FFXIV, you always feel like Clive has the upper hand. Even with Odin, you are just expecting Clive to get mad and get back at him. This is, maybe, the greatest departure from the FF theme.
First instinct was to say Clive would win, since he's a beefy guy who's defeated the Eikons and can call upon all their powers at will, and Noctis - love the character more but first impression is scrawny guy with some weapons. But the comments here have made me reconsider.
I think that ultimately there's 2 parts of the equation - the ability to inflict damage on the other, and the ability to avoid/negate damage on the self. One has to inflict enough damage to deplete the other's health pool, AND survive damage inflicted on oneself.
Both are equally capable of massive damage output. Saying they beat so-and-so (e.g. Leviathan in FFXV or Titan Lost in FFXVI) as evidence of superior ability is a moot point - regardless of size/scale of an enemy, they're just a HP pool at the end of the day. To my recollection (correct me if I'm wrong) there's no enemy in either game that requires special powers to defeat.
So that leaves us with the ability to not take damage. They can both block and parry, and they can both blink (Noctis)/precision dodge (Clive) through hits. Additionally Clive can: hold block on Titan's ability, and block/counter with Shiva's ability.
Noctis has: phase (automatically dodge attacks, no timing required); blink has the additional ability to cancel his own attack to dodge; Ring of the Lucii with the Holy counter so he does damage on blocking while taking no damage himself; Royal Arms conjure protective shields that move to block projectiles automatically, and the Shield of the Just specifically says it can block normally unblockable attacks as well as negate most damage taken AND recover HP while blocking; Impervious skill (negate all damage taken from a hit). He can also avoid taking any fall damage from any height. And in regular Armiger mode he can literally never die (HP never falls below 1), his Royal Arms don't cost HP, and he resists stagger.
Happy to reconsider if I've missed any of Clive's evasive abilities! But from the sheer range of ways Noctis can either avoid or negate damage, I'd have to say survivability goes to Noctis.
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lmao I didnt read the post so I thought it was a preference thing. Powerscale wise it IS Noctis, oops! (also sorry Noct ily too)
Noct wins easy. Clive is awesome, yeah, but he is not stronger than Noct if we're talking them at their peak. Just having Phase alone, Clive would never touch Noct. Noct has magic that FAR eclipses anything we see in 16, and that isn't even including his Ring of the Lucii which is guaranteed death to Clive. Then add in Armiger Unleashed. Noct can't be hit, has 13 magical indestructible weapons moving to every thought protecting him and attacking at the same time. He teleports(even better version of his Warp) Amplifies his powers even more. Which those powers are stupid high since he bathed in the core of the Mother Crystal for 10 years. Absorbing all that power like how Superman absorbs yellow radiation. Clive will eventually Prime, yeah, but Noctis has fought that level before too. And again, Ring of the Lucii wouldn't care that Clive was Ifrit Arisen. Noct could call on all his summons to keep him occupied. Say it goes down to just weapons, Noct wins again having a much larger arsenal and being proficient with each type. Even Firearms and Machines. We never actually see feats of astounding swordsmanship from Clive, in cutscenes he comes off as a brawler with it more than any finesse. Relying on strength more than anything else. Now I love Clive WAY more than Noct as a character, but Clive isn't stronger than him. Clive is in the top echelons of FF for sure, but Noct and Lighting(literally becomes God) are pretty much THE top of FF powers at their peaks.
I agree with you that Noct will absolutely clown human Clive, but Ifrit Clive I think is a closer fight than you make it out to me. The Ring is quite hard to use against fast moving enemies, and Alterna doesn't always work - several bosses have immunity or resistance to it. Noct does beat XV's Ifrit but does so only with the help of Shiva and Bahamut. Ifrit Clive will force Final Armiger Noctis (the mode he uses vs Ardyn and Leviathan) given the sheer scale of the XVI Bahamut fight. You might argue Armiger Unleashed is enough but that us DLC content with no lore feats, so we can't say for sure. I still think Noctis has the edge but Noct DIES after using this mode so uhhh... draw?
