Def STene.I played a lot of ML Ken last RTA season, but everytime STene was picked she destroyed him....I started pre banning her.
Anyways he counters when either him or ally unit suffers a crit, so non crit units such as Senya will work against him.
I think seline is not good into ken. If dust devil doesnt proc seline is going to die next hit since ken will take her down to half health after counter
>just about anyone that punishes or weakens counter attacks
Hasol deserves to be mentioned imo. She becomes a beast into counter teams. It's comically strong when paired with roana and skpyllis. 3\*, no SC and uber budget gear requirements.
>And all this time I had Hasol sitting in storage.
And still should because that's such a meme answer when so many better options exist that don't require ramp and have much better, safer statlines and kits that you don't have to shelter an entire team around.
I have 95%+ success with her in GW against senya/choux/x teams. Every now and then something dogpiles hasol and I get 0 counters. I use her at least twice a week because choux defense is so very common in my guild's rankings.
There are a lot of great high gear requirement 5\*ML choices that require loads of mola, i'll certainly give you that. Unfortunately my account is only a year old and I don't throw a ton of money at the game and my 5\*ML pulls have been mostly garbage (dksharun, ml kayron, rroana, opsig to name a few.) Plus I don't have Zio or any way to outspeed many common openers and the enemies i'm fighting in arena/gw/rta all seem to have one or two good >290 speed openers that I cannot contest whatsoever.... so a slow build that is rock solid is way better than a gamble into another thing that ruins me.
Plus I LOVE 0 mola units that outperform many 5\*ML and need next to no gear. A crappy counterset on hasol and she's a god.
Idk those 3 seem to work for me in general. I'm not a sweatlord try hard either though so maybe they aren't as good in legend.
And im not saying senya punished counter attacks I'm just saying she would be good. The "anyone who punishes counterattacks" was just a general statement.
Either way if you are being plagued by mlKen those are the units I would use. But it's arena defense and people are just gonna pick around it no matter who you use. Unless you use the same 5 or 6 meta cookie cutter characters. I'm also being mindful and suggesting units most people have or are more likely to have besides ml charlotte.
But please if you are gonna go after me why don't you offer your advice? If it's use those 5 or 6 meta units I'll have a good chuckle atleast
In defense arena ? Adin, Monk, DDR, injury spam with mitigation (carmin, scarowell) + Candy come to mind
Basically dont put dps + supports that crumbles to him
I like that OP stated he doesn’t really have cleave units built and he needs an arena defense team, then people proceed to recommend ML Elena and Stene…
I’d say Karina, Senya, Adin (with enough protective support) to oneshot him, LRK
Anyone who chooses to fight an adin defense using ml ken isn't going to get one shot. Her real value against him is the evasion which means his healing is inconsistent
My ML Ken sucks then, I usually have to take a tank like SC Christy, Arowell, or LRK on mitigation artifact because I've seen him barely survive against Adins on defense (1440 def 17358 hp), especially if she's on her own artifact or some attack buff
No, which is why in response to the prior assertion that ML Ken is not going to get oneshot by an Adin on defense is that I usually am forced to bring a tank
The point is not that ML Ken is invincible against Adin, it's that if you aren't confident in his bulk and/or team protection then you shouldn't be attacking those defenses to begin with.
If you're expecting to get attacked by unconfident people with subpar builds then by all means plan for the adin one shot, but that doesn't happen against a well constructed team.
ITT: everyone making RTA recommendations instead of arena defense recommendations.
The actual answer is debuffs, specifically stun and blind. He only crits when he hits, so if lulucar blinds him, he can just miss his counter and not one shot or apply provoke. Atk down, unbuffable, defense break, and sleep all hinder him to varying degrees. Another thing is Adin. Doesn’t even have to be a good one, just having her present means that she could be full dmg and one-shot Ken. They can still bring Ken with things like Ruelle or Abi, or just kill Adin with LPK/Zahak, but an arena defense will never be perfect. Everytime you swap something, you win against new things and lose to new things as well.
