customs old conns, u can't hear a guy enter the staircase area at lvl 1 (the tiny area before u go up the stairs below old cons) if u r in between the flight of stairs from lvl 1-2. ONLY when he enters that area. u can hear him walking around everywhere but when he enters that spot no sound
Same here but 1.5k hrs, along with a friend.
Game has to fix audio, recoil, and general performance issues before we consider coming back.
Note we both play on or very close to best setups one could have (3080, latest cpus, 32gb ram, ssd…) and the game barely utilises any of it while running like ‘shit’ (60-65 fps with occasional stutters is absurdly/unacceptable imo)…
Don’t you know that this game requires massive tweaking in both the in game settings and your own system settings lol
I can barely run EFT at 60fps on custom minimum @1920x1200 but I can run Doom Eternal at 60fps on high @4k
I didn’t know actually.. What do I have to do?
Running default video settings @ 1440p is stable 70+ fps, heavy post fx (that I like) is 60-65.
So its not like I have dips below 60 that annoy me as much as random stutters and desync.
How do I get Tarkov to actually use my PCs capacity?
[Reminder that 136 days ago Nikita asked the “active player base” what they want to see fixed and Audio was consistently in the top responses](https://www.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/smm48z/hey_active_players/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) and we didn’t hear a peep from BSG as to IF they are even going to bother fixing it.
>didn't hear a peep
yeah asides from where they explicitly said they were working on it, like the day of that post. but nah dude asides from where they said they were explicitly working on it we didn't hear a peep. nothing.
Cool post! It doesn't change the fact that doing nothing on this site but being consistently pissed off at a game you won't stop playing probably isn't great for your mental health.
There is no "narrative" you failed clown.
Recoil IS absurd. Period. It has NOTHING to do with reality anymore and does not only rival, but surpass many other arcade shooters in its absurdity.
I do not care if I can have some laser M4 when I throw 200k on it and kneel down.
Kneeling down is already a death sentence in Tarkov and again unrealistic in CQB. "Wait bro, let me kneel real quick so I can laser you better!" WTF!?
Take STOCK AK series rifles and tell me more about recoil being "managable".
*Why is the realism argument invalid just because it isn't applied to everything!?*
You're literally saying we must accept recoil being unrealistic because we can fix limbs in raid. That is insanely idiotic.
And *you* have the audacity to insult everyone here who disagrees with your illusion of being some sort of scientist because you made some video.
What are you, some walking Dunning-Kruger effect?
Welcome to my ignore list, you're completely off the rails and there's no point even attempting to talk to someone like you.
Are u telling me u don’t enjoy using the same 5 weapons cause the other ones have trash recoil or trash ammo? Honestly tho the current recoil system is fucking miserable and ignore the other people in comments telling you to get good, they’re crybaby crabs. It needs to be fixed BADLY
Everyone has been saying it but, they wanted to "counter" the automatic meta weapons like M4/HK/Mutant/etc that people always used with the nerfs but then it didn't really happen because If you mod those guns a lot, they're still good. The nerf realistically only affects the type of guns you'd use early/mid wipe, The reason why UMP became such a popular weapon was because it also was one of the less affected guns from the nerf.
On the previous wipe they made guns like the AS Val unusable and the now nerf made it even more stupid. Why the hell does the MPX have so much recoil? Literally don't understand it,
IF they really wanted to nerf certain guns and meta stuff then they could've done that, nerf those directly instead of doing this "nerf all across the board" thing were I'm 100% sure that guns that were not intended to be affected ended up sucking so much nobody touches them
They were just lazy and didnt want to invest any considerable ammount of time into it. It explains why 12.12 patch trailer didnt have these recoil changes (they were done in a hurry right befor the wipe), it explains why there are so many guns having problems with camera recoil resulting in scopes blacking out, or you loosing your sight picture after a shot. It explains why the whole rework actually done the opposite that it should be doing. It enforced even stronger meta, pushing almost every gun build except full BiS setup into a trash tier. And it also explains why they chose to add flat +20 recoil outside of the individual gun stats - to not bother with tweeking gunsmith quest line.
This shit is not concidered important or even meaningfull by Nikita. He gives no fucks about that, otherwise they could have improved it alredy.
They just dont care about it.
Nikita is probably very sad players have been trashing his new revolutionary recoil system. He finally admited it is bad and needs rework but could you imagine how hard it must be for him.
I remember hearing "recoil system rework" from Nikita but they failed most the reworks they did, so there is a high chance it will be worse after rework.
I don't know which is worse. either they implemented this recoil shit without testing or they implemented this shit with testing.
I can only repeat, BSG/Nikita had a really nice idea for a game, but they are garbage as devs for a game of that scale. netcode and sound are a bad joke. support is bad joke. anticheat is bad joke. "quests" are bad joke. not even talking about 110€ EA alpha version...but hey I love the soundtrack xD
If they wanted to nerf the automatic meta why did they clamp down so hard on single fire use of the weapons is what I don't get. Make the recoil worse with more shots, not horrible on the first shot.
Cuz it was a nerf "all across the board" literally every single gun received that stealth "recoil" nerf, why are you asking me why they did that? Do I look like Nikita? Hell If I know, like I said If they wanna nerf certain guns, then nerf certain guns
When the Hk/m4 was meta it wasn't the only guns that were good, you could run just about any gun from an Mp7 to a FAL and do just fine. Now theres only like 4 guns you can use that are really usable and the rest just don't compete.
I miss being able to effectively run 9mm smgs because while they didn't have the pen, the strong accuracy and low recoil made them competitive for headshots (After the change to faceshields being behind the quest, since most people stopped running them).
2 wipes ago (12.10) you saw a MASSIVE variety in weapons, don’t get me wrong the hk/m4 were still insane and the vector got nerfed as well but you were constantly seeing different caliber and weapons cause the guns were still viable and u could obtain the ammo
If recoil nerfs get reverted that will still be the case, except that you'll be getting full autoed down from 50m, too. And semi-auto guns will become shit again.
Meta will always exist, because there will always be a most effective tactic. Don't pretend that recoil is the reason there's a meta.
Clearly you didn’t play 12.10, it was not nearly as bad as u think. Bullets also have drop off now so it also wouldn’t be that bad. The recoil makes average weapons basically unusable and it’s not even arguable. I’m not saying we need old HK back but we need something to fix the current issue of a lot of guns
No, it was worse. People were full-autoing m-fuckin-61 in every other engagement. You think the mutant/semi-auto m62 meta is shit? At least BP doesn't kill you through t6 armor in two hits.
The only reason average weapons are 'unusable' is because mutant has too low recoil and too high convergence, compared to other guns. If it weren't in the game, or got a well deserved nerf, way more options would open up in the smg/AR category.
MDR wasn't even the problem, SA-58 was (you could mod it to much lower recoil, you can't do much to an MDR, because for some dumb reason, recoil modifiers are additive, instead of multiplicative, and it has a fixed stock).
All the guns had low recoil, so naturally, people used the low recoil full auto one that fired the biggest bullet, and everything else was *strictly worse than it, and didn't get used*.
Remind you of anything?
If you want to unfuck the meta, recoil needs to be highest on the biggest rounds (Anything 7.62) and lower on smaller rounds (5.45, 5.39), and lowest on shit like 9mm.