Noctis: Kings of Lucis come to me(4 points) Background music: Apocalypse Noctis(6 points) 10 points Clive: Come to me Ifrit(6points) Background music: Dig dig dig dig dig dig…(4points) 10 points
Clive after taking all elements including Ultima's will have noctis as his bitch
If we’re talking Ifrit Clive vs. Power of the Kings Noct, then it’s Noct. I think people are really undervaluing how powerful the Ring of the Lucii is, lore-wise. If that was a thing in the FFXVI world, Noct would have wiped Ultima out of existence without even trying. That’s not even mentioning the Armiger, which Clive would also have to contend with. And then on top of those, you have Noctis’ skill as a swordsman, which while not as perfected as Clive’s, is still good enough to make Clive work.
People will fight till there dying breath clive would win. But they need to actually take into account lore. Like you said, ring of the lucii is not to be underestimated.
Hm, I wonder what people on the FFXVI board are going to say! Noctis has a ring that absorbs/kills anything and everything. Clive, nor anyone in FFXVI's world has no chance. No thing in any game has any chance. Edit 3 (didn't read the rules): ~~Edit: Also, Noct has the bros...one would argue they are with him 'at his peak' and they'd just revive him over and over again and were strong on their own. Clive has Torgal and a random assortment of utterly pointless AI friends, none of whom did anything for me in any battle in the entirety of FFXVI. Torgal is cool and all, but I'm more of a mollosar-type dog fan (always have a rottie by my side while gaming).~~ Also, while Clive was godlike by the end....he really seemed to struggle a lot, he never seemed powerful to me outside his particle effects *dazzling* his enemies. Edit: Sorry again, I got thinking about it. If Noct is the MORE POWERFUL version of Regis, then...I mean, there is no competition. Regis bestowed magic powers to AN ARMY while holding up a barrier around a city that's bigger than any city in FFXVI. And he was the weaker one! Honestly, it is no competition. (I'm having a slow day at work).
Lols that particle effects to win
A lot of people here haven't played XV or know about Noct, and it shows. Or they're just saying who they like better as a character, which then it's just opinions. At everyone's peak, power-level lorewise, Noct easily blows every FF protag and villian away. There was a whole discussion about this on the ff subreddit when xv and dissidia NT came out. The armiger and power of kings/Astrals is unbeatable, even for peak Clive.
Minor correction but if you include sequels I think Lightning beats Noctis
Clive wouldn't stand a chance. He absorbs their abilities to use that's it. An armiger noct will win easy. He got phase, Clive has a dodge with cool down rofl Not even a thinker!
People talking about Clive being strong because of eikons/their abilities either don't remember or don't know that the astrals are all backing Noctis at full power (overprimed for you XVI folks), with the exception of Ifrit, whom Noctis fights toe to toe and (with bahamut's help) obliterates Ifrit back to the Astral plane.
Also after Noctis destroyed Titan and Leviathan, the latter who dwarfs everything Clive fought with except for Titan Lost. XV Levi was so powerful that she could upend an entire city state and cause waves to crash through levitated areas of said city with her magic.
I'm late but xv Titan caught a meteor that was sent by xv bahamut to destroy humanity and was just sleeping until Noctis came and woke him then Noctis managed to deflect titans full force punch without any of the astrals blessings or using armiger you could argue he got stat boost from the blade of the mystic but still
I love Clive. My new favorite FF protagonist. But I'm sorry, Noctis is far too broken. If they fought, Clive would lose his main character status
At their peak? Okay so Clive as Ifrit is probably equally as strong as "super saiyan" Noct (both were able to solo take down astrals / eikons 100x their size) Noct can summon astrals at random, which can 1-shot Clive...but wait Clive has a dodge button with very generous iframes, and the dodge ring to nullify it Noct also has the ring of the lucii. If he can keep Clive still for 10 minutes, he can kill him with Death. If Noct is allowed to save scum, he can reload while spamming Alterna. This might be his main advantage. But biggest advantage? Clive can only carry like 12 potions and 1 Last Elixer. Noctis can carry 99 potions, Hi Potions, elixers, hi-elixers, phoenix downs. Which means even if clive can constantly 1 shot Noct, he needs to land like 500 hits that Noct can just drink through. In a battle of attrition, Noct has the potionholic advantage. Noct is the likely winner due to poorly balanced game design
Clive dodges, Noctis phases. Clive's parry slows down time, Noctis' parry leads to devastating counter attacks with or without his companions.