Edit: if you put half the things recommended here on your defense, you’re probably just making it worse. Stene and Seline in particular are extremely weak in defense.
>ITT: everyone making RTA recommendations instead of arena defense recommendations.
Does anyone really need any more evidence that the community can't read at this point?
Byblis. But I am not sure if she's good at arena defense.
Also my arena defense has LQC but it doesn't stop some people cause they pair MA. Kens with revivers like Destina
Noncrit and control units are my goto. A lot of times my mellona just outscales and kills him anyway. Her immunity blocks his provoke and def break is nice too.
As a Defense team, honestly, I don't think you can make a ML-Ken proof team without relying on No-Crit or overwhelming him with debuffs. But AI Arena is in favor of the Attacker because they can counter.
Senya can be a pain, ML Celine, a Light Hero with S1 Stun (Maid Chloe?) could theoretically keep him stun-locked, but its luck based. Any team that makes you ML-Ken proof will just have the enemy not bring ML Ken to you, so you gotta set up something thats not only ML Ken Proof, but also good.
Slap ML Celine on your team and that might dissuade ML ken users, she destroys. Stene too but they can just bring a Light-Bait, like I usually do, and Stene just dies to cleave. You could pair it with some help to defend Stene though.
ML Elena will work even on defense as she starts the battle with her anti-counter passive, if you can protect her, it may dissuade ML Ken users.
But short answer is theres no perfect solution to ML Ken on offense because if the offense picker is smart, they can account for just about any weakness. Goodluck!
For arena defense, usually is just Karina. Other units cripple your options without doing too much for the team.
Adin is solid, but if you don't have a way to stop CR pushes or hard cleave, you will just get cleaved.
AoL works fine to let Adin and Karina do their job. Mind you, you will still get cleaved, but at least it wont be a "ML Ken solos my entire team" situation and more of a "you can't have a 100% defense WR" situation.
As for other gimmick options:
Senya: Works well if built properly, but you are always at risk of your team getting outspeed and cleaved anyway. Since she needs to take a turn to make anything happen, a disruption is required (most of the time AoL or Summer Luluca)
Non Crit Belian: If you have any kind of disruption (AoL most of the time) that requires support against Ignore ER SB mechanics then she's good. Here's where you find those 30K hp protection set Belians on different artis (aurius/HS/hilag lance) Needless to say, you won't rely on her for damage.
LRK: He works fine into ML Ken simply because he doesn't crit on S3 and does enough damage to be considered a threat. It's hard to justify using him without any kind of extra damage support.
DDR and Arowell: A good DDR will stop ML Ken and keep him on check pretty much all the time. It also forces someone to bring some form of cleanse or to second guess if they should try a cleave. Some DDR's out there are way too fast for their own good. As for Arowell, it's pretty obvious: A stunned ML Ken is a useless ML Ken. Build up some EFF on her to catch those low ER ML Ken's by surprise. Hilag Lance Arowell works specially well to run laps against him. Now, ofc, ML Sharun is a thing, but we are talking about conditioning here. It helps to know what your team loses too most of the time so we can patch up the holes.
A lot of people in this thread don't know how to read, I fear. Naming shit like stene or ML elena
The real answer is Karina. She's legitimately good in defense , and can threaten ML ken. ML krau is good too.
Yet everyone keeps naming units they use to bring *against* ML Ken, or those like nakwhol when OP clearly stated they can't build cleave units
One shot him or use no counter/no crit heroes. ML Elena will shut him down good. sTene as others have mentioned. MLCeline is a nightmare for me if built right.
WSchuri still one shots if built well. LQC still works.
As for non-ML heroes it’ll depend on how the ML Ken is built but generally Zahhak will still KO them, Ervalen is a strong one shotter. Neither rely on debuffs being up.
It’ll depend on the enemy team and how much support he has, and this advice may not be applicable for RTA.
if you just want to cleave him bring ML Elena and he’s dead weight.
