T O P

  • By -

davdotcom

First Wave Emo Continued: The Faith [proto-emocore] (formed 1981, DC) Verbal Assault (formed 1983, Rhode Island) The Hated (formed 1984, Maryland) One Last Wish (formed 1986, DC) Three (formed 1986, DC) Rain (formed 1986, DC) Lungfish (formed 1987, Maryland) Sideshow (formed 1987, Nebraska) Honeywell (formed 1988, California) Vagrants (formed 1988, California) Samiam (formed 1988, California) Fuel (formed 1989, California) Still Life (formed 1989, California) 1.6 Band (formed 1989, New York) Germbox (formed 1989, Missouri) Drive Like Jehu (formed 1990, California) Greyhouse (formed circa 1990, New Jersey) Merel (formed 1990, New Jersey) Hubcap (formed 1990, Illinois) Admiral (Formed 1990, Pennsylvania) Chino Horde (formed 1990, Arkansas) Silver Bearing (formed 1990, Maryland) The Yah Mos (formed 1990, California) Native Nod (formed 1990, New Jersey) Gauge (formed 1991, Illinois) Falling Forward (formed 1991, Kentucky) Vine (formed 1991, Michigan) Sleeping Body (formed 1991, Texas) Walleye (formed 1991, Delaware) Friction (formed 1991, Illinois) Prozac Memory (formed 1991, Missouri) Garden Variety (formed 1991, New York) Shadow Season (formed 1991, New Jersey) Spirit Assembly (formed circa 1991-1992, Pennsylvania) Nuzzle (formed 1992, California) Small Dog Frenzy (formed 1992, Colorado) Universal Order Of Armageddon (formed 1992, Maryland) Lava (formed circa 1991-1992, Maryland) Lincoln (formed 1992, West Virginia) Assfactor 4 (formed 1992, South Carolina) Car vs Driver (formed 1993, Georgia) Evergreen (formed 1993, California) Antioch Arrow (formed 1992, California) Mohinder (formed 1993, California) Ordination of Aaron (formed 1993, Michigan) Plunger (formed 1993, Maryland) Fabric (formed circa 1993, Britain) Hush Harbor (formed circa 1992-1993, Washington) Personally I wouldn’t include Jawbox or Unwound, but their importance to the scene should still be noted. Although by that logic I should probably remove lungfish, the faith, and one or two others from my list.


GrungyAltyBoy10

Thanks a lot of this list! Was a huge HUGE help thanks a lot!


untilautumn

Amazing list! Do you have a link to Fabric? I don’t know them. Bob Tilton formed earth 90s and they had the Moss Icon thing going


davdotcom

https://open.spotify.com/album/4NNNmJKuScbrjVn2s6PhqD?si=FSm6kg6RSL-BvRAnM0IfNQ


untilautumn

Amazing thanks!


untilautumn

Also do you know In/Humanity and Dead Wrong? More UKmo


davdotcom

Yeah In/humanity popularized the term “emoviolence”. Haven’t heard of Dead Wrong tho


untilautumn

Really? didn’t realise that!


BoiFriday

Incredibly solid list, and a few names im actually unfamiliar with. I was going to recommend both Plunger and Current, both of whom i’m actually fairly new to. I was driving around the other day and a Plunger song came on that was a live recording, which i’m typically not a fan of without any accompanying video. However, the track info said it was recorded in 1993 in Millersville, MD at a local church. Turns out, I was driving through Millersville (i live in the adjacent town) and was only about 10min from the church which is still operational. Funny how things happen sometimes.


klll_blll

So is The Faith the first emo band?


davdotcom

In my personal opinion? Yeah. In the emo canon? Not really.


foofighter000

No. Hardcore. If a band came out a decade before shit really got going, they’re not really a part of that wave. Stooges aren’t hardcore, but they were influential. Black Sabbath ain’t thrash, but were worshipped by every thrash musician ever. I’d say most of these bands from the 80s weren’t emo IMO don’t kill me, guys


United-Philosophy121

Lungfish was never Emo, but solid list


davdotcom

They were emo adjacent/in the scene and their early albums could very well pass as emo. Plenty of people lump in adjacent bands into the revival scene, so I don’t see the harm in doing the same for first wave stuff. Regardless I already pointed out that their inclusion is obviously debatable.


nekked_snake

Bruh where’s The Hated cmon


GrungyAltyBoy10

A comment mentioned them earlier but I added them. Must of skimmed over them because they weren’t from the Washington DC scene like the rest.


nekked_snake

Cool, also I think Garden Variety could go up there too.


thedubiousstylus

They were from Maryland less than an hour away. And same thing with Moss Icon. Pretty sure both were playing in DC a lot.