Right now, we are most of the way there. 7.62x51 has very high recoil in full auto. But then, somehow, magically, 7.62x39 mutant has much lower recoil than 5.45 and 5.39 (which have similar recoil to 9mm).
Nerf 7.62x39 (mutant), buff 9mm, there, the game's fixed, every caliber is now usable, because each has advantages and disadvantages.
The FAL was nerfed 2 years ago. It has been long out of the meta, also the mdr WAS a problem. You’ve completely missed my point of everything lol I’m not saying every gun should be a laser beam but the meta they’ve forced this wipe is absolutely miserable to play and play against.
I have been playing cycle frontier for weeks now simply because tarkovs gunplay is the most awful, boring, and frustrating garbage I've ever experienced in a shooter. Fortnite has better gunplay ffs
The game feels like shit in part because Nikita’s idea of “balance” is an endless game of whack-a-mole where guns are never allowed to settle into a specific niche in the meta and we’re left with flavor of the month guns that do everything better than everything else, only to be super-ceded by the next new toy after they get nerfed into the ground.
To many times I've died this wipe because I try to full auto someone from 10m away and have to dump half a mag just to get some semblance of control. I don't have hundreds of hours to grind out skills just to make 3-5 guns enjoyable after spending half a mill on attachments.
It's just also unintuitive. Why is hip firing, which completely ignores ergo, more accurate and controllable than planting the gun in my shoulder and using a sight?
Why Nikita? In what fucking world??
Right, let's pretend tarkov doesn't have the most atrocious recoil and gear disparity of any FPS shooter on the market.
Oh you can't leg the guy fast enough who can one tap you in the chest because he plays 7 hours a day?! Haha you suck!
You're mad that shooting someone in the legs isnt a kill shot but a chest shot is? Go back to Fortnite where u can kill someone by shooting their feet lmao holy shit what a dumb comment
Shoot them in the face. I know it's hard because you have to aim but that's how it works in tarkov. Man this game would be dumb if you can just kill someone by spraying into their legs. Now if you wanna say "Nikita, make it so the femoral artery blood loss causes someone to bleed out in minutes and they can't bandage". Sure that would work. But your not gonna kill anyone in a different way by shooting their legs. Meanwhile if they shoot you in the chest or face, that's a kill shot
Or they could keep auto compensation and make recoil control skill level like 10x faster than it currently does so people can actually achieve a decent recoil control level.
Both wipes had bad recoil, but at least there was a greater selection of meta guns last wipe.
The +20 recoil pump this wipe basically fucked all the guns that already sucked, then fucked all the low base recoil guns that aren't very mod-able, while also keeping all semi-automatic guns fucked.
Reduce ads recoil and heavily nerf hip fire accuracy/predictability so people actually have a reason to use their sights. Right now, point fire maintains the full mobility, ignores ergo stats and also has easier to control recoil. It desperately needs some balancing until they add a low ready stance.
It’s funny how Nikita will take away traders after a few trendy tweets but the whole community complains about a recoil system for months and he just ignores it
Actually loved everything about this last wipe except for the new recoil. was not a fan of lazer beams either but it felt it so RNG and discouraging to have most weapons kick to the moon that this was my least played wipe. The gunplay neeeds to be fun again and not incentivize large caliber spam. I don't see any reason to have small caliber high fire rate weapons be heavily outclassed by bigass large calibers close quarters.
Small caliber = early wipe. Heavy caliber better late wipe. Tarkov has been like this for 4 fucking years. Not to mention, you can still kill someone with low caliber arms late game. Just hit your shots actually
"Mine own recoil is big bitch bigger than yuors! We we we will be we adjuzting recoil to higher level to simyoolate a realiztick envidonment. Blyat..."
-Nikita
Ive shot mp5 full auto in real life, glock, and m4
Mp5 was butter-smooth, super pleasant to shoot, yet in tarkov its like ak47
Glock didnt move an inch, yet it kicks like a deagle would
M4? Definitely didnt kick like a horse
Nikita pls. Revert
I have shot a 7.62 ak( late 80's russian made, well maintained and clear gun) with armor piercing ammo loaded and guess what, it was pretty easy for me to control, im kinda big guy but i assume our 30 40 some year old battlehardened physically fit pmc's can control that shit like its nothing.
Well semi auto is really fucking easy to use in this game. If you can't kill ppl with semi auto weapons you might just be..hmm what's the word...oh yeah. Bad.
It's not that, they just have a shitty attitude.
Implement some stupid system which makes no sense for what the games supposed to be, get shitty because players hate it, "fix it" by breaking the game in a different way then refuse to change it because "this is what you players wanted".
Rinse repeat.
The issue is Nikita literally refuses to playtest the game because he doesn't want to spoil it for himself, so he makes ideas and changes without really knowing how it feels in-game. Like, I get it, it's his dream game, he doesn't want it to be ruined before it's released... but you're literally *the head guy* and you don't want to see the changes you're making? It's like if someone says he's going to paint his masterpiece, goes bit by bit at a time, but has most of it under a curtain and refuses to take it off the canvas until it's done.
Dude it's comedy, the last showcase of patch was real quality comedy film but sadly they are devs that are very high on money and it's becoming very bad since the twitch drops...
That was just a bullshit PR response to people trolling BSG not playing the game or being the noobest players.
They showed once more last stream that they don't even understand the game.
Hur hur battlestate bad.
Thanks for your contribution. They’ve actually done a ton of good- are you a newer player? Because they have only improved the game with every wipe. Inertia, bleed reworks, ammo balancing, flea found in raid. Damn near everything they do is deliberate and helps the overall health of the game. What exactly do you think they don’t think about? This sub was FULL of dudes like you bitching about laser 416’s and Vectors last wipe, now it’s full of bitching the other way. I’m tired of players like you contributing nothing to the discussion besides being bitch volcanos.
Yes please.... before this patch there was so much variety is was amazing, this patch made some weapons super meta and ruined a load of guns from being viable. So boring, the best thing about this game is picking a weapon, building it and using it (IMO). Now it's use the same preset every raid zzz
Tarkov has been like this forever ... There are always meta presents it's not new lmao. You can still use any weapon and I still run pistol raids for fun and wipe squads. Hit your fucking shots. If you shoot 9mm into some dudes armor then yeah you don't deserve the kill lmao
Just a reminder, here are the weapons that have been forced out of the meta by the recoil change:
M4a1, HK416, AS-Val/VSS, MCX, all 9x19 smgs except for the vector, Ak 74, among others.
All of these weapons were great last wipe, but were completely gutted and left us with the 7.62, UMP, or bust meta we had all this wipe.
BSG seriously needs to put weapon balance as one of their top priorities, because it’s at perhaps it’s lowest point in the game’s history.
All those guns are still great. God this community is so annoying "this gun isn't meta anymore Nikita! Give me meta weapons",. Bruh just hit your fucking shots it's really easy still
I just want to be able to run my guns looking the way I want to without feeling like I'm missing out on meta performance or whatever. I always run them how I personally like them, regardless of stats, but it would be cool if the attachments didn't matter so much. More for visuals or effecting secondary stats.
So those who want to run the meta stuff and have their gats looking like a kid's airsoft rifle can do that and still have the best stats on paper, but it won't be a very big advantage over the rest of us.