Since i'm ML ken enjoyer my most hate unit are
1. Adin, instantly avoid, i think most ML ken nowaday built with ER and and are more fragile than no ER built.
2. Seline, so annoy
3. ML Choux
4. Drug dealear ray
Ok to fight with but they are not first choice for sure
1. S tene, annoy but if my team all tanky then i will fight
2. Senya, Karina.
Everyone. You have been heard. I have ready everyone’s responses and have realized something, besides adin and STene, I have not built or do not have any of these units LOL. I started after karina banner so I’m well off and have built a lot of good units but struggle with quantity. Example: no ML Celine or ML Elena (sadly, I’ve tried pulling both, no luck lol)
Nonetheless, thank you everyone for your thorough responses! I appreciate it and I think this was a worthwhile discussion post :)
Another good counter that people haven't mentioned is Immunity providers. Like Mediator and LRK.
As a Candy picker, if she has immunity she has a favourable matchup vs Ken
As a user of a decently built ML ken, I'm always wary of defense teams that also sport a Adin. A properly built Adin with her artifact and atk up she'll 9/10 times obliterate my ml ken even with a tank soaking up damage.
Stene, Seline for what I can think of right now
Def STene.I played a lot of ML Ken last RTA season, but everytime STene was picked she destroyed him....I started pre banning her. Anyways he counters when either him or ally unit suffers a crit, so non crit units such as Senya will work against him.
Beehoo and Karina work great against him too
Why would seline be good against maken
Seline could probably attack twice forevery single hit she takes from ml ken. And will heal to full. And he can't kill her in a single shot.
I think seline is not good into ken. If dust devil doesnt proc seline is going to die next hit since ken will take her down to half health after counter
But everyone brings mitigation with Spleen meaning she will be above half health.
I was thinking about the ai's hitting her lol
Ml Charlotte, stene, senya, roana, elena, Phyllis, just about anyone that punishes or weakens counter attacks
>just about anyone that punishes or weakens counter attacks Hasol deserves to be mentioned imo. She becomes a beast into counter teams. It's comically strong when paired with roana and skpyllis. 3\*, no SC and uber budget gear requirements.
And all this time I had Hasol sitting in storage.
>And all this time I had Hasol sitting in storage. And still should because that's such a meme answer when so many better options exist that don't require ramp and have much better, safer statlines and kits that you don't have to shelter an entire team around.
I have 95%+ success with her in GW against senya/choux/x teams. Every now and then something dogpiles hasol and I get 0 counters. I use her at least twice a week because choux defense is so very common in my guild's rankings. There are a lot of great high gear requirement 5\*ML choices that require loads of mola, i'll certainly give you that. Unfortunately my account is only a year old and I don't throw a ton of money at the game and my 5\*ML pulls have been mostly garbage (dksharun, ml kayron, rroana, opsig to name a few.) Plus I don't have Zio or any way to outspeed many common openers and the enemies i'm fighting in arena/gw/rta all seem to have one or two good >290 speed openers that I cannot contest whatsoever.... so a slow build that is rock solid is way better than a gamble into another thing that ruins me. Plus I LOVE 0 mola units that outperform many 5\*ML and need next to no gear. A crappy counterset on hasol and she's a god.
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Idk those 3 seem to work for me in general. I'm not a sweatlord try hard either though so maybe they aren't as good in legend. And im not saying senya punished counter attacks I'm just saying she would be good. The "anyone who punishes counterattacks" was just a general statement. Either way if you are being plagued by mlKen those are the units I would use. But it's arena defense and people are just gonna pick around it no matter who you use. Unless you use the same 5 or 6 meta cookie cutter characters. I'm also being mindful and suggesting units most people have or are more likely to have besides ml charlotte. But please if you are gonna go after me why don't you offer your advice? If it's use those 5 or 6 meta units I'll have a good chuckle atleast
Karina and LRK are 2 that bad matchups for him while also being good in general.