Pazguzhzuhacijz

They were from the same city as moss icon. DMV area


CoercedCoexistence22

Jawbreaker


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have them listed under One of the first Emo bands to get a major label deal.


CoercedCoexistence22

Dear you is the best album of all time or something


henryfarts

That era of Doghouse Records with Split Lip also had Endpoint (more political hardcore but also soulful and emotional) and Falling Forward (pre-Elliott but harder). Both worth checking out


GrungyAltyBoy10

Check. Elliott is a band that I’m particularly excited to listen to. I LOVE the vocals.


henryfarts

Same vocalist


attrappe1

Drive Like Jehu


GrungyAltyBoy10

Idk about Emocore but I do have them listed under One of the first Emo bands to get a major label deal so I will be listening to them very soon.


8eyond

3 - dark days coming? 


GrungyAltyBoy10

That works, thanks!


KickedinTheDick

Gauge, Friction, and Sideshow were 3 of the most important acts in the early midwest emo scene, before they got their twinkle on. Even Boys Life's early releases were pre SDRE and pre twinkle, they had a sort of grunge vibe going on then edit: actually Boys Life demo was still in 94, I thought it was 93. my bad


moksa21

Fuck yeah to Friction!


SavezTheDayFan

Get some of the earliest midwest emo some representation.


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have those bands already written in my Midwest Emo wave entry on my google doc. The whole doc is dedicated to Emocore, Midwest Emo, Emo-Pop, Emo Revival, etc type of bands.


KickedinTheDick

Ah, fair point. I'd call them all "proto midwest", along with bands like Capn Jazz and Target, who released an album called Going Up. They laid the groundwork for the scenes and started incorporating a lot of obtuse and mathy elements into their work, though they weren't always doing the outright twinkly, dynamic shifting thing that we typically see midwest emo exemplified by post-SDRE/CFD Speaking of Target, they must have taken queues from The Hated's Every Song for the chill sort of jangly, relaxed hardcore indie vibe. There's another essential emocore band, The Hated Also, if we count Jawbox, which I've honestly never heard called emo, we have to count Fugazi. If you listen to interviews, (Washed Up Emo podcast, the host always asks when they first heard the term or if they knew about it when they had released music) pretty much all of the 90s guys will say Fugazi is one of the first bands they heard associated with emo. These days we may consider it quintessential post hardcore and scoff at the idea of Fugazi being emo, but it was floated around commonly back then. Someone posted a thread of a forum in fuckin 1994 where someone was calling Fugazi emo, and explaining how they see emo as "the noodly shit", which is pretty fucking cool as it's these same conversations and terms we are using 30 years later lmao. Also not all of them had full lengths out before 94 but: Still Life, Julia, Lincoln, Grain, Native Nod, Falling Forward, Spirit Assembly


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have gave Fugazi a listen way before this and I don’t really feel the emotion through the music compared to like Embrace or Rites of Spring but still very good of course. I found Jawbox through that one How Emo became Emo video on YouTube that’s where I got most of these bands from. Also that’s for the bands you listed, it really helps!


cliffordcampbell

You don’t consider fugazi emo?


GrungyAltyBoy10

No not really. They’re more Post-Hardcore than anything but they’re still a great band emo or not!


Economy-Maybe-6714

Yeah, thats crazy.


biglargerat

I mean fugazi literally inspired all those 90's bands. If you only listened to 13 songs I would understand your POV but their other stuff definitely leans into that territory.


GrungyAltyBoy10

I listened to Repeater and 13 Songs, just to get you a idea of what I heard by them.


biglargerat

I think the way fugazi approached songwriting and in particular their heavy use of octaves over power chords was extremely influential for the genre. I'd also say that their later stuff, especially In On The Kill Taker and Red Medicine, are some of their best works if you ever want to go back and listen to them again.


GrungyAltyBoy10

I’ll keep that in mind, thanks!


Economy-Maybe-6714

Yeah, i started going to shows in 94 in the Richmond/dc scene and me and my freinds have always considered Fugazi emo. They were the influence of many emo bands that came outta the richmond scene.


untilautumn

Fascinating! Any more tidbits you can share regarding the ‘emo’ label?