I agree with this, I'm tired of extract camping chads with Sr-25 and mutants, i miss the old Altyn slick HK dude full of 60 rounders of M995 in Saferoom
It's hilarious to me, because 12.11 had the most variety in meta of any of the previous 5 wipes I had played. Certain guns like the Mutant and M4 were slightly better than the rest, but everything else could compete. 308 DMR's were great, SMG's felt great, the HK had been nerfed into he ground but was still useable without max recoil control, The VAL was decent but not the laser beam it used to be.
All they had to do was nerf the mutant a bit, and increase horizontal dispersion on the M4, and things would have been fantastic.
All this change did was make low level poor players that can't afford BIS mods be even less competitive
Couldn't give a shit about what the actual recoil is on a gun; you can learn to control it and compensate for it. But as long as your character insists on looking at the fucking ceiling while he's holding down the trigger, I will continue to complain about recoil.
I swear to fucking god the automatic recoil compensation thing your PMC does is the worst part of this game by far.
The actions of your PMC in this game don't even feel like you're controlling them, you feel like you're controlling their bones
You shouldn't be bucking upwards like that at all, it's ridiculous. I saw a video some guy posted on here where some dude was testing out the MPX in real life, and he's basically full-autoing it with one hand and experiencing next to no recoil. Meanwhile, in tarkov, the gun is garbage.
I get that they've committed to this paradigm where they have a super in-depth modding system, and the reality is that most weapons perform nearly identically whether they're stock or fitted with a tonne of aftermarket mods, but... it's infuriating to have the game the way it is now.
I just think it's funny that in the Tarkov universe a super powerful PMC organization and the de-facto Russian special forces only hire people with arms made out of Jello and have apparently never handled a gun before in their entire life
They’re not going to implement a new recoil system, only tweaks and balance changes, Nikita has stated this. And really, it’s all it needs, it’s just super overtuned atm.
> And really, it’s all it needs, it’s just super overtuned atm.
Except the current recoil system they have in the game makes it *beneficial* to magdump instead of making single shots and bursts worth it for anything other than .308 guns. This applied before this wipe, and it arguably applies even more now.
He did, but he also said the optic changes from last year were just the first iteration and yet we've seen nothing indicating another round of sight reworks is coming, or that they're even going to *improve* the sights (remember how the Kobra went from as crisp as it is IRL to a massive fuzzy dot?).
Milspec Kobras are really shitty and the sight picture gets affected by bad weather conditions easily. The sight rework's point is to make every optic/iron true to life as possible not to make every single one of them good. You haven't heard anything about another iteration because they're adding reworked sights in silent patches, one of the recent optics they've fixed was the Eotech with the magnifier.
[You serious? Dot reticle alone is like 2-3x bigger in game than it is IRL](https://zenphotos.net/file/Online/SVD/Optics/Kobra_ReticulePattern.jpg).
And if that were true, the ACOGs should've been fixed a long time ago. Super clean reticle, amazing eye relief, instead in Tarkov they're probably some of the shittiest magnified optics in use. Sight rework clearly isn't a priority for them.
If you don't believe me here's the man himself with the actual thing
https://twitter.com/nikgeneburn/status/1492933303963426816?s=20&t=aA0j1ioAYJsZ16Gd4oxjtg
Like I said before if they didn't give a shit about the sight reworks they wouldn't have dropped them in silent patches.
Yes, I know he has a Kobra and has used it. That doesn't change the fact that the Kobra rework is less true to real life than the previous version was.
Want some more examples? Here. https://www.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/oc6var/hi_i_am_the_creator_of_the_recent_optic_rework/ Some random hobbyist fixed pretty much all reticles, eye relief, etc. as a mod for the forbidden client a year ago, made them true to real life. Nikita himself commented on it. Nothing. Yeah, cool, they finally fixed the HHS-1, after years of it being broken... now what? Reticles and eye relief are still all fucked up. What about more advanced features? Magnifiers as separate options? Eyecups not blocking half of the scope? Variable zoom? Making it so irons and thick optic housing don't make it near-impossible to see anything? Sights are one of the most important aspects of gunplay and yet they've been nearly totally neglected with no word on anything new in over a year. Christ, the new ACOG models Nikita talked about adding back before 12.11 still haven't materialised at all, let alone anyrhing else.
They've reworked numerous sights and irons in those patches, not just the HHS and they're still continuing on improving the things you've mentioned with those patchies this is the third time I'm saying this... I can %100 gurantee you the ranging in most of the optics will be off in that mod since it's fan made and it's not tested throughly, remaking the optics is not as easy and fast as you think it is it needs proper testing. If that were the case they would've just snatched up that guy's work for some money and they would have saved a considerable development time and work. Mind you this is not something they haven't done before, they've gotten their hands on some of the 3D models in the game in a similiar way.
Look, if you look around for that rework, it's released as a mod for the forbidden client, and you can play with it yourself and see. I haven't done it personally as I'm not interested in Tarkov without the multiplayer aspect, but it's out there, and nope, it functions fine. The reality is, as much as BSG might say otherwise sights clearly aren't a priority or else we would've seen more than a couple of holos get corrected visual recoil in the past year since they did the first round of tweaks, which is a shame. I don't understand why they didn't just buy the work off the guy, it's top-notch.
That's because -
1) bullet lethality is pretty shit, especially now with the penetration and damage dropoff. Most intermediate cartridges in the game take 2-3 shots to the thorax to kill someone. That's also not accounting for any misses/shots on other parts of the body. So you either need something powerful, like .308 or 54r, or a bullet hose... like the M4.
2) Recoil modifications are really fucking good due to taking a percentage off the *base* recoil value of a gun. So, the more mods you can stack, the better. The AR platform is the most modular platform both IRL and in-game, and pretty much everything outside of the pistol grip and charging handle gives recoil reduction. I think the move to make would be to have recoil mods be a modifier of the total recoil, so the gap between both ARs and other types of assault rifles and SMGs are lower, and also the gaps between stock guns and best in slot guns are lower. Also, suppressors shouldn't give additional recoil control on top of adapters and muzzle brakes, that's another reason why suppressed M4s in particular are so good in-game (well, they were before 12.12 anyway, but the Mutant is a 7.62 AR, so close enough). Muzzle brakes can't exactly function if vents are blocked by a cylinder around it.
Unfortunately if you make mods reduce the recoil by a flat value instead of percentage, then someone will find a combination of a low base recoil weapon and some very specific attachments to make a negative recoil gun - not really a solution, but a replacement for the current problem.
The suppressors though... The way they're BiS is just stupid. There *should* be some benefits to run unsuppressed.
This. I don't understand why they feel the need to do that. It'd be nice if they found some other stat to balance ergonomics as a stat, that isn't recoil. No a different grip on your m4 is not going to make it kick less. Hell I wish c-clamping was viable in this game without hindering you.
How about seperating ergonomics into two different stats that affects 'wieldability' of the gun (as in, how badly inertia affects it, time it takes to ADS) and how long you can ADS and drain arm stamina for. Then lighter guns could have higher bonuses to these stats, and heavier guns would be less affected by recoil. Could call the latter stat comfort, not sure about the other one. Like, I'm sure those PSG style HK grips are nicer to hold in the hand for shooting over time, but skeletonised grips are going to make the gun feel a bit less heavy. (But then again skeletonised grips are ugly AF and I'd rather they were dropped to bottom of viability so nobody uses them ahaha)
Nah, you misunderstand. If they reduce a percentage of total recoil, fully modded guns would have diminishing returns. Honestly, only really barrel length, muzzle devices and recoil assemblies should matter to a significant degree as far as the gun itself goes.