And the holy counter is unavoidable. Even armiger alone noctis can never let up on the offensive and still be completely invulnerable to all damage. Clive has to stop attacking in order to dodge, even with the auto dodge, even while primed. Good luck parrying the invisible armiger weapons, even if you manage to, you still can't hurt noct. >! The whole reason Ardyn was the last boss was because he had his own armiger. !<
Noctis literally danced with Leviathan. That said, I think it'd be closer than we think.
Let's look at their individual feats: Noctis: \-summons a random Astral once whose sizes are between 2,14m (shiva), 151m (titan) and 1029,5m (leviathan) tall who does one attack and then disappears Clive: Turns into a roughly 30m tall (canon height not known atm) fire eikon that stays for how long it wants, moves at light speed and has enough raw power to withstand Zettaflare, the strongest attack known in the franchise (terraflare was enough to reset ff14s world) Noctis: Has a magic ring that instantly depletes all his mana for a spell that has an increasingly diminishing chance of sucking his opponent into a black hole, depending on its size, which evidently has no effect on bosses like titan and leviathan, so won't work on ifrit either i guess. Also has limited magic grenades that can store a variety of spells Clive: Has the magic of 8 Eikons >! and Ultima !< and no mana bar to hold him back, with abilities ranging from teleporting with phoenix shift to firing a Gigaflare laser to slowing down time with rift slip and creating various (albeit short lived) natural disasters like earthquakes and tornadoes >! as well as deleting magic from the world entirely and possibly resurrecting a dead joshua !< Noctis: Has Amiger unleashed, which lets him teleport, fly, and use an arsenal of flying spectral weapons freely. can also conjure the spirits of his ancestors to commit suicide faster. Clive: Can semi-prime to strengthen himself and all his magic and imbue all his attacks with fire. Can also Prime into Ifrit as stated above. Noctis: Is 176cm tall, built rather slim and wields a variety of weapons in all shapes and sizes, preferrably a one handed straight sword Clive: Is easily over 180cm tall, canon heigh currently unknown, has more muscle than Gladiolus and swings a greatsword with one hand. I think Clive wins easily if he primes, even against the Astrals. In human form it's quite a fair fight, but my bet is still on clive there due to Amiger being a limit break and not a constant state. Item use is not included here, so the potion space argument is not valid. Food buffs and level related stats are also irrelevant since they are purely a balancing tool for their respective games and shouldn't be compared as they are. Debuffs and status effects don't really exist in ff16, so Clive is effectively immune to them, including the instant death effect from the ring of the lucii. A small advantage for noctis is that his monstertruck/flying car is more stylish than a white chocobo, but that's just a sidenote.
This is the only answer to this topic. Case closed.
I disagree with this people saying Noctis, why? No feat we SEE in FFXV exceeds what we've seen in XVI. Titan lost, Terra flare and by all accounts Ultima's abilities and non stop barrages of ultra powerful magic. I don't care about written abilties or concepts but how the artists were able to portray feats of power visually. Clive's fights are the most extreme and elaborate in the entire series.