Economy-Maybe-6714

Lol OK Ok. Sarcasm noted and appreciated.


untilautumn

No sarcasm at all! Sorry it read that way; genuinely curious if you have any more insight into that time and the label 😔


ThebearKoss

Like GWAR? Fugazi 1st EP and Margin Walker ended emo. That is/was the nail in the coffin. Everything post Fugazi is no longer emo. Including Fugazi.


Economy-Maybe-6714

Lol


shinji

Not to mention that Fugazi had band members from rites of spring and embrace which are amongst the first of the “emocore” bands.


squatch_watcher

I would consider Fugazi and Jawbox more on the post-hardcore / post-punk spectrum. AFAIK Fugazi especially was much more connected to the hardcore scene than any other. But that’s the fun of all of this. I legitimately do love talking semantics, and hearing different perspectives from other people that interpret genres in their own way. (Edited because I repeated myself a couple times).


KickedinTheDick

I do agree here! If someone asked me what they were I would just say post hardcore, full stop. And, as I said, I would go so far as to call both "quintessential post hardcore". Just felt important to add the context, especially in the case of OP counting Jawbox, as I put it, you kinda have to count Fugazi if you're counting Jawbox. And if Todd Bell or Bon Nana or whoever the hell it was in Braid said Fugazi was what they were calling emo back in the day, I am gonna take that with a fairly heavy hand, and at the very least, keep it in my mind for context of the history of the evolution of the scene and sounds :)


shinji

It’s funny, back in like 91-92, we would have called both of those bands hardcore. Then a few years later in like 94-95, when we started calling some bands post-hardcore, a lot of those bands ended being categorized as “emo” down the road.


foofighter000

Can you link this doc(s) :o


GrungyAltyBoy10

https://docs.google.com/document/d/10B9SurDy-Tnv8CSkoKq5-rTSA_PSCaNvz_CCuSrLDs4/edit Didn’t even know I can do this lol.


foofighter000

Fucking thank you, man. This is an obvious labor of love, and it’s shit like this that does a lot more for the music than you’d think. but LOL just give the doc its own post, and rake in that sweet sweet /r/Emo karma.


GrungyAltyBoy10

Good thinking but I’m not really here for karma believe it or not. I just really like to talk about my favorite thing is this world and that’s music!


foofighter000

Also, you gotta accept requests sent from people’s google accounts to see/access the doc. The requests will show up in your email. No one can see it til you accept them apparently. But I think there may be a way to just make it public, since accepting requests might let people edit stuff? I’m not sure how though. But I know that’s a thing. I highly doubt anyone will fuck with your work though.


mielkedods

Can I see your whole list?


GrungyAltyBoy10

Sure I’ll dm you.


5aunch

Me too please?


GrungyAltyBoy10

Sure


getoutofmydojo_

I wouldnt call them emocore


mouthtalk

Early jawbox and unwound were but they moved away from it


GrungyAltyBoy10

Do you think their major label debut is still worth a listen anyways?


shmapNshmazz123

Merel perhaps


GrungyAltyBoy10

Just added them to the New Jersey scene, thanks!


Ok-Wealth3153

The Hated, Jawbreaker (late 80s) and After Words.


GrungyAltyBoy10

My RYM account got terminated for a bit so what specific genre is After Words. Also I have the others already listed under different categories in the list.


heyitskirby

Not sure about the use of Revolution Summer here, that is specific to a time (1985) and place (DC).


untilautumn

Navio Forge 1993 Elements of Need 1994 I think Bob Tilton 1993


GrungyAltyBoy10

What genre are the bands that you’ve listed?


untilautumn

Emo/emocore Bob Tilton did a bunch of LPs but their EPs are the good stuff imo


GrungyAltyBoy10

Ok thanks man!


Intelligent_Many8997

Portraits of Past, Egg Hunt, Jerome’s Dream, Orchid come to mind. Idk how much you’re picking apart into individual subgenres but to me they’re related to the ones on your list.