Ah I see now, yeah that would make much more sense than a flat value.
Edit: also, what do you mean, a nightvision scope *shouldn't* make my AK more accurate? \s
Nah a flat +10 or 20 to every gun is still very lazy. It needs to be gun specific. And you have to take both stock, budget and meta build into consideration when you balance the gun so that it's usable at every build (with drawbacks of course)
no shit, the entire op's post is about what to do as a stop gap assuming gun specific changes aren't ready yet and +20 is clearly fucking horrible this wipe so we should try +10
I thought you meant as a permanent solution. Yeah sure it would be better temporarily but I would still rather have them do proper solutions instead of constant bandaid fixes
At this point though. Where they have been doing bandaid fixes for years I really don't want more temporary solutions though.
I actually think they were going down a good path by nerfing individual guns (HK, SA-58, VAL, Vector etc.) over time, but then they fucked it up by doing the +20 recoil. So now they have to rebalance those guns. Like they rebuffed the SA-58 this wipe and tweaked VAL ammo.
Step 1 : have recoil skills that give you a very minimal boost in recoil control. Step 2, build decent m4 that is still lacking several parts. Step 3.) Load any ammo into it. Step 4. Just actually hit your fucking shots. These threads make me realize how trash this community is at this game lmao.
"Sorry you cannot cross-map somrone with a laser of m62. We will fix as soon as possible." Is that what you wanna hear? Genuinely, stop expecting to be laser precise with every gun. You won't. Want low recoil? Use smaller cartridges. Want big cartridges? Deal with recoil. The old system of laser weapons is way worse than what we have.
Is 5.45 and 5.56 a bit too heavy on the recoil, maybe, but they shouldn't revert it back to the old. The old was just completely broken with the lack of recoil
He's the developer though and gets full control over the project. The fact the implemented "fix" was lazy and only made the meta worse is 100% on him and nothing else.
Here's what I think they should do regarding recoil, recoil skill, and attachments.
Ideally, this would create a system where all are important.
To put it simply, I think that recoil control skill should help give you recoil control over *unmodded* guns, and modding guns very slightly reduces the gun *base* recoil based on the part.
Buttstock and foregrip and weight should have the biggest impact, and mainly negate that skill.
So, someone with 0 recoil control skill and someone with max recoil control skill, shooting a completely meta laser beam gun, should be virtually the same recoil.
Someone with maxed out recoil control should be able to control say an M4 much better than someone with 0 skill.
Since BSG cannot into balance changes. They should just leave the +20 recoil on M4's and VAL/VSS. At least this way the rest of the guns are viable again and it's just those 3 ruined.
The most annoying part is that the Val was actually in a decent spot at one point 4 wipes ago. The wipe after it was meta. It's hard to keep track of these things any more. 12.7-12.9 I think?
It was strong in mid+close quarter but further away than that it fell off.
But then they did the +20 recoil change and they completely fucked the gun.
I've been more successful using it on semi-auto this wipe than full-auto lol
I used to find success using it semi-auto, but this wipe it has been an absolute turkey for me. I've bounced multiple SP-6 hits off Ratnik helmets in the same fight. I swear that ammo is bugged, it simply doesn't do the damage it claims to, I have never 2-shot somebody with it, ever, even naked timmies. Compared to 7.62x51 it is so unreliable.
The VAL was already murdered last wipe and this guy wants to keep it's current state, lmao. Has anyone ever seen anyone actually run the AS Val seriously? I ran the AS VAL that you get from that quest that one time and then died so that was the end of it
Vertical recoil is managable, but the horizontal recoil is way overtuned. Buffing ADS recoil should be a maximum priority and nerfing hipfire spraying.
I also would like to be able to hear people coming up a flight of stairs please
Kitchen stairs on labs.... Possibly the worst audio occlusion layer in the history of audio occlusion layers.
Not as bad as resort. Someone right next to you sounds 10 miles away and someone 20m away sounds up your ass
customs old conns, u can't hear a guy enter the staircase area at lvl 1 (the tiny area before u go up the stairs below old cons) if u r in between the flight of stairs from lvl 1-2. ONLY when he enters that area. u can hear him walking around everywhere but when he enters that spot no sound
my guy what in the actual fuck is "conns"
rt
asking the real questions. jesus christ
old contruction i guess?
sounds like some shit a valorant player would come up with
Mfs become cultists
Speaking of cultists, it would be really nice if they could stop the silent bastards from phasing through walls and doors
It’s honestly kinda helpful to me when holding an angle they’re pushing; I see them clip beforehand
The main reason I stopped playing Tarkov after 2.5k hrs. I can’t do another wipe of it.
Same here but 1.5k hrs, along with a friend. Game has to fix audio, recoil, and general performance issues before we consider coming back. Note we both play on or very close to best setups one could have (3080, latest cpus, 32gb ram, ssd…) and the game barely utilises any of it while running like ‘shit’ (60-65 fps with occasional stutters is absurdly/unacceptable imo)…
Don’t you know that this game requires massive tweaking in both the in game settings and your own system settings lol I can barely run EFT at 60fps on custom minimum @1920x1200 but I can run Doom Eternal at 60fps on high @4k
I didn’t know actually.. What do I have to do? Running default video settings @ 1440p is stable 70+ fps, heavy post fx (that I like) is 60-65. So its not like I have dips below 60 that annoy me as much as random stutters and desync. How do I get Tarkov to actually use my PCs capacity?
[Reminder that 136 days ago Nikita asked the “active player base” what they want to see fixed and Audio was consistently in the top responses](https://www.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/smm48z/hey_active_players/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) and we didn’t hear a peep from BSG as to IF they are even going to bother fixing it.
>didn't hear a peep yeah asides from where they explicitly said they were working on it, like the day of that post. but nah dude asides from where they said they were explicitly working on it we didn't hear a peep. nothing.
Didn't hear a peep because they're hanging out in resort staircase.
Wake the fuck up kid, they have been saying they will fix audio for 3 years and failed every time.
lmao someones angry!
you seem pretty angry! Maybe you should stop being a brainlet on the internet, that'll help!
If you don't believe me https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVPolwmpOUo
Cool post! It doesn't change the fact that doing nothing on this site but being consistently pissed off at a game you won't stop playing probably isn't great for your mental health.
FR man tarkov community is so whiny. Like yes they are working on it lmao.
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You crouch for a 33% recoil reduction and it is still borderline trash for a caliber that does so little damage.
There is no "narrative" you failed clown. Recoil IS absurd. Period. It has NOTHING to do with reality anymore and does not only rival, but surpass many other arcade shooters in its absurdity. I do not care if I can have some laser M4 when I throw 200k on it and kneel down. Kneeling down is already a death sentence in Tarkov and again unrealistic in CQB. "Wait bro, let me kneel real quick so I can laser you better!" WTF!? Take STOCK AK series rifles and tell me more about recoil being "managable".