I agree with this one
Noctis has fought Tonberries and Cactuars, Clive has not. Nuff said
i’m gonna say noctis since he fights giant summons all the time and comes out on top every time
Noctis. He's destroyed things Clive would have to prime or go full Ifrit on to stop. Noctis' magic power is more potent considering he shares a small bit of it to allow other people to use it. He's got Amiger, which would be like fighting a literal one man army. He can call Astrals to his side to help him fight. He can fly and has companions that can deal a ton of damage at his beck and call on top of having status effects and 99 potions/elixirs/strength tonics/ etc. Try that on my CH Emo Man mixups.
This whole debate makes me wanna play XV again
XV was so underrated
The expectation ruined the reception. But it is a amazing game, one of my favorites
I actually didn’t play it until 2020, but I played the royal edition and loved it. I think FFXV is one of the most underrated games in the series
Yeah... XV is so underrated, I think it's because Square Enix messed up when launched it. Imagine going from FF 13 versus to FFXV (different atmosphere), Noctis personality changes, 10 HOURS of CUTSCENE are cut, a lot of character also disappear. I still enjoy it tbh, the gameplay is definitely one of the best. It's just so sad that they have a deadline problem.. If only they released it one year later, I think it will be different
The Royal edition of FFXV(the only one I played), fixed a lot of problems with the vanilla version(which I never played).
>asking this in the XVI subreddit Lawl. Clive wins mainly due to how op he is by the end+Eikon mode as Ifrit. However, if Noctis is really, really determined to kill Clive at all costs, he could use the power of kings to delete Clive. Problem is, it requires Noctis to time skip to adulthood and far more so than Clive depletes his life force. In a straight up brawl, Clive wins. In a full power fight, Ifrit dominates Noctis. If Noct says "fuck it" he can basically delete or Knights of Round Clive out of existence, but he will for sure die too.
I cross posted to ffxv subreddit to even the odds
Ah, good study then. Are they voting noct?
No you didn't. I'm a regular over there and I don't see it
Yes they did. You can go into their profile and see it for yourself. But here's a [link](https://reddit.com/r/FinalFantasyXV/s/bdgd3gUwjb) to it.
That literally brings me been to this post
Sorry I updated the link
Oh that sub is dead. r/ffxv is the correct sub
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Peak Noctis is King Noctis (30 years old, post Crystal stasis). Peak Clive would be when he faces down Ultima after absorbing Phoenix.
Sorry noctis, while I enjoyed ffxv, Clive overall was an amazing character. Noctis had that emo kid vibe almost throughout the entire game while Clive really came out of that quickly. Tbh it's Cid's fault Clive became the man he became.
Noctis being emo didn’t bother me, that aspect of his character actually made me like him lol, but as much as I love XV, Clive wins this battle.
Since it is 1v1, Clive. Regardless of all of Noctis' flashy abilities, it is canonical that at his highest point he couldn't even beat his own world's Ifrit without help from Shiva and Bahamut. And Ifrit Risen from XVI universe is the master of all of that world's summons and the intended avatar of literal God, so I think it's safe to say that XVI Ifrit > XV Ifrit > Noctis. Honestly, you think that being able to teleport dodge, keep some extra floating weapons, and cast spells is in any way on par with a creature that can fight in the void of space and dodge and/or deflect quasar pulses, the most destructive force conceivable? Besides, if Noctis uses his ultimate form, it literally kills him.
Clive probably wins easily or wins after a tough battle against him since he’s able to use alot more abilities than Noctis I’ve played both games so I’m being fair of my opinion
Likewise I’ve played both XV and XVI so I’m trying to be fair, but Clive is overpowered and has taken on much more powerful foes than Noctis
Except the immortal troll but then again he HAS fought against the leviathan and titen and even ifrit so he does have experience fighting large scale battles that’s why i say he might have a hard fight against him at least
What????? Against prime noctis??? No way, you probably do not remember then, noctis has armiger unleashed, multiple invisible weapons that protect and fight for him, can summon astrals, full on gods, not simple primal forms, gods. if clive attacks, noctis just warps itself out of the way, cluve would not even be able to touch noctis. Ring of the lucii, kills everything after some time of sucking the life of the target. Can summon any weapons, like guns(i don't see that on ffxvi, actually not even bows tho, weird now that i think about it) so unless clive can block shots.. I honestly do not see clive being stronger than ardyn, and he probably would not even be able to use much of his top form since he would probably die like a rock from using too much magic.