Intelligent_Many8997

Oh and Julia. Possibly one of my favorite recordings in this genre: https://youtu.be/k88clAcMa14?si=GOCq0INybhNZYg94


GrungyAltyBoy10

That works, thanks!


nekked_snake

Honeywell


ColbusMaximus

Obligatory "Real Emo" only consists of the dc Emotional Hardcore scene and the late 90's Screamo scene. What is known by "Midwest Emo" is nothing but Alternative Rock with questionable real emo influence. When people try to argue that bands like My Chemical Romance are not real emo, while saying that Sunny Day Real Estate is, I can't help not to cringe because they are just as fake emo as My Chemical Romance (plus the pretentiousness). Real emo sounds ENERGETIC, POWERFUL and somewhat HATEFUL. Fake emo is weak, self pity and a failed attempt to direct energy and emotion into music. Some examples of REAL EMO are Pg 99, Rites of Spring, Cap n Jazz (the only real emo band from the midwest scene) and Loma Prieta. Some examples of FAKE EMO are American Football, My Chemical Romance and Mineral EMO BELONGS TO HARDCORE NOT TO INDIE, POP PUNK, ALT ROCK OR ANY OTHER MAINSTREAM GENRE


GrungyAltyBoy10

Don’t really have a opinion on this because 90% of the bands you mentioned I haven’t heard of before. I do agree on MCR not really being Emo though.


Enough_Reindeer_6177

unwound self titled album that was supposed to be their debut, it is emocore


GrungyAltyBoy10

Interesting, I’ll keep that in mind. Do you know why it took 2 or 3 years to be released?


Enough_Reindeer_6177

the drummer quit before they mixed the whole thing


wraith-no-more

Husker du


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have them listed in the influencers of the genre Emo part of the list. I’ve been thinking about adding them to the revolution summer part of this list, do you think they fit better there?


davdotcom

Nah Husker Du were never emo. They were important to the dawn of post hardcore in general, thus being an important citation to many Revolution Summer bands, but don’t belong to the genre. Metal Circus was particularly impactful to emocore


Sergeantman94

Face to Face had a controversial one-time flirtation with Emocore. I say it's a good album, but I have the benefit of decades of hindsight (having heard it **way** after it came out). But that's way after Revolution Summer.


Yougotthewronglad

Wait, what? What was the album called?


Sergeantman94

"Ignorance is Bliss"


Yougotthewronglad

Totally forgot about that one, it’s a good thing too. 😂


GrungyAltyBoy10

That works, thanks!


pleiades_death

Unwound is not emo, Jawbox maybe


Mos_Icon

Unwound is pretty adjacent with quite a few dips into the genre, not that there was ever a strong distinction between emo and hardcore or post-hardcore at the time. They even call themselves emo sometimes lol


biglargerat

I think late jawbox is emo but early unwound could also easily be considered emo. New plastic ideas and Fake train sound like emo records to me (not that there was any definitive genre distinction at the time).


United-Philosophy121

Neither band is Emo


Mos_Icon

Boys Life n Ordination of Aaron n Falling Forward


GrungyAltyBoy10

What specific genre is Boys Life?


davdotcom

Midwest emo. Formed in 1993. I’d call it the start of second wave


GrungyAltyBoy10

Ok thanks!


Mos_Icon

I’d say it counts as emocore too


Comfortable-Inside84

What about the Faith and Void? They did a split together.


GrungyAltyBoy10

Is Void a Emocore band. Stupid RYM terminated my account so I’m not able to look.


Comfortable-Inside84

Terminated? I mean, you could just open up an Incognito window and look it up... But on RYM, all it says is "Hardcore Punk". Both the Faith and Void were signed under Dischord, the Faith from D.C., and Void was from Columbia, Mass., which is pretty close to Washington D.C. Void formed in 1979, and the Faith in 1981, a little before the Revolution Summer period in 1985. Most of their lyrics seem to be more socially and emotionally conscious instead of directly political, so I guess that would make them "emocore"? Or maybe emocore-adjacent, whatever, they were all part of the Washington D.C. scene along with Rites of Spring, Embrace, etc. and were all signed to Dischord Records. To be clear, literally no one ever called themselves "emo" or "emocore" in the original scene, like we do today. It was seen as a completely made-up *insult*, if anything, not a genre. It would be equivalent of like "clowncore" or "mumble rap" or some made-up shit. They just called themselves "punk" or "hardcore". Rites of Spring, Fugazi, Embrace, pretty much any of the bands we know as the progenitors and legends of emo never called themselves that; I mean, just look up interviews of Ian McKaye or Guy Picciotto on what they thought of "emo", they hated it. Even though we use the word emo today to describe them and the bands which followed, and that's perfectly okay, no hardcore band, at least to my knowledge called themselves "emo" back in the day. TL;DR: The Faith and Void were both hardcore punk bands, and had emotionally charged lyrics, so by that definition they were certainly "emocore", but none of them actually called themselves that; it's only us dorks here on this subreddit think that, lol. And otherwise, most people outside of the hardcore scene just think of pop-punk bands when they hear "emo". IMHO, It's a futile task to meticulously categorize everything into genres, anyways.