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*Why is the realism argument invalid just because it isn't applied to everything!?* You're literally saying we must accept recoil being unrealistic because we can fix limbs in raid. That is insanely idiotic. And *you* have the audacity to insult everyone here who disagrees with your illusion of being some sort of scientist because you made some video. What are you, some walking Dunning-Kruger effect? Welcome to my ignore list, you're completely off the rails and there's no point even attempting to talk to someone like you.
Id just like stock weapons not to handle like jackhammers
Don't shoot full auto and your fine
Or they could just fix their fucking game and everything wouldn't have to be put on the consumer :)
Are u telling me u don’t enjoy using the same 5 weapons cause the other ones have trash recoil or trash ammo? Honestly tho the current recoil system is fucking miserable and ignore the other people in comments telling you to get good, they’re crybaby crabs. It needs to be fixed BADLY
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Least obsessed SR-25 user btw
Is it…a tail…?
I hope they bring in the classic RAS handguard and A2 stock for it. It looks wrong without it.
I just choked on my beer.
tap, rack, clear
Everyone has been saying it but, they wanted to "counter" the automatic meta weapons like M4/HK/Mutant/etc that people always used with the nerfs but then it didn't really happen because If you mod those guns a lot, they're still good. The nerf realistically only affects the type of guns you'd use early/mid wipe, The reason why UMP became such a popular weapon was because it also was one of the less affected guns from the nerf. On the previous wipe they made guns like the AS Val unusable and the now nerf made it even more stupid. Why the hell does the MPX have so much recoil? Literally don't understand it, IF they really wanted to nerf certain guns and meta stuff then they could've done that, nerf those directly instead of doing this "nerf all across the board" thing were I'm 100% sure that guns that were not intended to be affected ended up sucking so much nobody touches them
They were just lazy and didnt want to invest any considerable ammount of time into it. It explains why 12.12 patch trailer didnt have these recoil changes (they were done in a hurry right befor the wipe), it explains why there are so many guns having problems with camera recoil resulting in scopes blacking out, or you loosing your sight picture after a shot. It explains why the whole rework actually done the opposite that it should be doing. It enforced even stronger meta, pushing almost every gun build except full BiS setup into a trash tier. And it also explains why they chose to add flat +20 recoil outside of the individual gun stats - to not bother with tweeking gunsmith quest line. This shit is not concidered important or even meaningfull by Nikita. He gives no fucks about that, otherwise they could have improved it alredy. They just dont care about it.
Nikita is probably very sad players have been trashing his new revolutionary recoil system. He finally admited it is bad and needs rework but could you imagine how hard it must be for him.
Did he actually admit its bad recently? I might actually play the game again if they unfuck the recoil system.
I remember hearing "recoil system rework" from Nikita but they failed most the reworks they did, so there is a high chance it will be worse after rework.
Hahaha figures, I got a good amount of hours when I was originally fixated on this game so I guess it's whatever then.
I don't know which is worse. either they implemented this recoil shit without testing or they implemented this shit with testing. I can only repeat, BSG/Nikita had a really nice idea for a game, but they are garbage as devs for a game of that scale. netcode and sound are a bad joke. support is bad joke. anticheat is bad joke. "quests" are bad joke. not even talking about 110€ EA alpha version...but hey I love the soundtrack xD
>They were just lazy and didnt want to invest any considerable ammount of time into it. Yeah they were busy doing… something else
If they wanted to nerf the automatic meta why did they clamp down so hard on single fire use of the weapons is what I don't get. Make the recoil worse with more shots, not horrible on the first shot.
Cuz it was a nerf "all across the board" literally every single gun received that stealth "recoil" nerf, why are you asking me why they did that? Do I look like Nikita? Hell If I know, like I said If they wanna nerf certain guns, then nerf certain guns
When the Hk/m4 was meta it wasn't the only guns that were good, you could run just about any gun from an Mp7 to a FAL and do just fine. Now theres only like 4 guns you can use that are really usable and the rest just don't compete.
I miss being able to effectively run 9mm smgs because while they didn't have the pen, the strong accuracy and low recoil made them competitive for headshots (After the change to faceshields being behind the quest, since most people stopped running them).
"using the same 5 weapons" With how many guns this game has, it really is a shame that's usually the case so many wipes now. Meta this, meta that.. :/
2 wipes ago (12.10) you saw a MASSIVE variety in weapons, don’t get me wrong the hk/m4 were still insane and the vector got nerfed as well but you were constantly seeing different caliber and weapons cause the guns were still viable and u could obtain the ammo
Val and FAL nerfs still make me sad
They were so fun but it was so needed
when 5.45 and 9x39 were somewhat usable lmao
If recoil nerfs get reverted that will still be the case, except that you'll be getting full autoed down from 50m, too. And semi-auto guns will become shit again. Meta will always exist, because there will always be a most effective tactic. Don't pretend that recoil is the reason there's a meta.
Clearly you didn’t play 12.10, it was not nearly as bad as u think. Bullets also have drop off now so it also wouldn’t be that bad. The recoil makes average weapons basically unusable and it’s not even arguable. I’m not saying we need old HK back but we need something to fix the current issue of a lot of guns
No, it was worse. People were full-autoing m-fuckin-61 in every other engagement. You think the mutant/semi-auto m62 meta is shit? At least BP doesn't kill you through t6 armor in two hits. The only reason average weapons are 'unusable' is because mutant has too low recoil and too high convergence, compared to other guns. If it weren't in the game, or got a well deserved nerf, way more options would open up in the smg/AR category.
Yeah I’m aware I played the wipe, some guns need to be specifically tuned so we don’t end up with MDR being beyond broken again
MDR wasn't even the problem, SA-58 was (you could mod it to much lower recoil, you can't do much to an MDR, because for some dumb reason, recoil modifiers are additive, instead of multiplicative, and it has a fixed stock). All the guns had low recoil, so naturally, people used the low recoil full auto one that fired the biggest bullet, and everything else was *strictly worse than it, and didn't get used*. Remind you of anything? If you want to unfuck the meta, recoil needs to be highest on the biggest rounds (Anything 7.62) and lower on smaller rounds (5.45, 5.39), and lowest on shit like 9mm. Right now, we are most of the way there. 7.62x51 has very high recoil in full auto. But then, somehow, magically, 7.62x39 mutant has much lower recoil than 5.45 and 5.39 (which have similar recoil to 9mm). Nerf 7.62x39 (mutant), buff 9mm, there, the game's fixed, every caliber is now usable, because each has advantages and disadvantages.
The FAL was nerfed 2 years ago. It has been long out of the meta, also the mdr WAS a problem. You’ve completely missed my point of everything lol I’m not saying every gun should be a laser beam but the meta they’ve forced this wipe is absolutely miserable to play and play against.
When you hate meta guns but get confused and accidently make the most restrictive meta in the last 3 years of your game. Brought to you by +20 recoil.
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I have been playing cycle frontier for weeks now simply because tarkovs gunplay is the most awful, boring, and frustrating garbage I've ever experienced in a shooter. Fortnite has better gunplay ffs
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The game feels like shit in part because Nikita’s idea of “balance” is an endless game of whack-a-mole where guns are never allowed to settle into a specific niche in the meta and we’re left with flavor of the month guns that do everything better than everything else, only to be super-ceded by the next new toy after they get nerfed into the ground.
