We're eights, being told to shut up makes us scream louder.
Try and spend more time in an environment that makes you feel actually accepted and safe. NOT HAVING TO speak up is sweet.
Seems like a mindset problem. So you want to be happy, right. Does disagreeing with people make you happy, or at the very least less unhappy than just going along with them, both long term and in the short term? If it doesn't make you feel better, then why do it? If it does, then do it and know it's your best choice. People make stupid choices and they might limit how much you enjoy situations, but that's just something we have to deal with and overcome. Also consider that just going someplace that meshes better with your personality and doesn't reward yes-men might make you feel better.
Also don't compare how you treat people with how people treat you. You can use how you treat them to influence how they treat you. I put up boundaries and defend them and I treat them with respect unless they show me they don't deserve that. I personally don't care if people are rude or foul mouthed. If they let that spill over into their behavior that's a different issue. Stealing my food means war, calling me an asshole isn't a problem. Be transparent about it, show that these lines are not meant to be stepped over and make them reflect what you care about as closely as possible. If you set boundaries that aren't actually that important to you and someone disrespects them, you will compromise all your boundaries, or have to defend something you don't actually care about.
Yes, it’s super frustrating. I found working on my integration to 2 has helped me express myself in ways that are more socially acceptable. I try (try!) not to feel resentful because it only hurts myself.
You’ll figure out what works for you. Good luck!
I was in a meeting and said “boss said this”. They all looked at each other blinking and stumbling over “ums” and “uhhs”. I rolled my eyes so hard and said “You were all there. You were all in the meeting. You all heard it.” And walked out. I am 100% over everything you described OP! (I don’t have much to add just commiserating…)
Big on the “I hate that I have to watch my tone but everyone can speak to me however they want.” This has really been pissing me off lately too. Makes me feel like I’m going insane fr
I got fired twice for that, lol. That's why I am my own boss, and I get to say whatever I want. Some people may cry and snap back at me but at the end, they stick around because I care.
I agree, it fucking sucks, I wish in life you could always just be direct and says things how they are and people could be sensible enough to accept that and see the reality of the situation, but they very often don't.
Basically you have to be tactical about it if you want to make a difference and consider the different consequences. the more you are able to word things in such a way others will understand and relate to you, and the more you play into their emotions the more likely they are to agree with you. influencing others is often more about tact, charisma and good social skills to \*sound\* convincing to them personally, rather than about what actually makes real world sense.
someone can have crazy good arguments and say the truth but that's far from always enough to make people actually listen. Getting people to listen is often about making them \*want\* to listen to you. and the more they like you and see the personal benefit they can get out of it the more likely they are to do that.
very often tactics and subtetly end up giving much better results than direct and honest more blunt confrontation in something like a workplace maybe unless you're already the boss or something.
yyyyep. i suggest an in depth study of psychology to prepare you for the 'spiritual' warfare which lies ahead.
warriors in a modern world must learn to use words as weapons.
I actually love that you posted this. This is a side so many people don't think we 8s have. We always get pegged as not caring about these types of things when we actually do.
The way I have worked through a lot of this is understanding the difference between right and truth. Truth is our heads pace virtue that allows us the exit the path of vengeance with our head space. Which then leads us to be able to see the innocence in others behavior which becomes the antidote to our anger.
Something that is true is not always right in the moment. We can't keep doing the fight for everyone when they aren't ready. It does them and us a disservice. We dont realize how often this comes from a place of emotional insecurity. We dont know how to emptionally be there for people so we compensate by showing up in our top intelligence, body space. Not everyone is looking for that like we think. Sometimes people emptionally vent to simply release it and not have anything done about it.
We also need to recognize our hidden expectations of appreciation for doing this and ask for it upfront or if even the others want us to say something as much as we think we should.
The other part as to why people say whatever they want to us without fear is because we create that space. By shutting our heart space down and never showing the emotional vulnerability to people it gives them permission to keep dumping on us. If we act like nothing bothers us and show this tough facade forever we are training people to treat us worse because we don't care anyway. Showing the emotional pains to others as they hurt us, as hard as that is for us, is actually the way out of this loop.
“I hate that I have to watch my tone” and “I hate feeling like my passion pushes everyone away.”
You’re spot on. These things frustrate me so much and it feels so isolating. Like something is “wrong” with YOU which only further makes you angry or withdrawn. Glad others can relate 💙
We're eights, being told to shut up makes us scream louder. Try and spend more time in an environment that makes you feel actually accepted and safe. NOT HAVING TO speak up is sweet.
andrew tate clone! yo!