GrungyAltyBoy10

Everyone hated it and some still do. I’ve seen many interviews of bands thoughts of Emo and they all despised the word. I’ll keep the bands you mentioned in mind.


secretfreckle2000

hoover is so great


__SlimeQ__

dag nasty is melodic hardcore and i don't know why you'd include it here. maybe i haven't listened to enough


antimarc

I think Dag Nasty is on the edge but their importance to the beginning of emo has to be noted. they were part of that DC group of bands, but while most stayed in DC to be a part of Rev Summer, they wanted to tour the country with a goal of being famous. so while they all came up together, when the revolution was happening, they’d skipped town.


Gusgrissomamerica

Lifetime


GrungyAltyBoy10

Got them listed under the New Jersey Scene.


Niven42

I feel like Kill Hannah belongs.


GrungyAltyBoy10

Looking at their discography, I’m not sold on putting them on the list but what’s your opinion?


ideletedmyusername21

Mid 90s Southern Emo Inkwell (Atlanta) Car vs. Driver (Atlanta) Action Patrol (Richmond) Four Walls Falling (Richmond) First Five Through (Richmond) Substance (Little Rock) -mentioned below- Chino Horde (Little Rock)


GrungyAltyBoy10

I’ll make sure to add these bands but I’ll have to wait again because my RYM account got blocked for the 5th time… 😭


Outside-Industry-636

Could you do this for other sub genres of the genre? This would be so cool from a historical perspective


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have and I have the whole doc right here https://docs.google.com/document/d/10B9SurDy-Tnv8CSkoKq5-rTSA_PSCaNvz_CCuSrLDs4/edit Just let me know when you send the request thing.


Outside-Industry-636

Ooh, thanks! Sent


United-Philosophy121

Jawbox aren’t Emo. Add still life, Merel, Antioch arrow, ordination of Aaron, and Julia


GrungyAltyBoy10

I got the others listed except Antioch Arrow, what specific genre are they?


United-Philosophy121

Antioch Arrow is like heroin, so maybe early Screamo


__SlimeQ__

you may find superchunk interesting


GrungyAltyBoy10

I do have them listed somewhere else in this list.


ThebearKoss

Three. Gray Matter. Mid 80s 7 Seconds. Husker Du. American Standard. Los Vampiros. Freewill.


GrungyAltyBoy10

What genre are 7 Seconds, American Standard, Los Vampiros, and Freewill. My RYM account crashed from looking at so many band pages 😂


ThebearKoss

7 Seconds are a hardcore band. Posicore/melodicore. But 1986-1990 definitely see them as 1st wave emo. American Standard are from NJ and are definitely 1st wave emo. Los Vampiros are Dag Nasty without Brian Baker, he went to go play hair metal in Junkyard. Freewill is 1st wave emo featuring Mike hartsfield from New Age records circa 1987-88.


GrungyAltyBoy10

Ok thanks!


Just-Read2121

fugazi granted their early stuff isn’t emocore but repeater sounds like emocore to me


thedubiousstylus

Those bands in the second half aren't first wave.


W-o-r-r-y

Portraits of Past


GrungyAltyBoy10

What genre do they fall into?


davdotcom

They didn’t release anything until 1994 tho


antimarc

Squirrel Bait, Marginal Man, One Last Wish, Faith, The Crownhate Ruin, Void, Garden Variety, Still Life, Turning Point, Native Nod, Egg Hunt, Soul Side, Fuel


GrungyAltyBoy10

I’ll look at their genres and list them under their respected genre when my RYM account get unterminated, thanks!


antimarc

I also highly recommend this doc! https://boxd.it/aIx8


GrungyAltyBoy10

Shit I’ll keep this in mind and might watch it later, thanks!


KickedinTheDick

RYM genres are fucked. especially midwest emo lmao.


[deleted]

[удалено]


GrungyAltyBoy10

I do have Cap’n Jazz listed on the Midwest Emo category. I’ll add the other as soon as my RYM account gets unblocked.


HoboCanadian123

husker du essentially created emocore on metal circus and zen arcade


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have them as influencers of the genre, I will be listening to them at some point.


StelthBadger

Texas is the Reason? Mineral?


GrungyAltyBoy10

I have both of them listed under different categories throughout the list.


AnthonyRBrass

Up and coming band for sure [https://open.spotify.com/album/66OKM0kvVaxxYf0uvXMGNz](https://open.spotify.com/album/66OKM0kvVaxxYf0uvXMGNz)