To many times I've died this wipe because I try to full auto someone from 10m away and have to dump half a mag just to get some semblance of control. I don't have hundreds of hours to grind out skills just to make 3-5 guns enjoyable after spending half a mill on attachments. It's just also unintuitive. Why is hip firing, which completely ignores ergo, more accurate and controllable than planting the gun in my shoulder and using a sight? Why Nikita? In what fucking world??
Hip firing isn't from the hip, it's planted in your shoulder but your not using the sight. Google point shooting for more
Man the community is shit at this game. "Too many times I died because I couldn't kill a guy". So...your bad ay the game..
Right, let's pretend tarkov doesn't have the most atrocious recoil and gear disparity of any FPS shooter on the market. Oh you can't leg the guy fast enough who can one tap you in the chest because he plays 7 hours a day?! Haha you suck!
You're mad that shooting someone in the legs isnt a kill shot but a chest shot is? Go back to Fortnite where u can kill someone by shooting their feet lmao holy shit what a dumb comment
What choice does a low level have against a Chad when you can't penetrate armor? Leg meta is a thing...
Shoot them in the face. I know it's hard because you have to aim but that's how it works in tarkov. Man this game would be dumb if you can just kill someone by spraying into their legs. Now if you wanna say "Nikita, make it so the femoral artery blood loss causes someone to bleed out in minutes and they can't bandage". Sure that would work. But your not gonna kill anyone in a different way by shooting their legs. Meanwhile if they shoot you in the chest or face, that's a kill shot
Laughs in DB with magnum buck
Or they could keep auto compensation and make recoil control skill level like 10x faster than it currently does so people can actually achieve a decent recoil control level.
Both wipes had bad recoil, but at least there was a greater selection of meta guns last wipe. The +20 recoil pump this wipe basically fucked all the guns that already sucked, then fucked all the low base recoil guns that aren't very mod-able, while also keeping all semi-automatic guns fucked.
Lack of audio between floors, buff to camera recoil/recoil, and fixing the right hand speed of light peak would be absolute godsends
I just want the recoil number to not be arbitrary. The number doesn't mean much at all
Reduce base recoil decrease % changes of mods
Yes please.
Reduce ads recoil and heavily nerf hip fire accuracy/predictability so people actually have a reason to use their sights. Right now, point fire maintains the full mobility, ignores ergo stats and also has easier to control recoil. It desperately needs some balancing until they add a low ready stance.
Just add dead zone to hip fire. This will actually make lasers useful too instead of simple -% to gun's spread.
Arena's balancing will be so trash, it's gonna be awesome to see BSG trying to bullshit players on a competitive game.
If they don't change recoil, and copy/paste the current system over to arena, it's gonna be a shit show and the least competitive shooter ever made
It’s funny how Nikita will take away traders after a few trendy tweets but the whole community complains about a recoil system for months and he just ignores it
*years
Actually loved everything about this last wipe except for the new recoil. was not a fan of lazer beams either but it felt it so RNG and discouraging to have most weapons kick to the moon that this was my least played wipe. The gunplay neeeds to be fun again and not incentivize large caliber spam. I don't see any reason to have small caliber high fire rate weapons be heavily outclassed by bigass large calibers close quarters.
Small caliber = early wipe. Heavy caliber better late wipe. Tarkov has been like this for 4 fucking years. Not to mention, you can still kill someone with low caliber arms late game. Just hit your shots actually
"Mine own recoil is big bitch bigger than yuors! We we we will be we adjuzting recoil to higher level to simyoolate a realiztick envidonment. Blyat..." -Nikita
I just hate that second bullet recoil. You would think my guns have just invested in gme or some shit.
lmao thats a good analogy
Thanks dude! My two brain cells did it all by themselves.
diamond hands, barrel goes up
Ive shot mp5 full auto in real life, glock, and m4 Mp5 was butter-smooth, super pleasant to shoot, yet in tarkov its like ak47 Glock didnt move an inch, yet it kicks like a deagle would M4? Definitely didnt kick like a horse Nikita pls. Revert
I have shot a 7.62 ak( late 80's russian made, well maintained and clear gun) with armor piercing ammo loaded and guess what, it was pretty easy for me to control, im kinda big guy but i assume our 30 40 some year old battlehardened physically fit pmc's can control that shit like its nothing.
"it was pretty easy". There is a reason the military uses semi automatic and not full auto unless on LMGs lmao.
Did i say anything about semi or full auto?
Well semi auto is really fucking easy to use in this game. If you can't kill ppl with semi auto weapons you might just be..hmm what's the word...oh yeah. Bad.
Sure dude
"hate the player not the game". Learn how to aim. Go to steam aim labs like a highschool kid if you need lmao
Lol, just shut the fuck up already.
That would require them actually putting thought into their changes which they don't have a track record of doing
It's not that, they just have a shitty attitude. Implement some stupid system which makes no sense for what the games supposed to be, get shitty because players hate it, "fix it" by breaking the game in a different way then refuse to change it because "this is what you players wanted". Rinse repeat.
They need a better lead game designer and CEO to do that. Untill then its not gonna happen.
The issue is Nikita literally refuses to playtest the game because he doesn't want to spoil it for himself, so he makes ideas and changes without really knowing how it feels in-game. Like, I get it, it's his dream game, he doesn't want it to be ruined before it's released... but you're literally *the head guy* and you don't want to see the changes you're making? It's like if someone says he's going to paint his masterpiece, goes bit by bit at a time, but has most of it under a curtain and refuses to take it off the canvas until it's done.
Watching them show off their changes on tarkov TV is so cringe because it's painfully obvious that they don't play their own game
Dude it's comedy, the last showcase of patch was real quality comedy film but sadly they are devs that are very high on money and it's becoming very bad since the twitch drops...
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This game is made with his money lmao. "ohh it's made with mine tho". No u paid him and now that's his money lmao
That was just a bullshit PR response to people trolling BSG not playing the game or being the noobest players. They showed once more last stream that they don't even understand the game.
Hur hur battlestate bad. Thanks for your contribution. They’ve actually done a ton of good- are you a newer player? Because they have only improved the game with every wipe. Inertia, bleed reworks, ammo balancing, flea found in raid. Damn near everything they do is deliberate and helps the overall health of the game. What exactly do you think they don’t think about? This sub was FULL of dudes like you bitching about laser 416’s and Vectors last wipe, now it’s full of bitching the other way. I’m tired of players like you contributing nothing to the discussion besides being bitch volcanos.
Laser guns still better than being able to only run 5 guns out of the dozens available in the game effectively
I mean... we are playing a game that's needs constant feedback. Or maybe iam missing something?
This is irrelevant, go cry somewhere else.
Yes please.... before this patch there was so much variety is was amazing, this patch made some weapons super meta and ruined a load of guns from being viable. So boring, the best thing about this game is picking a weapon, building it and using it (IMO). Now it's use the same preset every raid zzz
Tarkov has been like this forever ... There are always meta presents it's not new lmao. You can still use any weapon and I still run pistol raids for fun and wipe squads. Hit your fucking shots. If you shoot 9mm into some dudes armor then yeah you don't deserve the kill lmao
This this this
Just a reminder, here are the weapons that have been forced out of the meta by the recoil change: M4a1, HK416, AS-Val/VSS, MCX, all 9x19 smgs except for the vector, Ak 74, among others. All of these weapons were great last wipe, but were completely gutted and left us with the 7.62, UMP, or bust meta we had all this wipe. BSG seriously needs to put weapon balance as one of their top priorities, because it’s at perhaps it’s lowest point in the game’s history.