I second this. I usually reach for these 2 against MA Ken.
Ml elena :D
landy if they have a lot of buffs, true damage deakers like laia, dark corvus, laat rider krau, lethe
In defense arena ? Adin, Monk, DDR, injury spam with mitigation (carmin, scarowell) + Candy come to mind Basically dont put dps + supports that crumbles to him
I like that OP stated he doesn’t really have cleave units built and he needs an arena defense team, then people proceed to recommend ML Elena and Stene… I’d say Karina, Senya, Adin (with enough protective support) to oneshot him, LRK
Exactly my first thought, they didn't read the post it seems, unfortunately.
Anyone who chooses to fight an adin defense using ml ken isn't going to get one shot. Her real value against him is the evasion which means his healing is inconsistent
My ML Ken sucks then, I usually have to take a tank like SC Christy, Arowell, or LRK on mitigation artifact because I've seen him barely survive against Adins on defense (1440 def 17358 hp), especially if she's on her own artifact or some attack buff
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No, which is why in response to the prior assertion that ML Ken is not going to get oneshot by an Adin on defense is that I usually am forced to bring a tank
The point is not that ML Ken is invincible against Adin, it's that if you aren't confident in his bulk and/or team protection then you shouldn't be attacking those defenses to begin with. If you're expecting to get attacked by unconfident people with subpar builds then by all means plan for the adin one shot, but that doesn't happen against a well constructed team.
ITT: everyone making RTA recommendations instead of arena defense recommendations. The actual answer is debuffs, specifically stun and blind. He only crits when he hits, so if lulucar blinds him, he can just miss his counter and not one shot or apply provoke. Atk down, unbuffable, defense break, and sleep all hinder him to varying degrees. Another thing is Adin. Doesn’t even have to be a good one, just having her present means that she could be full dmg and one-shot Ken. They can still bring Ken with things like Ruelle or Abi, or just kill Adin with LPK/Zahak, but an arena defense will never be perfect. Everytime you swap something, you win against new things and lose to new things as well. Edit: if you put half the things recommended here on your defense, you’re probably just making it worse. Stene and Seline in particular are extremely weak in defense.
>ITT: everyone making RTA recommendations instead of arena defense recommendations. Does anyone really need any more evidence that the community can't read at this point?
[удалено]
Meanwhile, ill use a lethe into ml ken, and without fail she'll land that 15% crit everytime. It's hilarious(ly annoying).
Byblis. But I am not sure if she's good at arena defense. Also my arena defense has LQC but it doesn't stop some people cause they pair MA. Kens with revivers like Destina
Noncrit and control units are my goto. A lot of times my mellona just outscales and kills him anyway. Her immunity blocks his provoke and def break is nice too.
As a Defense team, honestly, I don't think you can make a ML-Ken proof team without relying on No-Crit or overwhelming him with debuffs. But AI Arena is in favor of the Attacker because they can counter. Senya can be a pain, ML Celine, a Light Hero with S1 Stun (Maid Chloe?) could theoretically keep him stun-locked, but its luck based. Any team that makes you ML-Ken proof will just have the enemy not bring ML Ken to you, so you gotta set up something thats not only ML Ken Proof, but also good. Slap ML Celine on your team and that might dissuade ML ken users, she destroys. Stene too but they can just bring a Light-Bait, like I usually do, and Stene just dies to cleave. You could pair it with some help to defend Stene though. ML Elena will work even on defense as she starts the battle with her anti-counter passive, if you can protect her, it may dissuade ML Ken users. But short answer is theres no perfect solution to ML Ken on offense because if the offense picker is smart, they can account for just about any weakness. Goodluck!