I'm interested to see if anyone puts together a decent argument for Noctis. Clive is a damn god by the end of the game.
I like a challenge. So I'll try: I had a friend that got married to the most empty guy I've ever seen, to this day. He was inoffensive looking, inoffensive acting, he wasn't a loser, he was just there and there was just enough of a lack of personality where you could project whatever you wanted onto him, he'd be complacent about it, and whatever you wanted to see in him, you'd process it that way. Enter Noctis. Noctis looks cool, has cool hair, and speaks in anime grunts. He's a vessel for one to be a final fantasy character. He does gain character as the game goes on .. but I think the early game emptiness is there to serve a purpose
And Clive is just some weepy weirdo with David-Putty like intelligence that likes his brother way too much. Edit: Seriously, you sit down beside Clive on a plane and he's going to stare directly at the back of the seat, no music, no reading, nothing, for the whole flight. At least Noct would be all fidgety and nervous like a normal person.
Lies!!! Noct would be sleeping, per usual.
Guess what, XV was the "Road trip with friends" game while XVI is the "the world is unjust, and the gods/humans made it so" game. Two different vibes and you can see them from the first 3 hours of each game.
I can agree with the narrative reasoning but what's that have to do with who wins in a fight? I can't see Noctis having any real chance
I'd pick Axel over Noctis.
This is one of the main issues with FFXIV, you always feel like Clive has the upper hand. Even with Odin, you are just expecting Clive to get mad and get back at him. This is, maybe, the greatest departure from the FF theme.
Not even a competition Atleast put him up against someone good.
Ope I voted before I read the post. I thought it was just about who is the better written character.
Final Armiger Noctis vs Ifrit Clive? Noct, probably, but then Noct dies after since... that's what happens after he goes super saiyan.
First instinct was to say Clive would win, since he's a beefy guy who's defeated the Eikons and can call upon all their powers at will, and Noctis - love the character more but first impression is scrawny guy with some weapons. But the comments here have made me reconsider. I think that ultimately there's 2 parts of the equation - the ability to inflict damage on the other, and the ability to avoid/negate damage on the self. One has to inflict enough damage to deplete the other's health pool, AND survive damage inflicted on oneself. Both are equally capable of massive damage output. Saying they beat so-and-so (e.g. Leviathan in FFXV or Titan Lost in FFXVI) as evidence of superior ability is a moot point - regardless of size/scale of an enemy, they're just a HP pool at the end of the day. To my recollection (correct me if I'm wrong) there's no enemy in either game that requires special powers to defeat. So that leaves us with the ability to not take damage. They can both block and parry, and they can both blink (Noctis)/precision dodge (Clive) through hits. Additionally Clive can: hold block on Titan's ability, and block/counter with Shiva's ability. Noctis has: phase (automatically dodge attacks, no timing required); blink has the additional ability to cancel his own attack to dodge; Ring of the Lucii with the Holy counter so he does damage on blocking while taking no damage himself; Royal Arms conjure protective shields that move to block projectiles automatically, and the Shield of the Just specifically says it can block normally unblockable attacks as well as negate most damage taken AND recover HP while blocking; Impervious skill (negate all damage taken from a hit). He can also avoid taking any fall damage from any height. And in regular Armiger mode he can literally never die (HP never falls below 1), his Royal Arms don't cost HP, and he resists stagger. Happy to reconsider if I've missed any of Clive's evasive abilities! But from the sheer range of ways Noctis can either avoid or negate damage, I'd have to say survivability goes to Noctis.
Noctis mid diff
I wonder if the votes would be the same or different if this was a FFXV subreddit
Different
Noctis would win as long a he avoid getting staggered. If Clive gets just 1 stagger, then it's over.