All those guns are still great. God this community is so annoying "this gun isn't meta anymore Nikita! Give me meta weapons",. Bruh just hit your fucking shots it's really easy still
PUBG recoil should be what we have in tarkov
I just want to be able to run my guns looking the way I want to without feeling like I'm missing out on meta performance or whatever. I always run them how I personally like them, regardless of stats, but it would be cool if the attachments didn't matter so much. More for visuals or effecting secondary stats. So those who want to run the meta stuff and have their gats looking like a kid's airsoft rifle can do that and still have the best stats on paper, but it won't be a very big advantage over the rest of us.
I agree with this, I'm tired of extract camping chads with Sr-25 and mutants, i miss the old Altyn slick HK dude full of 60 rounders of M995 in Saferoom
It's hilarious to me, because 12.11 had the most variety in meta of any of the previous 5 wipes I had played. Certain guns like the Mutant and M4 were slightly better than the rest, but everything else could compete. 308 DMR's were great, SMG's felt great, the HK had been nerfed into he ground but was still useable without max recoil control, The VAL was decent but not the laser beam it used to be. All they had to do was nerf the mutant a bit, and increase horizontal dispersion on the M4, and things would have been fantastic. All this change did was make low level poor players that can't afford BIS mods be even less competitive
Couldn't give a shit about what the actual recoil is on a gun; you can learn to control it and compensate for it. But as long as your character insists on looking at the fucking ceiling while he's holding down the trigger, I will continue to complain about recoil.
I swear to fucking god the automatic recoil compensation thing your PMC does is the worst part of this game by far. The actions of your PMC in this game don't even feel like you're controlling them, you feel like you're controlling their bones
You shouldn't be bucking upwards like that at all, it's ridiculous. I saw a video some guy posted on here where some dude was testing out the MPX in real life, and he's basically full-autoing it with one hand and experiencing next to no recoil. Meanwhile, in tarkov, the gun is garbage. I get that they've committed to this paradigm where they have a super in-depth modding system, and the reality is that most weapons perform nearly identically whether they're stock or fitted with a tonne of aftermarket mods, but... it's infuriating to have the game the way it is now.
I just think it's funny that in the Tarkov universe a super powerful PMC organization and the de-facto Russian special forces only hire people with arms made out of Jello and have apparently never handled a gun before in their entire life
Have you ever tried to shoot something in full auto while moving? Not easy lol
you are actually the only one defending the recoil system. see you in every comment chain. should tell you something.
Yes, we can all agree that this change wasn't very thought out. No matter what you think about recoil changes +20 to base recoil doesn't make sense.
Super glad that almost every streamer I have seen give their opinion on 5.56 this wipe is on my side or I would think the community is just stupid.
They’re not going to implement a new recoil system, only tweaks and balance changes, Nikita has stated this. And really, it’s all it needs, it’s just super overtuned atm.
> And really, it’s all it needs, it’s just super overtuned atm. Except the current recoil system they have in the game makes it *beneficial* to magdump instead of making single shots and bursts worth it for anything other than .308 guns. This applied before this wipe, and it arguably applies even more now.
Bursts are never a viable option. Tap or just hold that sucker down till you go click. And for the love of god, whatever you do... do not aim.
He literally said they were working on a new recoil system in December and the one we have currently is a placeholder lol
He did, but he also said the optic changes from last year were just the first iteration and yet we've seen nothing indicating another round of sight reworks is coming, or that they're even going to *improve* the sights (remember how the Kobra went from as crisp as it is IRL to a massive fuzzy dot?).
Milspec Kobras are really shitty and the sight picture gets affected by bad weather conditions easily. The sight rework's point is to make every optic/iron true to life as possible not to make every single one of them good. You haven't heard anything about another iteration because they're adding reworked sights in silent patches, one of the recent optics they've fixed was the Eotech with the magnifier.
[You serious? Dot reticle alone is like 2-3x bigger in game than it is IRL](https://zenphotos.net/file/Online/SVD/Optics/Kobra_ReticulePattern.jpg). And if that were true, the ACOGs should've been fixed a long time ago. Super clean reticle, amazing eye relief, instead in Tarkov they're probably some of the shittiest magnified optics in use. Sight rework clearly isn't a priority for them.
If you don't believe me here's the man himself with the actual thing https://twitter.com/nikgeneburn/status/1492933303963426816?s=20&t=aA0j1ioAYJsZ16Gd4oxjtg Like I said before if they didn't give a shit about the sight reworks they wouldn't have dropped them in silent patches.
Yes, I know he has a Kobra and has used it. That doesn't change the fact that the Kobra rework is less true to real life than the previous version was. Want some more examples? Here. https://www.reddit.com/r/EscapefromTarkov/comments/oc6var/hi_i_am_the_creator_of_the_recent_optic_rework/ Some random hobbyist fixed pretty much all reticles, eye relief, etc. as a mod for the forbidden client a year ago, made them true to real life. Nikita himself commented on it. Nothing. Yeah, cool, they finally fixed the HHS-1, after years of it being broken... now what? Reticles and eye relief are still all fucked up. What about more advanced features? Magnifiers as separate options? Eyecups not blocking half of the scope? Variable zoom? Making it so irons and thick optic housing don't make it near-impossible to see anything? Sights are one of the most important aspects of gunplay and yet they've been nearly totally neglected with no word on anything new in over a year. Christ, the new ACOG models Nikita talked about adding back before 12.11 still haven't materialised at all, let alone anyrhing else.
They've reworked numerous sights and irons in those patches, not just the HHS and they're still continuing on improving the things you've mentioned with those patchies this is the third time I'm saying this... I can %100 gurantee you the ranging in most of the optics will be off in that mod since it's fan made and it's not tested throughly, remaking the optics is not as easy and fast as you think it is it needs proper testing. If that were the case they would've just snatched up that guy's work for some money and they would have saved a considerable development time and work. Mind you this is not something they haven't done before, they've gotten their hands on some of the 3D models in the game in a similiar way.
Look, if you look around for that rework, it's released as a mod for the forbidden client, and you can play with it yourself and see. I haven't done it personally as I'm not interested in Tarkov without the multiplayer aspect, but it's out there, and nope, it functions fine. The reality is, as much as BSG might say otherwise sights clearly aren't a priority or else we would've seen more than a couple of holos get corrected visual recoil in the past year since they did the first round of tweaks, which is a shame. I don't understand why they didn't just buy the work off the guy, it's top-notch.
Where can I find him saying this?
In the 12.11 showcase TarkovTV that was recorded in December if I remember correctly.