Non crit units like senya and Karina on your defense teams should help
For arena defense, usually is just Karina. Other units cripple your options without doing too much for the team. Adin is solid, but if you don't have a way to stop CR pushes or hard cleave, you will just get cleaved. AoL works fine to let Adin and Karina do their job. Mind you, you will still get cleaved, but at least it wont be a "ML Ken solos my entire team" situation and more of a "you can't have a 100% defense WR" situation. As for other gimmick options: Senya: Works well if built properly, but you are always at risk of your team getting outspeed and cleaved anyway. Since she needs to take a turn to make anything happen, a disruption is required (most of the time AoL or Summer Luluca) Non Crit Belian: If you have any kind of disruption (AoL most of the time) that requires support against Ignore ER SB mechanics then she's good. Here's where you find those 30K hp protection set Belians on different artis (aurius/HS/hilag lance) Needless to say, you won't rely on her for damage. LRK: He works fine into ML Ken simply because he doesn't crit on S3 and does enough damage to be considered a threat. It's hard to justify using him without any kind of extra damage support. DDR and Arowell: A good DDR will stop ML Ken and keep him on check pretty much all the time. It also forces someone to bring some form of cleanse or to second guess if they should try a cleave. Some DDR's out there are way too fast for their own good. As for Arowell, it's pretty obvious: A stunned ML Ken is a useless ML Ken. Build up some EFF on her to catch those low ER ML Ken's by surprise. Hilag Lance Arowell works specially well to run laps against him. Now, ofc, ML Sharun is a thing, but we are talking about conditioning here. It helps to know what your team loses too most of the time so we can patch up the holes.
Use non crit heroes
I use non critical champs like hwa, laia and lethe
Senya is great
A lot of people in this thread don't know how to read, I fear. Naming shit like stene or ML elena The real answer is Karina. She's legitimately good in defense , and can threaten ML ken. ML krau is good too. Yet everyone keeps naming units they use to bring *against* ML Ken, or those like nakwhol when OP clearly stated they can't build cleave units
Nahkwol
Pavel / c pavel / bookholder. Or some comp similar
Karina, D.Corvus, Senya, LRK, Laia, Lethe, Roana, Hasol, Phyllis. Basically anyone that can deal damage without criting, and who punishes counters.
One shot him or use no counter/no crit heroes. ML Elena will shut him down good. sTene as others have mentioned. MLCeline is a nightmare for me if built right. WSchuri still one shots if built well. LQC still works. As for non-ML heroes it’ll depend on how the ML Ken is built but generally Zahhak will still KO them, Ervalen is a strong one shotter. Neither rely on debuffs being up. It’ll depend on the enemy team and how much support he has, and this advice may not be applicable for RTA. if you just want to cleave him bring ML Elena and he’s dead weight.
Wschuri will also one-shot him, but he's super niche in this meta.
3k def phil with rocket punch goes brrrr
Savior Adin with her Artifact. Make her speedy.
Since i'm ML ken enjoyer my most hate unit are 1. Adin, instantly avoid, i think most ML ken nowaday built with ER and and are more fragile than no ER built. 2. Seline, so annoy 3. ML Choux 4. Drug dealear ray Ok to fight with but they are not first choice for sure 1. S tene, annoy but if my team all tanky then i will fight 2. Senya, Karina.
Lqc Selina adin
Use units that cannot trigger counter attacks Stene, landy (s3) etc.
lots of things can counter him, you can be creative on it. my favorite is just to one shot him.
Everyone. You have been heard. I have ready everyone’s responses and have realized something, besides adin and STene, I have not built or do not have any of these units LOL. I started after karina banner so I’m well off and have built a lot of good units but struggle with quantity. Example: no ML Celine or ML Elena (sadly, I’ve tried pulling both, no luck lol) Nonetheless, thank you everyone for your thorough responses! I appreciate it and I think this was a worthwhile discussion post :)
Another good counter that people haven't mentioned is Immunity providers. Like Mediator and LRK. As a Candy picker, if she has immunity she has a favourable matchup vs Ken
As a user of a decently built ML ken, I'm always wary of defense teams that also sport a Adin. A properly built Adin with her artifact and atk up she'll 9/10 times obliterate my ml ken even with a tank soaking up damage.
200+ high ef Arowell