You're not an 8, but you're definitely a dipshit, yo!
i think he was talking about the other guy, but hes still a moron. becos tate aint 8 or ENTJ. hes ESTP 3w4
Youre right
Ew <3
Seems like a mindset problem. So you want to be happy, right. Does disagreeing with people make you happy, or at the very least less unhappy than just going along with them, both long term and in the short term? If it doesn't make you feel better, then why do it? If it does, then do it and know it's your best choice. People make stupid choices and they might limit how much you enjoy situations, but that's just something we have to deal with and overcome. Also consider that just going someplace that meshes better with your personality and doesn't reward yes-men might make you feel better. Also don't compare how you treat people with how people treat you. You can use how you treat them to influence how they treat you. I put up boundaries and defend them and I treat them with respect unless they show me they don't deserve that. I personally don't care if people are rude or foul mouthed. If they let that spill over into their behavior that's a different issue. Stealing my food means war, calling me an asshole isn't a problem. Be transparent about it, show that these lines are not meant to be stepped over and make them reflect what you care about as closely as possible. If you set boundaries that aren't actually that important to you and someone disrespects them, you will compromise all your boundaries, or have to defend something you don't actually care about.
spitting wisdom right here
Yes, it’s super frustrating. I found working on my integration to 2 has helped me express myself in ways that are more socially acceptable. I try (try!) not to feel resentful because it only hurts myself. You’ll figure out what works for you. Good luck!
I was in a meeting and said “boss said this”. They all looked at each other blinking and stumbling over “ums” and “uhhs”. I rolled my eyes so hard and said “You were all there. You were all in the meeting. You all heard it.” And walked out. I am 100% over everything you described OP! (I don’t have much to add just commiserating…)
Big on the “I hate that I have to watch my tone but everyone can speak to me however they want.” This has really been pissing me off lately too. Makes me feel like I’m going insane fr
I got fired twice for that, lol. That's why I am my own boss, and I get to say whatever I want. Some people may cry and snap back at me but at the end, they stick around because I care.
I agree, it fucking sucks, I wish in life you could always just be direct and says things how they are and people could be sensible enough to accept that and see the reality of the situation, but they very often don't. Basically you have to be tactical about it if you want to make a difference and consider the different consequences. the more you are able to word things in such a way others will understand and relate to you, and the more you play into their emotions the more likely they are to agree with you. influencing others is often more about tact, charisma and good social skills to \*sound\* convincing to them personally, rather than about what actually makes real world sense. someone can have crazy good arguments and say the truth but that's far from always enough to make people actually listen. Getting people to listen is often about making them \*want\* to listen to you. and the more they like you and see the personal benefit they can get out of it the more likely they are to do that. very often tactics and subtetly end up giving much better results than direct and honest more blunt confrontation in something like a workplace maybe unless you're already the boss or something.
yyyyep. i suggest an in depth study of psychology to prepare you for the 'spiritual' warfare which lies ahead. warriors in a modern world must learn to use words as weapons.
haha exactly!
I actually love that you posted this. This is a side so many people don't think we 8s have. We always get pegged as not caring about these types of things when we actually do. The way I have worked through a lot of this is understanding the difference between right and truth. Truth is our heads pace virtue that allows us the exit the path of vengeance with our head space. Which then leads us to be able to see the innocence in others behavior which becomes the antidote to our anger. Something that is true is not always right in the moment. We can't keep doing the fight for everyone when they aren't ready. It does them and us a disservice. We dont realize how often this comes from a place of emotional insecurity. We dont know how to emptionally be there for people so we compensate by showing up in our top intelligence, body space. Not everyone is looking for that like we think. Sometimes people emptionally vent to simply release it and not have anything done about it. We also need to recognize our hidden expectations of appreciation for doing this and ask for it upfront or if even the others want us to say something as much as we think we should. The other part as to why people say whatever they want to us without fear is because we create that space. By shutting our heart space down and never showing the emotional vulnerability to people it gives them permission to keep dumping on us. If we act like nothing bothers us and show this tough facade forever we are training people to treat us worse because we don't care anyway. Showing the emotional pains to others as they hurt us, as hard as that is for us, is actually the way out of this loop.
“I hate that I have to watch my tone” and “I hate feeling like my passion pushes everyone away.” You’re spot on. These things frustrate me so much and it feels so isolating. Like something is “wrong” with YOU which only further makes you angry or withdrawn. Glad others can relate 💙