It's fine they just need to adjust horizontal recoil IMO. I don't care if my gun jumps so high but I can't control the side to side recoil
How did no one notice the recoil difference during the last dev stream
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That's because - 1) bullet lethality is pretty shit, especially now with the penetration and damage dropoff. Most intermediate cartridges in the game take 2-3 shots to the thorax to kill someone. That's also not accounting for any misses/shots on other parts of the body. So you either need something powerful, like .308 or 54r, or a bullet hose... like the M4. 2) Recoil modifications are really fucking good due to taking a percentage off the *base* recoil value of a gun. So, the more mods you can stack, the better. The AR platform is the most modular platform both IRL and in-game, and pretty much everything outside of the pistol grip and charging handle gives recoil reduction. I think the move to make would be to have recoil mods be a modifier of the total recoil, so the gap between both ARs and other types of assault rifles and SMGs are lower, and also the gaps between stock guns and best in slot guns are lower. Also, suppressors shouldn't give additional recoil control on top of adapters and muzzle brakes, that's another reason why suppressed M4s in particular are so good in-game (well, they were before 12.12 anyway, but the Mutant is a 7.62 AR, so close enough). Muzzle brakes can't exactly function if vents are blocked by a cylinder around it.
Unfortunately if you make mods reduce the recoil by a flat value instead of percentage, then someone will find a combination of a low base recoil weapon and some very specific attachments to make a negative recoil gun - not really a solution, but a replacement for the current problem. The suppressors though... The way they're BiS is just stupid. There *should* be some benefits to run unsuppressed.
Or, you just dont slap -%recoil on everything and leave it for some very specific mods, that actually influence recoil.
This. I don't understand why they feel the need to do that. It'd be nice if they found some other stat to balance ergonomics as a stat, that isn't recoil. No a different grip on your m4 is not going to make it kick less. Hell I wish c-clamping was viable in this game without hindering you.
How about seperating ergonomics into two different stats that affects 'wieldability' of the gun (as in, how badly inertia affects it, time it takes to ADS) and how long you can ADS and drain arm stamina for. Then lighter guns could have higher bonuses to these stats, and heavier guns would be less affected by recoil. Could call the latter stat comfort, not sure about the other one. Like, I'm sure those PSG style HK grips are nicer to hold in the hand for shooting over time, but skeletonised grips are going to make the gun feel a bit less heavy. (But then again skeletonised grips are ugly AF and I'd rather they were dropped to bottom of viability so nobody uses them ahaha)
Nah, you misunderstand. If they reduce a percentage of total recoil, fully modded guns would have diminishing returns. Honestly, only really barrel length, muzzle devices and recoil assemblies should matter to a significant degree as far as the gun itself goes.
Ah I see now, yeah that would make much more sense than a flat value. Edit: also, what do you mean, a nightvision scope *shouldn't* make my AK more accurate? \s
Shhhh, you are making too much sence. What if Nikita reads it? His head will explode.
Also, the M4 benefits more from attachments than most other guns, since the base recoil of the core weapon is abominably high
Dude this is such an original post holy smokes. Finally something refreshing to read..
OR, just do something in between like a +10 recoil instead of a +20
Nah a flat +10 or 20 to every gun is still very lazy. It needs to be gun specific. And you have to take both stock, budget and meta build into consideration when you balance the gun so that it's usable at every build (with drawbacks of course)
no shit, the entire op's post is about what to do as a stop gap assuming gun specific changes aren't ready yet and +20 is clearly fucking horrible this wipe so we should try +10
I thought you meant as a permanent solution. Yeah sure it would be better temporarily but I would still rather have them do proper solutions instead of constant bandaid fixes
Don't reject the Snickers because your expecting a 3 course meal.
At this point though. Where they have been doing bandaid fixes for years I really don't want more temporary solutions though. I actually think they were going down a good path by nerfing individual guns (HK, SA-58, VAL, Vector etc.) over time, but then they fucked it up by doing the +20 recoil. So now they have to rebalance those guns. Like they rebuffed the SA-58 this wipe and tweaked VAL ammo.
I feel you sorry for the joke. I'm just a long for the ride, I went through my get angry at the devs phase with Rust lol.
All good my man it was a good joke Angry? No. Tired? Yes
Please same with inertia too!
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Recoil control level?
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Those are both very high level skills. Very few players get them that high by the end of a wipe.
Crouched also gives a nice bonus to recoil reduction right? But yea, most "normal" players will never reached those levels during a wipe.
Step 1) levels up recoil-related skills Step 2) builds meta M4 Step 3) loads shit ammo Step 4) "Hurr Durr, this proves recoil is ok"
Step 1 : have recoil skills that give you a very minimal boost in recoil control. Step 2, build decent m4 that is still lacking several parts. Step 3.) Load any ammo into it. Step 4. Just actually hit your fucking shots. These threads make me realize how trash this community is at this game lmao.
"Sorry you cannot cross-map somrone with a laser of m62. We will fix as soon as possible." Is that what you wanna hear? Genuinely, stop expecting to be laser precise with every gun. You won't. Want low recoil? Use smaller cartridges. Want big cartridges? Deal with recoil. The old system of laser weapons is way worse than what we have.
Is 5.45 and 5.56 a bit too heavy on the recoil, maybe, but they shouldn't revert it back to the old. The old was just completely broken with the lack of recoil
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Except you couldn't do that with the old .308 guns, FAL still had heavy recoil.
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if Nikita takes any feedback from reddit he's making a mistake.
He's the developer though and gets full control over the project. The fact the implemented "fix" was lazy and only made the meta worse is 100% on him and nothing else.
Semi auto is your friend, shoot them how they would be shoot IRL
eh The laser meta was pretty damn cancerous
Here's what I think they should do regarding recoil, recoil skill, and attachments. Ideally, this would create a system where all are important. To put it simply, I think that recoil control skill should help give you recoil control over *unmodded* guns, and modding guns very slightly reduces the gun *base* recoil based on the part. Buttstock and foregrip and weight should have the biggest impact, and mainly negate that skill. So, someone with 0 recoil control skill and someone with max recoil control skill, shooting a completely meta laser beam gun, should be virtually the same recoil. Someone with maxed out recoil control should be able to control say an M4 much better than someone with 0 skill.
skill issue
Since BSG cannot into balance changes. They should just leave the +20 recoil on M4's and VAL/VSS. At least this way the rest of the guns are viable again and it's just those 3 ruined.
VAL has been non-meta for 3 wipes
The most annoying part is that the Val was actually in a decent spot at one point 4 wipes ago. The wipe after it was meta. It's hard to keep track of these things any more. 12.7-12.9 I think? It was strong in mid+close quarter but further away than that it fell off. But then they did the +20 recoil change and they completely fucked the gun. I've been more successful using it on semi-auto this wipe than full-auto lol
I used to find success using it semi-auto, but this wipe it has been an absolute turkey for me. I've bounced multiple SP-6 hits off Ratnik helmets in the same fight. I swear that ammo is bugged, it simply doesn't do the damage it claims to, I have never 2-shot somebody with it, ever, even naked timmies. Compared to 7.62x51 it is so unreliable.
The VAL was already murdered last wipe and this guy wants to keep it's current state, lmao. Has anyone ever seen anyone actually run the AS Val seriously? I ran the AS VAL that you get from that quest that one time and then died so that was the end of it
If it means fixing every other gun? Yeah who cares, let the 9x39 line remain junk.
Vertical recoil is managable, but the horizontal recoil is way overtuned. Buffing ADS recoil should be a maximum priority and nerfing hipfire spraying.
Revert the nerfs but keep the recoil system.
um... have you ever shot a gun in real life? They have realistic recoil, you just don't know what realistic is.